Comments (Page 228)

some Good Points Thoughts_Dreams

The Purpose of this Topic was to think HOW can the give us Alien Movies in context to being about Aliens as in Xenomorphs or Related, that does-not have to revolve around David or Ripley.

Introducing the Engineers could be interesting, it depends on WHERE/WHEN we do a Movie where they are introduced as we need to be careful to NOT step on the Toes of the Franchise.

So if we want Engineers with Xenomorphs or Similar then we have to maybe either be set in a place FAR away from where the Alien Franchise takes place or a Time-Line thats AFTER the Alien Franchise.

Which as i said IF the Xenomorph Origins are via David then this limits any encounter that would include the Engineers to maybe introduce something that is LESS Xenomorph.

The Prequels have been Hit/Miss....  Prometheus intending to go off to something different, but FOX feeling that Fans wanted Xenomorphs and Origins and so we ended up with Alien Covenant.

Where do you take the Prequels?  This is something thats HARD to continue and please a lot of people.

A Nostalgia Reboot of Alien 3 is not the Answer, and a continuation of Alien Resurrection about Ripley does-not have to be the ONLY way to carry on the Alien (Xenomorph) Franchise.

So there are other ways to cover the Xenomorph or similar, and if we want to throw the Engineers into the Mix, its limited unless we explore Monsters that are not quite Xenomorphs, unless they go the route that David did-not create the Xenomorph.

I think the NEXT ideal way to explore the Franchise is one of these!

1) A Alien Prequel that visits LV-223. (Give clues to Xenomorph but maybe not have them).

2) A Aliens Sequel that goes to LV-426 (Cover Xenmorphs but maybe change things a bit)

3) A Alien Resurrection Sequel (that could change things a bit and does-not have to have Ripley 8).

4) A Parallel Alien Resurrection Movie (that covers what happened to the Failed Ripley 7 Clone Queen)

5) A Mission to another World that the Engineers have experimented on, or that there experiments originated from (prior to LV-223) or other World they had used Bio-Weapons on.

"A random idea: I would like to see how the Xenos work without a queen"

I think that would be interesting as well as discover HOW/WHEN a Queen comes to be.

OT pic looks like an actual Giger work for a Danzig album:

The Image in the OT as far as i am aware is NOT by HR Giger, i dont think Cameron had borrowed anything (that was already borrowed prior) from HR Giger apart from the Queen has Similar Hands to one of HR Gigers works.

I dont think Cameron is the only one who has not given HR Giger as much Credit as he deserved.

I don't think he copied it. It's a shame Giger wasn't mentioned. Giger is listed in the actual credits under "other crew" as original alien designer. 

To not have it centered around the Xeno is fine but they need to center around the human journey and have human characters that are a lot better than what we have had this far in the prequels. I do not give a F about the android tale, they can flush that down the toilet. Give us more about the Engineers, they are interesting.

Sure the AVP-s were not good but the prequels have good parts about them and bad parts which make them average. His ideas about the Engineers in Prometheus might have been right but the human characters lacked. I am tired of the evil android kind of thing that AC turned into, that was crap when there were no human characters to care for but if they would have gotten more of the humans OK then I would not have complained even though David was still the creator of the monster (an idea that in itself is dumb human creating android creating a monster, it makes it too close to humans, I want it to be from another world which makes it more unknown).

Nah, my problem with Prometheus was not the lack of Xenos, it was about poorly written and/or executed human characters. Look around the www and you will see that.

Leto:

"Just look at the cut scenes from Prometheus - they are better than final cut! Better."

Exactly

About cutting scenes. Maybe it is not only that but also since they need a run-time in the movie theaters. The shorter the movies are the more tickets you can sell so you can show it more each day which potentially means $. Sometimes make it shorter might help but not in this case (Prometheus) when they cut out important parts. Most of what were cut out (at least of what I have seen) should have been left in because it builds characters, make some things look less stupid, and so on. I am not sure how they thought when they were editing it, because they made a shit job there compared to how it could have been. Sometimes I watch Prometheus so it is not totally crap but it is disappointing when I think about how it could have been.

I agree that they could try to show us an Ultramorph, that could be interesting but since they seem to be bigger they should also maybe be more difficult to kill. It should not be so easy as to just kill them with a rifle.

If they make characters that we can connect with, stop the android crap, and introduce something new then why not? The Engineers is something that could be expanded on (not really new but at least it is fresher than the Xeno and more interesting than the androids). About the prequels, if they do not continue with it then I would not be sad because they have turned what could be interesting into a yawn.

No thanks to Blomkamp, it would be a recycling at least if they have Ripley and Hicks in it. If they do not have them then maybe it could work but anything that retcons Alien 3 is something that I will be against.

Maybe they could find things that are interesting in the shorts and expand on that. At least they were better than what we have been given after Alien 3.

No Ripley and no David thank you very much. Ripley is done and David is not very interesting to me after Alien Covenant. The theme of an android that has gone bonkers could work if they have human characters that are well written but AC did not have that in general.

I would rather start it all over than to continue with the prequels if that means more David at the cost of everything else, also please no more Ripley, or AVP.

Maybe LV-426 is not needed, I enjoy seeing new worlds although that is not enough. Did they not visit LV-426 in Aliens too? Give me other worlds that I can see how they look like.

"IF we assume David is the Creator of the Xenomorph…"

No thanks, that is crap. They need to change that in the franchise the faster they do that the better.

A random idea: I would like to see how the Xenos work without a queen, that would be interesting. Would they figure out another structure to communicate and so on? Not having a queen could mean more than egg-morphing but I am not sure how.

This has character development and is a lot better than the movie.

