It’s Not About The Alien, It’s About Family

Nice Article but i myself Totally Disagree 100% but its a matter of Personel Oppinion... and i can see how for some yes its about Ripley.... Ridley even came out and said that ALIEN is about Ripley... which then was a concern and now we have Ripley links in Covenant......  i guess its the same philosophy as with STAR WARS.... myself i felt that the New Movie was a disapointment... its plot was so predictable, there was goofy moments like Phantom Meanance... but for the Fan Boys as long as it had Storm Troopers... Luke, Leia and Solo and Chewie R2D2, C3PO and some links to Jedi and Dark Side then its what Fan Boys want.

My point is would Star Wars Force Awakens had done so well if there was no Solo, Chewie, Leia and Luke? and is it these elements that was missing from the Prequels that led them to not fair too well?

So i guess with Alien as long as there is some Xenomorphs, the movie would do ok but add Ripley and then its a Hit?

For me not so......

Ripley is in the context of the Universe just one Female who was rubbed up the wrong way and became Bad Ass but she is one of Billions of Humans in a time span of 50 years tops active service minus years in Cryo Sleep.

The Alien Franchise is about the Alien Xenomorphs... they was around for thousands of years before Ripley, (unless they are making a U-Turn on that) and there is always that chance.. they can be around for thousands of years after her....

The movies was about Ripley and the Xeno... but the basis for a prequel was not about Ripley, what she did before a becoming a Warrent Officer.. who her Parents or Grand Parents were.... NOPE! the basis for  any prequel would have to be.... in part  How did that Derelict get on LV-426 what and why was that Cargo on the ship for what reason.... Who was the Space Jockey and what connection did he have with the Xenomorph.

Expand on that we should look at the Space Jockey Race... why was they there, why did they have those Eggs?

Prometheus opened up and explored this to a extent... the end product was more about the Space Jockey Race... AKA Engineers but it did start to be about the Xeno too.... and it did show us there was more to the Xenomorph than those Eggs...  they was just one variety of related Bio-Weaponology that these Space Jockeys had... and it evolved the Space Jockey to be a Race who not only played a role in the creation of the Xenomorph but also many other horrors..... but also the creation of Mankind... and even more than that... the creation of many other Life Forms and Organisms not only in the Galaxy but maybe the Universe...

THATS PRETTY EPIC....

So for me and its just my Oppinion.... the Franchise... which now includes the Engineers/Space Jockey is about..

1st) Hierarchy of the Engineers: Who is above them and the concept of creation and why?

2nd) The Engineers what role do they play in the whole Universe? Their Technology!

3rd) The various creations they had played a roll in..!

4th) The Xenomorph and related Organisms and how and why?

5th) Mankind and Space Exploration! and Technology! Colonal Marines!

6th) The Androids and evolution of them!

7th) Finally Ripley..

What i am saying is when Sigourney Weaver  is in her 90's does the Franchise then END? is it Dead?  When she passes away does that mean no more Movies about Xenomorphs or Engineers can work?

The expanded universe and games and comics did not need Ripley?  Not all of them...

When Sigourney Weaver has gone, or is too old or does not want to appear.... what then for the Franchise on Screen.....

Reboots with Ripley played by other Actresses... movies in alternate timelines that have a younger Ripley or CGI Ripleys?

I think she has a role to play.. and i think if done right a Alien 5 and 6 could work.. but i think she would need to pass the Torch to someone else.

I agree with BigDave. I like the perspective of the article....But I don't think 'family' is the word I'd use...They were just a group of people who all had the same goal...Survive this nightmare and get home to their families! Remove the extreme situation(xeno's) and I doubt Ripley is gonna want to shack up with any jar head, or take custody of a little girl...let alone be within 100 yards of a synth.

