Comments (Page 231)

Yeah its only something i would recommend spending $2-3 on to Buy lol....  i saw it on the SY-FY Channel. 

The reason i mentioned it, was because the Humanoids that where Engineered (think Replicants) did bare a resemblance to the Engineers... they was Engineers in like a Cross Between LV-223 and Planet 4...

The Movie seemed to take influences from the Prequels to ALIEN and Blade Runner.... 

The Interesting Part in Context to the TOPIC... is the Movie indicated that these Humanoids (who looked like Engineers) where Created for some Purpose (like David/Replicants) by Humans, but  these Creations where intended to Serve and NOT Procreate... its when these Creations then became Sentient, and could Procreate that the Humans Decided they had to PULL the Plug on them!

And so when Ridley Scott called the Planet 4 Engineers the Originals... then the Winters Dream 2307 Plot could very well FIT with the relation between Planet 4 Engineers and LV-223 Engineers.

As i am drawn to those Prometheus Engineers being to the Planet 4 Engineers as Replicants are to Humans in Bladerunner.

So to continue with my previous Post....

The ALIEN Franchise does-not have to connect to Ripley!

They could have a Movie set between Alien and Aliens, they would have to be Careful how this could Conflict with Aliens, but if done right then it could indicate WHY the company abandoned the pursuit of the Xenomorph for so LONG!

There is another potential ALIEN Movie by exploring what else happened to the Process/Events that lead to ALIEN, these could cover Planet 4, LV-223 and Origae-6 (if the Prequels were NOT to give these places closure) and so such Movies could offer something ALIEN but also different.

A More Traditional ALIEN Movie would be to Cover between ALIEN 3 and Alien Resurrection,  after the USCSS Patna leaves Fiorina "Fury" 161 do they head home and simply ACCEPT the Xenomorph is NO-MORE until we arrive at the Plot for Alien Resurrection?

It appears the USCSS Patna had not arrived at LV-426 prior to Fiorina 161 and so maybe its possible that it would go to LV-426 to see if the Derelict is Salvageable.....

Or indeed the Company goes back at some point in FUTURE which seems to be the Plot for Blomkamps Alien 5 (set 20 years latter).

So we could go for another Mission to LV-426 between ALIENS and Alien Resurrection, or indeed go for Blomkamps Alien 5 but just DONT use Ripley, Hicks and Newt as this was indeed what Blomkamps Idea was before showing it to Miss Weaver who then talked about it with Blomkamps and then he Re-wrote his ideas to bring back Ripley, Newt and Hicks.

The Alien Franchise does-not have to be about Ripley, so we can have Movies set between 2115-2375 that are very ALIEN/ALIENS (Xenomorph) that dont have to be about Ripley.

If we want Ripley i think they should continue from ALIEN RESURRECTION as what happens to her NOW that she is NOT fully Human, what Conflict does she suffer with her Humanity and Alien Soul!

"Make a movie between Aliens and Alien 3 it's a terrible idea ever. Nobody like it, because all know the end."

I disagree with this,  but your comment is VALID to a degree much like it is with this comment "What's a problem? Don't want, don't see. But there are people who want to see! And be better (and honestly) if people get the sequel what they want."

It comes down to Personal Preference, some people like Cameron's Aliens, some Dont, Every Fan has a different take and NO Fan owns the Franchise, the Majority who like ALIENS and the similar Comics/Books have a RIGHT to like that style but they should not be considered the VOICE of the Franchise, and neither should be those WHO dislike ALIENS and the like.

Personally i think whats DONE is DONE, and there is NO point in trying to UNDO anything to PLEASE a % because you then DISPLEASE a % so it comes down to then FORCING which Sect of Fans is in the RIGHT!   When None should be.

Nobody would like a Movie Set between Alien and Aliens? thats quite Bold, i think we cant say that, some will like it, some wont, but  then the same comes with this. "But there are people who want to see! And be better"  and so YES some would like to see a Blomkamp Alien 5, but some would not.

Personally i think its a case of looking into the Broad Reasons for ALIENS Fans Love of that Movie and the similar Style shown in some Comics and Books, and IF this is ONLY a case of because it has Ripley, Newt and Hicks, then Unfortunately they were Killed Off...  I personally dont think making more movies to BRING THEM BACK would be a Good idea, as it could lead to Disney basically just Rebooting what they want with the Franchise and its a case of where does this STOP?

We need to instead look at the other Elements about ALIENS and the similar Action Based Comics, Books and Games that a certain portion of Fans like.  And introduce these into ANOTHER Movie.

The ALIEN Franchise should NOT be about RIPLEY! doing this really does LIMIT the Franchise... is the Potential of the Xenomorph only LIMITED to the Derelict, and does it always have to have Ripley come to the Rescue?

so you can have other ALIEN Movies that DONT have to be about Ripley at all....  for those who Want Ripley then we could the route of what happens after ALIEN Resurrection, and continue with 1-2 Ripley Movies from this path.

Some Fans would be Quite Happy with Ripley and Co based Movies that Bring Back or Re-use there Characters, this is something some of the NOVELS do, such as there was ONE if i remember (have not read it) where Ripley is involved in another Situation with the Xenomorph between ALIEN and ALIENS, but then gets back on the Narcissus shuttle, and would then have had to Forgotten about those Events by the Time of ALIENS.  I would NOT like if they did similar with the Movie Franchise....  just like the Aliens Colonial Marines where Hicks is Alive after the events of ALIENS.

These would be just Fan Pleasing Nostalgia that could Conflict and Damage the Franchise, such things should be kept to GAMES, COMICS and NOVELS that are considered Canon/Non-Canon to each Fans own Personal Choice.

