New Replies (Page 566)
Two matters came into my mind after I had written my post.
1) The next film will not come quickly.
2) They must not make the same mistake as Covenant and listen to an element of the fanbase. Deep fans of all franchises share a commonality of view. I have been associated with three and they all share a very strong repeated behavioural quality they are highly conservative and essential demand more of the same a handful of people recognise the need to "stay in the spirit AND move on".
For the much bigger audience unless it is fresh, vigorous, creative and audacious they would much rather just go back to the original. Repetition in commercial terms is the law of diminishing returns.
There is nothing wrong being passionate about our hobbies but it is much more difficult to add to that perspective and put yourself in the broader audiences place.
The next film needs reviews which basically say "Yes I recognised the world in which it was set but boy was I surprised go see this film its fresh!!"
The dumb scientist arguments are right for the wrong reasons. The audience see it coming so they assume the players will to, its not about protocols, its about repetition makes everything ironic. Kane was as stupid as Oram or Milburn its just he was first.
You have to make a film where no one sees anything coming... or not go in that direction go in a direction no one is expecting.
Michelle Johnston Exactly. This is promising, it suggests more creativity will be invested on the next project. And this is the first official confirmation I see that Ridley Scott is still on board. However, I never saw his name along with that of Emma Watts, production president and vice chairman for 20th Century Fox. I wonder what that means. Snider also said something like "you are in trouble when you stay in a too familiar groove". I predict there will be a lot of discussions and negotiations and Fox won't greenlight the first pitch they get.
if one looks at the entire interview and its context then we have :-
1) A new CEO who has taken over within the last year.
2) A recognition that the Alien Universe, one of Fox's franchises is rich with potential but that essentially you can either
a) Retread.
or
b) Come up with a fresh invigorating story, setting or villain.
She acknowledges that A:C was disappointing at the box office.
It is therefore entirely logical to take the view that she believes to capture that additional larger audience way beyond the core fan base you need a terrific story that is fresh and that the reason that A:C was disappointing was because it was none of those things.
That seems to me the only logical explanation and if so it is encouraging because A:C was a well made well executed film which did not capture the wider audience because it was routine and predictable. (Everyone dies because of a Xenomorph supported by a robot)
I am quiet sure she believes that what captures the wider audience is not pulse rifles or dealing with a perceived lack of risk protocols but a fantastic story where the jeopardy and proposition is genuinely unique so that we are genuinely immersed and genuinely frightened and we can identify with the character(s) and desire for survival.
The only issue she did not address is whether a franchise like Alien is the correct place to weave in a philosophical underpin to the story I hope her view is that a crucial part of the Alien Universe is its unique and uncomfortable view of creation. Otherwise its just another "Bug Hunt".
Clearly it is recognised that A:C was a disappointment and she identifies how a franchise to survive and grow needs to deliver, thats a good place to start.
But remember, the higher the attendance is, usually the more time it takes to putter out of theaters. World of KJ member was nice enough to answer some questions for comparison: Officially, Kogyotsushin has Prometheus's opening weekend at $3.6 million with 200,180 in admissions. That led to a final take of $23.3 million with 1.24M in attendance.
138,297 in attendance is a pretty massive drop. Unless it shows some substantial legs $10 million is the best that can be hoped for with a likely embarrassing attendance number. (Again, unless there are some significant box office price changes.)
It's also important to note that pirating is not a big issue in Japan. The laws against pirating are far more strict than they are in America--It's not that it doesn't happen, but it's not as prominent of a "market" (black market?) as it is in the States. Not enough to make much of a dent in audience attendance anyway.
I dunno what FOX has planne but yeah I'm with you, especially on the points of ship-to-ship combat.
I make a deliberate point of putting that into ALIEN: Manticore 'Paradise', and just to assure people it is NOT going to be:
STAR TREK: OMG we're hopelessly outclassed and they're using us for gunnery practice!
I establish in ALIEN: Manticore's prologue that the ship is pretty heavily armed.
Time to get the guns firing.
Roger55 The source is an interview to Fox's CEO published by Variety. The Alien franchise is addressed in one single question. But the rest of the interview is interesting too to put things into context.
http://variety.com/2017/film/features/stacey-snider-21st-century-fox-first-year-1202563799/
RIPLEY (Smiling): Not all the way out.
ALIEN: Manticore has a direct sequel in ALIEN: Manticore 'Paradise', and yes, heh there'll be cute little neomorphs scampering around.
So cute as babies, then they grow up, bite heads off people...
ALIEN: LV-426 is an Indirect follow-up, as it's set five years after the events of ALIEN: Manticore. It's my take on doing ALIENS as-per staying true to the original creature from ALIEN.
