Evolution theory.

skittles6969
MemberOvomorphMarch 29, 20122152 Views33 RepliesThere's a lot of focus on the David8 character. I was thinking he would play a pivotal role in the evolution of the xeno. We know they will be different in this movie, larger at least. Probably due to the space jockey host's dna. If David8 is impregnated, would he supply his biological dna, and some artifical input. That would explain the bio-mechanical nature of later xeno's. Anyone have similar thoughts?
March 29, 2012
I think that it maybe impossible for the David8 to be a host of any kind because he is an artificially created being. He is made up of wires, and while he may have organic tissue, i don't think that anything would be able to grow inside him, because he wouldn't be able to provide it with nutrients. But I think that there is a reason that these things are able to attach themselves to specific hosts. Perhaps they have an instinct that enables them to know that a specific creature is habitable. But I'm certainly no scientist, and evolution has produced some miraculous creatures that are capable of things that we once thought were impossible.
Regarding the bio-mechanical nature of later Xenos, what do you mean?
March 29, 2012
that fake script had something about David becoming a real person after touching the 'bioformer'
if you ask me I like the idea very creepy...imagine he wakes up with a human hand and you can see a cool effect where muscle and flesh blend with cyborg fibre optics
March 29, 2012
@Corey-
In truth we don't know exactly WHAT David is made of. It's all mere speculation here of course.
We could speculate that this/these earlier version(s) were not true androids but more accurately cyborg. This has been mentioned of at least one other thread (the awesome 'Is Vickers a synthetic?' thread). And that could explain a few things: what appears to be some emotionality of David (and Vickers), and the aforementioned bio-mechanical (yes) nature of the later Xenos, IF a cyborg did act as a host. Then full on androids could've become preferable to cyborgs.
Just speculation but no matter how you look at it I haven't been this excited about an upcoming movie in a very long time!
March 29, 2012
Corey is right.
If David is a full synthetic there is no way a xeno could utilize his machinery to grow or develop an egg. David has no DNA.
DNA is vital for the growth of any organism. It supplies not only the code but the actual process to develop cellular organelles, cells, chemistry, proteins, tissue, organs, and so forth [this is called [i]The Central Dogma of Molecular Biology[/i]]. What's assumed is the xeno has a "viral" type of DNA that incorporates into and takes over the host DNA and causes it to develop whatever the xeno DNA has coded. This explains why the xeno takes characteristics of the host, and why this process happens so quick. It uses the host own chemistry against itself for the propagation of the xeno. Basically this is what viruses do and ironically the reason why there are no cures for viruses. Ingenious.
March 29, 2012
Bingo!
Think you're on to something. A creature that appears organic and synthetic, even on the outside.
Some great ideas here on this site but also think Mr. Scott is two steps ahead of us. Guess when we see the film, we'll all be a bit surprised.
Tommie
March 29, 2012
So have they been rounding up androids prior to Prometheus, seeing how there is a sculpture of a Xeno implying they already exist?
I don't think Xenos are spawned from androids, mutation, or anything else that has been speculated in these forums. We shall see.
March 29, 2012
Can someone please show me where the "bio-mechanical" term means an actual hybrid of biological and mechanical in the Alien universe?
My understanding is the term was coined because of the LOOK of Giger's work, but no true reference for Alien. I have found nothing to actually say it was the real thing. Aliens, and zenos don't actually have mechanical parts. They are only bio-mechanical in appearance. Much as the rest of Giger's work. The SJ suit and chair obviously raise questions, but not the Alien.
If I am wrong, please someone show me the light. This whole concept is very confusing. Quite frankly, I hope David is an android in the beginning, and still one at whatever end he meets. All of the speculation that he somehow evolves into the Alien race is a little too much like Robin Williams in Bicentennial Man. Please NO NO NO. Not for this universe!
