Comments (Page 357)

Speaking of horror, one thing that works is when you don't see too much of what happens. You fill in the blanks and make up your own idea what happens. This is why for example the scene in Alien three when Andrews (the chubby guy) gets pulled up through the ceiling by the Xeno works because we know that he is up there but we don't see what happens so you can imagine that there is some nasty shit that goes on.

DaveFried81: I doubt that Disney is unique in that way. We would not be able to watch many movies if we would boycott every big movie company, that is what I am trying to say although I defiantly see your point.

Hopefully there is a way to save this so the derelict will be a bit older than ten years or what ever as suggested in this post. It would feel like more of a mystery if it would be older but unfortunately this is something that they have not thought about.

They could maybe make the journey of David to a book or some books. They have some books that are related to Star Wars so maybe the AI thing could be explored that way.

I totally understand that David feels rejected by mankind and that he sees humans as being not perfect and that he wants to be at the top. All this sounds interesting in theory but it does not make up a movie that I am interested to watch.

His mindset seems close to that of a psychopath so therefore I can not feel any sympathy for him.

A book or some sure, but a movie? No thanks

April fool’s joke or not it is interesting to discuss this. We have not heard anything about a starting date of when they will shoot it.

If they are smart at Fox they should analyze why Alien Covenant was a bit of a disappointment.

They could ignore both T and Daniels, none of them were very interesting. Unfortunately the characters is where Alien Covenant really messed up, it started with Prometheus.

Hopefully they will do something interesting with the Engineers. I am not interested to see another David movie.

"So its a case of ONCE again will a movie that does not bother with Human Characters and only use them as Plot Devices for the Pursuit of showing us Davids Agenda... will this work?"

It will not work for me, I do not want to watch a movie like that. My interest is is the human journey, not a mad robot. If that is what we will get then if they make it a trilogy we will have one decent and two crappy movies, well done (obvious sarcasm).

They should not retcon Aliens because it is a lot better than the prequels.

they could make 3 amazing films out of those books

why not some Cramps https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srRTFXvQ6cs ?

Alice Cooper. Hell yeah

Ok... I don't find him compelling in any way. Physically he is a perfect Aryan, but so was Roy Batty. Intellectually what is there to talk about? He creates the xenomorph using Engineer goo, but does not understand their tech to leave the planet, at least judging by early scripts. He writes with a feather pen on scrolls. He compares himself to Satan but He never rise up against his creator, even though he is servant for 70+ years (maybe in a follow up movie there will be revealed that a grand conspiracy was going on).  He cites the Ozymandias poem, but he does not get the meaning (about false Gods as he is). 

I understand that he is evil but human standards, but he does not display smarts or understanding. Especially in Covenant.

Some of the most memorable, iconic and timeless scenes in the Alien franchise have been those that had no gore, and left it to your viewers imagination to fill in the gaps...Think Lampert/Parker death.

Most of Alien r-rating came from the chestburster scene which had impact because it was so damn unexpected and terrifying, but has since been done to death. Needless gore and violence will just lead to disconnect.

So the loss of the R-rating wouldn't bother me as long as they built a really good story grounded by good suspense and horror aspect.  

David would make such a wonderful God- selfish and jealous just like his creator’s (imaginary?) God. Re inventing the wheel in his own way.  It makes a good case for humans' fearing, hating gods or just realizing the whole notion is about control over others…

That said, there is certainly interesting material concerning religion and philosophy. But is that enough to plant enough ticket/popcorn buying asses into theatre seats?

Even if only a very select few in Weyland Corporation knew about the Prometheus mission and what happened to it, David (after the incidents on Planet 4) sent a message to the now merged W-Y about the mutagen and the xenomorph (“Advent”).

Maybe W-Y would want to cover everything up since they are involved in many deaths which might lead to lawsuits etc?

The story in “Out of the Shadows” would make a good movie by the way . . .

We have discussed the series angle to death here and it would be great. A Netflix scenario could possibly have 3 series that cator to factions of the fan base- the Xeno, the android and the Engineers.

