Comments (Page 556)

I could be on board with Daniels becoming a queen only if the character development was really good so it would have maximum impact.

I could actually be fine with less dying and more transforming/mutations.

The morphs are always neat but I would be ok to have them less prominent.

joylitt  Having some humans for the sake of having some humans would be the wrong move; the script should only include humans if it's necessary to tell a philosophical story. Symbolically, it feels more logical to discard humanity entirely for Awakening because of the intense anti-human stance of Alien Covenant. Covenant's story is very much to do with attacking human-centric ideology, and so it feels logical to have Awakening represent that attack by including no humans. 

The Engineers are a very risky idea as well, because having Engineers as main characters and even just as supporting characters would run the risk of destroying the classic movies; although in fairness I couldn't give a crap about Alien and Aliens at this point. If the Engineers can tell a great story but have to destroy the 1979 and 1986 films, so be it

trokanmariel I like that idea. A movie with just Engineers and no humans. That won't happen but a story that still features a few humans can be an Engineer movie in spirit.

Call replies firmly, "Not so long as there's a breath in me."

We're like neighbors dk in some futuristic, highly computerized and technologically advanced world analogy that we kind of live in.  I was just hoping you weren't falling out of interest of this thread.  It would hurt my feelings :(    I guess the problem with it, though, is that people can move faster than you can say, "Xenomorph.")

Yes, you are right. You cannot please every fan. But at least you can try to not offend most of the fans. And BTW the fans alone don't make a profitable movie, so the main focus should be to engage a larger audience with a groundbreaking story. Actually that's the word the Fox CEO recently used. Some of points you mention sound like formula. However, I would highlight your point # 5: answering questions, and not in a viral video, and not in the form of exposition. They have to embed those answers into the narrative through inquiry and revelations. And those revelations should not be predictable.

I'm apprehensive over Awakening mainly because of Upworth and Ricks, but also because of Covenant's overall sublime art. Bringing back Tennessee and Daniels can make sense, due to the intense evil nature of Alien Covenant's ending, but at the same time the evil nature of the ending was deeply philosophical. The other thing, is that the evil nature of the ending helps the meaning of Upworth and Ricks, so that would be reason to not bring back any crew members. 

I think Awakening needs to revolve around the Engineers, and not feature any human characters; this would help the symbolism of 1979's Alien, as it would mean that the 1979 film would be a definitive human story whereas Awakening would be a definitive alien story, just featuring extraterrestrials

The capture was a screen-grab Ati (mac: shift, command, and 4...simultaneous). Thank you again for links to Hallett and Hatton's material.

Ati  Linking Adam and Eve to Upworth and Ricks could make sense; what's definite, is that Upworth and Ricks put the priority of the mission above the safety of the Covenant crew. So they would seem to be protectors of the larger good. They never reach the planet, which is associated with individualism. The protectors of utilitarianism get slaughtered by individualism.

Emotionally, the interpretation of utilitarianism is neither here nor there. Utilitarianism is about the value of endgames, and in the film the concept of endgame gets attacked. This would then seem to make Upworth and Ricks into negative symbols, and my own emotional outlook is to want to see Upworth and Ricks as positive symbols

nice! Im counting down the minutes to read this

1. get out

2. covenant 

3. it

4.war for the planet of the apes

5. hoping that blade runner 2049 will make my list trailer alone makes my top 5.

Aight, thanks Big Dave.

IRaptus - There were some early concept art images of Covenant showing ships looking like the Icarus.

Alien is, of course, my favorite movie. Prometheus is my second, and Alien: Covenant is my third. 

I didn't get to see Kong: Skull Island when it came out in March, but when I saw it a dollar theater back in June, it was a surprisingly refreshing movie experience! I'm looking forward to its crossover with Godzilla.

Also, War for the Planet of the Apes was a very good movie, driven by the uniqueness of its premise and plot. I hope this isn't the end of the franchise!

