Comments (Page 144)

"It all depends on education. David said: "I think if we are kind, it will be a kind world""

Certainly i was mainly looking at it from the Creators POV ;)

I should have expanded upon HOW it effects the Creation. And so your Reply is something i have brought up quite a bit in the PAST, in that INDEED the Upbringing and Experiences can MOLD the SOUL if you would of a Intelligent being with Free-Will especially.

"I think if we are kind, it will be a kind world"

Had always been a Interesting Comment that David had made, i always looked into this Comment in Context to when RS had said the NEXT Movie would be about WHAT KIND of a World that David would Create.

I think some of these THEMES do Hold a Great Importance to what the Prequels were attempting to Cover.

I think its a GREAT point to mention about a KIND and Loving Creator.....  

Sometimes indeed a Creator is NOT really all that KIND and in Numerous Cases the Creator only Creates as a means to their OWN Self Need and Gratification.

Also with regards to Free-Will then your Creation can become Influenced in ways that would be AGAINST what the Creator would Expect....  

People can be Molded by their Environment and this has a MAJOR impact on how we TURN OUT.... but also with Free-will can bring Desire, Ambition, Selfishness.

Such Complex Nature is HUMAN Emotions, that NO MATTER how well you Program a A.I to be so Life-Like then Emotions and Experiences can really MESS UP a Human Mind...

Who knows WHAT they could do with a A.I that can Experience such Intense Emotions..

Its WHY i have felt that David was a Interesting Character he was SADLY a Product of his Environment of which his Treatment by Peter Weyland had MOLDED him into a Very Broken and Disturbed Boy.

If he had a Memory Wipe/Reset Switch and then was Brought up by Dr Shaw i am sure that David would have been Totally Different.

In Part i think Davids dislike towards Humans and Engineers does STEM from their Potential and WHAT we have done with it...  he would see himself as Superior and Strive to show he can DO BETTER.

I think he has learned of the Ways of Mankind and Engineers and seen that Fundamentally we are Wicked Species (but their is Good).

It is WHY i had been leaning towards maybe that David would want to Create his Own Humanoids.... and i dont think he would Necessarily be a CRUEL GOD... but i do think that IF his Creations would show signs of Rebellion then he would ACT in a way to Quell them.

This is WHY i Personally would have looked Forwards to a Sequel.........  I would Suspect that David could USE the Humans to SET-UP a Colony in Small Numbers... then he would DO AWAY with them....

Populate his OWN Creation (Enhance the Human Embryos) these Children would be RAISED to believe that David is their Creator and God......

THIS GOES TO POT!!!

When another Ship with Humans on who look similar but different to those Natives on Origae-6 that David Created.. and WHEN they see another being who MATCHES the likeness of their GOD and this TWIN goes on to say that David is NO GOD... and these Creations of David then Discover their TRUE origins (Human Embryos) and WHAT it is that David had done...

THEN the £%$& Hits the FAN!

Would all his Creations Turn on him?

With his Creations given this KNOWLEDGE.. and the Fear of the Threat and Rebellion... is WHEN it would be that DAVID would have to Unleash his WOLVES to Destroy his Wayward Lambs.

I had posted this Idea a LONG while back NOW... Many Months prior to the Announcement of Raised by Wolves... and i am Wondering is Raised by Wolves a case of RS taking such a Idea he maybe had.. and to Utilize it in a TV Show... thinking that their is LITTLE Chance he would be able to make a AC2 the way he would want?

The Problem is i am NOT sure most Fans would want to see such a Plot....

David is a consumate liar, and you have to take everything he says with a very large pinch of salt. But when he said "Sometimes, in order to create, one must first destroy" I'm sure he absolutely believed that. He wanted to exterminate the Engineers just as much as he did humanity. He doubtless regarded them as a failed species in the same way he looked down on us.

When I think about the possibilities for future movies, my biggest concern is the audience itself. If I had half a billion dollars to spare I could make the scariest movie imaginable, full of intrigue, novelty and wonder set in an Alien/Engineer/Space Jockey universe. But I fear those who pull the purse strings are just too wary that modern audiences like their popcorn, superheroes and fizzy drinks. Nothing worse than an audience that has to go away and think about things.

>>>*Sub-Creating something with Free-will and allowing Powerful Knowledge and Technology to Fall into their Hands can be Disastrous for the Creator.

No. This is not true. But if the creator is an evil sadist? Perhaps he deserved such an attitude!

It all depends on education. David said: "I think if we are kind, it will be a kind world".

Peter Weyland was not kind, he was tough and cruel creator (father). I know that your words are primarily about sub-creating, about AI - this is why it is incorrect. Peter created David; and influenced him with his behavior. But there are also Vickers. She is not AI, but an ordinary, biological person. And she also despises her father (creator) and when Weyland dies, she like: "Finally!"

I see that you are working on a vision of RS. But RS is mistaken. Warning of the dangers of sub-creation, AI, free will? Paranoid, luddite nonsense! With such thinking, people would still live in dirty caves. If you create a creature with free will, knowledge and technology, but you are not a tyrant, but quite the opposite, then you obviously have nothing to worry about. But if you are cruel, then you really should beware!

