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Indy John
MemberOvomorphOct-23-2012 11:11 AMIn relaying this series scenes I notice that Weyland introduced Holloway first..before Shaw..which to me says that Holloway is the leader in the Science Dept..
In fact Charlie cheerfully delivers the information about the trip and seemed enthused..a sharp contrast to his later drinking days..and even his death preference at the hands of Vickers.
I don't think there was one positive reaction to any of the crew members about this mission..which seems kind of strange,, Although it is a job,,still the grand scale of the Prometheus adventure should have appealled to at least some of them...
Finally I couldn't help my notice a brief Vicker's smile when Fifield questioned if this voyage is based on kids discovering a cave drawing,,,
Be choicelessly aware as you move through life
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asphaltpilot
MemberOvomorphOct-23-2012 3:16 PMHolloway may have been the lead on this from their respective science organization, even though Shaw may have had the brains. He also wears his heart on his sleeve, which explains his excitement in the beginning, his temper and quick disappointment when they didn't find what they wanted (“it’s just another tomb”), which of course led to the drinking. You wouldn’t think that a scientist like him would have those emotional attributes, but I believe that besides Shaw and one or two other crew members, Vickers hired the bottom-of-the barrel crew members/contractors for this mission. *
There isn’t much enthusiasm by the rest of the crew at the briefing because it was mostly kept secret. Also, I’m finding that time travel makes everybody very grouchy, at least in the Prometheus/Alien universe. In every movie after cryosleep (whatever you want to call it) everyone is cranky as hell.
What’s interesting is that some (most?) of the crew did their first introductions coming out of cryosleep. How does this happen? The only thing I can think of is that some went into cryosleep as others were still coming on board the Prometheus, or they went into cryosleep on their respective colonies, then delivered or picked up by Prometheus.
* Vickers may have been responsible in enlisted the crew. It’s evident she either wants the mission to fail. It’s because she either doesn't believe in the mission or hates the real boss/financier (Weyland), or both. Because of this, she hires bottom-of-the-barrel skillset to make the mission work. I liken it to hiring mercenaries. When presenting something like a multi-year mission when the destination and mission is secret, there aren't going to be too many top quality people saying “ok.”
Vickers: I’m looking for a Geologist for a multi-year mission. I need XYZ skillset.
Fifield: For what? What kind of mission?
Vickers: That’s classified until we get to our destination.
Fifield: No thanks, that’s crazy.
Vickers: We’ll pay you $30 million dollars.
Fifield: I’m in.
Vickers hated this from the beginning. “They were right,” then Janek states “You wanted them to be wrong?” Why, yes, Janek. Yes she did.
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Indy John
MemberOvomorphOct-23-2012 4:13 PMI think Vickers may have wanted this mission to fail,,and also wanted to safely return Janek was a good hire..at least he showed some leadership when searching for Fifield and had to return to the ship..in a hurry..
Holloway fall from the story's beginning to his demise..would be an interesting study,,
I especially liked the scene with Shaw where he seemingly care for her,..even if she was barren....Still what a twist of fate to impregnate her with an alien..
Be choicelessly aware as you move through life
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Mala'kak
MemberOvomorphOct-23-2012 8:21 PMHolloway did a tour on Mars ;)
I think part of it is definitely Vickers picking people she felt were somewhat incompetent but more so people she felt could be easily led and deceived.
Remember she's still kind of following Weyland's orders in a way. Her and David both know he's aboard and about his true plan. Both may dislike it. Both may want the king to die and be jealous of each other in their own ways. Both may have felt they should be on the throne...
The other part of it could be that there is a lot of incompetent people in the barrel to choose from. A barrel full of monkey wrenches. She wanted tools she could control... because Vickers is not really in control-- she minimizes risk so she can continue to stay in control. She likes to minimize risk.
She's aboard the ship to make sure nothing goes wrong and everything goes wrong at the same time... sort of what David may be doing under the surface.
She obviously wanted to keep herself alive and wasn't suicidal if she was minimizing the risk to herself the whole time, living in a life-cabin.
So why then is she hiring a team of incompetent morons?
Part of it is she wants to ensure Weyland dies on his foolish mission, but the other part is that not all of them are complete morons. They're simply too obedient, like humanoid robots who she feels are easy to control and deceive.
I have a feeling she told Jackson that under no circumstances was he to not have a weapon on him, Shaw tries to tell him no weapons and Jackson says alright good luck with that. Jackson was hired as an obedient little pawn, a non-essential character who she hoped would be helpful to her cause.
I don't think she really wanted to risk her own life too much, so although she may have wanted the mission to be a failure she was forced to try to balance that with ensuring her own safety a little (Jackson, living on the lifeboat).
She may have thought Fifield was a tough guy but as I said there's another part to it.
Think of the way the characters speak and the cliches they use-- they're all so old by that point in time. This isn't a script problem, it's meant to reflect the fact that the culture has gone somewhat stale... like the Engineers... their emotions are somewhat subdued, the responses and actions are fueled mainly by ego and false ego. Those who question authority like Fifield only do so for so long and are driven mainly by money. David didn't think Shaw had it "in her". Real emotion, intuition, survival skills and logic that is combined in the right way... most of the earth-born people of this period don't. These are different from humans who've been colony born or grew up a little later in the timeline. These are all earthborn characters who've been living in a culture Weyland created and morphed. Weyland gave them all their advanced tech and answers to many medical questions. We became too dependent on our leaders, and Weyland became the king of Earth and all her colonies through his ego and brilliance.
He became a major influence on human culture during his reign over the timeline.
He treated the humans as his subjects and beneath him the entire time even though he says "we are the gods" but it's Weyland who was seen as a king by Vickers and the creator of the David 8.
More like a dictator than a fair ruler. And a ruler of many colonies-- more like a King on his way to becoming Emperor. A dictator who did a lot of good things for his people, creating almost everything to come in the Alien series but who took things too far, was too expansive and left himself open. He made the culture dependent on immediate answers & their leader who portrays himself as a god. He also severely mistreated his subjects as Prometheus shows.
It's a nature/nurture thing. Some of the people Vickers selected were incompetent, some of them appeared to have themselves in control but were really emotionally more like children because of the culture Weyland had shaped. Doesn't everyone want to kill their parents? In this case Weyland is one of the "parents" and/or the major influencer of the culture they were all born into...
Shaw and Holloway are the only ones who have proper emotions and aren't fake, this is a different sort of semi-emotionlessness than what's going on by the time Alien rolls around with the people out in space. Sorry I keep leaving out janek, he's got things right too although instead of being too egotistical like Holloway and David, Janek gave up his ego. He doesn't want control even though he would make a competent leader, he just flies the ship.
It takes a lot to get him to spring into action and take control of the situation. From his perspective and the perspective we're given it seems he makes the logical choice, and sacrifices himself for the right reasons. He's not really fake at all, although he hides the fact that he's more competent in a leadership role/military position (knows what's going on based on this prior experience) and is a "shit pilot".
Holloway was too much like Weyland in some ways, too egotistical and his emotions aren't combined with logic in the way Shaw's are. Janek needed Ravel and Chance there, however they were both betting he was making the right decision in some way. They knew he/Shaw/David might be right about the Bio-weapons and they needed to act. It seems they knew that it was Janeks call to make and not Vickers.
Vickers runs away from the call. She was never meant to be a leader or to even contemplate the big sacrifices like this. She tries to act cool but is completely shaken up after burning her "hand".
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