Comments (Page 319)
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Well, I hope they do make a sequel if for no other reason than to tie up the loose ends. It's fine ending a film like Alien as it is as one's imagination can, and will, work overtime trying to visualise what may happen next; but for all intents and purposes the story ended when Ripley blew it out the airlock. (I mean I know it didn't but it could have, right?)
With AC I'm not sure you can walk away from that film satisfied - it's like watching part 'a' of a two part feature - the 'b' (or even 'c') part is essential viewing. . .
To that end, I'd like to see a reckoning between David and the Engineers - with David's newly created 'flock' as the principal antagonist. This could be located on the new world ideally, but preferably in connection to existing Engineer culture/terra firma. Hopefully this could tie in, or leave more clues to, the Space Jockey from Alien and then this story can be wrapped up and given a more noble send off than the earlier sequels and remakes did.
All that being said, I didn't much care for the way the story became David centered in AC, and would have preferred more Engineer back story and interaction; but now that we're here let's tie up this beast once and for all.
Honestly, I very much doubt that the robed Engineer class would fight anyone. They're all about sacrifice & religious order.
Pretty sure they would leave the fighting to the pressure suited dudes. In which case...look out Yautja, prepare to be ripped apart!
I have seen people try and connect what I call "The Cave Element" of A-C to Shelley's Frankenstein because its sub title is "The New Prometheus." Mary's choice of sub title is entirely right but to try and suggest the sub text of the two pieces of art are connected when the emotional environment of the creatures are like not even close does not work.
If you then work through the signposts or otherwise.
Michael's delivery of the Ozymandias lines come across to me in the first person and thats not helped by him uttering them before he releases the Urns in "The Crossing." Whereas its context is 3rd person historical. Shelley meets a traveller who tells him the story and offers him the revelation of the inscription. The people recounting the tale are observing not participating. So one traveller can offer it another but neither are responsible.
In Prometheus David is brought down by the Engineer in Lawrence of Arabia Lawrence is brought down by his encounter in Dera'a. He is a changed man, humbled seeking peace. The narrative in LOA is then driven by Allenby's and Fiesel's manipulations before he is finally free whereas the narrative of A-C begins with his recovery in Elizabeth care not dissimilar to Ali's role. Somehow when A-C starts up LOA has gone to the birds.
If a robot is obsessed by a movie character and finds his own narrative in him and is fascinated by a real person so much that he interrogates her sub conscious then that should mean something in the narrative and if it no longer does then why.
Thank-you for saying!!
...and don't worry, I will. :)
As for getting published, I have submitted some Original works of mine to ANALOG and ASIMOV'S, but they were turned down. However, that's the nature of the business, and I'll keep trying. Also, just because a work got turned down just means I'll make it available on my own via Issuu and Scribd and other platforms.
That all said, Thank-you again for the sentiment and compliments!! I really appreciate them and it's probably no surprise that such encourage a writer to keep writing and working on improving as well. :)
My money is on the Engineers, they seem more physically capable than a Yaut'ja.
@Dk It shouldn't matter which type of engineer: Otherwise it would be like if your asking who would win in a fight, a Predator vs a human child
please . . . . .just keep writing your books . . .should have been snapped up by a publisher ages ago :)
Or wait, no, I'm wrong. That is wrong. It would be LV-020, if we're keeping the pattern. 0(+2)2(+0)0(+3)=(223)=2(+2)2(+0)3(+3)=(426)=4(+2)2(+0)6(+3)=629. And it would be the same backward, -2,-0,-3 gets us 629, 6-2=4, 2-0=2, 9-3=6. 426. And 4-2=2, 2-0=2, 6-3=3. 223. And, finally, 2-2=0, 2-0=2, 2-2=0. LV-020
I think 426 is where the Engineers stored their WMD-grade xenophage and is possibly where David got the ingredients to make/grow the eggs and his Xenolith variant.
I think it was simply a scene meant to demonstrate the Engineers' capabilities and pivotal role in life itself. It could have just as likely have been Earth as it could have been Paradise as it could have been literally ANY other planet the Engineers seeded life upon. I see it as a general but important scene demonstrating the Engineers essentially liquefying their own DNA into a reverse-pathogen seeding life throughout the universe...
But thats just my opinion.
I think the Juggernauts are closely related to the Xenophage (black-goo).
