Problems with the landing

Why do you think they're using an auto pilot? Ravel and Chance seem to be doing the flying under Janek's direction.

So they're flying manual. So why order them to switch to manual if they're already on manual. And switching to manual is switching from what? These are not very difficult questions.

And yet you've not been able to work it out yourself... I have given the answer already. [b]They want to handle the landing manually.[/b] Janek says "Engage landing sequence" THEN says "Switch to manual". This implies that the landing sequence is an automated process, but once it's engaged Janek wants to land the ship manually. It's like having cruise control on your car, then turning it off so you can climb a hill more efficiently.

I think you're right. Even the steering thing can be explained by that analogy in some ways. If your car's on cruise control and you grab the wheel you can still steer it. They might have to be able to instantly regain steering in case of auto pilot failing, or wanting to try to go manually at an asteroid field because the auto-pilot's twitching out or something. You'd need to be able to instantly regain control if you wanted to just in case. So he may have started steering before actually disengaging the auto-pilot. That's easy enough to see happening. Just wondering if anyone knows offhand, how does it all happen when they hit the juggernaut? does janek say "hand's up" because they set it in position & plotted a course for it to somehow automatically ram the juggernaut while their hands were off the controls? Not trying to hint at anything or solve anything. I'm simply unsure of what exactly happens in that scene right now. Ravel and Chance must aim it at the Juggernaut, and they call Janek a crap pilot, but do they all take their hands off at the last second and it's still on manual?

Ok. Good Automated process. Which for a plane would be auto-pilot, wouldn't it? I don't give a flying fig about the landing, I'm just asking whether the spaceship was running on some automated process (auto-pilot) prior to switching to manual. Which could mean the destination was already input before entering the atmosphere. I'm asking about that possibility.

[quote]Just wondering if anyone knows offhand, do they switch to manual before they hit the juggernaut? or does janek say "hand's up" because they only set it in position & plotted a course for it to somehow automatically ram the juggernaut while their hands were off the controls? [/quote] They manually fly the ship while the ion drive warms up. They're still on manual when it engages to aim the the ship at the Juggernaut. Once the computer says "impact imminent", Janek says "Hands off!" I assume this is so no one accidently knocks them off course with no time to correct.

Pretty much what I figured, they were just going fast enough to keep them going straight. If part of that was autopilot it prob would have steered away from the juggernaut.

[quote]Which could mean the destination was already input before entering the atmosphere. I'm asking about that possibility. [/quote] Based on the dialogue in the film, I would say not.

Most of the dialogue is just techno babble so it doesn't matter much.

Maybe try actually listening to it and you might get your answers. They're exploring - not homing in on a position pinpointed from orbit like the Nostromo was.

Interesting Java. Tho it might have been on autopilot until they actually spotted something. Holloway does seem to know what he's doing more than Shaw in those early scenes, archaeologically speaking. Valleys could be indicative of water sources and life in the past because there's a chance rivers and even subterranean water deposits will run through valleys, around valleys, and there's a chance they helped carve them at some point. This is important because most life will need water and valleys can often be zones where we'll find dig sites. They might not have even been looking for a temple or anything specific at first, just anywhere that might have had rivers running through it. Only because this may be Holloway's thought process and he's comparing them to humans very early on, treating them like a culture and using archaeological principles for finding evidence of artificial construction from above. + places life might be. "God's don't build in straight lines". So Holloway, at least, was actually randomly searching for aerial signs of life. He saw the lines and decided right away that this spot within the valley was where they should set down. Most places where people live, where ancient cities were, happen to have at least one river running through them or near them. Here they never found evidence of rivers but they somehow lucked out on stumbling across the lines. It's a reference to the Nazca lines in Peru. Some alien astronaut proponents and even some archaeologists will claim that they had to have been made by something because when viewed from above it reveals a pattern. I won't go into a lot of the other Holloway stuff yet. I'll start a thread to attempt to redeem Holloway someday.

Basically Holloway is doing his job.

