Comments (Page 609)

Well the Lines and Writing on some of the Head Statues have to have some importance.

We have to look at Earth Cultures for similar things, in which some tribes Marking (Scars) and Tattoos on the Face are used to mean a number of things, depending on the Culture/Tribe but they are all to Symbolism the Importance of Ritual, for some they are a sign of coming of Age, or a Right of Passage, some they are to Ward off Evil and Offer Protection but i am not sure this fits with what we see in Prometheus/Alien Covenant.

They could be to mark beings of higher Importance, looking at the whole purpose in Prometheus/Alien Covenant it appears to be a reminder to those who encounter these Statues about the Purpose of Origin, Sacrifice and so to show case the Bravery/Sacrifice and Role of these beings in the Creation/Evolution of their kind.

As far as the whole GOD/Jesus and Father/Son i think we need to not read too much into One Culture, but it is important to consider the relationship of the Sacrificial Scene.

From Alien Engineers, the idea was there was this Ancient Race who have Evolved and Engineered themselves past the need to Procreate, and are able to Live very Long Lives, they are not IMMORTAL but due to Genetic Engineering they indeed have Vastly Greater Life Expectancy and do not (i assume) suffer from many Diseases and Disorders that can have a Drastic Effect on the Life Expectancy of a Human.

Doing this came at a Cost, as it meant the Race had then lost the Ability to Procreate, as there was less need for it. Such is the Cruel Nature of Evolution, and Price.

So the Sacrificial Scene was a attempt for this Race to Rectify this, having lost the ability to Procreate they had to come up with more inventive ways to Seed/Create Life.

This changed a bit with Prometheus, and Ridley Scott said these beings could create life in other ways, and the Sacrificial Scene was just the way they chose to do it.

so its all pretty open to debate really, as far as the whole Purpose of Creation etc, as we can clearly see those beings on Planet 4 have Females.. but the Question is is this via the Sacrificial Scene, and so if we go back to the time of the Sacrificial Scene, was there any Females on Paradise?

Who knows.. my personal theory is they attempted to use the Sacrificial Scene to eventually allow for the creation of Females so they then can breed with these and so Break the Curse of not being able to Procreate.

So i think Child Birth and Females are very important to the Engineers, and this could explain why those beings on Paradise look a bit different, they are in effect Hybrids.

This also i think explains why the Engineers on LV-223 held the Life-Cycle of the Xenomorph Related Organisms in High Regard, as it was another way these beings could Carry and Give Birth to New Life.... a Perverted Pregnancy of sorts.

Indeed Kethol...

i came across those in the draft too, i had always pondered what purpose the Cathedral Dome Device was when we saw the Trailers, to me i wondered if it was some kind of Safety Device that Activated to Prevent the Black Goo infection and resulted in those bodies looking the way they did...

And also would explain maybe the crashing of the Juggernaught.

But alas after the movie was out it appeared this may not have been the case and with the draft and comments by Hatton/Hallet etc then its clear this is not the case.

As far as Solar Power goes we can see a number of other objects in the city that are  Reflective and Gold and so i would assume there are a number of these over the City, but that does not mean the Central Cathedral cant be some kind of Power Station.

So when having to ignore the effects of those Burnt like Bodies being caused by a Safety Device (unless the Scorpion Docking Ship activated something).   Then we have to accept the Urns either are activated differently and so the effects are different or coming into contact with the Protective Shield changed the effects of the Bombardment.

@Cerulean Blue

The Tentacle like things, i would have to assume (until September the 18th) that this is the Black Goo Replicating itself inside the Hosts and then escaping from the Host and Forming together to then seek out another Target.

It appears the Black Goo Nano Particles (well just how its made up) seems to be able to move/swarm together to create what look like Shapes...  The Motes did the same when Ledwood Stood on the Spore,  they seemed to look like having some kind of Shape as it appeared to swim through the air and zone in onto its Target.

Some there is some kind of Intelligent/Instinctive design in how the Bio-Weapon seems to Swarm together, and i think this is why we see those Shapes.

Very similar to how the Water is Manipulated to Form Shapes in the movie The Abyss

Its still all pretty confusing to some due to the way AC handled the Black Goo, because Prometheus and if we also look at Alien Engineers Draft would have gave us these Options.

1) Engineers are mutated and evolve into Hybrid Organisms.

*which latter may cause the Engineers to break down/turn into Black Liquid/Nothing.

2) The Engineers simply start to break down and turn into Black Liquid/Nothing.

3) The Engineers start to Produce Tiny Worm-like Organisms that then maybe consume the Engineers to Black Liquid/Nothing.

It appears Alien Covenant has simply added that the Black Goo under certain circumstances just appears to infect a Targets DNA and instead of breaking down their DNA or Mutating it, the Black Goo simply Atomizes the Molecules turning them into some kind of Crystalline/Siliconized solid molecules.

Yet it also replicates itself inside and then escapes/leaves the infected Hosts Body.

