A Galaxy Far Far (or Not so) Away!

I would love to see more movies about the Engineers. For a start, it would be interesting to see some of their success stories. We know what happens when their handiwork goes rogue, but let's see what they're really aiming for.

That's before we even get started on the business of what there was before the Engineers, and the goo that they somehow managed to acquire.

Our Galaxy alone has several hundred billion stellar systems, and it is now known that most stars have planets. I'd like to see something completely inventive - and utterly alien - that shows what could exist throughout the cosmos. The possibilities are endless.

I'd like to see an Engineer movie that features no humans at all. Just focus on the alien aspects of alien worlds. The trouble is, Hollywood would never make such a movie these days as it would not put bums on seats. If I had a few $bn to spare, I'd really shake up the business, I can tell you!

"it would be interesting to see some of their success stories."

I think that could be interesting, and it did appear that Ridley Scott was more interested in covering more than the Xenomorph and Bio-Weapons,  There is  a lot more to Mankind than the Discovery of Gunpowder and its Various uses as a Weapon, so the same can be said with the Engineers. 

Ridley Scott still referred to them as Gardeners of Space at the time of Alien Covenant and after he even felt he was ahead of the Curve with Prometheus.

Ridley Scott claimed the Franchise should be on a Level with Star Trek and Star Wars, a BOLD Statement, the Franchise could NOT be on that level if we are ONLY dealing with the Engineers, Xenomorphs and Mankind.

Those Franchises are Galactic Stories, about Discovery, Exploration of Worlds, or/and the introduction to various Worlds and Races.  They also mainly deal with Conflict too...    The Plot of Prometheus could have taken us to Far Away Worlds that we get to see Many Various Races.

I think going this route would be TRICKY because for a lot of people you would need some Characters you can relate to, and this usually would mean the introduction of Human Characters.   However this does-not mean that you have to have Humans from Earth....   You could have a Human Race that are 100% Human but called say Thallians from the Planet Thall  you could have them called something else by the Engineers (be too much Coincidence to call Humans, Mankind or Humans... but maybe Man could work?)  What ever the Collective Word for what the Engineers would call Mankind....  they could use this Word (whatever it is) to describe how they had Seeded this Man across the Galaxy in 7 Colonies (or more) and that some of these became Corrupt and Action had to be taken against them...  (RS suggests the Engineers wanted to Wipe the Slate Clean when Creations become Rebellious or not behaving as intended).

This would indicate to the Audience that the Human Characters we would be introduced are another Colony of Humans the Engineers Seeded/Taken too other Worlds in the Distant Past, thus showing that Earth is not the ONLY place where Humans are.

These Humans could then be our Proxy and Characters to connect with but it does-not have to revolve around just this Species.

Something i have mentioned on here a number of times about our Creation/Intended Destruction, is it appears a lot of Effort had been Put into Mankind, surely the Engineers would NOT want to PULL the Plug at our First Offense?  And RS had suggested that maybe we have Displeased the Engineers a few times, and a Emissary was sent down as the Last Straw!   He had also hinted that the Engineers may have Wiped the Slate Clean on Earth multiple times, even mentioning Atlantis.

For Such Effort that our Creation and Interaction may have taken, then to SIMPLY just Destroy us to Start Again is a bit HARSH and unwise!

UNLESS....   we are just one of a Number of Human Colonies... where in Future they can just take some Humans from one of these places and Re-Seed us once the World has been Cleaned Anew!

Or could they have done as GOD had done with Noah! and offered a NEW Start for some of Mankind, we dont have to look at it in a Traditional Biblical Account, but it would make Sense for the Engineers to come down and take some Humans (maybe Children would be better) and take their Creations to another Place to Start Again, while they then Rain Down Hell on the remainder....

I think looking at it from the Engineers Perspective this makes sense, unless as mentioned before they have Humans on other Worlds so would NOT need to try and SAVE a few of their Number.

In either of these cases it would ALLOW for Humans to had been Placed on other Worlds than just Earth.

When we wish to look more at the Engineers Origins, we can take the following into Account.

At some point in our Past we used to Live in Caves, using only simple Stone Tools, we have Evolved Past the Stone Age and onto many Stages of Technological, Cultural Evolution.  

The Process of such Evolution started as Slow, and with each NEW Age, the rate of Advancement Grew at a more Rapid Pace...  The Dawn of Modern Man we had seen a much more Rapid Technological Revolution over the last 200 years or so.  "Eureka the Light Bulb" as Peter Weyland mentioned in his 2023 TED Talk.

