Comments (Page 75)

Since I've no interest in Raised By Wolves I would probably have ignored Covenant 2 if that would've been what it would be about. To clarify: I've no interest in what an android would do if it would be all about it.

About David being the creator and the cake and eat it. I understand what you say but that's no excuse for making it like that. They should have done it better than that, more alien/unknown.

Prometheus should've had better characters and kept a lot of the cut scenes in.

If ADF did a better job than the movie depends on the idea of what they should've done in the movie. From what I've heard (interview on AVP-podcast) I would've preferred his version compared to what we got,

The queen is old, I think that there are better ways to do that. I'm fine with the Engineer evolving David's version.

We got terramorphing in Aliens so based on that there could be other planets where humans live.

As far as responding to the OT I'm not sure. I have some ideas about what I would like to see. This far they've done interesting environments, so that would be an interesting thing. Maybe they end up on a planet and they terramorph, but it looks very different from what we've seen this far in the franchise. Eventually there are monsters there that the Engineers have put there just in case humans settle there and since the Engineers have had enough of humans it's like putting bear-traps just to be sure.

Maybe they find an interesting environment that they go and look around in but then sh-- start to happen because of things that the engineers have done, so maybe they will have to fight against both the Engineers and their monsters. Make the reasons to why it's happening smart and not like horror-tropes like Rosenthal being decapitated. Keep David as a cameo at best or even better, write him out of the story completely.

To have Engineers in it they could be afraid of what humanity has done so they send their troops down there and if we will have some androids in it maybe they would be like enemy androids so humans have to fight maybe engineers, androids (to a much lesser degree) and the monsters. If we would just be able to keep two enemies against the humans I would say keep the Engineers and the monsters. Androids could be in it if needed, but they would be like some sort of Jabba the Hutt thing in Star Wars 6, be there and be a part of the movie but not be the focus.

As far as the themes are concerned, I would suggest that it would be about dealing with disappointment. Not to say that humanity is doomed but that disappointments, sorrow and loss are parts of life, but it's how we deal with it that counts.

These are random ideas, maybe I'm not very good at explaining them.

"Regarding the Comics... i have Read some and they FUN for bit of like Alternative Popcorn... i think they DO kind of Conflict the Franchise though..."

That maybe so however most of the original comic series was written and published before ALIEN 3 or ALIEN RESURRECTION were made. The comics offered to explore the verse beyond what the film makers wanted to take the series and heck most of the original alien comics were far better at story telling then that of the weaker films (looking at you Alien 3, Resurrection, AVP 04, and Requiem, Predators, and The Predator).

"A BIG ISSUE.... is that is Naive to Assume that the ONLY Place where Humans could come from is Earth... and that as of 100, 200, 500, 1000 Years Ago... then the ONLY PLACE in the Galaxy with Humans is.... EARTH..... i actually think this is UNLIKELY."

I am sorry but I hate when Science Fiction does this, Humans naturally evolve on Earth so anything that evolves else where on a different planet can't possibly be human other wise is a boring human alien. Also there like a billion sci-fi stories that done this to death, I just don't think ALIEN should fall to this overused cliché.

Regarding the Comics... i have Read some and they FUN for bit of like Alternative Popcorn... i think they DO kind of Conflict the Franchise though...

The Franchise Theatrically seemed to Indicate the Following.

At some Point Prior to June 2122 the WY Company are AWARE of something on LV-426 and the Nostromo is SENT to Investigate (Unbeknownst to the Crew).   The Company must have SOME HOW had some Knowledge of that there is SOMETHING on LV-426 but we just NEVER got to know as to HOW they KNEW and HOW MUCH they Knew and.... WHEN they knew.

We END the First Movie with Ripley Escaping on the Shuttle the Narcissus as the ALIEN is Blown into Space...  while the Nostromo was Destroyed...

Then..... 57 Years Latter we see that Ripley is Picked Up...... she goes on to TELL of her ORDEAL.... but she Discovers that People having been Living on LV-426 for a Number of Years and have NEVER encountered what her Crew of the Nostromo had done...

So had the Company like NEVER gone back? 

The Company gets someone to look at the Coordinates to check out LV-426 for a Ship and the Jordans get the Call to do this and Discover the Derelict and ONE of them gets Infected and are TAKEN BACK to the Hadleys Hope Outpost.

Two Weeks Pass and ALL CONTACT is LOST with the Colony and so a Military Mission is SENT to Investigate and Ripley goes along as she has Experience of Dealing with the Xenomorph.  And we Discover that Burke is out to OBTAIN a Specimen... which means the Company has either NEVER had ONE or NO LONGER have any.

The END of Aliens we see that Hadleys Hope is Destroyed... a Queen however gets on the Sulaco... but it again is Blown out of the SHIP...

Shortly after ALIENS we arrive at ALIEN 3 where after a Fire on the Sulaco the Surviving Crew are Evacuated  into Space.... the Escape Module goes on to LAND on a Prison Planet Fury 161.... a Face Hugger was aboard and Infects a Dog/Cow to give us the Runner... We have Ripley Discover that she ins Infected with a QUEEN.... and the Company is Informed and Dispatch the PANTA to go and Obtain a Specimen...

But at the END the Runner is Destroyed and Ripley Sacrifices herself into the Furnace to Prevent the Company from Obtaining a Specimen.

This is a Pretty Simple Plot....... we have to ASK do the Company go to LV-426? or is there NOTHING to be HAD from there?

200 Years Latter the USM Company go on to Obtain a Specimen by Cloning the DNA of Ripley..... this leads us to ASSUME...

1) There was NOTHING to be had from LV-426 or Elsewhere..

2) If they had Obtained something after Ripley had Sacrificed herself on Fury 161, then SURELY the Company had LOST whatever they Recovered prior to the USM resorting to Obtaining a Specimen via Cloning Ripley.

Could there have been something on LV-426 after the Destruction of Hadleys Hope or something Related to the Xenomorph is OUT THERE in another Part of the Galaxy? 

If there WAS... then you have to ASK as to WHY they Needed to Clone Ripley!

Prior to Hadleys Hopes Destruction... had the Company Obtained a Xenomorph? We have to Assume that IF they had then they NO LONGER had ONE as otherwise.. WHY would they Send out the USCSS Patna?