Even more than that. He actually worked out the thesis. And part of it was correct. It allows David to talk to the Engineers. David says "provided" your thesis is correct. We know he talked to the Engineer after Holloway died. Holloway didn't get to live to find out that their work was successful. Holloway asks David how his language lessons were going, possibly figuring out the language, then having David learn the language from texts/ancient sources as he'll be able to translate better. In some ways David could be having issues with Holloway being right, when everyone else thinks they're gods. Holloway was wrong too though, I think he thought they would be alive and thriving (so eager at the start, then starts to think they're all dead). David basically recognizes there are very little signs of life on the planet, and says "there is nothing in the desert, and no man needs nothing". The water sources we do see on the planet are few and far between, something all men and almost every organism might need.

Aside from the Lawrence reference, the "desert" quote is also in response to Millburn's "Nobody's home".

@ Mala'kak [i]Interesting Java. Tho it might have been on autopilot until they actually spotted something.[/i] If they were on autopilot then you'd think they would be on autopilot until the captain said switch to manual. It's seems to me like they were on manual from the beginning of the descent but then why the order to switch to manual. I'm just asking for clarification. [i]Holloway does seem to know what he's doing more than Shaw in those early scenes, archaeologically speaking.[/i] Mate, I can't remember whether you've said you were an archeologist or not, but if you're saying, based on evidence from the movie, that Holloway is an archeologist, then you're not. I've already outlined very clearly my reasons for thinking he's not. Perhaps you haven't read them. The only thing that he does that is close to archeology is the "straight lines" bit and I'd say a lot of layman could pick that up. But he fails badly on two levels when it comes to the dome structure. First of all, he doesn't mention it at all which is very strange since it's situated at the end of the straight lines he spotted. And I would bet every punter in the audience would have spotted the dome as a non-natural structure, including the half a dozen identical structure running back to the horizon. And Holloway couldn't? Not even from 50 metres. Secondly, nobody, including Holloway, noticed that the terrain data computer had clearly detected the dome as a non-natural structure (as it is programed to do). This is strange since Ford and one of the pilots had just been reading off that computer. Even stranger is why the archeologists, who come to the moon with a "theory" of intelligent life, would not be crouched over this computer in great anticipation since it would detect things the human eye might not (it clearly detected the lines as well). He did two other archeological things - he said spectrogram once and was seen holding a sifter at the Scotland site. Otherwise his contribution to the mission as an archeologist, a scientist or a just a normal Joe was zero, zip, zilch. And that's without mentioning his mistake riddled presentation. I hope you can read my earlier posts on Holloway's presentation and give me your opinion.

The ship was not on "auto-pilot", as is commonly understood in commercial airline navigation. Anyone with something passing for a brain, and a working set of ears can figure that out... "Alright, take us round. We'll use that as our point of entry... Let's go through that gateway. Reduce airspeed by a hundred knots. Going through, nice and slow. Keep it steady, boys. Mr. Ravel, starboard 90 degrees." As for the landing itself... "Engage landing sequence. Switch to manual." The 'engaged' landing sequence was switched to manual on the Captain's instruction. Nothing more exciting than that.

".. it's situated at the end of the straight lines he spotted..." This dome reference in this thread is kinda interesting. It didn't occur to me that the on board computers could identify non-natural. So Holloway's question later on seems out of place. When I first heard the 'straight line' reference I thought that Holloway was referring to the domes themselves not to the roads.

Straight-line detection isn't necessarily an indication of non-natural phenomenon, but it's surely interesting. My camera shows little boxes when it 'sees' people's faces, because such things are of interest to it/me. Straight lines on the ground would be worth flagging up for investigation, however they got there.

Yes, I've already said that >>>[i] It's seems to me like they were on manual from the beginning of the descent but then why the order to switch to manual.[/i] And it seems that the first step in commencing the landing sequence was to switch to manual. Which means prior to that the ship was on something non-manual - something automatic.

Oh do pay attention. The descent was under manual control. The automatic landing sequence was then engaged a couple of hundred metres from the ground. [b]That[/b] was the 'first step in the landing sequence'. It was subsequently switched to manual by Janek, for his own good reasons. Those reasons are neither interesting, nor important to the telling of the story.

^ Quite.

@ZZZZZZZ So let me get this right. Janek ordered someone to engage the now supposedly automatic landing sequence and then moments later changed his mind and switched back to manual for a reason unimportant to the paying public. So many unimportant things in this movie. Maybe the primary reason Janek said it was because Ridley thought it would be a really cool thing for a captain to say or it was convenient.