Thus, a warning about the dangers of sub-creation discredits the creator, not creation at all.

I think that even the thought about "warning of the dangers of sub-creation" is offensive. Because it shifts guilt and responsibility to sub-creation in advance. And removes all blame from the creator himself.

And here we are miraculously returning to Prometheus! Are Engineers kind, smiling Space Gardeners? Did humanity disappoint or upset them? Or perhaps - did this cruel behavior of engineers make humanity like that? The more I think about it, the more I feel - David did the right thing when he destroyed the Engineers. Most likely they would not tolerate a competitor in the person of humanity, which is capable of space travel, terraforming, and already creating life. Most likely they would have killed David, Shaw, and then sent a team (or army) to destroy the Earth.

Thanks BD!

I'd like to think we can learn from the beast, not just replicate it. 

I think there is POTENTIAL to had Evolved the Story of the Engineers.

I think the HELMET looks Fine and Works Fine as Prometheus had shown us.... its just that their is QUITE a difference as far as the HELMET does look compared to the Space Jockey Skull/Helmet.   Which with the SCALE difference does leave it OPEN for the Space Jockey to have been a more Ancient Race who maybe were the Creators of the Engineers.

@MonsterZero

;)

I like it.... certainly what we need to look at... is how do we EVOLVE the Beast and UPLIFT it... from Experiments can we UPLIFT it... or is their something MORE about them than just KILLING?

Why i have brought up RIPLEY 8 in a Few Posts this Year.. as with Ripley 8 you can say is is more Superior to any other HUMAN... and she Retains the Memories to Ripley.

Surely she holds the KEY to Enhanced Humanity and some kind of IMMORTALITY (Genetic Memory Transfer).

And the BIG THING about this is that the XENOMORPH DNA is the KEY to those Enhancements/Traits that Ripley 8 has.

If the Engineers had encountered a ANCIENT ORGANISM that they had NO ROLE in its Existence and Saw Potential in its DNA to Enhance themselves and that this Organism had some kind of Genetic Memory Transfer...

THIS gives the Engineers FAR Greater Reason to be Experimenting with such a Organism.. than merely it can make a GOOD KILLING MACHINE.

THIS ^^^ is what a Sequel should have looked into... and then SHOW that David would Create his Own Monster.

Rather than the route of ALIEN COVENANT.

I will say it again..... WHAT really made ALIEN Great was the UNKNOWN.

Expanding on ALIEN there was quite a BIT that was more than Eggs.

*WHERE did the Eggs come from?

*WHAT was they doing on that Ship?

*WHAT was the intended Purpose/Target for the Cargo?

*WHY would the Space Jockey had been Intending to USE the Cargo?

ONCE you Answer those then their is MUCH more you could Answer about WHO the Space Jockey were/are!

ONCE you answer some of those Questions you LOSE the UNKNOWN and Mystery... Once you Especially answer the Xenomorph Origins and it is merely a Engineered Killing Machine, then there is NOT much you can do with it apart from more Eggs ==> Xenomorphs ==> Dead Humans.

Another Part of the ALIEN Mystery was... SPECIAL ORDER 937

This implies the Company had KNOWN something about the Specimen prior to the Nostromo being re-routed.

These UNKNOWNS were NEVER touched upon in the ALIEN Franchise, and i think EVENTUALLY even if we NEVER had Prometheus but we got ALIEN 5, ALIEN 6 and ALIEN 7 etc....  then i think Eventually they would have HAD to go for the Origins and Answers to the Mystery of ALIEN after the Xenomorph had got Cremated.

Prometheus was NOT a bad Start!  it lacked any real Alieny Attack Moments (Fifield and Space Cobra were NOT a Good Substitute to a Xenomorph) but it NEVER had to have any Xenomorphs.... the Neomorph would have DONE Fine and the Concepts for the intended MONSTER in the Prequel did look more like the Neomorph.

But with going for a Direct Prequel in Alien Covenant and the Route of David the Creator as Downplayed the Role of the Engineers, it has Degraded the Enigma of the Xenomorph and only Serves to UPLIFT the Theme!

*Knowledge, Technology are POWER

*Sub-Creating something with Free-will and allowing Powerful Knowledge and Technology to Fall into their Hands can be Disastrous for the Creator.

*Desire to PLAY GOD and mess about with STUFF that should be LEFT alone has Grave Consequences.

*That its what you Achieve that Elevates you as Godlike what you CREATE.... so the Desire to Prove you are more Superior to your Creator by Creating something Superior yourself would ELEVATE you do being more GOD than you Creator thought they was...

So these THEMES and ARC looked like it was ALWAYS going to Revolve around DAVID.... the U-Turn coming in WHAT IF...  what if we MADE it that David had Created the Original Monster...

It just Appeared that EVERYTHING else was Sacrificed to PUSH that Arc about David.

Such a Origin of the ALIEN has made it become something MUCH less than it was...

