Alien Awakening,Alien 5,AVP 3,or Alien Isolation?What's best for the future of Alien on film?

BigDave, I've read Prometheus 2: paradise Lost script (i also read alien engineers script) and, when i mentioned the Messiah of men, our Jesus christ, i was thinking in an hybrid, half human half engineer. The engineers Gave us a messiah because their society also had One, the original, the Messiah of the Messiah- GOD. May be they felt the need of having something superior and, because of that, they worship another hybrid, an half breed, half engineer, half black goo, the Deacon (more stable and rational than the Prometheus's Deacon without the human DNA, a more perfect organism). Can a creator worship it's creation like a disciple worship his god? In the end, we are all bastards.

PS: Jesus Christ and the engineer's Deacon had GOD's DNA.

When you clone someone, you clone a perfect body, with an hollow mind. Then, you have to insert the memories in the fresh Brain, a process of algorythms, synchronies and other stuff. Weyland didn't want to be a replica. He wanted to drink some potion to be Young again (he was searching for the Holy grail). Speaking of the soul, he wanted to create  souls and Gave them to robots. Perhaps, the soul lives in our Minds and, if you create a great mind, you create a great soul. We don't Control our creations, because we don't Control the process of creation. Many discoveries result from experiments that went wrong. That's how humans achieve knowledge, by failure.

Well, tha's why i love science fiction, everything is possible.

I Saw an excellent movie, "replicas", starring Keanu reaves. I recomend.

"Can a creator worship it's creation like a disciple worship his god?"

Certainly, as far as some gratification of their achievement, like a Artist does with a Painting, but also to worship a creation as a God is something that cant be ruled out.

The Messiah Aspect i context to Christ is interesting to ponder, i dont think Prometheus was setting up to be too on the nose as in giving us a Jesus.. Ridley Scott said they pondered a connection but its likely as in that the Christian Religions came from some kind of being who is misinterpreted and then spawned into Religion.

so in context with Prometheus, then indeed its likely the Messiah was as RS mentioned a Emissary and likely a Augmented Human Being or Hybrid so he would be Superior.  who knows how FAR that RS could have gone with this, and who knows if he could thrown the Curve-ball that Christ was actually some kind of Synthetic Being lol

I felt in context to a Emissary that its odd they only had ONE and so i like the idea that there was more than ONE, but most of the World during the Middle Ages must have particularly offended the Engineers and killed the Emissaries while other continents like the Ancient Americas likely behaved in a way or redeemed in a way that was worthy and maybe still lived among their Emissaries i think that would go some way to explain the LATTER Star Maps after say 2000 years ago.

The worship of the Deacon is a interesting subject, some think it was a GOD, some think it was them trying to Re-Create their Gods...  i see it as some Experiment or Organism that lead to their Experiments that had been deemed of Great Importance to them.

My Interpretation years ago was that these Engineers had either used this Organism to Re-Engineer Traits to apply to themselves, or they tried to Evolve themselves and this was a undesired out come that they then saw of Great Importance.

I even pondered years ago, what if those Engineers in Prometheus could not Procreate  and they had a certain role to play, but then coming into contact with something that lead to the Deacon or a More Ancient Related Organism and by Virtue of its Life-Cycle/Means of Procreation it allowed a Engineer to Give Birth to Life, something they maybe NEVER had or had LOST.

With Alien Covenant, and RS comments on those Engineers being the Originals... it made me think that indeed those LV-223 Engineers are in effect similar to Engineers, as Replicants are to Humans.  And so it would be like say seeing a Replicant who cant Procreate, Get Face Hugged and Birth a Xenomorph and then Worship the Xenomorph because it allowed them to Give Birth to a Perfect Life-Form.

A lot comes down to interpretation of the MURAL and what clues we take on board, which Alien Engineers offers a lot to decode that Mystery.

With regard to Weyland i think he was looking at ANY way to extend his LIFE and ideally he would wanted to be made YOUNG again... but i think he would have taken having his SOUL transferred to another Body if the Engineers could have offered him such.  When looking at Prometheus and taking into account the Concept for the Engineers by Jon Spaights, it seemed the Engineers had managed to Manipulate their Genetics to prevent them from Aging as Fast, and to be Immune to Illnesses etc.. but at a COST of making them Sterile... so if we assume this was the case, then maybe they could have ways they can Manipulate Human Genomes to become similar... i am actually drawn to the Plot for Alien Covenant 2 would have been David Manipulating/Evolving those Human Emrbyos to make Augmented/Evolved Human beings... Superior.

Thus David likely creating a Race, just as maybe those Planet 4 Engineers Created/Evolved those LV-223 Engineers.

I am not sure i have seen Replicas... i will check it out, thanks.

