Comments (Page 367)

It takes place in 2497 if I'm not mistaken.

So we can dream about a lot of Alien movies between 2104 and 2497. :)

I'm addicted to extras, bonus material and making of docs, they are total bliss to watch. I just wish every old Sci-fi movie I love had some extras. 

The Furious Gods in particular. It has to be about the, greatest behind the scenes documentary ever made. It's nine hours + of Ridley Sci-fi heaven. Totally epic!

Needless to say, the bonus material for both ALIEN and Blade Runner top my list too.

Plus of course, some deleted/alternate scenes always give rise to lively debate.

These movies involve such talent and skill, that you want to find out exactly how the effects were achieved!

'I think we need to explore/add another very Lovecraftian and Totally Alien Element to the Franchise.'

'...something very Alien, Enigmatic and Mysterious.'

Yes, BigDave, I'm sure everybody agrees with you.

Life-size... Wow! Looks awesome.

I agree about the sets of Prometheus.  If there ain't good sets, there is fantastic visuals and CGI, with wonderous choice of colors.  I watched the whole movie of Prometheus many times just to admire the sets and visuals.  

BigDave said, "I will see if we can arrange some interviews with some guys who worked on the Sets"

THAT needs to be done!!!  That would be cool if you could do that!

It's hard to believe that some people or person is trying to make a business out of massive statues!!!

They're even sold out of the 10' tall Optimus Prime!!! Who buys this stuff?!

They also got Big Chap

https://www.s9shop.com/collections/lifesize-statues/products/alien-lifesize-replica-statue

I'm not impressed with Big Chap as much as the Covenant workmanship.  Maybe it's just some bad pictures too.

It's so, beautiful...

I am talking about Prometheus not Covenant. Apparently you didn't read the entire post lol.

Going to be a bit busy now, so i will try and help another time.

But i will say that Ridley Scott is a fan of Massive Sets and quite a lot of Alien Covenant as far as Up close shots of Actors and the environments were mostly Practical and Built.

There are a number of behind the scenes shots and videos on the internet, i will link some another time and indeed the DVD/Blu-Ray Extras should have plenty of behind the scenes too.

As far as how much these all cost, thats something we cant really put a number on, but i would not be surprised if 25% of the Budget went on such things... maybe more.

I will see if we can arrange some interviews with some guys who worked on the Sets ;)

Totally agree..... Wise words by O'Bannon.

I think behind O'Bannons ideas for Alien which started with Star Beast offered a insight into a very Lovecraftian Tale, and by that its what we DID-NOT see.

So i am talking about the Star Beast concept behind the Beast, what happened to the Race that Preceded it, the whole idea/concept behind that Temple, the Murals.

There was a whole Interesting Story here.... if we assume this place was left as it was for say 10'000 years... then there is a interesting story to what happened 10'000 plus years ago.. or where are those who built that place now...

Same can be said regarding the Mystery of LV-223.

And so i think its these kinds of themes/stories that need to be explored with a touch of HR Giger Aesthetic to bring us back to something more Surreal and Alien.

With the Prequels we have to wonder are they going to explore some of this?   surely we cant just go the route of.

David Creates Thousands of Eggs on the way too, or on Origae-6 and then Engineers arrive and then either Engineers, David or Humans get Davids Eggs onto a Engineer Ship that then crashes on LV-426.

Yes this could be interesting.....   but i hope the way they explore it opens up something to expand upon and steer away from ALIEN and maybe give us something that is as Mysterious, Awe Inspiring and Enigmatic as when we first saw the DERELICT and Cargo/Pilot.

Because as interesting as the Ancient Aliens aspect is (something that needs more coverage) it also needs that extra bit of something TOTALLY Alien....  because as of now, we have 7-8ft Humanoids, Create Man,  who they then try and Destroy with the Black Goo, which fails.... and so Mankind go unchecked and create David who then leads to the down fall of the Engineers and creates something Deadly that ends up on a Engineer Ship piloted by likely a Engineer.

Big Bald Human Creating Humanoids, heading off with a Human Created Synthetics very own Devilish Creation.

I think we need to explore/add another very Lovecraftian and Totally Alien Element to the Franchise.

And this could be from ONE Question Dr Shaw asked, once she found out our Creators are merely Humanoids...    "WHO CREATED THEM"

Then make this reveal a Curve-Ball and something very Alien, Enigmatic and Mysterious.  With the reveal of a Sinister and Lovecraftian  Agenda.

Nice input Ingeniero :)

I think it depends on the Balance.... when CGI or Practice Effects are done great, they look great.. when they are done poor they look rubbish.

I usually find its the use of both in tandem that give the best results, but this also has to take into consideration..

*The Team behind the Effects, Both Practical and CGI

*The Budget for them.

