Comments (Page 194)

The felidae family

Certainly with the Engineers Advanced Genetic Engineering, and the Black Goo they could Create a kind of Hunting like Animal and so they could Combine the Best Traits of a Predatory Beast with a Touch of Black Goo.

If we look at what the Hammerpedes were as far as just Worms, and how Horrific the Neomorph is compared to a Human.

Can you imagine this done to a Tiger?

Okay next is the Ichthyosaurs 

"My thoughts: Prometheus should have been a sequel of Alien. Not a prequel. This would avoid confusion in multiple planets, signals and derelicts"

To a degree i think YES!

The Prequel with Alien Engineers did seem to indicate (but there was Conflicts) that the Events of that Movie Idea are what led to the Derelict, and so IF it was not for Dr Watts (Shaw) and Holloway and the Mission to that System in search of our Creators... then it seemed to indicate the Derelict would NOT have crashed on LV-426, it would have been Stuck in its Hanger with the Pilot in Cryo-Sleep.

So that Prequel would have also made the Derelict and Eggs as something that has NOT been there for Thousands of Years!

So Prometheus was a Smarter Move.... keeping it a Mystery but seemed to draw us to the Derelict being a Ancient Event...

But then we got Alien Covenant!

There were other ways to introduce the Xenomorph for a Fan Service, and Indicate what happened to the Derelict without having to set those Events as something Chronologically leading to ALIEN...

I think in HINDSIGHT.... they should have given the Fanboys a LV-223 based Prometheus Sequel called Epimetheus were they Investigate the Disappearance of the Prometheus, and uncover a Ship or Outpost with Eggs that contain a Variant of the Xenomorph.  That either reveals the Engineers had obtained Eggs from LV-426 or they had Created Variants of Eggs on LV-223.

They could have then gone and been FREE to make another Prometheus Sequel that would NOT have to Tie in to ALIEN and have the Freedom to Follow the Plans that Ridley Scott had intended prior to 2015

@Leto

I may have caused some confusion, i was not intending to be looking at Literally from the Movie Standpoint so i should have been a bit more clearer ;)

I understand that Prometheus was not Conceived back in 1979, so my purpose was to Wonder what would the Company had known and hidden by the Time we get to 2122, considering events of the Prequels.

So when looking at....

1) I think there have been some Good Answers, it was likely Dr Shaw used the Life-Boat as a Relay, and who knows how long it would take to Reach Earth, (2 Years?), and indeed the Prometheus was a Classified Mission only a Limited Number would be aware of it, and so those who are LEFT behind that are High Ranking in the Company may have NO Concerns to the Fate of the Prometheus, Weyland or Vickers as their Disappearance could PLAY to their Advantage.

I think SM makes a Great Point, we dont know HOW the Dust Storms may Effect any Communications from LV-223, we dont know also if the Transmitter becomes Damaged at some point and so WHEN and IF it stops Transmitting.

2) Partially covered above, i would suspect (but until we get a Sequel its not Conclusive) that in Light of Davids Message that the Company would Investigate LV-223 prior to ALIEN in 2122, if we also continue with the David as the Creator Plot, then i would suspect the Derelict would be either HEADING towards or LEAVING LV-223 before the Space Jockeys Fate Unfolds.

"3) a) "If the Derelict Signal had been Transmitted prior to 2094 then WHY had we not seen signs of the Prometheus being aware of this"

See point 1 - b."

I dont see the Relevance of how LV-426 changed to LV-223 had on the Plot, i think this was just a change to make the Derelict have Crashed on a near by Moon to where the Engineers had their Outpost/Experiments, rather than as the same Planet so i think as far as Alien Engineers Canon, then LV-426 would only be the Place that the Derelict would Eventually End Up on.

But as far as (3) it depends on the Plot Direction, as of Prometheus and Prior then we would have to Assume it was Likely the Signal had been Transmitting for a Long Time, likely it was not a Strong Signal, and so only being within the Vicinity would give a Clearer Indication.  The Weyland Viral Site and DVD Extras from Prometheus Era may NO-LONGER apply as Evidence.

IF we assume the Derelict was there prior to 2094, then maybe David and the Prometheus could have Detected it and their was a Priority to HIDE this from the other Crew which included Vickers and the Pilots/Captain.  And David would have seen getting to Paradise as a Priority.

The Company would then likely had detected the Space Jockey SOS and issued Special Order either as a Result of what David discovered on Paradise or a Company Mission to LV-223.

IF they instead stick with the David Creator Plot, then it could likely be that as of 2094 there is NO crashed Derelict on LV-426, and this Event would happen at some point between 2105-2122 and so the Company would Detect this Signal and Issue Special Order 937 in response to what they would do after they receive Davids Advent Message. (likely Investigate LV-223/Planet 4)

(4) I think i have Covered in the above......

So we are Stuck in Limbo really with Alien Covenant because now we are left with it being LIKELY there was NO Derelict on LV-426 prior to 2105 but then UNTIL the Prequels are Concluded there is NO 100% Proof that there was NO Derelict on LV-426 for a Long Long Time.

So its just added a Potential for there to BE or NOT BE any Ship and Eggs on LV-426 prior to Prometheus and UNTIL we get a Conclusion its all up in the AIR!

This all came about as a Consequence of giving us a Direct Prequel route to ALIEN after the events of Prometheus.

A Mistake in my Opinion.

This would be a bit of fun...

Shaw's signal:

AI is probably parsing all deep space messages...doubt very much a human is listening to these signals? The message isn't about incoming cargo or docking requests...so maybe the AI has orders to forward such messages to : Peter Weyland.

Example of an ancient ruined building which is barely recognizable.

Shaw would've transmitted her message from her suit via the lifeboat's transmitter.  Silica storms muck around with the comms.  Years of silica storms would likely wreck the transmitter eventually.