So a different effect to what Prometheus showed us..  I can only assume the Neomorphs and related infected Life are the result of maybe some of the Replicated Black Goo from the Targets ending up infecting the Planet.

Or more likely some Urns leaking after the Crash and contaminating the Water, which in turn contaminated growing Mold/Fungi that grew near by the Water Stream running down the Mountain and under the Juggernaught.

Where there is Moss/Algae by the side of the areas this water runs trough, we end up with Infected Black Goo Mold/Fungi which then gives rise to the Spore Sacks.

I would assume Davids other experiments also included using the Substance stored within the Glass Vials within the Urns too.

@ Sothoth, again why are you directing that question at me? I never said there were any insects in the bombing scene.

You are most welcome drucea.

The "spokes" may just be dressing the mountain after cutting out a scoop of it to build the temple and courtyard complex. They could be avalanche control after harvesting so much rock from the bottom of the slope.

So this is how we know what happened on LV-223, right?  Not chest-bursters & Xenomorphs, just the exploding black goo?

I've been reading all your debate, guys, very interesting one. 

Concerning the black goo bombing: I do think that it being "drops of black goo" raining down on the Engineers would make much more sense, BUT - when I watch the scene, it seems clear to me that it's something more like an insectoid form or whatever, kind of flying towards that poor bald citizens. I say that not only because of the way the black goo behaves towards them, but also because of the reaction of the Engineers, the way they try to "take it off" of them, the way they run... 

@Daliens - "How can you alter an organic life form to become biomechanical?"

Most organic life forms are already biomechanical. What Hox said is correct. "Biomechanical" is just a term used to describe Giger's art style. In the real world, the study of functions and structures of biological systems that use 'mechanics' is called "biomechanics". The mechanics part of the term refers to motion and forces on parts of biological objects.

Say you wanted to study how a human elbow joint works with the muscles and ligaments that allow it to move. That's biomechanics. If you look at a lot of David's drawings and notes, in many instances he was studying the biomechanics of those organisms.

@Joylott - I consider what is on the short "The Advent" to be canon, but in there David mentions that the pathogen is a form of radical AI, which would lead some to believe it is DNA mixed with something artificial."

He also says it is "primordial ooze", ripe with advanced "nano particles", operating off on an algorithm based on "evolutionary computing". Those are all real world terms. Primordial ooze is organic compounds and amino acids. Nanoparticles are used in genome editing and gene recombination to re-write DNA. Evolutionary computing uses algorithms based on biological evolution to organize amino acid sequences and protein structures in DNA in an intelligent, pre-determined way.

The pathogen can intelligently adapt to resistance to these DNA coding algorithms and write new algorithms insanely fast. Radical. Since it was created artificially by the Engineers (we assume) I think David just sees it as both 'artificial' and 'intelligent'.

That's my take on it anyway. It seems the writers have actually thought things through and are not just pulling sciency terms off the internet to make it sound like they do.

@drucea

Do you have photo evidence of those tendrils being still on the engineer corpses after they died? If so, I will admit you're right.

Should make them watch John Carpenters  The Thing that will give them Nightmares ;)

I remember i watched Alien for the first time and i was about 9 years old lol...   did not see it as a really bad horror but just one very interesting movie.

Thanks for the pic Ingeniero.  Interesting aspect, I wonder why they put the lines, even in the side of the mountain.

I think Scott is the only director that could really expand this universe in a very thought provoking way. The other director's movies just don't have enough depth for me.

@Yog Sothoth - I kind of wish Holloway had been allowed to explode!!  HAHA!!!

I don't think the black "tendrils" shooting out of the bodies are creatures.  They seem to be just the reaction from a large amount of black goo being ingested or however it entered the bodies.  That amount seems to just cause a violent eruption from the host, then hardens into a charred looking material.

Great point dk.

Should any students answer "Alien 3 Assembly Cut" VivisectedEngineer...set that gifted child aside for special recognition.

@ Cerulean Blue

Those black-bursters are the engineer version of trilobites. That's my best guess. I think Holloway would have suffered a similar effect if he didn't have sex. So would Fifield, if he didn't die.

My dog will continue to attack the vacuum cleaner no matter how many times he gets shown that it isn't alive.  He will fake jump at it a lot like he's trying to get it to move or play with him.  Sounds believable that the protomorph might have seen the claw as a live threat.

@ Thombach

Ok, take a super high resolution screen cap for me. Let me zoom in and see if I see any insects in the bombing scene. If I see any, I'll admit you are right.

The tentacled-looking black-bursters kind of look like face-huggers, do they not?  I keep thinking they may have something to do with the eggs?  What do you all think?

Great observation I Moon Girl.

To me, it did look like the xenomorph attacked the claw. The organism just had its teeth cleaned by Tennesse's rocket engine and shot at least twice by Daniels, so it did seem a little frantic to move in comparison to the xenomorph Daniels and Tennessee fought later on the Covenant. 

