Alien: Isolation (the novelization) and the Space Jockey

I get the impression that Weyland may have sort after Relics for a show of Power/Ownership like Owning a Priceless Piece of Art.

I dont think he finds any Value in them purely on a Religious Standpoint...  He would be INTERESTED in a Relic that could be of some Great Use to him...  if he believed this Relic held certain POWERS.... but maybe that would be Stepping a bit too much into the INDIAN JONES kind of Shoes...

I think we also have to NOT try and consider the Franchise as connecting too much to ANY certain Religion or Mythos but more in that there are Events related to the Engineers that had been passed down and interpreted as the basis for Various Mythos and Religions.

So in that Context, i think sure there may be Technology, and other Advancements or Tools the Engineers had that could have given RISE to various Stories of Certain Relics.

So looking at Peter Weyland and Prometheus... it seems there could be ONE Relic he would have hoped to Find! (if he believed in it that is).

That would be a Elixir of Life this would indeed be the Basis of WHY he wanted to meet the Gods... so they can Grant him more LIFE!  So indeed if David was to Discover something like this Exists and were to Find It maybe that could be Interesting....  it could be something that inspired things such as the Holy Grail.

What kind of Manifest to you think was so interesting to Peter Weyland?

In Regards back to the Acid Hole... i do think looking at the Image i made a few posts back, that it could open up the possibility of either..

*Someone goes to the Derelict after the Incident but prior to the Nostromo

*Some kind of Sabotage prior to the Derelict Incident.

'*Someone goes to the Derelict after the Incident but prior to the Nostromo'

I could see a exploration/salvage crew visiting the derelict in the late 21'st century(2090's?) and finding the Space Jockey...But no hole...And unable to 'explore/salvage' anything, they leave(going back to get tools?)......then caught by something (monster or just bad weather)and never get the chance to report or stake a claim. 

You could start the movie like that. Giving the audience a clear idea that the hole and access to the eggs came just before the Nostromo.

Jones -standing before the large seated alien  "As incredible as this is.....There's nothing here......"

Captain Randle - "No.... there is something...keep recording...I'm going back for some cutting tools...."

I could imagine LV426 is still haunted by many aliens....A whole colony underground...The black goo seeped deep.

What kind of Manifest to you think was so interesting to Peter Weyland?

You are absolutely right about the Indiana Jones angle and I would probably avoid having the relic something 'magical'

I guess the answer would be: What would the Engineers find of value from a backwater world......Something that would date the last time the derelict was in action? What would the audience recognize? A child's doll? A sword?

Or video footage of Jesus?  Dinosaurs? All of human history recorded on holodisc would be cool.

BigDave

I agree that organic material merges together over time and therefore it would be “hard to tell where the suit ends and the wearer begins”. But, at least it seems to rule out David: “it’s not a synthetic”.

As for the eggs in the cargo hold, I don’t think they would carry them one by one. They would probably have some high-tech device for this. And if we think in terms of egg-morphing, only one egg would be enough to eradicate all life on a planet.

@chli

Certainly you would Speculate that would have some means of Safe Transportation of Eggs.  Something that Alien Covenant had shown was that there was SMALLER EGGS.

So if we was to Ignore Alien Covenant as Canon or imply David had obtained a Smaller Egg...  If we assume that the Eggs can START off as SMALL and then Grow, that makes for Easy Transport to the Cargo Hold.

But we still have the Problem of HOW do they get them OUT of the Ship.  We can Speculate many things, that they have some Device for doing this, that they have a Separate Cargo Hold that is deployed and then OPENS up.

The dropping them like Bombs sounds ODD!

However.......  what if we took Ridley Scotts word for how he claimed the Xenomorph could Regenerate?

I have said before that sounds SILLY... and maybe a similar and better way would be from there Remains as they Die/Killed they Break Down/Decompose and from this we see NEW EGGS Grow!

Making them like Cabbages.. you could Cut a Cabbage into many pieces and they would Re-Grow into Clones.

So if a Egg can Regrow in a Similar Way then Dropping the Eggs would be NO PROBLEM.. from the Waste of the Dropped Eggs, eventually more Eggs would Sprout..

That would be a Easy Explanation a Very Convenient one.

"But, at least it seems to rule out David: “it’s not a synthetic”.

If the NOVEL is classed as 100% Canon... to a degree YES

However as Ignorantguy pointed out the Walter Models could be somewhat Organic, a Synthetic Construct like Eldon from Fire and Stone.  And if this is revealed to be the case then a Walter-Morph could be the Answer to the more Bio-Mechanical Xenomorph and also could allow for a Walter Body to become the Space Jockey.

While this would FIT with the Prometheus Themes and become a Hubris for David... i think him becoming the Space Jockey would be something else that WONT sit well with Fans...  It would in effect be TWISTING the KNIFE so to Speak.

We also have the Height Difference.... which is Larger than our Engineers but again we maybe have to accept this as a Oversight as Dallas said it SEEMED like he had GROWN out of the Chair.