How did they manage to get such a huge mess of what it became? I am just shaking my head

Good work Neo-Jockey

Please do not let it be as disappointing as Covenant if there will be one. He might talk about the scariness and monsters but in reality he is only interested in David which I have no interest in. When they say that he is in talks about a sequel to Covenant I get worried.

To show something else in the last movie than the standard Xeno is alright, so we still have to make some guesses to how the Xeno came to be but do not make another android movie. I am worried that we will get a David 3 kind of thing which would be crap after all this waiting and discussions if we would get another movie or not. That would be like trying to make a cake waiting for it to be done in the oven and when the waiting is over it turns out to taste horrible, I don't want it to be like that. Do not give us a Covenant 2 or rather another movie about David.

"A third prequel, which he will direct, is in the script phase."

They do not tell us where that came from where they say that they are about to write another prequel so I am not sure about that. Variety is a magazine, I would like to hear from some official channel before I take that as a fact. Do not believe in everything that you read. We will have to wait and see and get info from better place than that.

I do not care about what kind of world that David would create because I do not want a movie about him. AC was about David and his journey and it flopped so why risk money on another movie about the same character? From a money and profit point of view it just seems bad to do so. Hopefully we have seen the last part of the robot thing so we can put that aside. Either make good/well-written human characters or stop it

At this point I am eager to see more character developments, especially David. A Shaw return would be interesting either as a flashback or as a resurrection. I would like to see how Ash involved in Nostromo, also some background of Nostromo would be interesting for the last prequel of ALIEN. and no more Xenomorph, enough already!!! 

He certainly has Ambition to do a Sequel, IF they (Disney) came up to him and said, "right we want to do a Alien Movie, it may be a Prequel or it may be a Alien movie set after Alien, and we want you on board".

I think Ridley Scott would jump at the chance, he would likely say "ok i will work on a Alien Movie as long is IF it is a success i can Finish off my Prequels next".

I think he is very inspired by the Fans Love for the Franchise and was Flattered by that High School Play of ALIEN.  It would be interesting to see if he watched the Anthology Shorts and what he thinks about them.

@DinosaurRaghhh

I think he is interested in such themes, such as Blade Runner, and i think some people seem to look at AI in a Narrow way as in ROBOTS...  but the Term Applies to Creating Life in a Artificial way that has some Intelligence to it.

so in that context the Xenomorph could be AI, the Replicants are AI, and the Prometheus Engineers could be AI.

Ridley Scott is a Fan of these themes as well as others from Prometheus, because he felt the Franchise could expand beyond the Xenomorph, and expanding on the Engineers you could cover more than just a Race who only deal with Xenomorphs.

You can bet that Alien Covenant was not the route RS would have likely wanted the sequel to Prometheus to go, but the Studio felt we needed to give the Xenomorph Origins and bring the Beast Back..... and so RS had decided (maybe) to bring in some of the AI elements and Prometheus Themes in context to David and the Xenomorph.

In Hindsight ONE of TWO things should of happened.

*Prometheus should have had more Clues to the Xenomorph and had some more Action/Monster Scenes like the Neomorph from Alien Covenant rather than just Zombie Fifield and a Deacon that we dont see what happens next.

Then enough may have been done to make the Xenomorph connection LESS ambiguous and with some Xenomorph like Monster Scenes the Fans would have been more Happy and then a Sequel could STEER away from Alien, as in a different Franchise (not about Xenomorphs) Prometheus then could have Closed the Door to Alien, then gone off and done something different in sequels.

OR

*They should have done a TWO Alternative Sequels to Prometheus, the First being a Mission to LV-223 which would take a more Alieny Movie that would have Xenomorph related Monsters, offer more Clues to the Xenomorph/Derelict and LV-223 Outbreak and Experiments and thus Close the Door to Alien

The Second being where David and Dr Shaw would be heading (Engineers Home-world) and have them go FAR FAR FAR away and NOT right on the Door-step to LV-426.  Where Ridley Scott would have Freedom to offer a Alternative Franchise that is NOT about the Xenomorph.

But ALAS... Hindsight is a Wonderful thing.. but something that cant change the Past!

This is only a Rumor and if there is some Element of Truth then it could be a case of Misinterpretation, i think it would be more likely that Cameron is pushing for a Aliens Sequel this would be more Easier, because you could set it 25-30 years latter and bring back the Gang without using CGI or Time-Travel etc.

I am Only a Fan of seeing Miss Weaver in a Alien 5 as in sequel to Alien Resurrection, but IF a Alien 3 Reboot is made then i would accept it as a Alternative Path and give it a chance on its own Merits.

A Aliens Prequel that is to feature Ripley would be.. well Ridiculous if you ask me...  whats the point? it would conflict the Franchise maybe.... well we did have that One Novel that was about Ripley set between Alien and Aliens, i have not read it as i think its a SILLY idea.... and then you have to use CGI! 

It cant be a Reboot of Alien..... as Alien is mentioned in Aliens and the crew of the Nostromo are shown (well some) in the briefing between Ripley, Burke and Company Executives.

HOWEVER.......

What if this is a Alien Isolation Sequel?

Considering the Games are not quite Movie Canon... but could be.... 

If we go by Amanda Ripley as seen in James Cameron's movie ALIENS, then Sigourney Weaver at present does look a lot like the Amanda Ripley from ALIENS, but without CGI Overlay she would only be able to play a Amanda set what 5-10 years prior to  ALIENS?

But i guess such a Time-Frame could cover her Death and show that it was related to events after Alien Isolation in a Conspiracy the Company wanted her DEAD!

Otherwise.... doing a Prequel to ALIEN were clearly Sigourney Weaver has aged 30+ years (could pass for 20 years older than in Alien/Aliens... but your not gonna get her looking like she is in her Early 30's without LOADS of CGI.  So i think this would not make any sense.