These beasts may start their own metamorphosis.

Warcats, maybe?

Felidaes are good hunters. You can run, but you can not hide.

Perhaps not this one...

...but this one.

There must be some sort of reason why xenomorphs do not like felidaes.

Wardogs  "Cave Canem"

War dogs were used by the Egyptians, Greeks, Persians, Sarmatians, Baganda, Alans, Slavs, Britons, and the Romans. The Molossus dog of the Molossia region of Epirus was the strongest known to the Romans, and was specifically trained for battle. Among the Greeks and Romans, dogs served most often as sentries or patrols, though they were sometimes taken into battle.

This is an introverted dog. Freundlich oder feindlich?

Engineers' dogs may have a slightly different look.

Infected Mushroom - Kazabubu (Link)

1) a) Alien was filmed before Prometheus. Even before Prometheus appeared in the plans.

b) Even in early Prometheus LV-223 was called as LV-426.

2) We do not know where and on which device Shaw left a warning. But we can assume that it was a human device. But it turned out to be weak, so no one noticed Shaw's signal.

3) a) "If the Derelict Signal had been Transmitted prior to 2094 then WHY had we not seen signs of the Prometheus being aware of this"

See point 1 - b.

b) "and WHY had it not been Investigated between 2094 and 2105 (or had it?)."

Well, as we know, excluding extras, Prometheus mission was a secret. Maybe no one in the company knew about signal and LV-223/Lv-426 after Weyland left.

4) a) See point 2.

b) Derelict's signals may also have a limited transmission area. Covenant ship could detect Platent-4 Derelict's signal only when it was nearby.

My thoughts: Prometheus should have been a sequel of Alien. Not a prequel. This would avoid confusion in multiple planets, signals and derelicts.

@NTFS

Certainly would be Interesting if during the Landing they Detect a Ancient Ruined Building.

All we can do is SPECULATE about Origae-6 and the ONLY way we would ever get to see this Place is depending IF we get a Continuation and then its a case of WHY/WHEN would David go to Origae-6 and IF he does-not then WHEN/WHY would the Company go to Origae-6

I think Consent and Love are very Interesting to Ponder.

In Context to the Apparent Creation of Mankind, a lot depends on the Path.... we can only Speculate about HOW LONG it would be after the Sacrificial Scene before we arrive at Cave Men on Earth, and how many Artificial Evolution's on the way to this had Happened.

Depending on what we look at we could Arrive at a different Conclusion, but we have to maybe try and NOT consider any Deleted Material. 

We could Speculate about the Consent of the Engineer, was he really so WILLING?  The Theatrical Cut shows us he seemed like he had a Sense of Purpose i never got a Sense of him being Concerned or Fearful, do we assume that he Fully was Aware of what would become of him?  Surely he would know about his Races Procedures and Rituals which RS seemed to indicate that he would have.

Certainly Mankind did-not Consent to our Creation, but then with a lot of Creation, the Creator does not ask its Creation for Consent.   Regarding Love then indeed Human Creation does sometimes come from Love, but sometimes its purely a Consequence of Lust.

So when such a Creation comes from NOT so Love in that way, even Totally as NOT from Love such as Rape, that does-not mean that the Creation would be UNLOVED.

I dont mean for this to be OFF-TOPIC.. i think it kind of is ON-TOPIC, as far as HOW would such things be Covered by Michelle's work.

So by that its like IF we was Created because the Engineers Could and there was NO LOVE, would that apply to the Effort spent in Visiting us and Teaching us, was there Care and Compassion for us in this? or was this something (Visits/Teachings) that was done purely for some other GAIN and not for our Benefit?

I think looking at the Xenomorph and the like is Interesting too as there is 100% No Love or Compassion Involved it is Primal, Survival.

This does-not rule out that some Consent is involved if we cover that some CHOOSE to Self-Sacrifice themselves to allow for such Horrors to Exist, however you would Consider that Most would not be Consenting to this, unless they was Part of some Ritualistic Cult.

I think another Interesting take would be how Michelle you would tackle the Relationship between David and Dr Shaw, would a Robot be Capable of more than Platonic Love for Dr Shaw and how would she React?  Would she Reciprocate that or Reject it?

Which ever way she would React... how would this Effect David?

Then we have the Situation that David and Dr Shaw can-not create Life together... not in the Traditional/Natural Sense.  Would David be trying to look at HOW he could HELP her to become a Mother? She could NOT conceive a Child... only a Horror from the Pathogen, but this at least Proved that this Pathogen Presented a Way for her to Create a None Human Fetus.

Could David be thinking of if there was way she could Conceive a Normal Fetus, would he Help her?

So yeah there are many Interesting things to Ponder, which if some or all are Covered by you Work Michelle i think it would be Interesting to see how you tackle those.

Good Luck with your Project ;)

Hopefully i never came across as Harsh or too Opinionated in my Previous Post, i apologize i had done.

I think the David as a Creator makes Sense on One Hand as it Fits the Themes at Play, but it Totally Removes everything that was ALIEN about the Xenomorph and having David create something a little Different would have FITTED with the Reasons for having him Apparently being the Creator, so having him as the Creator was Unnecessary.

There are more Problems than just that, in regards to what effected the route we are going, it seems that the HR Giger Estate was not a Fan of using a lot of HR Giger Aesthetic and so that was Toned Down even Further...

There was NOTHING that stood out as Bio-Mechanical as in the HR Giger Aesthetic in Prometheus, the Horrors from the Black Goo were more Organic, the Ship being more Synthetic/Mechanical.