What would our Technology and Ability to Share Knowledge be like in 50, 100, 200 Years Time?  What about in Thousands of Years and would we Reach a Technological Perfection where the Technology is as Advanced as it can be and THUS it does-not change for Thousands of Years more!

The Engineers seemed to have Reached such a Level where they hit a Plateau of Technological Advancement.  My point being with this Reply... is what Evolution had the Engineers gone through?   Had they Once Lived in Caves and used Stone Tools?

How long was their Technological Evolution until they reached the Level that that had Obtained?

Prometheus indicated that our Technological Advancement and Knowledge came from the Engineers at Various Stages they came to Visit us.   Without their Interaction and Help, would Mankind had remained as Cave-Men? Or had been held back Thousands of Years (in Context to the Franchise).

so we can PONDER this with the Engineers, were they really so God-Like that they NEVER had a period where they were in the Stone Age?  Did they Evolve/Create Technology on their OWN? 

Maybe they had been Nurtured and Taught all they know from another more Ancient Species, maybe they STOLE some of their Technology.

There really is a LOT that you could expand upon with the Engineers, its quite Limitless Really, and by covering them in a FAR FAR away Place and/or at a Very Ancient Time, then we dont have to BOG down the ALIEN Franchise with all this stuff that some ALIEN Franchise Fans may feel is a Distraction...

A Prometheus Expansion, that covers FAR FAR away Parts of the Galaxy or other Galaxies, and is set Thousands, or Hundreds of Thousands of Years ago would allow them to have TOTAL FREEDOM.... and not be Restrained by ALIEN the Xenomorph and Ripley etc.

ALIEN Franchise as Big as Star Trek.... Not Likely... PROMETHEUS Franchise... Maybe...Certainly Bigger than the Avatar One ;)  

If Done Right!

Yes Sir Ridley Scott you was ahead of the Curve... but maybe such a Bold Plot for our Space Jockey was too Bold for some of the Fanbase of the Franchise.

I prefer to think that Engineers are not creators of humans, but created from humans! Some Master Race visit Earth at the dawn of humanity and find primitive humans. They take some people and upgrade them to Engineers. And then Engineers rebel against Master Race and win. And they get Master Race's technologies like a prize. In the end they go to Earth to teach primitive humans, but lost interest to them and decided recycle them into a “soil” for Black Goo.

Building on most ideas above: The Engineers are their own beings. They create things- much like the success stories or space gardeners ideas. They stumble onto primitive humans and things go like Leto describe. From there, the Goo goes back to the Engineers- some original Engineers exist but the Rebels begin to experiment with the Goo and things spiral downward. Somewhere along the way, Some Engineers are aware of where the Goo came from (Earth/humans) and that is why they have Earth on their sh%t list (mapped out on the Juggernaut and the one that wakes up wastes no time when he sees them).

@Leto

We certainly could be thrown a Curve-Ball.... and having it that we Pre-Date the Engineers would certainly FIT this, thus they came from US....  the Concept Work for the Cathedral Dome on Planet 4 was Interesting as Steve Messing and Wayne Haagg did their own where BOTH had the same Building and BOTH had Human looking beings and NOT Engineers. It would be interesting to get some answers of either of those two ;)  The source i had indicated Mankind was the Bigger role NOT the Engineers as far as Xenomorph goes. Also that we was like 5th Generation of Mankind.

So indeed Engineers Origins come from US would be a Curve-ball...    Maybe Mankind and Engineers were created by a Different Race, where Mankind could have been Created First?

I think there certainly is scope to adjust the Hierarchy/Levels of Creation and THROW a Curve-Ball.  Even the Masters as being Machines could be another Curve-Ball.

some Interesting comments, and the Black Goo/Origins could be something to EXPAND upon, but i think the Potential is FAR beyond even this Element (The Goo) i think the Franchise as far as Prometheus could open the Possibilities to explore Various Races, not limited to a Handful and not Limited to being Human-Like the Franchise should NOT be limited to exploring Black Goo Monsters related to the Xenomorph/Deacon, as that could be covered in Expanded ALIEN Movies.

I also think even if we explore Humans, i feel we dont have to revolve around Humans from Earth, as in context to the Prometheus PLOT, i feel its pretty limited to Center around Mankind from Earth.. Sure maybe Humans could Predate Engineers, but if so i think having it that Humans Originate from Earth as Limiting!

To have the Franchise Limited to say Humans, Engineers (both Alien Covenant and Prometheus kinds) would be a bit Limited, and especially if we are looking at these in Context to within a 200 LY distance from Earth.

Prometheus opened up a Potential to Go Beyond even our Galaxy.... Alien Covenant condensed everything to being set within 50LY (up to 300/400LY) of Earth and revolve around David and the Xenomorph...

