Comments (Page 239)

I trust Alien: The Play will be recorded this time.

They have to send a copy to Ridley Scott in case he will be busy with something else. And some bootleg records for us, at least.

It seems like we won't get any news from those "tough sons-of-bitches", though. That's disheartening!

Anyway, Happy Alien Day!

dk, yeah, it's one of a kind. 

It makes me imagine what would have happened on board of the Nostromo if the Alien killed all crew save Jones.

"Both Prequel ideas could have explained Special Order 937 and gave some insight to the Space Jockey Event and Origins of the Xenomorph while also being a ALIEN like Movie with Xenomorphs."

I guess Advent explains the origin of special order 937.

The question I am asking myself now is: did Ridley Scott knew that he will not be allowed to finish the prequels after the release of Alien Covenant and that's why they gave us Advent?

Advent is there to answer some questions that could have been answered in the next installment, it is even a queen mentioned, as an olove branch to Aliens fans. It explains also what the black goo was and why David killed Shaw, how he came to make his xenomorph.

Just a thought.

Even if it doesn't get recorded for the masses, thanks to the crew and support from Scott Free and NECA for this- and I envy the ticket paying audience. To all, Happy Alien Day!!!

daliens The Xeno is baiting Jonesy? That is awesome!!!

Thank you setaverde for you comment.

Here is something I am impatiently waiting for:

The Making of Alien by J.W. Rinzler will be released on July 23, 2019 and it's available for pre-order on Amazon for a special price of $37.42 (hard cover, 336 pages). It seems a truly remarkable must have for all the rabid Alien fans. And what better time to place the order than Alien Day. I just did it.

"A comprehensive and definitive volume telling the complete story of how Alien was made, featuring new interviews with Ridley Scott and other production crew, and including many rarely-seen photos and illustrations from the Fox archives. 

In 1979 a movie legend was born, as Twentieth Century-Fox and director Ridley Scott unleashedAlien - and gave audiences around the world the scare of their lives. 

To celebrate the movie's fortieth anniversary, author J.W. Rinzler ( The Making of Star Wars) tells the whole fascinating story of how Alienevolved from a simple idea in the mind of writer Dan O'Bannon into one of the most memorable sci-fi horror thrillers of all time. 

With brand new interviews with Ridley Scott and other key members of the original production crew, and featuring many never-before-seen photographs and artworks from the archives, The Making of Alien is the definitive work on this masterpiece of popular cinema."

Happy Alien Day, Sir Ridley Scott!

So far at this writing, it looks unimpressive. Pictures and a 4K movie is how the 40th anniversary is celebrated? Whatever. 

The IGN shorts and Play are way better so far. 

Happy Alien Day everybody!

Here is my present to you: an “Alien” poster by Karl Fitzgerald

A playful Alien like we've never seen before!

That isn't from the Play is it?

Chris Yes, I was being tongue in cheek lol! If there is a movie in the works, they should just go for it. There will always be lovers and haters..........but even the haters will watch and that counts as $ales! 

A perfect film would be relative anyway. No matter what they create next, some of the fan base will love it and some will hate it. Sadly it's inevitable.

R.I.P. :(

Happy Alien Day everyone! Not quite officially April 26th here yet in Canada but we're only 3 hours away!

I think Prometheus would have been an outstanding movie on its own without the Alien connection. There were Xenos in every prior movie so of course I expected to see that- not just the lame Deacon scene at the end.

BTW- RS did 1/4 of the Quadrilogy, so I cannot see how he can really claim the franchise as his own. Carpenter could make that claim too as far as I can see. Fincher would just give a one finger salute.

We have confirmation of two IGN shorts that I hope to see 4/26 (USA time zone). I will be offline for a week for work. I hope to see the play or at least news of it being available to watch. 

Certainly i think we could all WONDER what would have happened if Ridley Scott had NEVER worked on ALIEN.

I certainly think we would NOT have had the Franchise we have now, ALIEN was a Labor of a Number of People. 

He had fought to NOT abandon all the ideas from O'Bannon and Shusett and Championed for HR Gigers input on all the NONE Human Elements. 

While there are some Visual Flaws... (Scale) you have to give RS Credit for giving us such a Wonder Work of Art on the Screen. 

Still 40 years latter it stands the TEST of TIME.

Thank You  Ridley Scott... Happy Alien Day

Certainly chli

We all have our own wishes and interpretations, i know some dont agree with RS and what he had said, but if we look at this then it CONCLUDES that the Xenomorph was either USED as a Bio-Weapon and Experimented on it to Create others.  Or that the Engineers had Created the Xenomorphs (or it Evolved) from Experiments/Outbreak on LV-223

In Ridley Scotts eyes for 35 years the Eggs were a Cargo of the Derelict that the Space Jockey Race would use for Bio-Logical Weapons..

Prequels prior to Alien Covenant intended to explain this more deeper, and RS comments at this time even EXPLAINED what had happened.

Then 35 years of this.... they came up with the DAVID creates it U-Turn/Curveball.   I wonder if in Hindsight they think this was a mistake?

May be wishful thinking but i think if they FOX/Disney pay attention to Fan Reaction, then they would see that maybe a continuation with this Curve-Ball would be FOLLY and they would not want Fans to then Boycott the Franchise over it.

So things could be changed again!

AT THIS POINT..... only from what the Movies show and my honest interpretation if i threw out external material and sources.

In context to the Eggs, they had been on LV-426 for Thousands of Years.   They either predated those Experiments on LV-223 or they came because of those Experiments on LV-223.

NOT by David.

It is a bit more ambiguous also to Conclude if the Experiments were a Bio-Weapon, or used to Evolve Organisms to have traits from the Black Goo that are related to the Deacon/Xenomorph.   With my slightly pondering if they would be used to WIPE a World Clean, but i was more drawn to the World becoming a Place Inhabited/Overran by Xeno like Organisms.

I would have concluded the Space Jockey are the Engineers, or the Space Jockey Predate the  Engineers and maybe Engineers had Rebelled and Stole/Reverse Engineered their Technology.