Likewise with Alien Covenant we only really had the Juggernaught and Docking Scorpion like Ship that had a loose HR Giger Aesthetic, the Organisms we saw lacked that HR Giger Bio-Mechanical Aesthetic that the Classic Xenomorph and Sill from Species had.

So when you look at the Xenomorph in Alien Covenant in part it looks like a Work in Progress... which Ridley Scott had referred to it as...

If we DONT want it to be that route, then its a case of do we just go to LV-426 and show there are Eggs that have been there for Thousands of Years (How do you Prove the Date).  And then what of David and his Xenomorph and what went down on Planet 4?  We just Ignore that?

We could Speculate that David just tried to make a Knock Off and Failed and Decided to go and Mix the Xenomorph and Neomorph and pass it off as the Fruits of his Labor?

In Hindsight had FOX not considered some Complaints about Prometheus, and Stood by what Ridley Scott had intended then we would NOT have been in this MESS.

They simply could have given Fans Xenomorphs in a Different way i could think of a Number of Ways to go and give Direct Clues and Answers that would NEVER had lead to Alien Covenant.

Alien Covenant in Part Happened because of HOW do you do a Sequel to Prometheus and Introduce the Xenomorph and then THROW in Human Characters... that would also have to be about where David and Dr Shaw go!

Maybe all we can do now is try and think of some kind of Damage Limitation rather than to Ignore what we seen so far.

There could be some LIGHT in all of this, if they decide to go for the Xenomorph being the Source of the GOO, but then the Goo is something else that makes little Sense, unless they go to show us the Sacrificial Scene is NOT the way they Create Life at all.  Well i think that depends on Interpretation of the GOO.

I do have a FanBoys Pleasing Explanation that would Conflict the Sacrificial Scene leading to Mankind. I think some Fans would actually like that though if it RULED out the Engineers Created us.

I think what it ULTIMATELY comes down too is Fans think they know what is BEST but forget they dont really have 100% Control over what Direction they take the Franchise, sometimes they can Voice Frustration and FOX then Listen which is WHY we got Alien Covenant and its a case of BE CAREFUL what you wish for.....

But absolutely the David as the Creator Arc is surely a Unnecessary Move, ONE they should have Surely Considered would UPSET Fans...

But there would be NO WAY to please Fans anyway, IF the Sequel to Prometheus had NEVER given us the Answers or Xenomorphs then some would have NOT been happy... if it showed that a Queen was the Origins of the Xenomorph then NOT everyone would have been Happy.

Dr Shaw seems to sum it up the BEST..  "its what i choose to believe"

Then we are left with this quote "the trick is not minding that it hurts" but a Majority do mind that it Hurts.

We can offer some Explanations that David cant be Trusted or that Dr Shaw and Holloway are completely Incorrect and that in REALITY he (David) just found a Xenomorph Egg and Messed about with it, and our Space Jockey is Cyril Sneer from the Raccoons..

Sadly we have to Accept what we see, and then it can be Changed as long as it considers what we see before.

The Mural and Frescos dont show me a Xenomorph, but they are Ambiguous that anyone can make anything out of them, what it seems to show is that they had done Experiments on something that had lead to that Mural Deacon, and that the Black Goo seems to pass on Traits of this Organism that is Connected to the Xenomorph but there is NO evidence of HOW this is Connected, as far as what Process, which came First Etc.

There are Discrepancies to make its seem UNLIKELY that David could have Created the Xenomorph and these as far as On Screen are that the Derelict looked like it had been on LV-426 for Vastly Longer than 17 Years.

Davids creation also looks Aesthetically Different, but the same Argument is raised in the Differences between the Derelict/Juggernaught and Engineers/Space Jockey...    so Differences that could be just a OVERSIGHT... where we maybe have to either NOT MIND that it Hurts... or just CHOOSE to Believe what we want.

For the Record i think we are in a Pickle and the Move they with Alien Covenant was a Mistake!

But there are a Few things that we could use to Question the Integrity of what David had done, but then thats OK as long as we give a Good Explanation to what he had actually achieved... and WHY?

I think we could come up with some Explanations... but then maybe need to Respect what we saw in Alien Covenant and so i think to have David just discover a Live Egg or a Few Live Eggs and offer no other Explanations would be LAZY way out....

So i think we need to discover Davids Notes or hear it from him, that he had Discovered something that lead to his Creation that came from the Original Xenomorphs and have him indicate WHY he would bother with the other Experiments if he had already Discovered the Xenomorph Eggs that are in Perfect Condition.

Looking at the Movie i seem to think its Pushing us towards that David had either Began this Creation or he had Re-Engineered it but then from WHAT? as the Clues to me seem to point to using the Neomorph and Black Goo to then Cross-Breed Various Organisms...

For me it does-not ALONE conclude that those Eggs on the Derelict had Originated from David's Experiments, the Biggest Issue is that the Derelict looks like its been on LV-426 for a LONG LONG Time.

But if we dont pay Attention to Detail, then its a bit more Ambigious regarding Davids Experiments, it all comes down to the Production just NOT considering the other Movies and sticking stuff in because it looks COOL!

But i Understand this should NOT become another David did-not create the Xenomorph posts but more of WHAT can we do to Carry On and show that he could NOT have created or played a Roll in those Eggs on LV-426.

ULTIMATELY... it should have been Left a Mystery and NOT gone any route to show us Classic Xenomorphs or Indicate their Origins.

BigDave

If we go only by what we see in the film, we know that doctors Holloway and Shaw found identical star maps and a giant pointing towards a constellation.

Shaw chooses to believe it's an invitation and that the extraterrestrials created us. David has studied their "thesis" but what this contains we don't get to know.

So, in order to find the answer to why she believes they created us, we need to go beyond the movie . . .

A bit off-topic so, yes, there are many ways to make David not the creator of the xenomorph (Gavin has given a couple).