I'm looking forward to Blade Runner 2049's release in less than 3 weeks!

that last one Near the Sun  is definitely a nod to the Icarus from Sunshine :)  

which is a cool ship

Thatttwhich iwwwwwwwhich iwhiwww

Lawrence of Arabia

'Hopefully we get some more news soon.'

Can't wait. My personal theory is that we will be informed about a new Alien movie after the first weekend of Blade Runner 2049.

BigDave - It reminds me of the ship Prometheus. :D

The beacon and Shaw's journey on Paradise I feel Scott wants to be ambiguous for the time being, to leave as much mystery as the original Alien did. I'm sure we'll get either a novel or comic in the future to detail what exactly happened.

Ingeniero and BigDave

I have the feeling that Scott wants the answer to this beacon question to stay in darkness forever.

It kind of reminds me to a degree, of a different take on the Blake 7 TV Show  Liberator Ship ;)

MonsterZero

'Of course AI/Weyland-Yutani could be sending them to the Origae system because they know something is there'

Yes, I agree with you, I think something similar is in the background.

I think the Crossing gives us a lot of clues... thats provided they are not just a massive lazy oversight by FOX/RS.

Its been discussed quiet a bit prior to the movies release.

Leads me to a Logical Explanation that Dr Shaw took Davids Body to another Hanger, and boarded a Engineers Juggernaught where one of TWO things happened.

1) David informed Dr Shaw that she would need to completely re-attach David before he could operate the Ships. This is something Dr Shaw was not prepared to do, she had to think hard as once David is back together she would be a little at his Mercy... so she went to recover supplies to last her a few Months while She and David built up a Trust to the Point She Re-attached him and they then left LV-223.

2) David informs Dr Shaw the journey is long, he can get the ship into Space with her Help, but  she would not survive the journey and would need to go into Cryo-sleep which would need David to modify the the device, which would require him to be put back together...  Dr Shaw had a conundrum, and she bargained to help David get into Orbit, but then she was cautious about putting David back together and so she decided prior to leaving and agreeing to Davids Offer, she would collect Supplies so she could survive for as long as she could in Space without being in Cryo-sleep.

Then again as per Option 1, it was a matter of Months before David had gained her Trust, and also maybe Shaws Provisions were running low and so she then re-attached David.

One of these TWO Scenarios are what i think must have happened... and it was really what i hoped the Prequel Novel would cover.. Until we found it it was actually a Covenant Mission Prequel.

I agree with BigDave:

"I however dont like the Origae-6 reference, i think its a bit to coincidence that the Prometheus Crew go off to a World that the Engineers used as a Outpost, to then have the Survivors off to a World that the Engineers inhabit and then a Human Ship just happens to end up being within 7 Weeks Travel from this place.."

I thought Origae-6 is well mapped and they know what is there? They seemed to know it was a good fit for a colony. ?

Of course AI/Weyland-Yutani could be sending them to the Origae system because they know something is there? and AI/WY  have been lying to them("it's perfect for a colony! Go build your cabin!")...Conspiracy angle.

BigDave

"I am worried FOX/RS have given up a bit on David Arc, and the Giant well not so Giant Humanoid Engineers and all the Philosophy etc"

I don't think this'll be the case considering Ridley is keen on this story. He listened to the fanbase once and now they're out for his head hopefully means he just won't lol If Awakening is to have any impact it must build on the trajectory already set in place by Prometheus and now Covenant which I believe is what Ridley always had in mind. To contradict or give up now would result in nonsense imo. Hopefully we get some more news soon.

I will have to read this Space Beast ;)

Indeed Morse was interrogated, and it would have been nice to maybe got some insight to what happened to him...  But it appears maybe the Company realized after the loss of Ripley that its just a BUST...

Until a much latter date United Systems Military successfully clone a Ripley from her DNA

Lawrence of Arabia - Thank you very much!

Ingeniero - I wanted to use that female Engineer image from Hatton's page as well, how did you copy it? :)

"Why are there three of this topic?"

