Comments (Page 451)
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I don't want to hear the story of the black goo told by an engineer. I prefer to listen to David.
When you see a film about the Roman Empire would you prefer it in Latin, even if Latin sounds familiar?
The made up languages from GoT suck and they were unnecessary in my opinion. You always need an interpreter, it kills the pace of the film.
Who wants to hear funny sounds from engineers, hardcoded in English? Better make them telepathic.
Well if an alien civilization in a movie would talk in ancient Sumerian, would that also suck? When you hear it you can see it is also made up. Listen to this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUcTsFe1PVs . Or ancient Egyptian https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntnBuQAvFjA or ancient Hebrew https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--UABwqW9Sg .
Anything not indo-european sound weird probably.
Apart from blomcamps and Aliens diehard fans nobody wants to see Ripley, Newt or Hicks again.
They better explore new territories and go where no man or woman has gone before.
The facehugger too has acid blood. At some point it was speculated a resemblance with the acid lead batteries to explain the eggs' long life when hosts are not around. Not sure about the lifespan of xenomorphs. Do the neomorphs have acid blood too?
You have to trust an AI when traveling through space in cryostasis, MUTHER is also an AI and something has to wake you up from your sleep when the time comes.
All the engineers were supposed to be on planet 4, except for the SJ incident. About the SJ Ridley Scott said it is a suit, more exactly an engineer in a suit. Now, since fans cried when David wiped out the engineers' homeworld from all the 'meat' including all the engineers, Ridley Scott realized there are some engineers on some Juggernaut on their way home, so engineers will return to please the fans. Same story as that of the xenomorph returning in Alien Covenant after fans cursed the engineers and asked for xenomorph.
Should Ridley Scott listen to fans again or follow his own agenda and make a fresh sci fi without xenomorph, without engineers, without Ripley? The fanbase is so divided and there is no way to please everyone so trying to do that is just a recipe for disaster.
I thought the story belongs to the author, but the fans are now simply behaving like Annie Wilkes vs Paul Sheldon (from Misery by Stephen King).
More engineers doesn't make them successful. They are pretty stupid, first time on LV 223 when an outbreak destroyed them except one or two (if we consider the SJ) and second time on planet 4. If they created the mankind and then decided to destroy it, that is another example of bad management. Plus all the story from Advent. A bunch of failures.
I honestly don't want to see too many engineers because I dislike those movies when people speak some made up languages. Made up languages suck.
dk exactly!! Well said!
You think there is a rift in the fanbase now, wait until you retcon 1/3 of the films in the universe...
"Sorry all, those last two films with Ripley.....it was all a dream. now here is what really happened." weakest story arc ever.
I have found it helpful not getting too wrapped up in specific time lines. "Before this" or "After that" works for me. Just a thought.
Also, I think erasing a movie to fit a current story is kind of weak. If they feel the need to erase a movie because of convenience to tell a story, then they really don't seem to have a good story. It seems lazy and arrogant to revise/erase established canon and doesn't pass the sniff test imo.
I think we did see a similar awakening into death in Aliens, if that is what you mean. But I am not certain that is the meaning of these works. Aren't these the embodiment of man escaping bondage, to be free? And they are also probably an example of how much of a pain in the ass it is to chisel marble.
Leto having opinions and strong healthy discussions is great for the forum, but please refrain from attacking members because you don't agree with something. Starting a discussion with "Your idea is the most horrible, which I heard" is only going to offend others and instigate an argument, not a discussion.
Im sorry but I strongly disagree with any Retcon of Alien 3 And Resurrection. Like them or not, what you would be taking away is people nostalgic entry to the franchise. Alien 3 was the first of the films I saw on VHS after secretly renting it pretending to be over 18. I then back-watched Alien and Aliens quickly after and by then was totally taken on this franchise. Alien Resurrection was the first I saw in cinema.
Im sure Im not the only one in that age bracket that would have had similar viewing experience. Retcon those films and you make them worthless.....a cryo-deam nightmare is insulting to those who entered the franchise through either of these films.
With the endless possibilities in this franchise surely something could be written that doesn't need to retcon perfectly legitimate films and the legacies of those involved in them!!
I did not give a link- not sure if it is expected. Yeah- got turned onto Ash vs Evil Dead last night and cannot stop watching it!
It represents laughing at the Xeno stapler :)
Put a leash on Ridley and force him to collaborate while staying within a logical & vetted story+characters and finish that exercise. Or reboot with something entertaining. Kinda glad Disney has control since things got worse IMO since Prometheus.
I see they took my fanmade poster and changed the colour to green.
https://scpmaniac34.deviantart.com/art/Alien-Awakening-fan-poster-2-716732610
And now they are confusing others into thinking its real.
For the 1st image, it would have worked with this 100 Mile an Hour Tape:
there is a fan edit intitled paradise witch is an edit of prometheous and covenant together.
