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Walter seems to be the perfect guy for Daniels after her husband died. He has a way with words and timing, but he is very technical about it. It is kind of humorous, like a nerd trying to be romantic (and is succeeding at it!). Still, I don't think Walter loves Daniels or even likes her in a similar way. She is just available and is grieving, so she could use the friendly company. If her husband was still alive, Walter wouldn't appear that he loves her. The movie and more in the novel do play with that idea and I like it. Still, Walter is programmed to act the way he does. If the Walter we know started having feelings for Daniels, then I say there is a defect in all Walter models (and I doubt that is true). Now, if Walter started having feelings for Daniels after his lessons with David, than maybe I could believe that David started to make him more aware than he was programmed out to be. I think David is more aware of things in life then he was programmed to be. Still, right from the beginning of the book (and possibly movie. It's been awhile since I've seen it), Walter seems like he is charming Daniels.
Yeah no worries ;)
I think going faster than Speed of Light holds a lot of Questions as to how can a human withstand that if we do manage to break the Speed Barrier.... I think as you get closer to the Speed of Light then Time for those traveling at this speed greatly slows down.
Who knows how the Engineers ships work, maybe they imply another trick like the Punch a Hole in Space/Bending Space (Warping Space) Theory or Created a Worm Hole etc.
@Sherris
The Source had hinted which is all they do, well they give clues and statements and not Spoon Fed Answers. So here are the ones regarding the Engineers, or connecting and i will try and put as many as i can... if i miss some and remember i will add them after.
*The Engineers are not Gods, and they answer to a higher power.
*The movie is about multiple layers of creation/sub creation which does not Start with the Engineers and does not end with David.
*There is a Hierarchy above the Engineers, but the way they mention it its as if there could even be more levels of Hierarchy above the Engineers Creators
*The Engineers have more in common with David than they do with Mankind.
*The Engineers are not really creators as such, but they are Genetically connected to Mankind and so they share our DNA and Predate us... as in Modern Mankind.
*Mankind as of now is like 4th/5th Generation of Mankind, and we did not evolve from Apes, but Engineers DNA is in our roots.
*The Engineers serve a higher purpose and Agenda, one which is very sinister and dark and is a even further step away from how Dr Shaw would have envisioned meeting our makers. so what she found out in Prometheus that differs from what her beliefs are... is shown to be even further than what she found in Prometheus.
*They will meet some beings related to the Engineers.
*The Theme is about Forbidden Knowledge that is not intended for some and when gained/used can lead to down fall.
*The Sacrificial Goo is in effect the Prometheus Fire, and Fruit from the Forbidden Tree and playing with Fire can get you burnt.
*The Hierarchy have Terra-forming Technology that can affect the climate of Worlds, they can affect not only Weather, but Seismic Activity and can turn worlds into habitable or even UN-habitble and this Technology is what caused the Many Great Disasters. (Great Flood) and can cause Ice Ages etc.
*The themes from Paradise Lost will loosely play in regards to what role the Engineers play, but its loosely but in context to Paradise Lost. The Punishment that some of the Fallen Angels had suffered (Turned to Serpents) allowed the Engineers freedom from Bondage.
*The Agenda/Plot for Prometheus 2 is similar to that of The Matrix.
*The Engineers and Hierarchy connections will loosely tie with Religion and Mythos, but not too literally and it covers loosely many Mythos, including not only Biblical, and Greek but Egyptian, Sumerian and others. its a combination of a number of them.
*Biblical Events had actually happened in the past such as attempts to destroy Mankind/Wipe the Slate Clean but not directly connected to our Generation of Humanity.
*Paradise is loosely connected to the Biblical One, as the Cradle of Creation but while Biblical and other Mythos themes are connected they do not have to apply directly to Earth. Such as how Paradise is not a place on Earth but a separate World.
*Paradise is not the Engineers Home-world, it is the Cradle of Humanity Creation and it is considered a Headquarters of the Hierarchy local to our are of the Galaxy but is not where THEY came from.
*Mankind plays a bigger role in the Xenomorph than the Engineers.
*The Hierarchy have created many Humanoids and the Engineers are not the only ones.