IF such a Movie was made.... then as you had said LETO... it would be a case of THOSE who dont like the idea, DONT have to Watch or Consider it as a Canon... and can IGNORE the Movie/Sequels and Accept Alien 3, and those who would LOVE to see a Blomkamp Alien 5 can accept these as Canon and Ignore Alien 3.

And so those WHO would hate such a ROUTE that conflicts with Alien 3, kind of have a Right to dislike it, but it comes down to the Studio and WHAT they would like to do, and if Disney choose to do a Blomkamp Alien 5 that offers a ALTERNATIVE sequel to ALIENS, then we have no RIGHT to say this cant happen... those who dont like the idea can simply NOT go and watch or consider this route as Canon.

IF we do go this Route then it simply offers TWO alternative Paths after ALIENS which Fans can choose to accept which ever they want, Some Fans could be Happy to Watch Both sequels and view them on their OWN Merits... so we DONT know if a Blomkamp Alien 3 (which is  what it would be) would be just a Nostalgia Trip with NO real Good Story but just the same Old Action, Run and Shoot... it MAY actually be a Good Movie, we would not know until its been made.

Certainly from a $$$$ POV then it could be a Money Maker... if it is made and BOMBS then i think it could well be a Big Nail in the COFFIN of the Franchise as far as Disney would look at it.... but the same could be said with ANY movie they would attempt.

so what i am saying is IF they go for a Reboot of Alien 3, then thats down to Disney, those who dont like the idea, can IGNORE it, or maybe go and watch it and just see it as a Alternative and NOT true Canon.... those who dont like Alien  3 could go and see it as the True Sequel to Aliens.

I just hope IF they made it that the Plot is Good and it tries to offer something a bit different too, and its HOW they handle the AGE of the Actors... as it is going to take a lot of OVERSIGHT or Good CGI to set the Movie say 10 years or so after ALIENS.... 25-30 years latter would be more fitting.

I hope it does-not lead to them having Ripley appear in movies set between Alien and Aliens, or even doing a ALIEN reboot....  or a REBOOT of the Prequels.

@BigDave, 2307: Winter's Dream passed me by. I checked the trailer and it was quite intriguing. Unfortunately it gets some really bad reviews on IMDB. Not so much for the story, but the apparently terrible acting and CGI. I might have bought it on iTunes were it not for the consistently bad reviews.

NEVER seen that HR Giger BatMobile before, thanks for the Share, i dont think its suited to the BatMobile...... However as far as some Engineer small Craft be it some kind of Fighter/Scout or some kind of Hovercraft (i dont think Engineers would be using Wheels) then i think something like this would be VERY fitting.

I think one Mystery we have with the Engineers was HOW/WHEN/WHERE did they obtain that Bio-Mechanical looking Aesthetic/Technology and WHY they dont seem to have it on Planet 4 apart from the Ships in the Docking Hanger (Juggernauts) and Border Control Ship (Scorpionaught).

It appears they LIVE a basic Life like some Cultures do on Earth Still,  where they Sparingly use Modern Technology but choose to LIVE the same Life/Culture that they had done Many Hundreds or Thousands of Years ago.

Is this by CHOICE?

Did they abandon such Technology apart from for a Few Purposes and if so WHY?

OR are they FORCED to Live in this Manner by the Hierarchy above THEM?

A lot of things that would be INTERESTING to discover, but UNLIKELY that we ever will :(

What do you think of Giger's batmobile, BigDave?

I think it just shows a combination of things, First improvements to Costume Designs, Second each Producer/Directors own unique touch, and Third a change in how the Xenomorphs are intended to be Visualized 

By that it appears the Leg Design is something they now consider is more Standard for the Xenomorph.  As far as the Digitigrade  Anatomy, which we see in Alien Isolation and so by that if we got say a Sequel to Alien that was set between Alien and Aliens, or even a Aliens Sequel set between Aliens and Alien Resurrection i think our Xenomorphs would be depicted with Digitigrade Legs

The Lack of the Dorsal Tubes on the Runner is something to debate about.... 

But the differences between the Alien and Aliens Xenomorphs could be considered as either Separate Variants from different parts of the Ship.

Or maybe there is some kind of Pheromones or other Element that determines what the Xenomorphs Gestate into.     The Drone could be considered as something that is TASKED with Starting up a Colony... Once Established and a Queen is then Established then the Queen or Hive could release something that would make those Gestating Xenomorphs become Warriors.

Maybe in Alien Resurrection there was NOT what is deemed a successful Hive/Numbers for the Gestating Xenomorphs to appear more like Aliens Warriors?

I think the BIG Question should be around the Xenomorph's Origins, as a Purposely Created/Engineered Organism for the USE as a Bio-Weapon (to Clean up Worlds) is the Queen a Desired Trait that is Engineered into the Bio-Weapon?  A Mutation?

Or a Throw Back Trait from what ever the Xenomorphs, Deacons etc had been Experimented from?

Alien Engineers seems to indicate that the Xenomorphs came in Variants and are Experiments from Re-Engineering a Life-Form the Engineers likely Did-Not Create (Holloways Child)  If similar applies to the Movie Franchise, then some more Ancient Organism that lead to the Xenomorphs etc could have had a Procreation like Ants/Bees etc (had a Queen) and so this is a Throw Back Trait.

But then it could be explained as a Trait that was Engineered into some of the Variants of Xenomorph.

Especially if we look at the Black Goo like intended which was the same as the Scarabs in Alien Engineers, then it explains the Process of Davids many Experiments.  But even the Mcguffin Goo we now have could still do that due its Radical AI application, by that Every Organism has a different DNA/Genomes, that would READ as Separate and Different Genetic Code/Program and the Black Goo can thus take the Genetic Code of One Organism and Hybrid it to another Organism.  (not too far off what the Scarabs did). 