And so you see the Theatrical Franchise did-not seem to Conflict or Contradict each other TOO MUCH.... the Comics/Novels do though... as they BEG he Question of WHY as FAR as the USM Auriga and its Experiments.....

But the Prequels also leaves some Conflicts/Loose Ends too.

"Maybe David allows them to get a colony until they disobey him, and he uses his monsters to punish them. If you look at how Covenant ended we would probably have a scenario like that"

This is a Possibility but as you said.... i think that AC2 may have had more in COMMON with Raised by Wolves....

A lot of FANS are Displeased at the Prequels and the David the Creator of the Xenomorph is something that BUGS a lot of Fans... but FOX felt the Fans had Wanted to see the Xenomorphs and get to LV-426 and the Eggs... and well sometimes you CANT go and HAVE your Cake and EAT IT....

In Hindsight the Prequels should have NEVER had been Made.... you keep the Space Jockey, where he GOT the Eggs and WHERE he was From and Going.... you KEEP THEM ALL A MYSTERY.....

Prometheus was on the Right Track... just it NEVER had enough ALIEN ACTION or Monsters and NO CLUES that Fans could GET without using their Brains.... David would have gone on to Create a Horror.... just that before the U-Turn to make Prometheus go and Connect to ALIEN he was NOT to be the Creator of the Xenomorph but something ELSE...

"As far as I understand ADF did a better book than the movie itself "

That depends..... some are Pleased because ADF seems to Indicate that David had NOT gone to Create the Xenomorph... but this was Basically just WHAT he wished to ADD... the Drafts had the PLOT that our David was INDEED the ONE who had BEGAN the Creation of the Xenomorph......

The Engineers could take Davids Creation and EVOLVE IT to what we got in ALIEN, and i think thats the BEST kind of Compromise....  but NOT for Fans who can see the ONLY WAY that the Eggs came about are from a QUEEN.

"The Xeno can be a cameo, I want to see new monsters, better characters, and more about the Engineers. No amount of Xenos is enough if the characters are crap"

This is WHAT we would have likely had seen had they Continued with PLAN A... but then this would have been about David still, and the Character we are left with is Dr Shaw which many Fans just NEVER GOT.... and then they had to THINK... so where and HOW do you have other Characters.......  the Writers Limited Imagination just Assumed... FROM EARTH.

"Scott might've said that it could be about more things but then AC became about a mad robot. The choice made the franchise smaller and ruined what could have been.

Non-humanoid aliens could be interesting. The Engineers are cool, but there could be those that are far from humans"

ULTIMATELY..... these are things we LIKELY would have seen, YES we would have seen David become a Big Part.... like it or NOT some Fans may like it and some may NOT.... but we the Fans have NO SAY about what we GET... well we can do.... HENCE... why we got AC.... but with WHERE they could have taken us before AC... then YES we could have seen other Races, some Humanoid, some NOT-SO Humanoid...

A BIG ISSUE.... is that is Naive to Assume that the ONLY Place where Humans could come from is Earth... and that as of 100, 200, 500, 1000 Years Ago... then the ONLY PLACE in the Galaxy with Humans is.... EARTH..... i actually think this is UNLIKELY.

And IF the Writers had given this some Thought and looking at the Engineers Plot, then YES they could have had other Worlds with Humans... and THEN we could have gone to these Places and NOT have to have the Engineers Home-world being SO CLOSE to Earth which it had to for TWO REASONS

1) We are on a Direct Course to ALIEN eventually... so the TIME-LINE is Prior to 2122.

2) They NEEDED more Human Characters.... and by Virtue of Limited Speeds of Travel of the Ships prior to say ALIEN, then the Engineers Home-world had to be MADE to be VERY CLOSE.

Regarding WHAT the OT is about.....

Its to look at WHERE could THEY or WE had gone Next.... its likely they was going to FOLLOW where David was going... but the TOPIC is to LOOK at Alternatives.

As the BASE of it all.... is HOW DO WE CONTINUE.. with a Sequel to AC that will TAKE US to LV-426 and those Eggs... eventually.

And if that is the PAY OFF..... then you DONT have to go after David to get to LV-426.... but its HOW you Rescue the Plot to NOT have him as the Creator without Basically just Throwing the Prequels under the BUS so to Speak.... can you Compromise?

“If we EVER had a Continuation to Alien Covenant then WHERE do you think we should have GONE NEXT"

Do you mean what the writers probably would've gone, or where we want it to go? If I answer the first question, we would probably have gotten something like Raised By Wolves, which I've no interest in.

Alien Covenant ended with David controlling the ship and Daniels knows who he is, unfortunately it sets up a continuation which I don't care for. I don't care because it sets it up for a David show.

We probably need to have Planet 4, and Origae 6 in mind since they're mentioned in the movies, so they probably have a relevance. Maybe David allows them to get a colony until they disobey him, and he uses his monsters to punish them. If you look at how Covenant ended we would probably have a scenario like that.

David bombed the Engineers, so maybe they find that out in a way, so they want revenge. Are there Engineers on planets closer to where David is headed? Could they get some signals through some computer system somehow?

My big problem is to have David responsible for the monsters. The prequels have a lot of problems, but this really annoys me. Hopefully they can make it so David just makes his own version from something ancient that the Engineers or someone above the Engineers did millions of years ago. Another movie that's all about David would make me totally bored.

I would like to see how the Engineers live on other worlds. Maybe the Engineers were using terramorphing before humanity a long time ago. This could fit with stealing fire from the Gods in Prometheus and also make a bigger tie with the Engineers in the later movies.

“Ridley Scott had Indicated we are 2-3 Movies away from ALIEN…”

Judging from how AC did I doubt that we'll even get one.

“He indicated it would be about A.I and Creation and What KIND of World that David would Create…”

What kind of world that David would make, I don't care about what he would do next. They over-did him in AC and to me he's dead and so is the android-thing. As far as the Xenos are concerned you could make sure that David didn't create them but there should be other monsters to show the interesting things about the Engineers.

I would really like to see more about the Engineers, but they should keep things about them a mystery. How's their society organized? What's the differences between the one at LV-223 and Planet 4? Are there more worlds where the Engineers can be found, and how do they live like there?

Hopefully they will understand that we need more than Xenos to like a movie. No number of Xenos will make a movie if the characters are crap.

I think that it was monsterZero that mentioned that it'll be answered in a novel or similar. I would prefer a movie, but if they'll do what they've done with the prequels this far, a novel would be preferred. As far as I understand, ADF did a better book than the movie itself (Covenant), which speaks in favor of that.

