Opps....  Indeed realized my Typo's  yeah i meant 2094 so i edited it with 2094* so the post now makes sense with my post...

Also edited the 10 years after i meant 10 years prior... silly me ;)

Looking at the Paradise Lost Draft just a quick peak it appears this Crossing (in spite of errors) is written by Logan (well at very least the same person).

This depicts David as Totally Twisted and Ruthless... 

He was too stereotypically evil in this draft, in my opinion. As I said in my original post, him developing a dark love for Shaw gave him more character for me then him thinking, 'heheheheh, I'll just wait for the right moment and then...Pow!' 

I check out the site from time to time to see how much of the early work on the Prometheus follow up has surfaced. 

This draft is very interesting because it shows the screen writer pitching expositional narrative whose prime objective is to maintain the momentum of Prometheus.

However it has a very substantial in built difficulty. After ten minutes David has hoodwinked his maker, destroyed the Engineers and bait and switched Shaw.

We then watch a movie where the hapless Covenant arrives. In other words the ambiguity of the final film has more dramatic tension than the spelt out exposition. We would simply be waiting for David to knock them off.

The real point though is this demonstrates the difficulty with making Michael the centre of the movie, rather than carry on the search for our creators with Shaw and David as, the can we trust him facilitator, which would have an added dimension if he genuinely responded to Elizabeths healing of his body. There was a good deal of potential creative tension in that with the discovery of the Engineers mythology as the back drop to their journey. I also like the idea that the original infection of Shaw or should I say Holloway had down stream consequences for Shaw and if David became capable of intimacy with Shaw-David.

I have said it before but a faith based Shaw coming up against a mechanical view of creation whilst David the synthetic develops very complex feelings for Shaw could have had the enigmatic quality of BR2049. What is existence what is cognitive self starting life.... oh and who are our creators and what does LV223 represent small things like explaining Prometheus and what we are seeing rather than junking it. 

Xenovirus

It’s interesting that in the early draft the black goo is called “xenovirus” hinting at in the early stages of the Covenant project the idea wasn’t that David created the xenomorph? The name “xenovirus” hints at the black goo either is derived from a xenomorph (xeno-dna) or the black goo leads to a xenomorph (when humans or engineers are exposed to it)? In either case, the xenomoph would be known to the engineers and thus David not being the creator?

In this early script, David also kills Shaw as they arrive at Planet 4 which also gives the impression that David wasn’t thought of as the creator of the xenomorph from the beginning? He would need Shaw alive to be able to experiment with her and create the eggs?

The idea that David created the xenomorph, therefore, came later on in the Covenant project?

The Flashback scene

Another interesting thing is that they have moved David’s flashback scene (when he exterminates the engineers with the pathogen). In the early script, it was in the beginning as they reach Planet 4 (not a flashback). In the later one when David and the rest reach the engineer city and they see all the dead bodies, and in the movie, it is moved to when Walter and David are on the balcony overlooking the dead city.

So it is no longer called Alien Awakening?

"It’s interesting that in the early draft the black goo is called “xenovirus”

I would say this was purely to allow the reader to connect to the Xenomorph as its better than McGuffin Virus or Black Goo Virus.

sure there was a connection.... it appears John Logan was brought in to change the Story to bring the Xenomorph back into it as a result of the Black Goo and Prometheus mission rather than to confirm the Xenomorph Pre-existed.

Not sure i can contribute much today (drinking and meds again) so i may have to come back to some things including Michelle ;)

So i have to keep things to less Thought Provoking for now ;)

" David also kills Shaw as they arrive at Planet 4 which also gives the impression that David wasn’t thought of as the creator of the xenomorph from the beginning?"

Who knows... maybe he could have used her body for experiments, we really cant be 100% sure what the thought process had been...   The Source i had from February 2015 based off the Paglen/Green Draft from October 2014... seemed to hint that by showing David Re-Create Something.. would provide us clues to how Something was Created Before... and that Dr Shaw would be required to allow this Re-Creation to take place...  This is actually what we got in Alien Covenant, just slightly different and now its not a Re-Creation but a Actual Creation.

I think the moving of the Bombardment Scene actually was ideal as showing it in the beginning would have given too much away.

