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"For "Sweet Notes," Scott crafted a world similar to Dune with explorers discovering the gift of honey; "Rising Heat" is shaped as a hot desert like John Carter of Mars with giant Prometheus-like statues walking alongside a humanoid race; "Spicy Edge" focuses on alien technology in a chamber that looks straight from the Alien franchise that's being used to create a woman via colorful spices; while "Flowing Flame" deals with an advanced species of human navigating an aircraft over what seems to be an exploding volcano in a scene that looks pulled from his take on The Martian." (Source)
Work, over the main exterior of colony is finished.
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Thanks, it looks interesting. I will visit it again some time to see if there are some updates that have been made. I like to watch documentaries about how they made that movie and behind the scenes kind of things but that doesn’t mean that you will get everything explained.
Having some things unexplained is fine to me because that gives us things to discuss. It would be boring if they would answer everything. To me it is kind of interesting to think about what might be the differences between the Derelict and the Juggernaut for example.
As far as answering things or not there are so many small details in movies like that so some things might not get answered. You will never satisfy everyone because X might wants answer to A and Y wants an answer to Z. You got to choose what to reveal.
“Will Ridley Scott get to continue his Alien prequel saga?”
I am not sure if I am interested at this point, I don’t give a F about another David movie. When I see that David picture I am like “yeah whatever sigh “. Boring boring boring
A TV-series or a spin-off movie would be better than what Scott wants. Another alien movie with Scott as a director would probably mean more David and I am not a bit interested in that.
The picture that BD posted reminds me of the first AVP movie the way that it has lights and that. AVP isn’t very good but at least it is not as crappy as AVPR.
BD:
It is not that Shaw didn’t have a personality, she had but she was naive and very annoying. Tennesee and Daniels are not very well written but their flaws are not the same as Shaw’s.
“
.. i think i recall you saying that DAVID was the only main INTERESTING Character from Prometheus... but NOW you are NOT interested in him... “
Prometheus had David And Janek so that is two. Maybe you heard it from someone else or did not remembered it correctly but anyways. As far as not interested in David well I am so and so on that one, robots and technology is interesting and how it can go wrong but at the same time I don’t think that the Alien franchise and its movies is about or should be about robots/androids. They could make him a bit interesting by explaining his motifs more and make him less evil and/or explain why he hates humans. In AC it was just like he was angry for what reason exactly? It either made little to no sense or it was just “eh” but I blame it on a poor script or bad execution of it. David said something like “I will not allow them to start over. . .” but he never explained why. To me he came a cross a bit like a random sadist.
“it also shows that Characters who were GOOD can become FLAWED in a sequel depending HOW they are handled.”
Yes, and that is what happened to the character of David in Alien Covenant IMO.
"Which Logically would be David has to KILL them off."
It makes sense when we look at the story but it is still too much about an evil android.
"By Virtue of a Prequel Fans are also waiting for the BUS as in that inevitable March towards Eggs + Derelict and WHO is in that Pilot Chair."
Yeah but you can make it interesting along the way before they reach the goal so to speak but the prequels this far have failed with that.
"Introducing Characters in a Sequel... is going to be difficult if we are going to THROW our David under the BUS so to speak. As far as Character from the Covenant Ship!"
Then at least limit his screen-time. I would be annoyed if we got another David movie, also I would feel like that would be a dumb choice by Fox, Disney or what ever they are called now. Looking at the box office numbers for AC I guess that shows that very few compared to how many potential watchers there could be are interested in another Alien AI movie I frankly would not give a crap about that.
"But then we have to introduce a THREAT and so there would have to be some way to introduce a ALIEN Organism on the Surface.."
That could be done, you never know what kind of life forms there could be there. Imagine how many potential animals there could be in South America that are not discovered.
"Both kinds of PLOT as a Basis could WORK... they would be NOTHING New though... a Re-hash of sorts... but again IF the Characters are done well, it could be something that COULD work... if not it could be a Alien Trope/Fan Service alone!"
Doing something new is difficult but then they have already tried David and that did not work, if it would have then AC would have done better but it did not. I don't say that you need to throw in old stuff but when the new things do not work you got to sit down and think about how to improve the situation.
"It seems a PLOT that is too much to COVER in a single Movie... one that would be Difficult to get depth to Characters due to the number of pieces that have to come together.."
Yeah possibly but then they might need to go to something more simple because if this movie bombs then it would be bad to end it on a cliff-hanger, just look at AC.
"So the Logical Choice has to be a After-Math where we SKIP past the First Half of that SET-UP Plot.."