We could see Taller Engineers, or a Taller related Race who will become the Space Jockey..... or maybe David could Create the Space Jockey?

I do wonder HOW-FAR ahead they thought this out when they decided to go the David had Created the Xenomorph route?

Again we have NOT had the Conclusion, and with things like in the Novels and Inconstancy they could CHANGE things Once Again by the Time and IF we ever get a Conclusion.

I think it should remain a Mystery...

@MonsterZero

I think Certainly we could explore that the HOLE was made after the Space Jockey had Set Down on LV-426 and had Died!

The Hole does look like it was Melted a Bit... but then again i GUESS a Powerful Laser Cutting Tool could MELT the Metal so that it appears in the way the Hole looks.

"What would the Engineers find of value from a backwater world"

Are you implying they Left Something on Earth, or they had something Related to the Time Spent on Earth that was on the Derelict before it Crashed?

We know they have Holo-Recording Technology and most Scientist would Record their Advancements or Experiments via both taking down Notes/Drawings but also Visually Recording.

So we have to assume the Engineers could have done similar.

I am not sure it would be WISE to indicate that Actually Jesus Existed and Try to showcase him in the Biblical Light, but that HE was a being the Engineers used as a Emissary a Hybrid, a Selected Human they had Augmented somehow and allowed him to have certain Powers.

Revealing Various Accounts of Emissaries though-out Earth who look more Human but have been Given a ROLE by the Engineers with Genetic Enhancements as Part of that Deal and Technology that could be seen as Miracles would be more Fitting.

Revelation of this would caused CHAOS to Religion but so could the release of Information about Discovering the Engineers. 

The Scientific Community would want to obtain any Tools these Emissaries had for their own Benefit, and would also like to KNOW it was that these beings were MADE different and Enhanced to Normal Humans.

If David could discover these, then he could Engineer a New Race of Humans.

PS... sorry for being OFF-TOPIC

David created the Xeno(that was aboard the Nostromo), he MUST have have been aboard the juggernaut before or after, it crashed on LV426.

I think this is canon?

Unless Walter or someone else assumes Davids role?

We have yet to Conclude the Prequels at the Moment, Ridley Scott had claimed that we are backing into ALIEN and by the Time the Prequels are Completed we will KNOW who is in the Chair.

RS had also said we are like 2 maybe 3 Movies away from ALIEN, which means we have to go through 2-3 more Movies before we arrive at WHO is in the Space Jockey Chair.

Taking this into Account, it appears that RS is taking us on a route that WITHOUT the Experiments that David had conducted on Planet 4 there would be NO Xenomorphs.

This however does-not mean that it would be David in the Space Jockey Chair, or that David is the one who LOADS the Eggs on the Derelict.

It just appears that David's Xenomorphs will END UP on the Derelict, but a few things to NOTE... is that RS had claimed the Xenomorph has some Evolving to do YET, it is NOT yet the Organism we see in ALIEN.

Another thing to Consider is IF the Plan was that WITHOUT our David there would be NO Xenomorph, then we NEED a Engineer Ship to come into play...

Regarding the Sequel we had RS indicated that it would NOT be about the Xenomorph, David would be off to Planet and what "Kind of a World" would he Create.. we have to assume he means that David is off to Origae-6.

RS had said that 3/4 Incoming Parties will be arriving at where David goes, and ONE of these are the Engineers who are AFTER the Culprit for the Destruction of Planet 4..  it is LIKELY this will Provide us the Derelict or another Engineer Ship that will then lead to the Derelict being obtained from LV-223.

What i am saying is that its Likely that David goes to Origae-6 some Engineers Turn Up... I DOUBT that RS would KILL OFF our David in the Next Movie so its likely at some point the David (some how) gets the Better of Engineers or comes to a Covenant with them or is Captured by them...

Either way the Engineers with David will go to LV-223, or David using a Engineers Ship will go to LV-223 and this would be were essentially Alien Covenant 3 would take place... or Alien Covenant 4

somehow Davids Creation will get Evolved its a case of by WHO/HOW?  by David, by the Engineers (or related) or by WHAT/WHO he Creates in Alien Covenant 2?

Then as far as WHO/HOW the Eggs end up on the Derelict again it is likely ONE of those THREE mentioned above.

But this appeared to be the Route that Ridley Scott was taking, we dont know if RS will be involved in the Prequels from Now On... or IF they are to be Finished any time soon.

So by the Time we see another Prequel Planned, a LOT could change including the PLOT.

I think going back to the OT, some part i assume your indication is the Novel rules out David as Marlow says its not Synthetic, and also mentioning the 16ft Size.

It also Mentions a Suit... 

I know some Fans are Disappointed its a Suit, but then look at the Space Jockey and imagine what Species this Skeleton would Belong too?  It could look a bit SILLY.

Then its HOW is it connected to the Chair?

