Signs and Portents in the Original ALIEN Derelict

One thing that always bothered me was the amount of eggs: zillions of them. There's no way that they could all be the crew of the derelict. Plus, if you look at how big the Brett-egg is and the casing that's enveloping Dallas in the deleted Cocoon Scene, they look like they're the same size as the ones on the derelict. I would expect the derelict eggs to be bigger.

Herc: I had the impression that Bret's and Dallas' cocooning was turning them into bigger Eggs. I can be wrong though... Molecular: I agree with you. There were a lot of eggs in the Derelict and it seems to me only a straight portion of them were covered with that blue light/mist/laser. The Derelict is also very old. So I see two things happening as a possibility: One of the Eggs hatched and got into the SJ and the Derelict crashed damaging some of the blue laser/light/mist. And from this I would conclude that the area where the eggs are bathed by the blue light/mist/laser acts as a hybernation place, since the Eggs may have a limited lifespan and also because they are very dangerous. Nice thread mate.

I have never seen the deleted cocoon scene from Alien -- until today -- and am I crazy, cuz I don't see/think dallas/bret as "turning into eggs? I simply see a different version of cameron's, where people are gooped in a stationary place so that facehuggers can grab hold (granted, they appeared "more gooped" than those in Aliens and AvP, but nevertheless... Also, to my memory ALL the eggs in the Jugg were covered by the blue mist -- and it did seem to be more of climate control than any sort of security field (I mean, Kane breaks the field quite easily). In fact, dare I say -- it seems to be more of a security alarm (I know, Snorky!) than security field, too. It's clear to me the hold is just that: a cargo chamber used for transporting -- in this case -- eggs. This obviously means that the xeno (more specifically, facehuggers) existed as long ago as when the Jugg landed on LV-426, which seems to be anywhere from 200 years to... "eons" ago. Since urns are everywhere in Pro', it also seems that the E's moved to them rather than eggs -- perhaps DUE to what happened on the Jugg. Of course, from the holograph on LV-223 we see that things went equally awry... The best laid plans of mice and Engineers, I guess...

@Red Wolf: [i]"am I crazy, cuz I don't see/think dallas/bret as "turning into eggs?"[/i] Turning into eggs: [img]http://i47.tinypic.com/qzf6hj.png[/img]

ah, I love this CANON re-examination. Every time we say, "Dallas was being turned into an egg," and, "Lone xenomorph can re-decorate ANY surface," I'm a happy Alien/Giger fan. Cameron BROKE Alien canon with his Queen - I could say it all f***ing day.

Not necessarily. Depending on prevailing conditions, xeno biology could easily be flexible enough to bring about a Queen should conditions favour that happening. An infestation might reach a critical size where it becomes more efficient to have an egg-laying factory for example. Those conditions certainly did not arise in the first movie.

Just wanna remind people that Giger, O'Bannon, Giler and Ridley ALL loved the Alien Queen concept. Just sayin'.... Here is the cocoon scene in case someone wanted to see it. Click-->[url=http://youtu.be/dS5MtzrW1vU]Alien deleted scene: The Cocoon Sequence [/url]

Ok, OK... the scene I watched earlier was of terrible quality; I have now seen it again and cannot argue that dallas/bret appear to be morphing into eggs. But just my 2 cents: the queen is a MUCH better/more plausible alternative!

Also, will someone PLEASE advise how photos can be inserted into this forum? Copy/paste does not seem to work...

I don't get why someone would want to argue it uses one method over the other. If you have an Alien that can use any and all methods of reproduction, lone and a Queen, it is a totally dominant and terrifying creature that nothing can stop. @Red Wolf ; You have to upload an image though Photobucket or TinyPic, then add the URL. :)

Why does there only have to be one method of propagation for the Xenomorph, doesn't it make the creature more scary if it is able to reproduce no matter what the circumstances... [u]Egg Morphing[/u] Is it not possible that the Alien Warrior in Alien was turning Brett into an egg, which itself would have been incubating a Royal Facehugger, which would have used Dallas as a host and thus sired a Queen. Imagine if the Alien had been successful and the Nostromo had not been destroyed - the Nostromo would have returned to Earth with a Queen surrounded by thousands of eggs. [u]The Queen[/u] Kinda obviously really, just as in the films Aliens, Alien Resurrection and AVP - Once you have a Queen you have the means to produce thousands of eggs, each capable of using a host to produce another addition to the hive. [u]The Princess[/u] The idea as seen in AVPR, is that before becoming a fully grown Queen, the Queen caste of the xenomorph has a mid stage, where for a short period of time it is able to directly implant embryo's into its hosts. This allows the "Princess" to establish a small brood that not only can be used to grab more hosts and construct a hive, but also defend the Queen once she has fully grown (thus losing the short lived direct implantation ability), and ensure she is comfortable (suspending her ovipositor from the ceiling) and arrangine the eggs around her. With all 3 forms of propagation at the Xenomorphs disposal we have a highly flexible and even deadlier creature, do we not.

I am all for debates, but will knowing what ridley prefers as canon help us solve any mysteries in prometheus ?

Not that I can see... It's curious though why RS included -- to the good extent he did -- the xenos in Pro' after saying (both pre- and post-production) that it's not an Alien prequel and has little to do with xenos. While the Engineers' roles are central, the xenos' involvement was far from minor. Also, since the original SJ was on LV-426 for at least a couple/few hundred years, RS can only tie it & the Jugg into the story via flashback -- which will only f*ck with the timeline even MORE!!!