Happens sometimes... ive locked the others.. and sometimes it happens when your making a Topic and the Server or your connection is closed/crashes.  Other time is if the user is a New poster and their Topics will not appear right away.

But the more posts like replies/activity you have the sooner you posted Threads will appear.

I am concerned myself...

I think i can work out the plan they had... which would maybe need at least TWO movies... maybe a 3rd if David gets up to much Shenanigans on the Covenant.

I am worried FOX/RS have given up a bit on David Arc, and the Giant well not so Giant Humanoid Engineers and all the Philosophy etc

I think they will cover the Xenomorph as far as how we get to so many Eggs, i fear this means we will get a Proto-Queen.. which may not mean a Xeno Queen but at least some Hybrid that many Eggs can come from...

We we get links and a Story that now takes us away from the Prequels about Davids Journey and bring in the Ripley Family Store :(

And i think he will introduce us to another Race that will play a key role, and i wonder if this will show us the Engineers in a much more lesser light... and they are just Pawns for some other Race.

i only hope they can tie in the Ancient Mythos to these beings, and that RS is not gonna give us some Race who are more Alien and have nothing to do or link to mankind's interpretations of GOD

Which may still work out ok.... im just concerned about the QUEEN and RIPLEY... No thanks.. been done to Death... Give us the New Born instead lol

So many secrets... :D

Here you go Ati!

https://jobwillins.tumblr.com/post/165299936047/about-paradise

Ingeniero - Thank you for the zoom, :), like an alien egg... :)

IRaptus and BigDave and Ingeniero - I'm happy you like them. My fav is the first one, I love that ship! Would be good to see something similar on screen.

i think this was one of the BIG Questions fans was looking forwards to when Ridley Scott started work on a Prequel to Alien, a lot of Evolution has taken place since then... from Broad Ideas, to Prometheus Drafts, to Prometheus to what ever ideas was worked on prior to John Logans Alien Covenant.

Back to Alien...

We could see their was a Relationship, the Pilot, and his Ship looked Bio-Mechanical, and especially the Derelict, it shared a Atheistic with the Xenomorph and you could say the Face Hugger kind of did so with the Space Jockey.  You could just see there was a connection, as if the Xenomorph, Space Jockey and Derelict all originated from the same Source..  They Aesthetically looked similar.

Aliens (or Alien DC) pushed this more so, when we saw the Hive like Construction Aesthetic the Xenomorphs used, and how similar it was to the construction of the interior of the Derelict.

The Relationship we could see was that the Cargo somehow was related in some Fashion to the Ship and its Pilots, it was further evolved that this Cargo was a Bio-Weapon that the Space Jockey was Transporting and so at least we had this LINK...

Prometheus came along and to start with the idea as far as Xeno/Engineer was that these Engineers had indeed been experimenting on various forms of Xenomorph related Bio-Weapon, as much as 8 different kinds.  Alien Engineers seemed to allude to the possibility that the Engineers posessed a Genetic Manipulation Tool, Tiny Nano Scarabs, that they used to allow their DNA to eventually Evolve into Mankind... and that on LV-426 (which is where the Outpost was in Alien Engineers). these Engineers had likely been using this Genetic Tool on some Organism Discovered related to the Xenomorph, and they attempted to Hybrid various forms of it... while a bit ambiguous it could be that the kind of Spore/Cocoons Hanging from the Caves that Holloway discovered could be the Origins of the Xeno DNA that the Nano-Scarabs was used to Experiment and Hybrid it.

Prometheus however was more ambiguous, but the clues appear that something similar was at play on LV-223 (Mural/Frescos) but it was so ambiguous that its not really 100% clear of the connection.

The only Link really was that indeed these Engineers and the Black Goo contained within the Urns are connected to the Xenomorph, it either came from the Xenomorph (or via use of Sacrificial Goo on Xenomorph) or from some Organism that predates the Xenomorph.

Alien Engineers, the Aesthetic seemed to be the Engineers/Ships are more Mechanical and Organisms more Organic... but some concepts do show this connection being more closer to that of ALIEN.

