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Splortched
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 2:15 AMJust finished watching the movie and was confused until I started reading the discussions here. Now Prometheus seems to fit in very nicely with the other movies which retconning some things. I'm going to attempt to writing this in a timeline which explains how Prometheus fits with the other movies and what I see as a possible outcome of the next movie.
1. The first Engineer created all life on Earth by ingesting a form of the Bio-Former. His DNA is broken down into it's parts which in turn evolve separately into species that inhabit Earth. This doesn't explain how we are a perfect match to the DNA and yet other species can be so far from us, but we'll give Ridley a mulligan for an interesting concept.
2. David is unstable. Bishop tells Ripley that the A2 Hyperdyne (T2 Reference in Aliens, James Cameron hamming it up) unit that tries to kill her in Alien (Ash) "Were always a bit twitchy." He then tells her that the new models which Bishop is one of cannot harm anyone due to a behavioral inhibitor. Considering that David doesn't have this inhibitor along with the viral marketing campaigns it's safe to assume that his behavioral coding wasn't as developed yet as Bishop's was.
This explains the "conscience" we see in him, where he asks Holloway before spiking his drink. It also explains how he could be "programmed" by suggestion by Weyland. David doesn't seem to be able to make full decisions on his own unless directed to or, lacking that, a lack of direction where he can autonomously make his own choices. This is evidenced when Elizabeth tells him not to touch anything and he stops, apologizes, then proceeds with Weyland's suggestion to "Try Harder."
David is also very curious and seems to be programmed to try new things. We see that he is not only playful (basketball scene) but resourceful and genuinely interested in his surroundings. His eagerness in the map room, his experimentation with Holloway and the writings in the temple reinforce this. He has his mission from Weyland yet he is fascinated with learning and exploring, seemingly reaching a compromise between the two in a sinister way.
3. The head explodes due to electricity. (Let's assume that you've read 4 and we're going off the assumption that the Engineers have consumed a type of Bio-Former.) There could be several reasons for this but the logical conclusion is that the electricity is the catalyst in the Bio-Former.
One reason could be that the Bio-Former contains or is affected by electricity. This could be because it's made of nanobots, contains significant amounts of electrons or some other technical reason related to electrical science.
Another could be that due to the age and the cells being preserved to the point of almost no decay that rapid decomposition happened due to the introduction of a foreign material i.e. electrical shock. The neurosystem on the engineers may be more advanced and therefore doesn't take kindly to electrical shock. Who knows, it's a movie?
4. Elizabeth and Holloway create the first alien. Technically the Engineers are the first recipients of some form of Bio-Former as evidenced by their skin and appearance. Even as an advanced race, gigantic muscle mass for a humanoid either can be explained this way or they have really nice gyms in those Temples. The Bio-Former we see in the movie seems to have a different purpose than the one evidenced at the start which suggests that it can be manipulated for different purposes.
Elizabeth is impregnated by Holloway and removes a half human but probably more weaponized Bio-Former baby facehugger/chestburster from her womb. It would make sense that she wouldn't be more affected by his DNA other than reproduction due to a mother's immune system being significantly removed from most children, plus nature is weird.
5. Elizabeth's baby is the first queen facehugger, the first Bio-Former weapon that has the ability to reproduce. I read someone's idea that weaponized Bio-Former doesn't give a changed lifeform the ability to mate, which makes sense for a weapon. The purpose is to have it be a weapon, not a baby maker.
Inadvertently due to Elizabeth birthing the baby, the Bio-Former "fixed" Elizabeth's immune system in order to survive. The Alien we all know cares only for survival, so this makes sense that it would do anything it could to survive. Due to the tiny amount of infected DNA deposited in her the only way for the Bio-Former to work would be to secure itself into a gestation period where it could multiply and eventually become free. Elizabeth's condition fits with this idea too because it could be that she has endometriosis or some other infertility disease, so it could be that the Bio-Former found a way to circumvent this unlike normal sperm and voila, pregnancy.
Due to the Bio-Former having to adapt to a different survival method other than intended (direct contact), it gained a new trait and the first facehugger/chestburster is born. It implants itself into Engineer and we have the second chestburster/first alien drone.
17 Replies
ZoSyn
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 11:23 AMI'm confused. Im convinced prometheus is a prequel to aliens. With that said where does alien vs predator fit in? At the end of prometheus a (not yet evolved into what we are used to) alien is born right? Right. But if aliens didnt exist yet in 2093 then how did they exist in 2004 in alien vs predator? I mean peter weyland (in prometheus) is the son of charles weyland (in alien vs predator). I Guess they didnt realize this important connection just like in X-men the last stand. Professor X walks on his two legs in the beginning of the movie (a younger but still older professor X). But in the Prequel X- men first class, he is wheelchair bound at a clearly younger age.
blake_84
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 2:39 AMHOLY SHIT YOU KNOW YOUR STUFF
lol, i really dont have anything to add other then you explained everything very well and this should be expanded on pronto
get together with bigdave. he knows his stuff too
Splortched
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 2:53 AM[b]Alien[/b]
Now we have an alien. We not only have an alien drone but we have one that has the ability to reproduce. Obviously this one probably has to go through a Praetorian molting and then finally a Queen molting (if the other movies and games are to be believed).