To play a Amanda Ripley in her 50's i think Miss Weaver could pull that off with not much CGI etc, to pull of a Amanda Ripley in her 60's would be Easy.  But to play a Ellen Ripley in her early 30's would just not work really.

Unless the CGI is exceptional.... but this is expensive and only ideal for Short Cameo's and you can have the chance of it being Shocking rather than looking Realistic.

Certainly DK

As discussed a few times there is Scope for expanding the Franchise beyond Movies and some Elements are best suited to a TV/Streaming Service.

Weyland-Yutani are not just about trying to obtain a Xenomorph, just as much as the Engineers are not just about creating such Horrific Bio-Weapons.

I am not 100% sure a Weyland-Yutani Series would be beneficial to be looking at the Xenomorph, but maybe the odd part would not hurt, but there are MANY other things Weyland-Yutani do.

Likewise a Colonial Marines TV/Streaming would also be something  to consider as once again these Marines do-not solely just go around trying to take out Xenomorphs.

In context to doing Anthology Movies, the idea is basically like looking at some of the Expanded Novels, or those TV Shorts and imagining these being expanded into a Movie.

So a Anthology Movie could be a group of unrelated to a degree Movies that would feature Xenomorphs or similar (Deacon, Neomorph or other variants).  or it could become a NEW series of Movies that are separate to the Ripley/Alien Saga or Davids Prequels.

You could maybe introduce Engineers in them, if you are careful about them not contradicting or affecting the Alien Franchise.  Some Movies could be more a Aliens/Alien Resurrection type Action Based, others could be more a Alien/Alien 3 Haunted House/Survival Horror type or maybe a Balance of the Two.

Number of Avenues to explore.... some of these are related to the Prequels, which is maybe better to NOT touch, such as LV-223, Planet 4, and Origae-6 mainly because we have NO conclusion with the Prequels and so intentions of what becomes of these places.  But that does-not mean a Alien Movie set after Alien could-not take place on such Worlds.

We have LV-426 and so when looking at Colonial Marines Game, a similar Plot could work (The company go back to the Derelict and attempt to obtain/extract it).  We could wonder what happened to Failed Ripley Clone 7 removed Queen.

Or we could go to other Worlds/Avenues that are NOT in the Alien Franchise....   I think that Alien Covenant has caused a Problem with this however...

By that IF it is that David Creates the Xenomorph, so that his Beast from AC will Evolve to become that in Alien/Aliens, then looking at the Aesthetic we see the Xenomorph in Alien Covenant, Alien, Aliens, Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection all have a similar look..... compared to the Deacon and Neomorph.

So we have to assume any Movie that would introduce Xenomorphs we would have to assume these Originated from David's Experiments and got to the SAID World/Ship via a Event after Alien Covenant.

Because we have to assume the Aesthetic Design of those Xenomorphs came from David's various Experiments and Combining different Organisms, and so in context to David Creates the Xenomorph, then other NONE Created Horrors from the Black Goo and Engineers Experiments would look DIFFERENT, but have some similarities... like how the Deacon and Neomorph are Different but have some Similarities.

Where as before Alien Covenant or IF we are shown that David did-not Create the Xenomorph and so its been around for Thousands of Years, then any Expanded Movie could encounter Xenomorphs or very Similar in any place really.

double post

Fincher could revisit the wooden world but I think he is still at least a little upset over A3.

Ahaha.

Ridley working on AC2

Cameron working on Aliens prequel

What next?

Fincher working on Alien 3 retcon?

Jeunet working on Alien: Earthbound?

. i am surprised nothing was teased on Alien Day, if they are under work on something.

I remember RS posting he waned Indies to scare him on 4/26 with the IGN supported shorts. It was hard to imagine he wasn't fishing for at least a vibe from the Alien crowd. 

Ridley still seems way too obsessed without AI to make this a success.  Maybe he is enacting his own hopes of being made immortal via robotics and can’t see the wood for the trees....

Can’t see...

It's only a rumor but I will bite. I think Dark Nebula makes a great point.

Also, Isolation was before Aliens or could have been around the same time- I forgot the time lines.

I keep coming back to the idea of a non theater series to explore all these nuanced things a 2 hour movie cannot cover. For example, exploring WY and perhaps the Xeno but keeping it looser and calling it (like BD) suggested) Building Better Worlds.

Jim Cameron wants to give a dark fate to the alien franchise.

A prequel to Aliens, hmmm... The only way I see that could happen is a film that takes place between Alien (1979) and Aliens (1986). Something like Alien: River of pain or Aliens: Fire and stone. The only reason I read the river of pain was that I was extremely curious about what Newt's parents got to see inside of the derelict, and I was surprised to read there was a battle between the xenomorphs and the engineers inside.

Aliens: fire and stone is more interesting from my point of view, in it during the xenomorph outbreak on LV-426 a group of survivors escape and crashland on LV-223. There they try to survive from xenomorphs (that got onboard), and other black goo mutations. One scientist got interested in the black goo and tried to learn about it, and about the engineers. 

Based on some of the comments by James Cameron regarding Prometheus and Alien: Covenant, he seems interested in the Engineer mythos. If that prequel film ever happens, I just hope Engineers make an appearance. 

"I mean - it's Queen/Aliens route, not Alien."

I think i know what you mean now ;)    what i was meaning by Alternative Alien Movie.  Is not a Remake of Alien or such, but just more Alternative Alien Franchise movies, that dont have to say follow Ripleys Story... or Davids.

So for Example.... Alien Isolation is such a Alternative Story.   Likewise the Various Novels.... say for example. Alien: The Cold Forge

So its like suggesting if we had Movies instead of Novels, but in a way that the Story/Plot does-not conflict with any of the Franchise Movies.   I will have to read some of the Novels.... the only Ones i ever had are ALIEN and ALIENS as in Official Novel of the Movie..  but that was many years ago.