I guess so because the way you described it it seems that it would require a lot of time. I would not mind having it as a book, maybe it could be something interesting to read during the vacation in summer.
"But if we get them given the Engineers/Dr Shaw Treatment, then they cant also do that with David... because then you would have NOTHING to connect with Alien Covenant apart from maybe the EGGS. "
Flashbacks maybe? If they do that we do not need to see everything that went on but at least we will see the most important parts.
"Does-not mean it cant work.... but i think David has to be the Connecting Tissue between such Movies... even if he only plays as short role as ASH from Alien... at very least a BISHOP from Alien 3" At least the movie should not be about him
Cameron complaining of Newt and Hicks seems to be that it goes against his interpretation of what would happen. Hey Alien is not about Easterbunnies and fun times, bad things happen and people die.
I am not the least interested in Alien 2,5 or what ever it would be considered. Would they show such a movie in the movie theaters I would probably stay at home watching TV or something. Maybe if they have it as an alternative thing to Alien 3 it might work for me but to replace Alien 3 with Alien 2,5 would be crappy no matter who it is if you ask me. Just because it did not turn out the way Cameron wanted doesn’t mean that a new movie after Aliens is a good idea. Does he only accept his own stuff? To me that is like a baby complaining that he did not get all toys, time to move on.
Even if they decide to have another ending to Ripley I would be like “nah that’s stupid” and still consider Alien 3 to be the way it ended for Ripley. At least I can respond to it by not watching his Alien 5, let the dead stay dead so at least we can not encourage it by ignore watching that. I do not want to feed his ego
As far as the prequels are concerned I am not very interested because they already made a failure of them. To their credit they tried something new (Engineers and David) but things effed them up. If they make them about well made human characters and less about androids it might work for me but the way that it is now is just bad.
"I really don't want to sit through an Alien film with Sigourney Weaver and Michael Biehn de aged 30 years for nostalgia's sake."
What's a problem? Don't want, don't see. But there are people who want to see! And be better (and honestly) if people get the sequel what they want.
De aging is becoming more than a bit excessive.Marvel films have de aged Robert Downy Jr,Michelle Pfeiffer,Michael Douglas,Kurt Russell and Samuel L Jackson.Star Wars also did it with Carrie Fisher in Rogue One, Bonus points resurrecting Peter Cushing's with CGI.Blade Runner 2049 de aged Shawn Young as well.To me de aging is just to show off visual effects prowess,a gimmick more than anything really.I really don't want to sit through an Alien film with Sigourney Weaver and Michael Biehn de aged 30 years for nostalgia's sake.
Terminator seems to reset itself every 5 years to be honest.Terminator Dark Fate is now the 4th effort at Terminator 3,following Rise of The Machines and Salvation(both made so many continuity errors that they never felt like proper sequels)Sarah Connor Chronicles (which pretended Rise of the Machines never existed) and Genisys(which pretended Rise,Salvation, and Chronicles never existed,and reset 1 and 2.)Now Dark Fate pretends none of those ever happened.Thankfully Alien isn't this complicated or messy...yet.
If Cameron resurrects Blomkamps 5,which is possible,it's very possible everything but Alien and Aliens will be ret coned.Hell he might even make AVP canon because it was third in his mind after Alien and Aliens(to be fair he said this about Genisys as well),bringing about those bizarre cross overs that The Predator almost attempted.
As for Amanda...It seems as if Fox building an expanded universe around starting with Alien Isolation, as well as this years Alien Black Out (which I finally got around to downloading today)Aliens Resistance,and an upcoming Alien Isolation novel.But it's unlikely they will make a film about her,instead using games and comics to further her story.
The Quadrilogy was about Ellen, the Xeno and The Company.
As highly regarded Ellen is, it is time for a new direction without her. De-ageing with tech seems the ultimate raping of nostalgia. I think BigDave had it right having Siggy do voice overs or maybe seen in silhouette.
I think it is likely we will get a Return of Ellen Ripley, IF they give Cameron a Shot, its likely he will take Blomkamps ideas and CHANGE them a bit to fit with what he wants to do.
If we get a Blomkamp kind of Alternative Sequel to ALIENS.. i hope we get some kind of idea to explain for how we arrive at a alternative like i explained before... but likely they wont even consider this and it would be then just a case of Fans can Choose which Alternative they like... Alien 3 ==> Alien Resurrection or Cameron/Blomkamps Alien 5 and no doubt more...