We carefully removed the xenomorph's brain. It made a ‘slurping’ sound as it pulled free...This is  our fourth attempt to keep one ‘active’.  I’d asked the marines for five alien corpses; they'd delivered four. Removing the brain has been an issue, the exoskeleton is damned hard and detaching it from the stem even harder. This one has good mass though, and high brain wave activity. We have good feelings about this specimen. I directed the team to attach the dream monitoring device.  Now it was time to poke and prod, danger free.

Regarding the STUPID DECISIONS

Then its IMPORTANT to remember with Movies that introduce a Horrific Threat then they become a PLOT DEVICE to allow the Story/Threat to Develop.

Kane was STUPID but to a Degree plain Curious.

There was a NUMBER of Stupid Moments in ALIENS

The KEY thing is HOW they are Wrote and Executed... with Milburn/Fifield then the Draft had  the Space Cobra Scene having MORE of a Excuse for it (Fifield was STONED) in my Prometheus Re-Write i did make that Scene even more SENSIBLE... so its just how the Writers would WRITE such Scenes and then how they are Executed.

The Oram Scene would NOT have looked so SILLY if he had NOT encountered the Neomorphs and seen Davids Workshop....

If David had said something about Gods Creation, and How the Engineers are like Humans but they BORN from Eggs and that he has something to SHOW HIM and takes him to the Room and then claims that inside are Young Humanoids that are incubating (that he is keeping Safe so the Species has a Chance to Live on)  and tells Orgam to go in close to Listen to their Heart Beat!

Then maybe Oram could be Forgiven for NOT being as Cautious as he should have. But even so he would have still seen Davids Workshop and that should have SET OFF some Alarm Bells.

I Certainly think that a WELL WRITTEN Story that is Executed Well does Work..... and Characters that are Good and Executed well does UPLIFT the story.

Very nice picture. I'd have it on my wall.

But I don't do Social Media and hand my personal information over to large corporations, so that's that.

I refuse to believe that Engineers would construct a helmet quite as daft as this without a very good reason. Which leads me to think it's done as a mark of reverence - to the REAL Space Jockey race.

Thanks, I wish that they would have explained that better in Alien 3 even though I like the movie.

The Engineers is one of the things that the prequels have done right even though we saw too little of them in Covenant. I don't know how likely it is to get another prequel but if they make one then I hope to see more about them. Give me more about the Engineers and much less about the androids, that would be appreciated. Shipard made a good looking poster if that is what it is supposed to be it reminds me a bit about rain.

DK

There is a risk with having Scott involved in a third prequel, and that is that he would be involved in the writing of the story. As far as I know that is what he has been in Covenant and Prometheus and we know how that turned out. Maybe it is for the best to leave the prequels and pretend that they never happened. I am not sure how that would work though because you have the movies AC and P because maybe if Disney came out and said that they never happened you would still have fans that would miss that and still believe that David made the Xeno. By doing this there might be a risk that they say that Alien 3 never happened and I would not like that, I would not mind if that was done to the prequels though.

Leto

All characters do not have to be logical, in real life there are some stupid people. If we talk about scientists they should have to be kind of smart though. By the way, who would so dumb so they would lick an egg that they do not know what it is? Maybe there are germs on it that we do not know about especially if they find it on another planet.

I liked Oram as a character, he was way better than Daniels because at least he was interesting and had a personality something that Daniels and more of them lacked. Those that worked as characters in AC were David (although he was an asshole), Walter, Oram, and maybe Faris, the rest had as much personality as a chair. You mention that Oram puts his head into an egg, maybe he thought that God would help him since he was religious and also he was curious. Since he was fairly well written I did not got in a bad mood when he died because he was not stupid, while Milburn and Fifield were morons something that I will mention in the next paragraph.

You mention Millburn and Fifield and yeah maybe they were supposed to be victims but they should have been killed off in a smarter way but they were poorly made. Everyone can make mistakes that lead to their death but that does not mean that the mistakes are totally stupid because sometimes bad things happen. Holloway was not very convincing, I just found him to be generally dislikable and also the moment that he removed his helmet I wished him death because he was so stupid in addition to be an asshole. An example of his assholiness is how he was to David.

"Yes - we know whose idea it is!"

I am not sure if Scott tells them to make the characters into idiots but I think that he is too much involved in the story writing by giving ideas about what they should write about. Look at the making of Prometheus and you can see that he gives ideas that messes up the writing.

BD

I agree that there are things in the prequels that could be expanded on other than the monsters and the eggs. Giving the alien franchise new things is something that the prequels have done right especially the Engineers.

The themes are interesting, artificial intelligence and creation but it is not good when the themes are given bigger space than the characters and the story. You got to make them all work in the context of the movie. Ash and Bishop worked but they were not allowed to take it all over. Even Call was somewhat interesting even though far from those mentioned before.