I am sure some remember this interpretation in some of the Comics from way back.... is this better than a Bio-Mechanical Suit?

So i think we need to remember HR Giger and his Aesthetic of Organic meets Mechanical...

The Xenomorph and Especially from ALIEN is Bio-Mechanical.

so another Option for the Space Jockey could be a revelation of a Bio-Mechanical Being.... No Skeleton, No Suit... but a Totally Living Bio-Mechanical Entity.

Some of HR Gigers works carry some Space Jockey look and Aesthetic, and so maybe a Revelation of a Ancient Bio-Mechanical Race as the Space Jockey could be the way to FIX things.

Actually, Marlow says that “it’s not a synthetic. It’s definitely a life form” (“synthetic” with “a” in front).

I also believe that Scott focused on the aesthetics of Giger. How it looked (bio-mechanical). Not that it was a combination of biology and mechanical parts. The xenomorph in Alien looked bio-mechanical but was certainly biological - an organism with secretion and drooling jaws.

When David experiments (on Shaw for example) I imagine there would be a combination of biology and mechanical apparatus, tubes etc . . .

I think thats a Good Point... it is a bit odd how he would say "its no a synthetic" as why would they ever consider that this ALIEN Ship would be Piloted by a Synthetic, so if they said "its not Synthetic" that would make sense, but as he said its Not A Synthetic we have to consider he meant as in NOT a Synthetic Android, but its like would they had been Expecting One?

So we have to Wonder how much had they known about the Ship etc before they arrived to come out with a comment like that?Unless when they saw the Chair and how the Space Jockey was attached by Wires, they first thought it must be some kind of Synthetic Robot, but close inspection it was more Organic and NOT a Synthetic.

But i think what it ULTIMATELY comes down to is the Author using some Dialog to Clear up some things and so they had placed that Dialog to Indicate that the Space Jockey is in NO-WAY a Synthetic Android.

A indication that its NOT going to be David, which is not the best thing to put, as it would be Good to leave it Ambiguous until the Conclusion so WHEN/IF we get a Continuation some Fans may Expect its going to be David only to then be relieved that it DOES-NOT

Looking at what you have put from the Novel i think its the Author attempting to push us towards certain things.

"The human form was huge - at least 16 feet tall"

This is a Narration of the Scene, indicating the Space Jockey is Humanoid (well Bi-Pedal) and to indicate it is HUGE, the Thing is the Space Jockey Chair was 16ft, its Unlikely the Space Jockey is but we DONT see his Legs so we cant assume how LONG they are in Proportion to his Body... it does-not matter much, all this Narration seems intended to do is indicate the Pilot is certainly LARGE (Rules Out David, a Human and our Engineers from the Prequels).

"and it had been there a long time. It looked like a fossil”. Its ribcage had exploded outwards"

When the Fossil Comment is used its usually to indicate that it looks Skeletal and that its been there a LONG Time, actually it would be more like it was Mummified, the Indication here by the Author is to lead us to the Space Jockey had been there a LONG TIME... certainly what appears to be more than say 30 YEARS.

"it’s hard to tell where the suit ends and the wearer begins, but it’s not a synthetic. It’s definitely a life form”

This clearly shows a Indication that we are dealing with a Space Suit, but one that is Organic more than None-Organic where its hard to tell what is the Organic Suit or the Wearer.

This does fit well with the Concept Work, there are some Differences between the Engineers Suits, and Space Jockey, there are some Differences between the Juggernaut and Derelict.

The Juggernaut/Engineers appear to be LESS Organic, there are also some Size Differences...

These could come down to just OVERSIGHT...

If we look beyond that and try and Logically look at the Differences then we would likely have to Conclude.

1) They are the Same/Similar but over Time the Suit/Ship had Warped/Changed shape, grown and changed, this could make sense if they are Organic to a Degree, but WHAT could change the Composition/Size of the Ship/Suit in a Short Time.   But it could be something that could CHANGE over a LONG period of Time... which has to be more Longer than Thousands of Years as the Dead Engineer Suits in Prometheus had not changed.

2) They are some what Different, like a Newer/Older Model a Technological Evolution, but i dont see the Engineers Technology Changing VERY Often, so its not like say the Juggernauts were part of Different Models they bring out every Few Thousand Years, its Unlikely the Derelict is thus a Newer Model that came out only a Few Thousand Years ago.  It appear more likely the Derelict seemed like a more Ancient Model.

3)  It could appear we are looking at a Older slightly different Technology that is more Organic, this could maybe draw us to Conclude that the Derelict is a more Ancient Technology than the Juggernauts, that they belonged to a different Race to the Engineers (or Variant)

But who knows what we would END UP with.... going the Route that the Derelict Aesthetically is the same Technology as a Juggernaut (Created/Engineered at the around same Time) that then has ONLY been on LV-426 for like 10-15 years MAX and the Pilot is a 8ft Engineer never mind a Human or Human Synthetic, is surely a Very Difficult Oversight to Accept.