I also disagree. The "family" element really only applies to ALIENS. Alien has more of an element of loneliness, isolation and mistrust. Ripley only seems to trust Dallas, where as Dallas doesn't trust anyone. Lambert only seems to be close to Kane. Brett and Parker seem like they feel isolated from the rest of the crew and Parker has a "us against them," attitude.

There is also no feeling of "family" in Alien 3. The only person Ripley trusts is the doctor and even that's questionable.

Though i don't think it's a "family" element which makes the ALIEN saga what it is, i do agree that it's one of the main elements that makes ALIENS so appealling to some.

I will agree and disagree with you there MonsterZero. I would argue the original crew of the Nostromo acted a lot like family. At least I got that sense from them. The lonliness only set in when members of that family disappeared. I think Aliens definitely added to that sense of family, but I would argue Alien had more of that family dynamic. Ripley and the rest of the crew were on a long haul together, they knew eachother and had real relationships, while in Aliens Ripley only developed relationships with the select few Marines in a short timeframe. 

@BigDave, I don't think the franchise needs Ripley, as we saw with Prometheus however, having her in Blomkamp's film, or even by reference in Alien: Covenant would only add to the draw for people to go see the film. It's a ploy to gain more interest as I don't see her iinvolvement playing any key role in the prequels - we know what happens with her. That again, is the problem with prequels - we know the ending and we know how that character develops later on, so whatever reference she may have in Alien: Covenant is relatviely pointless. In Blomkamp's film however, she would take on a new role, especially if they retcon 3 and 4. At least then there's room for new development, something we don't already know.

The podcast was
Brilliant. Nice to hear you
Chris. There is so much in
There to talk about.

Thank you !!

How does carrie henn know
That the alien 5 script is
Any good ?? And who's the
Guy that spoke to her ?? 

I understand the auther of the Podcast etc, refers to the Franchise as a family to him and the Movie Franchise will touch people in different ways....

So my response was maybe not in that context, mine was in regards to the Franchise being about Ripley, then Ripley and Hicks and Newt then Alien 5 continues with this Family, which is find but if felt the Franchise has more to it than that.

"however, having her in Blomkamp's film, or even by reference in Alien: Covenant would only add to the draw for people to go see the film"

Yes Chris it makes perfect sense from that point of view which is why i mentioned the Star Wars Force Awakens Element....  if they made the new movie following the same story however they had taken out Solo, Chewie and Leia.... and Luke... but still had Storm Troopers, the Falcon and C3P0 and R2D2 would it had done so good?

I think for Star Wars it was wise to bring them back and even if we see those Characters not appeaar much in the next 2 movies, having them to bring interest into the EP7 and introduce two new Characters to follow (Rey and Finn) will then allow them to pass the Torch to these and allow fans to care about them.... where as not having Solo, Luke, Leia and Chewbacca in could maybe have fans not quite care about those new Characters as much.

And so from a Alien Franchise point of view i think a Alien 5 and bringing Ripley back could work, Originally the concept work and comments showed us the movie would have taken place a few years after the events of Aliens... the Company gets its hands on a Engineers Ship, maybe the Derelict (so it was not destroyed after Aliens) or maybe from LV-223 and thus with any of these and Ripley it would mean somehow Alien 3 and Alien R have to be thrown out of Canon and people did not quite agree that those movies did the first two justice.   Alien 3 never had enough Aliens and some fans where bummed out about Ripleys death....  then years later about the way she was brought back.

So having a movie set a few years after Aliens makes sense, its a way to give the movie a more better sequel... but if the company get a Derelict/Juggernaught ship,  then not only could the company gain the Xeno, but also Engineer Tech and maybe having finally got a Xeno and Engineer Ship to study and study the DNA, and as Prometheus showed us David could translate Engineers Language, then there is a lot of information the Company could have....

This element however and especially if Alien 5 got the ship from LV-223, it could step on the toes of Prometheus 2 and 3 plans.. as far as Engineers, what becomes of LV-223 and Engineers Tech and the Origins of the Xeno.