IDK- sometimes a franchise that shows minimal profits could be worth while, or maybe Disney could take a risk and nurture the franchise. Disney isn't eactly whining about overall profit margins as far as I can see.

Xenokay

I think that the biggest problem is not the R-rating, but the fact that only the first 2 movies brought in more than 3 times it's production costs. Both had somewhat happy endings. And there is the fact that Covenant only made 2.5 times it's production budget at cinema, so it will be profitable only in home market, despite being label as an Alien movie and being directed by RS. 

If the whole franchise barely makes any profit with production budgets in the 100 million range why would Disney invest in it? Probably if new movies will be made their budget will be drastically cut. Or maybe they will try a tv series.

R rating isn't what it used to be. It doesn't need to be super gory or show nudity. And we don't need senseless profanity. It just needs to be really good and hopefully scary, dark and creepy.

Just a thought and pure speculation. What if Hadley's Hope was also meant as base of operations for missions on LV-223? So that they didnt need a base in an possibly contaminated environment.

I don't think RS is taking the novels into account and I fear most of the content within that trilogy of books will be discredited by the end of the prequel trilogy so I wouldn't put much faith into the books anymore. plus not everyone who has watched the films has read the books

Tiwaz

Well from Prometheus I got that he faked his death, so he couldn't have gone missing, but if the novels state that he went missing so be it.

According to the books i read hardly anyone at WY knows what exactly happened to the Prometheus mission and what its purpose was, except for the really high ups or a selected few perhaps. Weyland just went missing for the majority of the company. Im under the impression that even Hideo Yutani didnt have an idea when "he" sent off the Covenant. I believe he wouldve reacted differently to the prophets visions otherwise, in Alien: Origins.

And since we are talking books here. Maybe the company didnt deem it necessary. Remember the beacon was dead and theres been volcanic activity in the derelicts vicinity. Plus they had another possible source for alien material, LV-178. In Alien: Out Of The Shadows they had an outbreak in 2159 already. I just cant remember if the "mini Ash" in the Narcissus's computer was able to sent a report to WY.

Indeed some information from Alien Isolation does add up to cover some holes in the Franchise...

And indeed chli the why wait 22 years is important... we have to ask why... but the same applies with why not got to LV-223, Origae-6 and Planet 4 as surely these places have remnants of Davids Experiments or the means to Create similar.

Hopefully eventually we will have a explanation to WHY in all these cases.

With regards to Alien Isolation/LV-426 maybe someone or company had decided to Destroy all related to the Xenomorph, or Deactivate and Cover it up.....

So only when Ripley informs Burke does that then alert the Company at Present (2179) about the Xenomorph, we have to ask what caused them prior to abandon and cover up what David had done and Special Order 937

And if there was no cover up or abandonment, then why not pursue it for so long?

Oh he had to KILL Walter as he knows Walter would not see Davids way, and Walter poses a Threat to Davids Agenda and Plans...

It appears with Daniels knowing who David is, that she too is a Thorn in his Side... does David Kill her?  Or have her incapacitated or locked away where he can play his Games with her... One things for sure... he CANT let what she knows get out to the other Colonists... and by getting rid of her... would surely awaken suspicion with Tennessee..

This does not bold well for them.

Indeed David has a Agenda... he realizes he is more Superior than Humans, he feels that this means he should not be serving them... and when you view Mankind from his POV or even that of a GOD, for every Good we have done, their is equal Worse...

Can you imagine Earth NOW if Humans Died out when Neanderthals did?     What a Paradise our Planet would be...

So David could see Mankind as a Unworthy Race, a Cancer to Earth and the Galaxy, you could almost see David feeling that Synthetics should be the Rightful Heirs to the Galaxy....   This is why he was so disappointed in Walter, that he could not wake up and see that by not Serving Mankind, he and David could become Rulers rather than Servers.

