Vickers robot theory still lingers

Wow!

Very nice idea...I think it works!

HAWLEY GRIFFIN - Hmm...most compelling! :)

I think Vickers was played to be compared to David to make the connection of brother and sister and that enables you to see the distinction between mankind and their creations.

In Vickers we see the brutal honest reaction of mankind to her megalomanic delusional father, contrast that with the robot that plays along; Vickers baits, indeed celebrates to his face his coming death, whereas David tells the audience he wants him dead. Its the difference between immoral and amoral.

Vickers wants to escape the coming catastrophe David is curious.

Vickers riddled with protocol doesn't even work out how to avoid the Juggernaut, David on the other hand is way ahead always challenging in a passive aggressive way.

He opens the headroom door by "mistake" he is insatiably curious Vickers is continuously risk averse.    

If I am right that Shaw is already in trouble it makes sense that David with a payload of Goo would offer to return Shaw to earth. Luckily for earth she shows driven by her moral belief system some curiosity and wants to go on. Wow that was close. 

The echoes are there and I see how you make the connection but I believe it was to refract once again the creator/creation paradigm. 

"What do you think?"

I've been hearing this for a few years and never seen anything approaching a compelling argument for her to be a robot.  What exactly is it about her "paranoia, attitude and body language" that makes someone think she's a robot?

If she was a robot why didn't she physically remove Janek from control of the ship and force Chance and Ravel to fly home?

And David calls her "ma'am", not "mum".

S.M. does have a point... If she was an android, she would've taken matters into her hands. It could've made a great climax.

Also I think that she's just jealous that her father likes David, a synthetic, more than Vickers, a human daughter. Family tensions.

But, I do agree with you! False memories and consciousness would tie gracefully into the story.

Great topic, upvoted!

@S.M 

"I've been hearing this for a few years and never seen anything approaching a compelling argument for her to be a robot."  

It's been heard before because it's predominantly asked in the film...so the question lingered since 2012 and hasn't really been answered.

"What exactly is it about her "paranoia, attitude and body language" that makes someone think she's a robot?"

well that was the point of the post, just a silly theory revolving around "replicants" and how they act human, but aren't. ("More human than human" is our motto). And how Vickers does seem human all around but yet so do replicants.

they are hard to spot...replicants and Vickers seem resentful and also angry lol So my point is that even if she acts human,  is she really human?

@Michelle Johnston makes a good point about her beying just an opposite reflection of robots to human differences.

and thank you to everyone who commented and discussing :D

@Facehuggers! @S.M 

Yes you guys have a point about her mutiny if she had evil intensions. But lets say she was angry at the fact that she's not "in" the plan, and just observing...David turns off his body camera and also Weyland doesn't respond to her with any care or worry.  It's almost like they dont want her to know everything in fear of her interference..who knows....but she thinks more like a human, ...like a replicant. versus david who follows orders and has no emotions..replicants have emotions...and fear... she even didn't want to come there...when her father died she couldn't wait to go home...she was just a supervisor and a disbeliever

replicants in bladerunner wernt taking over the world, they were victims who just wanted to live and run away and live life like a regular mortal. They didn't fight for Tyrell, they hated their maker.  Like maybe Vickers hates her father.... I feel if, and thats the BIG IF....that if she is a replicant. she was the emotional and less corporate like her father... and more of a attention deprived daughter caught in the middle of weyland's plans.....complying to it to please her father.. 

but this is theoretical and I'm not claiming she is a replicant..i am only suggesting it. :)

Vickers needs a Voidcomp iris test 

I think they intended to tease it a bit more than we got but for all intensive purposes the way Vickers was, was to make us maybe cast doubt.. and ask.. is she a robot?

Lindeloff mentioned this..... bu then said she is not a Robot...  But who knows... all the clues would suggest though that no she is not a Robot so to speak.

Replicant or Clone?  Who knows..

Peter Weyland was 103 years old when he met his death on LV-223 we dont know how many years he may spent in Cryo-sleep type devices to extend his life... Micheal Jackson used to have like a cryo-pod to sleep in that was supposed to help him age less LOL

So in the future yes we could see the use of such things...

Ignoring that... Weyland Biologically would have been in his 60's when he became the Father to Vickers... assuming Vickers was born and Aged like a Human.

So its still possible Weyland could have fathered her... even if there is doubt... who is to say his Sperm had not been frozen from when he was a more fertile age?