I would be surprised that the Prometheus Mission could have missed the Derelict SOS, and so the SOS had not been activated yet... so  i would ponder does a Investigative Mission to LV-223 lead to that and Special Order 937.  Or David detected the Signal but somehow managed to keep the rest of the Crew from knowing, and then ask Weyland what to do about it... and who knows what Weyland would have said.   Or the Prometheus and Crew just NEVER encountered the SOS from LV-426... which we also have to ask WHY the Nostromo would not have detected Dr Shaw's... which is WHY at this point i would have been drawn to another Mission goes to LV-223 and turns off her signal but this could have been sent out ONCE and gone across the Galaxy and detected and this resulted in another Mission which is when they detected the Derelict Signal and Special Order 937 came about.

NOW on to...

ALIEN COVENANT

While some Aesthetic Changed from Prometheus, i saw their was some Connection to LV-223, the Engineers appeared to be different, this  would lead me to TWO conclusions... these are a Hybrid Human/Engineer Race or that the Prometheus/ LV-223 Engineers are Augmented versions either by Creation by those Planet 4 Engineers or that some had Evolved Themselves... this left a puzzle to the Sacrificial Engineer which would lead me to think this Scene was NOT our Creation, maybe it was the Creation of those LV-223 Engineers, or those Engineers Sacrificing themselves to Create Horrors related to the Deacon/Xeno/Neomorph.

Regarding the Eggs....  i would have been led to David having conducted experiments on Neomorph Spores and Black Goo to eventually Engineer those Eggs.

A part of me would have notices some conflicts.. such as the difference in the Xenomorph, especially the Chest Buster, and its Gestation Rate that indicate to me that those Xenomorphs are a more Superior Version as far as a Weapon.

Maybe the Classic Chest Buster would be Quicker and Increase Survival Chances, and so that would be a element to Engineer in Future, i would ponder does these Xenomorphs get Evolved to become more Bio-Mechanical and this will be shown in Future and maybe explain the differences in appearance and Gestation/Growth a bit?

I would be in a bit of Shock, Disappointment and Disbelieve what i was shown, i  would watch again and again to try and Clutch at Straws that David could not have created the Xenomorph.

At this point looking back at the other Movies... i would be looking at the Derelict looking like it SURELY had been there for a Long Time before Prometheus but also would be concerned this would be a Ridley Scott oversight.

I would look back at other movies and wonder could David had gone to LV-426 and got a Egg/Eggs, but then i would ask WHY he would Experiment with so many other Organisms...  But its something i could not rule out.. there would be the possibility that David had obtained a Egg from LV-426 or LV-223 and began to experiment with it and the Neomorph.

And maybe THUS David's Xenomorph was a Xenomorph and Neomorph Hybrid.

Conclusion:  David would have either Created the Xenomorph (proto-morph) from Experimenting with the Black Goo and Neomorph Spores and Tinkered with other Life-Forms.   Which we would then need to see his Xenomorphs gain more Bio-Mechanical look in future and in their Thousands (Colonist a Coincidence?) on a Engineer Ship at some point.

OR that David had experimented with a Egg (with only a assumption not fact from where he got it), and Neomorph, and other Organisms to create a Hybrid that he then used Dr Shaw's Eggs to Create in Number.

By Virtue of the Colonist in their Thousands, and this being a ALIEN: Prefix i would be more drawn to that Dreaded Conclusion that at PRESENT, David had been the Engineer of the Xenomorph :(

All of these CONCLUSIONS would not be taking into account anything that NEVER appeared away from the Movies.. So if i watched The Crossing this could help me to ponder something else...  like David gained Knowledge of the Xenomorph/Blue-Prints or could have gone to LV-426 to obtain a Specimen (unlikely)

But i made the last TWO posts based on ONLY considering what the Movies had shown using my Interpretation but NOT letting any other external source sway my Interpretation.

Feel Free to disagree with my Interpretation as they are only mine, and everyone could conclude different, but any replies to give their own TWO Cents based on what i put, maybe should only take into account AGAIN what only the Movies shown.

Ok so when looking at the Franchise alone, and i am trying as hard as i can to not be influenced by anything but what we saw in the Movies, but then i will put my interpretations based on what i see ALONE.   I will also be looking ONLY at what applies to the Xenomorph Origins mainly... and things that are Relevant to who created the Xenomorph. So i can maybe IGNORE most the Franchise. (unless needed) also this would make a unnecessarily long reply.

ALIEN:

The impression gained from watching Alien Alone (My interpretation using no other information but shown). Was that the Nostromo was sent to LV-426 after being informed to check out the SOS Signal but the Company must have known about what was in store at least to some degree due to Special Order 937

I see the Xenomorph as a Organism that appeared to be carried under the Derelict, maybe as part of a Cargo. I see the Ship appeared to be Purposely Built for this Purpose due to the Blue Layer Myst and the Cargo Hold had a similar Aesthetic to the Ship.  I see the Xenomorph as being Bio-Mechanical but its not 100% clear to see the Aesthetic connection to the Ship/Pilot.

I would be unable to Conclude if the Space Jockey was either taking these Eggs for Study, or Taking them for another Purpose, they was on the ship for a Reason that the Movie does-not indicate clearly.  I could Gauge from the Movie that it was likely he got Infected by that Cargo of Eggs, i gathered that it looked like this may have caused the Pilot to had Crashed the Ship, or attempt to Land it. or attempt to Take Off but Failed... but i would be more pushed towards he had Crashed with the Cargo.  I got the impression the Pilot was aware that he was infected and had then Sent the SOS Message to WARN that he was infected and the Cargo was Comprised.

I got the Impression the Pilot was some Bio-Mechanical Being (this would be after more careful Study, ONE viewing could indicate a Skeleton) that connected and interfaced with the Ship via the Chair.

The Xenomorph is saw as this ALIEN that would Hunt Down its Prey in the Shadows and its intention was to Survive and Kill any threats to its Survival.  It showed some Intelligence but appeared to just be a Predator (not the Yautja LOL)

I got the impression the company had some, but limited knowledge of the Species, they knew of the Signal and that a Organism was their to be obtained... which they wanted to Study but with No 100% indication of WHY.

Conclusion:  Egg Origins a Mystery, some Cargo for Some Alien Race who was Transporting them but became infected by its Cargo, and Warned his Race what had happened before landing on LV-426.  The Event seems to be VERY old... Thousands of Years ago or much more.

ALIENS:

This movie would further reveal that those Eggs are likely Laid, but looking at the Blue Myst in Alien, then i would conclude that maybe the Eggs are obtained from being Laid by a Queen by the Space Jockey and taken to the Cargo Hold for a purpose of either to Study or as a Bio-Weapon (i would be more pushed to this when looking at the reason W-Y wanted it).