As for myself, I like the angle that David is delusional (one note is off). We see signs everywhere that this creature has been around for ages. I like to think that he isn't even close to the real xenomorph - the Deacon (on the mural) . . .

Regarding the Face Huggers, i think it would have been UNLIKELY that Ridley Scott would have gone the Camerons Queen, in that ONE or more of those Face Huggers would Produce a Queen Xenomorph. I think IF we did see much about those Face Huggers then it could be that RS would maybe have explored ALTERNATIVE forms of Procreation and so maybe that could be the Egg Morph?  Who knows.

We cant rule out that David could NOT go back to the Surface for some Black Goo, that would not be a Problem for him, Depending on HOW SURE he is that Walter is Completely Incapacitated...   maybe David could have Grabbed some Black Goo after his Conflict with Walter?

In Context to this Topic though, its about HOW can we go a route to Disprove that David could NOT have created those Eggs on the Derelict.

The its a case of maybe doing it in a way that DOES-NOT really Contradict what we have seen in Alien Covenant.

There are Differences with Davids Xenomorph that we could maybe look at...

The Chest Buster Stage is Different, and also the Gestation seems to be more Quicker.

To me the differences INDICATE maybe TWO reasons for the differences.

1) We are seeing a Re-engineering of the Classic Xenomorph that has taken some Neomorph Traits on, for example Faster Gestation and Fully Formed Chest Buster, that Mimics the Adult Form.

2) Something that had not YET been Evolved to what we have in ALIEN, so we have yet to see HOW the more Synthetic/Less Organic Aesthetic comes into PLAY.

And so i think the Best Solution has to be either as..

1) Where we get some Clues to David obtaining a Xenomorph to Re-Engineer which i just cant see the Engineers being Foolish Enough to Keep Such a Deadly Organism in some kind of ZOO... but maybe a somewhat Desiccated One in a Museum that he could EXTRACT DNA from could be a way to GO!

So that the Derelict Eggs are KEPT as Ancient and after the Company does-not Manage to Obtain the more Evolved Version of Davids, they realize that IF he could Re-Engineer it from a Classic Xenomorph Egg, and IF there are Thousands on LV-426 then they could attempt to Obtain these and Re-Engineer them too.

2) The Engineers or beings above them will Return to see David and HOW much Superior he is to Planet 4 Engineers and Humans, and he is NOT Organic.... and they also see how his Xenomorph is more Superior to the Experiments conducted on LV-223 and Horrors that Created.

So these Beings/Engineers see Great Potential and they make a Amalgamation of David/Walter and his Xenomorph to then get us to the Eggs on the Derelict.

So what we have then is either that David eventually reaches his Z by Experiments that Involved the Engineers A and his Experiments with other Life to make a Hybrid.

Or that the Engineers/Other beings take Davids work which is J-K which he had used the Engineers A-I to then Evolve this Process R-Z thus making David the Middle Man only.

We could have other Solutions that would appease the Fan Boys that would then Contradict or Trash what the Prequels set out..... such as a Discovery in the Depths of the Cathedral of a Egg Laying Xenomorph Queen... which then we would ask... WHY would David go through so much Effort?

'2000 colonists and the Space Jockey carrying the thousands of eggs'

Yeah...I'm wondering what David will do with only two facehugger embryos? (One is a queen? can't believe RS would do that. ) If he'd also vomited up an ampule of Goo.....then I'd feel better about him replicating eggs...as it is now, he's probably going to have to find another Goo source?

'I would say this would be a Plausible way to Introduce that he had OBTAINED a Egg without Contradictions or Complications.'

I like that idea. start Covenant 2 with Walter's rescue and have him fill in the planet 4 details and what he's learned?

Opening shot:

Walter (sitting) playing a flute in the plaza...he Looks up to see a vessel landing(space marines)

Spend a bit of time explaining the situation, maybe tour of the city/spooky underground burial chambers...etc........till an alien(Engineers?) probe shows up and scans them....Marines shoot it down. Walter suggests they hasten their departure.

"How did Shaw know or suspect this beforehand by the way"

it would be their Assumptions based of the more than Coincidental Archeological Discovers, that when they discover the Clues Lead to a Star System where they discover a Organism who Share our DNA, then they believe this has PROVED their Thesis as Correct.

But there is NOTHING that is 100% to show they are Correct, as you could throw in a Curve-ball that Mankind had Created the Engineers the Sacrificial Scene then a Curve-ball these Sub-Creations use the Black Goo to NOT seed their DNA but to Seed the Pathogen on Worlds.

Because its not CONCRETE from the Movies and so the above could be ADDED that would NOT really Contradict what we are shown in the Prequels.  Things can be CHANGED and any contradictions could be ignored as OVERSIGHT.

But the indication (until Change) is that Dr Shaw and Holloway had discovered our Creators.

Regarding the Changes to show that David could NOT have created the Xenomorph they could go that route, and dispute clues to suggest otherwise... they could put Davids Notes and Clues to what he was doing as just OVERSIGHT.

But you could change it AGAIN.... but you maybe have to then (or NOT) show us WHY by Coincidence that David has something VERY Similar!

So maybe you have to give a GOOD REASON for WHY would David have something so Similar! Unless you just use the LAZY excuse of Oversight!

Ridley Scott said the Cathedral is where the Engineers would STORE their Knowledge and so likely History too.

This BUILDING is Extremely Large and so if it is a Place to Store Knowledge and maybe History then what do we have like that on Earth?

A Library?  YES!

But also Museums so maybe this could give us a way to have them Store some Long Dead, Mummified Organisms? 

As i would find it VERY Stupid for them to STORE a Deadly Egg in the City, let alone this Building, but maybe a Petrified, Desiccated one for SHOW like  Museum piece would sound Plausible?