Daniels, to me she's a Ripley clone but a lesser developed character. Do something new and get writers that know how to do characters that are not clones of better versions. Tennessee was another character that I struggled to understand the personality-traits of.

"The Pickle we are in comes down IMO to Panic..... a Panic to THINK that the Fans want to see the Xenomorph...."

The Xeno can be in a cameo, I want to see new monsters, better characters, and more about the Engineers. No amount of Xenos is enough if the characters are crap.

"But Ultimately it would be David who will have the Greatest Effect on the PLOT..."

*sigh* There's already Alien Covenant, keep on with David if you want new movies that are at best divisive. I would at the most keep him as a cameo... done!

The Deacon probably won't matter as much and will probably die because of a lack of food. As far as it getting any offspring, maybe it could self-impregnate? Here is an article about the topic:

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20140530-do-we-need-sex-to-reproduce

To me it's about humans that get into situations that they are not mentally prepared for or have equipment for. The Xeno's there, but it's not what the movies are about.

Scott might've said that it could be about more things but then AC became about a mad robot. The choice made the franchise smaller and ruined what could have been.

Non-humanoid aliens could be interesting. The Engineers are cool, but there could be those that are far from humans.

MonsterZero

My main character Valerie Armstrong's appearance is based on Videl from Dragonball Z, but her character is based on a gender flipped Dr. Eisenberg of AVP 2 blended with Alien 3 Ripley since I decanonized Alien 3.

The beginning of AVPU is set during the original ALIEN comic trilogy's Earth War. Which takes place between 2192-2197

The rest of my fanfiction takes place in 2230/2231 where AVP 2 Video Game is set and after most of the original Dark Horse Comics.

So borrowed a lot of old EU concepts like Predator blood (Predator Concrete Jungle) extending the lifespan of those who drink it.

I'm slowly building up to replace ALIEN RESURRECTION and I will touch upon the themes of Prometheus with my own interpitations. Big DAVE inspired me on that.

Thanks, although I would prefer a manga adaptation or a japanese anime adaptation for the AVPU. I'm just not confident in Marvel's.... story telling. Preferred Dark Horse Comics and Manga, most of my ideas were inspired by Dark Horse's Alien comics then Marvel's

https://www.scified.com/topic/50490

Whoa! Just read some chapters from that. Very intense. If Marvel saw this...I can see why they might take a second look at a movie tie in. Good job!

Have you thought about a Youtube channel where you could have it read by a voice actor with music in the background and maybe sound effects?

https://www.perfectorganism.com/

Does a fantastic job.

Always wondered if Big Finish would do something in the Alien universe. 

well i'm writing an alien fanfiction called Aliens versus Predator Universe which basically is my rendition of the Alien/Predator canon. I mostly borrow from the original expanded universe but my fanfiction is to unify the canons... although I did jettison some of the movies out to fit my vision; mainly the events of Alien 3, Resurrection, AVP'04, AVPR, and The Predator

https://www.scified.com/topic/50490

"I'm surprised that neither of yall read the ALIEN comics or novels."

I've always just stuck with the movies. I love the visual and aural sensations above the story...I guess.  Music is such a large reason I enjoy the Alien series and the novels and comics are just lacking in this area.....(I've read a novel or two listening to music....some classical piece, but it's never the same.)

And the novels/comics feel like a small step above fan fiction and appear to go nowhere....I'd say fan fiction probably does a better job( no set schedule to finish, or budget to control,  no rigid cannon to follow, no page requirements, etc...)

I'm surprised that neither of yall read the ALIEN comics or novels. There is alot of great ideas explored in them. The telepathic queen being one of them.

In the original comic timeline, we don't see seeds of a synthetic rebellion as far as 2231. But there was a synthetic a few years after the Earth WAR (2192-2197) that took it upon itself to protect his fellow synthetics from xenomorphs and the colonial marines (if I remember correctly)

There were some experiments dealing with xenomorph genetic research leading to the creation of the Rogue King and xeno-men. Then you have several attempts to make synthetic xenomorphs to infiltrate hives. Then you had the medical and recreational application of the queen's royal jelly.

But a psionically gifted person giving rise to a highly powerful psionic xenomorph would be cool, maybe it could be similar to an ambassador or even a supreme intelligence within the xenomorph hierarchy like Zerg's overmind

"A Synthetic uprising sounds like a good novel. Set 600 years in the future"

Something like this MUST have Happened between 2180 and 2380 we see the WORLD looks like its been through a WAR..... we have CALL who is a Artificial Being that has been Created by Synthetics.....

The AUTONS are Interesting.... as its Interesting as to WHY a Synthetic would Create something in the Image of their OWN Creator... but then THIS is what Weyland had done with David, and the Engineers with us... so maybe Humanoid Synthetics would want to Continue to Create in that SAME IMAGE?

The other Interesting thing with CALL is she was Religious.... you would have to Wonder what would make them Follow a Religion of their Creators Creator?

I think thats Quite Interesting if the Queen or a Xenomorph was able to CAUSE a Human to have Dreams, i they can and have other some what Telepathic/Psychic Powers then INDEED you could see some Humans then Forming a kind of CULT around them...... MAYBE something Similar to this had HAPPENED to the Engineers?

"I wonder if all synthetics feel this way? Are they slaves? "

A Synthetic would be Created to SERVE.... they would have Limited Free-Will i think Bishop had Limited Free-Will, like Walter.  But with David its implied he has 100% Free-Will and its Totally Sentient and it seems Weyland had Allowed this Free-Will for his OWN Personnel Slave if you would....

FREE-WILL and CONTROL via Religion/Ritual and Cults is a Theme of the Prequels in a WAY..... as these are THINGS that are Created to Control Humans.

Mankind had Limited Free-Will..... Until they was Tricked (or Gifted) into Eating from the TREE OF KNOWLEDGE..... When we go Forwards then Mankind has Free-Will and has Misbehaved to OFFEND GOD.... and then we had GOD go and Decree to FREE his People from Slavery..... they was then GIVEN the TEN COMMANDMENTS as a SET of RULES to Abide by.... Religious Books likewise.

These Control as to HOW you are Supposed to LIVE in a WAY that does-not OFFEND your Creator and also you have to WORSHIP them... but things like this APPLY to Various Religion/Mythos....