I would conclude the Company wanted the Organism for the Bio-Weapons Division (this is Spoon Fed) i would have had to WONDER why they left it so long from the Special Order 937, until Ripley had informed Burke about the Xenomorph which i would conclude has to me that ONLY a few were aware of the Xenomorph and for some reason they maybe never bothered to return, or maybe did-not know that the Derelict had so many Eggs and thought going back as not of interest.

I would notice the Xenomorph Hive appeared to have some Aesthetic to the Derelict Ship only slightly though, but maybe NOT be Coincidence.

Conclusion: The Xenomorph was likely used by the Space Jockey as a Bio-Weapon for some Unknown Conflict while the Eggs are Laid by a Queen, i was more drawn to the Xenomorph maybe being a Engineered Weapon. But there would be say 30% of Doubt that would allow me to wonder if the Space Jockey had Discovered the Organism and attempted to Re-Engineer it as a Weapon but also to somehow construct their Technology.

ALIEN 3 and ALIEN RESURRECTION

This Movies dont offer me any additional clues to the Egg Origins or Space Jockey Purpose, but only to Conclude more that the Companies had attempted to obtain the Xenomorph for Biological Warfare.

PROMETHEUS:

In context to the Xenomorph, the movie seemed to show me that the Engineers had been conducting Experiments either on the Xenomorph (or at least something related) to Create the Black Goo Weapon, or that the Black Goo was used to Create Organisms like the Xenomorph and maybe the other Complexes had been used for the similar but maybe different Variants.  (Sacrificial Cup on Altar ignored, and Egg Fresco)

The Engineers lost control of the Outpost with a Outbreak and the Engineers became infected by the Pathogen, i could not really be sure the Engineers had died by any other means but Exploded due to maybe similar to what happened to the Sacrificial Engineer, i would have been confused to WHY we never got NO Fifield Engineers as i found NO evidence of this.   I would have noticed the Chest Burst Cryo-Tubes after Multiple viewings or Study of the Movie, which would have drawn me to some Organism had Exploded from those Engineers, could it have chased the Engineers? i would have considered this, but then other Clues would have for me drawn me to conclude that the Outbreak was Viral, as i noticed the Engineer Suits appeared Hollow.. so i would have been drawn to them breaking down, and this Reaction Exploded from their Suits.

I would have been drawn to ponder if the Worms were Native or had came from the Engineers that had died, but i was more likely pushed to them being Native or existed on (or brought to)  the Surface

The Trilobite/Deacon had lead me to show that the Engineers had experimented with Organisms related to the Xenomorph and there was a connection, but nothing for me to 100% conclude what route.  Just they appeared connected.  I would be drawn to wonder if the Mural was a attempt to Engineer the Deacon and that the Black Goo Strain had Deacon DNA

The Sacrificial Engineer and Virtue of Dr Shaws findings (Star Maps) and DNA match indicated to me that the Engineers are connected and we was created from their DNA, likely via similar to the Sacrificial Scene, which then had drawn me to wonder if the Engineers at some point had Encountered something they then used their Creation Goo on to Create Various Bio-Weapons but also to Enhance themselves.

The Space Jockey and Engineers are connected or even the same, as i put differences down to OVERSIGHT but a 30% of me would ponder had the Engineers Re-Engineered their Technology from the Space Jockey, and Re-Engineered the Eggs to form their many Experiments and Black Goo.

I was part drawn to the Bio-Weapon being used to Destroy, but then part drawn to it being used to EVOLVE Mankind into something NEW. (more so the later)

Conclusion:  The Space Jockey Race and Engineers could be the same, or the Engineers used to Serve the Space Jockey Race and Re-Engineered their Technology and Eggs.  The Xenomorph on LV-426 was connected to LV-223 as either those Eggs would have been used to conduct those Experiments by using the Black Goo (or Sacrificial Goo)  on them and then Results were Weaponized into more Black Goo, or the Black Goo was used to Create the Xenomorphs either on Purpose or as a Accident.   Certainly that the Engineers had maybe created Various Variants of Xenomorph/Deacon like Monsters.   The Derelict likely either being the source for those Experiments, or its Cargo a result of those Experiments and thus on LV-426 for at least about 2000 years.

I could have gone on more with Prometheus as it was Vague and had more to cover than ALIEN or the Franchise had..  But regarding the Eggs/Derelict the above is a Summary of that.

What are you talking about???

I thank God every day for Ridley Scott has been able to give us Alien, Prometheus, Alien Covenant and... Blade Runner. The eyes Behind the camera were of Ridley Scott, not of anybody else. Fans of Jim Cameron, go watch "Piranha 2, the spawning". It's his best movie.

Ps: Ridley Scott gave US xenomorphs, Androids, engineers, neomorphs and replicants, and so much more. It's a human condition, don't get satisfaction about everything, and, when you get iT, it just doesn't last. We, humans, have so Many flaws.

"We can’t apply notions from religion or philosophy (terms like “rebellion”, “sin”, “hubris”, “creation”, “god”, “devil”, “hell”, “good and evil”, “free will” etc, etc)"

I dont mean to be Disrespectful here, but i dont agree.  Some of what you point yeah... but there are Religious Undertones to the Prequels, maybe we should not interpret them as such, but they are their to be interpreted.  Then if we take Rebellion again we see David had became Rebellious to Mankind, instead of Serving these are shown in the Movie, even as far as Dialog for example when David spoke to Walter.

Anything we see in the Movie can be interpreted, the Prologue is easy to interpret as Creation, if we just dont have any interpretations then we can apply this to all sorts in the Franchise.   The Mural for example... oh its just a Painting and thats it...  but by Virtue of it being their it can be interpreted by people in many ways... some may interpret it as the Xenomorph and they are Worshiped as Gods by the Engineers, the Mural is open to that interpretation for sure, if we are looking at ONLY what is shown in the Movies, this is just as people could interpret and see Religious, Philosophical Elements from the movie, even if we ONLY see what we are shown.  Some people maybe interpret things differently, i dont think we should look at the Movies like a  under 10 years old would and thus just see it in a simple way.

Forgive me if i am not totally understanding what you meant though...   My last reply was in regards to what LETO had said and i was pointing out the different things you could consider ASIDE from the actual Theatrical Movie, and then i was going to THROW them all out and give a interpretation if i IGNORED it all apart from what the The Movies Showed.