Prometheus however the Engineers/Ships Tech appear more Mechanical, while the Xeno-related Organism more Organic, and the Space Jockey suits some how being a mixture of the TWO.

Then we come to ALIEN-COVENANT and well this baby has a lot of answers, and yet contradicting answers its a bit of a mess, but it appears that David's Bombardment maybe affected the Envirmoment, or if not the crash of the Juggernaught did, in a way that various Life Forms and Fungi got infected with the Black Goo and Produced Hybrids.

David witnessed these and using  them as well as Black Goo he conducted many experiments, trying to mix traits from various Organic Life, and Bacterial/Fungi, trying to take the best traits from each and mix them all together to Produce PERFECTION.

Which the Eggs that hosted the Xenomorph Face Huggers where the greatest success he had, that required Dr Shaw for his success.

THUS the Black Goo came from something related to the Xenomorph, and various experiments lead to the Xenomorph by David...

However the Novel and some comments by Concept Artist do give us some light that David may have caused a outbreak to infect Life on the Planet but he also discovered something related to the Xenomorph Eggs that was already there, and David just applied these to his experiments in a attempt to Perfect the Xenomorph Egg.

But this all is regarding the Xeno Origin as far as Covenant so forgive me, the Fact is that Alien Covenant does not give us any more clues to the Xeno connection to the Engineers, that Prometheus had not laid down.

some concept works, and comments could allude to the Engineers maybe using a older more Original Xenomorph or the Xenomorph in some kind of Sacrificial Ritual... but looking at how visually Alien Covenant presented the Engineers, i find it difficult to see what protective measures where taken from the Engineers as far as containing the Eggs. And Protection from Infection.

I will however say that i have not yet heard any of the Commentary on Alien Covenant by Ridley Scott and much of the stuff concept artist have mentioned over the last 8 weeks... while i have been away from the Internet etc LOL

So these could change my Two Cents, well interpretations.

Great point BigDave.

"she may have used something in the wreckage or the Life Boat."

Dr. Shaw was in a rush to gather supplies the moment she opened the door to the lifeboat and easily could have grabbed a means to communicate.

This of course was before the tall fellow with a very poor attitude showed up.

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BigDave

"Regarding the Concept work you had done for the Temple Dome, Entrance for Alien Covenant, i noticed the Doors have Females, and not Engineer looking ones and the entrance also has Humanoids and again with Hair and Beards...  was this just your idea, or did this kind of Humanoid Aesthetic have something or was supposed to have something to do with the Engineers History or Mankinds?"

That is an existing painting copied on the wall. If I remember well it conveys a kind of religious message (the scene shown by the painting) but it is not about the Engineers' history. 

Thanks for sharing. I hope it will be helpful for too many people that are searching for this topic.bandarq online

Here is a zoom of the central portion where it meets the ground. 

There are root-like structures at the base. Good work, nice detail.

Lawrence of Arabia - Can we download it? Does Willins have a site? I haven't jumped to the source yet...

This is a great source supporting the Weyland Industries corporate timeline, see below.

The Weyland Century (1990-2104)

"Dates for the events in Covenant are based around the December 5, 2104 date mentioned on screen.  Walter says they have 7 more recharges over the course over the next 7 years and four months.  This equates to around 11 months travel time between jumps, meaning the Covenant left Earth around January 2104.  Ricks says it’s ‘a few weeks’ to Planet 4, however the number on a blurry and pixelated video screen appears to say ‘2 weeks’.  Supporting this data is the Covenant novelization saying that Daniels had been in hypersleep for months; not years.  More details regarding the Origins novel cannot be released at this time."

The above calculation is also very respectful of those not wanting to walk into spoilers from the prequel novel. We might need ground rules on that from admin and others. I'll respect spoiler-free wishes.

This analysis above also reconciles with the Alien: Covenant novelization.

"Woozy from months spent in hypersleep, she..."

Alien: Covenant novelization, page 28.