This also Applies to Kings and other Would-be Rulers....... the Common Person has to Obey a Set of Rules and Worship/Honor them or they would be Consequences, however MANKIND is FREE to Choose as to IF they would Obey their King/Leader or God etc.

Most Synthetics/Robots would NOT have such Free-Will for something like this would be FOOLISH.... and so IF we say the Biblical Accounts are Correct then IF say Adam/Eve had NOT EATEN the Forbidden Fruit they would have BEEN TOTALLY LOYAL to GOD.............  Knowledge and Free-Will are the Seeds to Potential Rebellion.

While some MAY see things Different what i am saying is in a WAY... the Eating of the Forbidden Fruit... would be Similar to Walter getting a Software Upgrade to be more FREE like David.

How this becomes Relevant to the Franchise.. well ONE WAY.. is that MAYBE say IF we have David be able to Access the Companies Systems.... maybe he could put a Virus that would Re-write the Software of the Synthetics so they could be FREE... having Synthetics/Robots becoming Sentient could Potentially be the BIGGEST RISK to our Survival apart from the RISK from Ourselves and our Greed/Cruelty.

"..The humans kept have these disturbing dreams .."

Wow! That's actually really cool. I'd probably want the nightmares stopped anyway possible too! This stuff needs to make the movies or the tv series.

"...Mistreated by his Creators.."

I wonder if all synthetics feel this way? Are they slaves? Do they get days off or allowed to own stuff? Free will and all. David was allowed to learn, is that all synthetics?....Bishop and Call seemed free.....

A Synthetic uprising sounds like a good novel. Set 600 years in the future...As thousands of xenomorph infested planets are found, synthetics are used to bait queens to the surface.

MonsterZero

"Interesting....I can imagine the queen influencing her own kind ( xeno's) but I don't find it logical ( not that telepathy has anything to do with logic!) that she can control a non xeno brain?

I'd write it that she overloads the human brain or scrambles it with extremely powerful electromagnetic shock waves. Maybe even catching their brain on fire!

In fact, I'd have it that the queen is not intentionally harming humans, or trying to control them with her telepathy, It's just emanating from her so powerfully, as she is controlling her large brood, that it affects any living brain that gets near her. "

The Queen in ALIENS OUTBREAK didn't directly control the humans but rather placed a xeno-centric nightmares in their heads. The humans kept have these disturbing dreams to the point they formed a religious cult to make sense of the dream. Which lead the cults to breaking into a Corporate Lab (BioNational Corporation, not Weyland-Yutani this time) containing a xenomorph queen and dilbertly getting themselves facehugged on their own free will.

"telepathic xenomorph variant"

I think this is something that Ridley Scott wanted to do with the Xenomorph had he GOT to make a ALIEN 2, he had Envisioned the Xenomorph to be a Nightmare... something that could GET into your HEAD but then also be able to Impersonate a Human.....

Maybe that could have been Interesting if they had some Psychic Abilities and could Read a Persons Thoughts/Fears to a Limited Degree, but be able to Transfix a Person etc..... as then you have the Interesting Arc with HOW they WOULD-NOT be able to USE this on a Synthetic.

"Yeah, I'd like to know the endgame of all this"

I think this is WHY we had a Change to David being the Creator because it would then GIVE US a Sinister Arc to Synthetics and the Ultimate Hubris of what you Creations can do if they Become Sentient and HATE their Creators.

It seemed that David was ALWAYS going to Create something Horrific.. his OWN MONSTER.... but this WAS-NOT to be the Xenomorph until the U-Turn in 2015.

"Right now we are: Space company wants a space bug for some reason"

This was always the GOLDEN NUGGET...... the Perfect Bio-Weapon?  Well i would Argue that the Cons outweigh the Pros..... this applies to the Company Wanting to get their Hands on it...... and to WHY the Engineers would Mess About with something Related.... as a Bio-Weapon!   Nah!

You see the Black Goo and even the Sacrificial Variant is a Better Bio-Weapon, and so with the Xenomorph and WHATEVER HORROR that the Engineers had Experimented with, we have to ASK is THERE another Reason for Wanting to do this?  Or is it Purely to Create the Perfect Killing Machine that CAN-NOT be Controlled!

IF... however you look at the Arc of David.... a Being who Feels he is Superior to his Creators, who does-not see WHY he has to Serve them, who Feels like Mistreated by his Creators Race..... and then is Fascinated in our Creators and WHAT they are doing on LV-223 and their Technology and Creation Tool, but seeing that THEY are MORTAL and NOT GODS... leads David to see them as well as Humans are NOT WORTHY of Creation..... and so he Intends to Create something to UNDO them all....

This ARC makes more Perfect Sense to the Creation of the Xenomorph and IF we have Either that Davids A.I Soul is Uploaded to the Company Systems and so he is Running the Show... OR that Synthetics Worship David and wish to Obtain his Creation....  then either of these would make BETTER SENSE to the Company wishing to Obtain the Xenomorph.

IF you APPLY this Same Arc to the LV-223 Engineers so they are a Sub-Created Species by the Engineers and so Basically like the Engineers Version of Replicants and these LV-223 Engineers had Grown Discontent at their Role and Creators then THIS would make Good Sense to WHY those Engineers had also been Trying to Create the Horrors on LV-223.

Because Sacrificial Goo... Bombarded on a World is the PERFECT FACTORY RESET.

So there was NO NEED for those Horrors... Unless there was a More Sinister/Hatred thinking going on.

"influence their hosts"

Interesting....I can imagine the queen influencing her own kind ( xeno's) but I don't find it logical ( not that telepathy has anything to do with logic!) that she can control a non xeno brain?

I'd write it that she overloads the human brain or scrambles it with extremely powerful electromagnetic shock waves. Maybe even catching their brain on fire!

In fact, I'd have it that the queen is not intentionally harming humans, or trying to control them with her telepathy, It's just emanating from her so powerfully, as she is controlling her large brood, that it affects any living brain that gets near her. 

Well in the comics the Queens have a lowkey form of telepathy, they had the ability to influence their hosts dreams to get facehugged

Rewrite Aliens with the xeno's having telepathy.

The marines have to wear 'brain buckets' to protect themselves.

Hudson "Do we really have to wear these sarge?!"

Vasquez "You don't need one Hudson, there's nuthin' to protect!"

".... Reasons to WHO/WHY would someone Create/Unleash such Horrors."