BD:

It is not that Shaw didn’t have a personality, she had but she was naive and very annoying. Tennesee and Daniels are not very well written but their flaws are not the same as Shaw’s.
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.. i think i recall you saying that DAVID was the only main INTERESTING Character from Prometheus... but NOW you are NOT interested in him... “

Prometheus had David And Janek so that is two. Maybe you heard it from someone else or did not remembered it correctly but anyways. As far as not interested in David well I am so and so on that one, robots and technology is interesting and how it can go wrong but at the same time I don’t think that the Alien franchise and its movies is about or should be about robots/androids. They could make him a bit interesting by explaining his motifs more and make him less evil and/or explain why he hates humans. In AC it was just like he was angry for what reason exactly? It either made little to no sense or it was just “eh” but I blame it on a poor script or bad execution of it. David said something like “I will not allow them to start over. . .” but he never explained why. To me he came a cross a bit like a random sadist.

“it also shows that Characters who were GOOD can become FLAWED in a sequel depending HOW they are handled.”

Yes, and that is what happened to the character of David in Alien Covenant IMO.

"Which Logically would be David has to KILL them off."

It makes sense when we look at the story but it is still too much about an evil android.

"By Virtue of a Prequel Fans are also waiting for the BUS as in that inevitable March towards Eggs + Derelict and WHO is in that Pilot Chair."

Yeah but you can make it interesting along the way before they reach the goal so to speak but the prequels this far have failed with that.

"Introducing Characters in a Sequel... is going to be difficult if we are going to THROW our David under the BUS so to speak. As far as Character from the Covenant Ship!"

Then at least limit his screen-time. I would be annoyed if we got another David movie, also I would feel like that would be a dumb choice by Fox, Disney or what ever they are called now. Looking at the box office numbers for AC I guess that shows that very few compared to how many potential watchers there could be are interested in another Alien AI movie I frankly would not give a crap about that.

"But then we have to introduce a THREAT and so there would have to be some way to introduce a ALIEN Organism on the Surface.."

That could be done, you never know what kind of life forms there could be there. Imagine how many potential animals there could be in South America that are not discovered.

"Both kinds of PLOT as a Basis could WORK... they would be NOTHING New though... a Re-hash of sorts... but again IF the Characters are done well, it could be something that COULD work... if not it could be a Alien Trope/Fan Service alone!"

Doing something new is difficult but then they have already tried David and that did not work, if it would have then AC would have done better but it did not. I don't say that you need to throw in old stuff but when the new things do not work you got to sit down and think about how to improve the situation.

"It seems a PLOT that is too much to COVER in a single Movie... one that would be Difficult to get depth to Characters due to the number of pieces that have to come together.."

Yeah possibly but then they might need to go to something more simple because if this movie bombs then it would be bad to end it on a cliff-hanger, just look at AC.

"So the Logical Choice has to be a After-Math where we SKIP past the First Half of that SET-UP Plot.."

I guess so because the way you described it it seems that it would require a lot of time. I would not mind having it as a book, maybe it could be something interesting to read during the vacation in summer.

"But if we get them given the Engineers/Dr Shaw Treatment, then they cant also do that with David... because then you would have NOTHING to connect with Alien Covenant apart from maybe the EGGS. "

Flashbacks maybe? If they do that we do not need to see everything that went on but at least we will see the most important parts.

"Does-not mean it cant work.... but i think David has to be the Connecting Tissue between such Movies... even if he only plays as short role as ASH from Alien... at very least a BISHOP from Alien 3" At least the movie should not be about him

"It is not that Shaw didn’t have a personality, she had but she was naive and very annoying"

Totally Agree with that Statement, its a shame as they could have easily Fixed her for a sequel.

".. i think i recall you saying that DAVID was the only main INTERESTING Character from Prometheus... but NOW you are NOT interested in him... “

This comment may have seen harsh by me, it was not intended as such, it was to show that YOU have made some Very Good Points about how you can have a WORKING Character from a movie, and then Totally Fudge (posh word for F-word) in the sequel... Star Wars EP7 is a similar example... how Characters were done a disservice by EP8 and so i was saying how a Character you can like, can be ruined in a sequel if its NOT done right... on the Flip Side a Poorer Character can be FIXED too.  But i agree its a harder task with DAVID now.

"robots and technology is interesting and how it can go wrong but at the same time I don’t think that the Alien franchise and its movies is about or should be about robots/androids."

Again i can agree... i felt it was interesting but it appears these things are taking Center Stage away from the Space Jockey Race, and the Monsters... so while interesting, by Virtue of a ALIEN Prequel they are a bit of a distraction away from what maybe makes a ALIEN movie a ALIEN movie.  The Prometheus Creators Plot maybe brings the Surreal HP Lovecratian Space Jockey/Derelict more closer to MANKIND and less ALIEN and the sequel about David and AI again is taking it even further from anything ALIEN. And maybe in hindsight Prometheus should have been its OWN thing, that had no Alien Race who looked like the Space Jockey and Derelict, and No Weyland company then maybe it would have been allowed to have done other things.

Without quote everything else... i agree with what you are saying, and very good points... especially this one.

"Yeah possibly but then they might need to go to something more simple because if this movie bombs then it would be bad to end it on a cliff-hanger, justlook at AC."

Which is WHY a aftermath is best.... like AC was a aftermath to what David and Dr Shaw had been up to for the 10 years between Prometheus and Alien Covenant.... we never got that... but a Book would been nice...

And i feel this route is best option next... to arrive at the point when Davids World goes to POT... or the incoming Humans cause it to go to POT.