Are people jumping to 2 conclusions or did I miss something?

woodshed

MemberOvomorphJune 01, 20121061 Views22 Replies

I saw the film last night at 12:01am - good movie, light on answers. Two things that struck me though 1. The orignal engineer that drunk the black stuff. There seems to be a general assumption that this was all part of an initial organised sacrifice to kick start life on earth. Not sure thats ever confirmed though, and he could quite as easily be someone working alone, perhaps even just killing himself (because he missed the last bus home) without actually knowing the consequences. This might explain why the others want to come back later and kill everyone to clean up after him. If it was an organised way of kick starting life then it seems a bit haphazard method to say the least. If he'd have fell the other way he would have just disintegrated on rocks rather than falling into the water? Surely there would be a more controlled way of doing it, if it was part of an scientific process? 2. The other thing, in the movie and in the forums that people just take as read was that the engineers wanted to get back to earth to kill everyone. Where does that come from? There is proof they have been to earth many times before and not killed everyone. Each time they could have been carrying the black goo or other methods of destroying all life but they didn't use it - what makes everyone so sure they are going to this time? (and if they are coming to destroy all life it seems again an odd way of doing it, introducing the black goo, which appears quite random in its effect on different organisms - with life on earth so very varied, who is to say how it would react with birds, cats, insects, fish etc? Again surely there would be a more organised way to wipe out all life for such an advanced civilisation? Infact maybe their new purpose was not to destroy at all? The original SJ that disolved in the water after drinking the black goo actually have a very positive effect, presumable starting life as we know it - the black stuff did not go on to create a planet of violent hace hugging acid blooded monsters. Either he didn't know what would happen, or thought it was a good thing - but now because they are on their way back everyone assumes that its to destroy everything. Can't work out if its story writing at its most deep and inspired or just very very lazy.

MiguelSUPERSanchez
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June 01, 2012

I thought the start sequence was quite explanatory. The Engineer and the goo disintegrate and then recombine to form cells and we see them multiply and split. That one Engineer could be the reason why we have their DNA. I don't think the goo creates life it just changes and speeds along the evolutionary process. We evolved from single cell organisms back in the day. We see that David can read and speak the Engineer language. Perhaps the holograph recording on the bridge in which the Engineers are talking to one another has some mention of destroying Earth. We see that they've highlighted earth on the space map.

Axl_F
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June 01, 2012

Hey - good points... 1. The credits state that the Engineer at the start is called "Sacrifice Engineer" and an interview with the actor confirmed that is what the scene was about. I agree though, if you watched it without this knowledge it might not be that clear... 2. I AGREE!! I just couldn't figure out why all of a sudden everyone in the movie had seemed to come to the conclusion that whole situation was malevolent! Admittedly there was some nasty contagion issues but that was more down to stupid crew members (and the more sinister ones) than ever really getting to the bottom of the engineers reasons or motives...

markos_prometheus
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June 01, 2012

Only one touch to your second question: As another member wrote very very recently after having seen the movie, said that it becomes apparent that what sparks the surviving engineer's corrupt anger is David trying to communicate with him in his own language... Perhaps now he goes nuts with the evolution of the human race being able to communicate with him (thinking of himself as a higher being). He may think of it as an insult of humans to him, their creator. Something that never happened before in the history of Earth. Maybe now the human race should be wiped out for their insult...There was no need for something like that in the past as human race wasn't evolved enough. Also shows that our creators, the Engineers weren't able to keep a good tracking of our evolution and got surprised...

flexer
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June 01, 2012

In relation to #2, after analyzing alien ship David said that engineers were about to depart for Earth with their deadly cargo 2000 years ago. And after awakened Engineer kills several Prometheus crew members and starts the engines of his ship I think it's very logical to assume he not going to Earth just to spread love.

Axl_F
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June 01, 2012

@flexer - just putting this one in the mix...it was only deadly cargo because of the way that the humans totally mishandled it. By the time the engineer awakes the humans (and synthetics) had been up to all sorts of nonsense with the gooey stuff. Perhaps the engineer clocks on to the fact that it's US that shouldn't be trusted with it...

