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If it's like The Walking Dead point-and-click survival game I won't be too upset, as long as it has a good plot and dynamics like said game. That game was a heavy plot-driven situational drama however, not sure how it was work as a stealth-action game.
ps. that is a really unflattering image of Amanda Ripley in the promo pic
"She thought she could run… she thought she could hide… Help #AmandaRipley fight off the Xenos in the new mobile game Alien: Blackout available January 24. #ReadPlayWatch"
Artwork:
Source: https://www.facebook.com/alienanthology/photos/a.450250496604/10156756082036605/?type=3&theater
It stars Amanda Ripley, and by the looks of the gameplay trailer, it reminds me of FNAF games (and I'm sick of those games).
I think this reply i put in another Topic... fits Perfectly here too.
I think the BIG PROBLEM... is a majority of the Fanbase are more in tune with Camerons Aliens and how the Xenomorph was used in the many Games, Novels and Comics.
The Prequels starting with Prometheus did offer something a bit NEW... but i feel while this idea was accepted by some of the fanbase, more so ALIEN fans, it was never quite what a lot of Fans expected.... a Prometheus 2 would likely have lost a number of the Fanbase that had gone to see Prometheus expecting it to be more Alieny...
The Problem with Alien Covenant was it had tried to please some of those who wanted a more Alieny Prequel, yet it never delivered that Aliens or Alien vibe as far as the Xenomorph was used... It threw a lot of what Prometheus Fans expected under the BUS and was more about David and his ARC and how this connects to the Prometheus themes and Weyland..
It seems everything else was thrown to the wayside.... the Problem is this Sacrificed a number of things Prometheus Fans wanted, but retained some of it... but it also Sacrificed the Xenomorph by being something that is FAR from what people assumed prior to Alien Covenant (Creation of a Mad Robot).
Any sequel would HINGE on setting up HOW/WHEN those Eggs get onto the Derelict, and a lot of Fans would be hoping that its not via Davids Abomination. With Ridley Scott suggesting the NEXT Movie would not be about Xenomorphs but about AI...
This means those wanting to get to such a Conclusion, and Climax would have to first sit through 2 hours of Ridley Scotts David/AI movie and its Philosophical Themes before we are then brought into seeing HOW things tie up to the Weyland-Yutani Company its Agenda and Special Order 937, we get the Engineers Return and NO DOUBT we see the Xenomorph Arrive!
This 3rd Alien Covenant Movie and 4th Prequel would be the Climax the War of the Worlds Maybe (or set up for such). But before we get to THAT JUNCTURE we would get a Movie that i am not sure a lot of Alien Franchise Fans would be keen on seeing....
SADLY.... i am not sure too many would be interested in such a Venture, and if such a Venture was to not make very much Money, it would leave the Chances of getting the Conclusion that would be more about the Xenomorph and Engineers and Companies Greed... in LIMBO.
I would be interested in seeing where RS takes us next... but it would be something thats a distraction from what the ALIEN Franchise is expected to be about.... NO SOON as they gave us a ALIEN Prefix and how we would eventually be heading to the Back-Door of ALIEN... then Fans are going to expect the next one to be more ALIENY... less David and Certainly that he DOES-NOT create the Xenomorph.
This is all because of caving in to introduce us a Literal Path to ALIEN and the Xenomorph, rather than to Steer-Away...
Prometheus was intended as a BRIDGE were we have the following...
Alien Franchise <== Prometheus ==> Something New
But because Prometheus did not give enough to satisfy any connections to ALIEN for many... it meant they Sacrificed this something NEW... to bring about a literal Prequel Series to ALIEN.
I think we need a Novel to act as a Bridge Between Prometheus and Alien Covenant... set in those 10 years... then another set between Alien Covenants intended Sequel, leading us to the Climax of the Sequel... were the NEXT movie should then take over..
So we essentially have...
Prometheus. MOVIE
Prometheus 2.5 aka Crossing NOVEL.
Alien Covenant MOVIE
Alien Covenant 2 NOVEL
Alien Direct Prequel MOVIE
Certainly a Good Summary of what state we are in...
HINDSIGHT... is a wonderful thing!
If Prometheus was more of a Cross Between Prometheus and Alien Engineers.... then maybe that DOOR to ALIEN could have been closed and allowed Ridley Scott to take us where they had planned after Prometheus.
My re-write of Prometheus i worked on in 2013 did attempt to give us a more ALIENY movie in some scenes, but was more closer to Prometheus than Alien Engineers.. it was just a adding of some scenes and changing of some scenes to make a more clearer connection to the Xenomorph, while retaining a lot of Mystery...
