"Quit griping!" "I like griping"

I think both egg morphing and hive can work. Depends if the xeno is alone or with the hive.

 The only thing I can fault Aliens on is that it is a victim of its own success and has developed a Nickelback-like stigma  for haters that love to hate on it for the sake of loving to hate on it.

It probably has aged the worst of the films because of its '80s action flick vibe. 

Much like hearing a Zeppelin song reminds you of the '70s, Matchbox 20 song reminds you of the '90s, and Limp Bizkit / Korn of the '00s etc

Aliens captures that '80s nostalgia which is thick in cheesy bravado and Corporate weaselness...  

But beyond that it is just as much awesome as the other films.

And if anything was the MOST expansive of the films ! 

Being my favorite movie, I'm always a bit biased towards the film. As of now Aliens feels like The Last Jedi of it day. A new guy came in and added his own spin on the universe. Difference is it polarized next to no one at the time.

Aliens at times feels like it's the heart of the divide between The quadrilogy and Scotts prequels.

ninXeno426 I re-watched Aliens a few weeks ago. Still has so many great moments.

Alien also feels like this atm. 

Borrowed from facebook

I saw it in 1987 when it was still fresh and it still hasn't grown old for me. I wonder if someone who saw it for the first time on a blue ray might feel differently- "oh that looks so '80s".

I think ALIENS is a tricky one to look at, because it has so many Hard Core Fans, i think they seem to be more Passionate about that Movie and i think most ALIENS Fans dont dislike ALIEN  but i think there are ALIENS Fans who seem to dislike the Sequels and Prequels to ALIEN/ALIENS.

I dont think ALIENS gets a lot of Critism, it gets some, but then i feel the Prequels seem to get more, Alien 3 and Alien R seem to get more.  I would say in General ALIENS does-not get too much Flak!

The Movie effects people in different ways, and i think some of those who may pick some Bones with it, sometimes are against the QUEEN because it appeared Cameron Did-Not pay attention to the Source Material.....   HOWEVER... we need to Bare in Mind that for the most part, the Majority of people who remember or saw ALIEN especially back then would NOT have been aware of the True Intended Xenomorph Life Cycle  and so you had to ASK about WHERE those Eggs came from?

In the Majority of Biology EGGS are Laid, and so the Introduction of   a Queen would kind of made Sense, despite the Source Material (O'Bannon) had the Egg Morph which was more ALIEN...   Some Fans looked at Cameron's Aliens as BUGS! which to a degree it does come across similar, but i wont agree with how some say they are DUMB Bugs, because i see more Evidence in ALIENS for the Xenomorph having Intelligence and a Purpose... in ALIEN it was just a Stealthy Predator who relied on Instinct to Hunt and Kill its Victims....   The DC Cut with the Egg Morph showed a Purpose to the Organism however.

For me Personally.... when i first saw ALIENS it was a worthy Sequel to ALIEN it made sense and it was Action Packed, and in the 80's there was that Market for Action Movies.  It was a bit Cheesy at times but this was the 80's and a lot of Movies were like this.

Looking back NOW, as i grew older and Mature, then Aliens did start to become just a Action Flick, a very Good one at that...  I was disapointed with ALIEN 3 but as time goes on, that Movie Grew on me, while ALIENS just became a Action Packed Popcorn Flick set within the Universe but a VERY well executed one.

ALIENS is essentially similar to Starship Troopers... what makes it different is that it was better executed, and had a relatable better Character who was carried on from ALIEN in Ellen Ripley and so ALIEN Elevated ALIENS, because you had her Experience/Encounter from ALIEN and her concerns and warning to those who accompanied her to LV-426 that they are dealing with something very SERIOUS that they appeared to not take Seriously at all..... Until the $£%&% Hits the Fan!

What i mean by that is... IF say ALIEN was NEVER Made, and we had ALIENS with no knowledge/history of Ripleys Prior Plight against the Organism... and IF the Xenomorph was not that Iconic Design by HR Giger then what we could have got would have been NOT too Far from a Starship Troopers type Flick (my opinion)

We have to give Credit to ALIENS and its Queen and Action because this is what had accounted for the Franchise being as Marketable as it was... The Countless Merchandise, Comics, Games, Toys etc etc were all possible due to the more Action Packed ALIENS and the Queen.

Its hard to say IF the Franchise would have been as BIG had we NOT had ALIENS.... based on a single Movie then ALIEN would have been a Cult Hit but i would not think it would have Spawned as Much Merchandise/Marketing or Games, Comics and Toys etc..

So just ALIEN and i am not sure we would have had as Iconic Status....  a ALIEN sequel is something we cant really comment about, because WHO is to know if a Different (None Action, None Queen) Sequel would HAVE or HAD-NOT had the Impact that ALIENS had... we dont know.

What we do know is that ALIENS is the Movie that Most are Familiar with, that leaves the Bigger Impression on Most People (talking in General).