ShinobiX9X
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June 01, 2012

I didn't catch where David said they were about to destroy earth. I do sence David is "hurt" by the idea the humnas call him just a machine an incapable of feelings. so it's not translated but i wouldn't be surprised he didn't translate weyland as he should. (and i think the language he uses is the one he learns in the beginning of movie, where a bit later he mention he figured out the protolanguage of ppl on earth. the map of earth was quite recent, (tectonic movement) and i assume they visited earth more than once in the past, thinking of the starmaps all around the world. untill they got killed by something +- 2000 years ago? (i am repeating myself from other posts :p)

woodshed
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June 01, 2012

@axl_f good spot with the credits I'd missed that. I guess it still doesn't explain wether the sacrifice was with the consent of the others - it all just seemed a bit ambiguous and not a very structured/controlled way of doing something as major as starting life. That said if it were a religious ceremony then very few make any practical sense I suppose. @flexer I understood that David could speak their language and once the SJ starts killing people bad things are a foot but Shaw makes the decision they are all bad before this happens. The map alone is not enough, as we know they travel to earth regularly so you'd expect them to have a map. Also the fact they have weapons on board is in conclusive too. Prometheus carried weapons but it did not mean they wanted to wipe out the planet. Again I come back to the fact that the black goo just seems a really rubbish way of trying to kill everyone on a planet. First it seems random as to the effect the goo has on different organisms (from disolving SJs and creating life, to creating facehugging worms) and secondly the monsters it can sometimes create have proven to be completely killable with conventional weapons (re Aliens movie) so there is no guarantee of success. (its a bit like releasing rabies or small pox- it will kill a lot but the chances are it will be wiped out before it kills everything) Surely for such an advanced race there would be a better more concrete, instant method?

centaurian_slug
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June 01, 2012

the answer is... 4 8 15 16.. its like Lost. any attempt to answer it won't bring closure, its just put there to ask more questions. its will just get more convoluted with the sequel. but i'll play the game for a bit [quote]"First it seems random as to the effect the goo has on different organisms (from disolving SJs and creating life, to creating facehugging worms)"[/quote] it could be the goo is just programmed differently. goo is just software, this is like assuming all disks are intended to do the same thing. [quote] " the monsters it can sometimes create have proven to be completely killable with conventional weapons (re Aliens movie)"[/quote] but how much ammo can you make, Remember conventional weapons are fueled by biomass (long dead algae). Introducing a predator/parasite is an effective plan IMO. nukes might destroy the ecosystem. a targeted virus would be very effective if , say, you wanted to repopulate. (they seeded life to make a home for themselves, and human civ rising from their own DNA was un-intended, to them we're we're like Weeds? ) or, as someone else suggested, it could be they were trying to create xenos , like when we crossbreed

ShinobiX9X
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June 01, 2012

and if the goo is no weapon? but that those bugs there (like centipedes) accidently got mixed with goo and gave us cobraliens? and that fucked up the engineers. the engineer chestburst is from an infected holloway making love with shaw. but what about the killed engineers? and the onter ones in same room as sleeping engineer with hole in chest? it couldn't de the same origin that killed the old ones, and the last one

woodshed
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June 01, 2012

It all gets much easier, once you remember its not real and 'stuff just happens' :)

NoXWord
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June 01, 2012

I, too, completely agree with point 2. There is no hint, in the movie, that the engineer is going to destroy life on earth or has evil intents. As I understood, the black goo is a quick DNA reshuffler, it creates new life based on the one it gets in touch with, and as such it's not necessarily a weapon, but more of a terraforming instrument. It might destroy the individual, but its purpose is well beyond that single kill. It simply doesn't fit our standards. Concerning the overreaction of the engineer as he is woken up, I think it's very rushed and is one of the biggest misses in the film. The empathy for the deaths there is absolutely non existent, though it's interesting that we don't know what David says to the Engineer. I don't think it is a plot hole, but rather a trick to keep people wonder if he's ultimately following Weyland's orders, Shaw's concerns or his own rising self consciousness. It could have been done better, though. What I prefer to think is that David simply ignored all the requests and simply told the Engineer something along these lines: Hey you, ugly one? Are you as dumb as you are big? Those eyes, that nose, LOL, you look like a complete idiot. These people here seem to suggest that you built this templeso big so that you could fit yo' mama in it! And the engineer goes bananas...

