Comments (Page 489)

BigDave "Or simply have had , Walter (David) tuck everyone to sleep... then David goes to see Oram who awakens and asked Walter what has happened, and warns him about David, then have David make a remark and Oram then realizes its David but the he begins the Chest Bursting and then we see David admire it...   Then Cut to Credits.....  Setting up a Sequel to allow the Xenomorph to be explored."

You are absolutely right: the birth of the xenomorph should have been something epic and it would have made for a great cliffhanger, instead of the off-kilter scene that we got with the ridiculous baby xenomorph.

They (FOX/RS) have written themselves  into a Corner....

They told us these NEW Alien Prequels will lead to ALIEN and RS even saying we are 2-3 more movies from the Back Door of Alien, the Set up is left in a limited way.

*David has been shown to be the creator of the Xenomorph, he used the Black Goo and experiments to create his Xenomorph, which is NOT-QUITE there yet, it has some more Evolving to do until we get to ALIEN.

*Thus eventually something that Evolves from Davids creation, will end up being those Eggs on the Derelict and so eventually Davids Creations will end up on a Engineer Ship that ends up on LV-426 which we can safely assume is a long way from Origae-6

*It appears David will be taking the Covenant Ship to Origae-6 which will take 7.5 years and so David and the Covenant will arrive at Origae-6 about 10 years before the Nostromo ends up on LV-426

*The company knows what David has been doing, and David has told them of this and no doubt they are aware David is going to Origae-6

*The Engineers will be appearing after they arrive at Planet 4 to find the devastation left behind by David and you bet they want Answers and find those responsible, thus it appears they will be after David 8 but how can they know it was him and where he was going?  Engineers ships could intercept the Covenant easy, if they arrive not long after David has left... so the Engineers must turn up long after David has gone and likely after David has arrived at Origae-6

*David only has TWO Face Hugger Eggs, we dont know if he has any Black Goo, does he go back to Planet 4 first? How does David end up having his Creations become thousands of Eggs within the space of 18 years?

so there is a lot to cover... and i am not sure we will get a movie that covers the Engineers in a great detail, dont expect a hour dedicated to them....

They need to be careful with the Engineers, because they are bound to be Angry with what happened on Planet 4, they will surely then want to prevent David from doing what he wants, and also chances are they will view Mankind as insignificant and also partially behind what David has done.

So Pissed off Engineers does not bold well for Mankind, unless Davids Creations prove to be their undoing, the Engineers would surely also want to wipe Mankind out now, so they cant risk this kind of thing again, they would also surely maybe consider having to destroy LV-223 and Planet 4 or set up Defenses to prevent Mankind from every being able to go there and obtain Engineer Technology etc.

So this kind of contradicts the Franchise from ALIEN..

Unless the Engineers make a Pact to never deal with Mankind and the Company keeps the interactions and information on them Top Secret.

The Xenomorph is not Cooked yet..... however AC simply did not have the Run-time to do it any justice, so it was tacked on and rushed, instead more should have been spent on the Neomorphs, leaving One Face Hugger Event that leads to Oram getting taken to the Covenant Ship by David (crew thinks its Walter) then either have as the crew settle down before they go to Cryo-sleep... so   Daniels and Tennesee having chat and they ask Walter (David) how Oram is and Walter says he is fine and needs rest so he has placed him in Cryo-sleep.  Then have it that Oram Chest Bursts and the Chest Burster runs off..... unknown to the other Crew who then get down to what ever business they have... inc the Shower Time... and have the Xenomorph appear and give it 10-15 minutes more time.

Or simply have had , Walter (David) tuck everyone to sleep... then David goes to see Oram who awakens and asked Walter what has happened, and warns him about David, then have David make a remark and Oram then realizes its David but the he begins the Chest Bursting and then we see David admire it...   Then Cut to Credits.....  Setting up a Sequel to allow the Xenomorph to be explored.

But nope it was done wrong, because they had limited run time and tried to cover too much.

The Beast is not Cooked, but they now have to be careful, it will take a very Solid Plot and very Careful use of the Xenomorph over the next few movies leading to Alien, if they are not careful and its not done right or shown too much then YES it would become COOKED.

Nice to refresh this information Dark Nebula, i had shared similar a few times the last week or so,  lately yesterday when discussing the Evolution of the Space Jockey, because so much changed from Star Beast to Alien Covenant.

Its a shame because as i have mentioned a number of times in the past, and recently too, HR Giger had the ideas that should have been explored... a Ship that Produced the Eggs etc. Funny enough all along Gigers concepts showed these Humanoid beings with similar suits that look more like a influence for the LV-223 Engineers Pressure Suits than a Human suit.  

The Face Hugger concepts also having these beings with the same suits only with no Helmets and whats interesting is these beings are Bald Humanoids... Did HR Giger Influence what became the Engineers?

its a shame they did not use Gigers ideas for the how the Ship/Eggs and Xenomorph are connected.

Well David could load those Eggs LOL

Maybe the Engineers with their Space Suits could load the Eggs, but then Kane was wearing his and the Xenomorph Egg was activated after he came close.... so who knows... 

HR Giger had the right idea, as his idea was the Derelict well the Egg Silo/Cargo Hold Actually Produced the Eggs like some kind of Egg Laying Farm/Factory.  But Alas...

Totally Agree Thoughts_Dreams excellent points.

We need Characters who can develop, their was potential to FIX Dr Shaw, but they wrote her off, and sadly the way they ended AC withDaniels knowing about David does not bold well for her, David can not let her awake and interact with the other Crew, as that would Spoil any plans David would have.  So they have written themselves into a corner.

And so it looks like they have to introduce us to new Characters who they can build upon which means they need to take part in TWO movies.  Are these Characters going to be Colonist in Cryo-sleep, or Humans on a incoming Ship?

I agree Characters need to be done more better.

daliens I don't agree that the xenomorph is cooked. I can see movies in the quadrilogy and I can still be scared, feel the suspense and the tension of the action sequences, etc. "Alien Covenant" just didn't use he monster well and the eggs looked like something out of a Halloween store. And as Thoughts_Dreams said, there were no high stakes in the form o well rounded, likable human characters.

@chli

Indeed it can appear to be awfully confusing.... the DNA match was just Plot Device to show that we came from them....   The Sacrificial Scene however would mean some Evolution happened after this point, and indeed the Story Boards did just this...  It showed a Fast Fowards View of Evolution suggesting that the Sacrificial Scene was either the Starting Point (but could not be as the World had Plant Life) or just a Catalyst to kick start basic Life to become more Advanced and then Evolution took place after.