The Scope is MUCH Larger than those ;)

PS... the Area in Green on that Map would Span about 3000 LY, and the Yellow about 1500LY and so by Virtue of the Engineers Star Maps it shows the Explored Galaxy of the Alien Franchise is a Drop in the Ocean to what the Engineers have potentially Explored/Could Reach.

I think when looking at how things could expand...

While Ridley Mentioned the Engineers predate us, it does-not mean they Created us, this comment by RS was interesting. “You’ve got to go back and find those engineers and see what they are thinking. If engineers are the forerunners of us, and therefore were creators of life forms in places that were possible for biology to function, who created that? Where’s the big boy?”

While this more likely indicates the Engineers Created us, it does seem to indicate that their is another Being, Species or something Else (that is Intelligent) that could be above the Engineers.

When i was working on my ideas for Prometheus Sequels, i was going to have it that David and Dr Shaw go to place VERY FAR away, and for example if it was indicated as below, then this would be about 40'000 LY from Earth.

They discover a world that had Engineers, but also 2-3 other Variants of Humanoids, ONE being Humans.  At first David would have to Translate, but Dr Shaw could Communicate a little as she understood some Ancient Languages from her Research.   Realizing she could speak a bit of some Ancient Language i was to have it where the Engineers or a Humanoid use a Device or something that allows Dr Shaw to then be able to Understand the more common Language that this World Uses...  I was to have the Engineers become concerned when the Humanoids became interested in her Faith/Beliefs, which is when the Engineers would have to Act to take her away from being a Influence.  The Engineers who have NO Concern about our System are at First Intrigued and Curious but this does turn to Concern and Irritation... i then had a few ways things could have Gone Next... which would have involved either Dr Shaw becoming Tortured/Experimented and Punished, with David coming to her AID and causing Chaos for the Engineers World, or the Engineers Turn on Both of them but David offers them a Covenant, and throws Dr Shaw under the Bus so to speak.

While i am not suggesting this Exact Plot should have been the ROUTE to have taken the Prometheus Sequel, i think it Certainly should have gone this way to a degree (off to a World that is FAR FAR Away) this would have NOT had the Odyssey of Dr Shaw and David conflict with the Alien Franchise or Connect.

The Problem of Needing Human Characters could be FIXED by similar to what i suggested, which is if the Engineers are our Forerunners, then its likely other Worlds they play a Active Role in would speak some of the Ancient Languages we had on Earth.

I think when giving us Alien Covenant, i think it was a bit too Lazy and a Coincidence our Engineers Home-World is SO CLOSE to Earth, and i find it Unlikely that Earth is the only place with Humans or near enough Humans that the Engineers play a Active Role in Interacting with.

If David or Dr Shaw survive their Odyssey or certainly cause Major Trouble, then being so FAR away from our System could allow them or Engineers to come back to Our System at some-point after the EVENTS of Alien Resurrection.  Giving us maybe a War of the Worlds that would NOT have to Conflict with the Alien Franchise Time-Line of 2093-2179 at Least.

But what is Done is Done.... (i understand WHY some things had to be how they was due to a Direct Plot to Alien and Xenomorph Origins)

However as a Expanded Universe we could go to FAR Away Engineer/Human Worlds and have a Separate Franchise that would not Conflict with the Alien Franchise at all.

Such a Expanded Universe would not have to Limit Itself to the Alien Franchise, Earth, Weyland-Yutani or the Xenomorph for example.

Want to TIE them in down the Line... maybe a Future Earth Mission does Travel FAR FAR away and Discover the Engineers again, and then we can explore what would happen in this case.   Or the Engineers or some of the Humans could leave FAR FAR away and arrive in Systems that Mankind Occupy and regardless these events could happen past the Time-Line of Alien Resurrection.

Sure it seems like an interesting idea, I would like to see more about the Engineers. It should be clear that it is a part of the Alien-franchise but not be about the Xenos and include the human journey. We have not had any great human characters since alien 3 which is why the rest have failed which is not to say that there have not been some interesting ones after Alien 3 but as a whole they have failed.

We could see new planets because they would probably look different and see the results of what the Engineers have done there (gardeners of space). I would like to see the tools that they have to create life but those tools should not be explained. I would also like to see it explained what the difference between the Engineer in Prometheus and the Engineers in AC are about, I am still thinking about this. We have debated this but we have not had any explanation about this on the screen. Do they have different looking ship or do they all look like the Juggernaut and the Derelict. What are the different ones that they have? Are the Engineers something that just showed or up or are they made to serve an agenda and if so by who?