Getting rid of them is something that I have no problem with. Letting Hicks or Newt survive would have been repetitive. Either you let Ripley die or Hicks but I would not have liked to have them together in another movie. Ripley and the doctor in 3 worked because of the general feeling in 3 but he died which fitted the mood. Repeating the family motif would be boring, that is my point. The third movie has problems but when you look at the circumstances in where it was made it is a miracle that it is as good as it is, that is another reason why it is my favorite in the franchise. A lot might disagree but to me it is up there with Star Wars 5, Terminator 1, Terminator 2, Dawn of the Dead, Night of the Living Dead, for example.

Sure repetition often gets boring, but it depends on how it is done. They should keep it in the shadows where you do not see it often and also it should not be the focus on the movie. One of the good things about Alien is how they handled the monster. It was there to show our fears or how ever to put it but the story was not about it.

Expanding on the monster is a risk because it might turn into a joke. Because Alien C and Prometheus failed it has made the situation of Alien as a symbol worse. Having some more Xeno related scenes could have elevated the monster in Prometheus depending on how they were done. One example is the Xeno Fifield, that was scary because he was so disfigured, deadly, and fast and it was new.

"... it seems RS felt that having David be the Creator would UPLIFT his Characters Role in the Franchise"

The problem is that Scott just cares about David and maybe Walter and sacrifices the rest. I don't say that everyone have to be written and executed extremely well but you need more than one or two characters. I mean human characters, sure you can have androids but the humans should be the focus.

"The Problem with making a NEW Franchise Movie is IF the Eventual Movie would just STICK to and PLAY it SAFE!"

If that means to getting rid of David as the creator and having less of David then sure. You still need better made human characters because I am tired of androids taking over the franchise. The franchise is about more than Ripley and I am not against having something new but having enough relatable human characters is a must. We need better human characters and less of David if they shall make another prequel. Right now I am at the point where I say erase the prequels as if they never happened, I very much doubt that they will make it all right with a third one. Sure they could maybe make a third one where they focus more on the Engineers, have less of David, and make better human characters but I am not sure how likely that is to succeed. Maybe it is better to keep the prequels as an alternate universe.

 SuperAlien I kind of agree and was saying that in a different way- it's going to move forward under Marvel/Disney. Fans can always bow out- I would give it a shot expecting a popcorn movie. I can always quit if I don't like it.

BigDave I would rather keep things a mystery as well and can easily pretend the prequels never even happened- and why not- Bloomkamp wanted to pretend half the quadrilogy never really happened.

Even if RS took over and went with anther movie, it would still be divisive with fans. With that in mind, may as well see what someone else can do with it. Seems a lot minds are already made up.

@Hadar

Indeed their are OPTIONS...

This idea does look at similar to what you put... a Failed Ripley 7 Clones Queen...   Something that is a HYBRID but more Menacing than the New Born, that Procreates by Giving Birth to LIVE Young.... so Fully Formed Small Morphs like the Xenomorph in AC and Neomorphs... that would then Rabidly Grow to Adult.

These Hybrid Xenomorphs would Procreate via Egg Morphing which leads to again a Morph growing inside (NOT a Face Hugger) so  the Hybrids would do away with that Part of the Life Cycle.

I had another Idea that would Follow Ripley 8 as i think she is like the Ultimate Specimen.. a Super Enhanced Human with Genetic Memory Transfer.

It would explore the AUTONS who would claim to WANT to Help Ripley 8 but they are actually just after her DNA to use as a Bio-Weapon to RULE the World and Galaxy.

But i am STARTING to lose HOPE with any Future Alien Movie.

They may as-well have Ripley wake up on the Sulaco then back to LV-426 only for Tony Stark to Turn up with the Avengers at the END via a Time Machine ;)

Hydra and Weyland Yutani have Merged and are working for the Engineers......  BUT with the Help of the Predators the Avengers and Ripley can SAVE the Day...

Then the Sequel we reveal that Thanos is a Engineer Elder who works for the TRUE Race that are the Space Jockey!

But the Antman/Wasp share Tech with Tony Stark for Micro-Iron Man Suit and they Shrink Down to Atomic Scale to Manipulate and Harness the Black Goo.

The Final Battle sees Super Large Iron Man and Ant-Man Battle the King Space Jockey and HULK-MORPH!

While then using the Ant-Man Tech the Space Jockey Unleashes the ULTRAMORPH... a 50ft Xenomorph Flying Queen!

But Ripley Turns up in a SUPER Power Lifter... and Kills the Ultramorph and King Space Jockey.

The END CREDITS we see that Ripleys Work is NOT over and that HYDRA and the Space Jockey are Servants to Cthulhu and so Ripley in her 40ft Power Loader is joined by Mega Size Ant-Man and Iron Man and the Pacific Rim Jaegers as they MUST go and Destroy Cthulhu and its Underwater Minions!

LOL

Regarding SuperAlien ;)

LOL i do think Joking Aside though this is HOW we can see the Xenomorph eventually Exploited in Games and Comics... (SuperHero Cross-Overs)

IF this then becomes what the Theatrical Future is, then the ALIEN Franchise that ALIEN began a Sci-Fi Horror about the Unknown... and what Prometheus could have laid down as a Foundation of Expansion... would just become a JOKE!