So those remarks from the NOVEL are a indication by the Author to show that we are dealing with a Humanoid, that is inside a 16ft Space Suit that is Organic in its Material and has been there for a VERY Long Time.

Taking the NOVEL as 100% Canon, and looking at ALIEN, it would appear we could ASSUME we are looking at Ancient Ship, with a Ancient 13-16ft Pilot that has been there for more than a FEW Thousand Years.

Thought i would Quickly try and do a Comparison, this does have a Margin of Error, it also assumes Space Jockey has same Proportions as the Engineer Suit.

Also assumes Production Worker is about 6ft

This would Indicate the Space Jockey to be about 14.5 Feet Tall, with a Margin of Error it would appear the Actual Size could be about 15ft.

I always thought the Chair was 16ft, i cant remember where but it was described as such, i know the ONE in Prometheus was 15ft as far as Concept i will work out after what it was in Reality but it seems to be about 16ft.

All in all from what i have attempted to do, would mean the Space Jockey is Approximately the same 15ft that the Engineers were Described as from the Earlier Drafts.

This was the Intention, the Trailer Sacrificial Bowl on the Alter is Scaled to make the Engineers about 15ft if we assume the same one was used by the Sacrificial Engineer Scene.

likewise the Head they Examined on the Lab Table was LARGER than the Prometheus Engineer portrayed by Ian Whyte, i will have to work it out again, but when i did it before that HEAD would have been to a 10ft Engineer Scale.

This could be used to simply explain that WHILE we have Different Sized Humans... if the Engineers are on Average 25% Taller than a Human, then indeed some Engineers could stand 10 Feet Tall.

@BigDave, don't forget that space-suited children were used in the Space Jockey scene, not 6 feet adults. I reckon the Space Jockey is supposed to be at least 20ft long.

Certainly HOX...

That was indeed the Intention... but this was UNDONE.. by Ridely Scotts approach to Shooting and Scale...

Where close up we see the Space Jockey Mysteriously Shrunk by 1/3rd.

Same Problems happened with Prometheus.. the Intention at Shooting was a 10ft Race... some Scenes showed us that Actually we have a 8ft Race.

The Intention was a 26ft Space Jockey but in Reality what we got in ALIEN was a 22ft Giant that then appeared to be 15ft at Close Up.

Ridley Scott should have used ANOTHER Prop for the Close up that was 33% Larger.... but this would have been beyond Budget.

The Difference is considered a OVERSIGHT... we simply where not to be paying too much attention.

Upon IF/WHEN they would ever introduce the Space Jockey Race or go back to the Derelict again, then they would have to Choose, do we go for a 22ft Race or a 15ft.

When they began the Prequels they decided to go for a 15ft and so actual Prop Size... so the Smaller Children in suits shot was considered a Oversight.

This got Revised down to 12ft in Later Drafts, then intended as 10ft for Shooting but again another Mistake of Scale and we ended up with 8ft Engineers (Suited).

Again RS should have used LOTR/Hobbit Special Effects and Camera Trickery.

By the Time we get to the Space Jockey Event at the Rate of being 2-3 more Movies away.... then we may see Warwick Davies eventually playing the Space Jockey ;)

Here is roughly how the Space Jockey size has changed.

LOL!

I can forgive the close-up mismatch for the reason that - in that shot - there's no general impression of the overall scale of the creature. Likewise, the dropping of the original giant.

The real problem, one that's tricky to surmount, is the mismatch between Prometheus reality and the Alien distant shot.

There is a way out: the Space Jockey is not an Engineer.

I was always very disappointed that the utterly alien Space Jockey was ostensibly a human in a suit. Giger's original vision was so much better than that.

If I had my way with the future direction of the story...

Space Jockeys (and variants thereof) are a completely different and ancient species. They are to the Engineers as Engineers are to us. The Engineers hijacked their technology, including the ability to grow spaceships and engineer life. Being a religious bunch, they revere the Space Jockeys and even go so far as to imitate them, right down to the elephant masks they wear. Of course, the Engineers are much smaller, and they don't grow out of a pilot's chair in the same way that the Space Jockey does. They don't have the very obvious creeping growths over their arms that blend with the seat, for example.

More importantly, this is a more interesting story line! Imagine if Space Jockeys are the tip of the iceberg, and they have different castes and forms themselves. Endless possibilities for truly alien and shocking manifestations. Do you remember the very first time you saw the Space Jockey in his chamber? How utterly surreal and scary that was. We need more truly alien concepts to arise in the franchise.

I certainly can see where you are coming from, the Space Jockey Scene was Enigmatic, Awe Inspiring the Scale especially when the Crew entered the Pilot Chamber.....

The Scale seemed more Awe Inspiring in the First Shots, the Space Jockey would have been in the 20-22ft Ball Park.  Compared to the Prop would have made it a 14-15ft Being.