For Cameron and Blomkamp regarding Alien 3 and Alien R are going to be considered as NOT existing... just like we have to consider that AVP movies Dont Exist as in Literal Precursor to ALIEN Time-Line.
A Literal ALIEN 5 could be the way to go, that could connect with the THEMES of Prometheus and Alien Covenant, if done right... (Sub-Creation) Pursuit of Perfection and attempts to Recreate/acquire the Xenomorph DNA
But while this could incorporate some ideas from Blomkamps ALIEN 5 it would lack HICKS and NEWT
So Cameron/Blomkamps ideas are mainly driven by Nostalgia and HOW they felt Alien 3 did a Disservice in killing all 3 off in that Movie.
I agree that we could have a Amanda Ripley instead...and i would not be surprised if Cameron would go for his Ellen Ripley, Hicks and Newt PLOT and then throw in a TWIST that Ripley comes across her Daughter who is NOT dead and connect to the Alien Isolation Franchise.
I will ADD... while we can look at Cameron wanting to do the same with the Alien Franchise as with his Terminator (3rd movies on wards are BAD DREAMS).
I think we cant rule out that Ridley Scott would have also done similar, in doing a Ret-Con of Alien 3 and maybe Aliens too.. I dont think RS would be as disrespectful to disregard Aliens, but who knows..
As his WHOLE ... War of the Worlds.. Plot would contradict the sequels to ALIEN a little... and RS had said you can bring her back (Ripley) and De-Age her... but for what Reason? So maybe RS had intended to Undo Camerons ALIENS?
"Now since the Xenomorph origin has been largely revealed and philosophical connections have been made, we are left with two major PLOT points moving forward:
1) How does the company learn about the Xenomorph and why/who wants it?
2) How does the original derelict/Space Jockey wind up in the condition of the original Alien?"
How these things would have been explained prior to Alien Covenant could be a little different... but i think this is IRRELEVANT a little now... we have to look at them considering Alien Covenant and not just Prometheus alone.
1) This is likely as the result of the Advent Message to the Company, at some point Davids Creations will end up on the Derelict... Assuming they continue with the David Creator Plot... at the Climax of the Prequels it would be likely that Davids experiments are all LOST and the only remains of them are on the Derelict. The company likely discovers that this is the location of Davids Xenomorphs from events that lead to WHEN those Eggs get on the Ship.
Even if the PLOT gets changed to show us Davids Xenomorphs are NOT those on the Derelict, it will likely have to END with Davids Xenomorphs being LOST but the company was interested and then discover that actually there are similar already on LV-426.
2) This is likely going to be a OVERSIGHT with maybe No Explanation. From Inception of the Idea, the Ship was intended to be Very Similar. There could be a number of reasons WHY the Ships in Prometheus became different, one MAJOR change in the C Shape from U Shape was for the purpose of the Juggernaught Crash/Roll Sequence which would look odd if the ship was the Derelicts U shape, so a C Shape would roll better.
As of Prometheus we had RS confirm the Juggernaught and Derelict are related, they are similar and they differ by a Few Hundred years... so its kind of like RS saying that ONE is a Newer Model and so some Aesthetics are different.
The Engineers will return in the next movie, and it meant that this was likely the Source of the Derelict, if it was not then the Source would likely be from LV-223.
IF we got the Prequels Finished would we have been shown a Engineer Ship thats more like the U-Shape Derelict and has more of a Bio-Mechanical Aesthetic compared to the more Mechanical Juggernauts?
We may never know... it could be we would have to accept they are intended to be the SAME... the Degraded Condition of the Ship and Pilot would likely have NO explanation.
Or maybe they could have come up with explanations to why the Shape/Size and % of Mechanical/Organic look of the ships are different... or maybe NOT..
For now all we can do is try and explain it ourselves with ideas/interpretations or just accept it could be a OVERSIGHT.
We may NEVER know or get a exact explanation for it.
There could be multiple reasons for WHY we have David given that name, Originally it may have had something to do with the Alphabetical Naming, but also fitting that David fits with the Religious Elements of Prometheus. A lot of things are not explained and are ambiguous and so we can have Multiple Reasons.. One Example is WHY go to W for Walter? It could be just as much a Nod to David Giler and Walter Hill
I think for me to discus these in depth would take up too much time, i can agree to some degree with what the Prof A had said, the Room with David and Weyland was full of Creations, and Art-work is one form of Creation... There is likely some Biblical Connection to the chosen of David as far as Fleshing Out his Background for Alien Covenant. But we have to remember maybe NOT trying to connect everything too Literal, so connections could be loose and NOT a carbon copy of King David and so we cant attribute everything between Biblical David and the Android David as having to be a exact Literal Connection.