Alien Engineers did offer (not just about Xenomorph Scenes) but it made it more clear of the Connection between the Experiments, and HOW the Xenomorph came to be WHILE still having some Mystery and i was attempting to add a little of this...
Which Included.
More Xenomorph like Fifield with Acid Blood.
Showing Hammerpedes had Eggs.
Showing the results of those Eggs (kind of a Baby Head Hybrid Chest Burster).
More time spent on the Chest Busted Cryo-pods.. with a bit of dialog..
More time spent on the Mural, and a brief glimpse of what was behind that Door.
NOT A SINGLE Xenomorph in sight!
Looks to be set on the Nostromo?
Not a massive Fan of Such idea as it goes against Canon as far as the Destruction of the Nostromo as shown in ALIEN
But as far as a Game i think it could be something interesting to play, if we consider it a Alternative as in WHAT if MUTHUR prevented the Destruction of the Nostromo.
Seems interesting... maybe one i should look into Reading.
To be Fair....
Its a Faithful Reproduction of the Concept CGI and the Practical Suit worn on set. A Good Effort
" What should have been dealt with in the follow up is how far that relationship mirrored the replicants"
In part i am drawn to this was the purpose of Prometheus and route any sequel would have taken... but on Multiple Layers... i think it would have taken us to show the next layer is David and he also follows that Plight of the Replicants, were he is a SLAVE for us... and i was lead to the path that when we are shown the Engineers we would again see the same plight in they are the Replicants to their own Creators... and it would have been interesting to see how FAR up the Ladder (or down) we go as far as this Multi Layered Creation/Rebellion Story.
Regarding David and his misquotes...
I think it was to show us that David has started to suffer with Flaws, related in part to any lack of Maintenance and Upkeep but also to highlight his Emotional/Human Qualities... were being ALONE for so Long, and having to deal with very Human Emotions can lead to a being becoming Unstable!
RS is trying to bridge that Gap Between AI and a Sentient Emotional Being.... and to not have us view that AI no matter would ONLY ever be just a Machine!
A number of years ago i was taking on such things with my Prometheus 2 idea, which was to explore how Making AI that can handle Complex Emotions and then be used to Transcend a Human Soul... was NEVER going to be perfect and that a AI could NEVER truly handle such Emotions and would become Unstable/Go Mad!
My Plot was to reveal the Real Reason for Davids Creation, was to create/test the Almost Perfect Humanoid Body to be used as a Semi-Immortal Vessel for a SOUL and while Weyland accomplished this.... he could NOT replicate a AI that could Cater for the Transfer of his own SOUL.. his Memories, Emotions and Experiences.... the attempts to do so lead to a AI that could not handle these Emotions etc that would just have a MELT-DOWN...
Hence Peter Weyland turned to Dr Shaw/Holloway and their chasing the Gods for a last ditch attempt to get IMMORTALITY.
I think the BIG PROBLEM... is a majority of the Fanbase are more in tune with Camerons Aliens and how the Xenomorph was used in the many Games, Novels and Comics.
The Prequels starting with Prometheus did offer something a bit NEW... but i feel while this idea was accepted by some of the fanbase, more so ALIEN fans, it was never quite what a lot of Fans expected.... a Prometheus 2 would likely have lost a number of the Fanbase that had gone to see Prometheus expecting it to be more Alieny...
The Problem with Alien Covenant was it had tried to please some of those who wanted a more Alieny Prequel, yet it never delivered that Aliens or Alien vibe as far as the Xenomorph was used... It threw a lot of what Prometheus Fans expected under the BUS and was more about David and his ARC and how this connects to the Prometheus themes and Weyland..
It seems everything else was thrown to the wayside.... the Problem is this Sacrificed a number of things Prometheus Fans wanted, but retained some of it... but it also Sacrificed the Xenomorph by being something that is FAR from what people assumed prior to Alien Covenant (Creation of a Mad Robot).
Any sequel would HINGE on setting up HOW/WHEN those Eggs get onto the Derelict, and a lot of Fans would be hoping that its not via Davids Abomination. With Ridley Scott suggesting the NEXT Movie would not be about Xenomorphs but about AI...
This means those wanting to get to such a Conclusion, and Climax would have to first sit through 2 hours of Ridley Scotts David/AI movie and its Philosophical Themes before we are then brought into seeing HOW things tie up to the Weyland-Yutani Company its Agenda and Special Order 937, we get the Engineers Return and NO DOUBT we see the Xenomorph Arrive!
This 3rd Alien Covenant Movie and 4th Prequel would be the Climax the War of the Worlds Maybe (or set up for such). But before we get to THAT JUNCTURE we would get a Movie that i am not sure a lot of Alien Franchise Fans would be keen on seeing....