When doing any Sequel/Prequel that would either Answer the Space Jockey Mystery or have us be introduced to their Species would be something that would be more EXPENSIVE to portray as a 20ft+ Species.

It certainly is possible nowadays compared to in the 80's/90's but it would be much Easier with a 15ft Space Jockey... If there is to be a LIVE one that interacts with Humans.

When working on the Prequels they introduced the Space Jockey as the Engineers Giant Bald Humanoids who stood 15ft Tall.... if they had pulled off this Scale on Screen with the use of Various Effects like say Game of Thrones and Lord of the Rings had used, then i DONT think the Problems would have been as bad... (regarding the Space Jockey).

Some are Disappointed that we got Bald Humanoids...

But this is the Concept that HR Giger had gone for in 1978..

The Space Jockey had Changed over the Years....

*Started off as a Alien Skeleton of a Species who had attempted to take some Eggs/Spores back to the Ship for Study.

*Evolved to a more Humanoid looking Skeleton.

*Then RS did Story Boards that had been inspired by one of HR Gigers Works.

*HR Giger then came in to Redesign this to the Space Jockey we got in the above image...  looking like some kind of Space Suit at this point.

*Production began and the Space Jockey head came across more Organic/Skeletal, which combined with the Ribcage lead to Speculate it was a Skeleton (Dallas Fossil Comment seemed a confirmation).

BUT then we had Ridley Scott say a long while back it was a SPACE SUIT, and when work began on the Prequels this was the Idea they ran with...

But the Problem was our 15ft Humanoid Space Suited Space Jockeys got down sized to 8ft the Illusion intended to be 9-10ft but they FAILED just as much as the intention of a 26ft Space Jockey in ALIEN.

A Number of Fans are NOT pleased with the Space Jockey, certainly the Revelation does-not add up to the Expectation.

*Some thought it should be a SKELETON of some Tapir looking Alien Species or Elephantine.

*Some Fans dont-mind it being a Space Suit but dont like the Revelation of the Wearer being a Bald Human looking Race.

*Most Fans seem to Feel that the SCALE is off and that the True Space Jockey should have been some True Giant of at least 15ft in Size.

Its a case of OVERSIGHT and IF they would ever consider introducing the Space Jockey from ALIEN as different to a 8ft Humanoid in a Space Suit.

For me the SCALE is the issue i have...

Introduce other Race connected to the Engineers that can be as Human Looking but make them about 12ft and for me that would do...

Other than that, i would welcome the Occupants inside the SUIT to be much Less Human Looking.... OR the Space Jockey is a Bio-Mechanical Being like the Xenomorph was.

But NO to any Skeleton!

"There is a way out: the Space Jockey is not an Engineer"

And TIP of the Ice Berg!

Certainly ;)

I think that is a way to FIX things, the Space Jockey as a 13-16ft Species who are either Bio-Mechanical in Nature like how the Xenomorph appears and Sil from Species.

Or a Not-So Human looking Species under the Suit, we could even have a None Human Bio-Mechanical Species under the Suit.

Certainly we could Reveal that this Species had either Created the Engineers for a Purpose, they maybe Rebelled and Continued to use the Technology the Space Jockey Race had Created/Engineered for the Engineers to use.

Or the Engineers encountered the Space Jockey and had Stolen/Reverse Engineered their Technology.

So i think we need another LAYER to that Cake, and one which gets back to being more ALIENY and HP Lovecraftian.

HR Giger has a Wealth of Art that could be Influence for for a New Species.

Now you're talking.

So what is the Space Jockeys 'job'?

It's not the pilot(David was able to fly a Juggernaut)..

What is canon?

The Space Jockey was referred to as the PILOT, that certainly was its JOB , what Prometheus had indicated to us (IF we assume the Space Jockey and Engineers have same Function) is that Prometheus showed us that the Engineers use their Suits for MORE than just a Pilot Suit.  They did-not need them on the Surface of LV-223, the  Complex on LV-223 and Juggernaught had a Enviroment that could Support Life, well breathable to Humans.

So the Suit being NEEDED to Breath seems Unlikely, unless to Conserve Resources ONCE they set a Destination the Turn-Off their Life-Support and so use the Suit to Breath?

The other use we see in Prometheus is some kind of Bio-Hazzard Suit, maybe to Protect them from their Bio-Weapons, but Certainly so they DONT effect their Bio-Weapons/Experiments.

I can see the Point your trying to Raise with David... its actually a Very Good Point... something thats Obviously a Plot Convenience

David does-not Breath so he would NOT need a Suit.

We dont see him getting into any Suit... could it connect to a Synthetic?

We see the Space Jockey Suit (Pilot Chair one) connects the Pilot to the Chair, for some Purpose.

Now the ALIEN Prop differs a little as far as HOW the Head/Helmet is attached to the Chair, the Concept does show what is the Space Jockey Head Connected, but we dont get to see this as clear (lack Wires etc) in ALIEN.  It looks connected via the Arms in both though.

