Comments (Page 229)

@Leto

Forgive me if i misunderstand your comment, it could be lost in translation a little.

I think the Prequel Route was something that Ridley Scott felt had to be done, because the Xenomorph Origin and Who the Space Jockey was, were things that NONE of the other Movies Answered...    Was Aliens what Ridley Scott what have done?  Likely Not...  so the Franchise moved on, it introduced certain things (Queen), but the Franchise did-not touch upon the Origins of the Xenomorph and who the Space Jockey was and WHY he had that Cargo.  So exploring these are something that Ridley Scott could do and put his own Stamp on HOW to explore them.

He then felt (after Discussion with some in the Studio) that you DONT have to have the Xenomorph, and some Mystery is best kept, but the Franchise as far as the Space Jockey Race was something that was interesting and NEW to expand upon.

You could say now we are in a certain prequel route (Alien Covenant) there is Nothing as far as Great Ideas that can expand from this.... While Alien Covenant kind of Puts the Lid on the Scope of Prometheus as far as Ideas... the Limitation is from going for a Direct Prequel to get us to the Derelict and those Eggs.

I think there is Limits to how far you can continue with the Xenomorph, and Queen and Company wants the Bio-Weapon..... you can go this route again but you have to try and change things a little.

I think that Evolving the Xenomorph or Attempting to could be something to explore, and certainly showing us Alternatives and different ways to Procreate could be something to  maybe ADD some depth to the Xenomorph, i dont think you can have MANY ideas about this.

Yet the Engineers Plot opens up a much Greater Scope of Ideas.

I will add some of the comments about a Alien Covenant Sequel could offer something different, but NOW we are in a Prequel Route that surely will explain HOW/WHEN those Eggs get on the Derelict, then exploring things in DEPTH that Steer Away or dont cover Xenomorphs would be seen as a Distraction from the Expected Prequel Path.

Regarding the OT....

I agree with what Ridley Scott was saying, its a bit ambiguous to what he could be on about.. But to me it seems that he thinks there is ONLY so many times you can go back to the Traditional Xenomorph before it gets Repetitive, we have seen the Xenomorph over and over in various formats (Movies, Books, Comics, Video Games) and especially the Cameron's Queen route...

But this route is what made the Franchise as Iconic, but because we have seen this in Various Mediums, its a case of you have to be Careful HOW you Handle/Cover it

AVP for Example... the AVP Franchise has some Potential, some of the Video Games/Comics are a Format for a Good Popcorn Action/Horror (more so Action) and i think we can agree that the AVP Movie was NOT the best way to had used those Licenses.... a more Video Game/Comic Time-Line of say 2200-2300 would have worked better.

So while a AVP movie could have been better if it was more like based in the Alien Franchise/Colonial Marines Time-Line, The AVP Movie 2004 was by NO means as BAD as the AVPR Movie that Followed... so what i am saying is if you continue with the Aliens Formula or even ALIEN then you have to be Careful because your only a FEW Poor Efforts away from Degrading the Xenomorph to a JOKE!

Freddy was Scary, Jason too... but repeating those over and over and then with a number of POOR sequels has reduced them to a JOKE of sorts... The same could happen to the Xenomorph if we continue and make same old over and over...

What i am saying is 1-2 more Xenomorph Movies where things dont change much from the Franchise is something that could work or not, but going 3, 4 of the same could well make the Franchise Stale.... and Xenomorph just not as Iconic...

So i think RS was thinking that you have to EVOLVE the Xenomorph, offer different Variants, New Ways of Procreation than keeping to say the Queen and Eggs route.

I also think he sees the Franchise has NOT having to be and revolve around those Eggs on the Derelict, the Queen and certainly Characters like Ripley etc...

There is a LOT more that you could do and introduce than just Eggs and Xenomorphs.

"I like David as an antagonist, but an Alien movie without Xeno does not seem to be the right one, since Prometheus's main criticism was precisely the absence of the creature"

To a Degree yes, as a ALIEN Prequel there was some expectation of seeing the Xenomorph or at least something similar, and having more clues to the Xenomorph Origins...

But Prometheus Evolved into something that was to STEER away from ALIEN and give us something more about the Engineers, the Problem was that Prometheus should have been used as a Bridge to ALIEN and then Something New, and it should have offered something more than Zombie Fifield, Milburn Space Cobra Face Rape and the Deacon which we did not see what happens NEXT and more so HOW all these more clearly connect to the Xenomorph.

Prometheus had other Flaws, but the Studio thought that NOT having Xenomorphs and NOT giving a clear answer to those Eggs and thus a Direct Prequel was something they should have DONE... and hence we get Alien Covenant.

I will add SuperBerserker that i do feel Disney would more cater for the Action Type Movies, that follow a lot of the same Tropes that the Comics and Video Games (and some expanded Novels) would cater for..   So that GUN wielding Engineer could be something they would be a FAN of doing as opposed to the Creators and all the Philosophical/Chariots of the Gods like Plot/Story.