*The Sacrificial Goo is a Powerful tool, that is kind of Everything than how basic it was in Prometheus. This Tool is intended for Benevolent reasons but like Nuclear Power can be used for Energy and can also be used as a Great Weapon.. so can the Forbidden Fruit/Fire in the wrong and unauthorized hands.
*Paradise is a World that looks like the Klingon Home-world from Space, it is 3X Larger than Earth and has 7 Moons, but they said some concepts it had 3. Paradise is a Jungle/Forest kind of World.
*Paradise has Architecture that is more a combination of Ancient Sumerian/Babylonian and Egyptian but it also has some elements of Ancient Israel.
*There is a shot which looks like the Valley of Kings, and Luxor Temple where there is a Path that has by the side of it Pillars with Statues of Humanoids upon it, some look Engineer, some look different and some even dont look Humanoid.
*At the end of this path there is like Orchard but at the end of the path and in front of this Orchard there is a Black Obelisk that neither looks Rock or Metal, and it is growing out of the Ground and has Roots... it has a Green Glow at its Center
*This is the Source of their Power and is in effect the Tree of Life and Knowledge.
*The LV-223 Engineers had stolen a Shard of this Obelisk.
Thats it off my head... but my head does not work so well no more lol... i will have to take a look at my Older Posts from 2.5 years ago and see what parts i missed.
There was further clues linking what may happened to the LV-223 Engineers, but its vague as they keep referring to the Prometheus Punishment at play, but also more so playing with Fire gets you Burnt. And so a lot of Hubris which we ultimately see is the consequence of Weylands Agenda too.
The last game I really played was "The Last of Us" and IT WAS AMAZING! I have Alien: Isolation, but I stopped playing it at the beginning. It wasn't really scary at the beginning, which the game is advertised as a scary game. "The Last of Us" was scary right at the beginning. A great story and cool characters. I have been debating if I should go back and play Alien: Isolation just because the story is tied into the movies in a way. I think I've read that it is part of the actual Alien stories created in the film. Still, I'd rather be doing something else with my time at the moment.
I agree, it is disappointing when you see during production so much effort and time spent on fantastically detailed and elaborate sets, that only get glanced over in the final cut.
It must be disappointing for the artists/designers involved as well, they would pour their heart and soul into creating something wonderful only to have it in the background and never thoroughly explored or appreciated.
To answer your question, Ridley has confirmed the next instalment will return the engineers
Hopefully they come back with a vengeance to smite David!
@Kethol
I hope i never came across in a bad way with that reply though ;) sorry if i have. I think i will have to watch the extras and look at the Longer Scene.
@Michelle
I agree regarding the Deacon, i think those two outcomes are the most likely explanations as i cant really think of any others.
Also regarding the Novel, i have not read it yet but it seems to add some interesting parts to the Plot... who knows if we are to consider it as Canon... Does it mention what happened to the Mother/Docking Ship?
As i recall Wayne Haagg and someone else talked about how Both Ships had a Dust up and this is why they crashed, so it meant both crashed. someone posted a image on here showing a Crashed Mother Ship.
But the Novel as you suggested does then seem to indicate that the Juggernaught Survived this and it was Dr Shaw who crashed it while making a escape.
I think its very odd that she would be singing that Tune while making a hasty escape though... unless she had done something that made her think David is incapacitated and has no change to reach her before she escapes.
Its going to be interesting debating the Novel Differences to the Movie, as the Novel paints a different picture to a number of events and is not as ambiguous.
If you obtained the Screen Grab then you should see this door with the orange does shoot behind her, Dr Shaw is in such a rush that looking over her shoulder all she would be able to tell is at that point the Engineer and Trilobite are not following.
I think the image posted is a interesting one, because i would assume for sure that if you peered from this window you would likely not see what is inside the area where you marked Shaw as heading from. She would be able to see if something leaves that room but i doubt you could see directly into the room.
Also the distance between the inner door and outer door is a god 10ft or more.. maybe 15ft? i think its between 10-15ft foot and then with the outer door closed she would have no place to stand maybe to see clearly from the first Airlock to the Vickers Suite not as clear line of sight to be able to see the area where the Med-Pod is.
So i think the only way she would be able to check out if the Trillobite or Engineer had left the room would be to enter the Lifeboat and peer through the 2nd Airlock Door which you circled above and i am not sure she would have a clear view of what lies behind the door area where the Corridor to the Med-Pod is.