In Prometheus we got the Revelation that the Helmet is Permanently Connected/Fused with the Chair and it encases around the Pilot.

The point i am trying to raise is WHAT is the purpose of this Connection, does it connect to the Pilots Brain, does it Function as some kind of Life Support System?

The End of Prometheus, more so The Crossing would indicate the Ship can be Controlled without maybe having to be Connected to the Chair....

If the Suit Provides some Electrical Connection a Mind/Data Transfer-link to the Pilot, then HOW does this work with a Synthetic?  Can a Suit Connect and Interact with a Synthetic as it does a Engineer?

Does it merely provide Life Support which David would NOT need and so he simply would-not need to use the Suit?

We can only Speculate..

Prometheus also introduces us to the Engineer Ships having more than a Pilot, it could be the Pilot Chair is needed to get the Ship Up. and then they go into Cryo-sleep..... but how does David do this in TWO Parts? (Head/Body)

The Derelict is NOT exactly the same though, it lacks any signs of other Crew and Cryo-Pods but they could be located in other places on that Model of Ship.

some Speculated that as of ALIEN the Pilot is Permanently Fused with the Chair this is the Impression that some had, which included James Cameron..  However HOW would the Pilot had got Infected?  The only way if they was Fused with the Chair for Life would be a Face Hugger made it to the Pilot Room, but how did it then Infect the Pilot? (Easy if this is a Skeleton) but thats not the case.

This does-not matter as the idea is that the PILOT can Leave the Chair and they merely become Fused with it when they Sit/Activate it... but can Disconnect/Leave the Chair.

So its likely that either David could connect to the Suit, or that the Suits connection to the Chair is NOT required for the Control of the Ship but for other Purposes.

To be honest, to me, the Space Jockey looks just as it did to Dallas (and others): like a fossil which has been dead a long time (even if a petrified or desiccated skeleton might be more correct).

I wonder, those of you who are in favour of a suit and a mask which are organic in nature, do you see them as part of a living, organic ship (the Derelict). If the ship is grown (like a vegetable) and like a living organism, the suit and mask are as well?

Why then do the suit and mask look dead (yellowish) and merged with the dead body inside (so you can't tell them apart)?

The cockpit and the rest of the ship has a more bluish tone, more humid and looks more "alive".

That is a Good Point, there did appear to be a Bleached Bone Color to most of the Space Jockey, even Part of the Chair or we assume Chair.  Only the Base and the Torrent/Telescope and a few of the Cables/Pipes at the Back of the Chair are NOT that Bone Color,  the Part of the Bottom of the Chair seems to start of a Darker Brown and Gradually gets Lighter until its the Bone Color.

Does that mean they are Bone?   Nope, does it mean they had Faded/Decayed to the Same Process as the Space Jockey, possibly.....

When we look at HR Gigers Concept we see the Space Jockey and most of the Chair is Colored the same, the Base and Turret/Telescope a different Color.

Was they intended to be the Same Color? (Pilot and Chair) with the Base and Turret/Telescope being different and NOT in anyway way a Merger of Organic and Non-Organic?

Is it intended to show us a Decomposing/Fading of the Color as a indication that the Space Jockey has been there for a VERY LONG time?

Would this imply that Part of the Chair that Fuses to the Space Jockey Suit somehow Share the Same Construction/Material and thus are Bio-Mechanical?

In Prometheus we see the Chair and Turret/Telescope have a Uniform Color,  that fits with the Interior Color of the Room (unlike in ALIEN).

Again this is a Oversight... of sorts... Ridley Scott explained the Differences are the Derelict is NOT in Brand New Condition and is a Derelict, and the Juggernauts are in Pristine Condition.

If we accept the Space Jockey/Chair looked similar at ONE Time, then they have to had thought of WHY it looks so Degraded... a Good Explanation would be that the Derelict is a Much Older Version and has been on LV-426 for not just a FEW Thousand Years but a VERY VERY LONG time... maybe 35'000+ Years?

Regarding HOW the Space Jockey/Chair can look different and Degraded?  If they are Organic to a Degree, they have a like Dolphin/Shark Texture/Feel like Rubber, which would feel like how a Cactus is.

Maybe they are more like a Cactus as far as Organic, and so the Image above shows what a LIVE and DEAD one look like (Cactus) and thats about the BEST Explanation i can come up with.

HR Giger did Suggest the Derelict is maybe Grown and like a Plant.... so maybe thats NOT a Bad Explanation i have given?

Certainly help Support a Organic Suit and Chair, that can Fuse with Mechanical Components.  Everyone else is Entitled to their own Opinion on the Matter though ;)

If for a moment you consider what i have put... we still have to explain WHAT could cause the Decay of the Suit/Chair... what Event could cause that? What Environment.

Because without trying to Figure that out, the Most Logical Explanation is they have been on LV-223 for a LONG TIME, and those Dead Engineer Suits that have been on LV-223 for over 2000 years are NO-WHERE near showing us the Same signs of Degradation.

