Alien: Covenant Is A Better Aliens Sequel Than Alien 3

After watching it again...really bad matte ..off putting.

The soundtrack is the only reason i watch the film these days.

Of course..I don't know how you could top or even match Alien or Aliens....but this really fell short IMHO. I pretty much agree with all critiques. 

"So if we all got in a time machine...traveled back and were able to take control of the Alien3 script"

Firstly as FAR as Effects then yes a bit more Time and Money would have been Nice... but the same could be said about some shots from Alien Covenant.

Regarding Changing Alien 3.... i think most of the Script works..... i wish they had a more Plausible Explanation/Way to Show HOW the Eggs got on the Sulaco than the Plot Hole we got.

Would have changed some Dialog for the Bishop Scene where he would admire the Xenomorph more, suggesting it is a Evolutionary Perfection or something... and have him mention how Humanity has Limitations and then how the Bishop Model Androids where Flawed.... all of this would make it hard for us to Speculate if Micheal Bishop was Human or some other kind of A.I

On the Deaths!

Newt had to be done... as Carrie Henn would have been 15 at the Time of Shooting etc...

Ripley i felt it gave her a Good Ending, via Sacrifice.. and not forgetting Miss Weaver wanted out.

Hicks i would have KEPT ALIVE... have him in a Coma well Incapacitated until latter on, when he awakes and sees Ripley with NO Hair...  then  he is informed he is on a Prison Planet.... he may be Concerned/Confused but also Thankful... UNTIL he gets the Bombshells...

1st that Newt has Died.... and then that Ripley is infected with a Queen and that a ALIEN is on the Loose... By the END of the Movie after Ripley has died, we could have Hicks as our Proxy to how he feels... the Heart Break at the loss of Newt and Ripley...

You bet he would be DETERMINED to NEVER allow anyone to try and obtain a Xenomorph again... not if he dont have anything to do with it... as so we could have had a 4th Movie that would continue with Hicks.

Why a prison(/ore) planet? So you can kill a bunch of murdering psychos? I'm rooting for the Xeno!

Alien :R suffered the same problem...I didn't care about anyone. Weren't any characters I cared for...

Yeah If I were to (re)make Alien 3, I would have gone the ALIENS: Outbreak/Earth Hive route

MonsterZero:

They could probably have had it at another planet but I did not have any problem with it. About the prisoners I think that was an interesting thing. What do you do when you know that you have done terrible things and that you would be disliked to many on earth? Staying there and try to become a better person is not such a bad thing compared to what the alternative could be I guess. I understand your point of view but I just think that it is interesting. By the way, what did you think about Ripley and Clemens in that movie? Clemens was far from a murdering psycho, he was there because he killed people because of a wrong dosage of painkillers which to me was an accident it seems but not because he was an angry maniac or psychopath.

Most of the alien work (monster work) was not CGI, this is something that you can see in the making of Alien 3. I think that it is alright even though it could probably have been better.

When it comes to Alien Resurrection I agree. They only one that I probably gave a shit about was maybe Call but yeah it was bad writing so how they decided to go ahead with that is something that I don't understand. Maybe they thought that they needed money and that the Alien movies usually make a profit so they released it because of that and with no artistic thought in mind.

You mention Aliens, to me it feels too much like a Rambo shoot em up kind of movie. It has some sort of 80's vibe to it so to me it is the one that has not aged well, to me at least. Of course I watch it a bit now and then but it is probably the one that I watch the least among the original three which is interesting since it was my favorite for a long time.

I actually like Alien3 more than Aliens now! Creepier and dark. If Aliens had the level of acting exhibited in Alien3, it would rival A L I E N imho.

MonsterZero Which version- theatrical or Assembly?

Thoughts_Dreams What do you do when you know that you have done terrible things and that you would be disliked to many on earth? Staying there and try to become a better person is not such a bad thing compared to what the alternative could be I guess. I understand your point of view but I just think that it is interesting.

I whole-heartedly agree! There are a few scenes in the assembly cut where they try to explore this and the Brotherhood the inmates have created for themselves. Dillon going out of his way to ensure the group is inclusive of Golic for example. 

To be an outcast even amongst the outcast would be a truly lonely and sad fate. So they make a point 'to tolerate even the intolerable' so that every inmate knows they are not truly monstrous and irredeemable. 

You might not have any sympathy for a bunch of murderers, rapists and thieves - which is fair

But everyone can understand and appreciate the feeling of being included. We are a herd species. The sense of belonging is ingrained in us.

So its an interesting and deep topic to explore. Deeper than most people give Alien3 credit for, and a credit to Vincent Ward's script parts that made it into the film

Alien 3 is also about redemption if you take in the Assembly cut. They are society's outcast (and perhaps for good reason), but they create their own society and try to be orderly. There are levels to the movie to ponder. For instance, I learned the ox in the Assembly cut was a reference to the importance of owning an ox back in biblical times. 

Alien 3 is a movie that I hated in the 90s but it is a movie I really appreciate and it improves with age. 

It doesn't get better. This is just nostalgia.

Some characters is solid, but plot is crap. This film has an interesting dialogue (thx to Dillon), but the environment is wretched. Xenomorph is crippled by the amateurish and cheap production of ADI - they thought the flesh was scary and terrible, and biomechanical is unnatural and not scary. But the Alien (shape) was never about terrible and disgusting - it is primarily the erotomechanic of Giger and an incredible elegant style. Fortunately, Giger’s style is not so easy to ruin.

This is a controversial film. This film deserves to be watched and rewatched many times. But it does not deserve to be part of continuity, part of canon. I easily agree to any retcon.