My Issues with ALIENS is not the Movie itself, its just that the Formula is repeated in all of the Media Forms that Followed, most Novels, Comics and Games appear to be in the MOLD of a ALIENS/ALIEN Resurrection...  And so i would have liked to had seen something a BIT Different, which Prometheus appeared to have Attempted..

In a Ideal World.... it would have Been Great that we could have had Multiple Movies released where ONE follows the more Action Packed/Aliens Formula and another tried Something Different.

Awesome Poster in OT by the Way ;)

Alien deserved a proper sequel.

Giger should have been more involved 

I regret Ridley Scott was not asked to make the sequel, the producers were seduced by Cameron's queen, which seemed prolific for the sequels, but which I find to be plain stupid. The xenomorph can be eusocial without an egg laying ant queen. I don't see evidence of intelligence for Cameron's aliens, just cheesy plot convenience to make the film build some pathetic climax until the reveal of the queen.

All the Aliens fans protest now if David created the xenomorph because it is no more alien, but they never admit that Aliens destroyed the potential it could have had.

Aliens is so poorly executed that if you play it at a lower speed you will see the cheap costumes of the "xenomorphs".

Regarding character development, it is no better than Prometheus, except Prometheus had a better android. Hudson, Hicks, Apone, Newt, what characters? Oh, I forgot Burke.

Face the reality people, Aliens is a Disney film. Maybe you were excited back then in the 80s because you were young and easily entertained but this film is frustratingly dumb plain.

Like ThoughtDreams nailed it: what you see is what you get. Nothing to talk about later, like the big hit The Predator. 

This forum debated the topic to death a couple years ago. I believe the consensus was that egg morphing would work if a xeno was on its own and had no hive support. The hive idea would work too if there were enough victims to serve as hosts. The general masses didn't even know about egg morphing until post Aliens.

I watched ALIENS Special Edition last night, and maybe i have been a bit Harsh on ALIENS, in light to how reaction by some Fans in regards to Prometheus had led to them giving us the Mess that Alien Covenant has left us with.

Aliens as a Movie is a Good Action movie, i agree with RS that the Movie and other Action ones released since had gave us Queens and Xenomorphs over and over and over (includes other Media Forms) and that some CHANGE was needed.

Regarding the ALIEN sequel, we have to remember at the Time that RS had loads of Commitments and FOX wanted a Sequel done, and we had the Process that lead to ALIENS and we have to remember at this point Ridley Scott never had much Control over the Franchise, it was the Property of FOX and Hill & Giler had much more say it what to do NEXT.

Regarding the Costumes... i feel Every Movie was flawed in this regard...  Prometheus with Zombie Fifield or Not Great CGI Fifield...  Alien Covenant Effects had flaws, lets not talk about Alien 3...   and ALIEN in some shots the Costume was not so Convincing...

I think looking back INDEED it would have been likely had ALIEN 2 been made then it would likely had taken a much more different route than ALIENS..  Ridley Scott seemed to be wanting to give us a ALIEN World that would have had HR Giger Aesthetic (Aliens had this were Necessary)  a RS continuation would have No-Doubt gone to explore WHERE those Eggs Came from, and likely uncovered the Space Jockey and his Role in all of this.

It maybe would have turned to more of the Unused ideas from Starbeast and gave us HR Giger Inspired Worlds and Technology, Architecture.

But what happened had happened... its the same as some ALIENS Fans were really Bugged (no pun intended) by what Alien 3 had done with Hicks and Newt... and indeed what happened would likely had NOT been what would have happened IF we had Cameron continue with his Sequel... but again there were reasons he could not WORK on the Project and ALIENS Fans have to just Accept what happened had happened. (also not forgetting Miss Weaver wanted Ripley killed off).

These things happen.... not EVERY Movie will please all the Fans... Changes Happen sometimes due to the Directors/Production not being available for when the Studio want another Movie, and sometimes Changes are Forced because of what the Studio (and Producers) want changed.

It is UNLIKELY that Alien Covenant was the Sequel to Prometheus that Ridley Scott had intended...  Its likely if we get another Prequel Continuation it would NOT be quite the route Ridley Scott wanted either.

Everyone has the Right to like or dislike any movie, there are Fans who feel Ridley Scott had made a Hash of Things, and maybe would not object to a ALIEN reboot... some ALIEN Fans maybe would not object to a ALIENS reboot... and some Fans would want to Forget the Prequels even happened.

But we just have to accept them Warts and All.... going a Blomkamp THIS movie never happened route is NOT the way forwards..

Regarding the Egg Morph vs Queen they can Co-Exist in a number of ways that i will leave for another time.

https://youtu.be/Q_kBrGvXmoY

Cameron himself addressed many of these complaints back in 1986. Alien theory agrees that we can have both egg morphing and and hive.