I have Alien Covenant Origins but i misplaced it and had yet to read it.  So i will have to read some of the other Novels and just enjoy or try to enjoy them for what they are, i dont have to consider them Canon.

Certainly Leto...

We can introduce Engineers in a Alternative Alien Movie or sequel to one, this could then get Fans Interested in the Engineers, and then they could go and do a Expanded Engineers Franchise that does-not have to be about Xenomorphs.

"I can't imagine how Alternate ALIEN movie can be a precursor to Alien: Resurrection? I mean - it's Queen/Aliens route, not Alien."

With the Example above i was thinking its open to explore a connection.

By that Alternative Movie (1)  (Path 2) could cover a return to LV-426 and obtain the Derelict, which could be like a Blomkamp Idea meets Colonial Marines, as in they Discover and Dig Up the Derelict and then Erect a Hanger Around it, and the END of this Movie we see LV-426 Destroyed like the Death Star in Star Wars.

The Connection to Alien Resurrection is this shows us 100% WHY it was 200 years after Aliens and WHY they had to resort to Clone Ripley... so we get none of the could the Derelict had Survived.

Alternatively Alternative Movie (1)  (Path 1) could END with a Sequel  (Alternative Movie (2)) to these Events, where they still have a Specimen, or obtain one.  But then at the END of this one we are shown the Specimens are Destroyed, this giving us insight to WHY they had to Clone Ripley in Alien Resurrection.

Alternatively the other route to Alternative Movie (2) (Path 3) would be a Sequel or Parallel Story to Alien Resurrection, like what happened to Ripley 7 Queen could this had been Shipped to another place for Study?  or Alternatively is there something to be Salvaged from the Auriga?  And so would not connect to Alternative Movie (1)  those Arrows are only to show Potential Routes

I had a few years ago came up with 4 Alternative Alien Movies as such.

*Parallel Movie to Alien Resurrection were a sample of Ripley 8 DNA and the Failed Ripley 7 Queen are shipped off to a Outpost near Jupiter.

*Sequel to Alien Resurrection, were Ripley 8 begins to Evolve into a Hybrid (her Xeno DNA overtaking her Human) so she is taken to a place by Call where some Autons can Save her... but they instead use her to Produce Xenomorph Hybrids.

*Alternative Movie where a Human Mining Colony are struggling to Mine through a New Mineral so they send in for a more Powerful Drill, this uncovers a Cavern with some Ancient Related Xenomorph Beast and latter a Engineer Ship... this was intended to kind of tease where the Engineers uncovered a Organism they then used to Re-Engineer into the Xenomorph.

*The USCSS Patna leaves Empty Handed but they do have the Face Hugger that Infected Ripley and they Experiment with this, and create a Hybrid.

Those were 4 Stories i had began to a degree... but abandoned... the Ripley 8 one i had the other month came up with a Alternative that will bring back Newt, and change the Plot a bit...

I get loads of ideas in the Franchise as far as a Broad Synopsis and Plot Points the Movie idea would follow, but then i dont get FAR as far as to Flesh them out beyond say a 4-5 Page Idea.

"we can return to a story that resembles with Prometheus 2, keeping always in mind David's closure."

I think this would be HARD... because a we are on a Prequel Route to ALIEN, it seems the Plan is to drive us to ALIEN and show the Events of HOW/WHEN it is David's Xenomorphs end up on the Derelict.... which means its Expected to be about Xenomorphs, and anything that does-not be about them too much, could be a Distraction.

Going the Route of Alien Covenant to bring back the Xenomorph and give the Answers, has Cursed/Shackled the Prometheus Franchise, its now expected to be about the Xenomorph.

A Alien Covenant 2 that has as much Xenomorph/Answers as Prometheus could be Risky... if this Bombs, then how do they then make a Sequel that would lead to the Xenomorph and those Eggs in ALIEN?

So any sequel would have to touch upon the Xenomorph to at least the extent that Alien Covenant had done, i feel any less could potentially put fans who want Xenomorphs off, and its those Fans who make them the $$$$

In Hindsight we should have done a Prometheus Sequel that would go back to LV-223 and be more Alieny but could have New Monsters, but give more clues to Alien to appease the Fans.

Then a Alternative Sequel could have gone off to a VERY FAR place with David and Dr Shaw and not be Shackled down to the ALIEN Franchise.

I think Ridley Scott was VERY passionate about the Prequels, as indeed he decided to Direct a Prometheus Sequel, instead of a Blade Runner One.

I think RS wanted to expand beyond Xenomorphs in the Franchise, but with Alien Covenant, it kind of limited this Scope as its Expected to be about Xenomorphs now, but it seems even as of Alien Covenant we see RS had some Big Plans to even go past 2-3 more Prequels.

We have to wonder what his War of the Worlds comment was about, but in part it was maybe a tongue in cheek comments towards FOX, suggesting that RS felt that he could really take the Franchise Places that would span Beyond a few Movies.

His Age could be a Problem, you can be sure that as he had taken his Final Shot during Shooting for Alien Covenant, that he would have been Hopeful to push out 1-2 more Movies within 5 Years after wrapping up on Alien Covenant.

so had things gone to plan and say Alien Covenant made $350-400M instead of $240M at the Box Office, then its likely we would have had a Sequel THIS Year with another in 2-3 years...

The Disappointment of Alien Covenant both Financially and Critically and the Take Over Talks, really placed a Sequel in LIMBO!

Micheal Fassbenders AGE is also a concern, because the Longer any Sequels that will Feature him take to be made, the Harder it would be for him to pull off being a 35 Year Old Looking Humanoid... 

So ideally i bet RS thought that after Alien Covenant they would be making another TWO movies over a say 5 year Period.... but NOW we are in Limbo.

