BigDave: I also got the impression that he (Fifield) was high he said something like “Huh Tobacco? Yeah sure (*grin*).” The question is if people do such stupid things while being stoned and besides it could have been done in a better way. People can be fools sure but if they do such things and are supposed to be educated scientists then you got to explain why and not cut it out or else it just looks weird. I think that I have seen a cut scene on Youtube where they explain that better, which should have been in the movie so it would have made some sense.

Large crew: To me this isn’t very important that there are many characters. What is important is that they are well written and that you can sympathize with them something that I couldn’t do with Fifield and Milburn because they came off as stupid in the movie. I think that there were also two characters that were named Chance and Ravell but I could never get into their characters because they were just badly written and not very interesting. 22 crew persons as long as they are well written it is OK. If you look at Aliens they (marines and so on) all had different personalities which worked so it could also work this time.

 Paradise: I haven’t read that part of the Bible that much so I can’t really compare that to what paradise in Alien covenant could be like but it is always interesting to compare things. A science lab could be cool like the Engineers being creators of life (which we could see in the opening scene of Prometheus with the Engineer and the water).

Heaven and hell: I think that people have always had their own idea of what these two things are since we cannot prove how they look like. Who is to say that paradise is like the garden of Eden with the fruit and that which we can see in some churches? The forbidden fruit could also be used as a metaphor in Alien Covenant however they might use that metaphor in the movie.

The planet: Yeah that was also what I thought. It could have been nice before so the planet got the name Paradise but then something very bad happened so it became like a disaster which I think Ridley said. When David and Shaw get to Paradise it is bad.

When I wrote the science and art comment I was mainly wondering how that would look like. They probably have an advanced society if they can create life on other planets. Of course we can’t be sure until we see the movie but I would like if the showed us some of that. I remember the big head in the room and I also remember the hologram (that is the word right?) with the Engineer playing a flute so those imply something like that.

Yeah with Fifield, i think it could have been done a bit better, the movie just never seemed too serious in many ways Characters where played out, we can see Lindeloffs hallmarks with this.. including the Vickers Robot, come in my room and find out... again i felt this was a scene that was not needed....  But at the end of the day this movie People had to die, we had to have Plot elements to drive the Plot along.... Fifield and Milburn behaved silly had they not, then we would maybe not have been shown the Hamerpedes having Acid for Blood, or Fifield falling into the Black Goo to then allow them to show what effects the Goo has on Fifield.   Just what happens in movies but it could have been done better....   Most Horror movies we see people die from doing stupid things that as a viewer you would be like.. "dont split up" or "dont open that door" etc but they are necessary to the Plot.  

I hope Covenant they can make these Plot Devices (death of the Crew) more better, like in Alien as yes Bret was pretty dumb too, but then he was a Space Trucker and at that point had only seen the Alien being the size of say a Cat... had he knew a 7ft plus Monster was on the lose he would not have wandered off to check out those places on his own.

The crew size, i think its unknown at the moment, i think it has to be larger than Alien as a Colony Ship and one that is expecting a Earth like Paradise, would certainly take more than a few Crew....  But if Ridley is going for a more Alien movie by giving us something  more of a Horror/Thriller again... then i think a Smaller Crew works best... because we can then see the Monster pick them off one by one.. and what made Alien work was because we did not see the Monster much on screen, it was always the fear of the unknown.. the not seeing that made it as effective.... and so a Crew of between at least 8 and no more than 12 would have to be ideal..... It depends what kind of movie Ridley wants to give us... Prometheus and Alien 3 and Alien R gave us more of a Canon Fodder movie in how the Humans were killed... they needed a number of throw away deaths.....  Aliens did the same in a disapointing way in how so many all died after the Ammo Bag got blown up, and i was equally disapointed in how Fifield took out a lot of the Prometheus Crew.

I think Ridley may want to go back to a more Alien take on taking out the Crew.. and to add fear and horror we need to make more of a connection with the Cast and also not be shown the Monster full on, in a killing spree like Fifield and the Engineer was... and for this to work.. it would require a Smaller Cast so 10 Tops i think.

As far as Science and Art goes, yes i think these are important to the Engineers... they are very Advanced and they are very proud of their achievements... and that is why they make such Monuments, and Paintings and Murals to showcase ritually what their race has created and how great their accomplishments are....   and so if Paradise is where they come from... i would think maybe these Engineers would like to Showcase themselves Pretty Much like Ancient Greeks as far as Gods and Egyptian Faroes did.   With a Giger Twist!