I think a interesting thing is the effects of the Edits to the movie and what we get, as this image i found on the internet shows the Engineer Entering some part of the Lifeboat before he attacks Shaw and we can clearly see this does not quite add up with the route Dr Shaw shot unless the area in the Suite that leads to that Corridor where the Med Pod room is, has to have two doors to it.
originaldarthnugget I agree with your points about the cycle of creation and humanity/engineers playing god by creating subservient sentient life. Something that may surpass the creator and lead to a Kill-your-idols type scenario.
But, I think we can all agree what made ALIEN so special was the terrifying unknown and the mystery. Why is such a hostile and deadly creature out in the void of space, and will I run into it.... or something worse! like walking in darkness and that feeling of walking through a spider-web lol.
Humanity's androids creating Xenomorphs and the Yautja sounds like a fun idea, but it just totally diminishes the scope, fear and mythos of those species....and makes humanity the centre of the universe again...
Michelle, you are amazing and I enjoy your analysis and perspective. I know this is late to this thread but I had a wildly speculative epiphany while watching the show again. Let's say that David did have enough time to swap cloths and cut his arm, etc to look like Walter, instead of the other theory where he infects him with his conscious. That means Walter, the self healing robot that is loyal to saving humankind is still on Paradise and will probably wake up after he repairs.
With Walter on Paradise ,and with a load of time on his hands, he could then focus on making his own xenomorph to combat David's human killing machine Aliens Xenomorph. And wouldn't it be excellent if the one Walter designs are eventually Predators! Bringing a whole universe of AvP and filling in the back stories of most everything, except The Engineers.
However, I think they already answered the Engineers backstory by drawing a parallel with mankinds. The Engineers liked to experiment and build civilizations. When they don't like their creation they wipe them away... because they can. Although we know some Engineers didn't like that and stopped LV223 (bio experimental staging ground) from destroying earth.
Side note...I am curious if those rebel Engineers had interactions with humans and as others have speculated is tied into long believed religions we have and saviors? Those engineers that saw beauty in mankind were willing to sacrifice themselves to save humanity by destroying lv223 that we see in Prometheus. Thus humans killing their creators and a human creation destroying all Engineers on Paradise.
Like what Bigdave says above.. but his is more succinct.
Mankind builds androids... because we can and we enjoy creation. Engineers made mankind because... they could. Android kills the engineer creators and modify an existing pathogen creation to target wiping out mankind and force evolution for the Android reign.
I would think that the Engineers back story is similar to this one... the Engineers killed whomever/whatever created them and the evolution of intelligence and free will continue on until something they create killed them, humans/android. Which is close to our reality... don't our children today hate their parents for trying to control them? Hopefully not that they kill their parents but it is a similar struggle. And the cycles continue in parallel.
I think the overall lesson is you have a limited amount of time until you do something that gets you killed and there is beauty in distraction and the cycle of creation. What is the reason for life...? We exist because we can overcome what kills us until we can't and that new thing reigns for a time until it is replaced. So really what purpose is there in life... try not to kill yourself and enjoy your time here! Everything else is just smoke and mirrors of systems of control.
Australia for the win :)
@BigDave - "I cant see how she can see inside the Lifeboat from this position and besides the Door to Vickers Suite is closed"
From her position on the ground outside the door? All she had to do was stand up and go look. The outer airlock door was wide open.
I don't recall the inner airlock door closing, but even if it did close behind her (it should, it is an 'airlock'), there is a window on that door. All she had to do was look in to see if the Engineer or trilobite were lurking about. She had a direct line-of-sight view of the door to the hall where the Engineer and Trilobite lay as well.
That door was also open when she left. You can see both the airlock door window and that doorway in this screen grab.
BigDave, thanks for correcting me.
However, one thing which I recall reading about in university was the fact that living things cannot travel in space at FTL. Something would happen to their bodies at that speed. Therefore synthetics are needed. If RS really REALLY wanted the people in AC to be the Engineers, then I would assume the suited one we saw in Prometheus was simply an analogue to andriods, albeit much more complex and closer to the real thing.