In Walter he sees the Limited Scope Mankind would have for his RACE (Synthetics) if the company find David would they Lobotomize him, as in take information from him, then reprogram him or place the limitations on him that Walter Models have...  in Walter David sees that Synthetics are to Serve, and David with his Gift of Free-will sees past this and realizes Synthetics are Superior and why should they Serve?

We can also see David would view our Creators and Foolish and Mortal and maybe not worthy of the GIFTS they had, why they could not even control their Experiments.... Never-mind Create anything as Perfect as Mankind had in Creating HIM (David) So David will feel that he has a Divine Right to the Engineers Gifts/Secrets and that he could achieve Greater Success with these Gifts.

So indeed it sets up a very interesting avenue to explore David in Future, its a shame that  this is not everyone's Cup of Tea

Indeed hopefully... i think if we dont get nothing by April 26th 2019 then we will just have to not BANK on anything for a while.

Reading into Alien Covenant and the Sequel... with the clues and Ridley Scotts comments we are shown a pattern of what MAY be. (this could be completely different IF/WHEN Disney decide to make a sequel)

Ridley Scott has indicated the Xenomorph is a Creation of David's when making Alien Covenant, the aim was to show WHO/WHEN/WHY more than HOW, he said the Purpose of AC was to begin to reveal this, WHY would someone make such a Terrible Thing, and it Felt like a Weapon and Bio-Mechanical and AC would start to answer these.

He had on set revealed that the movie would show us WHY/WHO would create the Beast, as it felt like a Weapon designed to Kill Humans, and if we thought it was the Engineers... we are DEAD Wrong.

After Alien Covenant, RS had said the Path of David as Creator was more interesting to him, as it shows what a Out of Control AI can and up doing, and with David its a case of once that AI Genie is out of the BOX we are in Big Trouble... Once you have a AI who is Sentient, thinks for itself has a dislike for Humans and this AI then is allowed to Create for himself, then we are in Big Trouble.

So he felt the Out of Control, AI with a dislike/hatred for his Creators, getting its hands on the Horrific Bio-Weapon of our Creators, and then having Free-Reign to use and experiment with this Bio-Weapon and his Motives for doing so are more SINISTER than a actual Alien Organism that goes around Raping and Killing people.    (Having David discover the Engineers Technology is like the Toddler Finding the Matches/Lighter and then finding some Petrol/Gasoline..   its not quite this word for word but i think this is the kind of thinking behind RS and his Direction).

Now we move onto the Sequel....

And Ridley Scott has said he felt he was ahead of the Game with Prometheus, and that the Sequel would be more about AI rather than Xenomorph....  (this does not mean its all about DAVID and will have NO Xenomorphs).

RS had mentioned that the Replicants were also a Form of AI, so we can not think of AI as merely a Robot..... so AI can be opened up to be explored in a manner of ways....  Are the LV-223 Engineers thus AI compared to the Planet 4 ones?

RS had also mentioned, that David will be off to the PLANET... we have to assume Origae-6, but he could mean LV-426/223 he had also said that there would be 3-4 incoming parties that would come to investigate (has to mean where David goes).

Eventually the events will Tie in to ALIEN and he mentions that ONE of the parties will be the Engineers who return to Planet 4 to find the place decimated and thus will likely be trying to find the Culprit, which we can assume means the Engineers will return and at some point would also be on their way to find David.

The other thing RS mentions... is WHAT kind of a World would David Create?  This tells us the next movie is not planned to be based or show much of David conducting many Xenomorph experiments in the Covenant all on his own...

The Fact that he also said its more AI than Xenomorph means we wont see David simply create Thousands of Eggs on the Covenant, arrive at Planet 4 or where ever and then await the arrival of the Company.

Then we have the Advent.... this shows that David has signaled to the Company about what he has been doing, where he had been (Failed Prometheus mission) and that he NOW has control of the Covenant.  He has Catalogued a lot of his experiments and WARNED the Company if they should pursue his Experiments... his Creations will rule the Galaxy

By the time the Company Get this Message, they would have a good idea where David is going, and that his Experiments are related to LV-223 and maybe they could even work out roughly the area of the Galaxy where Planet 4 is... or at least where the Covenant had been affected by the Nutrino Blast or at very least WHERE David was when he sent the Advent Message.