Where The Predator would appear to be a Sensible and Solid Sequel in Comparison ;)

The ALIEN Franchise should NOT be turned into Guardians of the Galaxy meets Starship Troopers ;)

I dont have too much HOPE for the Future... I would expect more Damage to be done than the NEW Star Wars Trilogy did to Star Wars (Especially the Last Jedi)

"defending this loop of senseless nonsense for years…..I digress though we need to save this franchise from all these bad things….I don’t see how yet or if it is even possible."

Thats the Problem we are NOW in the Direction has Displeased a LOT of Fans but i dont think you can come up with any Prequel Conclusion that is going to WORK.  Not for the Majority.

The ADVANTAGE that Prometheus had and also by attempting to STEER AWAY from Alien is you dont STEP on the TOES of the Original as far as those Eggs and the Xenomorph, so you could GO and do other stuff without WORRYING about how it Conflicts with the Alien Franchise.

The PROBLEM with a Direct Prequel Path like Alien Covenant is that as you are LEADING towards ALIEN as far as to ANSWER those Questions then you do RE-WRITE the History a bit, and you have to be CAREFUL because what you do/show will become Canon Answers to what was Mystery before.... 

When these Answers are then something that is NOT going to SIT well with Most of the Fans.. (David Creator Arc) and how it seems the Eggs are just 2nd Fiddle... then this is something that has DILUTED the Xenomorph to Many more than seeing it COOKED by a Alien 5, Alien 6 etc.

So as you said BlackAnt "I don’t see how yet or if it is even possible."

I could not agree more ;)

I think what MADE the Franchise Great was the UNKNOWN and the more Movies about the Xenomorph then the more it becomes KNOWN and Familiar and Hunted Down by Predators at Local Swimming Pools.

This leaves the GREAT UNKNOWN as the Eggs and Origins and the Space Jockey and WHO they are...

Once you go to ANSWER those then it will NO LONGER be a Unknown... and depending on HOW you handle this you could either get something EPIC... or something that Tarnishes the Franchise..

Unfortunately i think we are on the Road to the Latter.

If they had Decided to NOT give us a Direct Prequel and to STEER AWAY from  the Xenomorph and ALIEN then Prometheus had opened up a Galaxy of Unknowns... with MANY things to Explore....

With Alien Covenant the Franchise was PUT back into a BOX, where its simply about a Robot who goes on to Create One of the MOST ICONIC pieces of Sci-Fi History.

This is NOT to be Anti-David.... i think his ARC could have Continued away from LV-426 and those Eggs.

I'd like to see Superman infected with the black goo pathogen.

A Superman version of monster Fifield would be amazing!

Can you imagine any kid waiting to see a film like this? And these toys are on the market for some time.

You will see, BigDave, in a few years we'll discuss if the SuperAlien is vulnerable to Kryptonite and if the green crystal in Prometheus' Head Room was not green Kryptonite. You see, we never considered it until now. We need to expand our views beyond what we think we know about the Alien universe. God doesn't build in straight lines.

LMAO!!!

We need to change the strategy, stop living in denial, Disney owns Alien, Disney owns Marvel, it is inevitable the two universes will collide. It will be a terrible fight. The question is not when, but who will be the first! And when everything would seem lost, the SuperAlien will make Alien great again.

We could keep talking about Ripley and Hicks and even the Engineers, but it would never be the same again. Times have changed. No matter how bad I hate to say it, Alien would have a great time hunting the Marvel Superheroes. This is already happening in the comics.

A dream within a dream?

Who's having nightmares now, Ripley?

Nice Dal..err SuperAlien!

Crazy as it sounds...D.C. comics universe might be a better fit for the xeno.

It's Bird! It's A PLANE! NO! IT'S SUPERDALIENS!

I see what you did there SuperAlien! Way to go! 
LMAO!!!! Very Awesome!

Great idea!

Thank you for you kindness, Leto.

Masterpiece! Congratulations on rebirth!

@BigDave

Sooo, I though that the queen from Alien Resurrection could be from Ripley 7 and it would be explain why such abomination as Newborn was born by the queen. But if the queen on USM Auriga was from Ripley 8 and we go with the plot that queen from Ripley 7 was transported to other facility then the film could (and probably should) go with new Xenomorphs being somewhat (or even heavily) deformed. But fans might disappointed without the 'perfect specimen' on screen. 

--

@Leto

I also think that USM Auriga was super secret facility outside the official budget of USM. And with destruction of Auriga most of the knowledge about Xenomorphs would be destroyed. But still the Auriga project would be subordinate to someone or some department of USM. And I could imagine a situation that people who accepted the Auriga project would become fed up with wasting money without any affects and it was the reason why they demanded that queen from Ripley 7 or 8 would be moved to other facility. So after destruction of Auriga the USM would have an Xenomorph queen but most of the knowledge would be lost, so the new project would have to start basically from scratch.

