New Replies (Page 624)
When you watch the Scene when the xeno gets crushed you see that the only things that Get crushed are it's legs and an arm, the head and torso are still attached.
Thoughts_Dreams That's what I think too. I hated Shaw but not the actor Noomi.
cuponator3000 I have a Soilent Green DVD buried around somewhere- maybe I will have to dig that up again.
cuponator3000 Do you mean Monday or The Drop? I sort of wonder if some made for Netflix movies are a bit like you describe- not quite theater worthy? Not that it's bad- viewing habits seem headed in this direction.
I liked the movie, but mainly only Rapace's perofrmance... The whole film itself felt like it was lacking something. I feel like this could have been treated as, like, bigger. You know? It fell below or right around the level of the Hunger Games, Mazrunner, and all that stuff when it comes to dystopian future films. There were some scenes, concepts and performance moments that showed the potential that this story had, but the whole project did not live up to that (in my opinion only, of course)
I mean, I am sure that if I watched it a few more times I would appreicate it more, but I don't want to rewatch it haha! It just doesn't have much replay value. Still though, I can't stress how well Rapace performed! I am also excited for Unlocked, which stars Rapace and Orlando Bloom! It unfortunately looks as if it is a pretty run-of-the-mill action type flick, but it might rise above that! I'll find out!
Hopefully "Unlocked," doesn't detract from her growing star power IF it is just a meh action film. "What Happened To Monday?," was a great example of Rapace's skill.
I just get the sense from this that 'this guy doesn't have a clue where hes going with this' and its starting to show
Nice catch Thombach! I completely missed he went from plural to singular there when I read it.
would their fear of AI possibly have come from having done something similar in their own history? we see stuff like terminator and the matrix and ok they are different films but the premise is the same. I believe many scientist and experts in that field believe that creating AI would be a dangerous route to go down as a computer that can think for itself and be self aware, could very well view its creator as a threat. being self aware would create that primal urge to survive and what such a creation would do to prolong its own existence is unkown so hence may view us as a threat. is it possible the engineers, millennia before they started seeding worlds had dabbled in AI and it reeked havoc amongst them and possibly led to a war? they have possibly managed to wipe the threat out (or maybe not) but have gotten to the stage they feel safe. they have seen how manking is evolving and can see where we are headed and that AI is something that they perceive as a path we will eventually take so they planned to stop this.
yes the engineer did def seem to smile and look upon david with positive emotion, then almost like someone had slapped him to his senses, proceeded to rip his head off and use it to kill the creator.
great thread, gets the synapsis working
@ Thombach
Yeah, it does mention pathogens then talks about the singular "it". Hard to grasp what he means. Could it be that David is refering collectively to all the urns as "their pathogens", but each urn contains the same pathogen?
I will look it up- thanks. Meanwhile, I need snacks and beverage and wait for the dark to watch this movie. AC two nights in a row and then this- very exciting week!
Yog Sothoth Yes, it helps to explain and even excuse discrepancies- reminds me a bit of the different gestation times of the chest bursters during all movies including AVPR. I will just go with it and enjoy personally.
put part duex up for u blackwater ma friend. wasn't at the races tonight so not sure what I make of it tbh.
@ dk
David says, in the "Advent" extension, that the pathogen "generates a unique reaction with every genome it encounters"
One effect is killing engineers quickly, with super fast parasite burstings.
good film. wont spoil it for u if u plan to watch it dk. she was good in it
You have to add Doctor Who and Star Trek to that list also dude lol.
Doctor Who, Star Wars, Star Trek and Alien. The sci-fi franchises that grown men will fight over.
Late to the party here. To the OP, nice captures, and I liked this scene but thought it was a bit odd to see the pathogen take effect immediately on contact.
Ali, I agree, David's dialogue seems to be purposefully written to be taken in several contexts. Even in the John Logans script David says "The Engineers were ingenious with their pathogens" - plural.
Then the very next sentence says "It was designed to infect every living being" - singular!
yea these little things do try and test us but its something that I think adds to the engineers mythology. but I do agree, the direct story involving the humans, no it doesn't change it much. but u have to remember alien is nearly 40 years old and is almost a Hollywood 'national treasure'. it is close to perfect imo and will stand the test of time even in another 40 years. fans who grew up with it like myself want it all tied up nice n neatly in a pretty red bow and in a way that does the original justice. for me, I just want to be really entertained, have the alien universe opened up and explored and then have it all fit in with the derelict on lv426. its not a lot to ask but RS seems to be losing some things here.
wer a fickle bunch but wer passionate about alien and the franchise. you could argue only star wars rivals the alien universe for such passion and that spills over into continuity where stories and plots are concerned. he cant please everyone, I get that, but at the very least he can please me lol
The Drop. Haven't seen it.
It has been said that these "ships" are rather grown than made.
Oh I would much rather this was explained fully, in some decent backup material. I find it annoying that inconsequential things are a mystery. I mean, would it change the overall story that much if there are multiple goos each with it's own reaction, or one goo with multiple reactions by genome. It wouldn't change the story much at all.....so this is such a pointless mystery.
Ridley Scott might as well be saying "Guess what's in my hand?". We say - "a matchstick?" "nope" "a jelly baby?" "nope" "a button?" "nope" "a coin?" "YES!!"
"Well that's solved that then....."
whats the film called with rapace, hardy and gandolfini?
I get what ur saying yogi and u may even be right. the issue here is the films have left everything about the goo so open. even in davids dialogue and description of it can be taken in several contexts. u have ur theory as u have preserved all the material as have I and we have come to 2 different theories. I do enjoy the theorising tbh and in a way don't want it to end by having something definitive produced but I would like to think wel see something that will straighten it out. I do think that the 1 source is tied in with the creature depicted in the mural. not sure how, another topic I think.