Then it could be Revealed that David had Re-Engineered this (use the Goo to extract DNA) to then Merge with the Neomorph and other Experiments... thus Creating a Hybrid.

I would say this would be a Plausible way to Introduce that he had OBTAINED a Egg without Contradictions or Complications.

I think the whole Subject such as I think the whole Subject such as WHO did or did NOT create the Xenomorph the same as WHO the Space Jockey is/was..... really just comes down to Dr Shaws Qoute "its what i choose to believe"

I think when looking at those Questions we have the Following to Consider.

*Original Idea/Concept.... which is something that has Changed/Evolved and so is NO LONGER a Valid Point but something that they could TURN BACK too.

*Bonus Material/Virals... again as things CHANGE these can be removed from being Canon.

*Drafts of the Movies....  again things CHANGE from the Draft too the Shooting of a Movie.

*Deleted/Extended Scenes.... these again can be removed for Various Reasons and their Content sometimes should NOT be considered Definite Evidence.

*Production/Cast Comments... these Tend to be more Accurate only as far as Present at the Time they was made, and so things can CHANGE that would NOT support earlier comments or Plans by Directors etc.

So its ONLY really the Theatrical Movies that remain the SOLID FORM of Clues, but also Sequels can Contradict some Elements of earlier Movies, but these Changes should be Considered the CURRENT Canon and Clues.

For me looking at this then i get the Impression that David is the CREATOR of the Xenomorph even though that may BUG the Fans...

But we have had NO SPOON FED and Water Tight Case, and there are Contradictions but these could all be just OVERSIGHT....

Ultimately until we see those Eggs get on the Derelict and we are shown CONCRETE Proof that these Eggs originate from David then there is always room for CHANGE.

IMO we don't have any hard evidence so far that David or the Engineers created the xenomorph. We can go that route, but all the other options are open. At some point I said that we can draw a parallel between the Covenat carrying the 2000 colonists and the Space Jockey carrying the thousands of eggs in a sense that the Space Jockey race was hired by the xenomorph race to spread their seeds into the Universe. Or to find a new home for them, like the colonists from Earth did in Alien Covenant. We can still say that the Space Jockey race and the Enginners race are different. It will all depend on the producers.

Daniels or Tennessee could possibly go by the by, in the same way that Dr. Shaw was virtually rubbed out of Covenant. But a direct follow-on to Covenant would surely require the presence of David.

Fassbender has high regard for Ridley Scott, and I'm sure he'd jump at the chance to play David again. As Big Dave says, he probably has time to squeeze in a movie or two. I certainly hope so.

@Michelle, I liked him very much in the oddball movie 'Frank'. Utterly bonkers but enjoyable. 'The Snowman', on the other hand, was a recent and terribly conceived movie of his.

In terms of what we'll see next (and it's surely a matter of when, not if) it would only be a guessing game :(

Planet 4

So... do we think The Engineers hid their planet with technology? And with the Engineers dead,  the tech has failed(or David switched it off)...A nice juicy green Earth type just shows up on their latest search!("..wasn't there last year..").....W Y might have a colony ship or a probe on the way already. 

LV-426

"...ghost-holograph recording depicting the Space Jockeys fate."

Yes! That would be cool.

But I'd probably leave LV-426 alone....Unless it's the source of Chemical A0-3959X.91 – 15.

@ BigDave,

In the OP I wanted to keep each suggestion vague so as to gauge peoples interpretations rather than bombard people with my own. But now that you have offered yours I will do so in kind...

LV-426

I would actually advise against returning there, as I view it akin to a well that has been mined too many times. Instead I imagine LV-426 could be mentioned in a flashback or memory whereby we again see David on the Prometheus en-route to LV-223 and a display showing LV-223 and LV-426, with some sort of identifier symbolizing the signal being sent from there.

Planet 4

There are actually a few ways in which Davids deception could be made apparent using Planet 4. One way would be the discovery of the remains of Engineer transcripts that David has attempted to burn and destroy that clearly show he copied their work. Another way would be to discover an egg hidden somewhere in the Engineer city, and another way would be to discover some Engineer mural or pictograph showing the Alien.

David

David revealing his deception could be the entire point of the deception. In the advent message, David boasted to Weyland-Yutani that he had created the perfect organism and that he would unleash it upon them. The intended result would be for Weyland-Yutani to track down David and either destroy him or take from him what he has claimed to create, leading Weyland-Yutani on a wild goose chase away from LV-426 where the real, original threat lies. But with Alien it would appear, should this avenue be pursued narratively, that Davids ruse did not work and that Weyland-Yutani learned of what was on LV-426.

Space Jockey

We could see, as I laid out in the OP how the derelict came to be on LV-426, or we could see a ghost-holograph recording depicting the Space Jockeys fate. Another way would be to show how the Space Jockey came to have eggs in its lower decks, which could be revealed to have come about in a way not yet postulated.

@ Monster Zero,

I like to think of the Alien franchise in three parts, Alien, Aliens and its sequels/crossovers which focused on the Queen, and the prequels that focused on the Engineers.

Additionally, there is no on-screen evidence that Ann and Russ Jorden discovered the "bug" Aliens from the same location (the egg silo) that Kane discovered, and it could be that they discovered a separate cache of eggs which had been modified to include a Queen, while the eggs in the silo could be an unmodified variant of the Alien.

As for the black goo could be the franchises savior, if used in the right way.

Michelle

That’s very kind of you. Looking forward to it!

About consent. Has anyone agreed to be born? Can we be sure that most people have been born out of love? Of course, the consent could refer to sexual agreement and the facehugging equal to rape. Furthermore, the birth of a xenomorph (through hosting) is violent, but not too dissimilar to human births, is it? Pain and violence is part of creation?