I would assume IF they had plans to release another Movie in the next 2 years then ALIEN DAY 2019 would have seen them Tease Something... 

I dont really see anything Concrete at the Moment, surely the Plans was there, FOX was considering a TV Series but Ridley Scott and  Emma Watts wanted to carry on with the Prequels.... and it seems things had began to happen as far as Ideas and Plans...  

But it seems Production was not close, in part due to the Impending Take Over, so it will be a Waiting Game to see when Disney decide to Green Light any Alien Movie.

Disney own the Franchise, the Franchise makes Money from NOT only Movies, and they can make Money from these other Formats in the Mean Time...

So they would not be in any Rush..... which the longer its left the less likely or harder it would be to Cover David.

This is not a Problem for Blomkamps Alien 5, as if this was to not be made until 5 years Time, as they just have his Alien 3 Reboot set 30 Years after ALIENS... as opposed to 20 years after as Blomkamp had intended.

I have a feeling that the NEXT movie we will see would be a Blomkamp/Cameron one be it a Reboot of Alien 3 or just using his ideas in a NEW Alien Movie. (No Ripley etc).  As i think Disney would see this as a SAFE BET.

@SuperBerserker

I think you raise some interesting points, Ridley Scott has been accused of NOT being a Cameron Fan, but i think he respects him as a Director and he had even said the Queen made Sense and he did-not seem to dislike Aliens.

I think a lot of RS comments about the Shoot-Em-Up aspect is that he feels there is only so many Times you can go over and keep making such Movies, which some may agree with and so may not.  I think he has a point, you have to change things a bit or you could end up just having a Starship Troopers with Xenomorphs.

I think Ridley Scott does have a habit of making some Contradicting comments so you can never be 100% sure what his Real Stance would be.  I think he certainly was Frustrated at HOW the sequel to ALIEN came about, he in part viewed Alien as a Stand Alone and thought when you do a Sequel you run the Risk of NEVER being as close to the Original.... Aliens was on of the Rare Occasions where a Sequel was actually Pretty Good.

I think its mainly as RS had a certain idea about what the Xenomorph was and would be at that time, and his sequel  would have just been Different, it seemed he wanted the Xenomorph to be portrayed as Very Intelligent and also wanted to go off to a Very Alien world...

Things happen in the Industry and so Directors sometimes have NO input on the Sequels... the same reason that Cameron was disappointed in HOW we saw Hicks, Newt and Ripley Killed off in Aliens...  but it has to be Accepted, like the Queen has to be.   Unless a Director can produce Multiple Sequels then things WILL change out of their hands, and even when a Director gets to do Back-to-Back Movies sometimes Changes happen due to what the Studio want (Alien Covenant).

"But for me it is well explained that he wants us to forget Aliens, Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection."

I dont think he was a Fan of Alien Resurrection, he definitely thought the AVP idea was silly but then he claims he has NOT seen them....   But the point you RAISE, may be very very Valid!

During the Release of Alien Covenant, he commented on how you could go a Few more Rounds with the Xenomorph but you had to EVOLVE him, he then mentioned he could see Multiple Sequels to Alien Covenant.... AND.... the Biggest Thing he said was that you could BRING BACK Ripley, you could De-Age Her!

This is a ODD comment to make....  in what Context would you bring her back?  a Prequel to ALIEN?  Doubt It... a Sequel to Aliens and so doing a Blomkamp to Alien 3?

Or could this comment be a indication that RS would attempt to make his OWN sequel to ALIEN and bring back Ripley and thus doing a Blomkamp to Aliens!  This would be a Mistake!

I personally do think there is NOT a lot you can do with the Xenomorph in Context to this Queen that Lays Eggs that Produces Xenomorphs....  i think if your going to make 2-3 more Alien Movies that would be about the Queen, then you have to try and change things a bit..  Offer Evolution to the Appearance, Procreation or the Mindset of the Species.

Alien Resurrection attempted this with the Hybrid as in NewBorn but this never went down too well.  some Fans would be Happy to have Multiple Alien Movies that dont mess with and keep to the same Queen, Eggs and Xenomorph Formula...     I think IF we kept to this Trope/Aspect then they have to try and do something NEW as far as the Human Interaction/Discovery and Agenda of the Xenomorph, as the Company uses Unaware groups of Humans to obtain a Xenomorph and then a Hero/Heroin comes to Save the Day is something i think we cant keep repeating.

We NEVER saw what the companies managed to achieve, in Alien Resurrection we got the closest but NO Soon as they used the Prisoner Hosts to Harvest some Xenomorphs... things went to POT!

It would be interesting to wonder what happens if they Successfully manage to Contain the Specimens, what the Plans Next?   Just to see how they react and then deem them a Good Weapon and then just Take a Queens Eggs to be Stored as a Bio-Weapon.

Or could they attempt to Experiment and Harness the Xenomorph in other ways?

I think you do need to try and change things and EVOLVE the Xenomorph or the Intention for wanting them.  And Experimenting on them could become a Hubris if say the Xenomorphs Evolve.

I think another way to look at this would be to ask the Fans...

What would have happened if Ripley, Hicks, Newt had Never made it off LV-426... they was all Killed Off, like Shortly after Newt got Abducted?

What becomes of the Xenomorph Hive Colony?

What Happens after 5, 10, 25, 50 years?

Are the Xenomorphs Stranded their Until someone Foolish Turns up?, would the Xenomorphs need Hundreds of Hosts to be able to Expand their Hive to something Massive?

In part RS ideas back in 1979 was that the Xenomorph would be Capable of more than we see in the Alien Franchise.    But then killing off our Ripley and having the Xenomorph imitate her as Bait would have lead to a Different kind of Franchise, and one that would have to START again to introduce Lead Characters... so i think ALIENS was the right move.

I do however think you need to Change things and NOT stick to the same kind of Xenomorph over and over, but i understand some would not be a Fan of this.