As far as Heaven/Hell and Paradise... Ridley said they was taking some themes from John Miltons Paradise Lost Book....  The book that re-tells some of the Fables of the Bible, as far as the Fall of Man (Eating of the Forbiden Fruit) The Fall/Rebelion of the Angels... Satan and Demons. And also about Gods Punishments to those Fallen Angels and Mankind and how eventually their is Redemption for Mankind.. but never for the Fallen Angels.

But this would be loosely... the movie like Prometheus while it touches on themes, it does not do them in a Literal Sense....   There wont be no Single God who lives in a realm in the clouds of heaven... and there be no Devil who lives bellow Earth in a Place that is a Lake of Fire. 

But it certainly does not rule out a Fraction of Engineers Banished from the Place of the Gods, to a World that is more of a Hell as far as the Agenda and Sinister motives...  We cant be sure how deep they are going with he Connections.... or after the Alien: Covenant name change.

But i had a source inform me about supposed leaks from the Draft that Paglen and Green had worked on the draft that was finished as of October 2014... but this could just all be false information and i had made a thread upon this... but yes they did say the idea of the Franchise was to Loosely tie in things such as the Forbiden Fruit, with the Fire of Prometheus.... and that the Fruit is something the Engineers and Mankind was not supposed to use, it is Forbiden for them.... but the Engineers use it as far as bieng Pawns to the Agenda of a Higher Power and the use of the Forbiden Fruit/Fire..... and that the Engineers Stole it for use for themselves as they wanted to be as Gods themselves.... The Fruit/Fire is the Origin of the Black Goo.

This does seem to match what Prometheus was trying to show us... but it was all to be taken with a Pinch of Salt... but some leaks was very specific with regards to stuff that never quite fitted with Prometheus....  but then Months latter Ridley came out with comments that seemed to fit with these leaks.... but alas we cant be sure if they was true and as Alien Covenant seems to be going a different route to them and also everything Ridley had said about the Sequel prior to the Summer.  I guess we cant consider them as connected and maybe we will never know if there is any Truth..... unless the earlier drafts ever get leaked... like the Two for Prometheus were.

@Thoughts_Dreams

I think the crew of the Prometheus like the Nostromo, are misfits, rogues, soldiers of fortune...probably don't have a family and don't care if they waste 4-20 years of their lives in deep space. The majority of humans are not going on this journey. I'ts probably very difficult to hire talented people.  "Sorry sweetheart, daddy's going away for 10 years....have fun in school...hope you graduate all the levels!  Tell mom not to cheat on me! lol! .......Oh and don't get married, have kids, then die before I return!"

The crew of the Prometheus were never told what the mission was UNTIL they arrived! Can you imagine signing up for this? Where are we going? Can't tell you. What is the mission?! Can't tell you....but....after you've spent 2 years in cryo, we'll tell you....if you survive. Sign me up!

Nostromo crew was very much the same....Who are these people? Why would you choose this job? Who did Dallas kill to get this assignment. Sorry Dallas, it's the Nostromo or prison.

Fifield would be exactly someone I expect to take that job. Loner. Can't fit in. Just give me the money. 

What about the crew of the Covenant? Why are they doing this? Is Earth that bad?

I think a explanation also that could have been more covered if they fleshed Vickers Character and Dialog a bit.. is what if she wanted her Fathers Wishes to Fail..? If this mission fails then she gets the Company....  she did not like being dragged all that far so that her father can go and meet some Ghosts.......

So a explanation would be she picked the crew, she made sure the Pilots and Captain were Good, she made sure the Mercs and Mechanics and Medics where Good...  and as far as Science Team she made sure she Employed a desperate bunch of degenerates.

Milburn seems over enthusiastic, yet a bit of a cop out as far as a Expert in the field of Biology, so what if Vickers picked someone who was not really up to that task and Milburn is just over the Moon to had been picked knowing there was so many other better candidates! This could explain some of his Actions.

Fifield was just a Ransom Man, a Journey Man and he was only in it for the MONEY, he may have had a past track record with being unreliable, forgetful and having problems with getting along with people as well as problems as far as following orders and off course being High as a Kite and off his Face.....    The Draft gives bit more background to his Character that would more fit the above...  and so yes Fifield would fit this role as being Totally only interested in the Money and unreliable.

Just as you hit the nail on the head with MonsterZero

As far as the Covenant Crew, well i would imagine they know more about their Mission than Prometheus crew did... i would assume that they was off to the Location of some world that had a massive potential to support life and be very Earth Like as far as potential for very little Teraforming.

I would imagine they have surveyed many worlds, and comming across Worlds that could potentially host a lot of Life and have a Topography very close to Earth and so very similar to the Primordial World that we saw the Sacrificial Scene Take Place.

What Human would not want to be a part of such a History Making Event.

I would thus assume we have a crew as follows.