March 29, 2012
The xeno is definately created through Prometheus, Ridley has stated the "pregenitor to the xenormorth" will be in the film and we have also had another interview from Idris Elba states "it's how the mum and dad met". My bets are on the 'progenitor' being the creature that Shaw gives birth to. My theory is that the Engineer lives in harmony with this white worm we keep seeing; maybe it gives the Engineer greater strength and longer life. I'm guesing the Engineers are 'A-sexual - only one gender' so they procreate through other means, maybe something to do witht he Ampules that infect Holloway. The sexual intercourse between infected Holloway and Shaw create the 'progenitor to the xenomorth' this creature stronger and more dangerous attacks the jockey birthing whatever lays or creates the eggs........... this is all my assumptions!!
March 29, 2012
lol...
Pretty Shocking Assumption ;)
If so that infected Hybrid Holloway Rapes Shaw that brings about Squidy, well how they gonna make that a PG 13 ;)
We dont know for sure but i think Ridley will go for the Shock Factor again, he even hinted that thare are a number of wow shock factor scenes in this movie that equal the Chest Burster Scene from Alien.
I suspect a vary Dark Uneasy Side to this Movie.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
March 29, 2012
Like many of you before me, all assumptions here, but:
1) A Scene of David crying from the original teaser trailer, (do androids come with tear ducts or is this an anomaly he experiences with his investigation of the contents from the ample room?)
2) I remember an Aliens comic series from the 90's in which Newt gets with a colonial marine who turns out to be an android, only he himself doesn't even know it. Maybe Holloway fits this scenario? Just a thought.
3) Alien from Shaw - fleshy and clearly organic. Potential alien from SJ - smooth, bio-mechanical in origin and large.
4) Ridley hints that the crew encounters an uncivilized society already in play there and a leak that one of the actors is eaten fairly early in the film. So what creatures are already lurking besides the aforementioned Shaw's son?
Interesting? Or retreaded stuff you've already read? Just contributing.
March 29, 2012
Why rape dude; he's looking in the mirror and is infected, I can't see a rape scene being in this film....
March 29, 2012
I would like to add that if there's one underlying expression within Alien, Aliens, and Prometheus films is the biomechanic structures of the "aliens".
I'm speculating the reason why androids are important is because of the limitations of pure organic tissues. Like I've said before, Ash in Alien tells you directly that the primary elemental material of the xeno is Silicon. All organisms on Earth are organic (Carbon based). The reason why living organisms are carbon based is because carbon can vary it's chemistry more than any other LIGHT element (except Silicon and Silicon belongs to the same chemical group as carbon... ie carbon and silicon share a lot of the same chemistry).
We already know that silicon is necessary for building computers, microprocessors, and so forth.
One would speculate that as any intelligent species attains greater technology, it hits the limitations of carbon based tissue. Look at our human brains. Because our tissue is carbon based we will never be able to think as quickly as computers because our tissue can't conduct electrical signals that rapidly. Thus, as any intelligent species advances in the universe, evolutionary, it would require its tissue to eventually incorporate silicon so it could increase it's mental capacity to advance technologically. In other words, as a species advances it would eventually become a hybrid machine/living organism=biomechanic.
I believe this is the significance of David(androids). He's the first step of human's evolutionary process that is entering a new paradigm of evolution.
March 29, 2012
I would like to add that if there's one underlying expression within Alien, Aliens, and Prometheus films is the biomechanic structures of the "aliens".
I'm speculating the reason why androids are important is because of the limitations of pure organic tissues. Like I've said before, Ash in Alien tells you directly that the primary elemental material of the xeno is Silicon. All organisms on Earth are organic (Carbon based). The reason why living organisms are carbon based is because carbon can vary it's chemistry more than any other LIGHT element (except Silicon and Silicon belongs to the same chemical group as carbon... ie carbon and silicon share a lot of the same chemistry).
We already know that silicon is necessary for building computers, microprocessors, and so forth.
