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David 1
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:10 PMNot only the initial "Sacrifice" shot is beautiful [though quite short in length] it is also a rather puzzling one.
Granted, the idea of it is to let us know that the Dna of the decomposing Engineerthat falls into the waters is what originated Mankind. That is pretty much a given [even if ludicrous to some].
But the thing about the scene that puzzles me is the Engineers' behavior before drinking the goo and facial reaction afterwards.
More than pain, it rather resembles surpise. An unexpected happening.
He seems to drink the liquid in the cup with great pride; in a ritualistic kind of way. His expression is of someone who reached a personal goal, but as soon as the pain starts to creep, he looks baffled by his bodily reaction. Pain ensues as the Saucer waited for his demise to finally leave.
So my question is this:
How much of a self sacrifice is there rather than an actual death punisment or plain out murder?
And if one concludes that it is in fact a death punishment or even a murderous action that is taking it's shape in that particular scene, wouldn't that make Mankind's beginning an unexpected one?
Wouldn't that be the reason for the Engineer race to willingly want to whipe out an entire offspring civilization [as being an unexpected error]?
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
26 Replies
Engineer Xeno - Chr1s
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:14 PMmaybe he was suprised by the pain more than the intention, he obviously never expreienced it before, its like spies taking cyonide, I bet they understand the implications of it clearly but the pain couldnt be described as no one survives it. Maybe its the same principle?
Engineer Xeno - Chr1s
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:15 PMI think we were intentional, are advancement perhaps not.
This to me is shown when the engineer awakes from hypersleep. At first he admires or is curious to David, but then realises he is not human but a creation of a creation, which could be a big nono to him as it implicates humans as creators too, making us a threat and throws the Gods concept out of balance. Cue ripping off heads and palm-blasts.
David 1
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:16 PMEngineer Xeno - Chr1s:
Indeed, but... could it be MURDER? As in "Murder she wrote"
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
Engineer Xeno - Chr1s
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:19 PMpossibly, it could be either sacrificial or murder, we dont know, then again he did take his robe off (were did he make that? Do they have space sheep for wool?) so I think he knew he was gonna fall down into the waterfall and die
David 1
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:21 PMEngineer Xeno - Chr1s:
Also true. or... he felt like bathing. lmao
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
Engineer Xeno - Chr1s
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:24 PMmaybe for fun?
defo not for a clean, he looks like he is the physical embodiment of Dove 2in1 body wash lol
.
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:24 PM... I see the grumpy angels as a part of a planet-wide life cycle kick starter, with the cocktail as the catalyst for the reformation of DNA. "Hey dude, drink this while we fly away...." Murder is always a possibly though...
David 1
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:31 PMEngineer Xeno - Chr1s:
"Dove 2in1 body wash"... ROFL ROFL ROFL good one there mate. C L A S S I C
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
Batchpool
MemberFacehuggerJun-12-2012 6:33 PMIf someone can prove to me for certain that the sacrifice takes place on earth then I will bow to that greater knowledge as I think that the sacrifice takes place elsewhere, and whats with the UFO in the background ? I do believed that it is inferred that a similar event may have taken place on earth but in a different manner. The point being that a DNA changing substance was introduced to the surrounding environment of the planet. A literal translation from the ancient Greek word 'Deacon' is 'awaiting man', and I believe this connection will only be revealed in a sequel. As for the engineer, perhaps its death by misadventure.
Engineer Xeno - Chr1s
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:38 PMit isnt definitively said they are our makers though the hints are kinda obvious.
For one the waterfall is a real one on earth.
Two the end result dna of the decomposed engineer is the same as ours.
They are referred to as our makers by the characters and through cave paintings.
I dont think it needed explanation vocally it was all there.
allinamberclad
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 6:52 PM"Sacrifice Engineer" - I think he fully intended to "die", and I think there is a clue in the Characters name.
As for his surprised reaction, I would guess that, no matter how much you may expect it, you only get to die once - and if that death is by disintegration at a molecular level, then the feeling of must be one that's quite unlike anything you've experienced before, or could expect.
David 1
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 7:01 PMallinamberclad:
so... he never met Brundle Fly at all?! sad thing... lol
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
Hadley's Hope
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 7:04 PM[u]If someone can prove to me for certain that the sacrifice takes place on earth then I will bow to that greater knowledge as I think that the sacrifice takes place elsewhere, and whats with the UFO in the background ?[/u]
I think I disagreed with you on this point before, but now I believe you are right. I previously argued that I think the opening shot of screen 2 is to signal continuity from scene 1. The departing ship flipping upright, makes the same shaps as that standing rock, with the sun peaking around it.
I now think, that this was deliberately misleading.
Ridley Scott is a devious riddler.