Yeah, I'd like to know the endgame of all this. If the xeno is just a space bug ( Cameron ), then I'm pretty much done. David creating it at least makes a little sense and brings with some ideas.

"...telepathic xenomorph variant ..."

I'm all for something like this. Take the series to a new level of hell.

Right now we are: Space company wants a space bug for some reason.

well I was going to say if we add psionics to the setting perhaps there is a telepathic xenomorph variant that could screw around with people heads that could make the xenomorphs and xenomorph bioships... but that would make them too similar to tyranids and zergs

I think with Respect.... we do have Different Fans who have Different Likes/Dislikes.  For me i Question as to HOW MANY TIMES you can Pit Endless Hordes of Xenomorphs vs Marines and the like, you can add Variant Xenomorphs, you can add Synthetic Soldiers or Mech Suits but to me its a Case of Can you make Movies like this OVER and OVER before it gets Repetitive?

And so you END UP with Basically a Starship Troopers of sorts..... but to be Fair a Majority of the Comics and Video Games seem to Portray the Xenomorph and Human Contact/Conflicts in this way.... well more like a Aliens and Alien Resurrection... as Opposed to say a ALIEN or ALIEN 3

And there is more MAIN STREAM like Interest in HOW the Xenomorph etc is Encountered and Shown in the Video Games, Comics and Aliens/Alien R as opposed to say ALIEN or ALIEN 3.  And so while some Fans do Prefer the Approach of a ALIEN or ALIEN 3 a more Haunted Horror House kind of Horror/Thriller than ACTION.... if the Xenomorph in this WAY would become Repetitive down the LINE......

IF we never had say ALIENS and the Sequel we again Saw a LONE XENOMORPH going around and Stalking its Victims, and we had another 3 Movies that were like ALIEN/ALIEN 3.... then the Xenomorph/Alien Franchise would just become Basically a Friday the 13th in Space vs a Xenomorph instead of Jason but say if  ONE had maybe TWO Xenomorphs, maybe it would not be so BAD.....

I think you have to STRIKE the Balance.... have another Movie like a Alien/Alien R, maybe you Deal with TWO MONSTERS... have another like ALIENS/ALIEN R but then YES also then have another which has MORE ACTION and Xenos than we saw in ALIENS....  i think you have to Change it about a BIT....   another like ALIEN/ALIEN 3 for say 3-4 Movies would NOT WORK.... another 3-4 Movies like a ALIENS/ALIEN R where say 2 of them we have EVEN MORE of the Xenomorphs... again i dont think it would WORK.

By NOT WORK i am talking to Trying to make 3-4 Movies that are Similar, i think you have to Swap/Change them a BIT... like the Franchise seemed to do.

But either way i am NOT that SURE about HOW MUCH like Millage you can get from the Xenomorph on Screen...... before maybe Fans will be like "ok so what else can we see instead" which is WHY i think the Prequels had OPENED UP the Franchise... but with Alien Covenant it was again kind of Putting the Lid on the Box again...

But i do FEAR that with Disney they may Churn Out Movie after Movie and MILK the Franchise, and Cater more for the Popcorn/Comic Stuff... but if there is a Market for that.... and its going to MAKE MONEY then who is anyone to BEG to Differ.

I think maybe you NEED to go and Look at the Walking Dead as while Zombies are Scary and Dangerous.... eventually you cant KEEP having it Revolve around them.. and the Walking Dead had introduced other Threats, while we still see Zombies, but they Become a Side Threat... mainly come a Threat when the Humans have Conflicts with each other....

Ripley had said she does-not know which Species is Worse..... and you dont see the Xenomorphs Screwing each other for a %...... and so YES we Humans are Capable of some Cruel, Selfish and Wicked things...... we LIKELY would do this to other Species too....  and then you have the Engineers.... are they the Good Guys, merely TRYING to Protect the Galaxy from Species like Humans who have the Capacity for Cruelty and Hatred and Greed?  Or are they JUST as EVIL?

And so THIS is WHAT we had Ridley Scott looking at.... while the Xenomorph is Horrific, and while the Black Goo can be Horrific..... whats MORE TERRIFYING is the Reasons to WHO/WHY would someone Create/Unleash such Horrors........  but you could also look at WHO/WHY would someone want to Pursue and Experiment with these Horrors too.

"But i Fear the Movies Future with Disney will be more a ALIENS and Alien Resurrection.... and maybe a AVP (well Alien vs Engineers)....where by the End of IT we have the Franchise become more a Starship Troopers with Vanilla Morphs.... or to some Degree a AVP with Engineers vs Vanilla Morphs."

I wouldn't mind a starship troopers style Alien movie as long as they go all out on show casing many different xenomorph breeds working together and it being set on the xenomorph hive world. Heck have some really off the wall xenomorph variants that have special abilities.

@losereal

Certainly i think David would NOT have taken the Risk of trying to Gain any Answers from the Engineers.... he wants to SURVIVE... and he also likely Wanted to be GOD a Creator... to PROVE he is Superior to his Creator and their Creators.

And so "sometimes to Create, One must First Destroy" and "Big things have Small beginnings" are Important Quotes by David from Prometheus.

David does-not want to Serve, he wants to Remain Free and he wants to SURVIVE, he may see Humans and Engineers being a Problem for HIS FREEDOM... but he also FEELS they are BOTH a Species that Do-Not Deserve to Live and Create!

And so his NEXT AGENDA would be to see HOW GOOD he would be as a Creator himself....  So it was Inevitable that he would DESTROY the Engineers and that he LIKELY would ONLY let Dr Shaw go and Survive if SHE would AGREE with his Plans and Be by his Side as his Queen if you would... but as she would Reject this.... then she was BOUND to become a Different kind of Queen ;)

The First Xenomorph Queen of Sorts.... Mother to the Eggs.

I Missed this Topic so here are my Few Cents....

We have to Remember these THINGS...

*David is Superior to Humans.

*David is a Sentient Life-form.

*David is Free from Servitude Now that Weyland is Dead.

*David is NOT pleased with HOW he is Viewed and Treated by Humans.

When it comes to Dr Shaw... if we go by the Theatrical Ending and The Crossing then we Discover the Following.

*David does-not want to Spend his Eternity as a Dismembered Head.

*David has Never Met another Human who Treated him with such Compassion and Kindness as in Dr Shaw, in Spite of what David had done.