So indeed the Creator of the Xenomorph, could use the Black Goo to Create Different Versions and Procreation... want a Flying Xenomorph, then the Black Goo could take the Traits of Flight from a Bat, Bird or Insect and apply them to the Xenomorph to Create a Flying Version etc.

Sorry i should have mentioned as far as Aesthetic but i guess having a BAR in their Meeting Rooms comes in handy ;)

So i would have liked to had seen a Scene were we see some kind of Corporate/Political Meeting Place with Chairs and Tables that had the Aesthetic of HR Gigers Bar, as well as the overall Aesthetic of that place..

Its a Nice Mix of Gothic meets HR Gigers Bio-Mechanical Aesthetic...  But ALAS we never got to see that in Alien Covenant, and maybe we WONT in Future..

I think it would depend if Disney would be interesting in the Engineers and what kind of deal they can strike with the HR Giger Estate.

@ Leto,

BigDave and I are just highlighting Cameron's perspective, which has to be taken into consideration when talking about the eusocial side of the Alien, as he was the one that introduced this to the mythology.

Personally, I believe that the hive/insect/eusocial Alien introduced in Aliens is a variant different to the biomechanical variant Kane discovered and that the "bug" Alien came from somewhere inside the derelict Juggernauts collapsed "hammer" arm; the part of the vessel the Jordens accessed the vessel...

Considering that it is highly unlikely that Anne Jorden dragged her husband all the way from the location of the eggs Kane discovered 57 years prior, it is my belief that shortly after they entered the collapsed arm o the derelict Juggernaut that Russ and Anne Jorden discovered a scene similar to this...

Upon discovering the bound Queen they approached a nearby egg as it opened only for Russ to get Facehugged, after which Anne would have dragged her husband out of there and back to the rover.

As for the Queen, it is my belief that the Space Jockey experimented with its cargo and created the Queen by introducing the Xenomorph to insect DNA.

Speculations aside, its key to take note that Alien and Aliens present their variants of the Xenomorph as somewhat individual to each other, whereas Alien 3 and Alien: Ressurection confuse/muddy the situation. The latter two movies carry forward the Queen idea, but the Aliens produced have a carapace akin to the creature from Alien, instead of the carapace-less look introduced in Aliens.

And then there are the inexplicable and unexplained reasons as to why the "Runner" Alien is the only standard Alien (as in not a Queen) that does not possess any of the Aliens dorsal appendages (the four tubes/nozzles and the "fin"). While it is also important to note that in Alien, Aliens, and Alien 3 the Aliens born shared the leg structure of their hosts, yet for reasons unexplained the Aliens in Alien: Ressurection, despite being born from human hosts (whose legs are plantigrade) somehow had digitigrade legs like those of the dog born Alien in Alien 3. The Aliens from Alien: Resurrection also do not possess the dorsal fin seen at the top of the spine in the variants seen in Alien and Aliens.

@BigDave That is a bar in Switzerland not a conference room. You can see the beverage fridge in the background and various bottles of alcohol. But I would be curious if the Engineers would enjoy Coca-Cola....

I for one are Concerned we MAY NEVER see much of our Engineers again, or Discover more about them, for instance where did the Bio-Mechanical Technology Come from?

The idea i had for a Prometheus 3 would have taken Dr Shaw and David to a World inhabited by Engineers and Humans but then i would have expanded on this with a connecting movie that would touch up more on the Bio-Mechanical Aspect in another Part of the Galaxy or another Galaxy all Together.

The Events could have then lead to the Engineers and Hierarchy returning back to our Part of the Galaxy many Hundreds of years after ALIENS.  And brought about and explored a kind of WAR OF THE WORLDS...

I think its a shame a lot of Fans and likely Disney would see the Franchise as having to Center around the Xenomorphs... but the Engineers/Space Jockey are something that would have expanded the Franchise beyond that.

I am sure Fans was Disappointed at Alien Covenant, as far as what to expect from our Engineers and Discovery more about them.

I think it would have been nice to see some various Bio-Mechanical Ships and Buildings...

Buildings/Ships with say Conference Rooms like this.

Also when considering the Weyland Yutani Military Sulaco Ships..  i wondered what would a Engineer/Space Jockey Answer be to them?

I always liked the HR Giger Train Design.... and thought it looked like some kind of Mother Ship...  like the Imperial Alliance Battle Ship from Star-fleet/X-Bomber

Loved to had seen a Engineer/HR Giger Version of that.

Which to me HR Gigers  The Train looked like.

Talking about The Train.. its a shame this Project/Movie was never made, some of its Elements/Plot could have been used for a Engineer Ship that goes around Collecting Various Life-Forms.

Or maybe David could have similar kind of Horror Plot turning the Covenant Ship into The Train?

There were other Aesthetic Differences between the Alien Big Chap and Aliens Warriors, James Cameron had mentioned the Maturity of the Species for some of the Differences, but he did intend to KEEP to the Clear Carapace Aesthetic but abandoned it as they See Through Part of the Costume became too Fragile for the more Action Sequences.

But again a lot of people will only go by what is SHOWN and not any comments by the Directors/Production.

So there are some Differences, these are from Cameron and his Team Deciding on some changes Aesthetically instead of trying to STICK with the Original...  But each Movie the Aesthetic is changed somewhat.

The Reality is those Working on Aliens and Cameron had came up with a Design that they in part felt was more suited for Action Scenes, and also going the route that these were WARRIORS then some of the Aesthetic Changes could be to make them look more... well Warrior Like.

We have to look at the Xenomorph from the BUG/HIVE POV and so there are different castes for maybe different Tasks... 

We cant Rule out that a Xenomorph can Evolve/Molt itself to some Changes to SUIT what ever role is required... so for a Queen who is Somewhat Incapacitated due to Egg Laying, then she would require the Warrior Class for Protection.