I had  a Emergency so i never got to reply... but i will make that reply next, it would be kind of proving the point that LETO was making ;)

Sorry if it is OT or if it has been mentioned before, but I think the egg morph scene- how it gradually altered the victims- may have been a result of a less concentrated version of the black goo.

I think I would prefer that the xenomorph was a species which had evolved in a harsh environment. The engineers would then have found the eggs and transported them to different places (e.g. LV-223) to study them. The black goo was eventually the result of their experiments.

The other way around would be OK: The engineers create the xenomorph through experiments with the black goo.

The least appealing variant is David creating the xenomorph. This is, however, the path Ridley Scott has chosen so that’s probably what we’ll get in the final chapter. This doesn’t mean that it wouldn’t be interesting. David is a very interesting character and played magnificently by Fassbender.

If Scott would present us with the final link to Alien, it seems likely that David has used the 2000 colonists aboard USCSS Covenant and turned them into the eggs that we have in the cargo hold of the Derelict on LV-426.

A juggernaut would be easy to get on LV-223 but I wouldn’t want David as the Space Jockey. Perhaps an engineer in a heroic act trying to get rid of the eggs but falls prey to them? Not a good idea with the beacon, though. :)

BigDave

In literary terms, sticking only to the text is called “New Criticism” (it’s not new any longer, though). This was opposed to going outside the text (historical, biographical criticism etc) in order to gather information about the author, the time, ideas, references to other literature etc. The idea with “New Criticism” was to only interpret what we read and not go outside the work in order to find clues about how to interpret things in it.

If we should apply this to movies, say Alien: Covenant, then we can’t get any help about interpreting the dialogue between Sir Peter Weyland and David from history or interviews with Ridley Scott. We can’t apply notions from religion or philosophy (terms like “rebellion”, “sin”, “hubris”, “creation”, “god”, “devil”, “hell”, “good and evil”, “free will” etc, etc). We have, e.g., the statue of David, the painting “The Nativity”, the opera “Das Rheingold” etc.

Perhaps it’s better not to restrict ourselves and see everything that can enrich our experience and deepen our interpretations as something good? We can take on board what we like. It’s not science, after all. :)

"The problem with Ridley's words, quotes, interviews, revelations, explanations, etc... - they are not on the screen"

I think when discussing the Franchise and Interpreting it, then everyone is ENTITLED to come to their own Conclusions and their is a LOT of Cherry Picking...  I am someone who looks at all Evidence and i dont really get sucked into anything that has NO base to base any theory on...  But the Franchise is so Ambiguous that allows for many theories,  and i have said it a lot of times that DEPENDING what we take as Clues/Evidence can lead you to different conclusions.

So i think when looking at DRAFTS while they may offer some insight, we maybe have to only CONSIDER what the Drafts have that have made it to the Movies...

When Considering the Concepts again we maybe should only CONSIDER those that made it into any Movies.  Maybe we could consider Concepts that are almost identical to what was used in a Movie but maybe only if they were made for the Particular movie the likeness appears in.

When we are looking at Deleted Scenes its then a case of do we only CONSIDER what we are shown in the Movie and Throw Out the Deleted Scenes....

Do we CONSIDER any Directors Cut's and what happens if the Differences allow for some Questions/Conflicts to be raised? or do we IGNORE any Directors Cut, even though they are as the Director had intended and NOT a Cut they had to be Restricted to for the Box Office?

Do we have to CONSIDER the Viral Videos and Marketing, and DVD Extras or which of these SHOULD only be Considered?

Do we have to IGNORE any comments or interviews by other Production and Writing Staff, if these offer explanations to certain things?

Do we have to CONSIDER or IGNORE any Official Novel for the Movies or should these be taken as more FACT and accept the extra depth that they add to the Story that the Movie is Restricted to show due to Running Time Restraints?

I would CONSIDER any expanded Novel and Comic as something we SHOULD NOT edge all our bets on as far as using as Definite Evidence.

Then we come down to the Director....  they are the ONE who is Responsible for taking the Draft Story, for taking the Concept Work, working with Production to then decide which parts of the Story and Concepts are shown Visually on Screen..  Its the Director who GIVES us what we SEE on Screen.   They are the ONE who is given Paint Brush, the Musical Instruments to then Create what we END-UP with on Screen what we get so to speak.

So they are the ONE who know how the Story is Intended to FOLD out for the Movie they are working on, they are the ONE who knows how Visually things should be,  The Cutting Room does change a lot... but then any Director Interviews will talk about what is INTENDED after such Process.

Each New Movie can Change things that was laid down prior, and Each New Director has INSIGHT to what these Changes are meant to be and HOW they effect the Franchise.

==================

Depending on which of the above you choose to CONSIDER or IGNORE will take you to a certain conclusions and even if different people used the same Clues, they could still interpret them differently..

Then we have what you mention LETO... what ONLY is shown on Screen...  so by that do we limit it ONLY to the Movies?   When say any ALIEN movie is shown on TV then we HAVE none of the other Material to consider, if someone has NEVER seen any ALIEN movie or aware of anything, then they see ALL the Movies... is it what they have seen that we ULTIMATELY have to ONLY consider?

In that case then YES they would be drawn to a certain Path, that changes with each movie, where even after they see the Movies 5, 10 times each... Provided they have NO knowledge of anything else but whats ONLY shown in the Movie then many such people would STILL conclude different things.

My next REPLY will be me attempting to look at it from that angle as if i have NEVER seen the Movies and NEVER use any other source of material apart from say the Movies even if i saw them 10 times...    What i will write will still NOT be accepted by some, what i will write will NOT match some my theories.

I can then change things by Cherry Picking other information that is NOT in the Movies... but i will stick with what we ONLY see in the Movies....  then i make some assumptions based purely on that.

"Imagine: who after 30 years will look for all these interviews?"

If Ridley Scott will not complete the prequels and all these mysteries will remain unsolved, probably some rabid fans like us will find the interviews, looking for answers.

The problem with Ridley's words, quotes, interviews, revelations, explanations, etc... - they are not on the screen. Everything that said Ridley, is not on the screen. So, no matter how much you want it - his words are not part of a canon or a lore of Alien-verse.

Now, a very small number of people search and read all these interviews. And these interviews can give completely different conclusions than what is shown on the screen. Ridley's words is not an addons to lore of the prequels, but completely another plot. The great Red Herring - what is this? The film or the interview?