"Well RS has in another interview suggested they could bring Ripley back and De-Age her, so i would think this is something they was considering"
That was the other interview I referred to. The interviewer suggested it. Not Ridley.
Ridley did say this back in 2015, before the change in direction that became Covenant.
"I’ve even got connections with Ripley [in Paradise Lost], but I’m not telling you what.”
I felt in the film that Walter and Daniels had some connection but that's how I interpreted it. The deleted/extended scenes seem to expand on it better.
The Deacon.
The deacon is born with a placenta, has humanoid characteristics and born, as the Deacon in the mural with the same bishops mitre shaped head, of an Engineer. Clearly Elizabeth was not prevented from scavenging in the life boat for supplies and other important personal elements found amongst the ruins of the Prometheus. This could be because the Deacon has :-
1) Moved off or
2) Being more humanoid has a much longer gestation period.
"It stated in the 'Art and Making of Covenant' that David kept her alive while he experimented on her and in the Collector's edition book it said he killed her to prevent Shaw from leaving him, androids have a funny way of showing affection".
The recent pod cast on AVP with Dale and Matt revealed some interesting perspectives not least that the aim in the second act was to let the narrative breath and retain some ambiguity which was built around David "The unreliable narrator". It maybe one of the reasons that the Tapestry of drawings which was planned for the Catacombs which showed David's journey of descent was not pursued in the movie it would have stopped the conjectural nature of the act dead in its tracks.
This highlights that the crossing which belongs in the 2nd act starts from the place of the unreliable narrator.
That said, and given ADF wrote the novel from a particular point in the evolution of the screen play, which locked his novels relationship with the movie at that point, there are several interesting elements that can be meshed together and sit with the quote I began this post with.
1) David's repair was carried out by Elizabeth.
2) Once he was repaired they set course for the Engineers Home world and Elizabeth was placed in cryo-sleep.
3) Whatever additional insight David gained in flight lead to his decision to deploy the pathogen and the juggernaut did not crash it landed, as Walter deduced and challenged him over in the novel, which David does not counter he simply responds he was not made too serve.
4) David woke Elizabeth and materials and necessities were transferred to the quarters Elizabeth lived in, which Walter in the novel discovered on his first reconnaissance of the Cathedral.
5) At some point Elizabeth decided to attempt an escape which is captured in the hologram of her singing and the hologram in the novel implies she can be seen anxiously looking over her shoulder as she manipulates the controls.
6) Unable to pilot effectively she crashes the ship and this leads to the point made in the collectors edition where she is clearly over come (she may have been injured) and subsequently killed to avoid her escaping.
This seems an important step change in David's relationship and gives credibility to their changing relationship where subsequent to her attempted escape his love is expressed in overt possessiveness, control and bringing her into his experiments.
As David did love Elizabeth he would not want to admit to the crew that she effectively rejected him in trying to leave nor explain what became of her subsequently. His opening remarks on what happened in the novel is she dies in the crash, a crash which occurs because the Juggernaut was on auto pilot to the Home world and which David could not intervene over including the dispersal of the Pathogen. Walter quickly deduces the description of Elizabeths death is a lie and leads him to further deduce the Juggernaut did not crash either and that David is responsible for the release of the payload.
I have always been troubled by David's arc with Elizabeth but knowing this kind of coercive control and exploitation is classic behaviour of an over controlling and possessed lover such a story thread would make sense of Prometheus, their Crossing and what happened in the year 2094 whilst on Paradise, the year of Elizabeths death immortalised on the tombstone in the novel.
I liked how the novel flirted with Walter developing feelings for Daniels
Ok just watched the end of Prometheus and as Shaw arrives at the Lifeboat the Outer Airlock Door/Entrance is open, she then shuts it from the inside, and then proceeds to open the 2nd Airlock Door that leads to Vickers Suite.
We then get a Edit of the Full Version, as she places her Helmet on the Bar and then Proceeds to check out the sound she hears from the Trillobite, the Door she takes to the Corridor where the Med-Pod room is, is indeed open.
When the Engineer arrives he would have came through the First Airlock Entrance as the Computer sets off a Airlock Breach Warning, the Engineer then forces the Doors of the 2nd Airlock Door open (that leads to Vickers Suite) and then runs at Dr Shaw and pushes her.... she then activates and opens the Med-Pod Door allowing the Trilobite to attack.