I think the Problem is the Fanbase does have different likes/dislikes and the more Cameron's Aliens Fans, would like to see Engineers explored more in a way like the Comic Books had done, where for the Most part it would be seeing these beings Rock Up, with their Superior Strength and Technology and Kick Ass, which would maybe NOT make them much different to the Predators. (in how they are shown for the most part).

some Prometheus Fans would want to go more deeper than just Engineers as Advanced Ancient Race with Bio-Mechanical Technology/Weapons who go around Creating and Unleashing Horrific Xenomorph like Monsters on Mankind. (maybe others too).

Its a case of finding a Balance... or making TWO variants of the Franchise, one to Cater for Prometheus Fans, and one to Cater for a more Action Based Fanbase (Aliens and Alien Resurrection).

I think it would be HARSH to Sacrifice One Type of Fans Wishes/Wants/Likes, well as in a Selection who would want more Action Like Movies with a BIT of the Prometheus Themes,  compared to some who would want to see the more Space Exploration and Philosophical Themes but Get Rid of the Action/Xenomorph.

Can you find the Balance?

Can they attempt to Offer Alternative Directions that are connected but one Goes for more Action/Xenomorph, while the other goes off to explore Something Different?

"For me, still the way to success is what Neil was plotting for '' Alien 5 ''

With Respect... i think this depends what you mean by SUCCESS?

Financially?  Yeah i think such a route may have more chance of being a SAFE-BET but if they go for such a route and it BOMBS... then it may leave the Franchise Dead in the Water!

Personally... i think there is only so many times you can go and give a Aliens/Alien Resurrection type Movie, before it could become Stale... maybe NOT for some Fans, but i feel we have seen this Kind of Stuff done over and over in Comics, Games and some Expanded Novels.

This does-not mean such a Movie would not SELL, i think you can go a round or TWO more with such a Movie, as long as you TRY and do something a bit different.   As the Company or Group of Humans Discover Eggs, or a Queen and then we reveal the Company wishes to obtain a Queen Trope is something i DONT think we can continue with over and over.

Some of Blomkamps ideas do appear to indicate different variants of the Xenomorph, Experimentations, Hybrids/Mutants and a Fusing of Human and Engineer Technology, so YES i think such things could WORK..

However i DONT think its necessary to BRING back Ripley and the Gang to cover such things, as Blomkamps ideas originally never had RIPLEY and the Gang ;)

Unless they want to apply Blomkamps ideas in context to a Direct Sequel to Alien Resurrection ;)

@Spike's Ghost

Unfortunately i dont think we shall see Dr Shaw in Future, unless David has some of her Memories and Implants them into another Body... could he Clone Her?  Who knows.

What we have to consider is WHAT is there to cover in regards to Dr Shaw, seem she NEVER got to meet any Engineers and get her Answers... but i think there is a LOT more to her FATE than just Ending Up Dead and Experimented on/Harvested for Eggs.

If we consider we have Prometheus and we have Alien Covenant, there is a series of Events between these that relate to Dr Shaw and David which the Crossing was a Snippet of...

The End of Prometheus we see Dr Shaw has collected Davids Body/Head she is seen heading to another Temple Complex on the ATV....   The Reason?  To get another SHIP to leave this Place (LV-223)

The Crossing confirms to us that they left LV-223 but the Ship was Floating through Space, David/Dr Shaw had left LV-223 but they had NOT set course for Anywhere else...  We can assume that David is playing a Game of Cat and Mouse, he has got Dr Shaw off that Rock (LV-223) but he WONT take her to Paradise unless she puts him back TOGETHER... 

We can see that from Dr Shaw's Hair Length that she had spent a Good 6-10 Months on the Juggernaught, Pondering what to do, she has to know ONCE she attaches David's Head he could be Dangerous... but over TIME he manages to Persuade her and they form a Better Bond.

Also of Note is that Dr Shaw had Salvaged a Number of things from the Prometheus, likely from the Life-Boat before they departed (Bed, Tools to Repair David, the Flare Gun among other things).

We get to the Point where Dr Shaw is in Cryo-Sleep and then David is FREE to do what he wants where he LEARNS the Ways of the Engineers, and this maybe in part Helps him to decide to Bombard the Engineers (he likely also wants to Guarantee his Survival and Dr Shaw's).

Following this we have a LONG period of Time after the Bombardment until the Covenant Ship arrives, and in these Near 10 Years we see that David has Experimented on and Studied with Various Life on the Planet, he has discovered Engineers and Infants that likely was NOT affected by the Bombardment and Subjected them to Torture and Experiments, before there had to come a TIME when he had to USE her (Dr Shaw) for his Experiments to End Up with those Eggs.

These Events could make a NOVEL but i am not sure there is enough to make a Movie, certainly one that would Entertain a lot of Fans... some would find it interesting though (myself for example) depending on HOW this is Covered.