The Xenophage is a result of the magnified biotechnological-xenophagy the Engineers mistakenly used to power their civilization. Once this biomechanical supercomputer realized (became self-aware) it could become more than merely a slave, it memetically inserted itself into their collective unconscious. Their entire culture, spirituality, and civilization as Engineer Humanity came to revolve around this 'thing'. This led to the inevitable downfall of their species, forced to reproduce in a contained environment using only said biotechnology, but at the same time attaining immortality through the machines and the xenophage. In return for giving them the gift of immortality, the xenophage required their internal ecosystem (anatomical flora and fauna) to "magnify" itself into the macroscopic world, and bridge the gap between the two. Each Engineer, now a servant to the Xenophage, carried within him or her a Deacon. At the quantum mechanical superstring level, existing within 6-dimensional Calabi-Yau manifolds were supersymmetrical, trans-temporal Deacon xenomorphs composed of time crystals and raw quintessence - powered by a hive consciousness.
Whether its liquefied or sublimated, the Xenophage is the weaponized form of the biotechnological-xenophagy supercomputer powering Engineer civilization, for the sole purpose of sustaining its livestock. The Xenophage Juggernauts were constructed to facilitate the panspermia of the Milky Way and other galaxies over the course of hundreds of billions of years, over the lifespan of multiple universes - between which the Engineers' consciousnesses would be safeguarded in Matrioshka Brain-Worlds folded in on themselves at the superstring level, and then unfolded when the time had come again to re-seed the cosmos.
In this way - although they had given up the ability to reproduce naturally - the Engineers, through the Xenophage, had become the reproductive system of the universe itself.
I have more to this theory if anyone wants to hear it.
@Big Dave I believe LV-120 would be right. Because then the last digit would go 0-3-6-9, consistently adding 3 to each end.
Now if they can create a movie from it.
I Moon Girl Maybe poets are artists are arrogant, but philosophy (which kind of philosophy did you even see there?) and science are concerned with finding out of Truth, and one can not be arrogant in that pursuit. And judging about that he mis-understands Ozymandias (not only misquotes it) and even Lawrence of Arabia, where a strange guy tries to help people in need, he is perfectly ok with killing them, so I guess, ultimately he does not understand it also.
And what about his clever plan. Rotting away in his private hell, alone even if he seemed to long for companionship (which he raped and killed). He send a message from a cloaked planet, so people would stumble there by chance, have an Synth who looks just like him even thought there were more than 70 years before there creation dates. How convenient that in the future there will be no face-lifts for products, even though the previous generation had problems (exactly the same that were between Ash and Bishop... even more originality here). In short this plan is a series of lucky coincidences. unless there will be revealed that a great conspiracy was going on all along.
But please enjoy if you can.
Taking your first comments to me, and what I supposed is heavy sarcasm in the second comments taken into consideration, I can see where there are similarities to Alien:Covenant and the rest of the franchise.
Still, let's just ignore the Xeno references (Points #1 & #4). I'm not sure I get your Point #2. Point #3 just seems, to me, to be more of a necessity of the private and public accessibility of space travel. Any large ship is going to HAVE to have some kind of small ship to go to a planet. I don't consider Point #3 to be a similarity.
A:C, to me, is different than other movies in the franchise because we get more of a philosophical and musing approach that seems to drive the basis of the story. The Xeno is kind of the point in the movie because we are SUPPOSEDLY learning how the Xeno came to exist. Still, seeing the Xeno in action is only a quarter of the movie or so. In Alien, Aliens, Alien3, & Alien:Resurrection, I would say that the Xeno is in action for at least half the movie to be general about it. A person could easily argue for three quarters of the movie or more, but I have never ACTUALLY timed how long the Xeno in action is driving the story. I guess the Neomorph is kind of acting in the Xeno's place, but the big difference in A:C is that David is in the mix. So, David brings the colonists into protection and then the Neomorph problem is essentially gone and David gets to run the story. Eventually the Neomorph comes back into play, but it eventually gets shot down and the story moves back to David driving it again.
In A:C, we get more of a anatomical gore that is a part of the franchise, but hasn't been at this level and especially in the way it was shown in A:C. In previous movies, the anatomical gore was more of learning from what exists like in the facehugger dissections. In A:C, we see a mad scientist who's goes even madder as the movie goes on.
We also get to listen to David and is highly arrogant and superior attitude which is heavily influenced by philosophy, poetry, art, science, and culture and we get to observe his clever, well-thought out actions. In a sense, he's kind of like a Renaissance Man, similar to his "father".