Just wondering. were did you get that image? did it already exist or was it made following the disney fox deal?
sherris it could be the new "exciting" player that comes into the game.
Thanks for the input Ingenerio -
Yes i am going to give it a go. just wish it was story that i would be tearing into as it landed through the letter box. oh well. ill check it. any info no matter how small is welcome in this franchise we cant help but love ;)
I think the Engineers will end up with a cult following regardless of if they feature again.
The potential mythos created and the way it opened the universe.
I just found them so interesting i spent honestly maybe 500 hours researching the net over the last 5 years.
IMO Fox never knew what they had.
About Amanda Ripley, I would rather not have it tied to Ripley at all. Follow another interesting character, that would be new. We have had three Ripley movies and a clone, isn't that enough? One thing that the prequels have done right this far is that they don't have a link to Ripley.
The wooden planet would be interesting, thanks for bringing that up Timmy The Ultramorph.
Having some movies about the Engineers could be alright if they are portrayed in a good way and if there are human characters that we can care for. I like the idea of caves and volcanos that Big Dave brings up.
It seems that he is changing his mind a lot, first it was about the Engineers and then it was about David. We would get a Ripley connection and then we didn't, what goes on with Ridley really?
Hopefully there will be more Engineers and better human characters in the next movie. Making it as disappointing as Covenant would be difficult, maybe if they did a mix of Covenant and AR it would be worse but that is not likely.
By reducing the role of the Xeno I think that they got to make something that is of a bigger threat and I don't mean David, I am tired of androids. Hopefully they will make the Engineers more of a danger.
AI to me is robots really but even if they would make it more about machines (think Terminator) I don't think that it is what this franchise is about or should be about. I would look elsewhere for that and I will ignore the next movie if that is the path that they will take.
Maybe the next one could be more about the Engineers and the black goo (sounds like Prometheus right?) but they got to make sense of the engineers and have way better human characters than we have seen in the prequels this far. More Engineers, less David thank you.
I like fan art and also the Xenos is something that there can be different versions of which is an interesting thing. My favorite aliens are those in Alien 3 and the original.
If this means that we won't get another movie about a mad robot then I am for it. The problem with Scott is not that he tried something different, the problem is that he didn't give a damn about the human characters but only had his heart in the robots. Nope the Xeno isn't cooked but a story based on androids at the expense of human characters is but I also like that they are trying new monsters.
"... i feel looking at the criticism aimed at Alien Covenant that for the majority its the Pursuit of AI and being about AI rather than the Xenomorph is the biggest gripe people seem to have for Alien Covenant."
This, combined with the fact that the human characters are thin as paper.
I like that they are trying something new with the Star Wars movies, they could do that with the Alien franchise as well. Alien to me is about human characters that get into situations that they are not well equipped to handle (someone tell Scott that). The Alien universe is bigger than Ripley, we have also had interesting characters like Clemens, Vasques, and Morse.
Having more derelict connections and some ideas where the alien came from is not bad, it depends on how they do it and they haven't done it very well in Prometheus and AC. Yes it have been wrong since they did AR, the last good movie was Alien 3.
“... and see what the BASICS of the ALIEN Franchise is.”
Fear of unknown consequences, a greedy company in the background that does what ever it wants to get money. The human adventure, or however to put it.
“what went so wrong with the exploration of the Space Jockey...”
Bad human characters, a lack of explanation of the Engineers and the SJ, and a focus on a mad android above all. A director that believes that he is a story teller, while he is not.
I would like to see more of the Engineer society, their religion, priests, soldiers, their army, science, and so on. They got to be portrayed as menacing and frightening, but still smart, otherwise it won't work and above all it got to make sense while still leaving some mystery.
“… i just feel right now they need to be very CAREFUL to not make it too much about the Company and AI, at the expense of the Engineers and the Forms of Bio-Weapon they created.”
The company could be interesting like something that is important but in the background but I don't care about the AI part.
Hopefully they will introduce some new things but the focus should be on the human characters and how they react when they are exposed to unknown threats.
I totally agree with DK when he says that Ripley is done, time to move on.
“I think this will be a good thing. I can't get any worse than AC or RS plan for Awakening aka David 3.”
LOL! I don't care about that either, F it.
Critters5: I don't have a problem with that. If new Alien movies means movies that focus on an android at the expense of good characters and the monster itself then I will not miss it. We still have Alien 1-3 to watch (and yes I occasionally watch Prometheus).
Big Dave:
Sure but I totally understand that about the backlash. Lack of action scenes was understandable but they still did not get enough well characters. There could maybe have been more action scenes, at least they could have cut down the David Walter dialogue because it was too long and too slow.
It should have had better clues to how the Xeno came to be but there were other things that I found bigger problems with than that. I think that the black goo cold have been expanded on but I think that it worked alright the way it was.