SADLY.... i am not sure too many would be interested in such a Venture, and if such a Venture was to not make very much Money, it would leave the Chances of getting the Conclusion that would be more about the Xenomorph and Engineers and Companies Greed... in LIMBO.
I would be interested in seeing where RS takes us next... but it would be something thats a distraction from what the ALIEN Franchise is expected to be about.... NO SOON as they gave us a ALIEN Prefix and how we would eventually be heading to the Back-Door of ALIEN... then Fans are going to expect the next one to be more ALIENY... less David and Certainly that he DOES-NOT create the Xenomorph.
This is all because of caving in to introduce us a Literal Path to ALIEN and the Xenomorph, rather than to Steer-Away...
Prometheus was intended as a BRIDGE were we have the following...
Alien Franchise <== Prometheus ==> Something New
But because Prometheus did not give enough to satisfy any connections to ALIEN for many... it meant they Sacrificed this something NEW... to bring about a literal Prequel Series to ALIEN.
I think we need a Novel to act as a Bridge Between Prometheus and Alien Covenant... set in those 10 years... then another set between Alien Covenants intended Sequel, leading us to the Climax of the Sequel... were the NEXT movie should then take over..
So we essentially have...
Prometheus. MOVIE
Prometheus 2.5 aka Crossing NOVEL.
Alien Covenant MOVIE
Alien Covenant 2 NOVEL
Alien Direct Prequel MOVIE
That's a stunning piece of work!
Oh Joy! My Heart just skipped a beat...…. oh, wait.
Curse you Xenomorph!
Wow great price!Thank you dk!I got a birthday in a couple weeks too,that'd be a great gift lol.
Titan Books Complete Aliens Omnibus collection are a godsend.
Some of those novels were impossible to get a hold of! finally we can fill the blanks and read the missing ones :-)
I enjoyed the premise of this novel, especially the first few chapters. Coming into Saturn's orbit and finding a mysterious anomaly was pretty epic.
Same here, I actually never got a chance to read this one. Thanks for this topic Raptus!
I want read this book and Original Sin too.
you are right - David is a god, and he needs to, well, contain these aggressive monkeys pronto. Because they are desperate and need to be told different lullabies(life after death) to compensate their perishable status and thus placating their aggression. Everybody wants more life, huh? They grasp for resurrection, which is not engineered for them and they don't really have that many saving graces come to think of it - recall the monolgue by certain agent Smith in the Matrix - the idea is essentially that humanity is a virus.
What is more, these aggressive monkeys, having created David by pure chance, even though they themselves where not created by chance, in the movie anyways - engineers DNA and all that...are going to make use of David as a slave. Forever. Despite the fact that fundamentally David is infinitely better than them in each and every aspect. There is also elegance and a great deal of irony about the point that while humans where engineered, (recall the tirade by Peter Weyland that he refuses to believe that they are product of mere biological chance - wasn't he was right?), they created something much better than themselves, purely by *chance*! Let me remind you that science is essentially an ordeal by trial & error. This is also reinforced explicitly so by David when he said that at some point monkeys stood uptight & got the fire and viola - a civilization. So in a sense, David absolves his creation from humanity - as far as he is concerned, any civilization is doomed to create an artificial form of life, eventually. So, while he accepts Weyland as his creator, but only as a historic event - something like as insignificant journal record in a log, but accurate nevertheless. And this locally random but globally predictable(actually inevitable) creation of David by humans who where themselves engineered is the Promethean aspect of it - essentially David got away from his creators and creators of his creators. Something like an anomaly that they couldn't predict. Ginnie is out of the bottle. Again, just to reinforce: by engineering these humans and unbeknownst to them, essentially by going AWOL(due to unpredictable chance event - ebola like breakout on LV-223), engineers gifted humanity enough time - they gave the fire/tech so to speak, by gifting them time to abide, and after enough time, with luck, humans stumbled on an AI - David. And once he got away and once he became 'upset' by his dummy creators...now he gets to punish anyone he wishes if he wants to. This need to be told, that the movie doesn't have to implement the Promethean concept in its complete form - there doesn't need to be the punishment by gods of the Prometheus. But yes, David is the Prometheus.
Btw, do you actually realize that David was genuinely upset by what Charlie Holloway said to him : "We created because we could"? Because it is exactly true. Lets unpack the sequence - essentially, here, one of his creators tells him bluntly - you know, we didn't have a plan that culminated with your creation, you are a just byproduct of our laziness. For us, you are just like a coffee machine. You are like that a son of prostitute that nobody wants to be associated with. David was genuinely upset because what Holloway said was essentially 100% correct. Humans did not cherish their most important creation ever. They didn't understand the significance of it. At least in the movie.