However, with no other lifeforms to impregnate (the other Engineers are all dead now) the alien Queen creates as many eggs as she can. If she dies or we see Queeny again is yet to be seen, but ties into why there are only eggs in both Alien and Aliens. This is a very easy point to conclude yet may not be how Scott and Giger planned the story.
As far as the other Bio-Formed worm serpents, those can be considered asexual for now.
After the $1 trillion loss of investor funding with NO explanation at all to investors that provided for the Prometheus project, Weyland Industries is forced into a merger with it's largest funder Yutani Group. This begins the worst example of corporate profiteering, with many workers sarcastically calling Weyland-Yutani "The Company" due to workers being contracted for many times under their value of work. At some point Weyland Yutani learns some info about LV-223 and send the Nostromo to intercept the distress beacon. This possibly could be the ship that Elizabeth flew but it isn't likely as there wasn't an Engineer piloting her's.
[b]Alien 3[/b]
The facehugger (which could possibly be a different type of facehugger, such as a royal/super facehugger) changes into a runner due to impregnating a dog. This fits with the Bio-Former taking the traits of it's hosts i.e. the alien worm snakes regrowing it's head. Here we see Bishop who could possibly be a long lived pet project of Peter Weylands that is still running. The human Bishop could be a clone of his.
[b]Aliens Vs. Predator[/b]
As much as I hate this movie there is an interesting idea that I thought of after watching Prometheus. The idea that the Engineers create hunting grounds for the Predators by creating life and then Bio-Forming the hosts into ultra hostile monsters is too neat to pass up. It ties the Aliens to the Predators in a believeable way that both AVP movies failed at.
Another concept would be that once an experimental planet is seeded with an Engineer then it is either cleansed with hostile Bio-Former or it is harvested. The human population is evolved into Engineers using non weaponized Bio-Former to change them into the "Titans" that they resemble. If a planet falls into war such as ours has (which could fit the 2000 year timeline more or less) then they schedule a weaponized version to clean the planet off and start from scratch. If they deem humans to be successful enough of a test to become Engineers then they bring them into their society. This explains the EXACT match up of our DNA that's seen in the movie. The other species on the planet can probably be attributed to evolutionary branching out or quirks in the Engineer's Bio-Former.
Splortched
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 2:59 AMOkay, I realized there were some holes with some of these ideas and yeah, I know it's not supposed to be really linkable with the other movies. I know Scott and Giger wanted to distance themselves because Fox burned them both. Also James Cameron is a douchebag (especially to Giger) but we all know that.
The main thing I wanted to do with this is give a decent explanation of what I observed and how I think Prometheus can be expanded upon. I'm not an expert on any of the really technical science stuff but I tried to make it as accurate as possible while still remembering that it's a movie, so creative liberty can be taken at points.
I would really like to see the harvesting idea become a reality because that means a decent AVP movie! Also where the hell is our explanation of Weyland-Yutani, Mr. Scott?
doombuggy
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 2:59 AMIt is imposable they make and give birth to the first face hugger/queen, both have already been in existence for thousands if not millions of years. In Alien Dallas says the ships been there at least a hundred thousand years.
Splortched
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 3:07 AMGood point. That is a different ship though, as far as we know since Prometheus takes place on LV-233 and Alien/Aliens is on LV-426.
We see the alien mural but no sign of the face hugger until it meets our Engineer friend. If other people's ideas are correct then when a living organism comes into contact with Bio-Former then they turn into their genetic form of the drone. With humanoids it's in the form of the Alien.
Also note that we only saw the Bio-Former, not the actual eggs or a Queen. So as far as the first queen goes, Holloway and Elizabeth may have created it or it may have existed before.
We won't know until Scott produces another movie. :)
doombuggy
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 3:37 AM"With humanoids it's in the form of the Alien."
the dog alien still looked like an alien
"That is a different ship though, as far as we know since Prometheus takes place on LV-233 and Alien/Aliens is on LV-426."
yes and this movie takes place only 39yr before LV426 is discovered. There fore the eggs and a egg layer have long been around already.
Splortched
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 3:52 AMYeah, like I said there were some holes to my ideas. It would work if the Alien had made it's way onto the ship that Elizabeth left on, but that's unlikely. So it still stands that there was some links to the other movies yet Scott really tried to distance himself from them.
The runner in 3 is still an unknown. It was originally shot with an ox, introducing the super facehugger. Then they changed it to a dog and changed some things. Then they released the assembly cut, which goes back to the ox. The alien doesn't look like the other movies either. It has the drone head (smooth), different color (brown), and has a different tail. Also it didn't seem to have the same intelligence as the human spawned ones, but that could have been bad scripting.
wilv
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 12:37 PM@ZoSyn Prometheus was definitely not a prequel to Alien. Yes it has the engineers/Space Jockeys and yes it gives you some background on them but that's about it.