Regarding Michelle's post... i have to get back to this when i can muster some more brain cells ;)   I will add that the Crossing Draft did paint David in a quite basic fashion,  i felt it was not the more interesting way to explore things... because we now if we accept this, and what the Logans Movie Drafts seem to show (not read them really yet) is that the next movie would be something along the lines of David just churning out Xenomorphs with the Covenant Crew.... he arrives at Origae-6 with loads of Eggs and a Company Ship arrive and discover them and well Davids Xenomorph Army is unleashed...

This goes against RS when he said the next movie would be less Xenomorph and more AI... because Logans drafts appear to lead up to the opposite.

"So it is no longer called Alien Awakening"

Regarding the Sequel...?

We cant be sure... it appears the idea was Alien Awakening, but then some contradictory comments  seem to hint Alien Awakening happens between Prometheus and Alien Covenant and others after Alien Covenant and a Alien Awakening fits more prior to Alien Covenant... it does not fit a sequel... not with how RS claimed the next one would be less Xenomorph.

But we really cant be sure what state the movie was in.. John Logan had apparently had a nearly ready to go Script as of last summer, but its been Limbo since.

BigDave & Michelle

It would be interesting to read the original scripts by Harper and Green, but I suppose they aren’t around on the Internet? “MacGuffin virus is perhaps a good name for the black goo since it’s not explained in detail how it works and is made (although we get some obscure description of it through David in “Advent”). At least we know from Prometheus that it does give rise to some kind of xenomorph creature seen in the mural and the deacon.

The original scripts by Harper and Green perhaps had a more direct continuation of the story (about David and Shaw) which Logan abruptly and literally kills off very early on? The prologue in the script is then deleted altogether but we get to see some of it in “The Crossing”, though. At the end of “The Crossing” we also see David unleash the pathogen on the engineer world so we already know what he has become and what he’s done?

To continue the story of David and Shaw would have been very interesting (although we do get most of it from “The Crossing”, David telling about it in AC, and “Advent”. In AC we get the story of David and Shaw through the new characters’ (The Covenant crew) actions, dialogues and discoveries where we (the audience) are forced to do some puzzle making as well.

If there ever will be a continuation of the Alien saga leading up to the original Alien movie, I think there will be new main characters (maybe a couple from the colonists) and Daniels and Tennessee are dead (experimented on).

Certainly would chli

If i come back to my comment about the Xeno-Virus i think it may appeared to be harsh... i can come across like that at times i think, where i dont intend on discrediting other people.  Just my Opinion.

so certainly its interesting to ask why it was referred to as the Xeno-Virus, this is a term that has been used on here and no doubt other sites way prior to Alien Covenant.. i am even guilty of using this term before...    The reasons we do this is because well its kind of like a Virus that imprinted Xenomorph Traits, that has to be connected to the Xenomorph in some way....

That with Alien Covenant the actual connection is the Xenomorph is the result of this Xeno-Virus... so it kind of seems odd to call it a Xeno-Virus is it pre-dates the Xenomorph... but then as it can lead to a Xenomorph i guess it can apply still.

Prometheus and Alien Covenant show us that the Xenomorph, Neomorph and Deacon are all results of the Black Goo, so its  a case of do we have any real NAME for related Organisms?  I mean we have orders like Reptiles, Birds, Primates so its a case of what does all these Morphs have as far as a Name... And well we dont have one... all we know is they are connected to that Black Goo and i guess as the Xenomorph is the more widely known of these Morphs, the Xeno-Virus just seems to stick more as explaining what the Pathogen is.

The Black Goo has always been a bit ambigious, the Advent Viral Video does give some more depth to it, but slightly makes it more complicated... were as Prometheus clearly shows it to be quite simple... and we need to remember Spaights Nano-Scarabs are the same thing, just they changed Scarabs to the Goo.. If we then look at Alien Engineers then the Goo is simply a Mutagenic Pathogen that Manipulates DNA, it breaks down DNA/Traits of a Organism that is infected with the Sacrificial Goo, into a new Substance that then passes on Traits of Sacrificed Organism.

It is thus likely the Urns contained something related to the Xenomorph that was Sacrificed....  If the Engineers became Facinated with a LION and felt its DNA and Traits would be something they would want to incorporate into other Life-Forms, then they could Sacrifice a LION with Sacrificial Goo, collect the Genetic Material/Pathogen that becomes of the Sacrificed LION and store these into Glass Vials/ampules (as seen with the Black Goo) then Bombard a Target with these and if they infect a Human/Engineer we basically get THUNDERCATS Humanoids lol

This ^^^^^ is basically what Prometheus kind of showed, its what Jon Spaights Alien Engineers showed as far as the Scarabs... and so the original concept was this is some kind of Creation/Evolutionary Tool...   which fits perfectly with the whole back story of the Engineers.