Yeah I also thought that it became slower when they got to the David cave. The pacing was alright p until then. I understand that there is room needed between the action scenes but the slow parts were too many.
The first act and introducing us to the characters failed because we never got to know who they were and what they were about. If the first act was about that it was a failure.
If Scotts vision is more robot movies then no thanks. I want better human characters and interesting monsters. Less AI, I am not very interested in that aspect.
"what Problems the Largest % of fans had with AC and the Future of the Franchise."
They still didn't get the characters right despite people complaining about that. I am afraid that the next movie might be a miss also, although I wish that they would learn from their mistakes.
"The only way things will change would be if FOX again decide to get RS to change things that they feel had disappointed the fans."
I want a good alien movie and if Scott's ideas make it worse then I will sure let people know about that.
"I think FOX need to either Back RS and the Fans have to give him a chance."
The problem with that is that he has made two alien movies in a row that have not been that good and judging from his plans the third movie will be a boring movie also.
"Or Replace RS and do a sequel that they can use his ideas but change things that have disappointed fans, but the problem lies again with NO TWO fans having the Same likes/dislikes."
At least listen to what the majority of fans have had problems with, not give Scott freedom to totally do what he wants and give us another underwhelming movie.
I don't have a problem with erasing Alien Resurrection but I want them to keep Alien 3 as canon because I like the movie and it is a good ending to Ripley. In case Blomkamp's
movie would erase Alien 3 out of canon I reject it.
"… i think Disney could be looking at what the FANS want instead of what Ridley Scott wants..."
That could be a good thing if they stop making movies about a mad android since RS refuses to make better human character, I am not even sure if he cares about that at all. I honestly can not say that I would miss it either.
"... but i think they would ULTIMATELY look at what they feel the Majority of Fans Want"
That is what Ridley should have done a bit more at least instead we get a robot movie which was not good. About time, better characters and less AI please.
I think this will be a good thing. I can't get any worse than AC or RS plan for Awakening aka David 3.
Critters5, I have many of the action figures.....but I just can't ever imagine rows of Walmart Alien action toys/figures...maybe a small section....but not the Star Wars/Marvel level.
Hope I'm wrong.
That was one of Ridley Scott's motivations in returning to the Alien franchise sherris. No one had expanded on who's space vehicle was on LV-426 and it bothered him.
So, Scott thought about it for a while before making Prometheus and that mystery (the Engineers) wasn't really explored Critters5 in the other films Ridley Scott was uninvolved with. Alan Dean Foster had nothing on the Engineers or the Space Jockey in the Alien novelization nor anywhere else before the Alien: Covenant novelization. And nothing on the Engineers in the Alien: Covenant Origins novel.
Monsterzero have you forgot the Kenner Aliens toy series??
Everyone who has complained about the lack of an alien, Dr. Shaw, David, or the Engineers has a legitimate gripe sherris.
I looked for all those things and was disappointed for a moment when I found they were not there but the book has a great second half and overall covers areas not touched on before. There is a time in the Alien story before any humans at large had any idea of the xenomorph...this book covers that time.
I enjoyed the book once I finished it. The character development of Rosenthal and Lope enriched what I saw of them in Alien: Covenant, as well as, what is written of Daniels. The main take away of the book is that you are given a glimpse Earth before the Covenant mission left and the motivations of those in support of the mission and others willing to die to keep the mission from happening at all. Earth is polluted, overpopulated, and saturated with amazing robotic technology that is both a benefit and a curse.
Like the book title says.."Origins"....the hospital where Ellen Ripley was born was not overrun by xenomorphs so we can all assume that there is a part of the story that doesn't have a teeth-capped pipe punching into someone's forehead.
I believe that it was written that the 20th Century Fox brand will continue under Disney to house the "edgy" movies sherris such as Alien, Planet of the Apes, etc...
Creative Perspective of the Acquisition
Great analysis of the creative perspective of the acquisition BigDave. The comparisons you make sure break down the component pieces of each respective story into easily understood parts. Thank you.
"We need to look at which Creation came first, Planet 4 Engineers, LV-223 Engineers, Humans and WHO/WHAT is above them..... THIS would be the ALIEN Franchises THE FORCE and while the Force has the Jedi and Sith i think we need to address what Factions are at play above and beyond the ENGINEERS but to NOT FORGET that they cant at least for the next TWO movies delve to Far Away from the Xenomorph, this is the Storm Troopers of the Alien Franchise, they cant abandon how we get to those Eggs on the Derelict in ALIEN"
I believe that the Engineers are a large enough part of the Alien anthology to expand on their influence (movies/streaming series) on/history of the pathogen. The resulting morphs have been shown in many variations but the LV-223 story has to be covered at length and Disney has the chops to do it. This conflict/outbreak that took place millennia ago would be mind blowing with Disney's CGI.
Wouldn't it be great to have Disney make a point with new Alien content that show's it can delivery more edgy content totally unrelated to their other internal story lines?