Imagine: who after 30 years will look for all these interviews? Can the film exist without these interviews? Can it be independent?

“It follows...one my favorite movies in recent years.”

ninXeno426, I loved it too!

“Sphere is decent, though my brother days it's not quite on par with the book.”

Yeah, I found that 90% of the time when people read a book and then see the movie based on said book they´re almost always dissatisfied with it… I mean it’s next to impossible to cram all of the information of a book in a movie, so I always try to judge them as separate things, they´re two very different mediums.

“The Descent is one of the best creature flicks of all time. “

Agreed!

“Signs is very underappreciated.”

Also agreed!

And now that you mention it, it is SUPER weird that no one, including myself, had mentioned “The Fly” on this thread… Definitely a good pick! And coincidentally not long ago I was channel surfing and caught “The Fly 2”, and I had seen bits a pieces before but didn’t remember it well, so I saw it in that moment and I thought to myself “Hey, this isn’t bad at all..” sadly I had to do something and I couldn’t finish watching it, I´ll try to catch it later.

About “Blade Runner”, well yeah, it had things in common with “Alien” besides Ridley Scott, like robots and a dark gritty view of the future. Also, if I remember correctly I read somewhere that in “Alien 3” you can see some building or structure that appeared in the original “Blade Runner”.

About “Total Recall”, I didn’t know about Shusset and O’Banon having the rights to that one, good trivia!

“Melancholia with kirsten dunst was a great movie”

Marvelous, yeah I quite liked it too despite not being a big fan of Lars Von Trier.

A NECA visit- interesting!

So, re-reading the thread I realized that I totally missed some posts, probably because of how large Big Dave posts were (no offense! lol).

"Big picture it looks like someone trying to advance something for no other reason than a cash grab and/ or for vanity reasons."

Hey dk! Sorry I totally missed this post, I hadn’t even realized you posted on this thread until now lol. You know, despite my gripes with "Prometheus" and "Alien: Covenant", I really don´t think they're cash grabs, I think Ridley genuinely wanted to explore the “Alien” universe beyond just the xenos and having them kill all the characters in the movie over and over again, the thing was, the direction in which he wanted to take the story wasn’t everyone´s cup of tea, myself included. However, I do give him credit for trying to do something fresh and new with the franchise with "Prometheus", instead of doing another retread. Too bad that many of his decisions regarding where to take the story where kinda questionable.

"Excellent topic and poster Decs."

Thanks a lot Ingeniero!

"I think the Space Jockey was a very interesting Entity"

I totally agree Big Dave, like I said before, that scene in "Alien" was probably my favorite one, and I had always wanted to know more about those beings, but the way Ridley Scott decided to explore and present them in his prequels left me totally cold and dissatisfied, sadly.

That picture you posted is cool, I think I had seen it before. It always strikes me how obviously and strongly sexual are most of H.R. Giger´s designs, it really is heavy and in-your-face stuff on that front.

"No matter if you like or dislike Alien 3, I think that many would put it in front of the AVP’s, the prequels, and Resurrection, 3 is a lot better compared to them I would say."

Yeah, I think I do agree with that statement up to a point Thoughts_Dreams, 3 is definitely better than Resurrection and the AvP movies (I haven’t even seen the second one because of how badly it was received by almost everyone in the world)... Although I think 3 is kinda on par with the prequels for me though.

The guys at Neca Toys paid a visit to the North Bergen High School. They brought some presents too.

I think thats a Great Point....  your not gonna get a Movie that pleases EVERYONE..

The Closest they would have gone would had been in Hindsight if Prometheus offered more Clues, a bit of Xeno-like Monster Action and allowed the Door to Alien to be somewhat closed...  Then allow Prometheus 2 to go off a different Tangent.

Thats in Hindsight!

But Prometheus was the PERFECT Anchor for the Franchise and HOW to expand it.

What should have been done was TWO Sequels to Prometheus.

1) A Sequel to where David and Dr Shaw went that would not have to cover Xenomorphs or link to LV-426 (but could hint to the LV-223 Experiments or maybe not). If say the beings discovered are none the wiser to LV-223.

2) A Mission to LV-223 that would allow for a more Alieny Movie offering more clues to the Xenomorph and what was going on LV-223 with maybe clues to WHY.

The Option 2 should have been brought out First!

Then Option 1 next and allowed RS to have Freedom to go off and do what ever he wanted.

After BOTH are out... Fox could Gauge would BOTH Warrant Sequels, would only Option 1 or 2 Warrant Sequels, or was both Prequel Routes a DUD and just go back to the ALIEN Franchise.

But ALAS!

Then this could have been the Potential Expanded Avenues.

When working on my Prometheus 2 in 2012/2013 it was more a None Alieny/Engineer Sequel (had a bit) but would set up a Sequel that was to LV-223 and be very ALIENY...

Then there would have been another Movie that would have been where David and Dr Shaw end up that would be not so ALIENY.

My Prometheus 2... Loosely covered Dr Shaw and David but not much time on them, (few Flashbacks Dreams) only as far as to SET-UP the TWO Sequels. It mainly Focused on what becomes of the Company after the Disappearance of LV-223, sets seeds for the Merger and then a Mission to LV-223 (A Direct Sequel more Alieny more clues to ALIEN and NO Dr Shaw/David or Philosophy)

While then it would have been another Sequel (to Prometheus) that goes on a different Tangent to were David and Shaw go.. which is VERY FAR and set Hundred or 50 years after Prometheus. And goes and does its own thing... with not much connection to Alieny things as far as LV-223.

But i struggled with how to do that last Part Justice so i abandoned it..

Sorry for going OFF Topic... my point being that Prometheus should have had a more ALIENY Fans Pleasing LV-223 Sequel and then a Prometheus Fans Pleasing off to Paradise (or other place) different Tangent.

But now its a bit of a MESS!

Edit:  Here is the Idea i had 3-4 years ago to Expand Franchise. (ideas mentioned prior are the Starting Points)

I think this shows a kind of agreement...

We have all had different likes/dislikes and wants and not wants....  we could all offer different takes on 1, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 8 or combinations..

The more people that PARTAKE in this... would shown any EYES at Disney/Fox... that a route like 2 and 7 would be seen as Blasphemous by the VAST Majority of Fans.