Anyway, “The Seven Worlds” is beautifully done.

BigDave

ALIEN (The Prequel) was actually very funny. :D

Well, it's mankind's longest journey so far in space and we end up finding extraterrestrials looking just like us. Furthermore, they created us.

How did Shaw know or suspect this beforehand by the way (that they engineered us)?

 "Alien was synonymous with Lovecraftian terror"

To me...That went out the window with ALIENS.   That movie made it painfully obvious Xenomorphs are space bugs, hatched like ordinary insects.

Far as I'm concerned David(humanity) creating a special space bug really doesn't bother me. Man creating Chemical/biological/nuclear warfare is much worse. (I'll take on a xeno before I step into a room filled with blister agent.)

Black goo is still very cosmic horror IMHO and I'd like to know where it comes from. 

@Gavin

If i could go back to the things you indicated in the OT.

LV-426

Indeed any clues about the Signal and being Ancient would Discredit the David Created it Arc.

I think Fans were Disappointed with Prometheus and the lack of Clues or Xenomorph like Attacks... a Hamerpede Face Rape, the Toxic Avenger Fifield, and a Postal Engineer simply would not be as Pleasing for Most.

I dont think we need to go to LV-426, but i do think that giving us a Movie that goes to LV-223 again, that would be more ALIENY and encounter a Organism that is Birthed from Eggs, even if this Organism is NOT the same as a Xenomorph but is somewhat just as close as the Xenomorph of Davids, as in we get something that is NOT quite as similar as the Xenomorph in Alien Covenant or Alien, but something that has that more Bio-Mechanical Aesthetic that the ALIEN had.

So you can keep it a bit Ambiguous but allow it to offer something that makes the Plot of Alien Covenant as being NOT Clear Cut and Dry.

Planet 4

This is more Tricky, so the only way to maybe Discredit David here would be a Mission to Planet 4 and recover some of his Notes, where extra information is Found Regarding how he Synthesized some Organism or the Pathogen to a Pure Form close to what the Engineers had Obtained their Parasitic Pathogen from, but it could NOT Yield Results from a Engineer.

So he had No Choice but to use this on Dr Shaw and the Results where Fruitful but he just could not Quite get to Mass Produce them, without Merging it with the Neomorph and then he would use this on Dr Shaws Egg Cells to obtain his Xenomorph

David

we could have him Explain in a Sequel a similar Process to what i described above.

Space Jockey

I think its maybe not Necessary to go this route, as in a way other clues could be given, but maybe a Mission to LV-426 where they Encounter the Derelict and Discover someone has been here before them, and find Clues that Indicate that DAVID had caused the Acid Hole to go down and Obtain a Specimen, so they Find Some Clues to indicate to the viewer that David came here while Dr Shaw was in Cryo-sleep and he must have left with a EGG.

Could David be revealed to had Activated the SOS in the Year 2094

I think certainly its Interesting to Ponder if David would be Searching for  a Purpose, and looking at our Purpose, he did seem Offended by the Suggestion that he was Created because we could....

So they Both could have Shared a Journey that could have gone in many ways, but what we Ended Up with was something that Tossed that Potential in the BIN!

The Seven Worlds Hennessy Advert was interesting and it also got me thinking was there some subtle hints in this to what he had Intended with the Prequels?

Could it be that he had Conceived that there is a possibility he MAY-NOT get to Tell the Story he wanted to, and so he Incorporates some ideas into other Projects... like The Seven Worlds.

It would be interesting to wonder how much of Raised by Wolves would borrow from his Alien Awakening too.

Prometheus Certainly had a lot of Potential, i do worry we would NEVER see anything that connects to it anymore...

So its always Interesting to see HOW others would have taken the Ball that was Dropped with Alien Covenant and see how they Run with it.

So i Wish you all the Best with your Prometheus : Theodicy

Wish him luck, with Racing its a Dangerous Sport (can be) maybe Safer than taking up Flying Planes as a Past Time (Harrison Ford)

I dont think it should effect his Acting as he would likely still take Jobs that appeal to him, but i think Regarding a Sequel to Alien Covenant there are Bigger Issues that are Holding Back a Sequel at Present.

I think its maybe likely we would see another ALIEN Movie at some point but is that in 5 years, 10 years? and would it be a Continuation of the Plot/Path of the Prequels?

You have to wonder if your a Cast Member of the Previous Movie and so say Fassender or Waterston then how much HOPE do they have of EVER reprising their Roles?

Michael's essential problem is over exposure. My favourite performance is Edwin Epps in "12 years a slave" , followed closely by "The Light Between Oceans." He reminds me of Rachel Weisz who is in the latter. Both of them are very good at projecting sociopathy. You know they are playing with their characters but without the stereotypical obviousness which is what makes AC tosh. In Steve Jobs he was profoundly unlikeable, like the person he played , modern driven tech man monster.

I really liked him in Macbeth where he was a victim of his wife's ambition, and could not find his way out.  

I think he needs a break and then chose much more carefully.       

In the Furious Gods Charlize and Guy spoke very highly of him. He can get up to speed very quickly (excuse the pun). He has the technique but needs to chose better.But if you need the cheque to pay the bills who doesn't end up doing jobs that are less than ideal.  

@chli

Out of politeness just to say I have not forgotten your request. 

After my experience with the "Furious Gods" I was inspired to enhance (not change) my descriptions of both the place and characters that David and Elizabeth meet and come into. Inevitably I found myself improving the text most often simplifying to make the reading more dynamic and communicative. When I write it tends to be backwards with the question then the answer, whereas for a completed narrative you simply need to offer the action of the narrative rather than explain it. 