I agree Scott perhaps should have been involved to some degree, but as far as sequels go Aliens was definitely the best approach at the time. Camerons intentions were not to make the same film or even take baby steps but instead a whole new beast. 

A couple months ago I posted a forum regarding whether Alien Isolation would have made a good film or not. I ultimately felt no it wouldn't have been. I bring this up because many Alien fans do feel it is the sequel Alien deserved all along. The issue with Isolation is while the plot works fine for an interactive experience, it follows so many basic beats from Alien that it would have fallen flat on film. It had special order 939,a crew lands on LV 426,discovers the derelict and space jockey etc. In the wrong hands this could have been the sequel we got,a ho hum retread that offered nothing new. Worth noting Alien 3 is often criticized for doing nothing new by imitating Alien.

Side notes: Thank you for the compliment on the topic banner Big Dave, I love fan made posters and that in particular is a favorite.

Iraptus I saw that in one of my many Alien Facebook groups lol,I saw Endgame and enjoyed it but Marvel will never come close to how much I love Alien.

 My beef with David "creating" the xenomorph is not that it seemingly crushes the queen,but that it threw the logic of Prometheus as well as Alien out the door. And that's coming from someone who enjoys Covenant and Prometheus and arguably feels Covenant might be better than Prometheus. I recall Ridley confirming that the LV 426 derelict managed to escape LV 223, and the space jockey chest burster caused it's crash. Then there was all the evidence of a xenomorph outbreak on LV 223.... Covenant discarded all of this.

That being said, between egg morphing,A hive,and black goo,the xenomorph is extremely adaptable to it's environment.

ninXeno426 Personally, I compartmentalize a bit. The Qudrilogy is canon to me regardless of "prequels". I have a "whatever" attitude toward P and AC. Decent movies on their own, but they seem to be getting bogged down too much with lofty and heavy handed ideas. Nothing tops the Quadrilogy for me.

While I agree that the Alien life cycle was inspired from the insect world, that wasp that lays its egg into the body of a living host, I still consider the idea of a egg laying queen was forced in by Cameron because he had his marvelous design of her "majesty".

So while in Alien the xenomorph hinted at the insect world, after Aliens there is no doubt it belongs to the insect world.  A space termite that belongs rather to the MiB universe than to the Alien universe.

We lost that catatonic fear, that sheer terror of the xenomorph,  whatever made it the perfect organism was lost in Aliens. You can send the marines straight in the middle of the hive and get away with a few casualties only. The entire hive of the xenomorphs is less dangerous than a group of primates from the Planet of the Apes.

The traditional xenomorph was not good enough to impress anybody, let's make a bigger one that can still fit inside an elevator, but still unable to kick Ripley's ass or at least drag her away into deep space.

As for Cameron's interpretation of how the eggs are made, I can never agree with it. If the Alien was a species in its own right, I prefer O'Bannon's story. For me the eggs are only to keep the facehuggers alive for an indefinite period of time, sort of incubators if you want, the ant looking queen is an unnecessary addition to the Alien world.

What if...

I have mentioned before my theory that Jordens may have discovered a different set of eggs than that which Kane found. What if the Jordens discovered a lab in the Juggernauts "hammer" arm within which was the Queen and some of her eggs - a variant created by the space jockey before his death (possibly too the cause), that crossed the DNA of the eggs in his cargo hold with that of an insect.

“So why is Aliens picked on by a certain subset of fans these days?”

Aliens is alright but now it feels like more of an action movie. Alien 3 and 1 have more of the horror thing with people being left alone to battle an enemy that they are not equipped to handle.

I like egg-morphing better since it is more unknown although the queen isn’t a disaster. Cameron did alright with the queen but it could have been better. Aliens is a movie that I have not watched in a long time but I go back to alien and Alien 3 and watch them a bit now and then, they are made in a way that suits me better.

Who can tell what happened to the chestburster/xenomorph that killed Jorden.

Or where did they get the facehuggers in the Hadley's Hope lab from? The derelict? And one of them was surgically removed from a host, really?

How did the xenomorphs captured all the colonists alive for hosts? 

How many colonists were used as hosts and how many xenomorphs were there?

Why were colonists still alive when Sulaco arrived on LV426? Would the xenomorphs risk to have the potential hosts die of old age or of starvation, especially when there was a queen laying eggs?

What were the xenomorphs doing since all the colonists were captured? Hibernating? Keeping busy with architecture? Why would they build such a fantastic nest if the hosts were so limited in supply?

How come they got everyone but they missed Newt?

Why did they run against the bullets? Even a cockroach has an instinct of survival. Why did the xenomorph stopped being a survivor? Because there was an egg laying queen that could replaced them? Like, how many were killed, two hundreds, ok, two hundreds eggs more. No more hosts? Oh, shit.

 Gavin that space jockey has a name: Jim Cameron.