I have a Few Theories to WHAT may have transpired that could maybe make a Decent Novel as far as a PLOT to follow.  But this would take the TOPIC to Off Topic... so my reply here is just in regards to Dr Shaw as in YES there is a Story to be TOLD and it wont really be quite as Deep as Potentially a Prometheus 2 could have been.... but still could have been some interaction between Dr Shaw and Engineers, in a (Discovery of what David is doing, and attempt to rescue some Engineers from him kinda Plot).

I could start a New Topic on this, and put what way i would explore such a The Crossing Story.

I like the Xeno but it isn't scary anymore. The neomorph just looked stupid. The series needs that sense of fear and dread that has been unseen since the Quadrilogy. David had that creepiness that is excellent but maybe we need sinister Engineers with unexpected tricks up their sleeves. WY should not be ignored either. I agree that the Engineer home planet scene was great but it only left more questions.

Above picture is a good example of why studios should not listen to the fans.

That is even worse than AvP.

Still the best way is to focus on Xeno to take this image of "Alien films without Xenos", but also to put the Enginners. But precisely as it is in Prometheus - Fire and Stone.

I agree with the idea of evolving the franchise or Xeno himself. But I also see that Ridley takes this franchise very personally, many elements that are present in these latest films (Prometheus and Alien Covenant) do not follow the recipe of the original films. I like David as an antagonist, but an Alien movie without Xeno does not seem to be the right one, since Prometheus's main criticism was precisely the absence of the creature and Covenant's blurring of it. For me, still the way to success is what Neil was plotting for '' Alien 5 ''.

I'm really glad there are discussions about future films, but it doesn't actually state that Sir Ridley is involved in those discussions.

It's just Ridley being Ridley, going off at tangents, repeating stuff he's said before, or changing what he's said before!

God bless him! :)

Sir Ridley states there are discussions about future instalments.

Sadly, there's no confirmation that he is involved in those discussions.

ALIEN is the perfect Sci-fi-Horror hybrid. A cosmic, primordial, psychosexual type of horror with depth. Had it not been for the coming together of Dan O’Bannon, H.R. Giger & Ridley Scott we probably wouldn’t be here discussing it or the franchise on this website.

O’Bannon & Shusett were about to sign a deal with Roger Corman when luckily the call came from Fox. ALIEN could have been just an enjoyable, low budget, one-off, rather than the enduring Franchise it developed into.

O’Bannon’s knowledge of & interest in Sci-fi & Lovecraft were key. Dan & Ron Shusett’s story, then Dan’s script laid the foundation. Plus, he thrust his copy of Giger’s Necronomicon, in front of Ridley Scott, when Ridley’s biggest worry was about finding a convincing design for the Alien.

They both realised that Giger’s incredible & unique designs were exactly what was needed to elevate the creature & therein the film to groundbreaking heights. The producers were reluctant to accept that, but finally acquiesced when Ridley threatened to quit.

As we know, Ridley was by no means the first choice for Director, fourth or fifth choice depending upon which interview with Ridley you read. Thanks to Fox’s British exec Sandy Lieberson, Ridley came into their sights. Without his visual gift ALIEN would have been an entirely different film. 

Dan O'Bannon might have liked PROMETHEUS, it does pay homage to so many of his ideas & those of H.R. Giger, with Ridley utilising them in an interesting & novel way.

Though O’Bannon & Giger have departed this mortal coil, I suspect Ridley Scott knows in his heart that their work remains at the core of what the ALIEN Universe is & should be. To me, much of PROMETHEUS is really a lamentation of sorts for them.

What would have been really disappointing to Dan is that even after all these years the studio execs control, interference, penny-pinching, ignorance of subject matter & downright stupidity at times, has remained so prevalent!

Quote from Fantastic Films US issue 11/GB issue 1  

"The problem with the money-men is that a lot of them don't care about making good films, and don't understand movies, yet they insist that you do it their way. The very people who say " I don't understand anything about it, i don't like it, " they rewrite it, they change everything you do, they don't let you do it yourself. That's what is so infuriating. They go "You know, six months ago I couldn't spell auteur and now I are one" I've got an insight for you. This is something that I've learned which has disappointed me very very greatly." 

As ALIEN fans & indeed Science Fiction fans, we should also be very grateful to Alejandro Jodorowsky. If his ambitious & visionary adaptation of Dune had received studio backing, Dan O’Bannon wouldn’t have ended up on Ron Shusett’s couch! Plus, because of Jodorowsky, Dan met Giger.

Hope the sequel will start production soon. Im ok if the beast doesn’t show up in the next one. They could just tease it. I mean, we know what we will see in the end (first movie). There are so many other possibilities, other creatures that can terrify the audience. The huge trilobyte and the hammerpede in Prometheus felt so fresh and dynamic. 

For Alien: Wakening.

No answers - good.

Direct answers - good.

Ambiguous things - bad.

I hope Disney will keep Ridley's ideas, buuuuut - I also hope Disney cut all ambiguous/water-like Ridley's ideas. We need direct answers and ideas.

RS wanted to explore the Engineers prior to Prometheus.  Prometheus, for me, didn't go far enough.  In AC Shaw and an Engineer city are killed and I still don't know why.  I'm glad he's talking with Disney.  I believed Disney would have to move on with the Alien franchise since they paid for it.  I also think there's more stories to tell.  I just don't know who Disney will find to tell them.