I think the same applies for when we try and connect the Prometheus Myth... it could be something that does not have to be a Exact Carbon Copy of the Prometheus Events and it does-not have to apply to Dr Shaw... i think it likely has Multiple Layers of how this is loosely applied.
The Jesus comments is something take too literal too as a example.... but trying to connect a Engineer to a Literal Christ will no doubt prove a Folly... all connections i think should be taken as loose and ambiguous as NONE are really Spelled out so there is not second guesses or interpretations.
I think we also need remember Dr Shaw was on here knees because she had taken a Blow to the Ribs... David was respectful to the Engineers, he seemed to really appreciate what they had done, and mistakenly thought the Engineers would Appreciate him.... HOW wrong was he...
The Prequels have been something were ideas are constantly changed... it is HIGHLY likely that at the inception of the concept (began with Jon Spaights and Ridley Scott) that a number of the things we was shown in Alien Covenant would not have been as intended back in 2010. The best example being the Derelict and Cargo and HOW/WHEN those Eggs came to be on the Derelict which at this time it was likely to had been a Long Time and Certainly NOT a Creation of Davids.
IF we got a sequel you can bet a number of things planned as in 2017 would no doubt change as things progress.
After all this Scott/Cameron crap, I keep going back to starting anew with Amanda and going from there.
Indeed ninXeno426
Those comments about Terminator are a concern...
It appears we would be in store for a Ellen Ripley Saga again, and Queens... and IF the movie does well, then no doubt we will see a ALIENS 4, 5 and maybe a 6 (ALIENS as in a more Alieny movie like Aliens 1986) then the Concern would be that Disney would maybe let Cameron Reboot the Prequels... or even ALIEN!
He will drop clues/hints in his Sequel to Aliens, about the Space Jockey Origins and Xenomorphs that will contradict the Prequels and when Fanboys go... oh this is COOL... then i would not be surprised if the ALIEN Franchise because Cameron's Franchise...
Where he has his versions of Sequels and Prequels...
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If Jim Cameron produces blomkamp's alien , it's like starwars paralel stories. He just needs to had the word "another" to the title: another alien story. It's like alien versus Predator on steroids (forgive me Arnie). What alien fans need is time. Wine needs time to taste better. With time, Prometheus and alien covenant Will be considered great adictions to the alien saga. My regret is to see a Ridley Scott in great shape being wasted for nothing. Now, i think it's too late. Ridley Scott is moving on. He produces the Man in the high Castle, the terror and taboo TV shows. He will direct and produce the TV show raised by wolves and the movie gladiator 2.
Sorry, I have to say that this professor makes some very thin and comparisons, maybe because the movie makers also do.
David from the Bible is a great figure because he defends the chosen people from a great threat, namely the Philistine army with its strongest warrior Goliath the Giant. However in AC, David exterminates some space giant hippies and turns against stupid humans, neither of which threatening him directly.
And the Prometheus - Shaw thing is way of. For one, Prometheus was a trickster Titan (akin to Loki), who incited humans to mock the gods with fake offerings. After that he stole the fire and only then he was chained to the rock. But the thing is Zeus is the one who sends Hercules to free him so he does not die there. Shaw was the only one respectful to the god, kneeling before him,etc (OK, he killed him in self defense). Yes she stole the ship (fire), but she is not punished by the gods and furthermore she dies as opposed to Prometheus who is set free. I think she could be better compared to Christ (the passion scene after the Cesarean, the resurrection of the evil robot, etc)
What James Cameron has said about new Terminator recalls what dk has said above about Alien 5's ret con on 3 and Resurrection.Terminator is ignoring all non Cameron sequels,He's referred to those films as "bad dreams".
I think if Alien 5 is indeed back on the table,then I think it would be safe to say he'll make it Blomkamps 5.Though he was never directly involved, he praised Blomkamps vision during a 2016 comic con panel celebrating Aliens 30th anniversary.
To be completely honest, i didn't know What was the meaning of dramatic irony. When i watched the movie in a 4dx theater i was kind of surprised when evil Walter was on the ship helping Daniels and Tennesse against the protomorph. People underestimate the genius of Ridley Scott. He produced an excellent movie, "Morgan". I have a showcase intitled "Ridley Scott Universe" with all the alien movies, different versions of the movies, Blade Runner movies, Predator movies, alien vs predators movies and This One, "Morgan" (i also have the books and the the Empire, wired and sfx magazines with This movies on the front cover). Morgan- It's an attempt to build from the scratch in a lab a human being, perfected by using the knowledge of the human genoma . There are two streams of evolution allowed by the advances on technology, the molecular and the robotic. Morgan is a project in a molecular level, using advanced tech. The models evolve, competing against each other and completing missions. It's like they were building human replicants.