All of the above paragraph makes me feel a little better For Close Encounters once I was able to convince myself that the scene was little more scientific opposed to artistic. No, slow moving crane claws shouldn't be able to capture a xenomorph but this xenomorph was really pissed after the rocket exhaust bath and appeared to make a wrong decision.

Great point daliens. It did look like the Protomorph healed in a second from the left shoulder shot.

The left shoulder shot wasn't visible when it was later shot in the right shoulder. And, the sentry weapon gif is spectacular. Thank you.

"first created by David based mainly on the fauna from Paradise, probably that's the reason he is running on all four, like the dog alien from Alien3, even his feet remind me of the dog alien."

Yes, this xenomorph (Protomorph in Alien: Covenant) reminds me of the "Dragon" in Alien 3 (below). Another great point daliens.

I'm glad you doubt that, but why was it directed at me? I did not say either.

Screen size makes a huge difference in the level of detail you can see, which is why I asked.

Nice! You can test their mettle by asking which cut of Alien was better, why or why not, and how it changed the franchise- in proper essay form!

screw the colonists hahaha

thanks again iraptus

@ Thombach

I doubt having different screen sizes changes what is intended by the production team. Drops of black goo are not insects.

hox let's be patient,  David will explain the faster than light travel speed after he will finish with the biomechanical xenomorph. 

He is so clever.

I thought this was about the Xeno killing humans

both of mine are from the second movie.  Firstly, the one that gets crushed under the APC and secondly the one that gets shot by Ripley (as she protects Newt & gets a bit thrown back by the gun's backlash herself) during the attack in the Medlab.  And in fact, shortly after this, Vasquez holding her ground with grenades was rather cool too

Alien 3 molten lead- I think the sucked out into space deaths are more than done to death.

I agree with the questioning in a general sense too but alas it's just nitpicking but I'll bite. When she grabs and traps the xeno it's actually kinda centered still over top the lifter and not massively off balance! Why does she know to MOVE the crane arm WAY out the side to SQUISH the xeno=so the plot could continue with the lander now being off balanced & out of control=more action. To the point of the thread, it's meant to haul mega heavy STUFF into high gravity so why is it struggling with just 600 pounds of human/Android and an extended crane arm? My only guess was for it making sense was the lifter was only used for low gravity outer space repairs but then I don't see how that massive Colony ship was going to scream into an earthlike atmosphere and land without a runway or busting up into pieces? Maybe it entered the colony planet and broke into sections with giant parachutes. Not bad action but when Daniels is shooting from the winch rope and then briefly running/dragging on the ground while still on the rope and still holding onto the gun was cringeworthy thus belonging to Micheal Bay film.

I may be missing something, but David had a full Engineer civilization to experiment with. Even after the bombardment, he was able to even have one in his lab - why wasn't he experimenting with the pure/original Engineer DNA as well? (Or was he?)

Something a xenomorph learns while in primary school: airlocks are bad for health! #1 for me.

That's pretty cool stuff gang, good catch Dave. They are somebody and could be family, a real head scratcher 

@IRaptus

He promised that, but then when she went to throw herself into the incinerator, didn't he shout something like "Nooo! Think of all we could learn from it!" ???

...I have a strong feeling he didn't go to all that trouble of recovering it just to destroy it.

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The 'rules of the universe' got trashed in this series in 1979, when they started travelling faster than light. Just roll with it.

Yea if you slow it down, it jumps into the jaws, begins clawing at it and whipping it with it's tail

What the eff lol

I agree with Elon Musk on this point. In fact i would go even further than him and be very cautious about anything AI related. What if an advanced no military AI civil finds out that it is superior to human in any possible way, and that human are either a threat for him or holding it back, what would prevent the so called AI to try anything possible to get rid of us ?

By for example developping deadly nanobots or triggering a nuclear war ?

We are talking of non human intelligence with limitless potential which could be no cluttered by moral or any kind of mercy !

Nice topic indeed.

1 and 4 are my favorites. And I would add to your list one more:

hox well, David and the writers should get to work already if they want to convince somebody that David created this beauty

If thay cannot explain it in a reasonable way and expect us to believe that David is so clever and he simply can defy the rules of the universe, better leave it unexplained in the realms of fantasy and blame it on the engineers. 

David may die by the hand or teeth of his own creation,  the Protomorph.

Now he opened a way for a future film, Protomorph  vs. Xenomorph. 

@daliens, strictly speaking, biomechanical relates to 'the mechanical laws concerning the movement or structure of living organisms'. However, the term is used to describe Giger's art, where his creations often blend into machine-like forms.

Since it's purely in the realms of fantasy (at this stage at least!) we have no idea how a creator would achieve such in thing in practical terms. Having said this, David is so clever that he might be able to figure it out if he has something to work with already.

The Protomorph was no longer bleeding when was trying to break the glass? Did he heal himself?

Was the self repairing specific to the engineers' world or it was something that David added to the formula?