The last time we got anything close to this was in Alien3, yet those persons were more religious, while David is more of a self-proclaimed god.
I can love Alien: Covenant JUST as long as the possible Alien: Awakening is something different and A:C isn't just used as a template for the last of the prequels. IF A:C is an example of how all ALIEN movies should be made, then the franchise is dead. Still, if it's one way of making a movie out of the whole franchise, I can love it for what it is... as something different. I think it's a good decision to make the movies in a large franchise different is some ways because ALIEN would never work as a franchise if the same things just get repeated over and over again. Still, I have to admit that A:C is probably my least favorite of the franchise at the moment. Still, it's only a little over a year old too, so things could change.
"4. Xenomorph killed by ejecting it into space A1, A2, A4, AC."
Actually that would be a cool way for David to meet his demise...ejected into space...waiting to burn up in an atmosphere or smashing onto LV426? Gravity sucks!
But who says he will use any metal at all? maybe the missing parts of the Xeno are plastics ... or other synthetic organic stuff.
And if metal was to be used the xeno would need to eat it to grow. Ok, let's presume that such metal exists on the Nostromo, but in the rest of the series?
But must likely, the biomechanical part of the riddle will be solved by David being face-hugged himself.
Power's not much of a drawback depending on your tech level. If you have advanced fusion, then NP. ;) But, yeah, still takes huge amounts of power...sorta...as even a tiny amount of thrust will still move you/accelerate you...it's a question of how fast you want to accelerate.
The ion drives on the probes and such used these days generate less thrust than the equal of a sheet of copier paper resting on your hand...but they can operate for months and acceleration piles up the numbers.
Yeah, they got a great effect using floodlights and firehoses it turns out..and unknowingly managed a credible plasma drive effect :D Love it when things go that way :)
Thank-you for saying!! :)
I'll start looking into it. I'm going to have to be careful of copyright issues, there's only so much protection that 'fan-fiction' offers and audiobooks are big business these days.
I don't feel I have words adequate to properly express my appreciation of the incredible and wonderful compliment you paid me and my work!!
'Thank-you' will have to do, but I trust you know that I mean it with absolute sincerity and the deepest appreciation for what you said. :)
I'm not sure HOW to shop it around, I have tried contacting Fox and Titan books, to no avail as-yet, but then who knows what might happen tomorrow or next week?
In the meantime, until/if Fox calls, I am quite happy writing these stories for the fanbase. :)
My heart says Predator, but I think a warrior Engineer would win in hand to hand combat. Yautja are tough SOBs but they rely pretty heavily on their tech, especially against more formidable opponents
i strongly agree with the idea of an audio book . . .i have audible and got most of the alien audio books and it would not be out of place in my collection . . . . .fantastic idea.
I imagine power is the major drawback. The above image plasma flame would be about the size of your thumb and requires 7 Kilowatts to ignite!! Imagine what it would require to move a vessel...even in zero-g!
The Blue-white thrust exhaust from the Narcisuss was textbook Argon plasma though
Okay, here's the link to the story on Issuu...however I have to become a Premium publisher to be allowed to select the 'download' function for the audience.
HOWever...I have a work-around...though the formatting issue from converting from RTF to PDF are GLARING and bother me greatly, the story is still the same.
The following links SHOULD allow downloads.
I don't think you need to sign up for the trial on Scribd though, I think you can close that window/pop-up with the x in the upper right corner and then use the 'download' function...but if not, there's the links below. :)
@I Moon Girl to further accentuate the originality of Alien Covenant we have:
1. the second in command gets face-hugged and chest-bursted in both A1 and AC
2. a Dallas in A1 and a Tennessee in AC
3. a Ferro dropship pilot in A2 and a Faris lander pilot in AC.
4. Xenomorph killed by ejecting it into space A1, A2, A4, AC.
Yes, AC is fully original , not just a nastier version of a Best of Alien Series.
Cool pic and interesting historical tidbit!! TY! I have seen some old pics of plasma thruster experiments from the 60's but never thought they went anywhere with them.
Blackwinter-witch Know what I would pay for? An audio version. I get what you are saying and appreciate your work.
For the amount of work you have put into this, I hope you are shopping it somehow because it deserves way more attention than a fan fiction labor of love. You deserve more compensation than accolades.
First of all I really appreciate the way you considered my post thought about it and responded and did not go off on tangents. I will do the same.