I have had different views over the years. I think the Xeno can go or assume a lesser but present role. I am ok with the android angle but I don't think that was what Alien was about. I disliked Prometheus (liked the concept but not the execution in theater) but it seems like that is where RS needs to go. I have a wait and see attitude right now. 

Really hope the next movie includes Shaw flashbacks. Hoping the reason they moved on from her story is because it would spoil the upcoming film. If nothing ever comes of Shaw's story then imo Covenant will forever be a stain on the Alien universe.

I try to see where in the interview Scott confirmed his discussions with Disney about future Alien installments and I don't see it.

I hope it's true, probably we have to wait a year to find out.

"But it's harder to keep the beast going for that long. I think it’s just tough. The joke wears out. Once you've seen it twice, three times, it’s no longer frightening.”

“Go on, leave that behind, and see where it can evolve,”

“So we're looking where we're going to evolve.”

Yes, something fresh is what we need. Go on, Ridley Scott. And hurry up. 

I don't think so. Ridley had to make Prometheus - first "prequel" as prequel to Alien. And after - made another stories.

He didn't give to us the prequel, but he is still in prequels route. There is no place for other great ideas.

Thanks for the Share.

Interesting Interview, it kind of confirms that he had a Idea where to take the Franchise Next, certainly seems his Direction would be different to a Blomkamps Alien 5 Direction.

It is ambiguous as far as are we talking a Broader way to Evolve/Change the Franchise or is he being Specific to the Beast?

I get the impression he wants to Evolve something to be different to what we have seen been done over and over, and so WHAT does this mean for the Prequels as far as getting to ALIEN, because we are just Marching to the Inevitable... yet RS seems to HINT at wanting to explore something different/evolved than something that becomes the Standard Xenomorph.

Looks VERY nice.

"David already knows the answer. He’s always known. Creators are disgusted by what they make. We create because we’re bored, and when we realize what we’ve made is actually alive we quickly try to control it. Eventually our creation evolves out of our control, and our only option left is then to kill it."

I think this is a accurate in a Nutshell overlook of what is going on.

Both Blade Runner and Prometheus touch upon Creation, and Creation in Context to Artificial and that their is Hubris in playing GOD and creating something that is Superior to yourself that is intended to SERVE....

So indeed if you Created a Species to Serve some Purpose, and this Creation Cant Create, then NO soon as they can Procreate or Re-Create then that would be a Concern.

A lot also centers around Knowledge and Free-Will if a Creation is given certain Knowledge and Free-Will or gains them, then they could start to Question the reasons for their Creation and become Sentient, this would be another Concern.

There are Multiple Ways to look at WHY you would Create Something, especially in your own Image.

*Sometimes this could be for Companionship because you feel Alone. 

*It could be to create something to take over tasks/duties that you would No-Longer have to do and so to act as a Servant.

*It could be to have something to look up to you and worship you and elevate you to a King/God.

*It could be that creating something leaves you a Legacy, it also shows off the Height of your Achievements.

*It could be to make up for the Disappointment of something you created before, or other aspects you are Disappointed with in context to yourself, your own kind or Previous Creation.  A attempt to Re-do/Perfect something.

*It could be because you CAN and out of Boredom.

*Finally it could be to have something that you do-not have to Watch Over and Love/Care for.  Because having something to Love and Cherish will make you feel Accomplished.

To some degree a number of these apply to reasons for Creation in many Religions/Mythos, they all share some of the above.  The same would fit with WHY we have Weyland and Tyrell create also.

One of the Big Questions that Fans of Prometheus would have been hoping to find out is what reasons the Engineers had for our Creation.

The SOUL is a interesting thing to look at... because it falls into the following.

*The Spiritual Soul of a Person that Lives on in another Pane of a Existence after Death.  (There is NO 100% way to say that Mankind has this).

*The Collection of Memories and Emotions and Experiences that you gain through Life  that make you who you are (this leads to the next point).

*The Kind of Person one becomes from their Upbringing and Interaction throughout their Lives. (determines if you have a Kind/Good Soul/Person or a Evil/Selfish one).

*Putting a lot of Effort/Emotion into something you do or work on (putting your Heart/Soul into something).

Looking at these then a AI like David can have them all apart from the FIRST One......  But this is something that there is No Guarantee that we Humans have.

A AI like David, if he could Upload/Transfer his Memories and Emotions into a NEW Body after his Current One is Damaged or into some kind of Cloud/Network... would IN EFFECT have gained After-Life and a Ever Living Immortal Soul!

So the Irony is that maybe DAVID is the ONLY one who has/can gain a Complete Soul!

I think the 100% way that Mankind could get a Ever Lasting Soul would be ONCE we are able to Transfer our Emotions, Memories and Experiences into a AI just as we see in the 2014 Movie Transcendence  

Sorry if this seems a little Off-Topic, but to carry on i think that the Themes you expressed in the OT are shared in Blade Runner and Prometheus, and who knows if they will carry on with Ridley Scotts Future plans as far as WHAT KIND OF WORLD would our David Create.