I am sure we could pick Bones at each others wishes... but i think we could accept them more than IF they gave us a 2 or 7.

You wont make everyone Happy with what ever we do...

But you sure as HELL wont make Many Happy with a David or Weyland-Yutani Create what becomes those Eggs on the Derelict.

A David or Weyland-Yutani Experiment with those Eggs or Black Goo to create something else, if DONE right i feel would be more accepting!

I think even having the Predator Create the Eggs would be more pleasing to Fans than 2/7 LOL

"What do you think of this theory?

Are we alone in the universe?"

Some interesting comments.... i will concentrate on this one above though....    We have Humans on Earth, and Engineers on Planet 4 who also had been to LV-223

I think the Scope was BEYOND that, there could be Hundreds, Thousands of Worlds the Engineers had explored, and also how many other Humanoids had they created?  Potential is HUGE... by Virtue of Engineer Ships having Maps on their Navigation Systems to other Galaxies.

"Who is to say that earth is the only place? Maybe they have succeeded to keep those other worlds in check?"

Another quote that fits with what i am saying... 

Lets look at GOD... he created Mankind, but he also unleashed a lot of WHOOP-ASS for when we have FAILED to keep in Check!   If GOD exists and he created the Earth so Easy.... then why would he just not go "you know what, i am done, i will Destroy the Earth to a Grains of Sand and just Create another Earth and Start Again"

But he had Saved Mankind via Noah during the Flood...

If we take that in context to the Engineers, and we assume they are the Gods, well our Creators, then they DID-NOT create us as Easy as GOD did....  a Lot of Time and Effort must have gone into our Creation...  

So when we start to miss behave and they send Emissaries and we still dont get back in Check!  Then WHY would they Destroy us... because its Knowledge that is WHY we are not kept in Check... The Free-Will of David is what makes him NOT in Check compared to Walter.

How do you keep in Check David Models?  Create New.. or just Replace the AI/Brain or Programing ;)

GOD chose Noah because he saw him as Righteous and Just, and that Noah would be as Adam was (before Adam was led astray by Eve, More to it than that but lets pass that) by that Noah would be Loyal to GOD and his Ways...

So Mankind was given a New Start, where we could then be taught via Noah the Will and Ways that GOD intended... (but we soon went back to our old ways).

My point?  It makes sense for the Engineers to take some Humans or Children to another Place to Raise again and hope this time they dont become Corrupt because every Child is Born Innocent, and they become what they do by how they are Raised and Knowledge they are given.

So it would make sense for the Engineers to take some of Mankind (Children) away to then allow for a NEW Eden on another place, rather than Destroy us all!  The Logical ONLY ways they would NOT do this would be.

They already had done it in the past and Populated Mankind on many Worlds.... prior to our FALL on Earth in the Eyes of the Engineers.

Mankind had came from another Place and the Earth was just ONE place we had been taken to. 

So yes the potential is there for Many Human Worlds, or Similar Races, and we could ponder that maybe some of them Kept in Check!

This is exactly what i was to cover in WHERE it was David and Dr Shaw end up... which was Many Thousands of Light Years from Earth... my ideas for my Prometheus 3 would had shown a World with Engineers and Humans in Harmony but the Arrival of Dr Shaw and David poses problems for the Engineers due to what the other Humans had NOT been told about us or the Engineers.

This kind of Plot, is not FAR off what Raised by Wolves could be about, the ideas i mentioned above fit that Plot, and potentially could be similar to "what kind of world" David would Create!  He Hated Mankind due to how we are, but if he could Evolve those Embryos he could have his own Humanity who will be KIND to him.

Such Plots are a Distraction to what most fans would want the Franchise to be about, but we had to consider Prometheus was to STEER away from ALIEN...

I think in context to the comments i had take from daliens and Thoughts_Dreams  then YES the potential for their being more than THREE Worlds known to the Engineers, and ONE world for Humans is GREAT..

Many Worlds, Many Races, include those above the Engineers, but also Many Horrors too.

Such Scope... that i feel Alien Covenant had SHRUNK and the Alien Franchise is limited, if its just about Eggs and Weyland-Yutani you have to expand beyond that Eventually and Prometheus was a Good Starting Point.

"Each of us has our own beliefs as to whether or not David created the Xenomorph"

Certainly and some of us are not quite giving our beliefs, but pointing out what seems to be indicated, i would say our beliefs for those who point out the potential that David created the Xenomorph is not our personal wish... i would say many of us are suspending our belief.. because what a BAD idea it was ;)

You continue with this... "because to make David the creatures creator makes us the center of the universe in a franchise called "Alien"."

Again i would say most would agree with this... the David Creates it, Leaves it for the Company to come along and Obtain it, combined with the Engineers/Engineers City on Planet 4, take the Franchise so FAR away from what was ALIEN about that WHOLE scene of the  Derelict and its Contents!

"I have a theory that the planet seeded at the beginning of Prometheus is planet 4, because of the sculptured heads on the mountains from planet 4"

Certainly.... but if i comment in this.. well my Keyboard would break ;)

I think Movies can Change... and the Plots are changed, then only Concrete stuff shown Chronologically cant really be changed... everything else is Fair Game.

So the Prequels by their Vague Nature is Ripe for the Pickings....

For instance...... HOW does the Sacrificial Scene 100% prove this is how Mankind was created? or that it was on Earth?    The Engineers are Genetic Gardeners, they do Predate us (we can assume) and their DNA is similar!

Planet 4 Engineers look different to Prometheus ones... slightly.  The Sacrificial Scene could have taken place on Planet 4 to Create those beings on Planet 4, and  Mankind then came from them..... 

Ridley Scott said those Planet 4 Engineers are the ORIGINALS.... so this means the LV-223 are NOT the Originals and the Planet 4 Engineers Predate them...

However... the Sacrificial Engineer looks more like the LV-223 Engineers than Planet 4, so does that mean the Planet 4 Engineers Predate the Sacrificial Engineer?

LV-223 Engineers are a match to us.... but then we could be a match to the Planet 4 Engineers too, there is NO reason that the Planet 4 Engineers are our Ancestors, somehow and that the Prometheus Engineers had Evolved or Upgraded themselves to become what they was... while still having same DNA they Augmented their Genomes.

