Comments (Page 601)
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not connected though they spoke with Danny Boyle to do AR. wonder how that would have turned out
Cerulean Blue, do you think that David 8 could have a Mermaid's Purse inside himself that housed the facehugger eggs?
I know sherris, I had to search "Mermaids purse alien covenant" first to see if anyone wrote about it.
My pleasure daliens, Cerulean Blue, Space JOC, sosse and you're all most welcome.
the way david comes to the conclusion and decision to to rise above humanity was done in seconds during his discussion with weyland. he decided even before weyland mistreats him. ''you will die, I will not, i am perfect, your own words''. yet he is an imperfect creation but doesn't see that and only sees the blunt logic in his belief that, because he lacks the mortality of man he is perfect.
Call, Winona Ryder looks great with short hair.
This answer is a bit late but what ever
Hopefully David just created the Protomorph. Maybe this can lessen the damage now that they hinted that David created the Xeno in Alien Covenant.
“I don't believe Ridley Scott would go further into David as the creator of the xenomorph only to justify his experiments from Covenant.”
I am not so sure about that. Scott seems to put is interest primary in the AI so there is a risk that it will be the case, however that is a direction that I will point finger at so to speak because to me that direction is rotten. Hopefully there are enough alien fans that agree with me on this one. David shouldn’t be the creator of the Xeno, to me that would just be wrong.
David shouldn’t be the space Jockey. I would like it to be either an Engineer or a distant relative to the Engineers.
Let the synthetics play a more distant role but don’t put them in the foreground, leave that to more robot-centered SF movies.
I won’t be mad if the SJ is an Engineer or a distant relative to the Engineers if they will make the Engineers interesting but they got to make them a lot better than they have done this far. They were a letdown in Prometheus so they shouldn’t be the same as the SJ right now but if they will make them more interesting then I wouldn’t mind the SJ being an Engineer.
“Right now it does seem RS has been heading towards the Xenomorph being Davids Creation, and i think RS has come under fire for changing this direction to this from Alien/Aliens fans and even Prometheus fans...” (Big Dave)
Can’t just someone tell him that this is a really bad idea? Hopefully someone can make him change his mind. This is a reason why he should direct and not be involved in the story like they said in a AVP podcast.
David is an interesting character but he shouldn’t be the main focus, the humans should be. I don’t want another movie that is mainly about the AI at the expense of human characters. This is one of the things that I have a problem with when it comes to Covenant.
“There is no worry about the Space Jockey being a Human/Synthetic as we are getting the Engineers returning in part and so i think its more likely these Engineers discover Davids creation and decide to take the Eggs for themselves.“ (Big Dave)
This could maybe lessen David’s involvement with the creation of the Xenos, that would be a good thing. As far as the mechanical part of the Xeno maybe that could be something that the Engineers added to make it more able to endure different climates if they decide to use it as a bio-weapon?
@ Ingeniero - This is another very thoughtful post to add to your contributions to this site! I have found Mermaid cases on the beach & always found them extremely interesting. They are not the most risk-free way way to reproduce so David, it seems, is only helping them increase there chances to survive. He is nurturing them!!
Unfortunately most of the characters lacked specific character traits that made them stand out. It seems like the only characters that were given a thought or two were David and Walter but I think that they made an OK job with Oram. They should have fleshed out the human characters a lot more, I hope that this is a mistake that they have in mind for the next movie so it will be better.
Can someone make a list of the names of the characters and more exactly explain how they are as characters? To me most of them didn’t have their specific personality (patient, hysterical, serious, and so on). If someone can think of a character with at least tree traits that we are really shown as an audience then please let me know because I can’t think about many of them.
They must get these things right in the next movie or else the franchise will be fucked.
"I think Cameron likes to build around Human Characters.."
Prometheus and Covenant should have been done that way because that would make the human characters better. I have said this before and I say it again: human characters are number one because if they don't work then the rest will not matter at least not to me. Maybe with this in
mind it would have been better if Cameron would have made Prometheus and Alien Covenant?
Aliens feels a bit old but at least it has better characters than AC and Prometheus.
"Pretty cinematography won't carry the day anymore."
Yes, they got to focus on the human characters. It doesn't matter if the environment looks great if the characters are anonymous or dis-likable.
Maybe this is a good thing since it gives us a bigger possibility that there will be a sequel.
I hope that the extra material will make the movie better as far as the characters are concerned. Actually I think that they should allow people to put in copies of the extra material into the movie if they have already bought it to make it better if they want to (compare it to making re-mixes of songs).