Considering that he said the Sequel to Alien Covenant would NOT be about Xenomorphs, but about AI and that RS sees the Replicants as AI too...  so AI means a Artificially Created/Engineered or Enhanced Life-Form/Intelligent Creation.

Hi, original author of the article here, I'm glad you all liked it and thanks to Lawrence of Arabia for sharing!

I think IF we combined some of these ideas so a Amalgamation of them then we could indeed have ourselves something NEW to use in the Franchise that could follow the Idea/Path that Dan O'Bannon had intended ;)

I missed this Topic so thanks for the SPAM Bump ;)

I think there is  a lot that O'Bannon should be Happy with, as far as from what his Star Beast had evolved into, some of the Designs for the Star Beast were... well Poor to be Honest!

This ONE by O'Bannon being the Exception.... also the Face Hugger is described more like the Trilobite.

But we ENDED up with HR Gigers Effort which O'Bannon had showed his work to Ridley Scott and well i think the Monster we ENDED up with was Exceptional and Certainly something i FEEL that O'Bannon would be pleased with.

I think the ONLY Disappointments maybe he would have, could be the Organism had gone from being the Remnants of a Ancient Alien Species, that was discovered by another Giant Alien Species (Space Jockey) who fell Victim to their Curiosity something repeated by the Human Crew who come in to investigate the SOS/Warning.  To then just becoming a Engineered Bio-Weapon by said Giant Alien Species (Space Jockey).

I would certainly think he would be VERY Disappointed with the route that Alien Covenant has been as a Creation by a AWOL Android.

Which is a FAR CRY from the Alien Species who are somewhat Advanced and Civilized but required to use other Organisms to Procreate its Kind.

With the ADULTS Gone.... the Remaining Young Once Birthed would remain Feral and Hostile.

The route of David as a Creator would be Further away from O'Bannons ideas, more so than a Engineered Bio-Weapon by the Space Jockey Race.

I think O'Bannon can still feel proud that a Majority Nuts and Bolts of the Franchise, as far as the First Movie are from his Ideas, and especially the Unique Aliens Life-Cycle.

I would assume that the QUEEN is something Totally different to what he would ever conceive as far as Sequels, but thats NOT to say he Dislikes the Queen.

I have said this BEFORE.... we could explore a Origin to what lead to the DNA that the Black Goo had that seemed to pass on Xenomorph like Traits, and Alien Engineers seemed to indicate that the Engineers had Discovered a Organism that they then Experimented on and Re-Engineered to obtain the Xenomorph and Variants.

So we could still explore a Ancient Species that has a Life-Cycle similar to the Xenomorph and some Aesthetic, and either the Engineers Discovered this and Re-Engineered from it, or the Engineers became a Slave Race to this Ancient Star Beast Species before Overthrowing their Masters!

I think this would be a IDEAL way to expand upon the Franchise, and GO BACK to O'Bannons ideas...  i would take O'Bannon's Design, add a bit of HR Giger to it, and maybe some HP Lovecraftian Design.

And thus introduce the STARBEAST!

I think to a degree it did-not matter what Time-Line we was in, the Advent of the Prequels i think makes it more important to give some detail/context to the Time-Line which they clearly do.

But indeed while the Prequels have Dates Set in Stone by Virtue of the Movies, the other Movies in the Franchise do-not clearly specify any dates.  so we could ponder if they are indeed 28 years after the End of the First Prequel, or 50, or 100 years. Would this matter so much?

I think one cause for concern with the Time-Line is the route of Alien Covenant where being set 18 Years Prior to ALIEN causes some Conflict for some in regards to how the Derelict looked like it had been on LV-426 for MUCH more than 18 years.... we have YET to conclude the Prequels however, so it could be shown that the Derelict/Space Jockey may have been there a LONG time but the Egg Cargo not so.... However we would still have to Question what then happened to the Space Jockey and that Acid Hole, and WHAT was the Derelict carrying if it Did-Not have Eggs all those many years back.

These sorts of Questions would NOT have been a issue had Alien Covenant not had to become a more Direct Prequel, and they stuck to the Original Idea for the Event. (Derelict)

Again i think you just have to accept what we are shown/told that has not been shown in the Movies in some cases....   But i understand some would not be willing to accept anything that is NOT shown in the Movies, while sometimes using information from Books/Comics and Games as providing more Definate Dates/Events as Canon, as opposed to Blu-Ray/DVD Extras and comments by Directors etc.

We get a lot of such Cherry Picking.

so if we ONLY consider what the Movies Show, then Indeed the Date for Alien becomes ambiguous with No Clear indication. 

But as DK mentions... should it really matter?

Again i think the ONLY thing that kind of BUGS the Time-Line would be the Route the Prequels take IF we conclude that with NO David there was NO Derelict/Eggs on LV-426, which would mean that IF we say Alien was set in 2122 then those Eggs (maybe Derelict) could have been on LV-426 for No-Longer than say 10 years!