Captain/Leader Role (possible Daniels?)

Deputy/Leader Role (possible Daniels?)

Min 1X Pilot

Min 1X Mechanic

Min 1X Medical

Min 1X Scientist Biology

Min 1X Scientist Geologist

Min 1X Corperation Type Investor (Greedy and Selfish)

A Hardman Merc Type

The Joker/Fool type... but they could fit into any of the other roles..

So i would assume we would look at a 10 Human Crew with at least 3 Females. I cant see a Colony Ship having less than this.

I doubt they would have a Crew of more than 15 nevermind 20 or so (not inc Synthetics) especially if Ridley is not maybe going for a Xeno Killing Fest Movie but trying to being some of the Horror and Scares that Alien had...

Unless only 5-8 are killed in the movie and the rest survive for a sequel?

Yes, I think at least a crew of 10-15.  (Keeps down production costs...actors are expensive.)  I think crew size also depends on the size of the Covenant. The ship could be carrying human embryo's(like Nolans 'Interstellar') and they expect to 'seed' Paradise. So maybe they are a small crew.

It could be a huge ship with thousands of humans, all in cryo sleep, ready to be awakened when they reach Paradise!

So I think a good portion of the crew might be left in cryo-sleep, until the plot calls for them.

Fifield and Millburn and being necessary to the plot. Yeah but that could have been made better. I am not buying the being necessary to the plot because it could have been done better, I suppose they made this movie with the intention that it would be smarter than A Nightmare On Elm Street because that behavior could be understandable in a movie like that but in Prometheus at least I expect the characters to be smarter.

Vickers just seemed like a character that wasn’t really well thought out. Yes she had a role in the mission and that she never got the attention from her father the way David had. I understand that part, maybe that affected the mission but they could have made that character better and not just some greedy person at a big company (“a king has his reigns and then he dies” = Weyland would die and then she would be in charge of the company, that is my way to look at it which is Vickers is greedy). One thing that I think really sucked was when the captain (which was actually a character that I think was good, I got to admit that) asked if Vickers was a robot, that part just felt embarrassing like “Ugh! Really? Is that the best you could come up with?”.

Sure you will have to find ways to make the story move along but you also got to think about how that is made to make it interesting and sort of convincing something that this movie lacks too much of. Obviously you can make it work (alien and aliens for example) but this movie didn’t manage to do that well.

You mention Brett but he wasn’t a scientist. He felt more like a randomly picked crew person so therefore you wouldn’t expect as much from him as you would do with two scientists that are supposedly persons with training to deal with an environment like that. Maybe it is safe to say that the more education you have to deal with situation X the more convincingly you got make the death sequence in order to not make the person look like an idiot.

Crew size: Wouldn’t that also depend on what kind of movie he wants to make? If they go for horror a smaller crew might work but if they go for sci-fi a bigger crew might work. I like both sci-fi and horror it is just that they got to decide what kind of genre they want to do. At least you got to have some characters that we (the viewers care for).

I understand what you say that it is more effective if you don’t see the monster but I wonder if it would still be scary in 2016/2017. The question is what people get scared about today and these things change over time, you know? Maybe more effort is being needed to scare people now? You mention how Fifield killed people I didn’t get disappointed by that except they should have used the cgi version, I was more disappointed that he acted stupid when he was a human character. The CGI monster was way better than what we got in the movie but the CGI version could probably have been done better as well.

Yeah in order to create horror you got to care about the characters plus make their death gruesome I just wonder how you could make that work and at the same time avoid it from being another Alien copy. Some familiar things are alright but I would like to see some new things also I don’t say that it is an easy task I just wonder how they can make that work. A smaller cast makes sense.

A Gieger version of Faraoes, that would be cool. This is something that could be very interesting if it is done right. Maybe they can be like huge cruel scientists with a God complex? They could have some labs where they are doing horrifying experiments, something that they can control to a huge extent but if the experiments go wrong you got to explain that in a convincing way. How are these semi-Gods (Engineers) killed by their creations (Xenomorphs, etc.)?

I think that they could elaborate a bit more about the black goo even though they might not tell us everything about it.

MonsterZero

Yeah, I understand what you mean. I hope that the crew on Covenant (if that is the ship) will be made better so that they will be in it for more than the money and that they will be better characvters. As far as Interstellar goes I can't comment because I haven't watched it.

Yeah, Fifield and Millburn could have been written as sympathetic characters and theirs deaths might have meant more/something: ------>

Millburn: "Hi, I'm Rafe, Rafe Millburn"

Fifield "Nice to meet you Rafe, My names Sean, Sean Fifield"

Milllburn "Well...What brings you out here Sean?"