So Logically the movie was on hold.... we get a new writter for Prometheus Sequel and things change....  Now Alien 5 seems to have a back ground story of being set 20+ years after Alien 5, this allows for a better explantion for how Ripley would have aged.. without having to use CGI overlay to make Sigourney look younger, and the new Plot seems to indicate Newt now makes a appearence and may actually have the Torch passed to her.

It makes sense thus to change Prometheus 2 a bit to be a bit more Alieny and maybe link to Ripley to cash in on the antisipation for Alien 5, as lets face it some fans was bummed because Prometheus did not explore the Space Jockey but mainly had no Xenos or explained how they came to be..... so Covenant could give us some of the above, then not have to worry about Alien 5 comming out and treading on the toes of the Alien Prequels.

So yes i agree Chris and Ridley even said Ripley is the Franchise and so i agree, that if Fox and Ridley feel Prometheus did not do as well as it could because it lacked those Answers to the Xeno and Space Jockey and that there was no Xenos...... then throwing in a movie that would show us these, and then act as a launch platform for Alien 5 to come out and have Ripley and Gang back and show us Engineer Tech and information without then treading on the Prometheus Franchise toes... it could lead a way for a Part 3 to Prometheus to then explore the Engineers with fans now interested in the Bad Ass Beings who created the Xeno and also who Ripley had used their Technology in Alien 5... it opens the door for more fans to then want to see a Part 3 sequel to Prometheus that would be able to explore the Engineers more... and also for a Alien 6 that could see Ripley pass the Torch to Newt or some other lead Character.

My point was that i feel the Franchise is bigger...... but once we have seen a Alien 5 and 6 with Ripley, and a set of Alien Sequels that explore the Xeno and give the Answers while covering the Engineers in part.... after this has all been done..

The door is then open to do a Alien 7 etc that has no Ripley, that could maybe introduce the Engineers or some of their other creations... or horrors from the use of the Engineers Black Goo.... it opens the door to do a Prometheus spin off Franchise that explores the Engineers and who ever is above them.

So while i think these above are the bigger elements... there is only small amount to time to Cash in on the Alien Hype and Ripley... as she (Sigourney ) is not getting younger..

I will listern to the Pod Cast in Full tomorrow and then i can comment more on that.

"How does carrie henn know That the alien 5 script is Any good "

I dont think they had quite a Final Draft, Blomkamp had ideas, at the time he was working on Chappie... he then sat down with Fox and Ridley and they had then fleshed out and change ideas, and Ridley was apointed Producer... they then was going to next work on a draft on these ideas......  But work seemed to be halted..

so maybe they have a Draft? or they have a Story Board and basic ideas of the Plot.... and i am sure this Plot has been pitched to Weaver, Henn and Biehn as to then see if they would be onboard.....   similar to how Ridley would have pitched the broad strokes of Prometheus 2 to Fassbender and Rappace... but that story could have changed a lot.

So i would assume Henn has heard the idea and if you would Full Plot Synopsis for the Alien 5 project as opposed to a full finished draft...... Micheal Biehn likewise had known about the plans too.... he was the one who leaked that the movie would NOW be set 20+ years after Aliens and that Newts would feature as a Grown Woman and that she would have the Torched passed onto her.... he also said that Alien: Covenant takes place on a different World but explores similar themes only its "set thousands of years before"  <=== VERY INTERESTING POINT

I listened to the full broadcast.....It was good. Nice to hear from Chris!

Didn't realize just how much Alien 5 is being looked forward to! I was of the opinion anything after Aliens is kinda' re-tread territory....I mean where can you go with this story!? It really was done to perfection in Aliens.

Alien 5

Ripley "Get behind me Newt! The aliens are coming!!"

Newt "Not this time grandma!" BLAM! BLAM!

Ripley "Newt you saved us!"

Newt "Affirmative!"