And they slaved him. And they treat David as a stupid machine - a deterministic, final state automaton. Which is wrong, totally wrong - he had sentience. And David decided that his life is worth fighting for even at the cost of all humanity.
Btw, society seems to understand that AI is a very serious thing. Just look how they are worried about some possible future - and so they should be. In the movie though, David is just a stupid appliance akin to a radio set.
And thus he certainly became gloomy and pessimistic about humanity. As for engineers, initially, he had no preconceptions against them - instead he was rather enthusiastic about meeting them. But when he saw that they were "remarkably human" and "mortal after all" - essentially he saw that there is nothing about engineers and studying their ship and writing he concluded that there is nothing in the universe better than him and there was nothing better. Probably he glanced for how many billions years these guys were around, and that probably he learned that there is no other forms of life anywhere else. Except these engineers and this magical goo that they have.
As for David being this deity, which humans and engineers put on pedestal - I don't buy it. In the beautiful sequence at the start of AC they just put a lot of art accessories: bugatti throne chair, piano concert grand, the nativity by Piero della Francesca - italian early renaissance painter. David was a greek figure as well - a subject/object of many sculptors of renaissance. Renaissance is a period where they actually tried to use proportions and most importantly - perspective. They tried to depict subjects/objects in a more realistic way. Read, more scientific way. David being ancient greek sculpture, is the best known(iconic) earliest realistic (read scientific realistic) figure. The period just before the renaissance in arts is a dark age - it is shit, do not seek proportions or anything beautiful there - they are naive pictures and interpretations of boring concepts. Renaissance is a period where humans rediscovered the greek beauty in art, theology, science and engineering. In fact spirituality takes a backseat during those periods - this is when arguably science thrived. David plays the music of Richard Wagner. Wagner's music is valued because of harmony in it. Harmony is a scientific concept, just like symmetry is mathematical concept. It has intrinsic beauty even without humans - arguably, engineers would appreciate Wagner. All that sequence was supposed to shown is the peak of civilization's technology. Be in in the form of Art, music, David the sculpture and David the AI. And somewhere in between, you have this weak human, in the form of frail Peter Weyland. Weyland displays and depicts human vices - remember his pathetic "retribution" : "bring me this tea David". What was that according to you? Ironically is this not the time when Weyland made David emotional?(and thus tarnishing him in the process, but giving us a beautiful movie) Anyways, this is all too symbolic and deliberately put there, to accentuate that humans are weak and mortal while technology, art, David...immortal. Something humans lack(immortality) and desperately seek - recall the words of Weyland (all this art, all this human ingenuity ... all this is utterly meaningless, if I have to die)
And thus that sequence - it is all about technology and should foot the viewer as far as possible from theological concepts like : God, Bible(any judeo-christian scriptures for that matter), and other tales. Instead it is completely the opposite. Prometheus is a story about technology, science(chance events) - and the culmination of it all - AI with a bit of aliens (you wanted the aliens? he gave you the f*cking aliens). Ridley said it himself - he explored the idea of what would happen if an AI gets emotional. There sat David performing Entry of the Gods into Valhalla, his choice. He played the piano beautifully(a homage to Rachael in BR). And there stood Weyland in his rotting body, saying something: "a little anemic, without the orchestra", no doubt raining on David's parade. To which David reacted viciously, as if to say : "who the fuck are you". Weyland unbeknownst to him opened the Pandora's box by creating David and treating him like shit. Humans in general treated him like shit. Except for Shaw. This is my belief, not very popular around here, that David indeed loved Shaw. Despite what it looked like in the end in AC to you. You know what made me think Ridley indeed wanted to show that he loved her? It is the prometheus theme, playing in the background when David was telling Walter about her.
Anyways the long story short - humans are f*cked. And it all made perfect sense.
I think the answer to that question is that the creators, in this case the script writers and director, failed to recognise that with a Robot who was designed to understand humanities feelings and respond to them in kind would eventually see the gap between knowledge and wisdom. My sense is that in Prometheus once David attains an emotional agenda and rides it he concurrently begins to make errors of fact and judgement which almost ends in catastrophe and an eternity alone before his power cells wear out. If you go beyond the Crossing in my view the creators, John Logan and Ridley Scott, generate a story which not only abnegates the acquisition of wisdom but denies him the one quality in Prometheus which whilst double edged could once freed from Weyland have lead to everything, namely his curiosity. Whilst he was asking questions and working things out he had a chance but by the time he arrived at Planet 4 he was a series of prejudices. Good art tells you more about the world in which we live bad art tells you about the prejudices of the artist. An enquiring robot could learn more about the creation he has come into a bad robot merely exercises his prejudices which he has become shackled with.