Six planned movies are too much since much of Prometheus and AC is not that well done. I say at the most two more until they get to Alien if they don’t drastically change the direction (mainly the AI involvement and the monster). They should get some interesting characters while they are working on it, something that both AC and Prometheus could have done a lot better.
Update: being second on that list isn’t bad either. I don’t care about WW so it would have been better if Alien Covenant still would have been at first place. Judging from IMDB reviews there are a lot that give it like 1 star or two starts so it might look that not many will buy it but this is good since I think that it at least was OK. What is important to me is that enough people buy it so we will get at least another movie before we get to the original.
Is it possible to look up somewhere how many copies of the DVDs and Blu-rays that have been sold? By this I mean in total numbers (50 000, 60 000, whatever).
Probably Bishop, he seems friendly enough and probably gets things done. Defiantly not David or Ash. Ash was crazy in Alien and what David did to Shaw speaks for itself.
That is good, I like how it was written. What I liked most about it is how the way that the conversation was flowing, it felt like something that could take place. If they would have written Shaw this way in Prometheus then she would have been more likable.
This is almost like asking is serial killers can be held responsible for what they do. Here we also come to the discussion of free will. I doubt that David had free will like humans but he had emotions so he got mad at how Weyland and other humans treated him. Maybe he had some synthetical way of moral judgment but I don’t think that he had it like humans do.
I think that he had some synthetic way of making judgments but I don’t think that it is like how humans do. Droids are programmed like a machine, humans are not. There simply got to be some difference between humans and androids and to me free will is the main difference something that synthetics lack so no, I don’t think so.
Good topic DK, thanks a lot.
I would've preferred something more akin to this...
AC was better than Prometheus but it is far from perfect. My main complaint is that the characters are too weakly written. They are not complete idiots like some in Prometheus, they feel more like real persons but few of them are very memorable. I remember many of the characters in Prometheus (mostly for bad reasons) but few of them from AC. Saying that it is an average movie is probably fair but it is better than the movie that was released before it in the franchise.
Yes it was a bad thing to turn it into Blade Runner, that was too bad. I am glad that I am not the only one that dislikes that. Hopefully they will focus more on the human characters in the next movie and less on AI. For example I wouldn’t enjoy Alien as much if they chose to focus on Ash, that wouldn’t be as interesting, far from it.
“Just like Prometheus, this is David’s story”
Yeah and that shouldn’t be the case. If they ignore the human characters and focus primarily on AI then it isn’t very interesting to me. Who shall I as a viewer identify with? A crazy android? To me I got to have a human character that I can find sympathetic and interesting otherwise it is not a good movie, sorry. Oram was the most interesting human character in AC since he was one of the few that had some back-story, Tennessee was OK also. Unfortunately we were not given a lot of information about Daniels which was the main human character which made her less interesting. Daniels wasn’t bad it is just that se was too anonymous because I didn’t get that much info about her personality. Was the tough? Stubborn? Shy? What were her personality traits? They got to make her a lot better as a character in the next movie.
I don’t want the next movie to be about David and if it will then they got to have a lot better human characters otherwise it is a miss.
Perhaps not as far as building environments and that but maybe in making better characters. Alien Covenant and Prometheus didn’t have that many good characters so maybe they would get that part better. Having said this, I am not wishing to see an Alien 5 movie.
Walter: I disagree, Alien 3 is my favorite and Aliens is OK. AR and the AvP movies is another story.
“. . . the big problem I have withs blomcamps movie is that it would completely undermine alien 3 witch in my opinion is one of the greatest sci fi films of all time and better than aliens, alien ressurection, prometheous, and alien convant.”
I totally agree with this statement.
Alien movies have done the airlock thing a million times so that is getting old. I would probably vote for the cross death/Ripley suicide from Alien 3. Is there anyone else that notices that she is falling down in the shape of a cross? There is some religious symbolism in Alien 3, I think that is a very interesting thing.
I LOVE IT!!
Also, I really do think David appeared to be crying as he bombed them?
Hopefully they will start soon.
“… i think they are having to reconsider some things and you can bet at FOX HQ they will be wanting to know why Alien Covenant did not do as well as planned.”
To me the problems were mainly about:
- The human characters were too weak. The only human character that I got some idea about how he was, was really Oram and that is probably because he was a captain and had an important position there.
- It had too much focus on the AI part
What is important to me is that they mainly focus on the human characters and put the AI story in the background even though androids play an important part. Compare it to how Ash was in Alien, he was still important to what happened (he let Kane on-board with the infection) but he was still not the main-character. Bishop was an important part of Aliens but he was still on a more equal level as far as how much attention that he got compared to the rest. Ripley wasn’t as much the center of the story in Alien compared to the sequels, it was more equal in how much attention each character was given but that is how I see it even though I can be totally wrong about this.