I kind of agree... its more of a PLOT set-up than a Twist, it is a Plot Device... now some may see it as a Twist... but to some it was obvious.
This is in regards to the "Oh the dramatic irony!"
Regarding the OT!.... i missed this Post, and so i will come back to this and give my Two Cents... as there seems a lot of interesting things brought up.
"I don't mind Cameron doing this with Terminator because it's his property,It's the last shot the series has at ever being taken seriously again"
The Terminator works... because the Franchise is based off the TIME-TRAVEL aspect... this makes its easier to go about and not be concerned with in-continuities apart from say returning Characters NOT looking the same as in the other movies.... EVEN THEN they dont care about that.
Returning Ripley and Hicks and Newt would as i said, would let the Genie out the Bottle and then allow them to basically Reboot anything in the Franchise.... Giving a Possible Explanation of Time-Travel in the Franchise would also cause much more Problems IMO
Blomkamp or was it Miss Weaver? said Alien 5 would provide a FORK in the Road... where after ALIENS we have TWO alternative sequel routes that Fans can Enjoy. And to a degree YES much like a Halloween 2018
They could offer a explanation... such as the Destruction of Hadleys Hope had opened up a Paradox.. where the Sulaco was thrown into TWO Alternative Dimensions due to the Explosion that Teared a Hole in Space/Time.. While this could make you then THINK... oh that would explain it...... by Virtue of Acknowledging TWO Alternative Dimensions they could take if Further by giving us other ALIEN movies set in a different Dimension and well Countless Re-Hashes.. No Thanks.....
I offered similar to explain the Derelict in terms of the Prequels, if say LV-223 Was Destroyed that Teared Hold in Space/Time that sent the Derelict back Thousands of Year. This would be not so bad... because it would be a Temporary Hole that merely drags the Derelict in and back into the Past and Closes...
Going for a Tear in Space that allows a Multiple Dimension Paradox however would be a MISTAKE!
I will agree with some your comments regarding Cameron ninXeno426 i cant see him using Blomkamps ideas but NOT include Ripley and i am AFRAID the Franchise will end up being like the Re-Hash Marvel Franchise. In terms of they will make Multiple Movies that will be about Queens and Ripley and Co!
Basically bringing things like the Various Novels onto Screen, where they should stay as alternative stories.
Best explanation i've seen!
Oh the dramatic irony!
https://www.google.com/amp/s/whatwouldbaledo.com/2017/08/11/no-the-alien-covenant-ending-was-not-an-obvious-twist-it-was-dramatic-irony/amp/
@setaverde
Potentially maybe... we see Amanda Ripley being shown to have had a NONE exciting LIFE compared to Ellen Ripley and her Xenomorph Shenanigans and she had died the year before Ellen Ripley was recovered and at the age of 66.
However.... we know that she had been involved with Xenomorphs via the Alien Isolation Plot, and so there is potential to do a movie that covers her during any period between 2037 and 2178... had she really died? is she really in her 60's Age Wise? Because as you mentioned, who is to say she had not spent any time in Cryo-sleep so she would not be as old as she would if she had not... because lets not forget that Ellen Ripley was 87 in ALIENS. So it opens up for the Picture that Burke Showed Ellen to be Forged.. and offer some Conspiracy about her Disappearance/End. You could even have Miss Weaver play Amanda and use some Prosthetics/Make up to make her appear a bit different to what Ellen Ripley did.
So yes even if its a younger Amanda Ripley, a movie that covers some of the Shenanigans after Isolation could be shown.... WHY they could even have her played by Miss Weaver and a PLOT where she is LOCKED up in some Mental Ward... she escapes, finds out her mother went to Fury-161 and off she goes to find her Mother again.. (dont have use Miss Weaver though).
But these would be a Re-hash of sorts.... we need something DIFFERENT.
Blomkamp had some GOOD ideas... i think it would be better to Merge them with a PLOT set after Alien Resurrection if they intend to BRING BACK our Ellen Ripley. and her AGE can be hidden with a bit of CGI for a short time, but then show her Evolving where make up can hide her Age as she becomes a Hybrid.. which is what idea i had discussed a few times.