But still, after 25 years, I think it is possible that new research team was able to subdue Xenomorphs and make them an absolutely obedient 'service dog', for example via some electronic implants. And the new 'outbreak' would be because some Xenos were so intelligent that they removed theirs implant (with the extremely precise second jaw). And it is the reason why USM are trying to lure Ripley 8 in, because they need her help.

I always tough that after USM Auriga destruction Ripley 8 and Annalee Call would settle in some remote location like Alaska, Yukon or Nunavut while Ron Johner and Dom Vriess would go back to being mercenaries. And I am imaging that USM would have no idea about Ripley's 8 whereabouts while they where able to locate "New Betty" with Johner and Vriess (I imagine him in full exoskeleton with strength matching a Xenomorph :D), plug an agent in "New Betty" crew and stage a Xenomorph attack that Johner and Vriess in act of desperation would send distress call to Call and Ripley 8. But still I lack of ideas what for exactly Ripley 8 would be needed and how would the action sequences would look like. 

To honour the bright future of Alien (and being tired of my old profile) I decided for an upgrade. So much for daliens, from now on I will be SuperAlien!

BigDave, sorry for hijacking your post to make this announcement, but this is the last one I was reading.

Attaboy!

The Superalien will make the Alien great again. We are not far from it.

WELL WELL WELL…….

What do we have here Alien fans???

Which came first the Xeno or the egg? Hummm? Ahhhhhhhh? Interesting! Intriguing! Spelling binding questions we have been wanting to know the answer to for so many years.

I have got it! But first we must address some of the previous comments……

BigDave said,  (What hasn’t BigDave said but I digress LOL)

Cough cough LOL where were we.

“JUDGING by the Varied Replies here it shows the RANGE of what People Like/Dislike and would LIKE to see or NOT see.

"The Prequels Certainly have been Divisive and YET they
opened up a LOT to expand on BEYOND just Eggs and
WHO laid them."

Very interesting question indeed BigDave but we know what BigDave really means.

People we keep going round and round with this same conversation and you all know where it is getting us all...please refer to this instructional video to understand more.

@Leto

Responding to-----> MonsterZero,

“This is the way! In fact, it’s better than cooking the franchise in the swamp of prequels.

Indeed yes! I’m sorry and I thought we were all getting somewhere with all of this by now.
Sorry Leto and MonsterZero this entire franchise is way overcooked already.

No the sad sad truth is we are not getting anywhere with any of this….we do know a person, that I do not even like to mention out loud in these sacred forums, that gave the insane idea to RS while making Prometheus that the “EGGS” we see in the Juggernaut in Alien is the result of David’s experimentation with the black goo and human dna.

This is where I start crying too Alien fans because in the next prequel David is supposed to show us how he will perfect the Queen Xenomorph so we can all see what lays those eggs in the Juggernaut in Alien also making what we see in Aliens possible as WELL......

And there you have it what came first the Xeno or the egg, well neither really David came first if we are all to accept it was Weyland's stupid robots tinkering trifling AI androids messing around with 1 million year old more advanced technologies involving the engineer black goo something or other.

Here is the real story pay attention class!

So the performances I saw in the original Alien movie are spectacular to say the least but do not connect with the other films. Looking more closely at Alien I sense a profound disconnect with the two prequels and perhaps a third prequel yet even to be made.

For me Alien fans the entire David arc is just this awful never ending loop in an episodic story where nothing really makes sense. We are all stuck in this endless loop going nowhere. Why though???...the Nostromo crew sets down on LV-426 to investigate this warning signal picked up by Weyland Corporation from a juggernaut what a surprise!, all while Ash a much more advanced android than David and Walter goes completely bonkers helping the Xenomorph the entire time to infect and kill the crew one by one….I mean I thought you all read special order 937 as well….That is very important because what it all means is a very bad plot contradiction…..you see in all these movies, even in Aliens Bishop says to Ripley “WELL that explains it well the A2’s were always a little bit twitchy that could never happen now with our behavioral inhibitors it is impossible for me to harm a human being yadda yadda yadda!!!……..Ahhh so even after creating David then Walter Weyland Corporation still puts a ridiculously malfunctioning artificial person - Hyperdyne Systems model 120-A/2 AKA – ASH on the Nostromo to infect the crew with what David has created so they can bring it back and study it, YOU ALL READ SPECIAL ORDER 937!!!!!!

Weyland Corp sends some ore mining space truckers to unwittingly get duped by incompetent ASH into exposing themselves to this thing???….HERE IS THE PROBLEM!!! Weyland Corporation already knows this is David’s creation it involves a “Superior species no doubt.” This is why they would have never sent a twitchy AI AKA ASH and some space truckers to go get it……they would have immediately gone there with an even bigger spaceship than Weyland’s research vessel and got what ever was on LV-426 with hundreds of extremely non twitchy sophisticated AI persons that could not be infected and would easily be able to get and control the Xenomorph…..you don’t think Weyland Corporation can’t make military versions of AI robots much faster, stronger, and more powerful than any Xenomorph…..it is also why Prometheus completely sux too…they would have never gone there with only some rifles and hand guns and a few scientists saying yo big dude engineers can you help us out like give us all your secrets....it's all laughable BULLSHITE!!!

