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Thoughts from an open mind...

Engineering

MemberOvomorphJune 21, 20121272 Views28 Replies
I've always considered myself a "fanboy" of certain things but it seems my definition of the term may differ from some other people's. I've been reading a lot of posts which infer that the people who don't have the same opinion of the one posting are close minded and wrong. For example "He's a fanboy and nothing you say will change his mind" and "He's a hater and he'll never understand the film no matter what happens." I am a fan who has an open mind and as I've stated before I will listen to and consider what people have to say as long as there's a mutual respect of opinions. But mutual respect for other's opinions seems to be close to non-existent on the forum. I'm not saying that I'm innocent of this behavior. I have been sucked in to this type of posting at least a few times and I regret it as I'm not that kind of person. Obviously this film instills a passion, either for or against, and sometimes we let that passion get the best of us. However some people are just that way and that's why the slang term "troll" was invented. Now, onto some thoughts about the film... I have stated that I love the film and discussed how I believe that not all the "plot holes" that members point out are necessarily "plot holes." However, I have really tried to hold off on talking in depth about why I love the film. I wanted to see the film a few times, read intelligent thoughts from both sides of the fence and make up my mind in an informed manner. I feel a little comfortable now and wish to say a few things in reaction to all the talk inferring that people who love the film are close minded. I love Ridley Scott's work but I absolutely do not think that everything he's done is great. He's done some films which I didn't like. Prometheus is not one of those. I love the film. I will admit that it does have flaws. Mainly imo the flaws are what some might call "lazy" writing. Especially in regards to characterization. Some of the characters and their actions and reactions are pretty silly. IMO nobody should deny that. The characterization imo is the biggest flaw in the film but the film does have other flaws and I'll go into what I think they are at a later time. All films have flaws though. Why did some feel it wouldn't be infected by this fact? Why are the flaws of Prometheus magnified so much? So, those flaws in mind I will now state why I can overlook them and still love the film. Most of this stuff I've said a million times. Pretty much evrything I've stated that I love about the film totally outweighs the lazy characterization for me. In fact, some of the things I love in the film kind of explain why the lazy characterization is there and why I feel it can be overlooked. First is the very immense ideas the film touches on. We all know what these ideas are. The what, who, when, why and how of humans, spirituality, faith, empathy or the lack thereof. Ideas like that. Ideas that are very rarely tackled in films. Large ideas that are in all reality are impossible to get exactly right in a 2 hour film. These ideas where brought up in an interesting and intruiging way. I can overlook the lazy characterization because the film takes on such big things. This film isn't about Fifield or Millburn or why one smokes pot or why the other makes bad descisions. This film is about our creators and gives us a taste of what extraordinary mysteries lay behind them. I've said it a thousand times and you can plug your ears if you want but I love the ambiguity...I love the questions...I love mysteries. I love being able to talk about and read other's theories about the films questions. To me that is really getting your moneys worth. Thos film has provided me with more entertainment out of the theatre than any film I've ever seen...Period. Now it's clear and totally understandable that some do not like films that ask this much of their audience. Sometimes I have said that sarcastically, implying that the people who didn't like the film just don't like to use their brains. I know that's probably not the case. Some people just like different kinds of films. There's nothing wrong with wanting a film that is pretty straight forward. Nothing at all. Finally, I'll talk about the totally obvious reason that I love the film. It wont b e a long talk as I haven't seen anyone speak in disfavor of this aspect of the film. In fact, I can sum it up and one word and leave it at that...VISUALS. Another thing I've posted about before is the early reviews Alien and even more so Blade Runner. As most know the early reviews for both basically stated the films were "All style and no substance." Much like some reviews for Prometheus. Could ANYTHING be further from the truth? I mean, could anyone get a review that wrong without trying. Now, in no way am I saying that this will definitely happen with Prometheus. It's just something to consider. Finally, I think that this film tried to do some very specific things. It focused on certain things and obviously paid a little less attention to other aspects. The aspects which they didn't get right are obviously what some were really hoping they got right. The things that I feel the film got right are the very things I was looking for in the film. That's why I love it. That's why it's a classic imo. The biggest tragedy imo is it seems it should have been fairly easy to get the things they got wrong, right. I'm not a filmmaker though and I have no idea if it would have been easy. Anyway, I'm going to continue to keep an open mind. When I feel an argument has been presented that makes sense I will admit it and take it into consideration. However I do not think that I will like the film any less. I know each and every one of us have at least 1 bad film that they love. Just because the film isn't a "masterpiece" per se doesn't mean that you can't love it. Doesn't mean that it's not great. They can still hgave magical elements which make audiences love them. I really hope and wish that everyone will try to open their mind and respect other's opinions. Hopefully if a few members do it it will become contagious and people wont get sucked into negative conversations. By "negative" I mean conversations that don't respect the other's opinions. I do not mean "negative" as in you don't like the film.
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FREEZE!
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Nice thread! I enjoyed reading this a lot and it's comments. Cheers!
[url=http://www.madmax4-movie.com/]Visit the Mad Max: Fury Road Forums today![/url]
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Engineering
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@Xenotron...Really don't want to get into this kind of discussion as it seems you feel some of your opinions are facts and not opinions. Kind of exactly the thing I talked about trying to avoid so... We'll have to agree to disagree.