But those at FOX have kept changing how it works first with the Weyland Agent A0-3959X.91 – 15 File... that basically contradicted what we saw in Prometheus.

Then we get the Advent Viral which complicates what was essentially a simple Creation Tool.

"To continue the story of David and Shaw would have been very interesting"

Potentially yes.... but its something that could have been hard to do, a Question would have been if they should/would have encountered any Engineers or related beings and then how these beings would have reacted to David and Dr Shaw.

If we expanded on the Crossing and then what we see of Dr Shaw in Alien Covenant...  it would have been a movie that would have covered basically David and Dr Shaw interacting, David then killing her/using her for his experiments, David then experimenting with various Life-Forms and maybe we could see some alive Engineers being experimented on too.

This would be kind of limited, as far as what a broad audience would want to see, and as its a Alien Movie, it would simply not be enough of a Alien movie, and as a Prometheus sequel again it would not be enough of a Alien movie for the general public/Alien Fans (not inc Prometheus ones)

its doing a movie as described above, and then asking does David find/capture a few alive Engineers and what kind of dialect do they have etc....    because this would expand the movie a little.

But as FOX wanted a story to bring in the Xenomorph and indeed having a incoming Human Ship that comes across the Aftermath of what David had done... simply having a movie like i explained above as a Expanded Crossing ==> Few months/years prior to the Covenant.... would maybe be something a lot of Fans would not want to be interested in, and if this sets up Alien Covenant, maybe fans would be turned off the idea to go and see Alien Covenant, if the prequel to it (Prometheus 2) was something they could not engage with...

And also adding some expanded Crossing etc by having this as a extra 30-40 Minutes at the start of the movie would then give away a lot of the Plot and Surprises for when the Covenant Crew Arrive etc..  and having a 30-40 Minute Crossing/What David had done in those years Section in the middle of Alien Covenant would be maybe too much a large break up in the Alien Covenant movie.

So we have to kind of understand why we got what we did...

It CERTAINLY Warrants a Novel/Book of the events post Prometheus to prior to Alien Covenant, a Novel with a Section that has some images/notes (like Davids Workshop) would have been Fantastic.

"It CERTAINLY Warrants a Novel/Book of the events post Prometheus to prior to Alien Covenant, a Novel with a Section that has some images/notes (like Davids Workshop) would have been Fantastic."

I would love to read that book especially if it would include what David found out about the engineers' ways he mentioned in Advent.

I wonder what was the meaning of Alien Covenant Origins. Was it supposed to prepare the fans for a Covenant sequel film? I think people wanted to know what happened on planet 4 before Covenant's arrival.

Well, according to an interview with Harper, it was Ridley Scott who wanted to end the focus on the relationship between David and Shaw. It would have been interesting but also very limiting? Just David and Shaw and some engineers would perhaps be hard to make something out of? So, they had to bring in another party - The Covenant Crew. In order for that to work, to get new main characters, you would have to end the focus on David and Shaw and she would have to be dead? The logic from Prometheus also gives us this development of David - the rebel who turns against his creators? The AI focus is also consistent with Scott’s view of AI as dangerous and contact with extraterrestrials as well (just as the sadly departed Hawking).

The black goo has been given many names, such as xenovirus, mutagen and pathogen. Personally, I like the name mutagen best since that seems to be the main purpose of the liquid? It’s supposed to mutate its host into something different and highly aggressive. Interestingly, Holloway didn’t become aggressive, whereas Fifield did. The indigenous worms also mutated into the hammerpedes which also became aggressive. It seemed to work primarily as a pathogen on the engineers (well, perhaps they mutated also but they didn't seem to become aggressive towards one another?) whereas fungi changed, mutated, evolved into the spore-sprouting thing we met in AC?

A book between Covenant and Prometheus is a great idea! Would make it easier to make a slower, lore heavy, lovecraftian, ODD story. Much easier to make Prometheus 2 that way. 

This idea that a film featuring David and Shaw and the Engineer Homeworld which Damon Lindelof has indicated has not yet been "reached" would be difficult to make is undermined by BR2049. It has one main character who is joined by another as they find the answer to a riddle. It would have been adult, deeply philosophical, breath taking in its portrayal of a dystopian world and would pursue the themes of 2001 which is essentially what Prometheus is all about but it would not have been an ALIEN movie. It would simply have given context to the Xenomorph which was created out of the experiments on LV 223. Making David the creator of denture features was all "bread and circuses" and has backfired.