I do not care about another David movie, they destroyed that in Alien Covenant. Screw that

"… they would maybe NOT have to Speak a Human Language, they could speak a Ancient One, and all we have to show is them speaking in a Ancient/Alien Dialect for a Short while with Subtitles…"

Well we have the Hobbits in the Lord of the Rings so they are technically not humans and that worked.

I don’t like the idea that mankind is older than the Engineers. I like the idea that they made us or something similar or at least that is better. Maybe something higher up in the hierarchy made both the Engineers and mankind, that could work.

I like the idea of the black goo, it is just that AC messed it up a bit.

Certainly Thoughts_Dreams we have to go back to ALIEN as the Kick Starter to the Franchise, and we had the Xenomorph explored in Future Movies but NONE ever went back to expand on WHO the Space Jockey was and WHY that Cargo.  The Space Jockey Scene was Enigmatic this Species, his Technology their History and Agenda are something to be explored...   The Xenomorph was considered a Bio-Weapon throughout most the Franchise and in Ridley Scotts Eyes, and so it was a case of ONCE you explained WHY this Bio-Weapon was Created and what for, then what do you do NEXT?

More Eggs, more Weyland-Yutani Conspiracy? The Plot of the Prequels which includes Alien Engineers does-not solely rely on showing us all these Space Jockey/Engineers do is Create Bio-Weapons to just KILL off Folk!

The Galactic Gardeners of Space Plot opens up a WHOLE Universe of possibilities and i think this is what Ridley Scott was aiming for, so that Prometheus would act as a Bridge... it would loosely link to ALIEN but then allow a sequel that would be Totally Different to the ALIEN Franchise.

Alien Covenant should not cause any Problems for exploring the Engineers and who created them, what else did they or their creators create..  This is by Virtue of a Few Things.

*The Engineers and their Origins/Hierarchy are ANCIENT, and could have Many Layers who Origins Span Millions, a Billion or so Years.

*The Engineers and their Hierarchy (Creators) have likely Seeded Life and Created Life Across the Galaxy (never mind other Galaxies), if Humanoids are a near Perfect Desired Project you dont Scrap it to Start Again...   David proved Flawed... did Weyland-Yutani just Scrap having AI/Robots?

*The Galaxy is Large its like about 100'00 Light Years from Side to Side, the Center of the Galaxy is 25'000 Light Years from Earth.  Within the Franchise it appears such Interstellar Distances are BEYOND what Mankind can Achieve in the 2100-2300 but certainly not for Engineer Technology that is perhaps Millions if not MORE Older can traverse!

*If we ASSUME there are other Humanoid Worlds in the Galaxy, we cant assume everyone is at a similar Stage to out own.  some Worlds could be Much Younger, with some Humanoid Species that are Stone Men....  some Worlds could have Evolved to past what we have Today, or in the Alien Franchise, but they achieved this Tens of Thousands of Years ago, or More and are SIMPLY.... No More!

So the Engineers are unlikely to ONLY had interacted with and located on Earth, LV-223 and Planet 4...  so indeed we can have a expanded Franchise thats ONLY connection to ALIEN is the Engineers/Space Jockey in that this Race had also maybe Created Mankind and at very least Interacted with us.

No need for Earth (could have flash backs to our Past) or be set Hundreds of years in the Future, No Need for Xenomorphs, David etc etc.

Star Wars has Humans... yet it is NOT set in our Galaxy, a number of other TV Franchises likewise (Caprica/Battle Star Galactics)

There could be Interactions between the Engineers/Humans from these Distant Places and Earth, these could be done in Flash Backs/Set in our Distant Past.... or a Future Interaction Set after the EVENTS of Alien Resurrection, but we dont really need to have them interact.

Such a Expansion would not have to be Restricted to ALIEN, and so would have a lot of Freedom to cover many things.

We could be shown a Distant Human Colony (Colonies) came from the Engineers visiting Earth in the Ancient Past and taking some of us to other Worlds...  or it could be shown that out Origins came from a FAR away place and we are just one of many Colonies of Humans and we came from another Place Many Many Thousands of Years ago.

However... to be honest its unlikely we shall see such Ventures, i do feel that Disney would want to Maintain the Alien Franchise and have it all CONNECT together, so we are more likely to explore the Engineers in some kind of AVP like Movie, where we replace the Predators with Engineers.  So Fans can see Engineers purely shown as Bad Asses who use their Superior Technology against Humans and Xenomorphs... so Yeah! just like the Predators.

I think Ridley Scott had BIGGER/BOLDER intentions/dreams than just that ;)

so we are more likely to explore the Engineers in some kind of AVP like Movie, where we replace the Predators with Engineers.  So Fans can see Engineers purely shown as Bad Asses who use their Superior Technology against Humans and Xenomorphs... so Yeah! just like the Predators.