Maybe there is some Pheromone, Telepathic or some other kind of Element that helps to Determine what is required..   So that a Face Hugger who infects a Host and Gestates a Certain Distance from a Established Hive would Automatically Create a Big Chap/Runner Variant of the Species.

Where as ONCE a Hive has been Established and a Queen then any Gestating Xenomorphs within a Proximity to the Hive would Automatically become a Warrior....   When the QUEEN is gone then something triggers a Face Hugger to Produce a Royal Embryo.

(But it could be something similar to how daliens had mentioned in regards to a BEE HIVE).

Regarding the Finger Digits, maybe they felt the Xenomorph Costume benefited from having the Stunt Person inside placing their Hands in the Gloves in pairs, as far as a Production Perspective instead of 4 Individual Fingered Glove....  with the Thumb in addition.  With ALIEN in some shots the Costume Glove as far as 6 digits did look odd as ONE of those Digits had NONE of the Stunt Persons (Bolaji Badejo) Fingers in it, so it was a attached Additional Digit and it did come across as being a bit Wobbly and Odd.

It boils down to a combination of whats going to be better to use as a Costume, while also maybe what could look a bit different as far as Cameron putting his own Twist on the Design.

something INTERESTING to consider is that the QUEEN also has 6 Digits like the  ALIEN Big Chap could we consider this means they are Procreative Versions of the Species, and so would explain the Egg Morph Procreation or could a Big Chap simply EVOLVE into a Queen?

 James Cameron's statements that his Aliens were older is valid...

Oh, that's obvious. I try to say - they are not the same species from original Alien. Whatever what Cameron said. How anybody can explain missing six finger?

If we look at the bee world we can try to explain a few things, by comparison. 

A queen bee mates with the drones (male bees) and can lay fertilized or not fertilized eggs. From the not fertilized eggs come the drones, whose only purpose in life is eating and mating. From the fertilized eggs come the worker bees that are all female but not sexually mature. If the queen dies, the worker bees can lay eggs, but not being fertilized will produce only drones. Since the drones do not work or collect food, the hive will disappear. 

How do we get the queen bee? Nothing special about the egg, the worker bees feed a female larva from a fertilized egg with royal jelly, that female bee will thus become sexually mature and will lay thousands of eggs after mating with the drones.

But it is crucial to feed that female larva with royal jelly from the very first stages, otherwise it will be another worker bee.

If we consider the eusocial type xenomorph's chestburster like the bee larva, nobody would feed the poor creature with alien royal jelly unless it is born within hive or a group of xenomorphs able to protect and watch over it. 

@ Leto,

In nature, ovipositors are only ever used to transport and place eggs, the eggs are produced in the abdomen of the insect/animal. In Aliens there is no evidence to the contrary with one egg being placed and a few more being shown moving through the ovipositor.

Alien Queen Full Scene

James Cameron's statements that his Aliens were older is valid...

The Alien in Alien was alive as an adult for 24 hours, In Alien 3 the Alien was alive for 2-3 days, and in Alien: Resurrection the Aliens were also alive for 2-3 days. In Aliens the Aliens had been alive for 2.5-3 weeks before the USS Sulaco arrived there...

10 days/one and a half weeks for Gateway Station to stop receiving communications from Hadley's Hope (Supervisor Al's comments about three weeks to wait for a reply - 1.5 weeks for a signal to be received by Gateway Station, and a further 1.5 weeks for a response to be received).

2-3 days for confirmation that no signal is being received from Hadley's Hope, and Ripley's indecision to join the Sulaco to LV-426.

7 Days/one week for the USS Sulaco to arrive at LV-426 from Gateway Station (Hicks states 17 days until a rescue would arrive - one week for the Sulaco to return to Gateway Station from LV-426, 2-3 days leeway period in case the Sulaco is late, one week for another Colonial Marines ship to travel from Gateway Station to LV-426).

10 Days + 2-3 Days + 7 Days = 2.5-3 weeks.

The Aliens at Hadley's Hope were more skeletal in appearance, with missing carapace's and, at least in one scene, blades attached to their forearms...

The bladed forearms are not evident in most of the movie, with this scene being their only inclusion. Cameron's answer that such changes are from these Aliens being older is the only viable answer we have, especially as no other Aliens have been shown to include any of the features unique to the Hadley's Hope Aliens.

Gavin

No point clinging to words. Ovopositor or something else. The point is that it is in this "hanging" thing that eggs are produced. Not in the Queen.

BigDave

About eggs, egg-morphing and queen. I think, we should ask: how David get all these eggs - small and normal? Well, maybe answer - he used Shaw, but it's not an answer! We still don't know HOW. The process.

the Xenomorph in Alien and Alien 3 were Juvenile and when they get Older they loose the Clear Dome Carapace.

Between Giger's Big Chap and Cameron's xenomorphs much more differences than just with dome head. Another numbers of fingers, another jaw structure, etc. details, like blades on hands. No xenomorphs in Aliens is not a older. Some people talk about another cast of xenomorphs (well, you know - drone, warrior, etc.) and this is have a more sense.

Indeed regarding the Face Hugger Growing inside a Host, as suggested on here, maybe the ALIEN DC scene is showing that Brett is being changed into a Egg  Casing that will host a Face Huger he had maybe been implanted with?

Prometheus we saw that Dr Shaw had a Type of Face Hugger growing inside her...

We see from David's Notes that he had a interest in some Mermaids Purses that he Discovered.

It is possible he used these in his Experiments to Engineer from them what became the Egg Casing for the Face Huger Embryos.

A lot of the Errors and Conflicts come from Various Cuts/Edits of the Movies, then Changes that the Next Director/Writing Team make without considering what was shown prior.   Other Members of Production/The Studio also add what they want Changed Also!