Fifield " Money mostly...I need as much as I can...I have a daughter back home that needs a operation and this was about the only big credits anyone was handing out..."

Millburn "Whoa...That's too bad..sorry man...I have a couple of daughters of my own...can't imagine if they got sick.."

Fifield "Yeah..it's been rough on the family...But...I'm gonna do this job and get home to them as fast as I can...I already miss them..."

I think a little scene like this would have helped.

Monster Zero: I agree, sure he was in it for the money but there is probably a reason why he was that way. They could have had an explanation to it for example he could have said:

"I am in it for the money because (X Y Z)."

That would have made it more interesting. Sure he might have been greedy but there is always a reason why people are the way they are. This was not only about Fifield and Milburn because all the characters could have been done better which is one of the problems that Prometheus had. Let's hope that they have better characters in Alien Covenant but this is something that they should have understood by now.

I think a lot of the Problems Thoughts_Dreams is the way Lindeloff writes his dialog for Characters and how he gives them Personality and i think in Prometheus it was not done to well, if you read how similar Characters where written in Spaights draft you can see a big difference.

The Characters were a bit to Korny?  But Alass JJ Abrahams is the same... Star Wars FA had to much Goofy and Korny moments for my liking and his Star Trek Movies too.

However to be fair the Drafts had better way of covering those Characters, i sugest you read them and you will find that beneath and between the two their was a movie that could have been so much better....

These Pair (Milburn and Fifield) both thought the other had the Map.....   Then a High as a Kite Fifield Picks the Hammerpede up to tease Milburn with it...  thats when things get out of control.

But overall yes maybe it could have been better written.... they could have been shocked at the Hammerpede... Milburn goes in for closer look, and then slips in the Goo and the Hamerpede then goes towards him and he grabs it to stop it getting close to him... as opposed to grab it to Pet the thing. LOL

If you looked at the Other Fifield Concepts then you would see that some of them were very good, they was not used however as the Animatronic Prop was just taking to much time and costs, and also it and other concepts were not used because they wanted to TONE DOWN the Xeno Elements....

BigDave:

I haven't watched too much of Lindeloff's things so I can not comment on it. I have however read the Spaights script and the characters were a lot better developed there. You could see their motivations, you could understand them better, and so on. A movie based on the Spaights script would have been a lot better I think because the characters were better explained but they would probably have kept it open to lead into a sequel if they would like to do that.

The Force Awakens had some silly moments also but for me the good out-weighted the bad by a long shot so I could accept that. P1 could have been so much better, I read at a blog or what ever that (and this comes from my memory so don't take it literally) that one of the reasons that Prometheus was frustrating was that with all its faults you could see some smart things behind the surface which makes its misses more frustrating because it really had potential. I sort of agree with this criticism because it is correct to an extent.

Your idea of the Milburn situation with the Hammerpeded is better than what was in the movie, no doubt. Fifled and the Xeno elements, they had an animated Xeno Fifled which was a lot better than what we got it is just too bad that they didn't use it but I think that I understand why they did what they did but to me it was like "well that's too bad". This is not to say that the Zombie Fifield was useless though.

*Alien Covenant is casting extras aged between 8-40 who are either Very Small and Thin, or Very Tall and Thin but who also have to be very Strong and Athletic and skilled as Acrobats, Contortionists and the like.

The emphasis mainly being on Thin, Strong and very Agile/Flexible, and casting seems to indicate maybe they are not looking for just one particular person to play such a role, as they said Extras....  which could indicate they need someone who is very thin so they can wear a Prosthetic Suit, and be strong enough to be able to move quite quickly, agile and a to high degree of articulation.  This sounds more like the requirements for wearing a more modern version of the Xenomorph Suit as worn in Alien and Aliens.   It could also point to there being more than One Xenomorph or related Organism in the next Movie.

*Noomi Rapace (Dr Shaw) will not be apearing in the next movie.

This now fits in with the Synopsis for the movie, but a big puzzle is how she has gone from a minor role to now not even getting a apearence....   Ridley did say in the same Interview that he is casting some major roles but Shaw will not be one of those and will not appear.

Prometheus set off two possible endings... 

1) To go and explore the Adventures of Shaw and David as they head to Paradise the Place the Engineers are from, for answers to why did they create Mankind, only to then create and test such Horrific Experiments on LV-223 that were intended to destroy Mankind.

2) Find out what becomes of LV-223 after the events of Prometheus and Prior to Alien, as LV-223 has a lot of Secrets yet to be uncovered, it has more Engineer Temples and Ships and so what other horrors do these hold?  And what becomes of the horrors unleashed from the Crew of Prometheus misfortune of comming to a place they should never had.

