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The original Space jockeys fait!

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willbo

MemberOvomorphSep-25-2012 10:37 AM
HI, had some great response to my last question. So many question running through my head now. Has it ever been explained what happened to the engineer in Alien. I know they found him dead in his chair, where his ribs had been broke, ie. a Alien burst from within him, killed him in flight and crashed. So one of the face huggers hatched and lay an egg inside him before/during the flight, and therefore there must have been a xeno in the ship, possibly a queen, laying eggs? or were all those eggs being transported somewhere! Was it the queen we saw in Aliens? Thanks Will
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Cypher

Co-AdminMemberOvomorphSep-25-2012 10:44 AM
That is exactly the question I had hoped to have answered with Prometheus............. And I'll bet you 10 bucks that Shaw ends up being the Space Jockey.
[url=http://www.robocopmovie.net/][img]http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac89/snorkelbottom/NewRoboBanner.jpg[/img][/url] "Is it dead this time?" "I dunno, poke it with this stick and see."

Voidhawk

MemberOvomorphSep-25-2012 11:05 AM
Ridley Scott already erased that line of thought. That juggernaut was a millitary cargo vessel carrying weapons (the eggs we see) to a given destination, yet to be disclosed. Those were weapons to be deployed around 2200 up to 1800 years prior to the movie by RS words, so unless Shaw ships get back to the past, she is not that one there (and she would be living inside that suit, huge as it was to her size relatively). The eggs were ready, primed weapons whereas in Prometheus we see the urns with possibly many different bio-materials, possibly spoiling after the chamber was exposed to human presence and outer atmosphere. Aww my, and I hope this Queen thing gets erased FOREVER! Lets bring back something really alien and not this Space Ant Monster concept which so diminished the original concept...
[IMG]http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f234/VoidHawk555/CORE-Copy.png[/IMG]

BigDave

MemberDeaconSep-25-2012 12:19 PM
As Voidhawk said.. Ridley has in a few interviews already confirmed his fate and why there are a few unanswered questions about it mind. 1) The Space Jockey was a brother to those in Prometheus.. thus a Engineer (although a near 15ft one). 2) The Juggernaut and Derelict are the same kinds of ship, the Juggernaut is in as good as new and pristine condition, the Derelict is dead and degraded. 3) The Derelict was a Warship a Bomber of sorts, well it was a Cargo Ship that was carrying a Cargo of Bio Weapons. 4) The ship was on its way from LV 223 (i could be wrong about this) to a undisclosed location. When one of its Cargo had got lose and got to the Pilot. 5) The Pilot knowing he was infected set a course for the nearest baron moon so he could Quarantine the Cargo, and he set off the Warning Beacon. 6) The ship then made a emergency landing on LV 426. 7) The Derelict had been on LV 426 for thousands of years by the time the Nostromo Crew found it in Alien. 8 ) The mission of that Pilot to Transport the Cargo of Bio Weapons had occurred within a few hundred years of the event that caused the outbreak on LV 223 and killed of most of the Engineers and thus 1800-2200 years ago. 9) It was a Face Hugger that got to the Pilot and he had a traditional Chest Buster. 10) That the Pilot was Benevolent and performed a Heroic Act. What he has not covered is... a) Where the Ship was going. b) Why it had the Cargo. c) Where the Cargo came from. d) How did they come across the Xeno. e) Exactly how the Cargo became compromised and got to the Pilot.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Voidhawk

MemberOvomorphSep-25-2012 12:33 PM
Yeah, and those questions might be answered on the sequel. One thing is, saying it was a brother might not mean that it was an engineer, but that it had the same origin, thus are related... This might pint out that: -They are indeed bio-tools created by an yet not shown force; -Their species has also been seeded by an ancient not shown Seeder Race who created more than one species out there, different yet sharing the same origin; -The SJ on the first movie is the enemy the aliens in shown in Prometheus are battling, brothers by in different sides. The original Space Jockey was, both in the book and in the movie, depicted as being benevolent and honored, from a benevolent race...so they might be the ones against the ones shown in the movie so far, locked in battle against these Egineers we see. Saying they are brothers does not immediately means they are the same nor that they are in the same side... Something to consider... Using an example for the xeno lovers out there (myself NOT being one) the xeno we saw at the end of the movie is a "brother" to the one we saw in Alien, yet it is not the same ...
[IMG]http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f234/VoidHawk555/CORE-Copy.png[/IMG]

Rubirosa

MemberOvomorphSep-25-2012 2:34 PM
First of all forget about the Queen theory. The Xeno's do not need a Queen to reproduce. That is why they have host bodies for. Which are mainly humanoid tupe beings like us and the Engineers. Jim Cameron invented the Queen concept in Aliens and changed Ridleys original concept of the Xeno's being biological weapons that are produced by the Engineers in urns. The Queen concept has only damaged the Alien universe.    Also I will bet anybody 100 bucks that Shaw is not the original Space Jockey. The story of the original Space Jockey takes place at least 2000 years before the story of Prometheous. The only way that Shaw could transform herself into the original Space Jockey is if the alien she was caring somehow left some residue inside her body and it eventually will transform her into the original SJ. She then would have to go back in time and begin her mission, and then crash land on LV-426. 