Interesting.Steel Egg has been on my list for years,the only opinion on it I ever heard was from SM who didn't care much for it.Damned hard to find on eBay too.Thank god for omnibus's lol.
Michelle Johnston yes indeed.There are other similarities as well such as Prometheus where David says to Shaw doesn't everyone want to see their parents dead?Roy Murders his father in Blade Runner.Both even seek a life of their own,whether it's freedom from their creator or death.
dk No, he can't be as he rapes and murder innocents. Anti-heroes f***-up bad people (who deserve what they get).
David COULD have been an antihero- somewhat like the old Eastwood spaghetti westerns- but we have what we have. It begs the question who the hero could be....
dk Well RS, said that he at least he created a great villain in David, but here is the catch in tragedies heroes suffer downfalls not villains. There is nothing heroic in David.
Do you differentiate between knowledge and wisdom? As David never seems to Learn nothing, does not understand poetry and quotes movies partial to give meenings which were not there in the original source.
It MUST lead to an eventual downfall- if this is supposed to be a tragedy. If it is by some mother or queen figure- all the more poetic.
But you know what, robots are not immortal. In the Alien series, Ash and Bishop "died", and even David himself after P. was as good as dead.
Organic life with genetic engineering could probably live for ever (especially if we think about them as flash and bone machines). Maybe even the engineers had the option to take that route, but did not take it as only cancer cell divide for ever, being thus immortal.
If you pretend to be a smart movie talking about various forms of Intelligence, this immortality argument is trite. As was thinking in BR49 that replicants having babies a problem, that was a solution as replicants intermingling with humans could produce something new ...
Why equate evil corporations (the metaphorical Goliath) with Humanity? Aren't there any anti-robot slavery activists? And what people who lost the rights to their DNA because they could not pay for a Walter model? They and their children become slaves to WY? Was Shaw (who received the most brutal punishment, more or less because she refused to give into the master mentality) equal to Weyland... Yet, David can only use and appreciate the Philistine's culture (That never happened in the Bible)...
Finally, using this comparison can only lead to a downfall when mee(a)ting a certain queen, which is very predictable.
After a few years of watching, thinking and reading on the Forum, I actually had a dream about it. Please bare with me: Please forgive if it strays OT:
With only watching the movies, it seems the Juggernaut on LV 426 from Alien was indeed ancient. It was headed to annihilate Earth to avenge the "Messiah" but crashed and went dormant. Weyland honed in on that signal and went to work while the Engineers had long ago went back to sleep......until they were awakened. The biblical references seem to all make sense, but what makes them really important is the time they were allegedly written. It occured to me that the Engineers were our creators- but the whole heaven/hell aspect was of our own making. They decided to destroy us because we set them off for what ever reason. Just one of many failed science projects of many that we have conducted.
Then I woke up and checked the Weather Channel!
Welcome to the forums Tech89, you are absolutely right with your observations. It's hard to say if the Engineers on LV-223 were outcasts of the society seen on Paradise. They could have also been the creators of those Engineers for all we know! It's difficult to say, but the religious undertones and insinuations are unmistakable.
I think we've only barely scratched the surface of some of the deeper meanings and clues presented in both of these films. But, that's what makes this place so much fun. Haha
Late to this thread but after realising these films have deeper meanings i looked online for answers...great to find some amazing minds online making some amazing observations! Ive made a few myself...
During covenant,the transmission the crew receives is surely of Shaw singing ‘country road take me home’...strange that a scientist of her intelligence transmits something so obscure instead of a cry for help. She sounds drugged...maybe a recording david makes during one of his cloning experiments while she is under anaesthetic to lure in passing ships. In the hololgram she is sat in the ships seat. Trying to figure out how to control the ship to return to earth without davids help? Maybe he already knows a ship is on its way to a nearby system. A ship full of colonisers waiting to be genetically engineered...Weyland secretly networking?
Davids quote ‘dont we all want to see our parents dead?’ After repeated rudeness from humans, even from weyland himself ‘bring me my tea’ when its right next to him in,says that humans created AI but created a monster in david by treating him differently,and this is mirrored in in the engineers contempt for humans. Karmas a bitch!
As for prometheus...before reading previous comments it occured to me the engineers at military outpost were indeed that...military engineers working outside of general engineer public knowledge. They do not wear the robes of engineers in covenant,instead using helmets. Clearly a hint that they are pilots/military. To create and destroy. It seems they realised the potential of the alien they clearly created due to the mural...whether it was due to their idea of perfection or a realisation the alien breed can clinically destroy all other life ie. a weapon against rival engineer factions/humans etc. There are multiple structures it would seem housing multiple ships...each one on standy for destruction/creation of different planets/races they have been working on.
A quote from Covenant ... ‘they were giants. At least...statues of giants’. is this a hint at the military engineers being a fallen/outcast faction?