She leaves while the Trilobite and Engineer are Wrestling, at this point the Trilobite has not got the Engineer pinned on the floor.
Dr Shaw then has to open the 2nd Airlock Door (leads to Vickers Suite) which closes behind her, and then she opens the Entrance Airlock Door which is also closed.
She jumps down while this door is open and lands on the floor, where she is lying down for a little while.
I cant see how she can see inside the Lifeboat from this position and besides the Door to Vickers Suite is closed.
I will assume as the Engineer opened both Doors, but they was both closed when Dr Shaw made her escape that indeed both Doors would also automatically close and so i think its likely the entrance door closes after Dr Shaw hits the floor outside.
We see not proof either way to show the Door open/closed, but as the Doors had been closed even after the Engineers Entrance then i would assume both would close again.
The one between Vickers Suite 100% is closed after she leaves.
So i dont think she would have seen the outcome of the Fight, she may assume the Trilobite won, because of how things looked when she left and how after laying down for a little while the Engineer did not make a appearance and she would know the Trilobite may not be able to open the Doors.
This means after hours or the next day, Dr Shaw could enter the Lifeboat and look through the 2nd Airlock Window to spot the Trillobite and Engineer... i dont think she would have had a clear view though... not how the Lifeboat was set out.
But after watching for a while with no Reaction, she could open up the Door and take a quick peek.. where she may indeed Spot the Bodies of them on the Floor then cautiously assess the situation.
Then decide to make a rush to get what ever supplies.
I can only assume the Deacon Gestation took days, and by the time it had Chest Busted, Dr Shaw had obtained all the equipment she needed and then had set off some distance to the other Temple.
At this point its now open to debate if they soon left, and spent Months floating in Space before she put David together, or if she indeed spent time on LV-223 before she did that.
The Light is interesting as looking at the Juggernaught and the Set for it, its odd that these would be Windows. But its something we cant rule out.
Gutted :( I was all set for an early August release.
September 18 seems an age away - looks like i will be using Kodi until September then ;)
BD -
I would be interested in anything you have around this when you have time. It is still something I am interested in even after A:C.
As long as we have the hope of an Engineer return I will be searching for something that leads to more as this is something i have still so much interest in.
Perhaps it would not be any fun if A:C answered our cravings and given us some gold....
No. I still want to know. A:A is fine. I dont need it all, just as much as you can fit in to 123 mins film plz RS ;)
@Gralen We don't know if it only has one city. We're only shown one city, there could be more, but the pathogen would've wiped out all animal life across the planet.
It actually makes perfect sense that their homeworld is a pristine Paradise, a religious haven, while their facilities are on other worlds. But then again it could just be one world they seeded out of many while their true homeworld looks quite different.
One of the things that points toward planet 4 being their homeworld is when ricks says something about "main sequence star, just like ours, but old, very old".
Thanks for the Link....
I am not 100% sure this can be taken as Accurate though, i dont recall if RS or any other connected people ever confirmed or mentioned the Sacrificial Date.... Its a pity SM is not around here no more.. as i am sure they would maybe be able to confirm this.
I think the key thing is what RS said though, and that is the Sacrificial Scene could be any place at any time, it just shows how the Engineers Seed Worlds. They could have started doing this Millions, or Hundreds of Millions of years ago.. maybe over a Billion.
And they could have been doing it even as far as the Alien Covenant Timeline, we really dont know when the First or Last time they did this was... i think its open to debate but shows us this is a event they partake in over a vast length of their History.
Even though Walter says he doesn't have emotions, he probably has some. Maybe Daniel's death will trigger a sort of, say, awakening ;)
She opened the airlock door, but she does not close doors behind her in the theatrical cut or any of the deleted scenes. All are left open, although I suppose by default if the outer airlock door was opened, the inner one would close. In the Deacon birth scene it does look like the door to the main room may be closed, but it is difficult to see for sure. It was not closed when Shaw left.
Its logical that a Lifeboat would contain Food and Medical Supplies, at the very least.. even if it is separate to the Kitchen/Dining area the Prometheus Crew used.
Janek tells Vickers she can survive for two years in the lifeboat, so there would have been two years worth of supplies. David also says earlier in the movie - "Its actually a separate module with its own self contained life support. Air, food. Anything needed to survive a hostile environment".