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Engineering
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@Antony..."I really hope and wish that everyone will try to open their mind and respect other's opinions. Hopefully if a few members do it it will become contagious and people wont get sucked into negative conversations. By "negative" I mean conversations that don't respect the other's opinions. I do not mean "negative" as in you don't like the film." [i]I 100% agree![/i] I'm glad you do and hope that many others do too. Like I said, I haven't been 100% innocent when it comes to my actions but I'm paying more attention and taking steps to insure that I don't get pulled into conversations or arguments of this nature. It's sad and upsetting that I've felt compelled lately to talk more about my own as well as other's behavior rather than talking about the film. I have begun to just ignore posts and members who don't seem to respect other's opinions. Especially those who seem to get such a kick out of getting a rise out of other members. Furthermore, I would like to implore other members to just ignore posts of this nature. If it seems disrespectful or anything like that just ignore it and move on. I know it's hard sometimes. We as humans usually defend our roles and veiws-sometimes rather aggressively-so yes, it's hard to hold back when you feel passionately about something. But if you can just refrain from responding to posts which irritate you I have a feeling that posts that irritate you will slowly disappear and this forum can become a more enjoyable place for all. However, please don't ignore respectful, relevant posts simply because you don't agree with them. Healthy debate is what this forum should be all about. This is my final word on the matter. I will adhere to my own advice and hope others will consider taking the advice as well.
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artyoh
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Xenotron posted: [i]"Prometheus could have had ambiguity if the Engineers didn't act like mindless killers. For instance, Roy Batty is a thoughtful, complex character who quotes poetry, plays chess, laments death, and threatens Deckard, but decides to show that he has a soul by saving Deckard's life in recompense for his murders. Was Roy really a bad guy? Who was more machine-like: the guy with emotions or the guy sent to kill him? Now, you tell me how the Engineer displays anything remotely close to that. Do you see what I mean?"[/i] On the one hand, Engineers sacrifice themselves to seed life, but on the other, they behave like mindless killers when confronted by the fruits of their labors...........and you see no ambiguity in that dichotomy, or apparently, anywhere else in this film? Mmmkay
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fader
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For once a good thread and read.... I like Prometheus allot, imo as good as Alien... As far as the depth of the characters in Prometheus, there was not much depth in the characters in Alien as well imo....so what? I think it’s one of the better Sci-Fi movies in a long time... But this movie does cause a reaction from the fan base or even the non fan base, what does that tell you about this movie, that tells me in time it will fit along side the ranks of Alien, Kingdom of Heaven..... once again, nice thread
I should reach the frontier in about 6 weeks. With a little luck, the network will pick me up. This is Ripley, last survivor of the Nostromo....
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Xenotron
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@artyoh Here's the problem with the dichotomy that the Engineers showed in Prometheus. The Engineer at the beginning and the Engineer at the end are two separate characters. They are not one and the same character. Even if it were the same character, we only see the beginning and the end of the character arc and not the middle or transformative part. [i]Character arc is what story is all about.[/i] Inconsistency for the sake of inconsistency does not equal ambiguity. @Engineering If you look at the context of my post, I'm not talking about religion, just using it as an example. Yes, we can have our own opinions, but quite frankly, I've had a formal education in art, philosophy, religion, and film so my views are coming from a viewpoint where I had to discuss the merits and issues of works of art on a daily basis. So, I'm sorry if my opinions offend you, but there are places where people study narrative in all its forms and there is a right way and a wrong way to do it despite your preconceived notions about the subjectivity of art. I would suggest a book by Robert McKee titled [i]Story[/i] as a good place to start. Cheers.
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Jett
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I got my own way of seeing things and when they work for me..they work for me. There's no right or wrong, there's only the perspective of the individual that counts to me. Anything other than that is just as valid to those who feel that way. But not to me.
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dallas!dallas!
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Engineering, What was meant by my "first viewing" comment was that after seeing a movie for the first time, I think it perfectly understandable to be passionate about a movie one way or the other, and to be more heated in any debate about it. After a bit of time the love or hate for a movie may not decrease, but I would expect most folks to be a bit less in one's face about it, though still eager to share how bad or good it was with those who may share the same opinion. If one sees it a second or a third time and gets all heated up again, then I would question that person's sanity. Not that someone can't love or hate a movie even more but one should know what is coming. I for one like arguing, but I am not going to be in someone's face about it (and I have to call you out on the bit about haters being more offensive, the lovers are just as insulting and mocking.) So I come back when I see an interesting review and post it, really to share with others of a like mind (eg my thread with a SF writer's review). The only pleasure I got from Star Wars I was laughing about it with other haters! What is silly is still trying to convince someone to love or hate it at this point. It seems like this site welcomes both sides so I like to make fun of this movie with that crowd, Drakeequation, Colonial Soldier and others. Nothing more. I am not trying to convince the fans of this flick to dislike it. I don't care if they read my (very funny and spot on) SF writer's review. And if they do and get all pissed and start posting stupid comments, then they should get a figurative b**** slap. Not that you are in that category; I am just pointing out what I think is silly.

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