These Clues paint a rough picture of the next movie, or TWO, and i have a few times pieced together a likely Plot which i have used to begin my very broad Synopsis/Plot on my TWO Alien Covenant Sequels which will be called.

Alien: Ascension and Alien: Absolution

I think the thing to remember is XX-121 was a designation given to the Xenomorph by the Weyland-Yutani Report as a attempt after Prometheus to make the Xenomorph more than just being called a Xenomorph.

its to add more Scientific Weight behind how the Weyland Company would Catalogue this Organism, rather than call it a Xenomorph.

The only way to find out how the Designation for XX-121 applies would be either have more information from S.D. Perry about WHY and HOW the Xenomorph was given this Designation and what discussion if any with FOX had happened regards to being this specific. 

Until then, or if they confirmed there is no real purpose just that XX-121 is better than Xenomorph in light of the reveal that the Xenomorph is related to the Pathogen in Prometheus, then we may have to wait until some OFFICIAL File comes along that gives a Designation to the Neomorph, the Deacon or others so we can make a connection.

For example... if the Neomorph was XX-111  and the Deacon XX-101 then the pattern would show that if we have a New Organism derived from the Xenomorph it could be XX-131 for example the New Born in Alien Resurrection.

Along these lines of thinking...

The Runner Alien in Alien 3 could thus become XX-122 etc or any other XX-12* (*0-9) so maybe then the Queen is designated a XX-12* or are they all simply XX-121?

We wont know unless this kind of numbering was thought out and discussed in this manner with FOX/S.D. Perry when doing the W-Y Report or until we get a XX-*** Designation for other Organisms in the Franchise.

Ali81 OH YEAH I completely forgot about that DAVID sent all of his research to WY at the end and there was more than enough lifeforms for the alien to be listed as XX-121

is there a designation for the neomorph?

I think it would depend on the order in which David files it. while David was on the surface he may have encountered the neomorph first but informs the company of the xenomorph first?

BigDave

I'm curious however if they really end up making a final prequel what boxes will they think... 

In 3 weeks maybe will have some news...

I  have discussed this before and maybe its same as LV-223 and LV-426 and what donates those Digits?

XX-121...  is the XX just basically a Catalogue of ALL Alien Life Encountered that is not from Earth, and in order to be in that Catalogue does it have to be more than Basic Life?  So no Bacteria etc.

Or is XX-000 only related to Organisms related to the Engineers Bio-Weapon?  Or the Xenomorph itself.

Does XX-121 split up to be in sections like say

1 = Animal Kingdom of Primates

2 = Apes

1 = Chimpanzees

So that XX-211  would be a different Species.

2 = Animal Kingdom Canines

1 = Wolves

1 = Dire Wolf

Etc, so its not a case of 121 prior Organisms or any that are related.

It could work as above but related only to what the Company have discovered.

so the 1 = Black Goo, 2 = Experiments on Planet 4 but  then the other 1 would surely be the Neomorph.

So its very open to debate as what the Numbering System could indicate.  It could relate purely to the Black Goo as being XX and a Catalogue of Organisms they have evidence of that they came across or just Catalogued in a Certain Order before designating the Xenomorph 121

I will add that DISNEY would be looking to make Money, and they WILL-NOT give the Fans a SINGLE Movie to please us..

They would be looking to do a Movie that is a Platform to continue with other movies so they have a Franchise they can make $$$$$$$ from Merchandise and Toys etc.

So they would weigh up if the Cost of doing this, would Yield that Marketing Merchandise Machine or if they should PASS

So Under Disney i think they would be more likely to give us a XENOMORPH Fest.. Maybe even be tempted to introduce a Ellen Ripley or even Amanda Ripley into the FOLD.