I actually think Blomkamp was right if your gonna do a retread go full on and get the whole band together again. Whether that or a Prom 2 would have actually sold who knows. But my generation just LOVES nostalgia with a low sense of audacity and real challenge. "Just play the same tunes"

All life comes from the gift taken by the Acolyte set down by the tear drop ship. That was tainted by a fall and produced the catastrophe of LV 223 as Ridders said, E Bola like, that was a perfectly respectable beginning for penis head.     

I think when trying to piece together what may have been as far as what could lead to the Crossing, and so maybe this reply fits a bit to what Michelle was saying..

We have TWO Survivors of Prometheus....

Dr Shaw...  A Scientist who expected that going to LV-223 will reveal some answers/truths behind the creation of Mankind and our Purpose in the Grand Scheme of things...  What she discovers contradicts her FAITH..... there are no Gods like her Faith has, these beings are connected to ourselves but they are Mortal Advanced Ancient Humanoids... who had made a lot of effort in our creation and nurturing and then they attempted to create something to Destroy/Replace us and then after this failed, they apparently abandoned us.

Dr Shaw has NOTHING, No Parents, No Fiance and Can-Not have Children....  All she wants NOW is Answers... Why did THEY create us, WHY did they want to Destroy us, WHAT Changed their minds...   SHE would be willing to take the RISK of Death if it even gives her the slightest Chance of getting her Answers.. and a Part of her holds on to her FAITH that maybe there is a GOD or beings above these Engineers and maybe THEY are more Benevolent like her Faith seems to indicate.

David is alone and FREE from being a Servant to Weyland and Mankind, he has spent his whole life, seeing Weylands Fascination with Perfection/Creation and then Pursuit to Prolong his Life from the Inevitable Climax that is Death.  David would know he is SUPERIOR to Humans in almost every way, and provided he is maintained he WILL NEVER DIE and having more Free-will in his Programming than other Robots... David would start to ask WHY should he Serve a In-Superior being.. what makes Humans more Deserving to be the ones David should Serve.  This is very much the same kind of thinking that leads to the Fall of Lucifer 

David has spent years being treated as a Machine/Servant instead of on equal Terms to Humans.   When he is on his way to LV-223 he has had time to Study Dr Shaws works, and he takes a great interest in meeting our MAKERS..     David then discovers these beings are NOT GODS and they are MORTAL after all

David is no doubt intrigued about the revelations about his own Creators, Makers (aka Engineers) i also think he has a interest in the whole Creation/Creator Philosophy and knowing that he is Superior to his Creator and then that his Creators Creator is also just a Humanoid and all that separates them really is Knowledge and Technology which David now has some fundamental knowledge about.  David discovering he can use their Technology and Knowledge and that HE can-not be infected by the Outbreak that killed Mankinds so called makers, then this leaves us wondering what Davids Agenda could be.

So we can see from the Get Go, Davids possible Agenda and Goals he could achieve are far more than what Dr Shaw merely wants.

They are at a STALE-MATE without Dr Shaw, David would remain in TWO Halves, he would be incapacitated he would perform no other function than to be left stranded all alone... he is No Longer Free  he is a Prisoner on that Crashed Juggernaught.  We have to ask how long can David Function before his Battery or Systems Fail... and we simply had no idea how long this would be.

We have Dr Shaw, who is also Stranded on that Forsaken Rock, she has only limited Life-Support on the Life-Boat but she has to take the risk of going back to this Vessel and ponder what becomes of the Trillobite she Gave Birth too, and the Engineer and even if they are assumed DEAD... Dr Shaw has only limited Life Support that she would have to PRAY another Ship arrives within 2 years...  But as the question was proposed... who would return first?  Humans?  or Engineers?

So David and Dr Shaw NEED each other, without either they are Marooned on LV-223 until someone else arrives or until their systems/life support runs out/fails.  This leaves a Interesting Dynamic as far as a game of Chess/Trust...  Dr Shaw would surely know that IF she puts David back together he would be Dangerous but the only Alternative is to be stranded on LV-223.

The END of Prometheus shows us that some kind of deal must have been made, and that Dr Shaw and David did leave LV-223.