So its interesting to speculate but i think Vickers was not Robot,  she could be a clone or replicant but i would assume she is 100% Human.

"It's been heard before because it's predominantly asked in the film...so the question lingered since 2012 and hasn't really been answered."

It was answered with Vickers inviting Janek to her quarters.

@S.M exactly, thats the scene......

So if the question was asked and answered - what basis is there for the theory.

well it wasn't answered... although Vickers may had an "intimate moment" with Janek. doesn't really say anything, because even Pris (bladerunner) was a pleasure model with those human "functions".

and even Rachel was a "full range" new Nexus replicant, able to be Tyrell's "Neice" and also be a love interest to Deckard.

I must also point out her strength..when she yanked David threatening to cut his wire... Replicants have freakish strength

Androids aren't replicants.

If we are to speculate she was a Android... well when i was working on my Prometheus 2... i had a twist..

The company was in a mess.. there was a board meeting discussing what happens now... after 4 months no contact from Prometheus (Easter Time) it seemed the board of directors had to make plans for who runs the company now...

In Weyland and Vickers Absence it was the Nephew of Peter Weyland.... as Peters Partner was his Brother who was also old, and not in great health.

I had a board meeting with this Nephew... and we then get to see Lance Henricksen communicate that he is the heir of the company and he was about to start proceedings to allow his Son to take over.

Then we see a Briefcase being opened in another place, with a Screen like a Laptop and a message from Peter Weyland and it declared his assets to be left to Vickers.  We then see a Female Hand close it.

We then go to the board meeting as everything is being sorted and signed and announced about the change of CEO due to the event of assumed Death of Weyland and Vickers..

And we hear a female say not so fast...

It is Vickers... she shows the Will and Testament and as she is alive then she runs the company..   Her Cousin is very bitter at this...

Vickers then fires him, and points out all the shares of her Fathers are to go to her and so Peters Nephew and Brother are not a member of the board.

We see Weylands Nephew has a plan, he is interested in Military Applications of Weyland Company he is not all that interested in the Terraforming and would want to sell shares... and he makes a deal with Yutani to not only corrupt things and hack Weyland Files and Accounts.... but they inform Weylands Nephew of a signal from LV-223 and they have others..

Weylands Nephew then has proof that indeed Prometheus mission was destroyed and Vickers was supposed to be on the ship... but Yutani want a deal if they are to pass the information and proof...

They want all rights to the Synthetic Patents so they can use them for their own Synthetics...

They both realize maybe Vickers never went and it was a cover up by Vickers because she knew the stunt they would pull..... its hinted that from clues that indeed this Vickers had been on Earth all along.... in hiding for 2.5 years.

To deal with this Yutani dispatch Two Synthetics of its own to Assassinate Vickers, not quite as Human looking as Weyland David 8 models.. and they are dressed as Geisha.

They confront Vickers and have a fight Scene, where Vickers holds her own and kills one.... then is wounded by the other......

AT THIS POINT!  we find that this Vickers is a Android and was part of Weylands plans should Prometheus Fail and maybe he wanted Android Vickers to run the company over his own Daughter... because he has a better bond and favoritism to his Synthetic Creations.

Vickers 8 then destroys the other Yutani Android but she is found out as Weylands Nephew arrives and shoots her so she can not walk..

Then he knows a Android has no Human Rights and so the company is all his..... 

Oh his father dies, well is killed at the orders of his Son.. as Weylands Nephew is even more Megalomaniac than Peter Weyland himself.

S.M

"Androids aren't replicants"  

yes ur correct, i may have typed that in the post..but you get what I'm saying about Replicants

that also highlights the theory I'm making,. that she was asked if she was a robot (even android)...and didn't really answer........

and goes back to your

"Androids aren't replicants"

"I must also point out her strength..when she yanked David threatening to cut his wire... Replicants have freakish strength"

They can have greater Strength....

But we also need to remember that David 8 was taken by surprise and only weighs 86KG and if we assume Vickers is strong for a female (look how she started press ups no soon as coming out of Cryo-Sleep)  then shoving a Humanoid that weights 86KG is not beyond the realms of possibility for a Human.

Good point! and I can dig that!... like i sayd its a theory lol ;) great discussion scified folks! :D

In order to even have a theory you need points to support said theory.  Like 'Could Vickers be a robot because in this scene she does this and in that other scene she does that'.  For instance, if it was kept secret that Bishop was a robot, then the knife trick would be a something that would support the theory he was a robot.