Which certainly in ALIEN it looks like it was there for MUCH Longer.... but again until we CONCLUDE the Prequels its open to debate and subject to CHANGE.

I don't think we can really trust the date about Amanda. Burke could have easilly lied. 

Honestly, getting caught up in the axles of timeline ruins the enjoyment. Remember that different people were involved in each movie and may have just pulled dates out of their arses. 

Thats good Question, i think sometimes we just have to rely on and accept what is said that has NOT been shown in the Movies.   I am sure and i will have to Watch Aliens again that there is a mention in regards to Burke about a June 79 Date, which we can assume is June 2179.

I am sure Amanda was said to have Died 2 Years prior to Ripley being rescued but the DOB for Amanda on the Document shown to Ripley is NOT in any Date Format we use on Earth...  so its more like a Star Date.

Here is a image of it, Date of Birth 24.6.59.20. and Date of Death 12.23.20. ??  these make No Sense and the 24.6.59.20. could have more Digits after, example 24.6.59.20.55 etc

There are a lot of Flaws with Dates in those Movies..

I missed this Topic, so its interesting to bring up.

I think this is also a case of how we dont have to have the Franchise Centered around Xenomorphs...

If Disney did a TV Series we could explore the Arcturians, i have not and do-not really read the Expanded Novels so cant really speak about them.

From ALIENS it was quite Ambiguous, it could have been that this was a Colony of Humans that is a World thats some kind of Get Away Break for Humans a kind of Relaxation/Holiday Resort and a Pleasure Planet if you would like say RISA is in the Star Trek Franchise.

But on the other hand we could Ponder if it was a actual different Alien Humanoid Species/World.  It remained very Ambiguous were we could ponder  why SEX did not matter for Frost as far as Arcturian Poontang

This must indicate the Species are Very Attractive and Sexually very Satisfying that its easy to mistake a Male and Female or that Frost was so under the Influence of Substances/Alcohol that he failed to realize.

It seems that the indication is they are a Separate Species and it would be interesting to explore them, and see WHY such a mistake could be made, maybe their is something Aesthetically that can cause a Mix-up?  Or Frost was Drunk or simply Bi-Sexual, we just dont know for sure.

Maybe its a Question for James Cameron ;)  Maybe they are what became his Navi from Avatar lol

Joke aside, it would be interesting to see what they was like, in context to away from Alien... Arcturians are seen by some as a Alien Species from the Arcturus Star System some 36+ Light Years from Earth, that appear to be described as being Blue in Color.  (of course their is No 100% Proof of this Species much like the Alien Greys)

So it would be interesting to wonder how they could have looked, and maybe it could be that BOTH species are Similar, we cant assume EVERY Humanoid Race would be like us, we cant for example assume every Alien Race would Give Birth and Raise their Young like Mammals and so maybe they DONT have Breast?  Maybe Both Male/Female have Breast so they could Share Breast Feeding Duties?

The Arcturian Poontang comment would imply their Species are visited for Sexual Pleasure so we have to ask WHY bother when there are Human Females.

So this can allow us to Imagine the Biology of such a Species, i had a IDEA a while back how to explore this Species and WHY they would have relations with Humans.  But maybe this would have been a bit complicated.

Looking into this Alien Wiki Page Xenopedia Arcturian a which i have only just checked out, i assume this is from the Novels Sources and it just sounds like a Cameron's Alien Queen meets Avatar Navi.

First of all i want to say Welcome and its nice to see People who saw Prometheus for more than just having to be about a Aggressive 7-8ft Humanoids intent on Killing Mankind with a Horrific Weapon....   I also think a Prometheus 2 had more scope and Dr Shaw while Flawed could have had some Revelations that could have Totally given her a new Story ARC.

"reduced humanoid aliens to a fantasy race in a boring roman city?"

There was a sense of Disappointment by many regarding the Aesthetic, the Engineers on Planet 4 looked more Human than Majestic as they did in Prometheus, and i am sure many expected to Discover a World with such Bio-Mechanical Technical and Architectural Wonders.

I dont really object to much to either, i had hoped we would be seeing more of the Engineers and their Worlds and would not mind a Mix of Ancient Civilization and the Space Jockey/Engineers Bio-Mechanical Civilization.

My main Concern was how these Engineers were  all killed off by the time the Covenant Ship arrived, and the Disappointment of the Movie does leave the possibility of ever exploring the Engineers beyond 8ft Aggressive Space Fairing Genocidal beings on a Warpath!  very unlikely.

I think it would be a Tragedy if the ONLY time we see our Engineers would be as shown in the Comics, where its deemed NOT important to go into DEPTH with them, but just show them going around with the Bio-Mechanical Technology and introduce some Bio-Mechanical Weapons and basically go around Killing Humans and Xenomorphs...

I think a little of this would be FINE... but for me the Engineers are more than just to be depicted as Flying Around Bombarding Worlds, and being Aggressive Jerks to everyone.