THIS IS WHEN WE ARRIVE AT THE CROSSING..

The Draft One and Actual One we got, both set up a slightly different conclusion to the last day/hours before the Juggernaught Departed LV-223.

The reason I repeatedly bring up BR2049 is because it is challenging what is existence. 

So

Shaw

Believes in a divine God mythos which is paternalistic and beyond any understanding.

David

Is a mechanical construct but one that has sentient feelings from the moment he is activated if we accept the PW/D8 opening.

Engineers

Who are ... Engineers in others they construct life out if mechanistic rituals which have been gifted to them.

What a thoroughly fantastic way to go beyond 2001 (creation, catalysts, humans and robots) and explore these themes in more detail. 

Shaw - has the potential for horror of horrors to realise that there is a mechanical element to creation, which she is not capable if and yet has been shown the mutagen can allow her to birth. Would she not like Adam and Eve be tempted to eat the apple. 

David - Healed by the woman whose partner he destroyed would he not be affected by such compassion and come to realise that existence is more than nuts and bolts. 

Engineers

Wow there are so many ways this could have gone. Paradise Lost is that like Elizabeth they are barren and it is a dying world the gifts of creation having been withdrawn because of their fall on LV223. 

So D & E reach a dying world (that feels a lot and looks a lot like BR2049) and interact with a handful of Engineers who reveal the true horror of their fall and their corruption of the catalyser. 

Shaw the reformist and David the curious can go in all sorts of directions. 

@Michelle Johnston

I don't know, but there sources also say that even the earliest script had pretty much the same story, but Shaw would be killed at a different time. As if the were ashamed of her, of the Engineers and were Lindelof was going. Was he blamed that Prometheus was not successful enough? if so maybe he is vindicated...

What you say is interesting for some of us, but apparently not for those involved.

What i still wonder, if in 2014/2015 this was already an alien movie, why was Blomkamp advocating his Alien movie? Of course no one would greenlight 2 alien movies at the same time.

Michelle Johnston

I agree with you that Bladerunner 2049 is a very good movie with the same atmosphere as the original Bladerunner (neo-noir). The genre might be called sci-fi drama (with lots of action as well)? The movie wouldn’t attract people who prefer (kitchen sink) realism, but otherwise, both women and men, as well as intellectuals and more plain action seekers, would be sufficiently satisfied? But still, it wasn’t a great success economically (worse than AC) and the original BR wasn’t either.

We have roughly the same questions in BR49 as in Prometheus/AC and (apart from religious and philosophical reflexions about our place in the universe, about life and death, creation etc) the main focus has come to be AI (synthetics/replicants - David/K) and questions about a soul, free will etc and about moral/ethical questions. As I see it, they are focused very much on the development of the main character (although David technically speaking is the antagonist he has in a way become the protagonist. There isn’t so much of character development in either Shaw nor Daniels, is there?)? K develops from bad to good whereas David goes the other way?

In both films, we have the love drama between humans and synthetics/AI (with implanted memories) - K/Joi and David/Shaw. But as I see it, in BR49 you have many characters around the main characters who serve different purposes: good/bad, helping/obstructing, sacrifice/victims, funny/irritating and if we compare this to a sequel with only David and Shaw (and an antagonist probably in the form of engineers) there would be no supporting characters filling up different needs in order to make a dynamic, exciting movie? There are, of course, interesting, good movies/books with (almost) only one character like “Robinson Crusoe” and “Castaway” (although in the latter you also get to follow the main character’s wife struggling with her life and his disappearance).

So, could a sequel to Prometheus which served as a continuation of the relationship between David and Shaw which could develop either into love or hate (or both), Shaw seeking the answers to her religious questions and David seeking himself, become interesting? Well, of course it could, but would it give the production company its money back? Probably not?

chli

I don't know if BR49 is more of a failure than AC, as Covenant had brand recognition (with the first 2 being global successes) and the original Blade Runner was a cult classic. Sure it was insane to spend 150 mil but it did make 15 mil more than Covenant world-wide with 20 mil made less in China. It is Villeneueve's highest grossing film today worldwide (making 55 mil more than Arrival), earned 2 Oscars and critical and public acclaim.

Covenant received mixed critical (slightly less then Prometheus), worse public reception and made less money then it''s predecessor, even thou it had Alien in it's title and was clearly marketed as a prequel.

All in all, I don't know how a direct continuation of Prometheus would have went down but it is clear that money was more important than making something interesting/new.