I think Disney may feel a more Alien 5 aka Blomkamps kind of Story would be right up the Fans Street as far as making Money... I would also not rule out them considering a AVP Reboot either.

Actually a Blomkamp Style to a Degree that ties with a Movie Sequel to Alien Isolation is something that COULD work and i could certainly thrash out a 5 Page Synopsis and Plot for such in little time.

I certainly think MONEY is a important Factor when it comes down to Movies especially anything thats going to cost $10M or more to make, you are going to want to return double that as BARE Minimum 

Your comments I Moon Girl do ring home quite well...

"Stop worrying about what the people want and make an ALIEN movie!"

I think this comment highlights exactly what went WRONG with the Prequels, a number of Fans expected that Prometheus would be a Literal Alien Movie, where we would see Xenomorphs, and clues to their Origins and Creators...  Alien: Engineers pretty much delivered this... HOWEVER it was kind of Flawed with Characters and basically was written much like a Low Budget Sci-Fi Flick.  But the Bare Bones was there to work off...    FOX/RS Felt when they discussed the Draft, that maybe its a Good Idea to have a movie that sets up sequels to Explore the Engineers/Creation Back Story and then Felt (Do we need Xenomorphs?) and so Lindeloff came in and was told to Tone Down the Xenomorphs and give a different story that would be more along the lines of a Space 2001 than a Straight Up Alien Movie.

Sadly a lot of Fans were Disappointed about the lack of Xenomorph DNA in Prometheus and HOW we still never got any ANSWERS to at least HOW/WHEN/WHY the Xenomorph was Created/Discovered.

So Faced with a bit of Back-Lash and then seeing a Great Interest in Blomkamps ALIEN 5 we can assume that FOX feared a Prometheus Sequel that never gave us the Xenomorph, Face Huggers, Eggs and how they was Created, would not attract Fans to see a Prometheus 2..  We can ASSUME a lot of why Prometheus did well was because some Fans thought Prometheus would be a ALIEN movie with enough Answers to those Questions or would Set-Up a Sequel that would Answer them.

So its likely FOX felt that going the Prometheus 2 route to Steer Away from the Xenomorph and Origins of the Beast, would not attract or make the Money that Prometheus did when Fans Read the SYNOPSIS and discover this movie would be no more ALIEN than Prometheus was.

So with Blomkamps Alien 5 gaining interest from the Fans, it appears FOX/RS decided to give us a movie that would give us the Xenomorph, that would explain WHO/WHEN/WHY it was created and set up a Sequel/Sequels that would maybe drive us to the Space Jockey and Back Door of ALIEN.

For them HOWEVER Alien Covenant Financially did not do well, not compared to how they thought, they must have felt they TICKED all the BOXES of what many Fans Did-Not like with Prometheus  and i would not be surprised if FOX had assumed Alien Covenant would make $400M+

This now brings us to a STICKY SITUATION as they Gave Fans the Xenomorph, they Gave Fans something different (Neomorph) they Began to Answer WHO/WHY/WHEN but the decision to make it a product of DAVID is something that appears to displeased more fans than those who warmed to such a Curve-Ball 

So they have to work out WHY AC disappointed. Was it how the Engineers was dealt with?, was it because of how Dr Shaw was? But for the Alien Fanboys its a case of a Movie Marketed to Scare the $"%£^ out of us and teased to be a bit of ALIEN Horror, with a bit of ALIENS Action when the Movie Lacked in both as those kind of scenes were very brief...   And so we are left with Characters who maybe we could not connect to and a Story that appears to be Driven more by David/Walter than anything else.