Everything Shaw needed was right there.
I think indeed Budget would not affect the Story and i agree the Plot Changes are nothing to do with the Budget, i just feel a bigger Budget would have helped to improve certain things.
I think he Budget to me showed FOX having a bit of reservations to the Franchisee and not willing to back it with as high a budget as Prometheus was.. which is a shame... not only Budget wise but i think it shows FOX have had a lot of say in what to Change as far as Prometheus 2
The same thing happened with Spaights Alien: Engineers, it appears FOX was the ones who wanted to cut back the Xenomorph elements and RS was pleased with Spaights draft but then agreed with FOX that maybe we dont need to include Xenomorphs everywhere....
I think FOX had seen some criticisms with Prometheus and saw how the Fans was really digging Blomkamps return to the Alien Franchise for Ripley.
Nice Captures.... indeed this is how i remember it.
I am sure we see the other doors shut though, and when she jumps out of the Door its open but its hard to make out in the shot when she is on the floor as i think the shot when she jumps out is the only one we last see of the Door to the Lifeboat.
I will have to re-watch Prometheus latter.
Nice Find Kethol ;)
Indeed i think there was a few concepts of the lay out but i cant seem to find a matching one, as it is different in the Movie, i can make a mock up i suppose.
I will watch Prometheus after, but i am certain the Doors Closes behind and indeed the Trillobite/Deacon event would have been contained in a Corridor that seperated Vickers Suite where she had the Bar and Tables and Chairs and the Med-Pod room.
Looking at Prometheus well from what i recall, it appears the Lifeboat would also contain the Hall that Vickers had grabbed David after he went to see Weyland and so Vickers and Weylands Bedrooms and the Cryo-Pod were all part of the Lifeboat too.
Its logical that a Lifeboat would contain Food and Medical Supplies, at the very least.. even if it is separate to the Kitchen/Dining area the Prometheus Crew used.
"Here is one of the Schematics and its not 100% Accurate"
Definitely not accurate. Much simpler in the movie. She literally walks in through the airlock into the main room. The door to the short hall to the med bay is on the right.
I think so yes...
I think in Hindsight they would have felt that Prometheus did not give enough Xenomorph Clues, it did not also show any real Xenomorph type Encounters.
We had Zombie Fifield Attack, The Hammerpede Attack both which was in Spaights Draft but had a more Xenomorph connection.
We got the Trillobite C-Section which in Spaights draft something similar had Chest Busted from Holloway but then grew into a Adult Organism that killed a few people... We get to see TWO Face Hugger events, both different, first was Holloways Octopus like one and then Watts (Shaw) Xenomorph type one... which she removes the Chest Buster via C-Section.
Spaights draft we also have TWO different more closer to Xenomorphs that came from the Face Hugged bodies of TWO crew members.
We see the Deacon come from Engineer in Prometheus but all it does is Chest Bust.... Spaights we get the Ultramorph instead which then chases down Watts (Shaw) before she kills it.
Spaights had Eggs, Face Huggers and Multiple Xenomorph type Monsters.
I think FOX/RS in hindsight felt Prometheus really should have had some of these things, it appears Prometheus was criticized by Fans especially Aliens ones for not having enough Xenomorphs etc.
This is why RS had said "they want Xenomorphs, ill give them F-ing Xenomorphs" to me this seems its more a Forced Change brought on by FOX rather than RS direction.
@Capt Torgo
Pretty sure nobody thought the same when Blade Runner initially came out either.
As for the script, I don't know. I think many things indicate that the whole social media campaign relating to the Oats studio and the hetz toward Alien Covenant could've been something deliberately created, but at the same time it might just be a spontaneous thing, one of many bubbles on social media.
"how can she get from the airlock to the food stores?"
Ben Proctors blueprint indicates the dining room was the next room after the airlock, so presumably food stores were there. In the movie the dining room and living room were condensed in a much smaller single room and the short hall/accessway to the med pod room was on the right instead of left. The Engineer and Trilobite were in that hall room.