If this means we can ASSUME the Derelict has been on LV-223 for Many Tens of Thousands of Years or FAR longer... then this does OFFER a potential Twist to LV-223 where we could be lead to Speculate the Derelict was there before that Outpost or that the Eggs were taken from the Derelict to Experiment on within those Complexes.

However... thats NOT the case with the New Direction, but then HOW would they explain the Degradation of the Space Jockey and Chair, never mind the Size Difference?

Certainly they would have a HARD time Convincing us the Derelict has only been there for up to 17.5 years.

Regarding the Ship.....

HR Giger saw the Ship as LIVING.... he even felt the SHIP would Produce the Eggs.

The Derelict did look like it was a Part Organic Vessel and so WHY-NOT.. as far as it being LIVING.

The Juggernauts dont look as Organic/Living and so that can lead us to Speculate the Engineers had Re-Engineered/Stolen their Aesthetic/Technology from some Place/Some One else...

I will add to CONCLUDE...

If they are going to SHOW us that the Derelict/Juggernaut are Very Similar and a Engineer (God Forbid anyone Smaller) was to get into the Pilot Chair before the Ship/Pilot eventually END UP on LV-426

Then the Above is the kind of OVERSIGHT we are supposed to Accept, especially if 18 years before ALIEN there is NOTHING on LV-426.

So from that Image here are the KEY things.

*The Engineer would be Smaller than the Space Jockey (using the Wider Shots) the Engineer would have to be as Big as the One i placed at the FAR Left of the One Image.

*A explanation would be needed for the Color Difference, and WHY the Space Jockey suit looked degraded like Bone and not the Dark Grey Color.

Slight Atheistic Differences Internally and Externally could be Addressed by showing us a Different Variant of Juggernaut.  Particularly Internal

So we would have to Conclude depending on what SHOT they would want as Reference for the Space Jockey (Wide Shot of 21ft Space Jockey or Close Shot of 15ft Space Jockey). 

While it could be a Space Suit... it Certainly looks like the Pilot has been there for a LONG LONG TIME and the Space Jockey is also about Twice the Size of a Engineer (or more).

EDIT:

Its hard to work out the Size using Humans next to the SET as the Angle and Distance does  mean you have NO accurate Reference Point.

There are 3 Shots that Provide the Best Basis, One with a Space Jockey thats Dead on its Side as shown in the Concept work... with TWO members of Production right by the Side...   Using this i worked out the Space Jockey would be about 14.5ft Tall.

The other TWO have Production Members UP-CLOSE actually like Face to Face near enough with the Space Jockey and NOT the Chair... using these i Estimate the Space Jockey to be 13-14ft.

All things Considered its likely the Space Jockey was Considered to be about 15ft Tall, which is what Alien Engineers went with...

Sadly on Screen we never ENDED UP with 15ft Engineers as Initially Intended.

I think to Summarize what the OT was intending as far as the NOVEL, then its likely to Cast Doubt on these things.

*Cast Doubt the Space Jockey Suit would contain a Synthetic.

*Indicate the Space Jockey Suit was more Organic.

*Indicate the Derelict had been on LV-426 for a Long Period of Time.

*To Cast Doubt that our 8ft Engineers could-not be in the 15-16ft Space Jockey Suit.

As Ignortantguy had pointed out, this does-not mean it rules out David as the Creator or that the Derelict is a Ancient Event.  If we take the NOVEL as Canon, then it does support what people would have seen if they saw just ALIEN, which looking at Prometheus has some Conflicting Issues. (Ship and Pilot).

As its stands the Novel lends some Weight to dispute the *Bullet Points i had made above.  However.... its to say if this would be Considered Canon by the Time we CONCLUDE the Prequels.

Its then a Case of IF the Prequels Conclude leading Chronologically to the Derelict Event... in which case its do they have a GOOD Explanation to the Following or are we just to accept them as Oversights!

*WHY does the Ship/Pilot look so Degraded especially the Pilot and Chair, if its NOT been there for a VERY LONG time then WHY does it have that look?

*WHY are there some Aesthetic Differences between the Derelict and Juggernaut, likely they are Different Ships but would we get a indication of WHAT kind of Age Difference there is between the Technologies/Construction.

*The Space Jockey appears to be ALMOST Double the Size of our Engineers can this be explained by them simply GROWING out of the Chair?

So its a case of DO they answer those, in a Clever Way that is Plausible or Simply not give much Interest and we are left with Inconsistencies we have to Consider as Oversights?

On a FINAL Note.... the Prequels have YET to Conclude and so things could be Changed... the Biggest Problem then would be IF they suggest the Derelict is Ancient.... then do they explain HOW it was that David created something so similar by Coincidence?

BigDave

I agree with your calculations about the size of the Engineer.