They got to have more fleshed out human characters that we can connect with. Unfortunately both Prometheus and AC suffered from this. I am not sure what happened since both Alien, Aliens, and A3 got this part right (this can really be questioned about AR and AvP but I haven’t watched AVPR and probably won’t bother). Bring in a writer that is good at writing human characters that are like people that we can meet in real life. Once they got this part right they can think about ships, the environment and how that shall look. No matter how good a movie looks, as long as the human characters are weak the movie will be a disappointment.
Maybe they felt that it had been shown already so they ignored it? To me it seems like a serial killer in Alien 3 rather than a biological thing that cocoons its prey (if that makes sense). I don’t have any problem with the lack of cocoon in the movie.
“are they similar to us in the manner that though the same species, they would become aggressive toward the runner due to its differences or would they accept they are just all the same species?“
They are so far from humans so it wouldn’t surprise me they have a way of dealing with each-other that is far from how humans interact. I would like to keep that as something unknown.
IMHO - A fair review of what was presented on screen. I agree this movie is going to grow in popularity with DVD sales, as Prometheus did!
No, I also think that it is a stupid idea. There are some things that they should let us wonder about.
An Alien prequel could explain some things but there are other things that are not that important. Sure we can be given a hint where it comes from but I am not interested in learning if it can smell tings, what they eat, and so on. What I am worried about is that the prequels will explain everything about it because then there is nothing left to think about which would be a shame. The Xeno shouldn’t be a meaningless creature like Bambi. Having the image of how it sees is one thing but we still don’t know how their vision is made up, from a physiological point of view and hopefully we will never learn about that.
The Dead Space infant looks quite capable dk. A mix of The Thing and Gollum.
I did not really care for it in the movie, but this was kinda fun.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKw1_l3htvA
Very interesting! I wish the bluray would come out here already, I'm sick of waiting ha
Forgive but since my attendance at Titus Andronicus it has hit me like a brick what is missing from Covenant that Alien and Prometheus enjoyed, mediation from a character on a journey who had a growing sense of revelation and a desire to survive and who did until the right point when she offered sacrifice.
As the film is centred around a narrator who is a robot who is unreliable, for both reasons he cannot offer mediation and take us along indeed his behaviour pushes us away (dismantle the bastard). Ripley and Shaw offered mediation with a growing realisation of what was going on. By the time Daniels discovered who the robot was she had not discovered anything or shared it with the audience except a half truth about Elizabeth which as you know is mired in confusion. THAT is why the film for me is an entertaining ride which shares the same broad thematic elements as Prometheus but has no ascension or build from its predecessor and it is for all the forgoing reasons I have outlined centred around the repositioning of the story and getting the creature on the screen that has lead to this.
can i change my vote. Upworth looks suspiciously like a synth ;-)
The POV in movies is a tough thing to accomplish, for films rely on the picture itself, and for you to really have a POV there - which would include showing the way the character REALLY senses the environment... It would have already been hard if it was written, let alone filmed. Yup, I would have passed.
I have this thing with twins, you know... So I'll take David AND Walter, if it is not a problem ;)
i thought that title was the most hilarious spam i ever seen ;)
i had to click, glad i did ingenerio you on some next level shit with this stuff you come with. amazing man thank you ;)
David never told a lie, right?
I don't know....he seemed ok with showing Vickers his extendable parts with wires...haha
Couldn't you play as the xeno in one of the AVP games? I didn't play it so I don't know what the xeno vision looked like, if differnt at all.
Yep, and if I remember correctly it was normal vision. It was a while ago now when I played it.
Maybe we'll get Vickers 9 in Awakening, sent by Weyland-Yutani to confront David. She would need some re-programming for that purpose though.
There must be some meaning to it. Maybe that's how Daniels will see things in the opening scene from Awakening.
What about Ms. Vickers? Didn't she look synthetic enough?
I don't believe David would share the body with Walter. He cannot afford losing control, he would rather cut his hand off.
He somehow got all the necessary info from Walter about the expedition, ship and so on.
First time when he is revealed as David is when he smiles seeing what the alien did to Lope, after the Mother got on line again and warned Daniels about the unidentified life form on the ship.
He knew about the log cabin, he was just cruel to Daniels before she got into cryosleep.
Even the scene with "Walter" stapling his cuts reminds me of the scene with David cutting his hair earlier.
At some point I was tempted myself to the body swapping theory, even I thought that Walter could have terminated David and uploaded all that David was into his system to save the data that could be later useful for the company. But if Ridley Scott said it was David in David's body we have to take it as such.