So its now odd that Alien: Covenant is stepping away from either of those.....  we definately see David 8 from Prometheus, the Synopsis confirms this and that he is the only survivor of that Doomed Mission, when we all know Shaw and David surived together and they set off to the Place the Engineer said he came from... and we have to assume David could not make this journey without Shaws Help, and indeed prior to Alien: Covenant the situation and dynamic between David and Dr Shaw and how he would eventually have to be put back together by Shaw, seemed to play one of the major Flash Points for the intended Sequel... along with finding Engineers and discovering the Answers Shaw gets are not what she had hoped for.

But with Engineers and Shaw not included in the Synopsis and knowing Shaw is a Casuality of the Casting and wont apear.... will we ever know what became of Shaw from when David left LV-223 10 years prior and what condition did David find this Paradise in when he arrived...  will we find out these in the next movie after Alien: Covenant?

Or are they going to pull a Lost on us in Homage to Lindeloff?

If Shaw will not be in it then I hope that they will give a good explanation to that being that she had an important role in Prometheus. How would David get to Paradise without Shaw's help and how will they explain that? Will they have Shaw's diseased body there to explain it in some way but how can they do that if Noomi isn't in it? This doesn't make sense to me but I hope that they will come up with some clever explanation. Please no Lost tactics, that would be lame.

Yes thats a shame, but we cant rule her out of being in the movie or franchise as Chris Posted a Interview with her and she seemed very coy and even smirking when asked about Prometheus sequel....

I have updated speculation and scenerios for what this could mean here... Alien Covenant loses Shaw

It seems like a throw away and i have covered it in detail in the above Topic....  but the premise for the next movie was to follow Shaw and David... it would be lazy or lame to have them completely write her out of the Franchise, like Newt and Hicks because more so, there is a lot to cover from when Shaw puts Davids head into that Bag, and takes his body on that Buggy to find the other Engineer ship... which we see departs LV-223.

Ridley even commented on the dynamic between them and how She does put him back together eventually but she was unsure but David is very persuasive.

But we did not see David put back together in Prometheus but we did see a Engineer Juggernaught leave LV-223 which we have to assume is the ship that David at very least is onboard....  

We have to assume David needs Shaw to put him back together and while its ok maybe if we skip this part, as this part would have fitted between the Scene of Shaw leaving the Juggernaught with Davids Body and Head and seeing another Juggernaught setting off from LV-223.

The movie was set up for her journey and questions, yet Alien: Covenant we have no Shaw in the Synopsis... so what happened... surely they cant use this as a mystrey and with less answers to this as how a Xenomorph got onboard the Sulaco after Aliens to infect Ripley in Alien 3 never mind the Dog/Cow.

Also its a wasted chance if they go with David arriving at Paradise to find not a trace of the Engineers but only the remains of a Bio-Weapon that is Evolving on Paradise...

So yes Alien: Covenant is going against what Ridley had sugested all along prior to the Name Change...   Which seemed to fit in with what a source had told me about in March 2015.   With regards to Shaw they said Shaw does not Technically Die... 

I have had some more information from the source today but not much.. which i will update my Topic on it.

Big Dave: I am not really a fan of the Shaw character, she lacks something but at the same time she had a big role in Prometheus so I hope that they won't get rid of her just like that. What I mean is that they can keep her but let her play a smaller role but at the same time she wants to get her answers so she will probably have some sort of importance to the story otherwise it won't make sense, no?

When they left LV-223 with the ship I thought that at least David gave her the instructions how to fly it (if she didn't have put him together already) so he has some sort of importnce there. My first thought when I saw them leave LV-223 was "how can she leave with David having no head?" but then I thought that that was a possible answer because David said that he could navigate them and I doubt that Shaw is much of a pilot.

I think that they should let Paradise have a bigger role than that. I sort of understand why they could do that being that Ridley said that Paradise could be nasty but still. Paradise has a potential of being an interesting place so I hope that they do something as far as how it looks rather than just having it be a junk yard or something similar. To me it could be a very interesting place because Paradse could mean different things to many people. The Engineers should be present there in some way but then those at Fox might wonder how much of the Engineers there should be in the movie depending on how people considered P1 to be.

Yes i think also there was a role for Shaw, even if she is killed off i thought they would at least carry on the Dynamic Between them, the first movie left us with a Mexican Stand off as David can not be of any use in the way he was found.... thats why he asked Shaw to help him and Shaw wont be going no place without Davids Help, apart from sit it out and wait for Help, in which time she may not survive by the time Help arrives.