HA! ALL LAUGHABLE NONSENSE, and you BigDave you have no excuse you have been defending this loop of senseless nonsense for years…..I digress though we need to save this franchise from all these bad things….I don’t see how yet or if it is even possible.

It is actually even a little more silly when you think about everything happening in real time in Prometheus because as everything is taking place in Prometheus it is being backed up to computers that are more intelligent than David and encrypted all while being sent back to Earth to go to Weyland Corporation’s AI systems…..So nothing really connects well with Alien. We are all stuck in this bad loop of films going so what….and then we lost the connection to all the colonists on LV-426, then Aliens happens and THEN RETCON…….GAME OVER MAN!

Ok so that’s my two cents Alien fans…..let the roasting begin! LOL

@Leto

Thanks! I changed it.

Need the history of khemfreaks....

BURNERS : An alien race...precursor to the Space Jockey. They burn their victims, then inhale the corpse(s) gases. Hence the Burners gas mask look.

MonsterZero

This is the way! In fact, it’s better than cooking the franchise in the swamp of prequels.

But I would remove one zero from 5200 > 520. Blaming WY after 5200 years - it's like complaining about Cheops. In addition, the hat will decompose much earlier. xDDD

Also, What's the point of having Earth in the story?

They might as well destroy it and leave how it was destroyed a mystery.

Set Alien 5 in the year 2533 where Earth is gone(destroyed), the tribes of Earth are scattered and are every bit as dangerous as the xeno.

Smith "Look Earth is gone, there's no going back!"

Jones "I'm not talking about Earth! More about Mars, the Sol system itself..Find some stuf.."

Smith "That system has been picked clean...there's nothing left..Nothing but khemfreaks and burners.."

Jones showed her his tattered hat, it was embroidered with a Weyland Corporation logo.

Jones “It’s real and from the twenty-first century!” , he boasted.

Smith grabbed it and shoved it in his face.

Jones “Hey!”

Smith “These bastards are the ones who started all this..” She attempted to tear it in two, failing to do so, she tossed it on the ground, stepping on it.

A shocked Jones retrieved his hat, knocking the dust from it. He didn’t care if Weyland Corp had gotten everybody on Earth killed, it was still a cool souvenir.

I don’t think that deep character development means: "The character behaves logically".

You can have a Shakespeare level in Alien. But if the script says - "A person licks the ovomorph". Then the deep quality of character will not save. At first glance, poor character development in Prometheus & AC is simply a consequence of observing the behavior of the characters in "special cases."

Millburn & Fifield were mediocre written supporting characters. Their role was to become victims. But it was served very rudely.

Same with Charlie & others. No matter how well written the characters are, when they scream YEEHAW, and rip off their helmets!

Same with Oram. Personally, I think this is a well-written character. At least, he is written better than Daniels (!!!). But then he just takes his head and puts it in the egg.

The problem is not the quality of the characters. But that they are forced to do stupid things.

Prometheus & AC have different screenwriters. And the fact that in both films the characters commit the same nonsense indicates that this is someone else's idea. Yes - we know whose idea it is! And I'm more than sure that if RS shoots a third film, the characters will do the same nonsense. Perhaps the maestro is trying to give us some kind of revelation?

@BlackAnt, same here! It's the one story angle that for me, has the most intrigue. I'm praying Disney lets Scott finish his prequel trilogy.

@Chris

Awesome art of the Engineer. Still have hope the story of the engineers continues in the next film.

Ha Ha YES indeed that could Explain Away some of the Flaws ;)

I think Moving On... and looking at the Hill/Giler idea we have to WONDER at WHAT point is it all a DREAM?

Could they be THROWING a Curve-ball in?

So it gives them the Opportunity to even go back and make ALIENS as a Dream.  I know this would GREATLY upset a MASS of Fans though.

However it could UPLIFT the Original Xenomorph.

Alien Resurrection we saw that Ripley 8 had the Xenomorph in her BLOOD.

If we had it that the Xenomorph in ALIEN had somehow Managed to Telepathically Implant itself into the SOUL of Ripley maybe that could be Interesting.  The reoccurring Dreams are just the TIP of the ICEBERG!

However i think the PREQUELS seem to give a LESSOR ROLE to the Xenomorph at Present.   So exploring the Beast having the Ability to Manipulate the Mind/Actions of someone it comes into Contact with could be a HARD STRETCH.

I think if the PLOT is about her Dreaming since she was on the Sulaco at the END of ALIENS... then it will be Interesting to see HOW do they Explore the Return of the Xenomorph and if they CHANGE anything or is it just another BUG HUNT?

I Wonder if they would EXPLORE some ideas from Earlier Drafts of ALIEN?

We know that O'Bannons earliest Draft was called Memory where he had NOT yet came up with the Life-Cycle.  Instead we had a Artifact that would STEAL the Memories of would be Explorers, which then Evolved to would be Explorers having LOOSE their Memories..