With Cameron he decided to make the Xenomorphs more like a Ant/Bee Nest/Hive and introduced the Egg Laying Queen, which he was in his rights to do so, as the DC Egg Morph was not considered Canon at that Time. (not many would have been aware of the Deleted Scenes, Cameron may of, but as they was Deleted it means he Did-Not have to consider them for his Project).

I am not sure if we would ever see a EGG MORPH or have it Contradict the Queen, i think at some point it would be interesting to find out HOW those Queens came to be though.

"When Ripley shoots ovipositor - from there yolks pour out, not mini-eggs."

Silly Me...  i should have consider this, as indeed it did show something like YOLKS that was spilling out the Center after Ripley had Shot at it...  

Can we rule out a Queen Producing smaller Eggs? Who knows, if we do go solely by ALIENS then there is a Process from the Queen through the External Egg Sac/Womb  that are Finally Once Fully formed are deposited by the Ovipositor

Which when i now consider that then indeed the likely hood of having a Small Egg like we see in AC, that goes along the Process to become Full Size, appears to be what is NOT going on with the Queens Eggs.

So again thanks for reminding me of that Little Oversight when i proposed that theory ;)

Regarding David's Eggs and if those Small Ones can Grow i think thats something thats open for debate, we cant say for sure either way.

I think maybe the best Solution would have to be the Multiple Cargo Holds/Different Xenomorph route!

A lot depends on IF we get another Movie that shows the differences or HOW a Queen comes to be, so FAR the only information we have IF we throw out the Alien DC Cut is..

As James Cameron had stated the Eggs are Laid by a Queen, the Xenomorph in Alien and Alien 3 were Juvenile and when they get Older they loose the Clear Dome Carapace.

@ Leto,

An ovipositor is not a sexual organ, it does not produce eggs, it merely is an organ used for the placement of eggs (with parasitic ovipositors also used for piercing hosts). However, ovipositors are not unique to insects, as some fish and seahorses also possess ovipositors.

As such a Queen Alien could still produce eggs without an ovipositor, and as BigDave mentioned the possibility that the eggs can grow could explain why Ripley did not discover them (the assembly cut of Alien 3 shows two Facehuggers) aboard the Sulaco.

@ daliens,

Liking the idea of a Facehugger growing inside a host. We not only saw this, in a fashion in Prometheus with Shaws child. but it could also be an interpretation of some concept art from Giger for Alien 3...

However, the idea that Bishop stowed the Facehuggers onboard the Sulaco is, for me, a stretch. Yes, he was fascinated by the Facehugger in the colony's med lab (could David have spread a virus among synthetics that would make them become beguiled by the Xenomorph?), but after the marines destroy the only two live specimens from the lab, the only Facehuggers remaining (not including the derelict Juggernaut) would have been in the Queens hive. The only opportunity he would have had to gather any eggs would have been while Ripley was rescuing Newt. It is possible but unlikely.

As for how the Egg got into its uncharacteristic position I have a theory about that...

You will notice that the alien egg, or Ovomorph, has some tendril/tentacle-like appendages at is base. Some have speculated in the past that the Ovomorph is in some way alive, and not just merely an egg, while others retain that it is just an egg and that these appendages are merely roots.

What if the Ovomorph is a creature either laid by a Queen, or formed from a reconstructed host (a la Brett) that incubates and protects the Facehugger, and that with the tendril/tentacle-like appendages the Ovomorph it capable of moving around - ergo, once laid by the Queen while she was hiding within the Dropships landing gear, the Ovomorph grew to full size and managed to maneuver itself to were we saw it in Alien 3.

Regarding the egg on Sulaco, what if Bishop put the egg there. He seemed very interested in studying the dead facehugger.

There was no special order 937, but Bishop was still an android programmed by W-Y and he might have saved Ripley & Co. to serve as hosts. Or due to a malfunction.

However the egg must have grown on board the Sulaco, otherwise it would have been spotted by Ripley before going into cryosleep. 

The egg was also hanging on the ceiling, the queen, no matter how smart it was using the elevator and all, would have put it on the floor.

I have another theory: an adult xenomorph can implant a mini facehugger into the body of a host that slowly changes into an egg. The facehugger grows inside the victim's body leading to the classic ovomorph. 

Probably this is how David intends to use the 2 mini facehuggers.

No. Queen can't produce eggs without ovipositor. When Ripley shoots ovipositor - from there yolks pour out, not mini-eggs.

I think, mini-eggs it's just a... mini-eggs with mini-face-huggers for rats, birds and another small life forms. They do not grow.

Agreed....   what you said is exactly what i had mentioned, i also felt the Egg Morph = Queen as it made most sense... but later movies would contradict that.... so then i agree with the Derelict having more than ONE kind of Egg Cargo could be used to explain the differences... its certainly what was indicated in Alien Engineers.

The Sulaco Egg was always a Mystery that Bugged People!

Could Bishop had done it? did he have time?, was there another Crew?  It really came down to purely a Plot Convenience that was NOT thought out because it NEVER mattered.

But THANKS to Alien Covenant we could have a Answer for the Sulaco Egg!

We see here SMALL Eggs, that are the same as the Larger Ones that infected  ORAM... we see David had sneaked some Face Huggers on the Covenant that where Small that he had Ingested... 

so it could be possible the Queen Produces Small Eggs that GROW in the Egg Sack/Ovipositor as these make their way along they GROW and are Finally Laid.

So the Queen that got on the Sulaco could have Produced a Few Small Eggs that where Stuck against the interior of the Sulaco and  GREW!

I think that could explain how they got Aboard the Sulaco ;)

Will have to check those out ;)

Indeed the Themes have been covered in Numerous Movies.