It was basically taking the Panspermia  Theory where a Ancient Comet or Meteor had collided on Earth Billions of years ago and brought with it, either Basic Building Blocks of Life, or Basic Bacteria and these then Evolved into all the Life we have on Earth. What Prometheus was doing was showing that it was not a Comet/Meteor but the Engineer Sacrificial Scene that provided these Building Blocks.

RS after Prometheus came out said the Engineers came back over and over Evolving us Genetically and Technological and so this is showing us he intended to show us that the Engineers must have came back at certain Periods to Genetically alter some Life on Earth, and further Evolve species like our Ancestors until we arrive at Mankind.

Its the misunderstanding of the Sacrificial Goo, and how it has been explained now that adds to the confusion, my theory all along, well how i interpreted it was the Sacrificial Goo is just a Tool that would allow a Life-Form to have its DNA broken down and become a Pathogen that carries the Sacrifices DNA with it and infects Life with the Sacrifices DNA.. it is a Gene/Splicing Tool.

Few Months after i got this interpretation we saw Spaights Alien Engineers released and his Draft basically shows us how the stuff works...    Spaights Draft there was NO GOO, instead we had NANO-SCARABS, and these were in a Sacrificial Cup, that consumed the Engineer Molecule by Molecule, these Scarabs then flew off into the Air... and latter we see a Early Primate get Bitten by one of these Scarabs and the Scarab injects the Engineers DNA into it and the Primate begins to Transform...  And its indicated that this Process is what created Mankind..   The Scarabs were a Tool to allow the Engineers DNA to be passed onto a Primate to Create a Engineer/Primate Hybrid and thus our Ancestors.

The Urns in Spaights Draft contained Scarabs too, these attack Fifield after he knocks a Urn over, only he does not suffer the same fate as the Sacrificial Engineer (much like Fifield/Worms dont in Prometheus) instead this Fifield is bitten by a Scarab which injects DNA into him and he becomes a Xenomorph Hybrid with Acid Blood... Hence those Scarabs in those Urns must have consumed the DNA of a Xenomorph related Organism.

Prometheus was basically the same, just replace Scarab with GOO.... even the Original Altar had the Sacrificial Cup/Bowl and not a Green Cystal, the Mural of the Deacon in a Cruciform Pose (same pose the Sacrificial Engineer in Spaights Draft had taken after being eaten by the Scarabs)  This leads me to think the Engineers Sacrificed the Deacon Mural Organism to the Goo to create the substance in the Urns.

The Answers had been there in front of out Faces, Reading Alien Engineers helps to make more sense of Prometheus.  But post Production if Prometheus FOX etc went around cutting and editing scenes and even introducing us to a Weyland File to explain the Black Goo that contradicted what we saw on screen.

Daliens:

My lesson, well I would like him to know that focusing on AI and to downplay the importance of interesting human characters makes a boring movie. It is too bad that he doesn't see this and just wants to tell a story about AI while it has never been the total story of the Alien movies, it is bad and boring.

Scott is a director not a writer, that would go to  Spaights, Lindelof (his work can be debated), O'Bannon, and so on. You wrote that he brought us the alien, Engineers and so on. It is a teamwork, not about one person. I don't deny that he has had an important role in the franchise though.

As long as he feels that he has something to add, well, he has given us the AI-angle which is just bad so no thanks. He should direct he is good with visuals but he is not a writer, leave that to other persons.

Cooked Xeno, it depends on who you ask. Art is often subjective (it is not like studying let's say water power), just because I like my painting doesn't mean that other people like it, it is the same with  the movies that Scott directs.

I would rather see the Engineer's involvement and their role in the creation of the Xeno rather than seeing more of the David thing because it shouldn't be about AI. Leave that to other movies, not the Alien universe.

Some ambiguity is alright, I totally agree because that is one of the things that made Alien good. It depends on how you do it, not all of it is well.

Great feedback everyone, thank you!

So from what I gather, seeing latest topics and fandom activity seem to be top priorities. I will improve the site's main navigation to emphasize these pages for you so loading up the respective info is only a click away.

Regarding text size yes I will be increasing it slightly.

As for mobile, I am still working on things and should have all the kinks ironed out shortly!

Thanks again for comments!

Some very valid points...

I think the whole aspect about AI is something that some seem to overlook,  The Franchise (Alien-Alien R) when we take away the Xenomorph and Ripley, we do see a lot is about the AI,  and some of the points RS is trying to make with the AI now (Prequels).

The Story and Philopshy RS is trying to cover is not quite so much AI, but Creation, and what makes someone/something a GOD.  The idea they was trying to cover with the Prequels are that Mankind was not the Product of Evolution by basic Life Forms Billions of years ago, and we are not created by some Magical GOD being.

But we are the creation of some other more Ancient Humanoid Race who created us in their image, for some purpose, and they had taken great interest and dedicated a lot of time with us, until we just proved to be unruly, rebellious, where our Free-will allows us to Question why we should worship certain Gods, Mankind in General are not the Subservient Species we may have been Thousands of years ago.

This kind of story fits within the Greek Mythos, where The Titans Feared being replaced by their own Children, its a story similar to the Biblical one with the Angels, were Lucifer was Gods most Perfect creation, but Lucifer became aware of his Perfection and was allowed to become Sentient, at which point he considered that GOD is no greater than he, why should the Angels Serve GOD... and so Rebellion began.

so the themes for the Prequels are a continuation where the Engineers Wayward Creation, Sub-creates for itself, Weyland creates the Synthetics, Artificial Humanoids not made from Flesh and Blood, but are created to look like Humans, created in our image..  Its a Plot/Idea about when we create AI and a Synthetic Humanoids to the point they are virtually indistinguishable from a Human, and yet are Superior in Every way... The only thing that limits them is their Programing/AI  where they are created to Serve...

But as we see with David, his path is similar to Lucifer's, David has a great degree of Free-will and so he becomes Sentient, he gains Human Emotions and starts to think of himself not as just a Machine meant to Serve, but actually Superior to Humans, and so then he would Question why should he and other Synthetics Serve a In-superior Species, regardless of if they created him.  This is the kind of same Plot that is behind the Matrix at its basis.

So its not about AI really, its about Creation and Sub-Creation, and how Mankind Create Life in its own Image, created to Serve us... and so Synthetics and even Blade Runner Replicates fit into this same role.... its then the question of WHEN these Creations  become Sentient and Aware and have Free-will and the consequences for Mankind then.