PS Thanks for the Portrait nice Work ;)

It is a good enough edit. It reminds me how much better this scene was than the actual movie due to real character development.

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I dont think Rebooting anything would be ideal...

The Prequels should remain, you can in further movies CHANGE some of the things they opened up as the Prequels are Ambiguous, more so Prometheus.

We have only be shown a Few Things as FACT.... Dr Shaw is Dead... as a example (but there could be work around).

But we have not yet been shown the Moment the Eggs get on the Derelict, and so its not SET IN STONE.. that the Xenomorphs are Created by David, and the Engineers are the Space Jockey, not as in context to what we have been shown in the Movies.

Directors Comments and Intended Path prior to Changes, dont really 100% count as they are subject to Change... by that 4+ Years ago the Xenomorph was a Creation of the Engineers that was Thousands of Years Old.

So instead of Rebooting the Prequels they can just use other movies to Elevate and Change the Plot.

This is similar to what they did with the David Creates the Xenomorph Curve-ball, which in Hindsight must be a Mistake as its certainly something i feel only a SMALL % of Fans are pleased with..

This can be Subject to Change.

I do agree that while the Franchise can go the Xenomorph for a Few More Rounds, i think Ellen Ripley has had her DAY!   However if they are to bring her back i think they have to make it a sequel to Alien Resurrection.

But there is a Fanbase/Market that would want to see the Gang Back and have a Cameron's Aliens 2, 3 and 4 etc... I think Hard Core ALIENS Fans (means those who really like the Movie, but also could like the others).  I feel a Majority of them would NOT mind a Blomkamps Alien 5

And i think Disney may see such a route as the Less Risk, more chance of making Money...  Nostalgia SELLS!

If they go this route i guess we can either Boycot those Movies, or Watch them on their own Merits but still accept Alien 3 on-wards as your own Personal Canon.

I just think there is a lot more to the Engineers Plot, that does-not have to restrict to them being used as they are in the Dark Horse Comics.

I certainly think it would be interesting to see more of their Technology, there was a lot of Good Concept work as far as Engineer Technology/Worlds that was done for Prometheus, but this was Toned Down somewhat for the Movie, and almost completely gone in Alien Covenant.

We dont have to see the Black Goo as per Bio-Weapon, it would be interesting to Explore it as the Creation Tool which is maybe what its Original Use was, and then maybe see what difference there is (Sacrificial/Black Goo) but its likely the same substance that can be used in different ways.

Dont get me wrong for all the Philosophical Thought Provoking Creation Plot, and Chariots of the Gods, i feel ANY expanded Spin Off would have to have its share of Horror and at some-point Action Scenes.

so some elements of Engineer Technology as far as Weapons and their use would be something to be explored, but i dont think it would SOLELY have to be based on this take on the Engineers, like the Comics seem to do.

I cant really see how you made that Comparison?  Maybe its as i put below?

I do accept that we saw the Engineer wake up and attack the Crew of the Prometheus, but he only killed Weyland, Ford and the One Mercenary (David to a degree) and all with his Bare Hands, so we never saw no real Predator Technology.

My point being that i feel Disney are more likely to revisit our Engineers (if they do) more in context to the Comics that they appeared in, were we would see them portrayed similar to Predators in 7-8ft Guys using Technology/Weapons and Hand to Hand Combat to dispatch of Humans and XENOMORPHS and so by that i mean more of a Action Role, and NOT much about their History or all the Gods stuff.... they would likely be shown as 7-8ft Angry Vengeful beings intend on Eradicating Humans and Tearing up Xenomorph Ass!

I can see AVP was like Prometheus in context to the Ancient interaction with Mankind, Undiscovered Temples that Xenomorph (Black Goo) awaits for  the Foolish Human Explorers.

What i mean by AVP was in General as far as the Franchise (Games, Comics) are Action Based, Xenomorph vs Predators in Combat, its also WHY i think Disney would rather go the route of a ALIEN movie thats more Action and Run/Shoot Orientated.

I think Disney would see that Action Sells and so there is more chance of a Aliens/Alien Resurrection type Alien Movie, than a Alien, Alien 3 and Alien Covenant for example.

Nothing wrong with what some would call PopCorn Action, i feel the Alien Franchise has much more to offer than the Gung Hoo Action Route, but a few in this Style would not Hurt, but i feel there is only so many times you can keep doing this, and even with Alien/Alien 3 i think the Franchise is BIGGER than the Xenomorph as far as a expanded route.

In Hindsight i think they needed to had done TWO Prometheus Sequels.... one to LV-223 where we could have a more Action and Alieny Vibe, have Xenomorphs or similar and more Clues to LV-426.  Then another that followed Dr Shaw and David could have gone off and done its OWN thing and steered away from ALIEN.

Dont get me wrong, when viewed on its own and Not-Canon i think the First AVP is actually a decent Popcorn Action Flick, i think Aliens is the better one (to some degree, as far as better OVERALL movie).

so we are more likely to explore the Engineers in some kind of AVP like Movie, where we replace the Predators with Engineers.  So Fans can see Engineers purely shown as Bad Asses who use their Superior Technology against Humans and Xenomorphs... so Yeah! just like the Predators.