Like Prometheus, right? :)

I think Ridley Scott had BIGGER/BOLDER intentions/dreams than just that ;)

May be, may be, but Prometheus already looks like AvP.

I cant really see how you made that Comparison?  Maybe its as i put below?

I do accept that we saw the Engineer wake up and attack the Crew of the Prometheus, but he only killed Weyland, Ford and the One Mercenary (David to a degree) and all with his Bare Hands, so we never saw no real Predator Technology.

My point being that i feel Disney are more likely to revisit our Engineers (if they do) more in context to the Comics that they appeared in, were we would see them portrayed similar to Predators in 7-8ft Guys using Technology/Weapons and Hand to Hand Combat to dispatch of Humans and XENOMORPHS and so by that i mean more of a Action Role, and NOT much about their History or all the Gods stuff.... they would likely be shown as 7-8ft Angry Vengeful beings intend on Eradicating Humans and Tearing up Xenomorph Ass!

I can see AVP was like Prometheus in context to the Ancient interaction with Mankind, Undiscovered Temples that Xenomorph (Black Goo) awaits for  the Foolish Human Explorers.

What i mean by AVP was in General as far as the Franchise (Games, Comics) are Action Based, Xenomorph vs Predators in Combat, its also WHY i think Disney would rather go the route of a ALIEN movie thats more Action and Run/Shoot Orientated.

I think Disney would see that Action Sells and so there is more chance of a Aliens/Alien Resurrection type Alien Movie, than a Alien, Alien 3 and Alien Covenant for example.

Nothing wrong with what some would call PopCorn Action, i feel the Alien Franchise has much more to offer than the Gung Hoo Action Route, but a few in this Style would not Hurt, but i feel there is only so many times you can keep doing this, and even with Alien/Alien 3 i think the Franchise is BIGGER than the Xenomorph as far as a expanded route.

In Hindsight i think they needed to had done TWO Prometheus Sequels.... one to LV-223 where we could have a more Action and Alieny Vibe, have Xenomorphs or similar and more Clues to LV-426.  Then another that followed Dr Shaw and David could have gone off and done its OWN thing and steered away from ALIEN.

Dont get me wrong, when viewed on its own and Not-Canon i think the First AVP is actually a decent Popcorn Action Flick, i think Aliens is the better one (to some degree, as far as better OVERALL movie).

I just think there is a lot more to the Engineers Plot, that does-not have to restrict to them being used as they are in the Dark Horse Comics.

I certainly think it would be interesting to see more of their Technology, there was a lot of Good Concept work as far as Engineer Technology/Worlds that was done for Prometheus, but this was Toned Down somewhat for the Movie, and almost completely gone in Alien Covenant.

We dont have to see the Black Goo as per Bio-Weapon, it would be interesting to Explore it as the Creation Tool which is maybe what its Original Use was, and then maybe see what difference there is (Sacrificial/Black Goo) but its likely the same substance that can be used in different ways.

Dont get me wrong for all the Philosophical Thought Provoking Creation Plot, and Chariots of the Gods, i feel ANY expanded Spin Off would have to have its share of Horror and at some-point Action Scenes.

so some elements of Engineer Technology as far as Weapons and their use would be something to be explored, but i dont think it would SOLELY have to be based on this take on the Engineers, like the Comics seem to do.

I think the Engineers are interesting only in their relation to humans / aliens creation.

They are not that interesting as a species and to make a film only about the Engineers ways of life would be like Rome on another planet. At least for Rome we can check some of the facts.

I think the Engineers contribution to the franchise is over. They created us and they failed at that. They wanted to destroy us and they failed at that too. They might have created the xenomorph but thay failed to prove it, so David took all the credit for himself.

For me it's equal if I see any Engineers in any future film or not. In the end they all have to dissapear along with any word about them.

For the people on earth they are no more than the mysterious giants found in various representations from antiquity. 

Keep it that way.

I think some would be interesting in more to the Engineers than just that,  i think having it be about just Mankind and the Xenomorph would be limiting what Potential Prometheus had opened up...  But i understand that some would not be interested in such a Expansion.

So in Context to ALIEN Franchise... yes Humans, Xenomorphs and Engineers, but i think you could have a expanded Franchise which has NO real Limits.

So you could expand it in many ways... we cant assume the Layers of the Creation Cake are.

And so we could have Layers Above, Below, Parallel Layers and then in some of these we could introduce something SINISTER.

Who Created the Engineers, who Taught them all their Knowledge and for what Purpose and where those beings Benevolent?