*The amount of Time to work on them.

Practical Effects with CGI Gloss Over seem to work best for me.

I see your point of view BigDave and I agree wholeheartedly. Different strokes for different folks and yes, the beast (as much I love the Xenomorph) has been done to death.

A great man once said "Once something has become familiar, no matter how well it's done, if it's familiar, well you know the old saying, familiarity breed contempt."

-Dan O'Bannon

Man nobody?

Indeed both those options will mean that DAVID is not the Direct Creator of those Eggs on the Derelict.

Option 1: We will discover David Evolves/Creates his own version of the Xenomorph.  Thus the Engineers may have created the Original Xenomorph or at least it was a event that happened thousands of years ago with NO input from David.

Option 2: We will discover the Engineers (or their creators) take Davids Xenomorph and Evolve it to become those Eggs on the Derelict.  Thus David just plays the Middle Man, the Engineers or their Creators provided the Starting and End point of the Xenomorphs total Origins.

Thanks for the Share..  Great Find

You can understand that point of view, i think for some their is a need for good Characters, and indeed Good Characters can help bring the Horror home more....  Alien it worked well, other movies in the Franchise never quite had us being connected to the Characters, i think it depends person to person.

For me i never really felt for even the Characters in Alien, with Alien and the first time of watching it, what works wonders was the NOT knowing who will survive...  that kind of helped to keep the tension and horror element... i also think it was the FIRST time anyone had ever seen the Beast and it was shown sparingly.

So its kind of hard to pull off Characters that we can connect with in the Franchise, a big problem has been any such Characters that could potentially get developed end up being KILLED OFF by the time of the next installment.

So this kind of put the Alien Franchise revolving around RIPLEY and so with the Prequels it has been about DAVID which maybe does not sit to well with some fans, but its interesting for others.

I totally agree the Emphasis was and should be about the BEAST as far as the First Few movies, its now going to be hard to keep to this and not give us something we have seen to death.

A lot of Prometheus and Alien Covenant was getting the PLOT Devices running, which was at the expense of some Characters but these Prequels are not about the Characters... its about the Engineers, Black Goo, their connection to Mankind... and the Potential Arc that David and Dr Shaw would take as far as a continuation...   Which was changed to be about the XENOMORPH in which case Dr Shaw was the Sacrifice needed for David to Perfect his Creation.

Alien is a Lovecraftian story where the characterization of humans is second to none. They aren't the point, it's the creature, whatever else wants to kill us, and what it means overall. It was the same in Covenant, the characters weren't developed because they serve no overall purpose aside from dying in whatever horrible way and introducing us to these unknown concepts and moving the narrative further. The creature was front and center, put on a pedestal by the A.I. that created it in the first place.

Big Dave:

I would like them to show that David made his own version because it would suck if they leave him as the creator of the original monster. Yeah artificial intelligence can be intelligent and the Xenos are smart so they must have gotten that from somewhere so maybe they could have been given that from David?

Having those above the Engineers in the next movie could be interesting. Maybe they could create the original. As long as David is not the creator of it, it will be alright. Perhaps the connection of the goo and the Xenos could be explained. I hope that the mural in Prometheus will make more sense when we see the next movie because right now it probably does not make a lot of sense to people unless many have a sense for details like that.

"i just hope its something with Good imagination, that makes Davids Work on the Xenomorph... lesser than the route taken, but also does not dis-credit his work or the THEMES of Prometheus."

Yes please, keep Scott away from the script. I would like the next movie to make things in Prometheus making more sense so it would be like "Aha! So That is why they did that!". This is not to say that they should overtly explain things in Prometheus but so we get some answers.

I would prefer if they did not show us the origin of the goo at all.

From some magazine

Source: http://oddstudio.com/portfolio_page/make-up-artist-magazine-issue-126-alien-covenant/

Another one

Regarding the Black Goo, there are so many Horrors this can create, its Origin is a Mystery and they need to either keep a bit of Mystery about it... or reveal its Origin as something VERY Sinister or VERY Alien.

I posted this on the other thread but it fits here too.

I see TWO ideal options..

1) Show that David has just Re-Created his own Xenomorph... but then we need to have him EVOLVE this Xenomorph to give us something of bit more of a threat, something different.  Maybe Introduce the aspects that Ridley Scott had intended in ALIEN which is to make this BEAST Far more Intelligent than what we got to see in ALIEN and on-ward's...   The Classic Xenomorph could be seen as a Perfect Killing Machine.   But then show that Davids version actually gets evolved to be more than a Killing Machine, and thus showing that Davids Creation is actually much more than the Hierarchy of Creation above his was...  So even if we start with the Engineers at the Top, these Mortals Created Mankind and the Xenomorph,  then Mortal Mankind Creates the Synthetics like David and then its David who actually creates something much greater than the Engineers.