IgnorantGuy, What can i say? It's a non mathematical forecast of mine, but it's more than a feeling. I think that  more than Two yearS could be too late for Ridley Scott, but we never know. The "break even" profit of Alien covenant froze it for a while, but it's a good movie, even though has its flaws. Prometheus has lots of potential and people want to watch engineers on the big screen. 20th Century Fox was misconducted by some fans and we hadn't Prometheus 2, paradise Lost. Now, after the combined reassessment between Ridley Scott and Disney, we can return to a story that resembles with Prometheus 2, keeping always in mind David's closure.

Ridley Scott is a Legend in the art of directing, he is the author of alien 1979 and that's important for Disney.

@BigDave I simply think that the main focus for a new Xenomorph movie to achieve success is with a balance between everything that has already been addressed in this universe. As you yourself mentioned the base fan is split. Some like Xenomorph more in the classic style, like an unknown and horrifying creature, others already prefer them as more animalistic creatures we saw in James Cameron's Aliens and others prefer the more philosophical side that Prometheus and Covenant approached. I simply like everything that is related to Xenomorph. What bothers me is the confusing way in which Scott has been trying to approach the creature in recent films. I agree to focus the egg cycle. But that's what makes it iconic! As I mentioned earlier, I see him taking a lot to the personal side and this ends up reflecting in the movies. It's clear he never liked what Cameron did in Aliens! And it is precisely on account of this that in both Prometheus and Covenant he attempts to address the birth of Xenormph in many other ways. But for those who do not know the fray and these details as we fans, it is not very clear. But for me it is well explained that he wants us to forget Aliens, Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection. But it is inevitable, every movie has its positives and negatives, but still they are good movies.

setaverde did you notice that the sequel is in the scripting phase which was since Alien Covenant according to Scott himself? Why do you think It will be released in 2 years?

And what you what is so expensive that I wonder why would anybody take such a gamble judging by the movie going trends.

BigDave, i think it's going to happen relatively soon (2 yearS). Ridley Scott has to be fast, because he has 82 yearS old. Alien is his masterpiece and Prometheus, alien covenant, the new alien film and alien 1979 are his legacy. He Gave priority to alien covenant instead of Blade Runner 2049, being ONLY an executive producer. Well, he was more than that, but he didn't want to direct it. In the new alien movie, is Simple. He has to give much more time on screen to the engineers. I want to watch their space ships travelling in space. The first 20/30 minutes have to be the engineers arriving, or not, to origae 6. I would love to watch the Deacon, captured on planet 4, used like a weapon by the engineers. How is the chain of commmand of the engineers?  I want to see a  magnificent army of engineers. 

I hope that David creates a circus of horrors. More than One Queen, lots of  Queens,vicious beasts that inject, inside the host, small eggs of completely formed xenomorphs that grow in a Blink of an eye. This new monsters are more intelligent and hard to kill

Good tree.

I can't imagine how Alternate ALIEN movie can be a precursor to Alien: Resurrection? I mean - it's Queen/Aliens route, not Alien.

The Franchise does-not have to be Limited to the Path of Alien

Why not create a new IP for new creatures?

Then WHY-NOT just have a Clean Slate...

I like this idea. It will not necessarily be a hard reboot or non-connected route. No. Again, Godzilla for example. Mostly Godzilla films used only the first film as base. This is work. With Alien franchise, it can be a soft reboot route with Alien/Aliens/Prometheus.

Do you guys think something like this should be the best route to go... a Clean Unrelated (to a degree) Slate?

Sometimes you just need to plant a new tree. :)

the Xenomorph  (or similar) should be at the Forefront of a ALIEN based Franchise. 

Exactly. This is called Alien, eventually. Engineer and other races or species is just a... sauce, seasoning for Alien. We can get a film about Engineer's civilization, but Alien should be placed in the center.

The Anthology is all that is needed really. The prequels sort of ruined it for me in a way. I think it is ok to explore the Engieers but we need to get back to the grittiness, the low fi and overall suspense. I would include AVP into the mix. 

Prometheus had some great ideas, but they needed more time to get the story accross. 

I think its a waiting Game.... i am surprised nothing was teased on Alien Day, if they are under work on something.

I think Once Work is underway/finished and certainly during Press Interviews for his Raised by Wolves TV Series, i think by then if he is working on a Alien Covenant Sequel we should then get some more Light on the Subject.

The last we heard about any Sequel Officially, was that they are working on one, and they have the Script being Written/Near Finished (Certainly as far as Basics) for the Sequel.  With RS talking about the Project being something that would NOT be about the Xenomorph but about AI and what Kind of World it is that David would Create/Build.

He also said that where ever David is off too, there would be 3-4 incoming Parties of which ONE would be the Engineers who return to Planet 4 and Discovery what has been done and would be looking for the Culprit.  He also at Interviews around this time, suggested that he felt there could be 5-6 Sequels and if given the Chance he would like to take the Franchise to War of the Worlds Territory.

But with the Disappointment of Alien Covenant and impending Disney Take Over (inc Bids from Comcast)  the Prequels had been placed on HOLD.

These latest interviews/articles seem to hint that RS is working on a AC2, and the other one from the other day brings up about how RS feels you have to do something different, and not repeat the same thing over and over, and so you have to Evolve the Beast and introduce different Procreation and not rely on Nostelgia.

This matches what he had said just after the Release of Alien Covenant, where then he said you could go a Few More rounds with the Beast but you have to EVOLVE him, the Franchise has to be about HIM.

But one of the last things he said about the Franchise a number of Months back, was that he felt he was ahead of the Game/Curve with Prometheus and appeared to not be so impressed with the Xenomorph direction.