And if folks think they had a rough time in ALIENS, well, the poor folks in ALIEN: LV-426 have a much worse time of it. :D
BOTH are in the works, and coming along nicely. I'm focussing on the Final Proof Edit of ALIEN: Manticore, but that'll be done pretty quickly. :)
Great news!, I will cheking out where this source coming from because all this is confusing, I mean the timeline on the story and where it will end this time, David logbook new endevours or a drastic change, Engineers striking back...
Thank you for your compliment Cerulean Blue. I hadn't considered this until I read "during one of my underwater expeditions" in David 8's notes...then, wow.
Blackwinter-witch ohhhh a sequel already in the works?! May I ask, does Manticore involve the Neomorphs at all?
yep I agree 100%, David created an Alien, not THE Alien.
Call replies, "And now they've brought the beast out of you."
Your welcome. :)
One of the most telling things in this controversy is one of R. Scott's comments that the ships on LV-223 are 'A few centuries newer', which does give us a reasonable date (as those ships were at least a couple millenia old) that flat-out kills the idea of David having created The Alien (as encountered by Nostromo).
Any way you slice it, the Derelict is too old for it to be connected to David's plots and planning except via Time-Travel.
Speaking of The Alien, I am looking forward to the audience meeting my interpretation.
ALIEN: Manticore serves as a 'Teaser' regarding them.
The upcoming story ALIEN: LV-426 is the proper buffet where they get to strut.
Lilly (Svanya) I don't think they are dropping David altogether. But I don't see Walter coming back. We will see less Fassbender for sure.
Are they going to drop David/Walter now, just like the Shaw storyline was dropped too? This is mighty frustrating. :(
The 'Back Cover' synopsis for ALIEN: Manticore, inspired by the one on my ancient paperback copy of ALIEN, and it's a genuine 1979 issue. :)
Voyage Interrupted…
A routine voyage home sleeping in the cold embrace of hibernacula. However, in their cold slumber the six starfarers had left their universe behind. After encountering one ruined vessel in the depths of open space with a missing crew they come upon a strange and indecipherable signal. This one followed by another, recognizably Human distress signal. Now, on two worlds lit by a sun with sickly-yellow rays they set out to rescue their fellows. But they would carry weapons. For who could truly tell who and what it was that called to them? All they knew was that something mysterious and Alien was involved.
Blackwinter-witch thank you. Half of my post disappeared with the rest of my Pro-Ridley points lol. I have edited them back in.
I guess the bottom line is; don't judge the David creator angle just yet, lets wait and see what revelations arise in Awakening :)
Speaking for my take on things, and in support of IRaptus, David basically tooled-up a 'knock-off', a Xenomorph
NOT an Alien.
No, I don't care what folks call them, to me it will always and ever will be The Alien.
Xenomorph is too....Identified, in feeling. Once you Name your fear, it loses it's power.
Also, name of the franchise is ALIEN, and not 'Xenomorph', which really sounds just kinda silly, really. Like a kitten sneeze. :)
Thank-you!! I admit, I had my doubts at times if I'd get it finished, but I bulled on ahead and just powered through the times when the Muse seemed to have wandered off. :)
Well, if FOX wants new ideas, this is the site they should be following, there's a lot of great writers here!
Best advice I can give, is try to get at least a little writing in each day. It doesn't matter if it's good, or whatever, that can all be fixed in editing, right?
The trick, Mr. IRaptus, is in the accumulation of small efforts into an aggregate whole. ;)
Fatheredcat Yes, I agree they have to modify this notion that David is almighty. Actually in the prologue to Covenant Weyland should have turned him off the instant he said "You will die, I will not". That is simply false because he is matter and matter wears off and crumbles. He should know better that the universal truth of Ozymandias applies to him as well. And as you said he did not invent anything neither, he just played with Gods' toys.
Neomorph said, "Please let him drift into space and disappear."
I think Fox has a very unique opportunity with David and the Alien franchise, the opportunity is linking future Alien movies that take place around a half of a century after David was first brought to life to the prequels. A chance like this for the Alien Franchise probably wont happen again anytime soon. Well, that's the advantage in concise terms...
Plus, I want to see the line between the Prequels and the main story blurred a little. I think David can provide that opportunity in a very small and restricted role in the possible reboots. If Alien: Awakening doesn't give David a small role, it would be nice to see what that is like in the possible reboots.
Also, I don't know if there is a death good enough to kill the almighty creator, master flute player, and so on, David.