Ridley made some contradictory remarks about David and Shaw, he mentioned that he needs her and she needs him in order to get off that rock... and Shaw has her reservations but she has no alternative and Ridley said David can be very persuasive.    But then in a latter Interview he says EVENTUALLY She will put him back together, and then after that she will SLOWLY put him back together...

so we have to assume Shaw did not need a Full David to leave LV-223 maybe David could talk her through how to activate the ships Navigation and Cryo-Sleep?   In  a earlier Interview Ridley teased that while Shaw may want to go to Paradise, once Davids head is on he can be very dangerous and Shaw is basically left to what ever wishes David has...

So he could indeed put Shaw in Cryo-Sleep and then go where ever he wants...

I would have thought they would have covered some dynamic about the two on their journey and then maybe as Shaw starts to trust David, he could then stab her in the back and have her become a Pawn in his Agenda much like Holloway was.... but it would be disapointing to see her not even used.

And also yes Engineers, they played to me a Bigger role in the Franchise... they are potentially now the Biggest thing in the Franchise or their Creators are... the Xenomorph was merely a Weapon to destroy Mankind and so both were created by the Engineers and so i think they have to cover the Engineers at some point.

Back to the Topic of Alien Covenant... yes Paradise may not be the Paradise we all think it could be, but why would the Last Engineer say its a place we may call Paradise... when Mankind through various cultures would perseve Paradise as a Place of Wonder a true Paradise that Creation Started and in other cultures that the Gods came from.

Paradise Ridley is hinted at is a Dark and Dangerous World and nothing like what we Humans would ever dream Paradise could be.... but he also added its a scene of a Disaster...

I think the Shooting Locations when added up with Micheal Biehns comments of Alien: Covenant being set thousands of years before Aliens, to me still gives us a hint we may see a Paradise before some Disaster that has left the place a Dark and Dangerous World.

Great posts BigDave. I became member in order to thank you for tons of good stuff from you and because I wanted to be in touch with happenings around Alien Covenant which is the movie I anxiously await to see (I m a huge fan of original Alien; and Prometheus despite its flaws).

I also wanted to share with you those several fabulous articles that I found, about Prometheus and some really interesting ideas about movie and its sequel. It seems to me that he (author) almost understood everything, and his ideas have possible plot elements for the Alien Covenant ;)

Here are the articles:
Prometheus: 6 Answers To The Key Questions - In this article he thoroughly examines the whole plot of Prometheus and some ideas of what might come in Covenant...

This next is also very good
Prometheus: 8 Mythological & Literary Motifs In The Film - Here he writes about mythological background of the movie and  examines the stories of Prometheus and his relation to Zeus, then he explaines the connection of the film with myth of Epimetheus & Pandora, it is interesting that this article is published back in 2012. but author also thoroughly writes and examines the relation of John Miltons Paradise Lost and its connection with the movie and the possible (back then) sequel; he also mentions The Book of Enoch (which is very interesting), and then makes some refference to Norse and mesopotamian mythology and he explains Christian influence of the movie backstory as well as influence of William Blakes art.

And another article from the same author:
Prometheus: 8 Key Themes In Understanding The Film

I was always interested in scene with wall relief (mural) with Xenomorph like creature in crucifix position and with altar in front of that mural that holds green crystal. To me the crystal is interesting thing because it reminds me to amber... ;) In trailer of the movie, there was a sacrificial cup from the first scene of the movie, but not the crystal... strange?

I also think that the black goo (used in sacrificial scene) is some kind of forbidden fruit, the element of creation that some group of Engineers then used for different purposes and made some kind of bio weapon from it (Sacrificial fluid isnt the same as black goo??). Maybe the original goo is the extract from that green crystal in front the Xeno mural (So it maybe comes from the primordial Xeno). I still believe that there are two confronted sides of Engineers... Angels and Fallen Angels. But who is the ultimate Boss, someone third?  Ridley said that those Engeeners with bio suits made black goo (bio weapon version from the vases) to defend themselves from someone? From who? Maybe the "First Xenomorph" have something to do with it. Why would Engeeners worship their own creation (Xeno on mural), why they made that mural? Is that the worship fresco or there is some other purpose to it. Who created the Engeeners? ;)  I also believe that Shaws (Noomi Rapace) story would still play a big part of the next movies, maybe not so big but it will have certain significance (no matter she is not in the movie... thats is still not for sure and maybe she will be in the next one... we still don't know everything). Ridley said that he wont work with her in Australia, maybe he will work on some other place ;) David is certanly the major player, so we ll se what story they have for him... Deacon looked to me organic, but ultimate Xeno from original Alien had some mechanical note to it... Biomechanical creature. Maybe David is ultimate link... Maybe enegeeners (Fallen group) represent the first Prometheus, maybe they stole somthing from their creator (maybe they even tried to "vassalize" the "God"), and wanted to be creators and gods themselves but then happend something... What reasons and motivations led those Fallen Eneeners to try to bring black goo to Earth? (Why all those carvings and artefact on Earth shows tall figure pointing to LV-223 that happens to be military outpost for mass destruction?) Maybe they were afraid that humanity could bacame threat as they themselves were corrupted...??? But then again David sentence: Sometime to create, one must first destroy contradict my thesis... They created something, and they want to destroy that to create something totaly different? That is not so logical to me... Murals suggest sthat Xeno already existed, so I think that they didnt want to create Xenos, but then again events in Prometheus led to spontaneous creation od the Deacon...it is too complictated to find out what is the thing behind all of this... There must be some logic to the ultimate story, because Ridley likes to relay on logical storytelling, so we are missing something.