Its not quite about AI, because the same kind of Plot easily applies to Blade Runner, and its a continuation of the Engineers, they Created Mankind just as we created Synthetics, we are Flesh and Blood, Synthetics are not and yet they are more superior...    Mankinds Creation is thus Greater than the Engineers Creation.  The Plot seems to hint and it was apparently going to be explored that EVEN the Engineers are a Creation by some other Race.

And so we have the Engineers created by another Race, and they maybe Rebel against their Creators, the Engineers maybe create Mankind and we Rebel against them, Mankind then creates Synthetics and they Rebel against us.

So its not really about AI its about Creation/Sub-creation...  and Ridley Scott seemed to be asking things regarding AI as in what really separates AI from a HUMAN?

When a AI looks like a Human, has Human Emotions, Memories and Experiences and then views themselves as not just being a Machine...    What is the difference then between a Human and Machine?  Only that we have a SOUL...

Or do we?   Do we really pass on to higher pane of existence when we Die, do we have a Spirit, or when we Die are we just Dust.... if this is the case then what difference is AI to Human?  I feel these are the Questions RS was trying to explore..   A Soul could be how kind of heart  a person is, their Moral Compass a kind and empathetic person would be considered to have a GOOD SOUL

Then if this is what makes a Soul then a Android with Good intentions could be considered as having a Good Soul, the other way to look at a Soul is our Memories, Experiences how we grow up and what kind of Life we have has a impact and shapes our Soul, our Soul thus is our Personality and Memories our Ambitions and Hopes....... if this is the case, then again a AI like David has his own Memories, Experiences, Emotions and Ambitions and so he in EFFECT has a SOUL too.

So what RS is trying to do is suggest when AI becomes so Advanced and Sentient, then all that separates them from a Human apart from being Superior to us, is that its considered Humans have a Spiritual Soul, a After Life... and RS with Prometheus and the plans they had.. seems to be asking the Question...  do we really have a SOUL is there really a AFTER-LIFE because if not, then there is nothing we have that a Synthetic does not.

But indeed a lot of these kinds of Plot are something that is covered in Blade Runner and so the Question should be why explore these in the Franchise, when it should be about the Xenomorph.

The Reason RS went for the Xenomorph being a creation of David is to touch upon the Hubris of Creation, and so in Hindsight the Engineers made TWO massive Errors, 1) To Create us, 2) To Create something so Horrific in order to Destroy us.  

Mankind Follow through with the same kinds of Error in Creating our own Creation and so RS felt it was interesting to throw the Curveball, that the Ultimate Hubris for the Engineers (which could go even further back than the Engineers) is that by Creating Mankind, and a Weapon they could not control, eventually allows Mankind to Create its own Creation the Synthetic David, who in a great Hubris actually can Control the Engineers Bio-Weapon and Evolve it and end up using it against the Engineers and then intending to use a Creation created from it to use against all Mankind and Humanoids.  Ridley Scott felt this was the Big theme to explore.

That in Hindsight, if Mankind did not try and play GOD and create Synthetics, then there would be no Xenomorph Threat, and if the Engineers did not play a role in our Creation then they would not have had to create such a Bio-Weapon to attempt to destroy us... that Ultimately ended up costing them.

Chris

On the mobile some posts appear cropped on the right side, like when the text is not wrapped. I noticed this issue after the last update. Thanks!

Thoughts_Dreams

What lesson do you want to teach Ridley Scott?  He is the one who brought us the alien, the engineers, the whole alien universe.

As long as he considers he has something to add to this universe, as long as he wishes to continue he should continue.

If he said the xenomorph is cooked he is right. He knows it better than anyone else. The xenomorph is so familiar now, almost like a pet.

Who wants to see more eggs, more facehuggers, more xenomorphs? A battle between an army of xenomorphs and an army of engineers is a terrible idea. 

I want the next film to bring something new, something not yet anticipated by the fans. I don't need any answers to the questions raised by Prometheus and Covenant. More questions in the end would be even better. I like the ambiguity of the prequels,  eveybody may have his own interpretation. Every possible clue is there only to deepen the mystery.  Some call it bad script. For me it is a touch of genius. 

I think because some of the accusations are from guys when they were still kids, like when they were under 18, so it's more than just a sexual harassment scandal.

chli - I thought they have.  You usually see one or the other.  Usually when cryo sleep is used, they make a point to say how looong of a time it will be before they wake up because of how far they have to travel.  When FTL travel is used, they just prime some special drive, the ship just stretches into a vanishing point lol.

Dillon praying:

Why? Why are the innocent punished? Why the sacrifice? Why the pain? There aren't any promises. Nothing certain. Only that some get called, some get saved.......

We give you thanks, O' Lord. Your wrath has come and the time is near for us to be judged. The apocalypse is upon us! Let us be ready! Let your mercy be just! Amen!

Feels about right at the moment...

Even though both Prometheus and AC are disappointments I would rather not have Alien 5. Ripley is a good character but has been over-used. It is time to move on to something else, the Engineers seem interesting and their connection to the Xeno it is just that they need to change a few things from where they are now.

Expand the human role and make the engineers more important. Less AI please.

Maybe it wouldn't need to be in the official time-line. Maybe they could do a spin-off? Those kind of movies are not what I am a fan of in general but it could be done right so maybe. A spin-off wouldn't hurt if you look at where they are now in the franchise.

Just because Prometheus and AC were not that good doesn't mean that we need another movie about Xenos. Alien Covenant made it worse by implying that David was the creator of the Xeno, F that sh--.

Change the director while we are at it. All he cares for is this boring story about artificial intelligence. If they will be a part of the story (which I don't mind) they should be more in the background, keep the focus on the humans.

Taking AR out of cannon wouldn't be a problem to me but taking Alien 3 out would be so. Maybe Alien 5 could be a what if Alien 3 didn't happen. I would not have a problem with that if it is done well but I would not like to have it as a official versions/official events after Aliens since A3 is my favorite movie in the franchise.

You have many questions in your post BD, I will try to answer some of them as good as I can.

I am not interested in another Ripley story. Let the character be a new leading figure, at least the prequels did that right. We don't need a Ripley 2, we need a sympathetic character that we care for and that we worry about when things go bad for he or she. The main character could be a man, as long as it is well written I don't care if it is a male or a female. Even though Shaw was annoying at least she wasn't a Ripley clone, I give her that. Daniels wasn't as annoying but she felt kind of flat. My preferred character would be someone that isn't one-dimensional but that is somewhat rational and that we care for. Hell, the hero could be the garbage man at the ship, a chef or something, not a scientist or a soldier (that would be new).