David 1
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 7:07 PMHadley's Hope:
What do you mean? Please elaborate
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
Hadley's Hope
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 7:08 PM[u]They are referred to as our makers by the characters and through cave paintings.
[/u]
So? Go to a synagogue, church or mosque, and they will show you books telling you who your creator is. Go to some Meso American tribe, they 'll show you something different with a different creator.
Where does that leave you?
Hadley's Hope
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 7:11 PM[u] What do you mean? Please elaborate[/u]
Misdirection.
JAL1967
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 8:28 PMbzzzt. wrong. Engineer Xeno - Chr1s was on to something but so many of the views/opinions are so ego-(terrestrial human)-centric. Think. Bio-weapons development. Galaxy as laboratory. Test subjects.
Outrigger
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 8:41 PMI'm not sure where, or if, we are to read into the title of the movie. In the mythology of Prometheus there is banishment and torment. I have wondered if the first 'Sacrifice Engineer' was in fact being banished and tormented, but the end result was a gift to man, much as Prometheus giving the gift of fire to man.
xiuix
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 8:51 PMI have no doubt that the Xeno-Engineer was sacrificing himself. I think that the DNA split into a base DNA structure that was the foundation of all life on earth not just The DNA of Humans.
What I have been wondering is the Cocktail that the Xeno Engineer on Earth drank the same as the Xeno-goo that is found on LV-223
Mashsig
MemberOvomorphJun-12-2012 11:15 PMI agree with David - after seeing the movie today and reflecting - the idea of a Sacrificial Engineer did not make sense. The Engineer was executed with the bio-weapon. The "creation" of modern man was an accident. An unexpected side effect of the bio-weapon.
Which the Engineers were not expecting and was the reason they were all killed.
The cave paintings in Scotland - were 35,000 years old - Neanderthals did the painting not Modern Man. Perhaps the executed Engineer was killed because it taught the Neanderthals about the Engineers.
Clearly the bio-weapon evolved and thus backfired on it's creators. Perhaps this is why the Engineer was surprised - because it wasn't designed to inflict pain...
xiuix
MemberOvomorphJun-13-2012 12:34 AM[b]Is that first planet in the prologue Earth?[/b]
Ridley Scott: No, it doesn't have to be. That could be anywhere. That could be a planet anywhere. All he's doing is acting as a gardener in space. And the plant life, in fact, is the disintegration of himself.
Indy John
MemberOvomorphJan-18-2013 1:59 PM".. The departing ship flipping upright, makes the same shaps as that standing rock, with the sun peaking around it..."
I stumbled across this suggestion connecting the openning scene to the Green stone in the Big Head Room based on it's shape.
Since the Green stone has not found a explanation this is as good as any.
I don't know if the Sacrificial Engineer was really murdered but his death is portrayed as our beginning of life.
Maybe the Sacrificial engineer should be the 'God' who gave us a start.
It still doesn't explain 'Why?' JUst because they could be a reasonable answer though not satisfying to earthlings who think they are (and have been raised to think) special, unique one of a kind.
Can you imagine coming across a distant planet filled with humans?
Be choicelessly aware as you move through life
Batchpool
MemberFacehuggerJan-18-2013 2:22 PMAfter a considerable re think, I don't think it was sacrifice or murder.
I believe that one possible explanation is that it was a test. I think that what was consumed, may have been a trial by DNA of sorts and that the engineer that died was targeted by a virus because he was not worthy.
Check out my thread called ' About that thread I posted in Sept 2013' and check out Joseph Kelper. That will explain better what I mean.
Indy John
MemberOvomorphJan-18-2013 2:33 PMBatchpool
Good thoughts .
I had seen somewhere a mention that than Sacrificial Engineer was actually a test subject for this round of 'goo' something that i didn't think I would consider.
Be choicelessly aware as you move through life
HadesSpark
MemberOvomorphJan-22-2013 3:07 AMmy thoughts about the sacrifice,
1) he was sentenced to earth (live/die)
2) he sacrificed himself to escape a contagion ( like on the recorded video that was decapitated, all running away) that drives them mad and HE wanted a new race to start beginning with him (DNA).
3) he was not like the others, maybe he thinks differently instead of destroying planets he want it to change so he escapes the others and knows the only way is to create a counter-race of his.
how does it sound guys?
Indy John
MemberOvomorphJan-22-2013 5:11 AMI have given your suggestions some thought. The 3rd scenario seems to be the most interesting.
THe special goo is somehow smuggled to th edge of the waterfall?
The regular DVD doesn't show how the goo container appeared in his hands.
In looking back on all of the movie's alien lifeforms, if we include humans in the mix then that must have been 'Goo Lite' he had in the jar as we seem the least deadly.
Be choicelessly aware as you move through life
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