One would speculate that as any intelligent species attains greater technology, it hits the limitations of carbon based tissue. Look at our human brains. Because our tissue is carbon based we will never be able to think as quickly as computers because our tissue can't conduct electrical signals that rapidly. Thus, as any intelligent species advances in the universe, evolutionary, it would require its tissue to eventually incorporate silicon so it could increase it's mental capacity to advance technologically. In other words, as a species advances it would eventually become a hybrid machine/living organism=biomechanic.
I believe this is the significance of David(androids). He's the first step of human's evolutionary process that is entering a new paradigm of evolution.
March 29, 2012
I disagree with David not having DNA. The nanotechnology could be so sophisticated that it can be mistaken for DNA. The technology could be small that it could combine with biological DNA. Just a thought.
March 29, 2012
Nanotechnology is just the ability to build an architecture at 1X10^-9 meters (0.000000009 meters) Nothing more. Nanotechnology is fabricating materials close to the molecular level (but not quite). No matter how complex nanotechnology is-it's easily distinguishable from DNA(which is far more complex than nanotechnology). We can already look at realms beyond nanotechnology with x-ray crystallography and x-ray physics. Matter of fact, DNA exists at the realm of "Angstroms" which is one power of 10 smaller than nanotechnology. I know this because I'm a chemical physicist and theoretical chemist.
DNA isn't even in the same category and/or doesn't have considerations entailing replication processes.
However, playing Devil's advocate, it still wouldn't make sense to have "made up" DNA. Why? The complexity would be too sophisticated. It would mean you would need to literally create billions of complex molecules that represent codes to millions of chemical substances, millions of proteins, tissues, and so forth, and non of this code could self eliminate itself. It took nature over a billion years just to construct a DNA code that resembles anything that our cells use for energy (glycolysis). If such a DNA technology existed, one could design organisms of unimaginable ability on a whim. Building an android is child's play compared to constructing self replicating, generating DNA organism. If you could it would mean your literally a god. A technology attainable by the Space Jockey but certainly not by humans.
Nanotechnology is a material science. Not a science about building entire organisms that are self sufficient from the ground up. No such science exist because it's so far beyond our reach.
March 29, 2012
Nanotechnology is just the ability to build an architecture at 1X10^-9 meters (0.000000009 meters) Nothing more. Nanotechnology is fabricating materials close to the molecular level (but not quite). No matter how complex nanotechnology is-it's easily distinguishable from DNA(which is far more complex than nanotechnology). We can already look at realms beyond nanotechnology with x-ray crystallography and x-ray physics. Matter of fact, DNA exists at the realm of "Angstroms" which is one power of 10 smaller than nanotechnology. I know this because I'm a chemical physicist and theoretical chemist.
DNA isn't even in the same category and/or doesn't have considerations entailing replication processes.
However, playing Devil's advocate, it still wouldn't make sense to have "made up" DNA. Why? The complexity would be too sophisticated. It would mean you would need to literally create billions of complex molecules that represent codes to millions of chemical substances, millions of proteins, tissues, and so forth, and non of this code could self eliminate itself. It took nature over a billion years just to construct a DNA code that resembles anything that our cells use for energy (glycolysis). If such a DNA technology existed, one could design organisms of unimaginable ability-on a whim. Building an android is child's play compared to constructing self replicating, generating DNA organism. If you could, it would mean you're literally a god. A technology attainable by the Space Jockey, but certainly not by humans.
Nanotechnology is a material science. Not a science about building entire organisms that are self sufficient from the ground up. No such science exist because it's so far beyond our reach.
March 29, 2012
Good hypothesis. Also, the android's ultimate revenge on humans (think myth of prometheus style) would be the Xeno.... His existence would not be tied no more to humans and this new "species" (in its own right) would be the scourge of humankind....
March 29, 2012
@czelaya - I was going to ask you if you were a chemical physicist and a theoretical chemist, but I figured you just tell me "No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night."
March 29, 2012
I hate to rain on your parade, but this happened 2 years ago. Scientists create artificial DNA.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/news/2010/05/100521_synthetic_life_nh_sl.shtml