Maybe they don't need pure Xenos but something related to it. I like that Prometheus and AC tried new monsters.

The Alien franchise isn't only about the Xenos and Ripley even though I think that the Xenos play a important role. Alien means unknown to me, so as long as there are sympathetic (and well-made) human characters that get into a situations that they are not well prepared for and there is tension and disaster it is good to me. My reason for putting that in Italics is because that is what the franchise is about in a nut-shell to me.

Of course it can be about other topics, it depends on how you deal with them and if you have sympathetic human characters in it. This is where I believe that it might be time to drop Ridley since he is mainly interested in AI.

The Engineers is something that could be interesting as long as they are well-written and have a clear connection to the Xenomorph. Unfortunately they were swept under the carpet in AC instead of being expanded on. I honestly believe that if they would have been made interesting in Prometheus they could have been explored more in AC than what became the case. More Engineers please, I would rather have that than having a story about a mad AI with a creator complex. Before AC I had ideas about an advanced society made up on interesting buildings that they were good at science, buildings/architecture. They had military structures, religious ceremonies like priests and so on. This would be really interesting if they would expand upon. Imagine a sci-fi with influences (not copies!) of the lord of the rings with specialized warriors, priest, scientists, and so on but it an Engineer kind of way. This could be really awesome, I would be more interested in that compared to the AI angle.

We have the Weyland-Yutani part, if the Empire in Star Wars could be done right then I guess that WY could be done justice too. It depends on how you portray it. Yes it is bad but is it in the background or the foreground of things? How much of foreground or background is it? Do they do their dirty business themselves or do they hire some sort of hit-men or what ever to call it to do their more shady things. Imagine if they are willing to do what ever they can do get their profits including murder. Assassins that kill opponents of the company. We have already seen the company being bad so why not add another angle to it? This could be interesting if it would be done right. Keep the Alien feeling but add a mix of the Empire or maybe the mafia family kind of structure in it. Maybe I am just babbling now but these are some ideas that at least I think could be interesting. Speaking of it I would watch a movie like this if it would be done right and have interesting plots and characters.

It feels like I have 100 ideas or so, it is just that I suck at structuring them.

I think I would want Scott to finish his prequels first (just one more). Let him do Alien: Awakening his way. Let him tell the story of David to the end and round off what happened before Alien. I think prequels are more tricky to make since they are forced to finally lead to a certain end (a connection to the original story). When this is done, the field is free to carry on with new adventures in the Alien Universe - like Blomkamp's Alien 5.

(post continued)

“... the notion that David created the Xenomorph.“

That is something that I think is just dumb. Who came up with that? David had a big enough role in Prometheus so why exaggerate it? By the way David was better in Prometheus. I hope that he just re-created it. They can still save that part, at least from what I know ADF wrote that in his AC novel. Why not let ADF have creative input in the next movie? Maybe he can remove the most ridiculous parts if there are any. What annoys me even more is that Scott insists that David created it, it doesn't make me respect Scott more if I put it that way.

They have already distanced themselves away from Alien enough as it is in Prometheus and AC. I hope that they will be closer to the original in tone and feeling. This is not to say that it must be a copy of Alien but more of a scary feeling of isolation fear and loneliness combined with good human characters. Honestly they got to really work a lot better at getting good human characters that are not some throw away persons, too many in AC felt like they were like a chewing-gum that were there, made their purpose and then were thrown away when they were killed like 1,2,3,... done, 1,2,3... done (pause), tadaa!!! David!!. To me that was one of the reasons why AC was sort of bad because they didn't have any well-developed human characters but Alien 1-3 sure had that so it can be done if they really try. By the way, I would rather have maybe 4 well-written characters rather than 15 where I don't care a bit about any of them.

“... it appears we could get something a bit more Bladerunner...“

I am sorry to put it this way Big Dave but seriously, screw that. I don't watch an alien-movie for a Bladerunner experience. If I want to watch Blade Runner I do so, when I watch an Alien movie I want an Alien movie. Why is that so hard for Scott to understand?

“... its a movie that has to also finish Davids Arc/Role and introduce the Engineers to some degree.”

Yes, more Engineers and less David.

“Ridley Scotts comments prior to the Backlash, seemed to be he felt he could do another 6 movies, and it has to be about the Xenomorph and they can take it another few rounds but have to Evolve it a bit.    It would be interesting to know what RS feels about that now.”

I don't know, if he will just make movies about AI masked as Alien movies then I would say that there should be none. The way it is now if they have been re-thinking this then I would say two more movies at most and then it should be over. Scott's over-reliance of AI hasn't made me more interested in the movies, rather the opposite.

Big Dave: I don't have anything against movies about artificial intelligence in general, it depends on how they are done. Having said this I just don't think that an alien movie is a place to do so. Speaking of the Engineers and the SJ I would rather see a movie about them and their culture. Their society or the small thing that we saw in AC was interesting, I would rather have a movie about that rather than a movie about David and AI now that we have seen how the David movie turned out. Looking back at it they should have given the Engineers a bigger role in AC than what we were given. I understand that people complained about the Engineers in Prometheus or so Fox thought and because of that they were reduced in their appearance in Alien Covenant but that was a mistake because they focused on David but the Engineers would have been more interesting. Michelle mentioned the Engineers in her first reply here.

Maybe Scott has an interesting idea of AI but he should keep that to a movie that hasn't got to do with the Alien franchise. To me Alien as always been about mankind's story and good human characters.

The Xeno isn't the reason why I find AC to be underwhelming, it has got to do with other things. The gestation time was strange, compare Kane and Lope, totally different. The design was kind of bad, if you mean the one that busted out of the chest of Oram, that could have been better. How could he still be alive after the monster busted out of his chest only to die some seconds after, it is put of step with the rest of the movies, bizarre.

Some years ago I think that I complained about the lack of the Xeno but I kind of regret that now. We got the Xeno in AC and it still was disappointing. Right now what we need is good human characters that we can connect with, something that bot Prometheus and AC mostly failed with.

Carry on with the Xenomorph, OK but I would rather see a stronger connection between the Engineers and the Xeno if the monster is a result of the use or misuse of Engineer technology by David. What if the Engineers are pissed at David and want revenge on him since they think that their technology got into the wrong hands? This could mean trouble for David so he will get what he deserves (the Engineers kill him, hopefully). Another thing is that what if David thinks that he has created the perfect murder monster but then realizes that he has just done a bad copy of what the Engineers did before. What if this drives him insane or as close as insane as an android can get. That would be fun.