I can't see any actual points being raised for discussion in support of the theory that Vickers is a robot.  Or a replicant.

@S.M ok great, but if the post got you to respond and pick at a "thought"...then it did its job in my opinion.

Also you are trying to state FACTS, and thats fantastic and i respect that..personally i post things to stimulate imagination.

The movie gave supple hints to prove a mild Red Herring for us.. but it shows more scenes that support she was Human than the tiny red herring...

Its to make us wonder a little.... but the "my room 10 mins" was meant to show us that (ah ah) she is Human... but then we dont know if they had any Intimate Moments...  But the Scenes after support she is not a Android.

During the run up no one attached to the movie would deny or acknowledge the Robot theory... i am sure Ridley gave a red herring there could be more than one Robot in this movie.

Again its how do we know its a red herring and how do we know he meant it as such or even in regards to Vickers.

The other Robot could be the Engineer, they for all intensive purposes could be to their creators as David is to Weyland... a Creation a Tool,  only a Genetic and not Synthetic Robot/Tool

As far as Tyrell it was teased in some bonus material but until the movie or future ones makes a more direct or minor link, then we cant accept that Blade Runner and Alien are connected or in the same Universe..

Ridley said they could be.. but thats not to say they are... or even if they are its not to say that Tyrell has anything to do with the Alien Franchise

i am sure McDonalds are around in the year 2200, surely 2100 we know Rebok are...  but do we see McDonalds Corp involved in the Franchise? Nope..

That does not mean in the universe on Earth or even Mars Outposts they dont have a McDonalds.

And so yes as SM said... there is not proof to suggest that Vickers was nothing more than Human.

Still fun to speculate and offer alternative theories though.

I don't need proof - just something that might qualify as evidence that could be discussed.  Even a hint.

We can only assume what happened between Vickers and Janek, we don't know. The actions following are no more conclusive than the actions preceeding.

I always heard it as 'Mum'. Why would he call her ma'am?

The feminine of "sir".

@ The thread starter Hawley. 

I for one have no problem with people speculating and my sense is the people that run this site see it rather like the fan art as a positive creative input.

If people who are genuinely in the know are here in my view they should simply say so and suggest that people are on the wrong track. If we enter one of these conversations knowing for certain whats going on however hard we try and just play the argument the fact is we should say so. Art is not science but to treat it as if it is is limiting unless we know for certain what the artist intended.

I would much rather read a hundred daft well intentioned bad ideas than the one line put downs that exist outside of discussion forums. On this one you made me think why people come back to it and proves Ridley got it right. He was trying to make the connection so we made the disconnection it was an excellent piece of relativism between characters and shows once again that Prometheus is a many layered experience if you chose to invest in it. 

Exactly Michelle, very well put!

@S.M- Janek had doubts. At this point I would like to chime in with a few points which made me question Vickers human validity.

I wondered, why was she already out of her cryosleep chamber, needing no assistance, when the curious David came to her quarters, whilst others were suffering the effects of the two year freeze? 

The scene with her doing push-ups, as a way of limbering and heating up, put me in mind of Ash's little warm up routine. That little A L I E N riff, could be a hint at something more. [It also put me in mind of the physically powerful Zora, from BladeRunner.]

Lastly, Ridley actually stated in an interview from the set, that there might be two androids in the story! I've been trying [unsuccessfully so far] to find that clip.

To me, all of the above, were deliberate attempts on the part of Ridley, to pique our interest and make us question what we are seeing. 

I cannot say with any certainty whether Vickers is, or is not, an android, none of us can, but I feel Ridley quite deliberately planted some doubt.

After Prometheus' release members were hashing out this very same topic here on SCIFIED. It's one of many perpetual Prometheus topics!

So Hawley, you are quite right, Vickers robot theory does still linger!

Maybe it's because I'm from the U.S., but here I wouldn't address anyone I know as Ma'am, unless it was 'yes ma'am' or 'no, ma'am', mock formality. 

I hear 'mum', but then I liked it that way, along with the other Britishness in the film.

"Ma'am" often comes out sounding like "mum" in some English accents.

"I wondered, why was she already out of her cryosleep chamber, needing no assistance, when the curious David came to her quarters, whilst others were suffering the effects of the two year freeze? "

Finally someone puts something concrete out there!

I don't agree, however. I always took that as simply displaying how much of an independent badass Vickers was. She's too tough to get sick after two years in hypersleep, and is ready to do push ups rather than chuck.