But I just watched the part of Prometheus where the Engineer sits down in the pilot chair. There are only two things which are attached to him: the helmet and "the ribcage" (which might be some kind of safety belt, perhaps?).

So, there is no "fusion" of the Engineer and the seat. It's more like when a driver of a fast car in a race puts on a helmet and fastens the safety belt.

Thats a Good Point, i was going to mention that and Upload a Photo of the Prometheus Pilot.... where it does-not appear to have the Arms Attached to the Chair.

But i failed to do so... mainly as we was talking about the ALIEN Space Jockey.

So i did go back (Prometheus) and Watch the Scene in Slow Motion.

As explained in the Image Above, its hard to see as the Scene is Short but you do see the Rings/Wires appear from behind the Engineer and then Wrap Around his Upper Arm... BUT not the Lower Arm.

We also  dont see them Connect to the Chair... However it could be that we DONT see the Full Process?

Some had compared the Space Jockey Helmet from Prometheus to being like a Tapir.  A Tapir Skeleton would LACK the Hose just as Human Skeletons dont have a NOSE.

so IF the Space Jockey was a Living Organism, we could consider it would be a bit like a Tapir, only its not a Skeleton but more Mummified.... or indeed like when some Animals (Reptiles/Amphibians) can Dry Out. Then YES you could consider it could be a Organism.

HR Gigers Concept gives more Detail to the Intention, where we can see the Snorkel is a Hose, a Breathing Pipe that looks None-Organic (we can see this in the Close Up of the Space Jockey Prop).

Here is the Most HD version of HR Gigers Space Jockey i could find.

I think its likely that the options would be...

1) Some Organism thats Mummified that would have looked a bit like a Tapir when Alive... would this had been Awe Inspiring?

Maybe if it was Revealed as Above (With Legs).

2) Some Organism where the Snorkel Attaches to its Face.

3) The Space Suit/Helmet similar to shown in Prometheus.

4) Or a Bio-Mechanical Being like the Xenomorph.

I am talking about mainly IF we are to introduce the Space Jockey as NOT a Engineer, unless we are introduced to a 12ft+ Version.

For me i say keep it as a Suit, it may be a bit different to Prometheus but a Suit none the less.. but you dont have to make the Occupant to be Very Humanoid/Engineer looking.

I made the above Image to show how its HARD to work out Scale from Stills from the Movies, as depending on Angle and Location from Camera, the Scale is HARD to Gauge.

It also shows the Intended Size of the Engineers during Production, which had been to Downscale them to 10ft from the 12-15ft as Described in the Drafts.

I had before made some Scale Calculations from the Sacrificial Cup, compared to Holloway and the Engineers and it appears the Cup in the Trailer is Scaled to make the Engineers about 10-11ft Tall.

I had made similar with the Head Scene and came to a Estimate of 9.5ft as the Height to Scale of the Engineer.

If they had used similar EFFECTS as used in Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit and Game of Thrones then our Engineer would have appeared as shown in the above Image at the TOP Right thus 10ft.  The Engineer would have matched the Scale of the Sacrificial Bowl from the Trailer and the Engineer Head in the Lab!

I Scaled the Engineer Pilot Shot to a 10ft Engineer and we see its a bit more Closer to the Space Jockey, so a 10ft Engineer would NOT have left so much of a Difference, and the Slight Difference could be put down to GROWING out of the Chair!

So in Relation to the OT and Novel with a 16ft Claim, this would be HUGE, but a 10ft Engineer would be more Manageable.  I think OVERALL when Considering the Space Jockey i think a 10ft Scale Engineer would be Passable, a 12-15ft would be BETTER but it would be a Massive Oversight if the Revelation is still a 8ft Being.

I am sure the Standing Engineer Suits are to a 9-10ft Scale, i have to maybe have another look ;)

I think Regardless it just makes sense to SCALE the Eventual Space Jockey to be Larger than our 8ft Engineers.

I think its Logical that we have a Space Suit, or a Bio-Mechanical Being or a Combination.

I have had a Look at some Concept Art...

It would appear they were LIKELY intended to be about 10ft Mark once they had began Production.  Most of the Evidence gathered from Various Props and Concept would seem to indicate that.

The above i had Increased the Engineer from Prometheus by 25% which would Scale the Supposed 8ft to 10ft but in Reality he would be about 9ft (As Ian Whyte is 7ft 1" and not 8ft) but Space Jockey suited i guess he would then be 8ft and so 10ft to this 25% Increase.

so this shows how with a Increase in size to say 10ft Space Jockey suited Engineers would have looked, i guess while NOT on the Space Jockey Scale it would have looked better with 10ft Engineers.

So if they had given us 10ft Engineers as Intended i think it would NOT have been as much of a Conflict to the Space Jockey....  Yes maybe 12-15ft would have been better.

But some are more than Disappointed at the Size!

Human looking Engineers was also a Concern......

Maybe 12-15ft  Not-So Human Space Jockey in a Suit would be better?