I just find it interesting in HOW we had Ridley Scott refer to the Engineers in Alien Covenant as the ORIGINALS... we saw they looked different which some fans noticed/complained about as our Prometheus Engineers looked more Godlike and Superior to our Planet 4 Engineers.

So they are NOT worthy Creators.... where as those in Prometheus looked more worthy!

But a thing to remember is Peter Weyland was a Creator and does he look more Godlike and Superior than David? The Answer is NO!

so when RS mentions our Engineers on Planet 4 are the Originals, then it does suggest that those in Prometheus are Created/Evolved much Latter... and THIS is something i think would be interesting to consider.

Its always considered that a Creator/God would be more Superior to their Creation... but maybe thats NOT always the Case.

@Chris what you and other people don't take into account is that films made by Cameron are bleeding edge technically speaking (talking about the gimmicky post-Avatar 3d craze). While Scott movies have gorgeous cinematography the last think I recall him being proud in the technical department is the sand storm CGI (perfected in Prometheus and in The Martian) ....

@ BigDave,

My position is that matters such as canonicity any really matter to the fans, and the version of any movie, especially franchise movies such as the Alien movies that matter to fans will in most cases be the extended home release of a movie, whereas theatrical releases are more geared towards general audiences. As such when it comes to Alien I view the Directors Cut, and ergo egg-morphing scene as canon.

As to how egg-morphing can fit in with the rest of the movies, which predominantly follow the Queen based lifecycle introduced by James Cameron, I feel there are two possibilities...

#1 - many moons ago I proposed the possibility that had Ripley not discovered and torched them that once Brett had fully 'morphed into an egg that the Facehugger within would implant an embryo into Dallas, which could have burst out as a Queen Chestburster.

#2 - a more recent proposition of mine is that the biomechanical egg-morphing Alien is sourced from the thousands of eggs stored within the derelict Juggernauts, whereas the more organic Queen variant of the Alien is sourced from the collapsed "hammer" arm of the derelict Juggernaut.

Option one answers the question of how a Queen would come about, whereas with option two the mystery of how a queen would be formed remains a partial mystery.

We know that Ripley ended up with a Queen Chestburster gestating within her, sourced from a Facehugger attacking her while she was in hypersleep aboard the USS Sulaco. This Facehugger, likely the royal variant pictured above, as seen in Alien 3's Assembly Cut (if we are to consider the Assembly Cut as the canon cut of the movie), would have come from egg onboard the Sulaco (pictured below), which was highly likely left there by the Queen that stowed away aboard the dropship.

This would mean that the Queen is capable of producing, collecting, and guarding eggs that would produce more Queens, using them to create a new hive if and when needed.

Their music is brutal but THEY aren't brutal. Not much sense in killing your fans- hard to pay bills with that kind of business model.

I'm pretty sure rebellion has been in movies ever since. In Terminator (1984), humans created Skynet, it turned against humanity and created an army of
robots.
In another 90's cartoon, I forgot its name but in it, humans created a genetically enhanced version of themselves and used them as slaves on other planets. Those humanoids rebelled against humans and soon took over the entire Earth.
In Blade Runner, humans created an enhanced version of themselves called replicants and used them off-world, and throughout the series, replicants rebelled against
humans.
Similar thing in Matrix (1999) and how it all started, the war between humans and machines (it was explained in Animatrix 2003 "The second renaissance" parts 1 and 2). There's another film Automata (2014) but I don't feel the need to talk about it.

As far as Engineers creating the pathogen and then wanting to use it as a weapon, writers and Ridley stated engineers didn't originally create it.

I'd like to mention one underrated horror film from 2017 called Trench 11. In it, during the final days of WW1, a group of soldiers was sent to investigate an abandoned German facility deep underneath the ground. There they discovered Germans were experimenting with some kind of parasitic worm that produces itself inside the host's body, causing the infected host in the process to become extremely hostile and attack others by infecting them. Those things got out of control so Germans attempted to blow the whole facility up but something went wrong with the explosives so they just shut the whole facility, leaving the infected trapped inside.

Also in Overlord (2018), a small group of American soldiers during WW2 discovered that Nazis was conducting experiments in an attempt to create an army of soldiers with enhanced strength, speed, etc. It was also stated in the film and Germans didn't originally create the serum that causes those mutations, but they discovered it deep underground in France and experimented with it.

What's even scarier is that in reality, Nazis were actually experimenting with performance enhancement drug called D-IX that was supposed to give their soldiers superhuman strength and be harder to kill. Luckily, the war ended and the drug was never introduced.

I saw this the other week. Winters Dream 2307 (Winter Soilder)

Seemed to use some ideas from the Alien/Prometheus and Blade Runner Franchises...

Plot is that in the year 2307 the Earth has became VERY COLD that Mankind has to Live Underground, but they Create a Artificial Humanoids to Carry out Tasks, These Humanoids (who look like our Prometheus Engineers) become Sentient, Rebel and are then targeted to be Destroyed by their Creators (Humans) but some of these Humanoids Escape.  so a Task Force is used to HUNT them down.

Why is it relevant?

These beings are like the Prometheus Engineers, they have White Skin are Psychically Superior and have Black Blood.  The movie uses some of the Philosophy of Prometheus, and indeed from Alien Covenant to a degree (yet THIS movie was out in 2016) there are parts that discus the SOUL and how these beings HAVE no Soul, like how David does-not... but then its shown actually they do have a Soul, depending on what is a SOUL. (if its not the Spiritual One that goes off to Heaven)

It touched upon a Fear of what happens when these Created Humanoids could Procreate, and this worry becomes a Reality which is in part WHY the Humans then Order the Destruction of these Beings who just want to live among us (very Blade Runner).