"she opened the door to the med pod room and let the trilobite into the main area of the ship"
The trilobite never entered the main room. It just stayed in that short room in front of the med pod door. After jumping out of the airlock, Shaw just stayed right there outside the open door. All she had to do was look through the inner door window and she could see if the trilobite was in the main room.
"would have saved her having to face the engineer and trilobite"
She had nothing to face. The Engineer and Trilobite both died while she was laying outside the lifeboat door.
A fine mess can be reduced is my guess. Just a total waste of Shaw/Rapace but I'm thankful we at least got that. A little mystery here and there is still pretty cool. Probably enjoyed the Crossing more than 65% of Covenant. Super disappointed we got no answers from Prometheus instead a ForceAwakens vs Friday13th/BladeRunner. All of those are fine and even mishmashed up are on but Ridley's characters are just atrocious in their behavior and dialogue as Expert Astronauts. That aspect will never age well and I think helped to sour the box office. Now , all we can hope for is flashbacks someday which never were present on the 4 of Alien films. #hotmess
I think its open for debate... its either a oversight.
Or there is a reason for the differences, and Ridley Scotts comments could suggest that indeed as these are Humanoids they could all appear different.
But the differences are still quite a bit, and so the only way to explain them would be that the LV-223 and Sacrificial Engineers, Evolved on a different World/Environment that would account for the different eyes, and skin tone.
Or they are Engineered to have such Advancements..
Or those beings on Paradise are the result of the Engineers Seeding. Well they come from the Engineers.
As for the Green Stuff i think the slime, may indeed have some importance as far as Technology. How it connects to the Crystal if it connects at all who knows.
I will have to recap what the Source i had claimed about the Engineers in Late February 2015 to me, as it does seem to give a lot of insight into these subjects... they are just as vague with clues as Ridley Scott is though, and as AC is a Re-write of the Paglen/Green Drafts which the Source said their information is from... i cant be sure if they are even remotely correct... as the only way to find out would be if a Paglen/Green Draft comes to light.
I want to preface this by saying I haven't read any of the tie in content of A:C, so strictly going off the movie and how I interpret it.
I don't think Walter has any concept of love, and David seems to have a very skewed understanding of it.
Big Dave= I have to disagree with you almost completely about the production budget- Ridley was going to insert this (imho) terrible and pretentious dialogue wether he had 100 or 200 million bucks. On top of that AC still would have been David,David, Android Show. Maybe Ridley was mad about the budget and set out to upset loyal fans, jk. However, Fox was very right in choosing Ridley's tale over Blomkamp at the time for Neil has been lost in the woods imo. Now, Ridley is in the doghouse for my feelings and I hope somebody/anybody gets a chance to shine with proper supervision. Is Brandywine NOT have any talent to ensure a coherent product? Milton's Paradise Lost is a bold ideal but it HAS to be done expertly and Ridley just missed the target by a mile. Intelligent and immersive characters don't require a !passive budget-see Shakespeare! Those characters in Covenant are not going to age like the ones in BladeRunner
@Ali81
Here is one of the Schematics and its not 100% Accurate, i have added in RED where there are Doors that are not on this Schematic... the RED ARROW showing where Dr Shaw had Entered/Left the Lifeboat
YELLOW is the Interior Boundaries of where the Lifeboat would Separate i assume.
And GREEN is where the Trillobite and Engineer are.
I will have to watch Prometheus again, but i am sure Shaw walks into the Lifeboat via the Arrow, and then there is a Door between this Airlock Part and Vickers Suite and then another Door from her Suite to the Med-Pod and Corridor.
I am certain these Doors Automatically Lock, the Airlock 100% does and we see the Engineer has to make his way through 2 closed doors to get to Dr Shaw outside the Med-Pod Room in the Theatrical Cut.
I am 90% sure when she leaves the Door between the Med-Pod Corridor section and Vickers Suite closes, i am also 80% sure that when she leaves the Room the Engineer and Trillobite where still battling it out... But Kethol ;) you made me doubt that lol, i will have to go and watch it again.
I am also sure there is a Large Drop to the Floor and the Entrance to the Lifeboat that maybe makes it hard for Dr Shaw to actually see, and i am not sure we can see if the Door is shut or not, but as a Airlock i would assume its purpose is to Automatically Shut.
I will have to watch Prometheus latter to confirm these though, but i think i am 80% certain on these.
