Is Ripley a 'compensatory' character that allows Scott's Alien to unleash unconscious rage against 'Mother'?

@murnau I think you make some fantastic observations on human nature. I remember as a pre teen feeling some of those EXACT feelings---although I wouldn't say "mother" had anything to do with them---but the "Alien" as a sexual metaphor and a "violator" certainly was/is a longstanding and poignant one.

iRaptus: 'The Xenomorph is the lurking black spider that secretly wishes to embrace and indulge such desires. That is why you never really get a look at the beast in ALIEN, because no-one wants to see their demons in full, and in the light, and acknowledge its presence as a whole.'

Interesting ideas, iRaptus, and thanks for replying. I think the beast is operating in different ways in the movie, and in a discussion like this. It may be operating differently from the ‘elephant in the room’ in the movie, where yes it is a manifestation of violent, forbidden urges to devour and destroy, that are ‘secret’ as you say, because the creature lurks in the dark and ambushes when you are looking the other way, and is never fully seen. But in this discussion, and in other circles, I stick to the idea that is the ‘elephant’ – it is in plain sight, we have seen (over and over, as fans) what it does, and how in Alien, and now A:C, it is clearly linked to angry impulses toward Mother/the feminine – but it is not being discussed as such. Perhaps this is inevitable, and of course, this is what (good) movies are for, to express parts of the human experience that are not easily approached or admitted to.

Loving this thread btw! It just shows how intelligent us fan boys can be, when we keep the discussion polite and deep-thinking. And good words from Starlogger, thanks for your cool observations. Alien really is one of the deepest movies for me, it is so rich, and never stops giving. It is art-house and blockbuster, mood-piece and horror slasher.

Blade Runner must be my next thread – lots to say on that!

@murnau (love the name, btw!) "Alien" is, to me, the best Horror and the best Science Fiction movie of all-time. I can never imagine it being topped. It is, as you say, so deep and dark and there are just so many layers in it...it stands up to time and multiple viewings very well, never appearing "hokey" or dated. Just a fantastic film in so many ways. I could watch it a bazillion times...in fact, I may have!

Sorry murnau but I would not include Shaw in the same category. She is no "virgin", she has sex with Halloway, she does not run from the space "dickhead". Further more we "have" probably for years before giving birth to many "bastards" like us. Sorry I still don't understand why did she have the most horrific death in the franchise. So that woman should not trust men, that naivety story again?

Thanks Starlogger – I agree!

You’re right Red0guy, Shaw is a bit different, as Prometheus is different. There is no xeno in it (Deacon aside), but the creatures in it do show erotic-genital features of both sexes. Yes, she is sexually active too, which is anomalous (Ripley in A3 aside, too, I’m only talking about Scott’s Alien movies). But her insemination is a violation by David, and so she is, like Ripley, the victim of male/’alien’ violence in Prometheus. She prevails in Prometheus, but remains under threat. Her disgusting mutilation is the most disturbing part of A:C for me, even as it restores the central horror theme of Scott’s Alien. This theme revolves around male creation, a theme common to Alien & Blade Runner. The male characters wish to supplant ‘Mother’, they want to claim her gift of creation for their own. The other element to this is a ‘rage’ against ‘Mother’, involving the wish to destroy, devour, ‘have’ her as her gifts are taken from her. That is why David experiments upon her, claims to love and mourn her, and yet keeps her mutilated body on display. His pleasure at seeing her pulled apart is what makes the scenes in the lab so disturbing.

It might be said that the weaker presence of these horror/sex/creation/agression themes in Prometheus is (partly) behind the disappointment expressed by so many fans. Other reasons given, such as the sketchy characterisation, don't seem so convincing to me. The characters in Alien are sketches, although much better sketches....

murnau Isn't it established in Aliens that Ripley had a daughter? So she isn't a technical virgin per se either lol

I agree with everything you're saying though :)

That's Cameron's Aliens, which I'm not discussing, and also that's a plot detail that's happened offscreen. What's important is the way in which a character functions within the narrative flow, and within the economy of ideas, events and images that happens in real-time. A movie is like a dream, made by many hands of course, but all involved belong to the same moment in history and (mostly) to the same culture, which means they will make something that either reflects or, more rarely, challenges the values of the culture within whose forces it is made. Personal issues, such as the agressivity I've been talking about, belong to the individual, yes, but are also shared by many others since we are all human minds/bodies with shared impulses and psychologies. These impulses make the culture around us too, and so cultural themes are often personal ones, and vice versa.

Good point though! In Aliens the threat is to the nuclear family. In Alien the threat is darker, wilder, more obscene and more erotic. That's what makes it horror, while Aliens is action, and satire, and adventure. Damn fine action, oh yes, but a different beast to Alien.