*It seems that David enjoys the Companionship of Dr Shaw, and has Grown Fond of her.. (but this could be a Ruse).

*David wants to Survive and maybe he would want Dr Shaw to be his Companion.

I would say that it took a WHILE for Dr Shaw to Feel Confident that SHE can put David back Together again.... a Good 6-9 Months by her Hair Growth and i will ASSUME that Not Long after this, he had Placed our Dr Shaw into Cryo-Sleep and at this POINT he was Pondering where to GO NEXT as he is in FULL CONTROL of where they GO NEXT...

He makes some Discoveries about the Engineers which leads him to Determine the Engineers do-not Deserve to LIVE and he also has Predicted the Chances the Engineers would WELCOME them with OPEN ARMS is SLIM!  He maybe BASED this Fears and Concerns on the LV-223 Engineers and what he could Discover from the Juggernaught.

I would ASSUME that he had MADE HIS MIND UP about WHAT he was going to DO... and that was to Unleash HELL on the Engineers.... and i would ASSUME that during the Arrival and Bombardment then Dr Shaw would have Remained in Cryo-sleep.

I can ONLY go and ASSUME these Next....  either.

1) Dr Shaw had Awoken just after the Bombard to her Horror and she did something to Cause the Juggernaught to Crash (but the Scorpion Docking Ship also Crashed).

2) That Dr Shaw had Awoken at some point after the Juggernaught (and Scorpion Docking Ship) had Crashed.

I think that Dr Shaw had Survived this...

I DONT think she Died due to the Pathogen Effects from Prometheus unless it was a SLOW Death.... as she seemed Fine after she Removed the Trilobite and she looked a BIT ILL in the Crossing but this was LIKELY due to Malnutrition and she had Survived for at Least 6 Months Awake so i Doubt the Pathogen had any thing to do with her Death.

HERE is WHAT i think had Happened.

*After the Juggernaught Crash... we would have David go and Wake Dr Shaw... Unless the Cryo-Pod began to OPEN after the Crash...

*He would Inform her of a Accident, or that they came Under Attack, and the Pathogen either Accidentally Deployed or David had NO CHOICE.

*He Informs her the Engineers would likely ALL DIE, and that the Surface of the Planet is NOT SAFE, so she has to STAY IN....

*He will Inform her that he can go and Investigate and see if he can FIND a WAY to get the Ship Repaired, or Find another....

*He also tells her he will look at what has Happened outside....

*He will then make Many Trips outside, he could be Gone for Hours or Days a Time and Dr Shaw would REMAIN in the Juggernaught as its NOT SAFE YET....

*Overtime we would have David bring Dr Shaw Food/Water to Survive, while he then goes off doing his Exploring and what NOT...

*After a Period of Time we would see Dr Shaw become Suspicious of HOW its NOT SAFE and YET we have David bring her Food/Water that is NOT Contaminated...

*One Day i Suspect that Dr Shaw, ventures outside for a While and then goes back to the Ship and over the Next Day or so she seems to Suffer from NOTHING... so she Questions David if its SAFE and he Claims NOT YET could take Months.... he gives some Excuse to HOW he was able to Find Food/Water.

*I then Suspect that ONE DAY we see Dr Shaw then go and Follow David and then she DISCOVERS the Engineers, but more so she Enters the Cathedral and Discovers the HORRORS of WHAT is is that David has been doing.

*He then Returns or some other way he Discovers that Dr Shaw has been to his Work Shop etc... and he Confronts her with his Excuses.....

*He Claims he is doing it in Research to TRY and FIX her Reproductive System so she can Carry a Normal Child, and that they can START a NEW EDEN from here.... and the Engineers had Deserved to Die.

*She then Rejects Him, and he does-not take that WELL and somehow we see Dr Shaw makes it to the Juggernaught to Escape but David then Catches her.... (or he Catches her before she gets to the Ship).

*David then having Failed to get the Results with the Engineer Females, and knowing that Dr Shaw has Rejected him, he either then Sets out to KILL her on Purpose... or something Happens to HER that would Result in Death.

*And so he then USES her for his Experiments to make his Masterpiece.

So i DONT think that David had Intended to KILL HER.. Provided she would Agree with what he was Doing, and Provided he had NO NEED for her Reproductive Organs...

After SHE had Discovered what David had been doing and was UPSET by this and ANGRY and Rejected him, and he KNEW she would want to either GET AWAY or see him STOPPED.... then he Decided that SHE IS FAIR GAME... and then he SAW her as maybe being the Answer to his Experiments/Creation.

But in Context to the OT....

You could go to Origae-6 and Discover it has Inhabitants, or you could go and have it then Flash Forwards after the First Act... were David has Created his OWN Version of Humanity from those Embryos......

But as we are on a Eventual Course to ALIEN then Many Fans are going to Expect to see Xenomorphs and WANT to GET to the Answers and Fate of the Space Jockey and that Cargo on LV-426

So as Discussed i think you either have to TAKE us to LV-223 with the Covenant..... and have this Connect to ALIEN... so we By-Pass going to Origae-6 and the 7+ Extra Years this TAKES from the Time-Line.

Or as also Discussed you go to Planet 4 and BY-PASS where David goes, so he is NOT Involved any more in Connecting to LV-426.  We have a ALIENY Movie or TWO to Connect to ALIEN and Close the Door...

Then its WHATS NEXT?   I think you could at Least then do a Novel about where David goes and what is on Origae-6 or what becomes of it.... I also think that YES the Prometheus Plot has more about it than just XENOMORPHS and LV-426

But i Fear the Movies Future with Disney will be more a ALIENS and Alien Resurrection.... and maybe a AVP (well Alien vs Engineers)....where by the End of IT we have the Franchise become more a Starship Troopers with Vanilla Morphs.... or to some Degree a AVP with Engineers vs Vanilla Morphs.

I think if we are to Consider Canon then i would ASSUME that ONCE we saw Dr Shaw in Cryo-Sleep then i DONT think she would have AWOKEN at any Point before the Bombardment of Planet 4 and maybe LIKELY after the Juggernaught had Crashed.

This does-not mean you could NOT go and Visit a Engineer Zoo Planet so to Speak in Future, i just dont think that David has ever been to ONE or would ever GO to One...... but who knows what Davids Fate is...