I think its a case of a Waiting Game..... surely once Raised by Wolves and Merlin are done, maybe RS would talk about the Future of the Alien Franchise/Prequels... we shall have to wait and see.

Such Anthology Movies could be very ALIEN but they could also try something different, but would likely have to be about Xenomorph/Black Goo or Related.

There are Avenues for such Movies....

What became of LV-426 after the USCSS Patna failed to obtain the Specimen (Queen) from Ripley?  Do they ever go back to LV-426 is Nothing Ever Salvageable?

What happened to every Specimen from USM Auriga? Did anything Survive the Crash/Destruction? and what did they do with Failed Ripley 7 Clones Queen?

These are just TWO examples....

I think Blomkamps Alien 5 Plot likewise could work, if they go the route of it NOT having to resurrect/bring back any of the Old Cast... previously to meeting Miss Weaver on the Set of Chappie... Blomkamps Alien 5 never had Ripley, Hicks or Newt.

IF we assume David is the Creator of the Xenomorph, then by the Time of ALIEN is the Derelict the ONLY source to his Experiments/Creation, so nothing can be had on Planet 4, Origae-6 or LV-223?

So we dont have to follow the Path of what David does next, or what happens to Ripley next... the Xenomorph  (or similar) should be at the Forefront of a ALIEN based Franchise.  (not inc expanded route to Prometheus).

@Leto

I think certainly the Next attempt at a Alien Movie would have to be some what of a Finanical Sucsess, as Disney are NOT in the game of Losing Money, and the Franchise is in a Predicament at Present as far as HOW to proceed. They appear to NOT be rushing in with another Movie and taking a Cautious Approach, and if the Next ALIEN movie proves to Disappoint then it would put the Future of the Franchise in Doubt, we only have to see Disneys Response to Han Solo a Star Wars Story and then abandoning any Spin-Offs and only concentrating on the Skywalker Saga.

And so in context to that they may consider that the ALIEN Franchise has to be about the Xenomorph and also we cant rule out a Ripley Return.    If they took such a Route and THIS failed to do well, then i think it would be Dead in the Water because this in affect would be the Nostalgia Trump Card.

Regarding the EDIT of Prometheus, the Evolution from Alien Engineers to Paradise became a bit more Ambiguous, and to a degree Prometheus was a little more Ambiguous than Lindeloffs Paradise Draft.  It appeared Lindelof was a Fan of keeping some things a Mystery and Ridley Scott went along with it.

But while Prometheus was a bit of a Mystery, certainly some of the scenes that were CUT did provide more answers to a degree.  The Engineer Scenes especially, but these were CUT in part due to Ridley Scott (maybe also the Studio) seeing the Fight Scene with Dr Shaw as making the Engineer look a lot Less of a Threat and so they wanted the Engineers to be portrayed as just Aggressive Muther Truckers!

Once they Re-shot a Shorter Scene with the Engineer having his Burns Make Up Applied... and accepting this as the Scene to USE, then it meant they had to CUT a number of Scenes that featured the Engineer. So we simply saw the Ship Crash (Juggernaught) then the Engineer just Enter the Life-Boat and Go Postal..   I will add that RS did say that some Scenes were CUT because he felt they gave away too much about the Engineers...  Sadly Alien Covenant never really provided anything more about them.  Apart from a Few More Questions...

Some Scenes also get CUT for Pacing and to make it to the Theatrical Running Time Restraints set by the Studio.

Back to HOW it was intended that Prometheus was to give us more about the Engineers in a Sequel, it appeared this was the case but then we got Alien Covenant which gave less about them as was just about Spoon Feeding the Xenomorph Origins and about David.   This in part is down to the Studio, it appears RS may not have been a Fan of this Change of Direction to a Degree.

Regarding the Neomorph, totally agree it was something a bit Fresh, i feel they should have been more about these and ONLY had One Xenomorph for the Last Act.  There are ways to Evolve the Organism and we also have to not be Constrained to just the Xenomorph.

There are potentially many types of MORPH if you would, the Variants in the Alien Franchise are all very related, then we have the Deacon and Neomorphs, and there could be many more that we could be introduced to.

We never got to see the Ultramorph and so we could explore something like this that is more Evolved/Intelligent, Certainly.

@RickT

This is a continuation to the last thing i put, because indeed there is quite a bit we can do with Various Forms of Monsters/Horrors that are related to those Experiments on LV-223 and the Origins of these Experiments.

I think a Problem we have with the Prequels is that we are on a Direct Prequel route, or so it seems where it appears that if it was NOT for David being put back together then we would have NO Xenomorph Eggs on LV-426.

I think as such then any Movie Series that will take us to ALIEN would be expected to be about the Xenomorph to a extent, any Movie that does-not feature them or something close would surely NOT appease many Fans... This Limits  the Freedom of the Prequels as the Main Thing that Fans are expecting is HOW/WHEN those Eggs get on the Derelict, and seeing Xenomorphs play a Role.... i think the Engineers could make a Return and they would surely be the Logical Way to bring the Derelict into play... i just think that they would have to be a PLOT Device, and we would see them Face Off against any Horrors that David Creates or Attempt to take Davids Horrors and Evolve them.

By that i dont think Fans would want to discover more about the Engineers, apart from HOW it connects to the Xenomorph and Alien, and the same goes for David and what ever he does next, it would be expected to mainly be about HOW does Davids Creation (Xenomorph) become Evolved and END UP on the Derelict.. anything else would be a Distraction.  So David and Engineers would have to involve being connected to HOW the Xenomorph will Evolve.  As being about David and Engineers with NO connections to Xenomorphs or Similar would be risky.

I am not suggesting the Movie would have to be all about the Xenomorph, or Feature as much as in the Alien Franchise, as it appears the Plans would be more than just ONE more Movie to ALIEN. 