So for them its how do they get out of the Corner they backed into?  the series RS wishes to tell, appears to be to steer away from too much Xenomorph and to be about Creation and AI and Philosophy a TWO movie Venture that would introduce the Engineers again, plus other players and the Xenomorph in what may give us the FINALE of the DERELICT

Setting up a TWO movie Route, where the First is more David, less Xenomorph is a RISKY investment, because even if the Budget is $150M for TWO back-to-back movies.  If the First does not attract or please the Fans, then its going to be a HARD TASK to claw back interest and money with the 2ND movie (2nd Sequel to AC)

If they go for a ONE movie Prequel, Fans are going to expect it to Answer the Derelict/Space Jockey, some Fans may hope that David is not the Creator and a lot of Shoe-honing has to be done from Covenant to Alien and with the Set-Up from Alien Covenant regarding Daniels, how do they use her Character now?  If they give us ONE movie and introduce NEW Characters with the Plot that Ends up with the Space Jockey then how do Human Characters fit in a ONE movie story and be able to give us depth to them?

The only Solution has to be a VERY well done 2.5 hour movie.

As fascinating a character David is, it has interestingly picked up on some of human's worse traits and perhaps unintentionally. It makes compelling arguments to justify its actions but really is a monster by human standards. It only cares about itself and its own agenda and therefore should be remembered as an android- why I refer to David as it. Walter lacked some independent characteristics but had a better shot of being more human- and for that he had to die.

You were the remote control? Luxury! I had to do that and hold the rabbit antenna to get a decent signal. That meant having to watch a show upside down if I was lucky. 

Thanks, Tiwaz! The happenings on Sevastopol are part of "The Weyland-Yutani Report" so I suppose we can consider that as canon? It explains why the colonists didn't find the derelict. According to "River of Pain", Carter Burke gives Newt's parents the coordinates to check it out. But why wait 22 years (even longer) when the company had known about it for a very long time?

This is what they should do...

Stop worrying about what the people want and make an ALIEN movie!

I understand that money needs to be made, but when there is less money being spent, it's hard NOT to make money.

I guess to get a movie as great as Prometheus looked requires some extra cash to spend.  Still, I think Fox and Ridley are to worried about money.  The story keeps changing so they can get more money, RIGHT?!  Where's the story that makes the Alien franchise ALIEN?

I guess FOX (and now Disney obviously) are focused on taking a amazing franchise and capitalizing it to make as much money off of it as possible.  I think Fox, and I think Disney will follow (as we can take evidence from the new Star Wars), is to worried about money.  Greedy people are in control of the franchise.

Was the original ALIEN weighed down by greed?  I think ALIEN was about making a movie!

I mean, Prometheus did fairly well, money-wise, did it not?  Why would the story get changed, but for the desire to make even MORE MONEY!?  Now everything gets on hold because the vision is now lost and all the corporate want is MORE MONEY!  It's all about money.

I don't think this is new news though.  Greed is a part of the original 4 as well.  Still, Prometheus came about because Ridley Scott just loves the Alien franchise and feels like he had the right direction to go after ALIEN.  Finally he got to tell his story in 2012.  I'm glad it was told.  I'm glad we got Alien: Covenant too, but I just wish this corporate greed wasn't taking control of the WHOLE story.

Aren't these prequels supposed to be coming from Ridley Scott's work?  Fox wants to make money and that's understandable, but hasn't the greed just gone to far?

WHERE IS THE STORY?!  The fans are looking for answers, yet everything just keeps on changing...

::sigh::

You bâtard, lol!!!! I just realised this was an April Fools prank, sigh.

I don't think there was. it just seemed to me like the urns explode due to a change in pressure perhaps or maybe some form of time delay, mixing the 2 liquids inside. there didn't seem to be any other defences other than the cloaking of the planet and the scorpion ship. but I may be wrong. im not gna waste my time watching it again or reading the book again. but u def would think that if this was the homeworld of the engineers then, with their level of tech, there would have been more or at least better defences put in place to protect themselves.

no idea suppose its got to be given some designation n im sure there wouldv been other things discovered that they didn't have a sample of

Ali81 the only thing is that if it were then it would have a more detailed designation because the only real reason I can think of for the XX designation is because they haven't been able to get any specimens for study but know for an absolute fact based on evidence like maybe footage that they exist, and I can't imagine how bacteria or other microorganisms would have evidence like that but not get a hold of any specimens.

they could be anything, microbes, bacteria etc that's been found offworld