Like Prometheus, right? :)

I think Ridley Scott had BIGGER/BOLDER intentions/dreams than just that ;)

May be, may be, but Prometheus already looks like AvP.

The description definitely helped. Otherwise I thought it was a bit abstract and the end seemed Matrixy somehow. Another viewer said " That’s how I feel when I walk up to the TSA line with my luggage". Most shorts have descriptions.

Certainly Thoughts_Dreams we have to go back to ALIEN as the Kick Starter to the Franchise, and we had the Xenomorph explored in Future Movies but NONE ever went back to expand on WHO the Space Jockey was and WHY that Cargo.  The Space Jockey Scene was Enigmatic this Species, his Technology their History and Agenda are something to be explored...   The Xenomorph was considered a Bio-Weapon throughout most the Franchise and in Ridley Scotts Eyes, and so it was a case of ONCE you explained WHY this Bio-Weapon was Created and what for, then what do you do NEXT?

More Eggs, more Weyland-Yutani Conspiracy? The Plot of the Prequels which includes Alien Engineers does-not solely rely on showing us all these Space Jockey/Engineers do is Create Bio-Weapons to just KILL off Folk!

The Galactic Gardeners of Space Plot opens up a WHOLE Universe of possibilities and i think this is what Ridley Scott was aiming for, so that Prometheus would act as a Bridge... it would loosely link to ALIEN but then allow a sequel that would be Totally Different to the ALIEN Franchise.

Alien Covenant should not cause any Problems for exploring the Engineers and who created them, what else did they or their creators create..  This is by Virtue of a Few Things.

*The Engineers and their Origins/Hierarchy are ANCIENT, and could have Many Layers who Origins Span Millions, a Billion or so Years.

*The Engineers and their Hierarchy (Creators) have likely Seeded Life and Created Life Across the Galaxy (never mind other Galaxies), if Humanoids are a near Perfect Desired Project you dont Scrap it to Start Again...   David proved Flawed... did Weyland-Yutani just Scrap having AI/Robots?

*The Galaxy is Large its like about 100'00 Light Years from Side to Side, the Center of the Galaxy is 25'000 Light Years from Earth.  Within the Franchise it appears such Interstellar Distances are BEYOND what Mankind can Achieve in the 2100-2300 but certainly not for Engineer Technology that is perhaps Millions if not MORE Older can traverse!

*If we ASSUME there are other Humanoid Worlds in the Galaxy, we cant assume everyone is at a similar Stage to out own.  some Worlds could be Much Younger, with some Humanoid Species that are Stone Men....  some Worlds could have Evolved to past what we have Today, or in the Alien Franchise, but they achieved this Tens of Thousands of Years ago, or More and are SIMPLY.... No More!

So the Engineers are unlikely to ONLY had interacted with and located on Earth, LV-223 and Planet 4...  so indeed we can have a expanded Franchise thats ONLY connection to ALIEN is the Engineers/Space Jockey in that this Race had also maybe Created Mankind and at very least Interacted with us.

No need for Earth (could have flash backs to our Past) or be set Hundreds of years in the Future, No Need for Xenomorphs, David etc etc.

Star Wars has Humans... yet it is NOT set in our Galaxy, a number of other TV Franchises likewise (Caprica/Battle Star Galactics)

There could be Interactions between the Engineers/Humans from these Distant Places and Earth, these could be done in Flash Backs/Set in our Distant Past.... or a Future Interaction Set after the EVENTS of Alien Resurrection, but we dont really need to have them interact.

Such a Expansion would not have to be Restricted to ALIEN, and so would have a lot of Freedom to cover many things.

We could be shown a Distant Human Colony (Colonies) came from the Engineers visiting Earth in the Ancient Past and taking some of us to other Worlds...  or it could be shown that out Origins came from a FAR away place and we are just one of many Colonies of Humans and we came from another Place Many Many Thousands of Years ago.

However... to be honest its unlikely we shall see such Ventures, i do feel that Disney would want to Maintain the Alien Franchise and have it all CONNECT together, so we are more likely to explore the Engineers in some kind of AVP like Movie, where we replace the Predators with Engineers.  So Fans can see Engineers purely shown as Bad Asses who use their Superior Technology against Humans and Xenomorphs... so Yeah! just like the Predators.

I think Ridley Scott had BIGGER/BOLDER intentions/dreams than just that ;)

About Ripley she had her time, she did great in Alien 1, 2, and 3 but it went into crap with AR. The prequels are disappointing about at least they are not about Ripley. Try to make good characters and try new ones instead of bringing up the same old character again.

Maybe they could have some Ripley adventures in a novel or what ever but not in a movie. Sooner or later it will become old and will probably tarnish the legacy of Ripley. Let her be and do not make it into a parody. Even if someone somewhere say that “well we can still try to respect her as a character” I would say that it will be repetitive make something new.

I would not be against them rebooting the prequels because they are disappointing anyways but don’t reboot any of the original 3.