However I have been reading some essays written collectively about Shelley's work and Scotts work and realise that sub consciously I had included within the narrative the importance of consent but hadn't focused on it. Unlike her father Elizabeth she ask questions, she does not offer blind obedience she personifies Miltonic Adam. David was created for his creators benefit and then upgraded by his creator eight times so consent or lack of it becomes very important to David.

Did the Engineers of this story consider consent and why did the  creatures of the Moon use hosting as a natural choice of sub creation. So the former is driven by Shelley and the latter by Scott.

It ties in with "the accident" the creature which hosts without consent so that footprint is in the Mutagen. (The Mutagen=Creature). Incidentally if the movie was made on the basis that the Mutagen(gloop)= Creature then the Mutagen thematically has to involve a Parasite it cannot be the original creation tool alone. In the sub created world that makes no sense.   

The other issue is the Dick/Bladerunner one, Do Androids dream.....   

If David finds himself in front of something which is capable of/has harnessed the power of creation what would his search for meaning include. In the movie he interrogates Elizabeths dreams, that cannot only have important consequences for their continued connection but for him and there is a story beat which it fits naturally with which I have rewritten. 

In closing I must stress the mode of the overall piece is quite definitely much more aligned with Lindelof's vision for P2 that it would "most likely" not contain any references to the things we associate with ALIEN. It would be a separate child moving narratively alongside and away from ALIEN. 

The issue of Giger/Lovecraftian is handled as Scott handles it in the "Furious Gods" he wanted a vision of a world before these things come into it older. if the Moon represents Paradise Lost then the dysfunctional interrupted quality of Giger is perfect but the original vision was pure which as you know was the original brief to the artists who wanted to sneak in Giger!

Earlier this year Scott offered the overall Prometheus story in the context of seven worlds a very sophisticated advertising vehicle for Hennessy.

Creation

Archaeological Discovery

The Ritual

Artificial Sub creation

Destruction

Aftermath

Religious seeking for the truth

Rebirth

Revelation  

It is not so much the themes echoes mine (I wrote my story in 2018) but as others have noted the visual symbolism offered is aligned with mine and if you view it, it is not dysfunctional at all. What you see is the world that David and Elizabeth come into, so the horrific truths for mankind are played out in a seaming Paradise which makes the pill that much more bitter and particularly if you can not accept the notion we might be a footnote.    

On a Serious Note!

We are in a Pickle....

Maybe the only Options really would be a REBOOT, or to Introduce another Species above the Engineers and make them more ALIEN and maybe we have to Write Off the Engineers and Xenomorph as NOT being the Most ALIEN thing to introduce/explore.

1) Where did the Engineers get their Technology From?

2) Where did the Black Goo come from and WHY does it seem to Create Organisms with Parasitic Traits and Aesthetic of the Deacon, Neomorph and Xenomorph.

And so Alien indicated the Space Jockey and Xenomorph, as (1) and (2) maybe we need to introduce something else for those instead of the Engineers and Xenomorph?

Or Maybe the Answer is to Combine 1+2 and Introduce the STARBEAST?

Could we find some Amalgamation of these to come up with something a Bit Different, be it a New Species and New Weapon that where BOTH... Stolen, Re-Engineered or Given but Miss-used by the Engineers?

Can a Introduction of New Things, or Few Changed really RESCUE the Prequels?

Or would we need a Reboot?

so in Regards to the OT... i agree having David as the Creator was a Mistake, and Alien Covenant has taken the Engineers/Space Jockey Species to something that is NOT as ALIEN or Lovecraftian as it appeared before the Prequels.

Certainly some Nice Examples.

I think a Major Problem with Exploring the Engineers with Weapons would be HOW and WHO and WHERE do they Conflict with Humans... and would we stand ANY chance?

So they could be a little Over Powering...

But then we Survived the Predators, but ALAS not a Full Scale Attack had been made by them.... but i GUESS if we can Survive Independence Day and War of the Worlds then there is HOPE ;)

With my Previous Post out of the way, lets look at the Evolution and HOW maybe these could have been Explored and Problems they Raised.

1) The Original Idea was a Tale about a Giant Alien Species (not Human like at all) who had Encountered a Pyramid on a Alien World, and Curiosity Killed the Cat... this Species had came across the Long Lost Remnants of a Ancient Species who had a Parasitic Life-Cycle.  After Falling Foul to the Spore/Egg stage of this Species the Giant Exploring Alien Species Survivor had Etched a Warning to Warn others of this Place, before they would Succumb to the Starbeast.

This O'Bannon's idea could have been Continued, but a lot had changed by the Time we got to ALIEN and so the only way this could have been Explored would just be a RE-HASH of Alien!  Well to a degree..   Because ALIEN had changed from Starbeast.....  what we had NOW is NOT a case of a Giant Species had Stumbled on these Eggs, what we have is a Connection!  The Aesthetic was Shared especially with the Ship and Xenomorph and so the Options would have been.

* Giant Alien Species (Space Jockey) discover the Ship and Cargo, and decide to Hijack them, where they Conveniently can Infuse with the Chair and are the Right Size.... well that would be SILLY!  But ALAS.. David managed to FLY a Ship ;)

* Giant Alien Species (Space Jockey) have either Created, or Re-Engineered those Eggs and the Derelict Technology for some Purpose.. likely as a Weapon... but against WHO?

* Giant Alien Species (Space Jockey) form some Symbiotic Relationship with the Xenomorph this is either Mutual or some Other Species would USE the Space Jockey for performing this Task... but to WHAT Benefit to the Space Jockey? is he merely a Slave?

2) As we Evolve it had been indicated that the Space Jockey was a Race who had Created the Xenomorphs as a Bio-Weapon..... THIS is where we really left off before the Prequels but could have explored Elements of (1).