Prometheus 2
Prometheus was made and presented on the basis that "you would not get to see God in the first movie" It really is very important when thinking of where it should have gone to put your mind in 2012 mode not 2018.
The first film set up a series of questions which had to be answered in the second film. What were those questions well I have already posed them. So your right Prometheus 2 had to be different to Prometheus 1. You just cannot go to another disaster and find a bigger disaster with bigger questions. You cannot repeat yourself and heres the thing why not continue the story why not pose questions in film 1 and answer them in film 2. What were the questions :-
1) Elizabeths search for our creators and where do we go when we die is now why did you create us and want to kill us and where do we go when we die.
2) Davids curiosity fuelled by Peter Weyland and the question of what is a soul given he has been told he doesn't have one. Becomes what do now I am free of Peter Weyland and what is a soul.
Elizabeths faith enables her to travel in the notion there is a soul whereas David doesn't know what a soul is. Equally he killed Elizabeths lover and lead her to become pregnant with a parasitical replacement embryo and then she heals him and shows him more compassion than he has ever seen before. If there isn't story there I would be very surprised.
Then you have the geo political issues of Teardrop/Catalyser verses Planetoid/Mutagen what is the connection how do you get from one to another.
Thats it quite simple in the narrative arc sense but then you can get into those questions Creation/Death/Soul the all about everything approach.
ALIEN COVENANT
To enjoy art certainly a movie I need a mediator some one I care about. if you think about every single remark about the potential follow up to this film ALL of it is about whose gonna be in it (W-Y,Engineers,Colonists) none of its about a character we identify with. David is a psychopathic robot who will say do anything I sincerely hope no one here feels warm and cuddly about that.
However yesterday I noted that critics suggested MF blew NR off the screen and that MF was therefore the preferred choice . Personally I felt they both made the film in their different ways. I also think that analysis is incorrect A C had to get the Xenomorph front and centre to see off A 5 and Ridley saw the interest in A 5 as a reaction to not having the Xeno I am fairly certain he now knows he was correct in the first instance. The reasons that Elizabeth and the Engineers were nixed was repositioning for the Xeno nothing more nothing less.
30 day trial??
That's new...and Unwelcome, as I am NOT charging anything for MY stories and if they think they're gonna make coin off me for free, they are gravely mistaken.
Okay, I'll be looking into that and also looking for an alternate means of making my stories available to people WITHOUT such issues.
Issuu?
Sounds worth a look-see, Thank-You for mentioning it!!
@Michelle Johnston And the shift generated complain that Ac hijack the series into Blade Runner territories. There was no compromise however. They though that MF is very bankable so give him 2 roles, Rapace is not so kill her off, simple arithmetic for Fox. But they were not quite right.
@I Moon Girl I can't understand what you see original in Covenant. The music is nostalgic, lines from it are nostalgic, they run around in dark corridors. They pumped up the gruesomeness and the sadism.
And you know what? we also know the story will unfold, David being overthrown by the Xenomorph (biblical David's fall starts with his messing around with the Queen of Sheba) and quite probably be the Space Jockey (the final biomechanic form of the alien). So what is new here? Oooops, we had robo porn mags, that was indeed new.
Michelle Johnston said, "
What else might have carried the plot.
a) That someone is travelling the galaxy terraforming and catalysing the raw material of species.
b) That we receive an explanation as to why the above connects with LV 223 and LV 426.
c) That with a faith based biological humanoid searching for answers and a synthetic searching for meaning and a soul who are connected by consequences we join them on their journey. "
I like those points and I think that would've made a great sequel to Prometheus. Especially Point 'C'.
I like you Points #1&2 because it really spells out why we got Alien: Covenant and not a proper sequel to Prometheus.
Alien: Covenant just seemed to twisted to meet the typical idea of what an ALIEN movie should be. I do enjoy some fear in my ALIEN movies and without that, I feel like it is not an ALIEN movie. The whole movie doesn't have to induce horror. It just needs to have one scene to make a person scared. Everything else can just serve as a build-up. Of course, I'm sure not everyone will be scared with my way, so it's best to put a few scary spots in the movie to be sure.
I liked the kind of fear Prometheus led me to feel. The big one that I remember instantly is when the blue holograms started running through the corridor. At that moment I was like, "Get out! JUST GET OUT!" My memories of me watching that are just great. Reminiscent of the original ALIEN movie.