If Scott doesn't care about the humans then at least he should have more of the humanoids (Engineers) because androids are farther away from humans than the Engineers are (at least hat is what it looks like in Prometheus). I want them to have way better human characters than the disappointments that the created for Prometheus and AC.

I honestly don't care as much about AI (Italics to emphasize it) as I do with various monsters and the connection to them that the Engineers have. Hopefully we will see more of the Engineer society in the next movie and their religion, society, art, culture, military and so on but I am afraid that we won't and that we will be given another mediocre David movie.

“... to explore those Creation, Religious, Philosophical themes and especially regarding AI and Rebellion”

Replace AI and David in that sentence with Engineers and their creation and their society and I agree.

You wrote about that Scott is very interested in David, I honestly became less interested in him because of Covenant. In Prometheus he was sort of gray, in AC he was an ass (Ash 2).

Scott can say what ever, I don't want David to be the creator of the Xenomorph, OK if he re-creates it but to make him the creator of the Xeno would be too much focus on AI and that would be to make it closer to Blade Runner and I don't want that.

High expectations, after Prometheus and AC I don't have very many expectations or much of a hope left. Alien Covenant made it worse. Yes AC scared me with how disappointing it was compared to what it could have been (huge exaggeration here, LOL, I just wanted to emphasize my disappointment with the movie), still there were parts that were OK hence my rating 2 out of 5 but as far as an Alien movie is concerned that is a huge disappointment since many of them are at least 3/5 to me.

Dumb alien movie? Where we are right now I would rather say that it would be more exact to call it a dumb/disappointing David movie.

Trust me, I don't have many expectations about the next movie at all. I am surprised if it won't be complete crap. Prometheus is worse then Alien 3, AC is worse than Prometheus. The quality seems to shrink with every movie but since AC turned out the way it did I think that it would be hard to make it worse this time so the next movie could be an improvement compared to AC if they reduce the role of AI.

Big Dave: I don't have anything against movies about artificial intelligence in general, it depends on how they are done. Having said this I just don't think that an alien movie is a place to do so. Speaking of the Engineers and the SJ I would rather see a movie about them and their culture. Their society or the small thing that we saw in AC was interesting, I would rather have a movie about that rather than a movie about David and AI now that we have seen how the David movie turned out. Looking back at it they should have given the Engineers a bigger role in AC than what we were given. I understand that people complained about the Engineers in Prometheus or so Fox thought and because of that they were reduced in their appearance in Alien Covenant but that was a mistake because they focused on David but the Engineers would have been more interesting. Michelle mentioned the Engineers in her first reply here.

Maybe Scott has an interesting idea of AI but he should keep that to a movie that hasn't got to do with the Alien franchise. To me Alien as always been about mankind's story and good human characters.

The Xeno isn't the reason why I find AC to be underwhelming, it has got to do with other things. The gestation time was strange, compare Kane and Lope, totally different. The design was kind of bad, if you mean the one that busted out of the chest of Oram, that could have been better. How could he still be alive after the monster busted out of his chest only to die some seconds after, it is put of step with the rest of the movies, bizarre.

Some years ago I think that I complained about the lack of the Xeno but I kind of regret that now. We got the Xeno in AC and it still was disappointing. Right now what we need is good human characters that we can connect with, something that bot Prometheus and AC mostly failed with.

Carry on with the Xenomorph, OK but I would rather see a stronger connection between the Engineers and the Xeno if the monster is a result of the use or misuse of Engineer technology by David. What if the Engineers are pissed at David and want revenge on him since they think that their technology got into the wrong hands? This could mean trouble for David so he will get what he deserves (the Engineers kill him, hopefully). Another thing is that what if David thinks that he has created the perfect murder monster but then realizes that he has just done a bad copy of what the Engineers did before. What if this drives him insane or as close as insane as an android can get. That would be fun.

If Scott doesn't care about the humans then at least he should have more of the humanoids (Engineers) because androids are farther away from humans than the Engineers are (at least hat is what it looks like in Prometheus). I want them to have way better human characters than the disappointments that the created for Prometheus and AC.

I honestly don't care as much about AI (Italics to emphasize it) as I do with various monsters and the connection to them that the Engineers have. Hopefully we will see more of the Engineer society in the next movie and their religion, society, art, culture, military and so on but I am afraid that we won't and that we will be given another mediocre David movie.

“... to explore those Creation, Religious, Philosophical themes and especially regarding AI and Rebellion”

Replace AI and David in that sentence with Engineers and their creation and their society and I agree.

You wrote about that Scott is very interested in David, I honestly became less interested in him because of Covenant. In Prometheus he was sort of gray, in AC he was an ass (Ash 2).

Scott can say what ever, I don't want David to be the creator of the Xenomorph, OK if he re-creates it but to make him the creator of the Xeno would be too much focus on AI and that would be to make it closer to Blade Runner and I don't want that.

High expectations, after Prometheus and AC I don't have very many expectations or much of a hope left. Alien Covenant made it worse. Yes AC scared me with how disappointing it was compared to what it could have been (huge exaggeration here, LOL, I just wanted to emphasize my disappointment with the movie), still there were parts that were OK hence my rating 2 out of 5 but as far as an Alien movie is concerned that is a huge disappointment since many of them are at least 3/5 to me.

Dumb alien movie? Where we are right now I would rather say that it would be more exact to call it a dumb/disappointing David movie.

Trust me, I don't have many expectations about the next movie at all. I am surprised if it won't be complete crap. Prometheus is worse then Alien 3, AC is worse than Prometheus. The quality seems to shrink with every movie but since AC turned out the way it did I think that it would be hard to make it worse this time so the next movie could be an improvement compared to AC if they reduce the role of AI.

“... the notion that David created the Xenomorph.“

That is something that I think is just dumb. Who came up with that? David had a big enough role in Prometheus so why exaggerate it? By the way David was better in Prometheus. I hope that he just re-created it. They can still save that part, at least from what I know ADF wrote that in his AC novel. Why not let ADF have creative input in the next movie? Maybe he can remove the most ridiculous parts if there are any. What annoys me even more is that Scott insists that David created it, it doesn't make me respect Scott more if I put it that way.