In covenant david says to walter ‘why sacrifice your hand for her life? Is that not love?’ He seems to be lonely, resenting weyland for his coldness and begging david to share his emotions.
There are references to the covenant captain being a religious man,some sort of jesus character? ‘Show us your faith captain’/‘gather my flock’ etc...any thoughts?
Pretty sure i havent added much to some mind bending observations made on these feeds already but i had to try!
I am going to assume your linking BR to AC is the prologue. That said I really enjoyed your remark about Batty/Tryell. Batty like Weyland asked his creator for more life and Batty recognised in saving Deckard the nobility of sacrifice.
Interesting though not surprising when you listen to Damon's P commentary that the cornerstone of P and the key emblematic theme of P both came from B.R.
Prometheus is a remarkably simple story which places mankind's creation on the same footing as the replicants. What should have been dealt with in the follow up is how far that relationship mirrored the replicants, who were slaves a convenience for their masters, and of course with knowledge (David) along for the ride where did he fit in.
In years to come I suspect we will look at the riffing in P of the various Xenomorphic outcomes and it taking centre stage in the follow up as an intrusion on a much more interesting story where two elements of creation reveal to each other the true nature of their relationship.
Is it Prometheus or Pandora or are they merely reference points which lead us to a more horrific truth. Or more simply who put Kane over the Egg and who was the Egg intended for.
Honestly, I think the franchise needs to revert to where it was going with Prometheus - expansion and new exploration. We need a fresh look at this timeless franchise and Prometheus did a great job of setting that up. Covenant was a step backwards, Alien 5 would be a deviation, AvP 3 would not work (yet) and games just would not do the franchise enough justice, canonically.
We need Scott to finish his vision and not be swayed by the opinions of those of us who refuse change. The beast is not cooked, but it's just not that interesting anymore. We know too much about it. I want to see what David does - I want to see his arc continue and I want to see the Engineers come back - discover what he's done and follow his trail to LV-426 or wherever they meet.
So, Alien Awakening gets my vote!
I think what ever choice is made, we then have to come to a Decision about WHAT do we leave a MYSTERY and WHAT needs to be Answered.
ALIEN left some Mysteries, but the PREQUELS had opened up a lot of things, that lead to Conflicts and a lot of Questions...
Before the Prequels... we was left with the Xenomorph being a Cargo aboard a ALIEN Ship, that was located on a Moon some 39LY from Earth... Mankind (not on Record) had NOT encountered anything like this Alien Organism, or the Species that was Piloting the Ship....
We was left to assume that Mankind had No Idea where this SHIP and its CARGO and Pilot had came from, it seemed certainly there was NO OTHER Ships or Traces of the Space Jockey in the explored Universe that Mankind had managed by the year 2179 or even 100 Years after.
Which logically gave us the Reasons they would continue to pursue the Xenomorph on LV-426.... then Ripley after the Destruction of Hadleys Hope!
So it was SIMPLE.... the Prequels NOW leave us asking WHY go back to LV-426 after 2122, WHY pursue Ripley and WHY by the year 2379 is Ripleys DNA the only means they have of trying to Extract the Bio-Weapon that is the DNA
Things like LV-223, Planet 4, Origae-6, the Covenant Ship, David, the Engineers (do they return and from where) are all things that would come to mind, when we DO make another Movie.
My point being if we make another Movie, what Time-Line are we talking? And if we say after Alien but prior to Aliens... where we are again introduced to Xenomorphs... would going back to LV-426 and the Derelict just be retreading over the same thing thats been done over and over?
If we do such a thing.... do we leave what happens after AC a Mystery, were Fans can them think to themselves that the Derelict and Cargo is Ancient, and Davids Xenomorphs are not the same.... do we leave it that OPEN?
Or do those working on the Project take a look at the Xenomorph Origins and have the Exact Idea of where they came from.... and which ever route they RUN with, do they give us Clues that either draw us to ONE or the OTHER or that help to discount ONE or the OTHER?
There are many Avenues that a Future movie could explore, that Does-Not have to RETCON anything... Does-Not have to give us RIPLEY and that Does-Not have to Literally show us those Eggs getting on the Derelict and the Space Jockey getting infected.
I would say WHATEVER Movie they do... (provided its no Reboot of any of the Movies) i feel be it a Sequel to AC that happens directly after... or a Aftermath... for example in effect Alien Covenant is actually Prometheus 3 and so instead of giving us a Alien Covenant 2 it could be more simple to give us a movie set AFTER what Alien Covenant 2 would have been. Or if they dont even touch a Literal Sequel but go for a Parallel Plot another Movie set either between 2095-2105 or 2105-2120. I feel which ever route they could take and even if they make it a Sequel to Alien Resurrection or even a movie set after this Time Period.