What you then have is WHO had they intended this Weapon for, WHAT Conflict are they involved in?

Then its HOW do you introduce the Humans, and so WHY and HOW do a group of Humans End up at a Place that would give Answers to WHO the Space Jockey are, what was their Agenda and Purpose for those Eggs and WHERE those Eggs came from.

Then its HOW do you have them Interact?  Do we get Subtitles between the Space Jockey Aliens?  Do they have a way to Communicate with Humans? Or do we never see any Communication with Humans and we never get any Understanding of what the Space Jockey would be saying to Each Other.

What you have then is Basically WAR OF THE WORLDS.. where instead of THEY come to Earth, instead Human Space Explorers would Stumble Upon a Place where they ARE!

Once we have these ALIENS shown, and we know about the Eggs... its HOW do you Continue... do we explore more about the Space Jockey?  And HOW? Do we Forget about them and its back to EGGS and Chest Busting?

Its these kinds of Issues that made them come up with the Chariots of the Gods like Plot, which came at the Expensive of Sacrificing some of that Lovecratian Horror.

@Gavin

I feel here lies the Major Problem with the Franchise, there was that MYSTERY and it should have been Kept as Such!

Because what we have is a Evolving Franchise, each Movie becomes Divisive, there are some who think that Cameron had Ruined the Franchise in how the Xenomorph was Expanded, and yet this route is what made the Franchise more Recognizable.

We had 4 Movies, it has been a LONG time since the Last some 12 Years before it was a case of HOW do you go back to the Franchise, which we have seen the Xenomorph over and over, in Various Medium be it Games, Comics, Novels, the Movies and AVP's, so its a case of WHERE do you go NEXT?

Nobody had ever EXPLAINED or Explored the Xenomorph Origins and WHO the Space Jockey was.....  

And here lies the PROBLEM.... because how ever you Answer those Questions, you are likely to NOT please every Fan....  Every Fan will have what they feel is the Right Way to have done this and that, every Fan could Interpret things differently.

Its a CASE of WHO really should Decide?  The Fans? do we take a POLL about what we want?  Sadly thats NOT how a Movie is made, this kind of Back Lash can Effect a Sequel though...

Should Dan O'Bannon had been Consulted and his Vision something to have looked at?  Sadly he Passed Away during the Period of when they was working on the Story for a Prequel.

Should Ridley Scott had been given more Control, as he was the First Director of the First Movie, and every other Movie Continued with a Different Director, what kind of Vision would RS have?  Seemed if he had made a ALIEN 2 it would have been Very Different.

Then we have David Giler and Walter Hill who also had a lot of Influence on the Franchise (more than most) do we look at what they would want to do for a Prequel?

Should HR Giger had been given more Control, as he had some pretty much Very Lovecraftian Ideas/Take on the Franchise?

Or should it be the Fans? This is just a Problem as we would all have Different Ideas of how we would Proceed, and you will not get a Fan Inspired Direction that would Please all the Fans...

Ultimately it would be FOX who would have the Most Say!

A Prequel is always something of a Poisoned Chalice a Origins Story can always Disappoint as much as it could Please.  Especially if you are going to be doing something that Directly Connects because you are ALWAYS going to know how this ENDS...  it is Lucky that ALIEN is something that there is a lot of Mystery that is not going to be something we know Happens... but with such a Mystery you have the Chance that you will NEVER do it Justice.

I Personally think Prometheus had opened up a Avenue for the Franchise, and things Could have got more ALIEN in a Sequel and by that i dont mean Xenomorphs because ONCE you cover them again, and their Origins its whats NEXT?  You can come up with a Origin that can Expand and be Interesting, but in regards to ONCE you know HOW/WHERE/WHY there are those Eggs, then its what do you do NEXT?  Because the way the Xenomorph seems to be in the Franchise we have either a Invasive Parasitic Organism that had been Discovered and Saw the Potential to use as a Weapon (Same Agenda the Company had) or it is a Engineered or Re-Engineered Organism that is USEFUL as a Weapon due to its Invasive Parasitic Nature.

So its more a case of WHY as far as WHO would Create or Contemplate using such a Horrific Beast and their Motives that is the WAY to give us more and Expand the Franchise past Eggs, Queens and Ripley.

So it was the SPACE JOCKEY that is how we expand the Franchise, WHO was he, WHERE was he from, WHERE was he going? WHY that Cargo, WHERE did those Eggs come from? and HOW they came to be?

And this is the MYSTERY that in Hindsight should have remained as it was.....  but then its WHAT do you do with the Franchise if your NEVER going to touch upon those Questions?

I Felt Prometheus was a Decent Way Forwards... but there was a Few Things it should have done differently, (some Alien Organisms killing Folk, a little more clues to HOW a Xenomorph could come to be) and Taller Engineers.

I will Close this Part by saying that what Potential was Shown, had been Thrown Away in General with the Direction that Alien Covenant had taken!

There are Logistical and Convenient Choices made, that also had to be made with Prometheus because of the Simple Reason..... HOW do you have Human Characters pushed into this Cosmic Horror?

The the Back Bone Plots for Prometheus and Alien Covenant were BORN! just they could have done things differently if they had CLEVER Writers.... but ALAS!

@ MonsterZero,

In all honesty, I think that would make for a better ending. Whereby after being defeated by the Engineers David finds himself alone with a lone egg. Then, as he strokes it and smiles contemplating how clever he was to keep this egg from the Engineers the egg opens and in a moment David realizes the Engineers have made him flesh and that he has lost.

Actually...it would be cool for Covenant 2 to open with David getting facehugged! Then calmly removing the facehugger(or letting it leave after awhile)....then show David vomiting the xeno placenta and examining it.        Could have multiple scenes of David letting the facehugger impregnate him. Rinse and repeat.