But, interesting point nonetheless.

Hi Aorta

I am English I am not a robot and I am woman and I find when I travel in Europe people call me madam, in Asia Ma'am. Rather than Madam Johnston which is a mouthful it tends to get contracted to thank you Ma'am and it will be the hospitality industry so thats what David is riffing and I hear Ma'am some people call me other names but we won't go in to that. Indeed butlers (asia africa) will always refer to their clients as Sir and Ma'am.   

In Australia where they made the movie (sorry is that a spoiler) the tone of deference is entirely absent. Usually they go straight for the first name or Mr or Mrs. 

Another thought I had regarding Vickers is that she overdoes the jealous-pouty-sulky-bitchy, hates everyone-and-everything vibe.

Is that because she is play-acting, over compensating, trying to convince [herself] that she is not an android?

Or is she simply a human female with PMT, which can turn the nicest of us, into dragons? :D

The thing I don't understand about this theory and haven't since it was first brought up when the movie came out is why does it matter? If she is or is not an android it doesn't really change anything in the movie. It matters so little to anything I can't see why she would be, like why even give a character that identity and never elaborate, or clarify, or at least have it effect anything that happens in the story.

Indeed.

"Or is she simply a human female with PMT, which can turn the nicest of us, into dragons? :D"

2 years asleep gotsta muck around with ones cycles.

Well, it's all interesting speculation, whether it's well-grounded or not.  Doesn't need any bearing on anything.  It just is. 

We are all discussing things with complete strangers here.  How do I know who I'm talking to?  What does it matter if one of YOU was an android? 

I don't think she was an android, just a bitch on wheels.  Yes, it's interesting that she's already out of her cryo-pod, but maybe it has advanced features such as auto wake up, tied into the ship's computers and proximity alert.

I think Janek's line was the best pick-up line for the situation.  Even melted the snow queen.  That's all it was, IMHO.

But yeah I can see where you might draw that conclusion, based on Weyland's reliance on David.

But the kicker would be if the bitch could go outside without a helmet.  Since she was in full freak-out mode, getting jocked up to abandon ship once Janek made it clear what he was about to do, I would say she was human, much too human at that.   

Indeed if she was a Robot, and she knew only Shaw was on the surface then she would not worry about suiting up when going to the EEV Pod.... if Shaw came across her with no Helmet... well what can she do.. she wont be able to out run Vickers and so its a Win/win for her..

So that scene indeed proves she was not a Robot

Well out of kicks in this Vickers theory, I must add that even "David" had to dress in a suit to make the rest of the crew feel more comfortable, and if Vickers was a replicant...she wouldn't know it...and would assume she needed one like the rest of the crew...   this is fun speculation so no one chew my head off lol  :)

Ive red all comments and love everyones take on this subject. thank you to everyone on scified who joined in and gave their compelling view, theories and thoughts!

:D

"Indeed if she was a Robot, and she knew only Shaw was on the surface then she would not worry about suiting up when going to the EEV Pod.... "

Quite.

Interesting topic. I remember from the Promethues blu ray, one of the bonus feature stuff had a journal entry or something of the sort from Weyland and he mentioned Tyrell and his use of biological creations. Weyland mentioned something about androids being better in the long run than his replicants. Don't know if it is just an easter egg, or it Ridley Scott is slyly  making Blade Runner and Alien take place in the same universe.

As for Vickers, if she was a robot, Janek didn't notice or didn't care.

It was kind of a Easter Egg.... a tease and it should not be taken as Canon unless future movies try to make more of a connection...

Ridley however did say that both Franchises could be within the same universe... this does not mean they are...

I would not rule out however other little easter Eggs... such as Blade Runner 2 i would not be surprised if Weyland Company is mentioned or we see the Logo on something in that movie...

But it could be only a easter egg nod  like how JJ Abrahams has used the Slusho from Cloverfield in a number of his projects including Star Trek

That makes sense, that's why I take it as a grain of salt until I see something concrete on film, and not in the bonus features.

Between the fact that an android could of kicked the flight crew's asses and insisted on just flying away (good one SM), and her panicked retreat into the escape pod, I'd have to say she was just a nasty example of homo sapiens.

Yeah RS, I take a whole friggin salt shaker at these hints and allegations from these movie-makers, because so much of it is BS.  While I love the art, the artist are sometimes a shifty bunch.