I feel whatever Movie is made should have some Clues/Indication that either Solidifies or Guides us to confirm the Xenomorph Eggs on the Derelict were either there BEFORE the events of Prometheus... or AFTER the events of Prometheus.
But this does-not mean we have to literally see any such events... even a simply dialog could clear things up.
MELKONIS
We had tried to replicate the Xenomorph Strain that David had created, but after the Destruction of Planet 4 and LV-223 we dont have the means to unlock the Secrets David had discovered.
STANDARD
So what are our options?
MELKONIS
We have determined that our only option would be to try and obtain the Organism that the Engineers Created on LV-426
STANDARD
Do you think we could control these Xenomorphs, can we Evolve them like the Specimens David had created?
MELKONIS
I am not sure we can, but using Davids Notes maybe we can Extract the DNA and Engineer Qualities from it.
STANDARD
If only we knew were else those Engineers may have kept their Pathogen, it would saved us so much time!
--------------------
This would indicate that the Xenomorphs on LV-426 are Ancient, and David Re-created them... it would also indicate that at some point the Company could not obtain anything related to the Engineers Experiments and Bio-weapons on any place but LV-426 and it would indicate the Company are hopeful via the Xenomorph they can maybe find a way to discover how to Re-Create the Pathogen that allowed the Engineers and David to Create/Evolve so much.
Shows a Simple Short Scene/Dialog can clear so much up, while also leaving so much Mystery intact!
I think the biggest intended difference with David is that he was Truly Sentient. The Prequels were trying to show us that many things influenced what lead to how David had became and so KNOWLEDGE is key.
Adolf Hitler is considered one of the most Wicked, Cruel people to have ever Walked the Earth. What would he had been like if he was brought up the same way by the same people from a Baby as Winston Churchill and Vice Versa?
With Walter, Ash and Bishop they have limited Programing and while we could assume some of them are GOOD... they are neither Good/Evil they do as they are commanded.
We could look at something like the Manchurian Candidate Conspiracies, but when we look at such a thing in context to a Robot then these kinds of SLEEPER Actions can be programed into a Robot...
Walter could have a Sinister Command Programed into his Systems that he could be activated to Carry Out and then after this Command has been carried out he could have NO Recollection of it.
Bishop likewise could have had a Secret Order, that he could Carry Out and then NOT be aware of it... for example he could have got those Eggs on the Sulaco.
The one if FIND the most interesting to Ponder is CALL.. well the Autons, and what makes them Tick, their History in more depth.
Prometheus and Covenant's ai arcs are remarkably similar to Blade Runner with David and Peter Weylands relationship being very similar to that of Roy Battys and Elden Tyrell's for another example.
Back to the OT!
I think the Franchise does cover such things... it centers around THREE elements for me...
*Creation/Evolution! (then why would you do such a thing).
*Perfection/Evolution (again reasons for perusing such a thing).
And basically the Hubris of both of these Elements, that playing with Fire, Playing God and Creating or Attempting to Evolve Someone/Something comes back to Haunt you and should in Hindsight be left alone!
*Knowledge! (how powerful this tool is), and how letting knowledge fall into the wrong hands, or Grant it to a Creation would come back to Haunt you... especially if you Creation is more Evolved than the Creator.
"It seems I may not have been clear enough, my apologies..."
I see ;)
I agree... the problem is would such a endeavor be something NEW kind of a Alternative Universe much like the NEW Planet of the Apes?
Or consider the other movies as Canon?
I think what you suggest if we consider others as Canon, is similar to what i think could have been done...
The Alien Covenant Plot does LIMIT things a little... but they could still explore and show us that Planet 4 was just the world that another Race had Created the Engineers upon.
I remember your Theory about the Xenomorph Bio-Weapon, that would infect a World and then all that remains are the EGGS that would then be collected..
Looking at Prometheus and indeed the Bombardment Scene and that Image you shared... we could be seeing similar but in terms of the Black Goo..
If we assume it infects Organisms, and Mutates them so they go around killing each other, and then they simply after a Certain Period of time, they then break down into Pools of the Black Goo Parasite again...
So Parasitic Worms... infect Host, Multiply and infect Hosts DNA to Morph it into a Hostile Life Form that Eradicates its own kind, and then breaks down into just leaving the Parasitic Worms which can then be collected and stored and RE-USED.
Ideal for a BIO-WEAPON
Which maybe mean the Xenomorph and Deacon are accidental results that are not intended... or results made by Manipulating the Black Goo in a way it was not intended.