5 minutes in, this looks GREAT!
@ Kethol
Maybe I had that discussion with someone else. Sorry.
@ali81 & Kethol
Well that's your view, I need a lot more convincing to believe in multiple goos. David says the pathogen "generates a unique reaction with every genome it encounters" not The different pathogens have unique reactions.
So that's how I interpret it.
Ali81 - Nailed it. My thoughts exactly on each point.
Thombach, the idea that there have to be several forms of the pathogen I have discussed many times here - I made a whole topic here on it - but I have never said black goo can instantly produce life out of itself, or anything like that, nor have I had any discussion about that idea with anyone here.
I don't even remember anyone here saying that before. Interesting idea, but I don't think anything in the movies, scripts or book indicates that. Pathogens would need proteins to read DNA and replicate itself, create new cells, et cetera. They don't do that. They just steal that stuff from cells they infect and make the cells do it for them.
This is the Alien universe, so anything is possible though!
Yes, and David then inadvertently recreated this process, but made it better/more efficient
daliens Nice! I did not see a price on that.
daliens Everybody has their own personal likes. It is good to be passionate about it as long as we remain respectful of each other's opinions. However, I don't think it is a good idea to remove all the recognizable iconography from the franchise.
Prometheus
( I like both AC and prometheus).
I think this trilogy is going to be like Lord of the Rings and Star Wars once they're finished: each one building on the last. They can't really stand very well on they're own, rather they are 3 parts to one, whole story. You can't watch one without watching the rest
yogi, if I may. I took from the discussion between urself and kethol a disagreement on the theory there were more than one form of the weaponized mutagen. speaking only for myself as kethol can quite clearly speak for himself lol I believe yes, there was only 1 original source of the black goo that the engineers have then taken and through whatever process they used, have created several types of the mutagen. I take this from what I have seen in Prometheus and AC. we see the sacrificial scene where the goo seems to bubble and move. then we have the goo that oozes out of the urn when the crew alter the pressure in the room. when we do see it, it seems to me to just be a thick liquid, nothing to suggest insect or worm like organisms within it. then we see the bombing scene and for me, it looks like the cloud of good moves and swarms. we then have the different effects from one engineer breaking down, to worms and members of the crew 'mutating' to engineers being turned to charcoal.
yes makes sense holloways sperm would have been mutated which then, once it had travelled up the uterus, would then use one of her eggs to produce the trilobite.
This old thread pertains to the OP but not directly- still interesting and may give some insight.
http://www.scified.com/topic/42754
@BD I can see why, that thing is nothing more than the "shoulder armour" of a standard xeno placed on the headpiece/carapace, essentially, with some other modifications. Nothing looks good to me.
Yes I now see that I misspoke. The squid creature Trilobite is a larger version of Holloways incubated sperm with Shaw's eggs.
Look, I'm sorry ok, I just had no access to the script. I saw you using the word "Macro" and was confused as to the context. I only called you "professionally wrong", because I thought you were misusing the word, turns out I was wrong and I'm sorry for that. I will be sorry if I ever make errors. That's why I'm honest.
Back to those points 1) Most of what I have read about both movies points to just one pathogen, with varying effects based on different genome of victim (different animals), different dosage (a drop vs a face full of it), and the method of infection (in the nose, or in the mouth).
2) There are some bits in this script that seem to point to the black goo producing life on it's own (hence the mold with the egg sacs), but the wording is very ambiguous, I'm siding with your view I think for now, that the goo always needs other DNA to work on, but here are the quotes from the script -
David - "It was designed to infect every living being. Either kill them outright, or mutate into a different lethal form, so the slaughter would never end until every humanoid life form was dead. Thus the creatures that attacked you: Human DNA infected with the virus and creating yet more deadly mutations ... An endless spiral of predation."
David - "The pathogen took so many forms, and was extremely mutable. Fiendishly inventive in fact. The original black liquid turned to lethal particles when exposed to air. Later stages produced parasites and invasive insects. From their eggs came, well... this enviable bestiary."
ORAM - "There were things like this on the ship, they grew out of a kind of black fur, like mold ... An evolution from the pathogen I take it?
DAVID - "Yes. I was curious so I brought them here and nursed them along. Did a bit of genetic experimentation, some cross breeding, hybridizing, what-have-you."
I know this script isn't final, but I doubt these ideas were changed much cuz they arn't very consequential. I'm still sort of guessing the Black goo pathogen needs host DNA to work on, it's just confusing how the script calls it "the virus" when its talking about the insects infecting humans. So confusing. Glad they fixed that bit at least.
No I'm saying those little buggers infected Holloway's sperm and THAT is what became the Trilobite. It's very possible that there were insectlike spores inside those egg sacs already and the black pathogen simply mutated them for its own purposes: To recode and impregnate. Does that answer your questions
OK, but go back a few pages. The MACRO thing had just been posted - a quoted section directly from the script. Your replied in the next post that there was no evidence and argued that MACRO meant zoomed out, even though the script described a close up. I confirmed macro meant zoomed in script, which I just read, then you rudely told me to stop being professionally wrong. Others also chimed in to try and explain you were wrong. Now you agree with us.
Point being, you were given the same evidence you later claimed changed your mind, but told us we were wrong anyway. It just seems so unnecessary.
Your point #1, I am still on the fence with. Seems it could be either way. I have not seen any hard evidence presented here for one version. Lots of things indicate it has to be more than one, or just inconsistent writing on the writers part.
I have not seen your point #2 to argued here anywhere, but I have not read all the threads. I'm not sure if I agree the black goo can instantly produce life out of itself. I don't know how that could be argued. Seems it needs some animal DNA to mutate or infect first.