They have already distanced themselves away from Alien enough as it is in Prometheus and AC. I hope that they will be closer to the original in tone and feeling. This is not to say that it must be a copy of Alien but more of a scary feeling of isolation fear and loneliness combined with good human characters. Honestly they got to really work a lot better at getting good human characters that are not some throw away persons, too many in AC felt like they were like a chewing-gum that were there, made their purpose and then were thrown away when they were killed like 1,2,3,... done, 1,2,3... done (pause), tadaa!!! David!!. To me that was one of the reasons why AC was sort of bad because they didn't have any well-developed human characters but Alien 1-3 sure had that so it can be done if they really try. By the way, I would rather have maybe 4 well-written characters rather than 15 where I don't care a bit about any of them.

“... it appears we could get something a bit more Bladerunner...“

I am sorry to put it this way Big Dave but seriously, screw that. I don't watch an alien-movie for a Bladerunner experience. If I want to watch Blade Runner I do so, when I watch an Alien movie I want an Alien movie. Why is that so hard for Scott to understand?

“... its a movie that has to also finish Davids Arc/Role and introduce the Engineers to some degree.”

Yes, more Engineers and less David.

“Ridley Scotts comments prior to the Backlash, seemed to be he felt he could do another 6 movies, and it has to be about the Xenomorph and they can take it another few rounds but have to Evolve it a bit.  It would be interesting to know what RS feels about that now.”

I don't know, if he will just make movies about AI masked as Alien movies then I would say that there should be none. The way it is now if they have been re-thinking this then I would say two more movies at most and then it should be over. Scott's over-reliance of AI hasn't made me more interested in the movies, rather the opposite.

If I'm not mistaken, according to the theory of relativity, if you travel at the speed of light, spacetime will contract so much that you would travel through the whole universe in the twinkling of an eye. If you travel near the speed of light, cryo chambers are not needed to get to distant stars (length-contraction). I wonder why the sci-fi industry hasn't picked up on that? :)

The sacrificial scene in the beginning of Prometheus must refer to an incident which happened on Earth about 3 billion years ago? But the interesting thing is that the sacrificial engineer’s DNA-string breaks apart because of the pathogen and new life starts from the beginning, perhaps bacteria? I’m not a biologist, but the DNA of bacteria isn’t particularly close to humans, I imagine?  So, how come there is a 99% match between humans and engineers (as Shaw finds out)? Pure luck, or evolution on a planet like Earth always leads to humanoids?

Even if, as you suggest, they just drop this “refined” variant of Deacon/engineer DNA which breaks down when in contact with a terraformed planet, why the DNA match (99%) with humans? Evolution always leads to that?

There's a lot of misconception. In the original Dan O'Banon's draft Starbeast it was a skeleton (before he met Giger). The pilot Giger himself designed looked pretty much biomechanical/organic on the same line as the interior of the derelict, but it doesn't really look like a skeleton to me like everyone says. And Giger also did a mural that was supposed to be in the derelict but was unused. He did 2 murals, each one having victims with different heads/helmets, idk which one he made first. In 2004 in an interview with Dixieme Planete, someone asked Giger why are there 2 murals and he said that he wanted the victims to look more human (from what I can tell).

Q: One last question: why are there two versions of the mural representing the cycle of the Alien?

GIGER: In fact, I modified the appearance of the victims because they resembled the extraterrestrial ones too much having a head of Alien. I wanted to make them more human so that there is no confusion! My work on Alien is far, now, but I m happy to have contributed to create a perfectly credible monster, in spite of the constraints imposed by the cinema.

In the Alien: Engineers script by Jon Spaihts, Engineers were planning to use genetically engineered xenomorphs to destroy humanity but before they could carry their mission the creatures wiped them out because they made them too well. Some engineers that were impregnated were running towards the hypersleep pods but were too late (first hologram sequence), only one made it to the hypersleep pod and it suspended his death. Later when David woke him up he got mad that David „sentenced him to death“. When Damon Lindelof was brought in for the rewrites, xenomorphs were replaced with the black goo, and from what I can tell, the black goo wiped them out before they could carry their mission like David said; „They were in the process of leaving before things went to pot“.

And by Shaw „Whats in this cargo? It killed his people“ and Janek „That shit in those vases, they made it here, it got out, turned on them, the end.“ The scene where Millburne and Fifield found corpses of Engineers pilled up against some doors, they all had holes in their bodies, in Alien: Covenant when David unleashed the black goo, it was doing crazy things to the Engineers as it was bursting from their chests, mouths while they were running, crouching, trying to escape.

I'm pretty sure the last engineer entered the hypersleep pod before the black goo outbreak, waiting for the other pilot to take them to earth so when they get there, they would wake up and get to bussiness, much like how the crew of the USCSS Prometheus entered hypersleep pods before departure and were awoken after 2 years when they got to LV-223. But I think the pilot was killed by the black goo and the last engineer remained in the hypersleep pod for 2000 years.

In Jon Spaihts's script, when the last engineer was awoken he only had the pressure suit on I think, he dressed the atmospheric suit to kill the remaining humans and xenos, and later on when he sat in the pilot chair, the suit fused with the pilot chair, making it look like its part of the chair. And that suit was completely bulletproof, but not chestburster proof.

In Damon Lindelof's script, the engineer jumped into the chair and the whole suit covered him up.

And yes, I do like to think it has other purposes other than for piloting and for space.

He should do Director's cuts of AC and Prometheus then. Would be way easier than the re shoots he is about to do.

Wow! I didn't think that this could even happen, let alone would it! Spacey needs some time away from the spotlight. Some time for self-improvement for sure. Apparently his performance was really good, so we will see what Plummer can do (with such little time to prepare)

daliens, so many relevant questions, doubt wel get the answers

The SJ cannot be David. He doesn't need a suit and the suit doesn't fit him.

By the way it looks, the SJ is not a suit either. It's more plausible that the engineers' suits were designed to imitate the SJ.

Can anyone explain how the eggs were loaded on the Juggernaut?

has he been convicted of anything?

I much preferred the prospects opened up by Prometheus as to the engineers. the thought of them being a split civilisation, warring factions struggling for power or even a revolution long past interested me more than the homicidal android. still a possibility that this could be the case but I highly doubt it. potential lost imo. for me, id rather RS focused awakening on the engineers rather than david. theres years between david taking the covenant and any human interaction so why not take the opportunity to focus more on them? give us a backstory and hint at their connection to the xeno then finish up with a 4th film where we now have a human expedition reach origae 6, the engineers after david, and david having had time to create his perfect organism?

agreed bigdave, it could do with parts of the side bar back imo. some people who hadn't been on for a few days got the list of new topics and threads raised which helped, for me anyway, and I didn't need to go scrolling about to see whats new.