Ati I'm currently not looking for a job at Fox. What are you talking about :-)
I'm with you on this one @Fatheredcat, Alien Covenant, although a good film overall and in itself imo, figuratively took a huge dump on the mysterious (not anymore) origin of the xenomorph the same way Prometheus took a huge dump on the space jockey, by similarly reducing the mystery and alien factor on the humongous pilot by turning him into a suit containing a human-like creature.
It all relates/connects back to earth regardless of which species came first in this regard.
:D :D
'I understand how difficult it must be for you to see your David/Walter soap opera crumble into oblivion.'
Are you talking about one of your copyrighted Alien short stories? :D
I understand how difficult it can be for you to face the fact that your Alien scripts are not wanted by Fox. :)
'What did you expect?'
Exactly the pieces of information revealed by Snider.
'Just suck it up, man.'
No comment. :D
Fatheredcat Ridley Scott is ignoring the predator tie-ins (and for good reason). They don't factor into the story one bit.
Ati Dude I didn't use any piece of information. I was just giving an example of how you take anything I say the wrong way. You are the one who needs to relax. I understand how difficult it must be for you to see your David/Walter soap opera crumble into oblivion. What did you expect? Just suck it up, man.
In fairness, David bio-engineered his own variant of the Xenomorph from existing Engineer technology. He sort of reverse-engineered the black pathogen as he saw fit.
Did he create the classic Xenomorph as we know it? Possibly; and I agree that would be a bit of a disappointment.
But he did not create the Black Pathogen that causes the 'Morph mutations, and there are endless ancient evil possibilities in that regard. Who knows what the Engineers have created and are lurking out there somewhere. Who knows what else the Mutagen is capable of. For example - We know the Engineers knew of the Deacon from the mural in Prometheus. We only ever saw the juvenile.......
During David's genetic tinkering he annihilated an entire city of Engineer-folk. Ridley Scott has already announced they will return in the next film, and you can bet they will return with vengeance.
We have yet to see the Engineers on a warpath - they have been mostly peaceful up until now.
We know from Alien onwards, that man and the Xenomorph appear to be the only aggressive lifeforms out there in space.
So it is my guess that Awakening will be a battle of the species, to highlight why both humanity and the xenomorph (that are spawned from us) are the best fit survivor.
I wonder how this will turn out, if it does. 'Groundbreaking'. It could expand to anything really.
I wonder if we'll see David again. The poetic, evil yet softly erotic, smooth-talking, flute-loving android scientist.
...
Please let him drift into space and disappear.
*hopes in vain*
We need a fight out in space. There is none of that in any of the alien movies and I want to see what those writers can come up with with futuristic space ship design and weaponry. That could really bring a completely new environment to the franchise. I've seen members post pictures of different futuristic environments on A:C and I think if the writers took time to develop more ships and their environments, we could get a completely new atmosphere than the lone ship out in space (like we seem to always get with any Alien movie). The fight doesn't have to be the whole movie, but I would like some.
ALSO! I want David to somehow survive Alien: Awakening so when the recently purposed reboot of the Alien franchise could happen, David can make the return since Michael Fassbender will still have his looks and skills. I think that would make a great first reboot movie. Of course, David wouldn't be the main character or villain. He could just be a strategic adviser against killing the Xeno because maybe David switches to being with the good guys? Or maybe he just tries his best to teach somehow how to make more alien variations or something like that. Or maybe he's in pieces and he can only advise. I could go on, but you get the point. I WANNA SEE DAVID IN THE ALIEN FRANCHISE REBOOT! (not much of the movie, but just a small amount so the story can be its own thing different than the prequels)
it would have been an engineer born xeno or higher being
Wow! That xeno is huge! :)
This is my opinion of the movie and what could fix it.
The idea of this silly David character(a bad copy of Lore from Star Trek. Cliche!) being the creator of the xenomorphs is just stupid. It takes away the mystique of the whole thing. I saw more flaws as well. One of the main ones is David being the creator(which was a dumb idea) when the xenomorphs were clearly around thousands of years before, indicated on Predator 2 and Alien vs predator.
The only way that can be fixed is to make it that the xenomorphs were not his creation but the genetics were already in the "black goo", and he just followed the instructions he would have gotten from the ship and the engineers base since he and the man who built him already knew their language, he could have gotten it from there. This would make sense since, David was just a fancy computer, and doesn't have a living brain which can change as it learns, making a living brain more advanced and adaptable, his mind would be more like a child even though he has information, he still wouldn't be able to think in the way we do. He would not be able to differentiate between a gardener planting an avocado seed and it growing into a tree and the gardener actually creating the tree. He could have just been planting the seed, but thinking that what came out was his creation. But they shouldn't have done it this way in the first place.