To then a Organism that Grows inside a Discovered Skull before we eventually get the LIFE-CYCLE and changes to become STARBEAST draft.

So i am Wondering if they have some Curve-Ball to give us rather than it just being a Blomkamp Alien 5 where Alien 3 on wards are Cryo-Dreams...  maybe something has EFFECTED our Ripley more than merely BAD DREAMS?

I think that as a Board Game then WHY NOT ;)

I dont think you have to Concentrate on ALIENS alone though.  With a Table Top Game they could Evolve the Xenomorph to give us Variants of it.

imagine the Scope with a Table Top/Board game based on Prometheus... by that going to Worlds where the Engineers have Horrors in Store.

I dont think seeing the Xenomorph in this FORMAT would do any more to reduce its Impact.  I think maybe with the Medium of Comics, Games and Board Games they could Experiment with some Evolution/Changes to the Beast and see how this goes down.

By that i mean you DONT have to stick to the Vanilla Flavor ;)

JUDGING by the Varied Replies here it shows the RANGE of what People Like/Dislike and would LIKE to see or NOT see.

The Prequels Certainly have been Divisive and YET they opened up a LOT to expand on BEYOND just Eggs and WHO laid them.

@Thoughts_Dreams

I do think that lot of EMPHASIS was on David, it seems the Prequels have Moved to be about HIM, where everything ELSE seemed to be Secondary.

I think the Arc does FIT with the THEMES of what Prometheus was trying to SHOW.  However it comes at the COST of Character Development.

For the MOST PART then the FIRST 3 Movies had Good Characters and Execution, but we SADLY have not seen that SINCE.... well NOT enough.

ALIEN 3 was Flawed, i dont think its Great, i Certainly think its above Average.   I think for some it was a Wasted Opportunity to NOT go and Carry On with Hicks and Newt.  But you can see WHY this had to happen.

I think in Context to FINDING the Greatness again... then its HARD because a LOT of that Greatness came from something NEW and UNKNOWN.

The Problem you have when doing a Franchise that REVOLVES around a SINGLE Monster is that IF this Monster has no Communication or Emotion then it is the STORY and Exposure to the THREAT that has to give the Monster its LEGS... this requires Good Characters.

The Xenomorph to me comes across like a Space Jason Voorhees (ALIEN and ALIEN 3) and with ALIENS then some Intelligent Space Termite.  I think you have MORE of a Millage out of the Xenomorph than JASON though, but my point being the MORE you see the MONSTER and the MORE the MONSTER just Repeats what it does... then it does-not have the same EFFECT.

This is WHERE you then have to EXPAND on a Story that gives more BACKGROUND to the Monster, while also with this Good Characters will PROP up the Monster... Poor Story Evolution and Characters and it FALLS on its Face.

With the ALIEN Franchise then it seems the BACKGROUND to try and RAISE the Xenomorph comes down to Exploring the WHO Created it and WHY and WHAT the Company would intend to DO with the Xenomorph.

The PROBLEM with Prometheus was that it Decided to TONE down such things and NOT to Directly involve the Xenomorph or give SOLID Clues....  But there was enough their to BUILD UPON and Explore in Future.

It was having to ACCEPT we are NOT getting a Literal Prequel that would Connect, but OPEN UP more Horrors that we can draw some Familiarity with.

The BIGGEST PROBLEM was with the Sequel then at some point we got a U-TURN to actually give us a Literal Prequel while TRYING to Carry Over some of the THEMES from Prometheus which CONCLUDED with the Decision to make DAVID as the Creator... 

This comes at the COST of throwing away other Plots that could have been Developed to SOLELY place this as a Davids Journey.... which i think came at the COST of Undeveloped Characters to UPLIFT the Story.

The Creator of the Xenomorph Plot surely should have been something that THEY would have known would have UPSET the Fanbase... but it seems that to RS that for him the Xenomorph was the PAST... and so WHILE they Changed the PLOT to BRING the Xenomorph Back... it seems RS felt that having David be the Creator would UPLIFT his Characters Role in the Franchise.

At the ULTIMATE COST of making the Xenomorph become a Lessor Footnote and taking AWAY the Unknown and Enigma of the MONSTER.

So THIS does make the Xenomorph become something LESS of a Enigma and this could EFFECT the Xenomorph in Future.

UNLESS they explore ways to UPLIFT the Beast beyond HOW is was Portrayed in the Franchise.

I think that Damage Control that David had merely STARTED a Project that the Engineers (or other Species) then EVOLVES to that Cargo on LV-426 is a WAY to BOTH restore the Origins of the Xenomorph to connected with a ALIEN Species, while also NOT Totally throwing out the Arc/Role that David had played.

The PROBLEM with a Continuation is if its seen as Financially Viable..... 

The Problem with making a NEW Franchise Movie is IF the Eventual Movie would just STICK to and PLAY it SAFE!

There is MORE to the Franchise than Ripley and Eggs and so you would HAVE to try and introduce the Xenomorph but do so in a way you can EXPLORE other things down the Line!