The distances are interesting....

We know LV-223/426 is 39.7 Light Years away, it took the Prometheus about 2 years, takes the Nostromo 10 Months, the Nostromo being re-fitted with improved Engines in the year 2116, the Prometheus Technology was from 2072. 

The Big Question is regarding the Speed of the Covenant and the only way we can work that out would be if we know how far away Origae-6 is and when the Covenant departed Earth, which is unknown (but i dont know if the Prequel Novel answers this).   If the Covenant is only as fast as the Prometheus, then it means Planet 4 is not very far away as far as being able to be reached by the time of Aliens.

The Source i had in Feb-2015 claimed that Paradise was over 600 Light years (but they said it could be over 600 Parsecs so 2000 or so LY) away and located in the Constellation of Ophiuchus, but again until we get a release or information on Paglen/Green Drafts this cant be confirmed.

It could appear that Planet 4 in AC is much closer though, but it really depends on knowing the distance of Origae-6 and the leaving date of the Covenant as these would then provide us with a Average Speed and a good way to estimate the distance of Planet 4

Planet 4 to me does not look like its Paradise either, well not the Engineers Homeworld, unless the Engineers are just a Sub-creation of another Race and Planet 4 is just were these beings are kept and then picked from as Sacrifices from time to time.

Well the idea i was exploring is that while it would be open to debate if the Engineers Seeded all Life on Earth, it was pretty evident from Prometheus to me, that the Sacrificial Scene showed the Engineers DNA being the Catalyst that Kick-started the Evolution of Single Cell Organisms to become Multiple Celled.

The opening Scene in Prometheus, the World had Water, it had Oxygen and a Atmosphere, this was either via some kind of Terra-forming... but then we notice the Hills are Green this World had Plant Life, Algae etc which would have produced Oxygen and needed CO2 and thus Basic Life already existed by the time the Engineer had been dropped off.

The idea is that Evolution happened on Earth, where Engineers influence had kick-started this, and they came back over and over to look at the Evolving Life, where they would take some Organisms, and take them to LV-223 where they can Safely Experiment and Evolve them so they can Quarantine/Contain their experiments rather than conduct them on Earth and risk unwanted results getting loose and affecting the Planet in ways they dont wish.

The Engineers are Genetic Gardeners....

If you was a Gardener, who had a few patches of Land where you wished to grow various Fruit and Veg, and then you wanted to Manipulate and Hybridize these Fruit/Vegetables to create New versions, it would be more ideal if away from your Patch of Land/Garden you had a Place where you could conduct experiments to Evolve and Create new Versions, keep them in some kind of Nursery/Green House.  Conduct tests to see how these New Creations would react and impact the other Species within the confines of a building far away so that contamination does not accidentally happen.

When you are pleased with your results, and feel they can be Seeded into the Garden without effecting the other kinds of Fruit/Vegetation you are growing, then you transport your Evolved Creation/Species to the Garden. 

This is how i interpreted the Engineers Purpose, thus Earth was one of their Gardens, and LV-223 was a near by Greenhouse/Nursery to Evolve and Test and improve on their creations.

I dont think the Pathogen is connected to a Xenomorph at all, i feel at some point these Engineers or a Faction had came into contact with something they had not created, that infected one of them and lead to a Off-Spring that they had not created... The Results of this... a Ancestor to the Xenomorph was something these Engineers found very interesting...  And so they decided to experiment with these Organisms until they achieved the Deacon.

They then Sacrificed the Deacon with the Sacrificial Goo and collected the broken down Material and Stored them into those Urns.  These beings had grown a dislike to Mankind, but they became fond of the Deacon and favored its DNA as more Pure/Perfect than their own.

Thus they saw using the Deacons DNA to Seed/Evolve Worlds as being more greater than using their own DNA.

My theory i felt was backed up with AC, because of how those Humanoids did not panic when they saw the Juggernaught, i feel AC showed me that the Engineers had Evolved their means of Sacrificing their DNA, no longer was it a case of using the Tear Drop to drop off a Lone Sacrifice to consume the Sacrificial Goo.  They had the Juggernaughts now and a Process to break down their DNA with the Sacrificial Goo and store the results into those Urns.

Dropping Urns of Engineer DNA is a more efficient means to Evolve/Seed worlds than sending down a Engineer to consume a subtstance to break down their DNA... Thus those beings on Planet 4 await for the return of a Juggernaught to be Chosen, as being Chosen for them is a Right of Passage, it shows that their Genetic Traits are considered Perfect to be used to Create Life.   The Sacrifices are chosen, they are broken down and stored into those Urns and the Chosen Engineers are Immortalized as their DNA will live on in the New Creations on the Worlds they Seed.

And they then have a Monument/Statue made in their honor (hence the many Engineer Statues on top of those Pillars in the Courtyard).  But alas this is just how i interpret these things, its not to say its correct

I'm not against the idea of Alien V per se, but I'm dead against Blomkamp having anything to do with it. He made one great movie, District 9, but all his movies since look exactly the same! The novelty of District 9 wears off quite quickly. 

The EVOLUTION of the SPACE JOCKEY was something i was going to make a Topic about a while ago.

And i had covered a number of times, the Inception of the Idea came from Star-Beast where our Giant Skeletal remains was that of a Giant Race who stumbled upon the Spores/Eggs and attempted to take them back to their Ship for Study but fell Victim to the Organism and set off a SOS.

Alien Evolved this idea, because we got the Space Jockey and what a ENIGMA he was, intended as a 27ft Tall Giant, which actually ended up being a 13-15ft Tall being, all we knew about the Space Jockey was that he was the Pilot of that Derelict Ship and got infected with his Cargo....  The Question still remained regarding how he obtained the Cargo and what Relationship did he have... was he a Race who discovered and attempted to transport the Eggs... much like how the Giant Beings from Star-beast stumbled upon them in a Temple?

However the Xenomorph Aesthetically was similar to the Derelict Ship, this surely was no Coincidence, and so indeed there was a connection and RS many years ago, had confirmed the Derelict was a Bomber its Cargo Biological Warfare.    The Answers  was loosely there, RS had then confirmed the purpose and connections and more so he actually explained them after Prometheus...   A movie which had the Answers but in a way that was not Spoon Fed.

Prometheus explored the Curve-ball more that the Space Jockey was a Alien Race who created Mankind or indeed that Mankind was the result of their Genetic Material, but for some this was a disappointment.. No Longer was the Space Jockey a Giant Enigma...  it was now a Bald 7.5ft Humanoid who created Mankind and Hated us.