This leaves the Classic Xenomorph as Ancient, but then we have to ask WHY would Weyland Persue the Classic rather than Davids? For this we have to show the Company take a Great Interest  in Davids Creation but in the END, we have to CLOSE THE DOOR on Davids Creation and LV-223 so that the company then discovers their is a source of a more Ancient Version thats Primitive that the Company could RE-ENGINEER to try and Replicate what David did, and REVEAL this as Special Order 937

2) Introduce the Engineers or those above them into the MIX and have them Pursue/EVOLVE Davids Creation to become the Classic Xenomorph.   A Big Question we should be asking is WHY does the Black Goo Evolve LIFE into something related to the Xenomorph, and WHY were those Murals and Frescos for?

some element within the Engineer Society and Hierarchy had been conducting experiments to Create/Evolve something that certainly is connected to the XENOMORPH and Held this in VERY high Regard. 

We need to show WHO/WHY had just a High Regard for the Mural, and then show us that these guys see Davids Xenomorph as a more Perfect Creation than what they was attempting... but then they see Davids Creation still needs some work.

Then its introducing a set of events from this that leads to the Classic Xenomorph and Derelict.

I CANT GUESS what route RS and those working with him have in mind... i just hope its something with Good imagination, that makes Davids Work on the Xenomorph... lesser than the route taken, but also does not dis-credit his work or the THEMES of Prometheus.

And i would CHALLENGE them to provide a more interesting route than the TWO i have outlined above ;)

I saw this before and he hits the nail on the head. Alien Covenant is a lot more faithful to the original than what people give it credit for and it's a shame.

To a degree i would agree... certainly a lot of people are not pleased that David Created it.... it makes it less Alien and Unique...

However we have to remember the PREQUELS where never really intended to Answer the Xenomorph,  not purely as it being about only this Organism....  it opened up a whole level above the Xenomorph which was just a Bio-Logical Experiment created from something Else and combined with the Engineers Nano-Creation/Hybrid Mutagen/Technology.

This holds TRUE for Alien Engineers and Prometheus, and Prometheus decided to tone down the Xenomorph and Explore the Creation and Rebellion and Philosophical Elements.

At this Present JUNCTURE they could indeed show us that David had NOT created the Original...  If they did this, then it may save FACE for some fans regarding the Original... but it could make a Mockery of Davids Xenomorph and well the whole Process of the Prequels which DAVID is a large part of.

I see TWO ideal options..

1) Show that David has just Re-Created his own Xenomorph... but then we need to have him EVOLVE this Xenomorph to give us something of bit more of a threat, something different.  Maybe Introduce the aspects that Ridley Scott had intended in ALIEN which is to make this BEAST Far more Intelligent than what we got to see in ALIEN and on-ward's...   The Classic Xenomorph could be seen as a Perfect Killing Machine.   But then show that Davids version actually gets evolved to be more than a Killing Machine, and thus showing that Davids Creation is actually much more than the Hierarchy of Creation above his was...  So even if we start with the Engineers at the Top, these Mortals Created Mankind and the Xenomorph,  then Mortal Mankind Creates the Synthetics like David and then its David who actually creates something much greater than the Engineers.

This leaves the Classic Xenomorph as Ancient, but then we have to ask WHY would Weyland Persue the Classic rather than Davids? For this we have to show the Company take a Great Interest  in Davids Creation but in the END, we have to CLOSE THE DOOR on Davids Creation and LV-223 so that the company then discovers their is a source of a more Ancient Version thats Primitive that the Company could RE-ENGINEER to try and Replicate what David did, and REVEAL this as Special Order 937

2) Introduce the Engineers or those above them into the MIX and have them Pursue/EVOLVE Davids Creation to become the Classic Xenomorph.   A Big Question we should be asking is WHY does the Black Goo Evolve LIFE into something related to the Xenomorph, and WHY were those Murals and Frescos for?

some element within the Engineer Society and Hierarchy had been conducting experiments to Create/Evolve something that certainly is connected to the XENOMORPH and Held this in VERY high Regard. 

We need to show WHO/WHY had just a High Regard for the Mural, and then show us that these guys see Davids Xenomorph as a more Perfect Creation than what they was attempting... but then they see Davids Creation still needs some work.

Then its introducing a set of events from this that leads to the Classic Xenomorph and Derelict.

I CANT GUESS what route RS and those working with him have in mind... i just hope its something with Good imagination, that makes Davids Work on the Xenomorph... lesser than the route taken, but also does not dis-credit his work or the THEMES of Prometheus.