Snorky......................... i have to applaud you my friend. The debate of turning people into Eggs or that it needs a Queen has been bridged by your idea... Indeed it makes more sense to use Dallas as Host to what ever comes out of the Egg that Brett is turning into. This way the Xeno now has a way to create another Xeno companion and we get two Xenos..... but then if this is the case and the Alien Xenos intention is to procreate its species then why did it not also do the same with Lambert and Parker? Then we would have two Eggs and two hosts and then we would have 3 Xenos.... What you said has now bridged the link to Aliens and made the Queen Canon... You see indeed if Brett was being turned into a Queen Egg or another type of Xeno Organism that can reproduce like the Queen can, then it only needed two victims one for the Egg Creation and one for the Host. The result a Queen that can then lay any number of Eggs, thus giving the potential for the Ship to be a harbinger of hundreds of Xeno Eggs and a Queen and Drone aboard, in comparison to a maximum of 3 Xenos if the Xeno used all Humans to create a Egg and Host. Fantastic Idea and one i think fits in with the whole Alien Biology they are the Perfect Organism after all. @David 1 Thats pretty much how i would sum it up, Ridley said some how but he never said how one of the Eggs opened and a Face Hugger got to the Pilot. But i wont cover that hear as thats been done in other threads. But as you said about there only being one chamber of the Cargo hold that had the Myst, while i cant voucher for if all the other Eggs are dead and if this is because it does not have the blue mist. It does seem maybe the crash had damaged the other Blue Mysts that covered the other Eggs. It would appear that this Myst may not only prolong and keep the Eggs alive, what it most certainly looks like it does is the barrier is some kind of protection from contamination. We can safely assume that Xeno Eggs are activated by the pressence of a Organism maybe something the Organism gives off be that say CO2 from its respiratory process then awakens the Eggs (Mosquito's find its victims by same method). So the Myst performs as a barrier to block what ever chemical or signature that a living organism may give off that activates the Eggs. This is why the Egg only opened once Kane had broken the seal and was on the other side of that blue protected Myst barrier.

@Red Wolf I am sure Ridley hinted that the Derelict on LV 426 had been there 200 years prior to the out break that be felled the Engineers on LV 223 thus it had been there for 2200 years approx.

Cocooning hosts to become eggs is something I had not considered, but it makes sense to me. I was always thinking Brett, Dallas & even Newt were being cocooned to be used for food, or to be face-hugged. I really have not thought too much on the subject, but what do adult Alien/Xenos eat, if in fact they live long enough to need to eat at all? I guess then, the Deacon has to become a scavenger & feed off the dead bodies left behind on LV-223 i.e. Bob & Vickers?

"I would expect the derelict eggs to be bigger". @Hercules, this brings up another point about the xeno that I have been pondering (hopefully a search on the site will turn up some good discussions). Whatever reproductive path the xeno decides to follow, it will inevitably lead to the creation of an egg, producing a facehugger; but just as the emerging chestburster grows into a genetic amalgam of xeno and host organism, wouldn't this hybrid also produce hybrid eggs- in turn affecting the physical characteristics of it's emerging the facehugger? So far no problem, but the original facehugger seemed a perfect fit for a human skull. What if the facehugger encounters a potential host of considerably larger size, like giants ("Bob" doesn't count, for obvious reasons)? It wouldn't be able to subdue this host and it's weapons function would be rendered useless. Thus, I think it's safe to assume the xeno is a weapon created for a *specific* target! "the Nostromo would have returned to Earth with a Queen surrounded by thousands of eggs." @Snorkelbottom, that would have made a fantastic foundation for an ALIEN sequel! Never really liked the idea that Ripley drifted off for decades due to a navigational error by the Narcisses computer. "I am all for debates, but will knowing what ridley prefers as canon help us solve any mysteries in prometheus ?" @oduodu, I would like to think so; Ridley to *some* degree must incorporate continuity and logical sense into the franchise, because he and Lindeloff already stated that these events branch off into both ALIEN and newer (parallel) story elements. One more question I wanted to inject into the discussion- next to the SJ's chair was that square hole with acid burns- I read in the Alien Explorations web site (http://alienexplorations.blogspot.com/) that this hole exists on each side of the chair, we just never see it because the camera never pans to the opposite side. This hole leads down a shaft which opens into the egg chamber, and if you look closely, you will see such an opening above each egg row- so this is obviously one method of accessing the chamber. Thing is- how the hell would the Derelict crew even fit through there? No way they could do it with the suit on (or off)?

Big Dave: I totally agree mate. If not, the Eggs would hatch the entire time, and it doesn't happen without a victim nearby.

I read a few decades back that the Alien in the original movie was a "worker" where as the Xenos in Aliens were 'warriors". I like the idea that the Xenos can adapt biologically based on the situation.In Alien,there was no Queen so the Xeno resorted to other techniques. In Aliens a Queen was developed.So were the warrior Xenos.The warriors don't have a domed jelly head like the original Alien. Maybe they have other techniques of procreating nobody's seen yet ?

2200 years from WHEN? Nostromo/Alien was around 2128 Pro' is set around 2093-94 Events via holograph occurred 2000 years prior or 93-94 A.D. Are you saying that SJ landed on 426 approx 100 B.C.?