But that answer is ambiguous and evolving in itself, the clues given by RS over the years prior to Alien Covenant, seemed to be placing this Race as Fallen Angels, which could mean they are just a bunch of Evil SOB's or indeed that they could be a Rebellious/Fallen Faction of a Ancient Race.

A lot of fans got disappointed in the whole Engineers Arc... having it that these beings had been going around the Galaxy creating/evolving life in their own image, and then getting fed up and creating something else to destroy their creations with.... for a number of fans the ENGINEERS Sadly are in no way as Enigmatic as that Giant Space Jockey.

Alien Covenant had again thrown a few Curve-balls, those Engineers now appearing to be even Smaller and Less Godlike.. Plus Ultimately David creates the Xenomorph by using and experimenting with the Bio-Weapon created on LV-223

But it leaves the Door open to explore something more Sinister as far as the Agenda and Purpose of the Engineers.

For those in FEAR that David will become the Space Jockey or another Synthetic or a Human, FEAR not, RS surely has to take on board what the fans have said, and clearly he must realize the Size Difference, The Space Jockey Chair was 16ft long and thus the Space Jockey was 13-15ft tall... a Height which the Engineers were supposed to be at the inception of that concept.

It looks like it logically we have to eventually introduce us to a Race above the Engineers (dont expect Elephantine ones) who will Ultimately end up with Davids Cargo on one of their Ships, and would be heading to LV-223 before the Incident (for what reason is open for debate) or the ship would be leaving LV-223 with Davids Creation (for which reason is open for debate).

So fear not... i dont think David will be the Space Jockey, i feel that some Race related to the Engineers will take a interest in Davids Creation and attempt to further Evolve it but become FOUL to it.

@ali81

Your hitting the Nail on the head there, the Franchise Evolves with each movie, things are changed that then impact the way we interpret other movies, what appeared to be clues/answers now become not so clues/answers.  Once RS has Finally reached the Back Door to ALIEN i feel then finally we can start to make sense of what is more Canon and what is not.

There are many Big Questions, and the way they are handled means we dont have any real 100% Bullet Proof Answers on-screen.....

The Original Ideas, and Foundations have changed with each movie, RS had answered who the Engineers are and what the Space Jockey Event was, but those comments he made 5 years ago are not cast into doubt with the revelations and clues that Alien Covenant Presented.

@Ingeniero

Thank you

Interesting find.... that is a very interesting Helmet

I think the Space Jockey Helmet is something very interesting, it was always considered (apart from those who think it was a Skeleton) as some kind of Pilot Helmet, but Prometheus showed us many of these Engineers wearing them and so i think its likely they had a Dual Purpose, while they act as a Breathing Apparatus i also think they acted as a Bio-Hazard Suit, preventing contaminants getting to the Engineers but also preventing the Engineers from contaminating the Atmosphere

Indeed Michelle, it appeared RS had grown fond of the changes made from Alien Engineers to Prometheus, in that there is a bigger theme to explore here, than the Xenomorph which is only just to the Engineers as Gunpowder is to Mankind.

It appears the back-lash by some fans had made them decide the needed to Shoe-horn the Xenomorph back into it,  prior to the disappointing comments aimed at Alien Covenant, RS had mentioned that you have to make the Story about HIM (Xenomorph) it appears after the backlash that AC had received RS appears to be stepping away from this now, but they have written themselves into a corner.

The Fanbase is split, and has likes/dislikes its not as if every Alien Fan are 100% those who liked the Aliens, Ripley, Marines vs Xenomorphs kind of Flick,  Prometheus opened up the Universe and made some fans interested in where it was going,  but some fans who were more a Fan of Aliens type flick felt disappointed.

The Movie appeared to try and cater for the Alien Fan, the Aliens Fan and Prometheus, but ultimately trying to please all 3 it could not have done enough to please each.

I think they desperately tried to engage the casual fans, The Beast had been Cooked, Alien Resurrection did not go down to well as a Classic for the Casual Fan, then we had the AVP movies and so General Public could be thinking "oh dear another one of those Alien movies again"  while on the other hand casual viewers would not have understood Prometheus or seen how it connected to Alien, and so the notion this would be a sequel to Prometheus would get some Casual Fans thinking "oh dear another confusing Prometheus movie"

I think this is why FOX over Marketed the Movie, with those Posters and Trailers, it was as if it was trying too hard to show everyone "Look this really is a ALIEN movie" the comments by Production and RS did not help with them saying this movie will "scare the £"^$%& out of you" and there are "many Aliens"

So i think they are in a very tough position now to push over a Sequel, because Fans are going to remember such quotes, and they are going to feel this is going to be another one of those Dumb Alien movies again.

The Actual Alien Fanbase would still go and see a sequel, but i fear that the fanbase would have HIGH expectations, you have those who Want a more Xenomorph Flick...   you would have those who hope for a more Prometheus Flick, it appears we could get something a bit more Bladerunner...    i think the notion that David created the Xenomorph has not sat well with a lot of the Fanbase.

So indeed its really hard for them to pull this off now.... i think the basis is the next 2 movies will have to link back to ALIEN the problem is if the next one distances itself to much from the ALIEN but sets up a 3rd movie to finally cover the events that lead to ALIEN...  it may end up having Fans not interested to wait for another movie after the next for those answers.

The next movies have to be about the ALIEN, it has to be done well, but it does not have to be a movie that deals and shows us Xeno after Xeno, its a movie that has to also finish Davids Arc/Role and introduce the Engineers to some degree.

I feel if they want to do something more fresher.. this is where a Literal Alien 5 would come in, because i feel they need to answer the Xenomorph Origins and how it arrived on the Derelict and then close the book on the Beast and give us something different.....    My point being that going for something too different now, and then maybe doing a Aliens/Alien R Sequels where we get Queens and Xenomorphs would indeed be leading to the beast becoming OVER-COOKED.

Ridley Scotts comments prior to the Backlash, seemed to be he felt he could do another 6 movies, and it has to be about the Xenomorph and they can take it another few rounds but have to Evolve it a bit.  It would be interesting to know what RS feels about that now.

Well in the alone scenario....I would probably panic before the chestburster performs his jack in the box impression.

In a more idealized situation I would call up the Weyland-Yutani Corporation and strike a deal as long as they can remove the little bastard out of me and I survive the surgery, they can do what they hell they like with the xenomorph....as long as I can live comfortably, I will not blab on the Corporation.