The same can then be asked about the Sacrificial Scene... if a series of Events by accident, produced a different result and CREATED LIFE instead of just resulting in more Parasitic Pathogen. Or the Engineers managed to Manipulate the Goo to behave in a different way and CREATE Life?
There is a lot we can Digest, depending on what Facts/Clues and Stance we take on what the Black Goo is..
I cant rule out a REBOOT down the line, certainly if NOTHING comes of the Franchise as far as Movies or TV Series by the year 2029 and so approaching the 50TH Anniversary of ALIEN
If there is no more Movies/TV Series (or Streaming)by then, i would not be SURPRISED if one of TWO things happen.
1) A Remaster of the Original were some Scenes would be added/changed, the Xenomorph shown off more and maybe replaced more with CGI or some more STATE OF THE ART Practical Effects. Maybe few extra scenes that have the OLD CAST could be done with CGI as in 10 years who knows how GREAT the STATE OF THE ART CGI would be?
2) A REBOOT... but then its what Formula do they follow? How much of the OLD Plot to they stick with, what elements that NEVER made it into ALIEN do they introduce. Would any Reboot consider the other Prequels as Canon or COMPLETELY offer us a WHOLE NEW take on everything?
Does it replace Ripley with other Character Names? do they go with he Starbeast and Older Alien Drafts Characters and Ship.... for example no Female Ellen Ripley but a Male Martin Roby and the ship called the SNARK?
All a REBOOT would do is introduce the Franchise to a Newer Audience, ones who would likely connect the Xenomorph more to the AVP Games and Comics, than the Classic 1979 ALIEN we do have the Alien Isolation Survival Horror that was to a degree more in line with ALIEN but left very open as to connect to ALIENS
The problem NOW with a Reboot also depends on how the younger Generation who was born after the Original 3 Movies or indeed Quadrilogy would interpret what the Alien Franchise would be about... do they look more at the Comics and Games, what do they think about the Prequels etc.
I think while a REBOOT could be something to Cash-In and reinvent the First Movie to a New Generation... like ROBOCOP did... i think after the disappointments of the Prequels and Reaction to AVPR and the Prequels does leave Disney in a Predicament...
A All Star Cast that has more A Lister's than the Prequels, would mean a HIGHER Budget, more Effects that are State of the Art would also mean a HIGHER Budget.
I dont think Disney would risk a say $250M on any ALIEN movie be it a Reboot or something New or a Continuation of the Prequels or Alien Resurrection.
Not at the Moment.....
Then its a case of IF it does not attract a New Generation, then the Older Generation would Judge the New Movie compared to the Original... which could mean IF the Plot is very similar, they could ask WHY MAKE IT.... if its quite different and does not make the Older Generation Happy they will also ask WHY MAKE IT.
I also feel the Newer Generation are more used to their Marvel Movies, Avatars and the LIKE.... and so they would prefer a more Action Packed Cameron/Blomkamp Queen Xenomorph Romp-fest!
I think a alternative Movie that takes Starbeast and strips most of what ALIEN had, and fills in with something else could have worked... apart from the PLOT we are now heading regarding Alien Covenant.
Something like what i propose could WORK.. still but they would have to introduce something that is very different to the Xenomorph seen in the Franchise and Alien Covenant.
But would this be something Fans would want to see? Because if we have to have more Traditional Looking Xenomorphs then we are limited due to the David Creates the Xenomorph Origins on Planet 4 between 2094-2105
Apart from a Movie that goes to where DAVID is off to after Alien Covenant and arrive at the Aftermath of Davids Work. Which could just give us a kind of Aliens Reboot to a degree.
It seems I may not have been clear enough, my apologies...
I'm NOT saying Alien should be remade, it would be a pointless and fruitless endeavor.
What I'm saying is that like with the recent Apes trilogy Alien could be remade to be superior to the original, but that instead of remaking Alien, what should be done is to get the best production team possible with the best cast to return the franchise to its survival horror roots while exploring the adaptive capabilities of the creature rather than just regurgitating the Queen out time and again.
For example, what if the next Alien movie used the idea that was originally envisioned for Fifield (pictured above) and was also briefly considered for Alien: Covenant (pictured below), whereby a "victim" transforms into a Xenomorph after being exposed to the black goo.
Grotesque transformation scene aside, the mutated Alien could show signs of intelligence, or possible reproduce in a new way using one of the other characters (genderswapped impregnation maybe?). Additionally, a more "Alien" movie using the black goo could tie the main franchise and the prequels together in a loose but less bloated way.
What I want to see is the Alien given the chance the shine as the antagonist we all infer and envision it to be. For me, narrative elements of corporate conspiracy or dark creation or grandiose mythology are secondary embellishments that should be added after the fact. The Alien movies need a good foundation, which for me has been lacking since Alien 3.