The Company or Autons (in my idea) offer to HELP and reverse the Xenomorph DNA.... but their true agenda is to extract the Xenomorph DNA
I will FINALLY add that the Re-boot route would be a GRAVE mistake... because ONCE they do this and especially if the Movie does well, or even NOT... once you go this route... then they could then Retcon the Prequels or even ALIEN... and then in 10-15 years could even Retcon even the Reboots lol
I think every movie is somewhat flawed and not 100% worked out too well as far as giving thought to certain continuity etc.
ALIEN not so much, ALIENS a little but not as much as the others (Apart from Prometheus which again had flaws but did-not offer anything major as far as continuity, it just never spoon fed any answers).
The Problem with doing say a movie set before Alien 3 to explain the Egg would really be whats the point for just ONE Plot Hole, when we have to consider the options of HOW do you make a Full Movie around this... the only explanation would be that either
a) There was a Secret Party on the Sulaco
b) The company had another Ship arrive after or prior to the Sulaco.
The Prequels HOWEVER... offer a potential avenue to explain the Egg on the Sulaco by virtue of a PLOT where the company sends a mission out to some other place (not the Derelict) that ends up a BUST at the end, and have a scene to explain via some Dialect or Message on Screen (Email type) that could then indicate about a Special Order being sent to Bishop to Obtain a Sample from the Hadleys Hope. But then there are a number of explanations now we have the Prequels... by Virtue of seeing the Smaller Eggs that David had in his Work-shop we could assume the Queen brought on-board some that size and they GREW!
I dont think we need to show any clues visually about seeing WHEN/HOW those Eggs got on the Sulaco and the same can be said for the Derelict in the First Place too.
There are other avenues to take a ALIEN movie that does-not have to be a continuation of the events of Ripley, the Prequels reveal that the Space Jockeys Technology/Bio-Weapons are not limited to that DERELICT and we have the Alien Isolation Plot that reveals that years after the events of ALIEN but prior to ALIENS the Xenomorph Organism had not been limited to on the Derelict or Hadleys Hope.
A Movie that is in the same Time-Line as Alien 3 as in within the same period of a week, would be tricky and the same would maybe go for a movie set between Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection because these would have us ASKING... ok so WHY pursue Ripley in Alien 3 and then Clone her 100 years latter to gain a Xenomorph? The answer prior would have been this was the ONLY way to obtain one that remained.
But the Franchise has shown that Producers/Production on another movie often pay LITTLE concern for any potential Conflicts and Plot Holes/In-Continuity mean diddly squat!
Ignorant guy there is a difference.Prometheus and Alien Covenant may have had their fare share of nods to the franchise's former glory,They at least told new plots and for better or for worse didn't use famous characters like Ellen Ripley and Hicks.What Blomkamp and Cameron want is to frag Alien 3(both hate the movie which is sad because a large amount of the fan base accepts the movie now) and Resurrection (Which sadly won't be mourned by many)all in order to pull a Force Awakens esq maneuver to put those aged stars on the screen one last time just to pass the torch to a younger generation.
I don't mind Cameron doing this with Terminator because it's his property,It's the last shot the series has at ever being taken seriously again.Aliens was a sequel he was hired to make,a damn fine one yes (my personal favorite film)but he moved on afterwards.He even cut ties to Alien after they decided to go ahead with AVP(which he actuality turned out to like).Cameron is very egotistical and arrogant, While he enjoyed Prometheus and Covenant he added criticism that they were films he would have never made.He's stated numerous times that Aliens is the only worthy follow up to Alien. And leading up to Covenant he criticized the return of the xenomorph as basically been there done that,and now he wants to get an Alien film out there.
I do agree with dk that nostalgia isn't always a bad thing,especially if a film can turn out.Case in point Blade Runner 2049,which thankfully wasn't dependent on the past, Villeneuve was confident enough to have the film stand on it's own.So there is no reason Alien 5 can't turn out,but in all likely hood James Cameron is likely pursuing Alien 5 to satisfy his ego.To see his film followed up the way he wants it followed up.
alien franchise, the original alien quadrilogy, follows two timelines, Ellen Ripley's and company's timelines (well, they cross each other but ignore that). Ignore Ellen Ripley's timeline and you can make easely a movie between alien 2 and alien 3. Another return to the planet may be on the way, the endless Quest of the company for a queen. Or, you can Suppose that Burke lied and Amanda Ripley is Alive and Young, because she traveled a lot in space and that damn cryotubes/cryo chambers made her not aging normally. Ah, the cryo sleep Card saves the franchise. The movie could be amanda Ripley going on a space Quest searching for her mother and the perfect organism.