LV223 was some sort of base for the Engineers. It's also in a star system close to LV426's star system. The ship in LV426 (as per Scott) was forced to crash land in LV426 (presumably on it's way to or from LV223) and then found by the Nostromo.
The connection between Alien and Prometheus is more like that of Superman (78) and Supergirl (84), where Superman is mentioned in Supergirl but never seen (except for a poster).
Emme
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 12:59 PMI guess after the incident in Prometheus, the Engineers send a team to see what happened, those discover the proto alien and either try to capture it or kill it, in any case either the alien or some eggs it layed came aboard the Engineer ship, which on its way home, crashed on the planetoid of ALIEN.
Case closed.Dead engineer, alien eggs (layed by thr proto), crashed ship.
wilv
MemberOvomorphJun-09-2012 1:11 PM@Emme Highly unlikely given that the Engineers in LV223 had been dead for thousands of years before Prometheus landed & no one from their planet bothered to go back and find out why.
This "proto alien" is nothing of the sort. It's definitely a xeno of some kind but watching the chain of events it just seemed to be a variation. The black goo seems to instill certain inherent qualities to it's creations, like acid blood, an instinct to constrict and penetrate and so on.
There's also the "altar" to consider which not only shows what looks like a xeno but also a facehugger.
[img]http://i733.photobucket.com/albums/ww336/Wilv79/vlcsnap2012053020h15m11.jpg[/img]
I have no doubt that this black goo is somehow related to the xenos we're familiar with but this thing in Prometheus is more like a cousin to them and not a predecessor.
engi
MemberOvomorphJun-20-2012 9:50 AMi dont get how in aliens vs predator the exnos and face huggers as shown in previous alien films were around before prometheus. because isnt premetheus ment to show how it all started because in AVP it shows the predators using the ancient people to breed these aliens thounsand of years back. i always thought that prometheus was about the evolution of the aliens yet in AVP back when the predators hunted aliens they looked like what they would of had if they evolved.
mrxavia
MemberOvomorphOct-14-2012 7:27 PMHere is my take on the film and how it links into the Alien and Predator franchises...
Earth was seeded by the Engineers, that is why humans evolved, and we contain similar DNA (but not 100% match as shown in the film)
LV233 is a weapons research facility, far from the Engineers home world, focused on modifying Xenomorphs to create a controllable weapon, but it got loose.....
The Xenomorph alien is a species that already existed before 2093, the Engineer ship that Crashed on LV426 crashed long ago, when transporting Xenomorphs for experimentation.
The wall carvings that appeared to show a Xenomorph Queen and a face hugger seem to agree that they existed before they began experiments.
There are many un answered questions...
Why did they seed earth?
Why did they plan to destroy us?
Assuming we take AVP to be cannon in this universe, then clearly the Xenomorphs are either
a) a Predator creation
b) a natural Occurance
c) a very old Engineer experiment(since AVP shows them visiting earth for thousands of years..
asphaltpilot
MemberOvomorphOct-15-2012 7:49 AMI keep thinking that humans were needed to propagate the perfect weapon for the engineers. But why? If engineers have the same DNA as humans why would they need humans? They'd rather sacrifice human lab rats instead, because they spent much time advancing their own species? Maybe the engineers are a dying race.
Shaw and Holloway didn't create the first alien. But perhaps Shaw's alien offspring is the alien life cycle to be female. I hate to use the term queen because I could do without the whole queen concept from Aliens.
cruzin6
MemberOvomorphOct-15-2012 2:03 PMThe theory I'm running with is that only successfull humans are allowed to join the engineer population and the rest are purged with bio-former. The ship on LV426 therefore would be an engineer ship from the past that was sent to purge the human population thousands of years ago. Under this assumption I would presume that all aliens are the result of bio-former and over time the predators found the eggs and probably bio-former as well. I will also assume that the predators upgraded their technology from salvaged engineer tech. Since the predators wanted a challenging game to hunt, then what better than a bio-superweapon able to destroy an entire planet's life forms? Other than going head-to-head with an engineer of course which would likely have a technological uperhand if we had witness to their arsenal. (Other than bio-weapons.)
SyfiCowboy
MemberOvomorphDec-13-2012 12:31 PMI will add few note starters. Some are working from the hypothesis that this was the first Queen at the end. I’ve seen comments about the alien race already being in existence, and I agree. We also know that the predator race visited earth. Therefore both races are extremely old. So we can interject that perhaps the predator and engineer were battling and a bargain was made for the engineers to develop the ultimate game to hunt, or simply the predator’s hired the engineers to develop the hybrid alien species. Need to give a reason why a engineer would commit suicide to start the human race. I also say hybrid, because we know from AVP requiem that the alien takes on characteristics of the host. Prometheus offer yet another layer to developing supporting/sub plot story lines.
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