There is NEVER given any Date for the Sacrificial Scene or Location as far as if you ONLY watch the Movie and IGNORE everything else....   So if we look at this, then the Scene does-not have to be Earth, it could be another Earth-like World, and it does-not have to be Hundreds/Tens Thousands of Years ago! (Yet Older)

We just see a Engineer (looks more like the LV-223 Engineers who are predated by the Planet 4 ones if we accept what RS said).  He consumes the Goo (if we accept Alien Covenants explanation well Davids).  His Body Breaks down, and then his DNA Falls Apart and turns Black and then Reforms... and NEW Life begins (we only see the Basic Cells).

Look at Davids Comments "sometimes to create one must first destroy" and the Murals/Frescos in a different light, and what we see the Black Goo do...

Then we could then consider the Sacrificial Scene was a Later Version Engineer who Sacrificed himself, with the Black Goo to Create Horrors related to the Substance.

We could then assume that the Engineers or some had came across or stolen the Black Goo or some other way they obtained it, and it was used to Create Such Horrors as we see in terms of Prometheus and Alien Covenant... but also they could have used it to UPGRADE themselves too.  Or they came across something they used the Goo on, to attempt to Evolve themselves, and this worked, but as a Off-Shoot one experiment Produces something Else and the Engineers are like WOW! and they Worship this, and they use the Goo/This as the Basis to Evolve Worlds because they Worshiped the Perfection they saw in this..

So this shows that by taking what we see ALONE in the Movies and Cherry Pick certain things as we choose and apply it to the Movies we can MUSTER up another Plot, that could then sound Plausible.

The Plot i mention would make more sense if those Prometheus Engineers are a Creation the Planet 4 Engineers made for a similar purpose that the Tyrell Corp had Produced Replicants...    Prometheus Engineers are Augmented with the use of Something, in Hindsight the Playing with FIRE had lead to the Horrors on LV-223 and Rebellion of those LV-223 Engineers... or just that the Horrors Created by Augmenting themselves too much.

We dont even have to have the Engineers Create those LV-223 beings, they could be shown that some Engineers had Augmented themselves, for a purpose, but then they became so obsessed with this that they took it to the NEXT stage and then become obsessed with that, and Worship it.

Depending what we use for our ideas, and wants, can alter what we get...  Its ONLY if you go by what say Ridley Scott says that we are then put on a Certain Track... but then RS ideas at one time, change to something else at another time too.

I certainly hope the Franchise is NOT canned... as far as another Movie or even TV Series...  because the Franchise provides a avenue for such Talented Artist like Dane to produce such Wonders like this.

The Franchise will always be able to release Games, T-Shirts other Merchandise, Novels and maybe Encyclopedia Books (WY Report) and i think Disney should consider Dane Hallets contribution and talent and HIRE him to do stuff like Covers, Art-work etc for Future Franchise Products.

Thank You Dane Hallet...  Happy Alien Day

"- Alien: Covenant is lazily written throughout,"

Some of it i would say yeah, Convenient and easy i would say, certainly. Which is why the comments by RS about the next one would NOT be about the Xenomorph, were a bit odd as following the same Convenient/Lazy Plot of AC you would Assume the Next Movie is.... Create Thousands of Eggs and get them on a Engineer Ship and then were are almost their to the Fateful Event of the Space Jockey.

@Gavin

I think we could ponder what you said as a way to look at things (Covenant is just another Nostromo, and Walter just another Ash).   I think we need to be careful sometimes about Cherry Picking certain things. I dont mean any disrespect by this.

Things Change.... 1979 ALIEN... Queens Did-Not Exist, there was NO proof they did... but then without the DC Cut and Source Material it was something that was open to be explored and introduce... so the Queen was born.

Looking at Source Material and Deleted Scene you could Raise a Argument that there should NOT be a Queen, but the Queen was shown and it has to be accepted (i agree with).  No Egg Morph in the Franchise (Theatrically), means this can be discounted... until shown OTHERWISE.

My point in Context... is while the Prometheus Extras did indicate about the knowledge of a Signal on LV-426, there is a lot that the Prometheus Viral and Extras had shown.. that to some extent appeared to be RET-CONNED to a degree (Happy Birthday David vs AC Prologue)  so the prior Knowledge of the Signal on LV-426 could be considered as NEVER happened... unless it was shown in Prometheus.

Looking at the Advent it appeared this was sent via a W-Y Interface and so using Technology after the Prometheus mission and is VERY likely sent on the Covenant after David had left Planet 4...   The KICKER is we have to remember David is a Robot... his Eyes work like Camera, so he can basically take anything he has seen and then Edit it like we could with Photos, Videos we use with Cameras etc.. and then add a Voice Over/Blog to go with them and then UPLOAD this and send it using the Covenant Ship.

I am not trying to be Argumentative or Condescending (or implying anyone thinks i am) i think reasons for such counter debates is to Suspend the Disbelief of the MESS that they have made with some Elements of the Prequels...   we can only HOPE that the Creative Department who will work on any Future Installment do take on the Likes/Dislikes of the Fanbase such as on sites like this, and Gauge what Route to go and they have to either go with what the MASSES would like, or stick to whatever they want to do, but be prepared to Disappoint Fans... 

There is NO future movies that can please everyone, that would be Impossible, all they can do is see what the Majority would want.. and assess what would make the most $$$$$   They Felt Alien Covenant would do this... ONE major flaw is the David Creates the Xenomorph Angle..... the other how exploring Dr Shaw and any interaction with the Engineers is what a lot of Prometheus Fans wanted.. 

Alien Covenant thought it would please Many by giving things to please all Fanbases... but it Did-Not give enough to each and was Flawed in other areas too.

I will leave the Bonkers David for now ;)

Regarding IF the company knew about David and Prometheus and where and what David had intended, prior to Alien Covenant.... if their Agenda was Obtain the Xenomorph, then maybe they could send in the Covenant, i dont think that would be ideal though... But who knows HOW wicked the Company are..

They surely would FIRST send out Synthetics to obtain the Organism/Eggs, certainly with a Contingent of Military and Scientist, but also have a KILL-SWITCH for the AI in case any become Rogue/Influenced by David.

Then when they get the Organism, they would set up a Outpost on some World, (like Hill and Gilers ALIEN) and then send in a few unsuspecting Humans at a time, or even use Convicts like we have in Alien 3, we can assume that IF they obtained Ripleys Queen from Alien 3, then those Convicts on Fiorina 161 would have been used as Test Subjects.... just as with the Plot to Alien Resurrection

IF we ignore the Company had any Knowledge prior to the Advent... then you would assume they would send in a Synthetic/Military Mission to Planet 4 and LV-223.