I am not saying its a Good Movie, some interesting things but its NOT well executed ;)

But in Context to this TOPIC....  i think we could ponder if the PLOT of this Movie (Winters Dream 2307) could FIT with the Prometheus Engineers Creation/Relation to maybe the Planet 4 beings?

could the Prometheus Engineers had been the WOLF?

I certainly are drawn to them being either a Engineered Creation by those Planet 4 Engineers (or their Creators) like say David and Replicants are to Mankind...  

Or those Prometheus Engineers are a Faction of Planet 4 Engineers who took to Enhancing themselves without the Consent of the Hierarchy.

I am very Drawn to the Prometheus Engineers being more connected to David, as far as Creations meant to Serve.  Or they used the Creation Secrets to Enhance themselves to CHEAT Death and Upgrade themselves.

Oh that Movie has the Lead Bounty Hunter with the Name Bishop!  And the Leader of the Rogue Humanoids is called ASH-393 who comes across quite a bit like David.

Can see where it took some influences from ;)

Forgot to say... saw it last week, and WELL DONE.. thanks for those who worked on this, and i saw the Trailer too and so i look forwards to other Installments

Forgot to reply the other week!

This is Pretty Awesome ;)

But do those Robots have the Symphonies of these Pair?

Symphonies my Brother!

LOL

Regarding the Future of the ALIEN Franchise...

I felt this Alien Day was the ideal time to tease and market such a Project.... being the 40th Anniversary of the Franchise. But the Take Over and Disappointment of Alien Covenant and Criticism at that Movie (and some of its creative decisions)  had had a Negative Effect!  As far as Movies go!

Disney know the Franchise will always have a Market for Books, Comics, Games and Toys and other Merchandise.

I think if we get NO News by Next Alien Day, then we maybe have to worry about NOT seeing anything any time soon, and especially as far as a continuation of the Prequels.

I am having to accept i MAY never see a continuation, maybe i would get to see another ALIEN Franchise movie though,  but 2026 is a Long Way off ;)

Regarding AVATAR!

I attempted to watch it but could not get into it, maybe NOT my kind of Movie, i will have to give it another GO!

But it made MONEY.... the Question is have they LEFT it too LONG?   They would be better of making a Second Movie thats OPEN ENDED... so it would not 100% have to have a Sequel... but could lead to one should it be a HIT.... then if its makes Big Bucks... then surely Role out the Rest!

Committing to 5 such Movies is a Risk!

It would be like say if the NEW Star Wars Franchise was to be a 6 Part New  Kylo/Rey Franchise, at Present they would have to make EP9 set up a EP10-12 and well if EP9 does not do well, they would be DEAD in the Water a Bit!

I think AVATAR would make $$$ though.... there is that Market for it, that say attracts those who would watch a Guardians of the Galaxy 3, 4 and 5 etc.

Fair Play to those putting on this Show and Michael Biehn hope it raises a lot of $$$$$ for a Good Cause.

Just hope there is NO Atmosphere Processors near by that could Overheat and Go Critical ;)

@daliens

I think considering a Limited Number of times a Xenomorph can Egg Morph would be some kind of Safeguard certainly. So indeed if we assume a Xenomorph could only EGG Morph a single Host, and then Cocoon another, then Certainly that would explain the Xenomorph actions as far as KILLING (or attempting to) the other Crew Members to Protect the Egg Morph.

I think as far as a Engineered Bio-Weapon this would make sense.  As indeed having the ability to Egg Morph as many Victims as possible would make it a Bio-Weapon they could Loose Control over...

The same can be said for the Queen though, not really a Ideal Weapon, unless the Queen has a Limited Life-Span, or if the Weapon has One Purpose and thats to Eradicate a World/Threat while leaving the Place  a Hostile Environment to go back too...   So a bit like using a NUKE... but maybe the Xenomorph Queen with a Limited Life-Span would mean after a World is Cleansed a Period of Time passes as all that remains are EGGS... then as Gavin pointed out it would make a Viable Weapon.

"Though scorned by some Alien purists, James Cameron's addition to the Alien lifecycle makes the creature a much more effective biological weapon."

I think Gavin it depends, on one hand YES having a Queen that can Lay Countless Eggs makes it a more Mass Producing Threat...  However.....  A lot depends on the Process of HOW a Queen comes about... what Process does a Queen come from, this is something we have YET to be shown and does have a BIG impact on the Organism as far as a Threat!

Example...   Queen Lays 40 Eggs... then the Queen Dies... what makes one or more of those Eggs Host a Queen?  Is it just a RANDOM number/chance, surely NOT?

If it was a Egg Morph then should all Egg Morphs be killed too, then does that leave ONLY standard Xenomorph Eggs?

So a Queen is a threat as long as she is ALIVE, it then depends on HOW does another Queen come about when the Queen is Killed Unexpectedly?

This is something the Movies have not answered (i cant say for any Novels though).   The ability and process of how a Queen can come about is what raises or lowers the Xenomorph threat as far as a Egg Laying Species via said Queen.

A Egg Morphing Species however.. would have the ability to Procreate Eggs at Will, provided it is given ample time to get Hosts and Egg Morph them...   It would NOT depend on a Queen, and thus Halt Egg Production with the Death of a Queen.

As far as a Bio-Weapon from the POV of those who intend to use it, then Egg Morphing would maybe NOT ideal as once you have say 20 Xenomorphs unleashed then they could go around and continuously Egg Morph Hosts and so you would have less control over how to HALT the Infestation..... with only a QUEEN as the route to the Eggs, then if the Queen has a Limited Life Span and a Fail-Safe or you could have a Fail-Safe to Kill the Queen, then you HALT the infestation... depending on HOW a Queen could come about.

Either way as a Bio-Weapon the Xenomorph has its draw backs... its a bit OVERKILL.   Unless we say ONLY had ALIEN and the Egg Morph and as daliens mentioned if a Xenomorph can ONLY perform a single Egg Morph.. 