Ridley Scott will eventually tell us how the Queen was born. Right now we have the Deacon; coming soon the Mercury, the May and the Taylor.

flexer
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June 01, 2012

@woodshed [quote] I understood that David could speak their language and once the SJ starts killing people bad things are a foot but Shaw makes the decision they are all bad before this happens.[/quote] I didn't get the impression that Shaw made her final decision about engineers' nature before the awakened engineer starts throwing people around. Of course she was suspicious and shocked by the alien ship cargo, but she still went to attend the meeting of Engineer with Weyland and tried to get the answers. But after things went wrong she told the captain that the ship needs to be stopped which I feel was the most logical thing to do at that point.

flexer
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June 01, 2012

@NoXWord [quote] There is no hint, in the movie, that the engineer is going to destroy life on earth or has evil intents.[/quote] Oh common. The big guy killed half of the Prometheus crew and rapidly flew his ship away with thousands of urns.. With the same success we can think there was a slight misunderstanding between Nostromo crew and the alien in the original. The poor thing was just trying to make friends with them.

Axl_F
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June 01, 2012

@NoXWord - ha ha ha ha LOL! The take I've got on it is: the goo is a potentially harmful substance...depending on how it's used. It's implied, after all, that it helps create life. The engineers revere it in some way, hence the way and places it is stored...just like any potentially hazardous material there are risks associated to storing it. There has been an accident and they've tried to evacuate - not all have made it. Then our hapless lot stumble across it, totally expose themselves to it (with complete disregard to any scientific method to deal with it) and to top it off they then start abusing it. By this point half or more of the crew are dead, Shaws made her mind up that the engineers are evil , Davids got his own agenda (NoXWord said it well "wonder if he's ultimately following Weyland's orders, Shaw's concerns or his own rising self consciousness).... Faced with this lot I don't blame the engineer for going bezerk!

fox
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June 01, 2012

Pondering why they wanted to destroy their owen creation? They made us in their image, we stole the fire and Weyland is the ultimate sinner... Now consider the title Prometheus. We as humas are prometheus, we stole the fire - and look at it as an interpretation of our evolution. We as humans have been unable to control ourselves and we also try to steal their fire. Fusion, Androids etc.. For that they wanna destroy their own creation knowing that they have failed. On a side note: Is that Idris Elba just genious or what?? Give this man some huge roles.. And the scene with Vickers? So over the top!

db
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June 01, 2012

All good points. Haven't seen it yet... but why hasn't someone worked out what David said yet? I'd assume someone with RS's experience would have exposed the audience to every word (earlier in the movie) with the translation below. And I know there are people out there who have seen it multiple times. Just a thought. Maybe the reveal for David's words comes in the Bluray and goes something like this: "Good morning mate. Just for shits and giggles rip my head off and start killing everyone else."

woodshed
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June 01, 2012

I agree it all feels a bit rushed towards the end and to a certain extent doesn't really make a lot of sense. Take the final SJ for example. He's just woke up from a 2000yr old sleep after something really bad happened (does he even know about the bad stuff that happened way back then or did he sleep through) He then tries to take off in his craft, gets it rammed and wrecked and crash lands, almost right next to where he took off. And his number one thought after all this? His cargo? His crew? Any of the other ships? Nope, its the woman he met once for about 20 seconds and probably thought he'd killed when he threw her across the room and he knows exactly where to find her. Having said that how did he even know she was alive or where she was? And how did david know what the SJ was going to go after her. You would think after being in a such a big crash and just being a head, he would have landed face down somewhere in a corner with a bunch of rubbish/debris on him - a pretty hard position to know for a fact that the SJ was going looking for her (unless he told the SJ of course ;)

ShinobiX9X
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June 01, 2012

Did you notice what Engineer did just before decapitating David? He puts his hand above his head, like a child or i don't know he did that, and all of a sudden wihtout warning, klik crack off, kiss weyland.

NoXWord
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June 01, 2012

@Fox Janek deserved more in this movie, Elba is awesome, and the scene with Vickers, IMO, is one of the best of the film. Additionally, the only scene that somehow involved me emotionally was the Prometheus ramming into the croissant, again, thanks to Elba.

Ridley Scott will eventually tell us how the Queen was born. Right now we have the Deacon; coming soon the Mercury, the May and the Taylor.

ShinobiX9X
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June 01, 2012

I liked Elba/Vickers moments, but didn't need more to be honest. And truely, i still wonder if the "joke" between them ,is in fact, the thuth wihtout knowing.