'My point was Corporal Hicks decided to quote it on his article published today.'
No, it wasn't. It was not your point. You used that piece of information to confuse people similarly to your whole comment above.
Everybody knows here that you are the troll. :D
I should repeat myself: Relax a little bit, joylitt. :)
Ati Again you are wrong. I don't understand why you make up stuff that is so easy to debunk. I don't care when that article was originally posted. My point was Corporal Hicks decided to quote it on his article published today. I understand it is his way to take the news with a grain of salt.
And BTW I didn't noticed there is another thread where that bit was highlighted by Daszkowski
I advise that you go pestering and trolling in that thread too because what Corporal Hicks says there is going to really bother you. A preview just for you:
"I made this comment earlier, before this post was made, that the executives at Fox are not going to be quick to finance another Alien movie. What he is saying to Ridley is, "back to the drawing board". And Ridley is no spring chicken."
IRaptus - Please help joylitt. :) You are from Australia. The link added by me leads to an Australian site. The article in question with Fred Baron's words is from July. Please visit the link and after that please tell me that I am right. :)
The link again:
I would be grateful if you could find this section in the article:
While Ridley Scott has previously said he wants to shoot two more Alien movies, Alien Covenant struggled to sell enough tickets to ensure another instalment.
"It got great reviews and was everything we set out for it to be, it just didn't hit the note at the box office," says Fred Baron, the 20th Century Fox executive on the movie: "It will be a profitable film for the studio but whether there's another one [is uncertain]."
I have no problems with Corporal Hicks but I'm sure you did not read the avpgalaxy article by him carefully enough. :)
That article contains a link which leads you to another internet article written months ago in July. In my previous comment I added the direct link to that source. :) In other words, Fred Baron's words were said and published in July.
It's September now. :D
You should relax a little bit. :)
Blackwinter-witch Congratulations on finishing a full novel, that is an achievement in itself!!! Well done
it may be the perfect time for Manticore to be released with the current state of things.
FOX and co seem to be looking around for fresh ideas and visions.......
On that note, I'd better get cracking myself ;-)
Ati You are wrong. That was posted today by Corporal Hicks. Obviously you would have problems with him too.
http://www.avpgalaxy.net/2017/09/20/20th-century-fox-ceo-talks-future-alien-franchise/
And yes, it is tiresome to reply to your nonsense. You are just too narrow minded.
joylitt - :D :D :D
Those lines are from an article from JULY 2017! :D To be more precise: 8th July. :D
Here you are, the link:
Your comments are a little bit tiring but I understand your bitterness. :)
How could the Covenant's mission purpose reflect around acquiring alien technology? It's a colonization mission according to WY. The Covenant just flew very suspiciously close to Planet 4 on their way to colonize Origae-6. Maybe WY created the Covenant mission to provide hosts for David is apparently one theory (as we see in this thread), but then there is evidence in Advent that suggests that WY never knew of David's location. I wish I could watch Advent again, but I do remember David formerly introducing himself, like he's meeting the viewer on the other end of the video for the first time. He breaks down everything he did in that transmission, basically, like WY never seen or heard of anything David has been doing on Planet 4 since after the Prometheus mission lost contact.
Sorry, I'm not ready to jump on this new bandwagon of a theory just yet. I think my theory is more plausible when considering what has been presented so far, but maybe that's just a little of my pride too. Plus, depending on how you look at it, the neutrino burst plays a part in the crew discovering Planet 4, yet it does depend where you're getting your facts from as well. The movie and the novel both have their viewpoints on the neutrino burst when you analyze the conspiracy that is the Covenant mission.
ali81 makes sense of this theory in this thread and I pretty much feel the same way. Still, communication could've been done through Engineer technology. David knows the language and apparently knows how a juggernaut works fairly well. I wouldn't be surprised if he went to a local Planet 4 library and learned some more things about Engineer technology, which would lead him into connecting with people on Earth in some way or another... like hacking, for example.
David seems like a hacker to me because he hated serving Weyland and looked forward to being free and enjoyed making himself as perfect as possible in addition to his experiments. Why would any android so against serving humans be on a servant mission for WY in the movie A:C. We know how much he hates how androids are "built to serve" in A:C. I don't see how David is serving WY. I don't think he would even trick them that he is serving them because David wants to protect what he has made and knows WY could easily copy him if they had the goo, eventually.
I wish I could have the book now, but I prefer reading in paperback. I'm telling you this, there must be some great stuff that prequel book because I don't know why else they would release it?
