Sucessful versus uncusessful mysteries in writing

@BlackAnt

Thank you for referring to ‘Life’, which I have watched.

In terms of execution, it functions well but there is no depth merely entertainment.

On the question of the special effects in Prometheus Ridley was anxious to use practical modelling rather than CGI that was a stated policy decision whether it works is down to individual preference personally I feel the entire riff at the end was off.

In the documentary, Jon Sphait’s is quite emphatic that rather than the SJ be giant elephantine comedic beings they should be relatable for storytelling purposes.

When you consider the Nobel Savages that offered the Donation Genesis and then consider the look of the woken pilot, something has happened there which can be important and bleed into what has been going on on this "Anthrax Island." If they had gone to Paradise they would have found out the answer to that. They wanted to make monsters sub create something of their own why was that so important?  

@Thoughts_Dreams

Thanks for your thoughts. 

I think why Prometheus is correctly named a cult film is because only a certain type of person will enjoy it and the reason it missed with a lot of people are the reasons that you give which I understand.  

Shaw

I have always been intrigued by your disdain for Shaw and wondered whether its because she represents a person of faith and given your remark "this is not a church" it sounds to me that you are unhappy with her faith as if it and her are out of place in the movie. 

My view is if a search for our creators, it is essential that a person of faith is included within that search.

I wonder is your real objection that they should not have made a film within the Franchise, which is essentially a quest for our creators with all that implies. It wasn't a quest for some cool Engineers but those who made us. 

From the original sacrificial scene to the rebirth of the Deacon, the ritual of life is before us and the movie should take us in a direction where we get Elizabeth’s answers. Who made us why and what is our purpose. What she would find out in the movie Prometheus is, dark angels made us because they could and our role is merely a punt whilst these dark angels seek to perfect a replacement.

So how would a person of faith react to this? The answer is there must be more, who made them, what’s really going on? She will not accept as a person of faith that is all and that's how Prometheus the movie ends.

So what would Prometheus Paradise have been about and how would Elizabeth as the person of faith as our proxy react to what she found?

She would arrive at Paradise and it would become clear she already knew the answer to her question. The reason we were made was that someone could and the reason we could be replaced is because they could. The really fascinating question is why were they doing this, why were they attempting to sub create and introduce their own vision? 

“For me, to echo some elements of Mary Shelley, It is a study of an unsentimental god, it is about creativity and destruction, of a people without loving relationships that allow havoc to reign and evil to triumph."

And that is my answer in my story "The Furious Gods".

But to return to Elizabeth. 

Dr. Shaw, a scientist who believes in God, is responsible for a mistake that could evoke the Greek hubris. More precisely, she “wants her religious beliefs affirmed, and believes she is entitled to answers from God”; but “her questions remain unanswered and she is punished for her hubris”

So in order to tell the story, she has to be a person of faith and having asked her question she is punished. But is there redemption for her? 

In the "Crossing" we see the first part of her redemption the healing of David out of a desire for forgiveness but it is also out of vanity so that she can get her answers and so she is not entirely redeemed and the punishment continues.

In "Furious Gods" She faces the ultimate test to achieve redemption and it is in the form of Temptation. 

Equally, David is drawn into this because he is responsible for her punishment. He does not need redemption more a sense of purpose in 'Covenant' he finds it by a sub creative act so he is now merely copying the fallen angels that all so begs the question. They were destroyed by what they created so will he be and by the same power? That I am sure would have been the story of the Space Jockey in the original 2015 vision Ridley had but that's to digress.

In the "Furious Gods," by being healed David is given another chance. At some point, he suffers remorse and conscience, is that the first move toward having a soul something that Weyland says he will never have?

He is given a glimpse of 'Heaven' and understands finally how he, David, knowledge fits in. But he too is tempted.

So eventually the Person of Faith, whose faith no longer makes any sense and the Android seeking meaning realise what they must do. The answer takes us back to the beginning of the Tale or let's say they believe that is the answer but they will only find out by a, “a leap of faith."     

To come back to Prometheus because that was made and we have the evidence to go looking for our creators without someone of faith would remove the relativism to what they found and each other. So much of the final act of Prometheus up until the craft smashes into the Juggernaut needs her faith-based viewpoint. For us the onlooker its the only thing that keeps her going.     

So for me that she is from "the Church" is vital. You have a perfect right not to want a Spiritual dimension to be placed in the mix but if you want to treat evil seriously rather than generic horror then you have to have goodness. In the first Trilogy Ripley is weary heroism against remorseless hate in the second set of films it would have naive faith. 

 

 

"BD should be able to confirm that because he has more specifics on just how silly the studio was with the other sets RS wanted to build and film"

I am not sure HOW MUCH the Studio had impacted the Height of the Engineers, when Production started to begin they had intended to give us 10ft Engineers (Downgraded from 12-15 in the Drafts) but for some reason there was a Decision to NOT use any kind of Effects to Portray the Engineers Scale and so Camera Angles would be used instead and i think this was something that RS had chosen to do as he liked to keep things as Practical as Possible.

But Certainly the STUDIO would have Held a LOT of Influence over Changes, which had Included the Decision to REMOVE the Xenomorph and Similar.  To TOWN DOWN the HR Giger Aesthetic and to NOT give us a Literal Prequel.

There are others working on the Project who also have a LOT of say in things, which include David Giler and Walter Hill.  Its Common for Movies to have to CUT Material to get a Theatrical Cut that is NOT too Long, so that it Allows for more People to be Willing to give the Movie a Chance, if the Movie had a Extra 30-45 Minutes then maybe ONLY the more Hard Core Fans would have turned up and so Box Office Figures could have Declined somewhat.

I think Prometheus was a Movie that DID-NOT give every Fan what they Expected and FOX felt that to STEER AWAY from Giving Answers to the Xenomorph and to NOT have the Beast Back, was MAYBE a Mistake.

I get the Impression that RS was Actually Happy with Prometheus for the Most Part, he seemed to be more Pleased with that than the Direction of Alien Covenant.

Prometheus had its Flaws.... some Suspect Writing/Moments of Stupidity but then a LOT of Horror Movies have these as a Plot Device.  It depends on HOW they Execute these Plot Devices and some i FELT was not so BAD but some were SILLY and UNNECESSARY.

ALIEN was well SILLY for letting Kane on board... HOW Stupid was ASH!!!  But then you get the Curve-ball that he was a Synthetic and Special Order 937 which was a Masterstoke to show that this was a Deliberate breach of Quarantine by the Robot ASH so was very WELL thought out and a Good Addition that Hill and Giler added to the Story.

I think Prometheus has its Moments of too much Ambiguity for some... Its a Movie you have to STUDY and go back to Numerous Times to start to Appreciate it and kind of BEGIN to understand it a Little.

PLOT HOLES... i think it depends on what you would Consider  ONE to be, other Movies are MORE Guilty of PLOT HOLES or things that MAKE Little Sense.

You were going to come up with some Conflicts when you go for a Chariots of the Gods Plot.... where our Ancient Mythos and Religions all STEM from the Engineers and Interaction with them.  Especially when you would have then Expected the Engineers to look like.....