5/10

Alien 3 is like a dead poop that your beloved dog is lays aside and that you keep as a sentimental memory.

 dk 'theatrical or Assembly'

I prefer the theatrical ....I like the flow.

Assembled makes me ask questions and i'd rather just turn my brain off.

Aliens like Rambo ;)

I would agree in Part, as far as i also held ALIENS in a Higher Regard and saw Alien Resurrection as a bit of a Abomination when it came out, but as i got Older and Older then Aliens became more of a Starship Troopers kind of Flick...   while then i began to look Deeper at other Underlying Themes that Alien Resurrection had such as WHAT would Mankind do when they Successfully obtain a Xenomorph, purely using it to unleash Face Huggers that then Produce Snarling Aggressive Xenomorphs is MAYBE NOT the best way to USE/EXPLOIT the Organism.

I found Ripley 8 interesting as far as the Amalgamation of Human and Xenomorph, i thought the Failed Experiments was interesting from the Standpoint of what if we saw some Successful Hybrids.

Finally i found Call interesting and the whole Autons Subplot as something to Explore.  When Prometheus was released if felt it touched on some of the same Concepts/Themes (Exploiting, Experimenting with the Xenomorph DNA) and Subcreation.

This is just nostalgia.

Not sure what that means as I watched it two nights ago and like it even better than when I watched it two years ago. The environment is wretched- it is supposed to be. Regarding whether it deserves to be in the continuity is subjective, but the fact is that it is canon warts and all as is Resurrection.

It is and probably always will be controversial as this thread shows (we aren't even talking Covenant anymore). That's ok. It just goes to show how passionate people still feel about the movie.

My biggest critique of Ripley's dialogue was when she said the company thought of everyone as "crud". I think it would have made more impact to use even saltier language. Bit I guess it was the 90s.

Yeah language/dialog is painfully 1980's based. they're not going to speak this way in a 100 years...hopefully.

Look at difference between Jules Verne/H.G. Wells prose and 100 years later Ian Banks/Peter f. Hamilton.

I'll still take Alien:Covenant over Alien3:

AC:

More monsters.

Cool spaceships.

See the Juggernaut drop cargo.

Gun play.

Alien city.

Backburst...really like the spore idea.

Alien3:

Soundtrack is great.

Dark.

In other words: More cools stuff in AC.

Let’s rewrite Alien 3

The Sulaco never leaves the system, stays in orbit around LV-426.

After the crew enter hypersleep, Mother brings a backup synthetic online. That synth, Bishop 2, interfaces with the Bishop. It learns about the alien.

 Bishop 2 travels to the surface, returning with multiple eggs.(visits the derelict)

 It later uses Newt as a test subject.  Bishop 2 “Fascinating”  The newly born xeno damages the Sulaco causing a fire. 

As Bishop 2 fights the fire, Ripley, Hicks and Bishop are awoken.

Ripley “Where’s Newt!?”

They are trapped as Mother isolates the ship from the fire.

Bishop hacks into Mother...finds out the truth.(lots of gory Newt video and facehuggers running loose on the Sulaco)

They defeat Bishop 2 and the xeno/facehuggers(lots of action)

Bishop rigs the Sulaco for destruction(“Sulaco CAN”T reach  Earth!!”)...he stays on board to carry out the task.

Hicks and Ripley escape the Sulaco in the drop ship. (Sulaco *boom!*)

The movie ends with them landing on LV-426.

Alien 3 scene 8:

Hicks and Ripley continued observing the monitors. Out of the corner of her eye she saw someone or something….

Ripley “Ash?!”

Hicks “Wha...who’s Ash?”

Ripley “Tell me you saw that!…?”

Hicks “Saw what?......You alright?”

Ripley “.......I’m seeing things...seeing ghosts..” gives a nervous laugh.

Hicks  “Maybe you should try and get some rest?”, “Take a break”, “I’ll keep an eye on things”.

Ripley “......Yeah...for once, I think you’re right” smiling “..think I’ll lay down…”

Ripley gets up, turns around and walks straight into captain Dallas of the Nostromo.

----

Dallas “How is she?”

Ash “Good”, “I have her under sedation”

Dallas “Alright, keep me up to date” Dallas leaves the cabin

Brett and Parker look in from the corridor .

Ash closes the door to the compartment..

Ash “Ripley? Can you hear me?”

A dazed Ripley ever so slightly nods her head.

Ash “I’m afraid we have all been exposed to a virus”, "A pathological one...Hallucinations and more.."

Ash “We’ve also read your report and I can assure you the Nostromo and it’s crew are very much alive..”

-----

Hicks “What’s wrong with her?”

Ripley laying on the floor, comatose.

Bishop “Results of the scan are incoming…”

Hicks “One moment she was up...the next down..”

Bishop “She has been mind stemmed..”

Hicks “What! Super Soldiered...Who wou..”, realizing  “The company..Carter Burke!”

Bishop “Yes, they must have implanted the device on Earth, just before the mission”

Hicks “Bastards”, “Should have known they would monitor her every step…”, “But why did it activate?!”

Suddenly there was a loud *clank* and the Sulaco shuddered

Bishop “I’m afraid you have your answer”

The monitors showed a spacecraft docking with the Sulaco

-----

Ash took the laser scalpel and made a small incision to his index finger. Red blood trickled from the cut

Ash “Satisfied?”

Ripley sighed. It is over. All a bad dream. Amanda is alive, Jonesy is alive...so is Kane. No alien. No problems...Just a virus Brett and Parker  picked up ‘bar hopping’. Earth orbit soon. Then a desk job.

Dallas “Glad you’re feeling better..” adding “...Not to be a bearer of bad news...But your shift is starting in one hour” Dallas grinned