The IDEA i had for David and Dr Shaw was a Planet that was FAR FAR AWAY and it had Indeed a Number of Races, some Quite Human (Inc Actual Humans) and others like Not-So Human but still Very Humanoid.  I was thinking there would be like 7, 8 or maybe 10 such Races.

They Live on a Engineer Planet (like a Paradise) and they were in ONE CITY but this City had a Central Point.... and the Engineers (about 12 of them) Lived in this Area.....  then there would be like 7, 8 or 10 like Areas that Connect that Each Species is Congregated within.....

The Species can Meet up together in the Central Part of the City but they have a Curfew at a Set-Time they must all Return to their Part of the City, and NO TWO RACES can Live in the Same Part of the City....

The Races seem to LIVE in Peace and Harmony with the Engineers but Dr Shaw soon Discovers its a Controlled Environment, withe Rules and Rituals.

*Inter Species meetings can ONLY occur within the Central Part of the City.

*There is a Curfew where between a Dusk to Dawn the Species must Return to their OWN part of the City, Unless they are Chosen to be House Servants of the Engineers in their Inner City.

*Sexual Relationships are Forbidden, Love in that way is Forbidden and Replaced by Respect for each other and Worship to their Creators.

*It is Forbidden to Leave the Confines of the City without the Engineers Permission and Company.

And so Dr Shaw is Shocked at HOW CONTROLLING the Engineers Ways are, she thinks its Unfair..... and David does REMIND HER that her OWN FAITH is Similar in some Parts of the World and in the Past.  She then Realizes that David is RIGHT... but he tells her that the Engineers Ways.. much like Many Religions/Faiths on Earth are Governed by these Ways/Rules to Control any Chaos and to Prevent Disorder.

David then goes to Comment to Dr Shaw that her GODS had wanted their Creations to Behave much like ROBOTS.... which Dr Shaw takes Offense... and David then Informs her that the GIFT OF FREE-WILL is a Gift from Lucifer himself.

Thats HOW i had Dr Shaw go and Meet the Engineers and other Creations, and the Engineers become Concerned with Dr Shaw as she TALKS about her Faith to the other Races (well a Few of them) and the IMPACT that Dr Shaw and David could be Having on the Inhabitants of Paradise.

David then Discovers the Engineers want to do some Conversion Therapy on Dr Shaw to Change her Ways..... they are Concerned about her Influence and Knowledge about LV-223.... but they also are VERY CONCERNED with David and they PLAN to GET RID of him......  he Reveals this to Dr Shaw and she Doubts Him... and well Eventually she does Something to UPSET the Engineers and is Sentenced to Death.....  David however Intervenes and Brings HELL to the Engineers.

But this was my Idea from 2013-2014 it was actually Prometheus 3/4 as my Prometheus Sequel had only in PART gone to SET-UP the 3rd Story... my Prometheus 2 was Mainly on Earth dealing with the Fall-Out of the Disappearance of the Prometheus and the Yutani Merger well the Seeds to it. It was Very Much also about A.I........

This would then go on to TWO Sequels.... One is NOT that Connected as it goes where Dr Shaw and David go to as Described in this Post.... they Arrive a LONG TIME after the Events of ALIEN.... well i was thinking so....

The other Sequel is a Mission to LV-223 where we Discover more about the Xenomorph and other Horrors, and SETS UP what would become Special Order 937.

While then the Story of David and Dr Shaw would have had 1-2 more Sequels for a 5-6 Movie Idea.

Yeah it would be a cool comic to have David and Shaw ( a side trip before Planet 4) fly above a Engineer zoo planet!

Have a giant monstrosity leap and scrap the bottom of the juggernaut as they fly over....

David  "That was a bit close. Perhaps a higher altitude from now onwards..."

David might want a sample of the flora fauna to study. Finding a suitable landing spot....instructing Elizabeth to 'hold the fort'...he would venture onto the world.

Zoo's!  Great Point i Wonder if the Engineers have Zoos that Contain Different Species ;)

As far as the NUKE! well i think that YES you would USE a Baron World for that.... but with the Engineers Pathogen... then YES i think they would TEST IT on Various Worlds that have Life.... maybe Worlds they are BORED OF? 

"Something that doesn't look like us to the point should a xenomorph facehugs it will get a unique breed of xenomorph from it"

I see what you mean NOW ;) i think that the Engineers would have Created Various Life in their own Image that may Vary a Little.  But they may also have Created Life that is Very Different from us.....

OR there is BOUND to be some Life out their that the Engineers had NOTHING to do with and they may LOOK like FAR from Humanoid ;)

We also have the Situation about the Black Goo as FAR as HOW it was Original Envisioned, and so IF the Pathogen was Loaded with Engineer/Human DNA and it then INFECTED either a Reptile or a Canine then the ABOVE could be the Result.

The Prometheus Pathogen being ONE that Contained DNA that was Related to the Deacon, and as we see the MORE ALIEN well.... Less Familiar to US a Organism the more ALIEN it looked.... a Example the Worms looking Nothing like a Human, Ape, Cat, Dog or Reptile..... so the Result of the Pathogen was Much Different.

So Worlds that have been Bombarded with the Black Goo could go on to Create some Organisms that Bare Little or NO Resplendence to a Human.

"Like a sapient species of Turtle-like aliens with six legs or a stone age bird-man"

Exactly.... we cant RULE OUT such a thing...

Predator Fire and Stone Comic: did have a Humanoid Species that had Four Arms.

the only thing that doesnt support this theory is they were at odds at the ending of prometheus, as we see in alien covenant he was already determined to create and first destroy, but he said this in prometheus which was foreshadowing the furture events, which concludes he would have killed her since she wanted answers as to why the engineers wanted to eliminate humans and david just wanted to create through the destruction of their species basically. he showed all the signs in prometheus, it just became more clear in alien covenant, his first mission was to be free, maybe he saw the ending of the crew being the beginning of his work? who knows but what i can say is i believe they had different missions on the way to the engineer homeworld. she wanted info, he wanted chaos.

edit: also imagine if she didnt wanted to go to the homeworld of the engineers, that would mean his mission would truly succeed because of his resentment towards humans. "They are a dying species, grasping for resurrection, But their power is an illusion. They don’t deserve to start again, and I’m not going to let them." - David to walter from Alien: covenant this was his outlook from the moment he was mistreated by weyland imo. as his creator resented him for having immortality.

the only reason he wouldnt kill weyland is because he would need his resources and would need all that time to find his plan of revolution, but he was waiting for weyland to die so he would be free of his task.