Yeah- the egg idea can go since it was just a plot device, but ignoring half the quadrilogy just so someone can make a movie, rake in cash and stroke an ego is a stupid idea. The Quadrilogy stays- warts and all.
Make a movie between Aliens and Alien 3 it's a terrible idea ever. Nobody like it, because all know the end. And... make a movie for explain magic egg? Seriously? I know, you know, all know - that the egg it's a only the tip of the iceberg of strange unexplained things of Alien 3.
No, need a retcon.
ninXeno426 Scott's work in recent years was full with nostalgia already (see Covenant, BR2049, Gladiator 2). What part of James Cameron work was really obsessed with his former glory? And I ask as someone who likes only Terminator and Strange days of all his stuff.
dk Let's use some good old fashioned logic here. JC hates Alien 3 for killing his characters so what are the chances for him to push for a movie where he tries to explain events from 3? Of course he is pushing for a sequel a la Halloween 2018 which discards 3 and Resurrection.
I think the success of The Force Awakes was bad for creativity as now everything is either a throw back to the 80s or a super hero movie. But we should I complain, as I do not give them money for this.
Nostalgia is an obvious reason to make cash on a built in audience, but it doesn't have to be a bad thing. Nostalgia can bring some continuity and remind existing fans to remember their franchise is not forgotten. It may sound like a stretch, but if done in a way that doesn't clobber us over the head, I would be fine with it.
I am fine with Cameron taking on a movie, but I do not look forward to half the Quadrilogy being explained away as a dream. I think it should happen between Aliens and A3 so the franchise will not be disturbed- lots of room to explain the A3 egg; also, a lot could have happened with that small crew between Aliens and A3.
Indeed that was confirmed to be the supposed Title, i wonder what Ridley Scott meant in the one interview when he said the Prequels would go in the Order Prometheus, Awakening and Covenant.
“There will be another one before we kind of literally and logically, clockwise, back into the rear back head of [the original] Alien.”
“It will go Prometheus, Awakening, Covenant….[it’s] fairly integral where this colonization ship is on the way….”
https://www.slashfilm.com/alien-awakening-sequel/
Ridley Scott can at times get muddled up, but prior to Alien Covenant it was reported that Alien 5 was on hold, but potentially would have came out next after the Prometheus Sequel that at the time was Alien Paradise Lost.
I do think that Production Companies do view Nostalgia as a way to make/milk Money. I think a bit of Nostalgia is fine but they have to also give us something NEW/Fresh as i feel repeating the same Nostalgia and Tropes can have a Negative Effect, but then there is a Fanbase that would NEVER mind such a thing.
A Concern is that SHOULD a Alien 5 be made, and brings back RIPLEY and Company... and it brings in a Good Return of say 300%+ and Gets Praised by Critics and Fans... then it could potentially limit the chances of getting any conclusion to Ridley Scotts Prequels.
But Alien Awakening originally is name for Blomkamp's Alien 5. Well... All honest!
I would be DEEPLY concerned this would be a Reboot of Alien 3, as Miss Weaver would likely be involved with Cameron and Blomkamp to pitch the BRING BACK RIPLEY! to Disney.
I think it appears that Blomkamps Alien movie had some interesting ideas, and originally it was not involving Ripley, so i would like to see some of those ideas used... but the ONLY way i would like to see Ripley would have to be a continuation after Alien Resurrection.
And i have mentioned the IDEA i have for that on here a few times, that could Incorporate a few of Blomkamps ideas.
I fear we will get the "Alien 3 and Resurrection" never happened route though and a FEAR for me is IF this does well, then we will get a "Prometheus and Alien Covenant" never happened set of Prequels that i would not be surprised also has a RIPLEY connection.
IF this happened (Reboot Prequels) or they never got made... but a few Cameron/Blomkamp ones do... i would feel sorry for Ridley Scott...
But i guess they would make MONEY... especially for the Generation/Fanbase who would love to be served up AVP Movies over and over, Marvel Hero Movies over and over etc.
I would not be so happy to see a Aliens 2, Aliens 3, Aliens 4 etc... with similar Formula to a Aliens or Alien Resurrection Repeated over and over.
But ALAS its what Disney intend to do that counts... they will consider a Alien Movie if they feel the Interest in ONE that has a certain PLOT that will make $$$$$$$
"Can a creator worship it's creation like a disciple worship his god?"
Certainly, as far as some gratification of their achievement, like a Artist does with a Painting, but also to worship a creation as a God is something that cant be ruled out.