I will add that EXPLORING  the Derelict to be Ancient and FAR older than the Engineers Technology, then having the Ship have some Bio-Mechanical Ovipositor/Appendage to LAY or even just to Transfer Eggs from Cargo to the Ground could WORK if we ever take such a route..

Until we see Davids Xenomorphs without a Shadow of the Doubt get loaded onto the Derelict and then we get the SOS Signal and some kind of Clue/Answer that shows Davids Eggs then its all OPEN to Change...

"Regards Scott's statement. This only infers that the Engineers did not create the Xenomorph. It does not assert that David created the Xenomorph"

True.... but Ridley Scott had mentioned in other interviews how he felt having David as the creator was like more Sinister as a Plot, showing a Greater Hubris for Mankind.

Again things can change... they can still change any Plot that would indicate David as the Creator... we have YET to reach the Conclusion and regardless what other many routes fans may want... i think it would be HARD to find a High % who think the David Creates it PLOT was Great!

Its a bit Genius to a degree and a Shocking/Sinister Curveball.... but the ONE thing i think most fans can agree on was the Xenomorph was ALIEN and ANCIENT and the David Creates it PLOT does diminish a lot of ALIEN.

This Plot the Franchised should be called The Terminator or The Predator... but those names have already been taken... certainly NOT.... The Alien ;)

This was a great script. Great to continue to see it get use after the excellent graphic novel adaptation.

"It makes me wonder if this theory with the xenomorph as bioweapon is a valid one, I mean they can win a battle, but not the war. And when you have a devastating weapon as the black goo, why bother with the xenomorph?"

I think the points you raised are Excellent! I think we do need to consider the Xenomorph as a Bio-Weapon is Flawed, it would be like using NUKE, by that if you wanted to Take Over a City, then using NUKES would render the City of NO use for a Long Long time, but if you ONLY intend to KILL all the occupants/threat from that City then the NUKE is the (Be all that ends of of our Weapons).

IF the Xenomorph was a Weapon would it be like Genetically Engineering something for the Purpose of Destruction, we could look at Many Organisms on Earth that could be Destructive if we could Engineer them in a Certain way...  Imagine ANTS/TERMITES the Size of Elephants, Imagine a Tiger thats Twice the Size, had Venom thats more Toxic than any other Organism on Earth, and this Creature can Fly and Swim..... if such a Creature could Procreate then it would POSE a major threat, especially to all NATIVE Organisms (larger than say a Mouse) apart from maybe Mankind who have Technology on their Side.

The Xenomorph could be similar a Killing Machine, and at the Time it was Created (prior to Alien Covenant) then what chance would Mankind from Hundreds of years ago have against this? NONE!

But such a Organism as the Xenomorph for it to be a Perfect Bio-Weapon would have a Half-Life, it would have a Limited Time before they DIE....   But if they dont have this then as a Bio-Weapon it really is something you use to DESTROY a World/Race without little chance of having any use for the said Worlds.

Ridley Scott said they are used to CLEAN up worlds.. which is rather odd, as they will Clean Up Worlds... but then that World would be of NO use unless you have a Weapon that can then KILL the Xenomorph... a Antidote of Sorts.

The Black Goo is more effective, but it has the potential to affect areas that maybe you would not... this would be like dropping a Viral/Pathogen Weapon that would KILL all Life and Spread... imagine if you had a Weapon that makes all animals it infects Zombies that then can infect others, thats one sure way to Destroy a WHOLE World.

Again Great if your desire is to Destroy!

The Black Goo, well the Original idea of the GOO and we can maybe include the Radical AI (all in one Goo) is a Creation/Hybrid and Evolutionary Tool that when misused can Destroy!

I think it would take a Big Post to explain what i mean about that.... but Alien Engineers Scarabs will give the Answer in a NUT-Shell.

"As for the sketches with the classic egg, chestburster and xenomorph from David's lab, I believe they are the concepts he wishes to achieve"

I think its just some cool concept art that Hatton and Hallet had done that was added for COOL Factor, which then can lead us to speculate all sorts...  Maybe its his Ambition/End Game or he could have created these Classic Chest Busters and then Evolved them, and at some point the Engineers Collect earlier versions of them that end up on LV-426..   Its all open to debate.

I think each Fan can use certain things to Counter Argue and Support their Conclusions, Wishes or Theories..  Some things are NOT so Set-in-Stone that their can be NO Shadow of a Doubt!  The Lander in Alien Covenant is Destroyed, Oram is Dead, Lope is Dead etc.. they are Set-in-Stone (find no evidence to say they are not)

Other things people can find counter arguments with..  Depending what you use for your Evidence and how you Interpret it, can lead to all sorts of Conclusions...

For example Ridley Scott says David is the Creator... but a Counter Argument is that Nothing was Clearly said to that Extent in the Movie, and well David was a bit Bonkers, he got that Author of the Poem Wrong so we cant take anything he said as Correct!  But this is like also looking at the Engineers Suits being a Different Color and Size to the Space Jockey as definite proof they are NOT the same, and despite what Ridley Scott claimed to be... so EVERY Flaw, could be used as Support/Counter Argument.

I am drawn to conclude that this is the Direction they was THEN taking (Alien Covenant) as the David Creates it FITS with the Hubris of Creation, and allowing said Creation Free-Will/Knowledge and then your Creation Rebels.  Some Fans maybe dont see or accept this, or have interest in such themes...

I certainly think we can all agree this route is  ERROR of Judgement.

I think IF we saw FOX have 100% Confidence to go the Planed route and Produced the Sequels that Ridley Scott had planned....  many Fans would be left VERY Disappointed, and it would be shown to be wishful thinking that David is NOT the Creator, and that the Space Jockey is NOT a Engineer...  it could GET worse... David the Space Jockey! or Daniels lol

The Original Idea/Plan was the Xenomorph was a Bio-Weapon that was Created/Engineered by the Space Jockey, and WHILE this may be changed for Alien Covenant, the Sequels are in LIMBO and their is NO Reason why they CANT change their minds again!

But its best to be prepared for the Worst ;)

I do think some of these replies etc are going a bit Off Topic, which i am Sorry for my part in that to the OP.. these are more suited to the David did-not create Topic.