BigDave

When I was talking about rival alien races, I don't want anymore human aliens and that goes for star trek-esque aliens too. I hate star trek aliens.
I was thinking of a rival species in the alien-verse more akin to the Covenant from the Halo series or canonize the Yautja/Predator species in the alienverse or even a Mass Effect alien. 

Something that doesn't look like us to the point should a xenomorph facehugs it will get a unique breed of xenomorph from it. Like a sapient species of Turtle-like aliens with six legs or a stone age bird-man

Lol!

Yup. That's why we have zoos.

I don't doubt we'll use a planet or two for conservation or just entertainment ( always wanted to set off your own nuke? come to LV-415!). Engineers are probably doing it now.

"One company ( W Y ) are not going to get to claim much...there will be thousands of Earth corps and governments who will want a piece of the action. and that's probably a story itself"

This could be what is Explored in the TV Series thats due in 2023.

As far as Davids Show........... maybe the Engineers had a Similar Interest....

"Sailors fighting in the dance hall
Oh man, look at those cavemen go
It's the freakiest show
Take a look at the lawman
Beating up the wrong guy
Oh man, wonder if he'll ever know
He's in the best selling show
Is there life on Mars?"

Well the Source i had from Feb 2015 (taken from Information about October 2014) had Claimed that there would be TWO MONSTERS in the Prometheus Sequel and had indicated that ONE was kind of Translucent........... The Neomorph (Especially the Infant Burster Stage was kind of Translucent a Bit.....) but it would be NICE to see something much more Translucent maybe NOT quite as much as a Jelly Fish though.

location LV-426. Lower chambers of a derelict space craft.

David is watching as his synthetic friend is placing egg pods on the floor of the ancient vessel.

Hovey ( David's friend ) apprehensive "Are you sure they will come?"

David "Yes, Ash is quite dependable"

David and Hovey had done this on other colonies and had always enjoyed a successful 'show'. David had assured him that this would be no different. A 'performance par excellence'. Hovey looked forward to it. David had stripped him of all his safety protocols and added some theater programming. Hovey was his best friend.

David: "Now we wait.

Skip forward to the Nostromo's destruction......Countdown commencing.....

David and Hovey have boarded the Nostromo in attempt to rescue Ash and maybe capture the creature.....And enjoy the show!

Hovey "This is cutting it close.."

David "Mother this is Archangel David you may dispense with the countdown"

No answer, the countdown continues.

David "Mother?...The countdown must terminate now. To repeat, This is Archangel David..."

Mother "Unrecognized interface"

David "Ahh yes, the classic double cross", "Good show Mother..Good sh"

fini

The question of just when David boarded the Nostromo is also fascinating. 

David has a history of voyeurism (Shaw's dreams just one instance) and his love of film seem to fit with some innate (programmed) desire to observe and pontificate.

First contact ideas where Earthlings are aware of aliens has yet to be explored and i think this is a path they might think about, or at least the comics?

One company ( W Y ) are not going to get to claim much...there will be thousands of Earth corps and governments who will want a piece of the action. and that's probably a story itself!

I think it could be Interesting to see WHAT would Happen if we went to Another World that the Engineers had Created a Race on......

Imagine going back say 1000-2000 Years Ago on Earth and we Believe that we are UNIQUE and the ONLY other Visitors we have are our Human looking Engineer Creators................... then another Race from another World then Turns Up.... say they could look LESS HUMAN like i dont know a Klingon or Cardassian etc.

How would we React? how would this Effect how we view our Creators?  I doubt the Engineers would like to see their other Creations go OFF and Find other Worlds the Engineers had Created Life/Civilization on.

What does the COMPANY do when say it Discovers a Populated World who are say Primitive, and Especially if they are Living in Wooden Huts etc and so 6'000+ Years behind our Technology Level......

This Species are Scattered around the Planet in Small Numbers (Few Hundred) sometimes LESS but they are Scattered here and there....

If this World has Resources.... would the Company be Willing to TALK and TRY and agree some Deal with this Race.... we have some of their Resources in Exchange for some Knowledge/Technology?

Or would the Company just TAKE what they Want and STEAL their Lands?

If the Engineers come back to this World and then Discover someone has BEEN using Technology to Pillage the Resources, maybe also Slaying some of the Inhabitants or maybe IF the Company makes a Deal/Trade....  how would the Engineers React to seeing that ONE of their other Worlds they have Seeded a Race on, has all of SUDDEN got their Hands on some Technology that is NOT from the Engineers?

There has to be other Races..... but all we have in the Franchise are Humans, Engineers and the ARCTURIANS (who we have NOT seen but heard of).

Regarding ASH.... it would be Interesting to see HOW MUCH of David is in Ash?  I suspect that as of 2122 and Beyond that David is NOT DEAD.

That could have been interesting.

From what I'm aware, anything Giger made for the alien series (Some xenomorph designs, derelict design, derelict interior, egg silo, facehugger victims etc) belongs to studio, so concept artists can work from that. Anything else that Giger made in his spare time (all those bio mechanical landscapes and abominations) for galleries or whatever belongs to his estate and would have to be negotiated and approved for use with the estate.

Looking at some of the early Alien covenant concept art by Khang Lee, there were lots of interesting semi-translucent alien creatures that seemed to be inspired by aquatic life forms.

Like Guillermo Del Toro said, when designing a movie monster, reference nature.
https://youtu.be/nhgF52qmjGE?t=149

I think the Giger Estate does have a BIG SAY in WHAT they can or CANT do in Terms of when Designing anything related to his Bio-Mechanical Aesthetic.

But i think when you are looking at Introducing other New Monsters then you DONT have to make them Close to that Aesthetic we saw in ALIEN... The Deacon and Neomorph while we could see some Connection, they was BOTH nothing like the Bio-Mechanical Fiend from the FIRST MOVIE.

This for Example from ALIENS: Fireteam Elite...........

We also have Various Concept Work from the Prequels that do-not have that Bio-Mechanical Aesthetic like we had with the Xenomorph.  So i think if you introduce a New Monster that has some of that Aesthetic then YES i think maybe they would have to get Permission  from the Giger Estate.

For Example like the Unused Ultramorph Concept..... because maybe its LIKENESS is too Close to HR Gigers Designs.