I m still thinking about this, so I inted to read Miltons Paradise Lost :) Maybe there is some answers to questions we ask? I like the premise and story that Ridley used (Miltons epic and all mytholgcal and religious background)  to explain Xenomorphs, but I think that the ultimate story of Xenos will be the ultimate story of human inner existence and fall of human spirt and so the story will be all the more frightening. He certainly wouldnt explain everything... mystery is the main thing revolving Xenos and Engineers. I myself would introduce some concept of ultimate entity that "created" all there is and then I would  show that creation of greatest evil is not deed of that entity but our deed instead. Maybe the Xenos are the material manifestation of human corrupted nature, it after all came from humans. But the concept of Devil also need sto be introduced in all of this. Fallen Engeeners are the Devil presumably... I know that there are many inconsistencies in my ideas, but I plan to figure it out... :) Shaw compared DNAs of Engeeners with human DNA and said: Its US...
I m still trying to connect everything... :(

I hope this was interesting to you as well as it was for me. I impatiently await further interesting analysis, predictions and comments by BigDave and other great members. I wish you all the best! Cheers guys.

I think Ridley would never allow himself to make bad movie at the end of his career... I honestly think that Covenant is going to be a real BOOM.
Movie with right amount of answers and some fresh form of shock and horror. Isnt that what we all want?

Well where do i start with this lot ;)  Welcome aboard!

"I know that there are many inconsistencies in my ideas, but I plan to figure it out... :) Shaw compared DNAs of Engeeners with human DNA and said: Its US...
I m still trying to connect everything... :("

While your post is going off Topic as far as what the Plot of Covenant is taking, your theories and those links which i will read, are touching upon what Prometheus was trying to show us and what Ridleys comments prior to Alien: Covenant was setting us up for...

Also the source that leakes some supposed stuff (take with pinch of salt) pretty much gave information that touches upon most of what you mentioned and i wonder also what those links could be covering.....  I have a Thread on these leaks and it seemed to confirm with what Ridley latter came out with..... but now there seems some U-Turn.

The source does not have information on Covenant, and would not even if they had some.  But they did say all they know is that they felt steering away from the Xeno and Alien, was maybe the wrong move... and so they are instead steering closer to it... but the ideas they was pushing with the Drafts by Paglen and Green are not forgotten and will be added to the Franchise but they are toning them down after they (Fox and Ridley) feel they need to get back to Alien as thats what is holding the Franchise up, its what the Franchise is about.... i.e Space Jockey/Engineers and the Xeno Bio-Weapon and how and why..... which is what Spaights draft was touching upon... but then they (Fox and Ridley) decided to Tone down the Xeno elements and flesh out the Engineers Story to make the Prequel series about the Engineers in which Mankind and the Xeno play a role but they wanted to explore the Engineers more.... 

Well now it seems they feel that maybe they need to head back more to the way Spaights draft was going and to cover the Engineers connection to the Xeno, and have the Engineers Agenda and what ever else they are involved in as the lesser Story....   The source said they are following the Elements and ideas of the Earlier Drafts just they will be toned down and spread over the Franchise and so the Emphasis is more to do with the Engineers and Xeno... where as before they was going to loosely Answer this but explore the Engineers and Hierarchy more.

The Source does not know what % of the ideas before will make it into the newer Trilogy planned but that the Engineers and connections to everything are not going away...  But they cant say that we would see a future set of movies that would be more about them.

So the source thinks pretty much the same as i had thought, that Fox feel maybe when Spaights Draft that had a higher % Xeno connections and was less ambigious was toned down those elements to give just mild Clues but wanted to evolve the Engineers and there role in the Galaxy and beyond....  they now think maybe they need to go back more to the Original idea.   Pretty much as a Alien Prequel... its how the Xeno was made, when and why and how Mankind played into this....  that is more important as far as fitting to the Franchise as opposed to moving futher away from Alien and the Xeno to explore and flesh out the Engineers and their History and Origins....   they was going for the Engineers being the main purpose and explore them.... but now seems this is to be the lesser plot as the Xeno Origins and Space Jockey explantion is now seen as what FANS want to see.