Voidhawk

MemberOvomorphSep-25-2012 5:22 PM
Exactly that, and I am happy to see another fellow member who sees how damaging, demeaning and unnecessary the Queen's concept is. A cheap tricky to make two female warriors do battle...cheap and unnecessary, making the original concept becoming the Attack of the Space Ants franchise, which ultimately spent the whle thing...damned change that should have never taken place IF the original concept was kept faithful, depicting something more original that the Terrible Space Ants. Another thing is this penchant for All Altering DNA Stuff. Such bioweapon could be even dangerous by design to its wielder as much as for the target. A lot more elegant, and still very efficient, is the original concept of a creature that could USE any bilogical being as a host to its pup, not altering itself and such, but just using the body of any biological being to implant its pup and then grew another aggressive adult form, primed to search new beings to spread itself. A bioweapon with probably a short lifespam and very aggressive behavior. A concept ideal for a bioweapon and still manageable after its deployment. Not altering itself to the host, mind you, but able to use any body as a host. That and its acidic blood would make a very damaging intruding force in any battle... And actually it used only intelligent targets...Jonesy was left untouched i more than one scene, which brings the idea that as a bioweapon, it was primed to target bigger, more intelligent prey. That was the idea at first, which was degraded by James Cameron movie and then everything derailed fast...concept wise, as monster movies can bring people to the movie theaters for a time, but will die eventually of its own boredom (what came to happen, by the way, with the old franchise)
[IMG]http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f234/VoidHawk555/CORE-Copy.png[/IMG]

Rubirosa

MemberOvomorphSep-25-2012 7:46 PM
I agee with everything you just stated @Voidhawk!

Voidhawk

MemberOvomorphSep-25-2012 8:18 PM
The whole DNA altering babling which seems so much loved by many, is something "alien" to the first movie (and book...yes, yes, the book!) and was brought by Cameron and its crew as something to desesperately bring some novelty to a title that had a lot of weight already, for exactly all the originality and aesthetics it brought, all the mind provoking imagens (thankfully without those abandoned artworks which found its way in Giger's compilation artwork for the movie (I have that book by the way) and the concepts of true alien looking beings (without being silly, as some did in times prior to that movie). Bioweapons, ancestral conflicts, giants, lurking terrors in the night. I recall when the sequel was released that it was deemed a good sequel because it had a good pace and a good direction, but it was nowhere as inovative and original as Alien. The original concept of the bioweapon, its nature and durability, everything was well thight, and Scott knew what put and what not...and everything that came later was a slow downgrading to the original concept, something many do share with us my friend. Ridley Scott could have rewritten everything and putting back in its trail aligning it with Alien alone, but well, lets see what comes... Anyway I have the first Alien Director's Cut on my drives, and only that movie. The rest I never really got enough interest and maybe Prometheus will deliver more in the sequel. Same goes with Predator, as I have only Predator, Predator 2 and Predators, which seems to have really rejuvenated the series, as a sequel is on the way...
[IMG]http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f234/VoidHawk555/CORE-Copy.png[/IMG]

willbo

MemberOvomorphSep-26-2012 6:03 AM
i agree with Voidhawk. The original Alien had a much better, darker type of narrative. More of a sci-fi mystery film rather than hollywood Action film. Thats how i would have directed Prometheus, made it really really indepth. Everyone on the ship the leading experts at Weyland, highly organized expedition, surveying the planet, creating a plan of action, saftey measures ect. Completely baffled the audience with lingo that is foreign to humans today. Then I would have shown very little in terms of action. Literally the whole film just builds upto finding the living engineer, a hint someone is infected, leaving the planet and a closing scene of a chest burster, again seeing very little. So where did the chest burster from the original SJ go, i take it it went on and left the ship and lived on the planet? do they have life spans?? W

asphaltpilot

MemberOvomorphSep-26-2012 6:35 AM
I have often wondered where the chestburster went in Alien. Given that it is a biological being, it eventually just died somewhere far outside the ship. But we don't know for sure what the lifespan is for the engineers. If they live a very long time and chestbursters often take some DNA from its host, then who knows.

BigDave

MemberDeaconSep-26-2012 2:22 PM
Well DNA altering is not just new to Aliens... The Deleted Alien scene showed Dallas and Brett being turned into Eggs, well Brett was and so genetically he was being altered and mutated which means his DNA could be being changed? Regardless this is what we see in Prometheus somehow the Goo changes one life form into another that has some of its Original Traits and also Xeno Traits. So this is some kind of DNA/Genome altering/Mutating process. I understand where they went with Aliens as in Alien we see Eggs and well how does most Eggs come to be.... thats right laid by something. The idea of lifeforms being changed into Eggs is well a bit bizarre as far as using that as a explanation to the Eggs on the Derelict, really we do not know how they was created or came to be. And maybe Ridley will tell us, or maybe he would not tell us enough to give us a clear indication on how they came to be, only he may say they was created from something or by something. Both Alien Turns Host into Eggs and Alien Queen Lays Eggs are both flawed as use as a Bio Weapon, they are perfect for a Organism that would try and procreate itself but as a Weapon.... Far from Perfect as far as those who are using them as a Weapon. A Flame Thrower is a more perfect Weapon than a Gun, but it has major flaws a Nuke is more perfect than a normal bomb but again has a major flaw or two, And thus the Xeno is also a Major Flawed Weapon.... unless we take Alien the Original Cut and thats this Organism evolves and comes into play from the Face Hugger implanting a Embryo into a Host, and the Organism end product the Xeno then goes on a rampage and kills off the targets areas indigenous life before eventually the Xeno dies... No Queen, No ability to create more Xenos and Eggs from its victims. It grows, it kills then it dies.... = Near Perfect Bio Weapon. The Alien DC Egg Morphing and Aliens Queen are both concepts that make a Near Perfect Organism but Flawed Bio Weapon.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

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