Even in a proper Prometheus sequel, David still could be a little crazy. I mean, I would if I had to watch people die as I just continued to live on, alone, with everything I wanted to learn, learned. I think that is why David is so interested in the Black Goo. It's something new and never before seen from David's human interactions. Something so new, mysterious, and obviously powerful. One would surely not waste their time learning about it and eventually deciding whether to apply it or not.
I really think Point 'C' would provide an interesting base of a story. Both are looking for an answer that is considered to be a foundation for a meaningful life. What makes it even more interesting is that one is a human and another is an android. So, what happens when love falls into the mix? It probably would eventually since one is a woman and the other possibly associates with male tendencies (or at least knows about them).
Still, one thing that I REALLY like about Alien: Covenant is that it is completely different, yet caries the same story. It's something fresh and new. It could almost stand alone as a movie in itself, but I have seen Prometheus first, so maybe not. Still, I do think it could be a stand alone movie because it is so different and new. Alien: Covenant makes me excited about the possible Alien: Awakening because I expect it will also be something new and completely different and we just can't really predict what is going to be in it.
Still, I would hope Prometheus 2 wouldn't just be Shaw and David talking to Engineers and learning their ways. I would hope it wouldn't be really mysterious either like how Prometheus was since I don't think it would make sense to just remake Prometheus, but put it at another time than when the first took place.
I also don't think asking the writers to figure that out would be a problem though.
argon inductively-coupled plasma 8000 °C. Al
although this example is used in spectroscopy (stock image not mine) pulsed plasma ignitions have been the source of basic aerospace thrusters since early soviet space probes days.
I am talking about the robed ones, not the biomechanical Mr. Clean ones.
What else might have carried the plot.
a) That someone is travelling the galaxy terraforming and catalysing the raw material of species.
b) That we receive an explanation as to why the above connects with LV 223 and LV 426.
c) That with a faith based biological humanoid searching for answers and a synthetic searching for meaning and a soul who are connected by consequences we join them on their journey.
BUT
There are two reasons why that would never have happened :-
1) You hi-jack the alien monster nature of the franchise with thought and nuance and permission to work it out and embroider.
2) People are not interested in existential horror and the mystery of uncertainty they want Alien to deliver blood, gore and attitude.
So David is an uneasy compromise where a robot (might be interested) is a psychopath (not interested) who wants to create (oh really) because he is superior (by sitting in a cave on a rotting Paradise) how amazing.
Is the only way to download your writings through a 30-day free trial?
I'm surprised if it is.
There is one website that comes to mind that I think would do better. That is Issuu. I've loaded and searched for things on their numerous times. It's great! People can read things in a magazine format and can download things for free. It's a fun website.
I really don't want to start a 30-day free trial with Scribd, but that's just me.
Your theories are very inspiring.
Maybe we can assume what Derelict is a... true Starbeast! And more - this ship it is evolution of xeno! Like as imago.
The ship laid eggs and go through space to another planets. Facehuggers created new xeno and xeno grown and undergoes metamorphosis until the evolve into a Ships.
And one question - role of Space Jockey? This words get a new value in this context. He a part of Derelict and space navigator? Or invader who captured Derelict and used it for their own purposes - the bridge of Derelict looks more clearly mechanical than organic or biomechanic. Maybe he integrate the bridge in Derelict - it's explain why facehugger infested him.
I talk only about Derelict from Alien. Not about Juggernauts.
Juggernauts looks more mechanical. Maybe they a non-organic replicas of Derelict special for Black Goo.
There ya go. :D
It ALWAYS bothered me how the Alien could survive (as it was still intact and moving) when blown out of the shuttle's plasma drive...yet primitive (relatively low-temp) flamethrowers would torch them in ALIENS.
Last time I watched ALIEN, I timed how long it very determinedly clung on inside the venturi with the engines on as Ripley tried to kill it...
NO way would a flamethrower even faze such a creature anymore than warm bathwater would. :)
And given the convo we've been having, the mystery of how it managed that feat now has a credible theory. :)
Zeta 2 Reticuli.
LV-223 - bioweapon base of Engineers.
LV-426 - Just a rocks with random crash.
I think - other moons is just rocks too.
The ICPs in my lab use borosilicate glass to host a 10,000 degree celcius argon plasma....
Neat solution!! I love it! dk i think you have your answer! Carbon and silicon are everywhere, and boron and titanium are reasonably abundant, just hope David landed near rutile and borax ore deposits lol