Basically finding out about the Xeno, is more important as far as Box Office than following Engineers and how they fitted into the whole God/Ancient Mankind Mythos.

Sorry got bit sidetracked there....

"I know that there are many inconsistencies in my ideas, but I plan to figure it out... :) Shaw compared DNAs of Engeeners with human DNA and said: Its US...
I m still trying to connect everything... :("

I have a set of theories and have studdied Prometheus in depth, mainly clues on the movie and franchise and other Alien movies and the two drafts Spaights and Lindeloffs....  to try and make some THEORY that works... but even mine have multiple expantions and i could not find the ONE SIZE fits all theory that all matches...

I wont go into detail as i covered them all on this site... and so too much to go through but feel free to PM Me..... i may make a Topc... Ask Dave Prometheus Questions Topic... as i pretty much have looked in depth at it.

You touched upon many themes i have covered and what you have touched upon are not far off what i have concluded.....  But to Answer Each aspect i have 1-2 theories that still conflict with other answers.... i may one day to the Complete Prometheus Answers and Plot... post.

I will say that yes, it seems the Engineers are a Servent Race, and are simply either Angels/Fallen Angels... but could also fall into being the Olympians, or 2nd Generation of Titans... i.e Children of the First Main 12 Titans.  They could also be linked to either the lesser Anunaki or even Iggi Servent Race.  The movie seems to loosely try and fit all these different versions of Gods of Ancient Man into being Interpretations of the Engineers and their Hierarchy

The Mural, and Sacrifcial Cup and alter, again Spaights Draft gives clues if you apply his drafts explanations to Lindeloffs Holes.... and alternative shots and concepts.  Then it would seem the Engineers are used to seed their DNA to create Life..... but something happened that produced the First Deacon (Mural) or Something else that they then tried to re-engineer this to produce the Mural Deacon... that was seen as having Perfect DNA... those Engineers on LV-223 Worshiped this Evolution of their DNA and deemed this would be the basis to Evolve Life and so instead of using their DNA.... the Deacon was now the DNA they favoured..... What creature they produced this from?  Was it the Xeno, or a Ancestor to the Xeno...? Who knows... 

I feel this was a Punishment to the Rebelious Engineers, who then inturn.. engineered this Punishment to create something else to use against their creators or indeed use their creators own Punishment against them....  or it could be their creators Punishment for the Engineers back fired.... killed off their creators.. so the Rebel Engineers chose to then use and re-engineer this intended and failed Punishment for the Engineers, on Mankind and they too failed and had it back fire.  Its hard to figure a concrete idea. but i think these ideas are roughly about right.

The Black Goo in the Urns was re-weaponizing something, or trying to harvest the DNA of something (Deacon Mural) the same way that the Sacrifical Engineer broken down his DNA to seed life on Earth, the Engineers on LV-223 had used the Sacrficial Substance to Seed the DNA of this new Evolution to Engineer DNA (Deacon) the same process the Sacrificial Engineer had used, the Deacon's had done to them.  Only the resulting broken down material was not left to infect the Water and Air of Worlds like the Sacrificial Scene... the resulting DNA etc from a Sacrificed Deacon was collected and stored into the Urns.... to use as a Weapon that would Upgrade/Transcend Mankind...

But there are things that could go against this theory... thats the mess that Prometheus left us with....  The other aspect could be that the Black Goo was what eventually leads to Xenos?

The Fresco that people say is like the Cistine Chapel Adam and God... to me looks more like the Prometheus and his Punishment (Rock, Eagle and Liver) Fresco...   and this fits in with the Prometheus Mythos and my other theories.

I could go on but i have covered these to death before... and i may either do a Thread where people can ask Questions about aspects and i will give my answers... or i may do a Thread where i try to get it all to fit together..

But they had changed things... they made a Weyland Goo File to explain what was going on, Ridley and Lindeloff gave two different takes on the Goo and Deacon at the end etc.. that contradicted each other... and the Weyland File contradicted what we saw.... so its one massive INCOHERENT Story....... that i tried to peice together.

But they may now be simplifying it more....  Basically now could just be that the Engineers where a Race at War, lead by a Older and Wiser First Engineer, who a faction rebelled against and they got involved in a intergalactic War.... where the Xeno was a Bio Weapon created from the Black Goo to be used on Mankind.

So the explanation to the Mural could be... look we are Engineers who created you (Mankind) look at our Head Statue to show you this... and now look at what we created instead (Deacon Mural) that we are now going to replace you Humans with.