The Messiah Aspect i context to Christ is interesting to ponder, i dont think Prometheus was setting up to be too on the nose as in giving us a Jesus.. Ridley Scott said they pondered a connection but its likely as in that the Christian Religions came from some kind of being who is misinterpreted and then spawned into Religion.
so in context with Prometheus, then indeed its likely the Messiah was as RS mentioned a Emissary and likely a Augmented Human Being or Hybrid so he would be Superior. who knows how FAR that RS could have gone with this, and who knows if he could thrown the Curve-ball that Christ was actually some kind of Synthetic Being lol
I felt in context to a Emissary that its odd they only had ONE and so i like the idea that there was more than ONE, but most of the World during the Middle Ages must have particularly offended the Engineers and killed the Emissaries while other continents like the Ancient Americas likely behaved in a way or redeemed in a way that was worthy and maybe still lived among their Emissaries i think that would go some way to explain the LATTER Star Maps after say 2000 years ago.
The worship of the Deacon is a interesting subject, some think it was a GOD, some think it was them trying to Re-Create their Gods... i see it as some Experiment or Organism that lead to their Experiments that had been deemed of Great Importance to them.
My Interpretation years ago was that these Engineers had either used this Organism to Re-Engineer Traits to apply to themselves, or they tried to Evolve themselves and this was a undesired out come that they then saw of Great Importance.
I even pondered years ago, what if those Engineers in Prometheus could not Procreate and they had a certain role to play, but then coming into contact with something that lead to the Deacon or a More Ancient Related Organism and by Virtue of its Life-Cycle/Means of Procreation it allowed a Engineer to Give Birth to Life, something they maybe NEVER had or had LOST.
With Alien Covenant, and RS comments on those Engineers being the Originals... it made me think that indeed those LV-223 Engineers are in effect similar to Engineers, as Replicants are to Humans. And so it would be like say seeing a Replicant who cant Procreate, Get Face Hugged and Birth a Xenomorph and then Worship the Xenomorph because it allowed them to Give Birth to a Perfect Life-Form.
A lot comes down to interpretation of the MURAL and what clues we take on board, which Alien Engineers offers a lot to decode that Mystery.
With regard to Weyland i think he was looking at ANY way to extend his LIFE and ideally he would wanted to be made YOUNG again... but i think he would have taken having his SOUL transferred to another Body if the Engineers could have offered him such. When looking at Prometheus and taking into account the Concept for the Engineers by Jon Spaights, it seemed the Engineers had managed to Manipulate their Genetics to prevent them from Aging as Fast, and to be Immune to Illnesses etc.. but at a COST of making them Sterile... so if we assume this was the case, then maybe they could have ways they can Manipulate Human Genomes to become similar... i am actually drawn to the Plot for Alien Covenant 2 would have been David Manipulating/Evolving those Human Emrbyos to make Augmented/Evolved Human beings... Superior.
Thus David likely creating a Race, just as maybe those Planet 4 Engineers Created/Evolved those LV-223 Engineers.
I am not sure i have seen Replicas... i will check it out, thanks.
Good. Cameron can do Renaissance for Alien. It doesn't matter as a director or as a producer. Blomkamp is a good director too. I think - they both together can create a masterpiece!
BigDave, I've read Prometheus 2: paradise Lost script (i also read alien engineers script) and, when i mentioned the Messiah of men, our Jesus christ, i was thinking in an hybrid, half human half engineer. The engineers Gave us a messiah because their society also had One, the original, the Messiah of the Messiah- GOD. May be they felt the need of having something superior and, because of that, they worship another hybrid, an half breed, half engineer, half black goo, the Deacon (more stable and rational than the Prometheus's Deacon without the human DNA, a more perfect organism). Can a creator worship it's creation like a disciple worship his god? In the end, we are all bastards.
PS: Jesus Christ and the engineer's Deacon had GOD's DNA.
When you clone someone, you clone a perfect body, with an hollow mind. Then, you have to insert the memories in the fresh Brain, a process of algorythms, synchronies and other stuff. Weyland didn't want to be a replica. He wanted to drink some potion to be Young again (he was searching for the Holy grail). Speaking of the soul, he wanted to create souls and Gave them to robots. Perhaps, the soul lives in our Minds and, if you create a great mind, you create a great soul. We don't Control our creations, because we don't Control the process of creation. Many discoveries result from experiments that went wrong. That's how humans achieve knowledge, by failure.
Well, tha's why i love science fiction, everything is possible.
I Saw an excellent movie, "replicas", starring Keanu reaves. I recomend.