And i would CHALLENGE them to provide a more interesting route than the TWO i have outlined above ;)

ignorantGuy

Yeah, Ash and Blade Runner. Only really talking Alien movies...certainly not literature.

I think its interesting, and well to a degree Alien never had much of a build up about the Characters, we had no real back ground for them, not as far as Character Development... it was just the way they reacted to the situation and how the actors portrayed them.  This had a bit of a unscripted element to it, thats how it looked.. it kind of had like a Reality TV about it... well looked more Reality than a lot of the Reality (not so real crap we get churned out) and so you had these Space Truckers, looking forwards to their Trip Home to then collect their Pay Checks... when they came across and had to investigate the Signal from the Derelict...

And it all went Pear Shaped no soon as they settled down to LV-426

It just seems much more real, i also get this impression a little with Alien 3,  were as Aliens and Alien Resurrection just looks so scripted.   And Predictable

"Delving into the Reason for the Mural in Prometheus, by showing us why these beings want to Evolve Davids Creation."

I would like David's version to be another kind of monster but not the one that we see in the movie from 1979, that could save the prequels.

Big Dave: I agree that the Xeno is not as threatening as before but I believe that the black goo sort of could take that place if they do not explain it too much. Hopefully they will not make the same mistake with the black goo that they did with the Xeno. Unfortunately Scott was a reason why it was made worse since they made it so it was a creation by David.

Maybe the Engineers and the black goo could take that place that the Xeno had. They both need to be made a mystery at least parts of them. It would be bad if they explain all about the goo and the Engineers.

I believe that Scott has made it worse by making it a creation of David but it could be saved so it will be a re-creation. Hopefully it could be a re-creation of other beasts that the Engineers have done before, that would be nice.

Welcome See, the more people that participate the better. People have different opinions and it is interesting to discuss things. I hope that you will enjoy it here.

My favorite alien movie is Alien 3, which it has been for years. Many things are alright about Prometheus, my main complaint is that many of the characters are either dislikeable or are just average. David and Janek were good in Prometheus. Hopefully we will see more about the Engineers in the next movie if there will be one. Alien Covenant was an android movie therefore a disappointment, I don’t  alien movies to see androids talking about creating things.

Do you mean as far as the Alien franchise is concerned or about movies in general? It depends on how they use it and if the genre that the movie belongs to requires it much. For example it could work in a Superman movie but not in an Alien movie if they use too much special effects in it. There is no yes or no kind of answer to this, it depends.

The picture is fun it is like "nah fuck this I am going for a shitbreak"

(The dog that walks there)

I have watched that one before and art is subjective. Alien Covenant to me is still an underwhelming movie. Sure people can try to defend it but there are probably people that try to defend Alien Resurrection too. There are parts of it that are OK but it fails as a whole because of the lack of character building and too much focus on the androids.

MonsterZero: About AR, please no. It is not misunderstood, it is kind of bad. They got it right with Alien 1-3 but that movie is where it started to get worse.

MonsterZero

2040s - 2010s = 70 years? Are you taking into account Ash? Was he supposed to have free will in '79? And how do you define artificial intelligence? Conscious robots acting as human, capable of understanding language, capable of "creating"? That will never happen in the near future. We don't understand human consciousness so how do you expect we could simulate them? Do you even understand what today is called AI and how it works? 

And Ridley ahead of the curve? What about the medieval rabbi who invented the golem myth, which inspired Capek brothers to invent the robot term, who inspired Asimov, who inspired Philip K Dick, and Arthur C larke and Kubrick, and final there is also Ridley, who sincerely did not bring absolutely nothing to the table.

And if it becomes a cult movie in the future good for those involved, but don't say that those don't enjoy it don't understand it, as if there is a hidden depth to it that only a selected cabal can access. Right.

AC will be considered a classic in 20 years.....especially when the first artificial intelligence comes online in the 2040's...people will acknowledge just how right Ridley was...70 years ahead of the curve! 

I've enjoyed Alien3 for the last 26 years...didn't have to wait 20 years to finally understand and enjoy it.

Alien:R is the same way....I imagine that movie will start to to pick up support and 'suddenly' be come a misunderstood classic!! lol

Alien:Covenant is like a 50's b-movie to me: 'Space colonists looking for a new home are attacked by a mad scientist and his space monsters!!'

What's not to like!

Oh I had no idea you had posted this too Ati. I'll be transcribing the entire novelisation soon. It will cost .15c per word, so there will be a kickstarter for it.

very true. I wanted to love AC so much. haven't looked forward to a film as much as I did AC but for me personally, other than the look of the beasts and scenery, it sucked.

Oh god I hope not

Movies are subjective, what appeals to one person may not appeal to another. I love Alien: Covenant and I am in a group of 2,500 people on fb who like it for different reasons...