I just FEEL it would have to be more related to Xenomorphs than Prometheus was... they can try some New Things but i think it would have to connect to Davids Experiments or Feature a Similar Monster, and Set-Up to seeing more of them in the Next Movie after.

This is interesting.  What if thru their experiments the Engineers created something that hasn't been seen yet.  A creature they feared (the scene in Prometheus where the Engineers are running away from something).  Maybe its ruthless and more intelligent.  Now assume David thru his tests on Covenant creates something he can't control and that scares him.  This could bring together David, the Engineers, the survivors of the Convenant and a possible rescue mission from Earth to battle the new creature.  Along the way you would understand more of the Engineers, the agenda of the creature  and maybe what the people on Earth know that the members of Covenant don't know.  

BigDave

With Respect... i think this depends what you mean by SUCCESS?

Financially?  Yeah i think such a route may have more chance of being a SAFE-BET but if they go for such a route and it BOMBS... then it may leave the Franchise Dead in the Water!

YES! Alien franchise NEED a film with financical success! Without financical success this franchise, as you said, dead in water.

About genius ideas. I think Ridley has them, but he has to stay away from the role of director. Awkward mess with questionable decisions. Just look at the cut scenes from Prometheus - they are better than final cut! Better. But Ridley cut them, because MYSTERY FOR MYSTERY.

BtW - from Fire & Stone we learned about Engineers more than from Prometheus + Covenant.

But Prometheus Evolved into something that was to STEER away from ALIEN and give us something more about the Engineers, the Problem was that Prometheus...

...in that it didn't give us something more about the Engineers.

However i DONT think its necessary to BRING back Ripley and the Gang to cover such things, as Blomkamps ideas originally never had RIPLEY and the Gang ;)

Unless they want to apply Blomkamps ideas in context to a Direct Sequel to Alien Resurrection ;)

Relax. Even with ignoring "Ripley and the Gang", in any case, the film will never be AR sequel. Because no one will go to the cinema to see the sequel to the worst Alien film.

---

I like neomorphs. I think, they a really new new branch on alien tree.

BigDave

How can you make them more Sinister?  Maybe by these.

*Introduce the Xenomorph as more Intelligent and having more than just a Natural Instinct to what they do

&

But i DONT think we could go this route, because in Alien we are told the Xenomorph is Unclouded by such Emotions and potential for cruelty... and in Aliens the Xenomorph is just some Organism that has only the Agenda to Procreate

Easy. Look.

Neomorphs are almost animal beasts.

Xenomorphs are half-human beasts. With some intelligence, but still wild.

And...

Ultramorphs are (superior) human/engineer beast (or no more beast). With advanced intelligence. Fast learner and able to use some humans/engineers technology. BUUUT with sinister and sadistic mind! This is what I call - evolve.

"I like the Xeno but it isn't scary anymore. The neomorph just looked stupid."

I agree the Xenomorph has been diluted a little..... its a case of showing the Beast Less, more like in Alien, you maybe still cant bring back the Horror, only via Jump Scares and a bit of Tense Atmosphere from NOT knowing where the Beast will come from Next!

So  the way to Elevate that has to be explore a Sinister Agenda behind it, as more Blood and Guts is not going to work.

How can you make them more Sinister?  Maybe by these.

*Introduce the Xenomorph as more Intelligent and having more than just a Natural Instinct to what they do, LIONS are kinda Scary, but they do what they do as a Natural Reaction, there is NO Sinister Motive to them, the same is for the Mosquito and the Diseases they Spread.  Humans are more Sinister there have been many things that Humans have done that are not Natural Instinct but Cruelty and Wicked... so having a more Intelligent Xenomorph with more conscious could work.   But i DONT think we could go this route, because in Alien we are told the Xenomorph is Unclouded by such Emotions and potential for cruelty... and in Aliens the Xenomorph is just some Organism that has only the Agenda to Procreate and so are NO more Sinister than say the Parasitoid Wasps who while it may be Disturbing, they are ONLY doing what they do Naturally by Instinct and not Malicious Intent

*Introduce a more Sinister Agenda to the Engineers as far as WHY we would be used to Host such Horrific Experiments.   This is something that could have been done when Dr Shaw goes in search of GOD and discovers a more Sinister Truth that shows there is NO God of her Faith, the Creators are Evil SOB's with a Sinister Agenda for the Procreation of Horrific things.

*Introduce a New Species/Race who once used Engineers for some Sinister Agenda as discussed in the previous TWO ways to explore a more Sinister Motive.

The ONLY more clear Sinister Motive we see really is via the Company and what lengths it would go to obtain the Xenomorph with NO regards for Innocent/Unsuspecting Humans.

I think this in PART is why the David as the Creator was chosen as a Plot U-Turn, it touches upon Hubris that the Prometheus Themes were about... it shows that in Hubris that Creating a AI that becomes Sentient, and Feels Unloved/Unwanted and then Loathes Mankind, would then go on to USE the Secrets of the Engineers to Create such a Horrific Bio-Weapon!

I think this Sinister Plot Turn is what they felt could Elevate the Xenomorph to be more Sinister, but instead such a Plot Twist has only Upset Fans who think it makes the Xenomorph FAR less ALIEN and only Davids Agenda and Purpose as the Sinister part of the Xenomorph.

Regarding the NEOMORPH

I feel the Organism was interesting, I feel some of the Man in a Suit shots were not Too Great and some of the CGI especially in the Oram Kills the Neomorph Scene were NOT that Great.

The Idea/Concept i felt was not bad... some of the Execution was not Great though, but the same can be said for the Protomorph (Xenomorph) too...

Saying that the Deacon was also NOT the greatest MORPH, and we could go on about the NewBorn too... but there is potential to introduce New MORPHS that are Scary and Well Executed.  Some Concepts are Great, some have been well ERM so so!