Then this is a Weapon that while it would have less Killing Potential/Threat due to Limited Procreation, it would make any World they are Unleashed upon, something that you have some Control over as far as Retaining that World after a Infestation.

10 Eggs Deployed...   After Killing Spree...  having up to 10 Eggs (Egg Morphs) remaining... or if 3 of those had Hosts then thats 7 Eggs (potentially) and 3 Xenomorphs left over that could potentially lead to another 3 Eggs.

Compared to 10 Eggs/Xenomorphs that can Egg Morph as many times as they like... that could leave a HELL of a lot of Eggs/Threats.

The Queen likewise.. especially if their is some Efficient way to replenish Queens once a Queen has died...  then your left with a Massive Clean Up Problem.

So as far as the OT goes....  YES they could Co-Exist, its trying to think HOW, as in what does a Egg Morph create, i think as most would not be aware of Egg Morphing i think it could make a appearance in Future...  but as far as being the Procreative Route of the ALIEN Xenomorph as its only shown in the DC, then it can be down to Personal Preference, until we are shown a Egg Morph and Result in Future...    Also it would be interesting in Future to be shown HOW does a Queen come about.

@setaverde, I agree with you 110%. I would take a flawed Alien film over a repetitive narrative like Avatar any day, let alone 4 more films full of it.

@daliens,

Speaking retroactively, I think the Ovomorph and Facehugger parts of the Alien lifecycle allow reusability of the creature as a deployable biological weapon. let us consider the deployment of a direct-implantation variant, alongside the traditional Facehugger implantation variant.

Scenario #1 - Direct Implantation Deployment

Adult Xenomorph deployed subjugates hosts spreading until all viable hosts have been exhausted/killed. Adult Aliens die, leaving behind a devastated ecosystem.

Scenario #2 - Facehugger Implantation Deployment

Ovomorph deployed. Facehugger subjugates host. Adult Xenomorph gathers hosts for further Facehugger subjugation, spreading until all viable hosts are exhausted/killed. Adult Xenomorphs die, leaving behind a devastated ecosystem and hordes of Ovomorphs, ready for future deployment elsewhere.

In layman's terms - you drop one egg off, wait a few weeks/months and return to a world devoid of hosts and thousands of eggs. A highly effective, self-sustaining biological weapon. Direct implantation would remove the self-sustainability of such a weapon.

on the other hand, Gavin, it would be more appropriate if the xenomorph would have the capability of direct implantation, they could do it on spot, without the need of dragging the hosts to the nest. 

I was reading some interesting facts on Wikipadia about the commercial use of parasitoid wasps and the use of xenomorphs as pest control would be perfectly plausible if the Engineers started to see the humans as pests. This would not exclude the theory of the xenomorph being a species of its own right discovered and deemed useful for the Engineers' purposes.

"Parasitoid wasps are considered beneficial as they naturally control the population of many pest insects. They are widely used commercially (alongside other parasitoids such as tachinid flies) for biological pest control, for which the most important groups are the ichneumonid wasps, which prey mainly on caterpillars of butterflies and moths; braconid wasps, which attack caterpillars and a wide range of other insects including greenfly; chalcid wasps, which parasitise eggs and larvae of greenfly, whitefly, cabbage caterpillars, and scale insects."

@daliens,

The second scenario you infer to b egg-morphing is actually "direct implantation", an idea that was used by the Pred-Alien (Chet) in AvP: Requiem. The writers/directors the Brothers Strause retroactively claiming that the Pred-Alien was an immature Queen and that she was only capable of direct implantation for a short period of time before she evolved into a Queen. This idea makes sense as it allows the Queen to establish a small brood before becoming defenseless, but conversely, the Queen would be putting herself at risk by doing so.

Egg-Morphing has always been referred to as what we saw in Alien's deleted scene - whereby a host, likely after being forced to consume something passed to it by the Alien, metamorphosizes into the Ovomorph stage of the Alien lifecycle. More specifically an Ovomorph slowly encases the host, reducing the host to viscera, and likely reconstructing components from the host (such as the spine, hands, lungs) into a Facehugger.

If we are to look at the Xenomorph as a biological weapon, then it would likely be classed as a WMD (Weapon of Mass Destruction). Once released into an ecosystem, the resulting spread of the weapon would devastate said ecosystem, supplanting all viable hosts with more of its kind until all such hosts were exhausted, after which the adults would eventually die, with only the eggs remaining. Reducing the number of possible hosts the Alien can egg-morph reduces its R Nought (reproductive rate), but in no way can be viewed as a safeguard, because as Alien showed, the creature eliminated potential hosts it viewed as a threat to its young. The spread of the Xenomorph would therefore slow, but the fatalities from a gradually rising number of Xenomorphs would grow quite rapidly. The safeguard against the Xenomorph is its reliance on hosts to propagate. Without viable hosts, any brood/hive of Xenomorphs will die out.

This is where the Queen as an insect-like mother-caste, capable of producing thousands upon thousands of eggs makes the Xenomorph a deadly and more efficient biological weapon, as one Queen could wipe out within a relatively small time frame an entire worldwide ecosystem. Though scorned by some Alien purists, James Cameron's addition to the Alien lifecycle makes the creature a much more effective biological weapon.

But here's some food for thought...

in Aliens, Ripley says towards the end of her hearing with Weyland-Yutani that Kane told her (and the crew of the Nostromo) that he saw thousands of eggs. Yet in Alien when Kane wakes up all he relates to his crewmates is a nightmare about smothering.

By-the-by, James Cameron has a habit of doing this. In Terminator 2: Judgment Day Sarah Connor is shown to know the exact date of Judgment Day; August 29th, 1997. But in The Terminator Kyle Reese never once related that date to her.