Ridley Scott - Is there any chance that engineers will cross paths with predators in the Alien universe?
BigDave -
A couple of months ago I did a search for an Aien Timeline and it was on there. Again im not sure if it is correct or official or even where the information is from. I just wrote it in my notebook.
I just searched again and there is one at:
http://alienanthology.wikia.com/wiki/Alien_Universe_Timeline
Again I dont know if its correct or where that info is originally from.
"@BigDave - She was just wearing the bra/tank top thing when she put her pressure suit on, not a t-shirt. The t-shirt must have come from the lifeboat."
Precisely ;)
That was what i was getting at, sorry if maybe you misread me, i was indicating that clearly she had no T-Shirt under the Space Suit and that i was certain she had a Tank Top at the end of Prometheus, i am sure i mentioned this? I did not mention where she got the T-Shirt though.. i was not assuming she had it on. I think indeed she must have salvaged it from some place.
I think the Lifeboat is a ideal candidate to salvage stuff from, and as i had said here but also before when i discussed the crossing that Dr Shaw would not be sure what threat the Trilobite poses she knows nothing about it, she could see it over powered the Engineer, but i am not sure she would know what happens next.
She was very distraught and broken after she ran out of the Lifeboat that the Trilobite may not have been on her mind, and so indeed as you said, maybe she would have noticed the Trilobite had Subdued the Engineer but we cant be 100% sure if Dr Shaw could be 100% Certain the Trilobite was dead.
Which is why i suggested maybe David could have told her it seems the purpose of these Organisms is to simply kill its Victim and so it poses no threat. David would especially have to relay such information if he knows the only Equipment to put him back together is in the Life Boat.
The Question really comes from how long does the Deacon Gestate and where does it go after....
The Movie events we cant take as Chronological, not with the Crossing, not 100% its now open for debate... which brings me to your next VALID POINT
"The Prometheus arrived late on Christmas day. The events in the movie happened quickly, probably in a span of about 48 hours. She left LV-223 on New years day, so she had 4-5 days to move anything she needed from the lifeboat to the Juggernaut"
BINGO.... indeed this is something i discussed a few years ago, a inconsistency in the Life Cycle.. because i had a few times discussed the Deacon and how in Chronological Order, it would mean Gestation was 4-5 Days... I debated this a few times years ago using the same thing you did in that Dr Shaw had left the SOS on New Years Day 2094 and so looking at the events of Prometheus in detail, it would leave a 4-5 day Gap between when she had escaped from the Engineer to when she left that SOS.
There was some interesting debates in this time, and i was thinking back then if the SOS was not exactly done at the same time we see her ride off into the sunset... well towards the other temples... so i was wondering was the SOS played over the top of this scene but recorded prior or after? who knows.
But i wondered if these 4-5 days was where she would have managed to put David back together.
I think maybe the Big Question is Gestation of the Deacon, if we follow the Prometheus Timeline then indeed it would appear to be 4-5 days or so.... which we have to ask how come DR Shaws Trillobite Gestation was way faster, and how come the Deacon Gestated longer than a Xenomorph?
The only answer i could come up with is that as the Deacon is in effect a Human/Xeno Hybrid as it was from a Human/Xeno-strain Hybrid Face Hugger, maybe Gestation took longer.
SO ULTIMATELY....
The Most Logical Answer would be the Deacon Gestated Longer and Dr Shaw had no choice to go and check out the Life Boat, maybe she did take the Shotgun as you sugested, this would be wise, and maybe she would peer inside at a latter date/few hours after or what ever and if she has Davids head with her.
And sees the Dead Trilobite and Engineer, David could maybe indeed confirm they are Dead and so Dr Shaw would indeed then be relaxed enough to start to collect supplies.
Take them to the Juggernaught they acquire....
This still leaves us wondering if Dr Shaw and David then left after 4-5 days and then is the Dr Shaw's Hair simply a Lazy Oversight again... because this looks like a good 6 Months of Growth.
But we still cant work out if this is the case, then could Dr Shaw had Held herself up for a Period of time... where the Deacon simply does not come to where she is... or did they indeed take off with David in Two Parts but then could not Navigate until David was back in one piece.
I think its a bit open to which of these takes place.
And thats a plausible one....
