Everything wrong with AVP

I prefer Peter Weyland, but I like how they made Bishop Weyland more then one dimensional (unlike nearly everyone else).

Um the first one?

-Put them in the current time

-All the characters pretty much sucked

the second one

-pitch black 90% of the movie

@Durp004

"-Put them in the current time"

This comment reminds me that AVP and Prometheus had conflicting presentations of all things Weyland. Annoying, though I guess Ridley Scott is at fault for ignoring what was set up in AVP (not that I blame him)

@S.M

"Up to this point there was no "typical Weyland characterization". Of course everyone expected him to be a greedy prick - it's one of the movies few positives that they avoided that particular cliché."

You are right. When I posted that, I was thinking of Lance Henriksen in Alien 3. Then I double checked and realized Lance wasn't supposed to be a Weyland in Alien 3. This actually makes me even more annoyed with Lance as the choice for Weyland in AVP. Why ever they would use the same actor that was a completely different character in another Alien movie I can't imagine other than a cheap attempt to excite the crowd. It was a grubby move.

"Aliens always were agile.  Advances in CGI mean we can now actually see it without cutting away before you realise it's a dude in a wetsuit with some pipes stuck on it."

It's true that xenos were always agile, but I'm talking about the jump in performance we see in AVP. To be fair I actually forgot about how agile the xenos were in Resurrection since I don't pay it much attention. But even compared to Resurrection, there was still a pretty serious upgrade in AVP that was a little jarring. It's probably better if I make it clear that my problem here is no ramp up from what we had seen before. That fight scene between Scar and the xeno kicks off and I'm left feeling like I'm watching an Ang Lee movie. Just felt out of place. Maybe it wouldn't have bothered me if that fight took place later in the movie and there had been several scenes prior that showed us this improved ability, gradually increasing the intensity with each scene until we reached a point where the fight scene was less of a dramatic difference. 

I personally enjoy AVPs version of him. Rather than just being an ass because he was named Weyland, he ended up being a good guy. It's more interesting to think at the start the company wasn't this evil thing with horrible intentions and it somehow got that way as time went on.

I don't really see the xenos as all that different mannerism wise then what the last few movies gave us, maybe that's why I don't hate AVP, actually started rewatching Prometheus yesterday and the characters in it(minus David) are just as bad, maybe worse the mohawk guy is just in there to cause scenes and be a dick.

@Durp004

I don't disagree with you or S.M about the character Charles Weyland being likable. S.M was right when he said Weyland was the only character in the movie that didn't feel one-dimensional.

My main point there is that Charles felt out of step with what I had come to expect from Weyland. Granted, that feeling was also based partially based on a misnomer rooted in Lance Henriksen's character Michael Bishop in Alien 3. When I first saw AVP I didn't realize they just decided to use the same actor. I took it as an implication that Lance's character in 3 was also supposed to be a Weyland. Now I see Charles Weyland is the first true depiction if a Weyland we are shown in the movies.

While it is still difficult to move past the awkwardness I felt from his character's presence and role, the ideas of the company being less calculated in it's early days and the founder being not a "greedy prick" are more realistic, it's true. 

To your comments on the Prometheus characters, weren't they supposed to be unlikable? I thought Ridley Scott was taking the opportunity to showcase the pretentious characteristics of academics and polished corporate employees as compared to the likable space truckers from Alien.

Just recalled something. There's a scene somewhere in the film where the Predator and the lead were running away from an explosion in slow motion side by side. It was quite tacky.

If they were the only people it translated fully to were Him, Vickers, and to some extent Holloway, the other characters weren't in it enough to get any point. When first introduced one scientist introduces himself to Fifield he gets told to basically buzz off then when it comes time for someone to criticize the project it again is Fifield(Vickers does in private but he announces it to the group) then when someone needs to freak out and leave on falls to Fifield again to make a scene.

That's pretty much the point of that character and that character alone, make a scene whenever you can until it's time to kill someone then it's falling on you. He kind of reminds me of the girl with the gun for AVP, but if she only ever complained or tried to act like an ass.

Durp004

I've seen a fair amount of distaste for Fifield on the forum. It should be noted, his character did in fact have a more important role in the original drafts of the script. It appears he was meant to be a character you became somewhat attached to so that his demonstration of the black goo turning humans into neomorphs had a deeper impact to the viewer. 

He had more coverage before Lindelof altered the script. I would assume that he was meant to be a sub-focal character with a similar caliber to that of Janek. What you have surfaced is likely the product of a higher focus character being reduced down with the script change, but leaving remnants of his former significance in the final product. It seems unlikely that he was intentionally calibrated to create scenes.

I don't think his purpose was just to create scenes, but at the end that's all this character amounted to. Admittedly I'm ignorant to early scripts and can only judge what was put on screen, but in that respect that is ultimately the final product which is what most people will see if the message didn't translate in that medium it's kind of a moot point.

I understand and that is a fair point. Ultimately, it is another mark against Lindelof.

I still think a big contradiction was the Predator vision could see Weyland's ill innards in great detail but not the embryo in their own comrade as they carried him onboard their ship.

Yes, AVPR was comical in some scenes, and AVP just does not make sense in the Alien time line.

Despite its shortcomings I like AVP. AVPR though- what a train wreck.