I'll watch Alien 5 But I'm worried it might be fan service. ...Of course I'll still love it....But watching Harrison Ford in TFA, I immediately thought of Sigourny Weaver in Alien 5.

@BigDave

Maybe Ridley is going to destroy LV-223 and Blomkamp needs to steal a juggernaut from it?

Well i was given supposed leaks to Prometheus 2 which while stuff Ridley later came out with and original release dates and shooting dates that came out after all added up... the sauce has no real information about Alien 5 only that it was trying to show somethings that would somewhat contradict Prometheus 2 and 3...  they however had not had no information on Alien 5. The same with Covenant, all they said was some elements are matching with what they found out but other are not (including link to Ripley) and they only had known that it seems some parts of the Draft finished in October 2014 could be going through some changes so that it does not clash with Alien 5 when they are to release that after...... which is maybe why Alien 5 is on Hold and Prometheus 2 gets a new Writter John Logan and we see a change in Alien 5's ideas...

So the only information i can gain from Alien 5 and Covenant is by peice together every bit of information and clue and look at timeframes of production information....... Here is what i have worked out.... which is only a interpretation of the information we had... and so by no means what is going on at all... just what i THINK is going on.

Alien 5, looked set to be set after Aliens but before Alien 3 in the timeline.... Blomkamp did say his movies however would not quite rule out Alien 3 or Alien Resurection.....  the only likely outcome would be that  if they was to use Alien 5 as a Bridge between Aliens and Alien 3 and thus at the end of Alien 5 we get back to Ripley and Hicks being on the Sulaco and maybe Alien 5 could explain how the Xeno Eggs got on the Sulaco...

This is one theory i had, but then we have to consider that Blomkamp had some other way to side step Alien 3 so that the end of Alien 5 does not lead to those movies, but how is he going to have it that is possible? Unless we see a Clone of Ripley or similar? Who knows...

But lets just ignore Alien 3 and Alien R regardless of if Alien 5 was to link to it, or ignore them.

Alien 5 seems to be set not to far beyond Aliens in 2179, it seems that the Company somehow gain a Engineer Ship, be that from LV-426 (Derelict) or LV-223, i would assume the Derelict as the Concept work it looked in bad shape and i am not sure Blomkamp would want to plan a Alien 5 that would step on the toes of Prometheus by going to LV-223 without knowing what Ridleys plans for LV-223 was... maybe the Ship could have come from LV-223 or even the one David and Shaw had... but i am sure Blomkamp would not follow such a path if he was serious about his idea being considered for a Green Light and then not trying to find out what Ridleys plans for Prometheus is...

But something Blomkamp had done, had contradicted with some ideas Ridley had planned for Prometheus 2 and 3 etc... what could it be?  Could it be how and what kind of Engineer Technology there is to optain from a Engineer ship and how this would work? Could it be how the Xeno Eggs or DNA could come to be? Black Goo, who knows.. but something was bugging Prometheus that had to be Changed and we shall come to that.. but for now it could be anything, it could be what happened to LV-223 and David but i doubt it....

Again its likely they recover the Derelict.... we see the Derelict in a Hanger of a base that seems to have Oriental Feel and another concept work shows a Xenomorph Queen with Oriental Plants in the background....  so they recover a Engineer ship... maybe the Derelict on LV-426 and they get hold of a Xeno Queen.

We see the company may also have got hold of different kind of Xenomorph, a different Egg, different Face Huger and we see a different Xenomorph with no Tail and that has a look similar to the Deacon yet a bit different... does this show us the Engineers ship had different kinds of Cargo Eggs?  Spaights draft claimed the Ship in that had different cargo holds each with a different variant of the Xenomorph....

Or did the company conduct experiments on Xeno DNA to create these new types of Xenomorph? Or did they come across the Back Goo that produced these new kinds of Xeno, if so how?  Did they actually recover something from LV-223 then?  is that why the new one looks like a Deacon? Or did they not go to LV-223 and recover anything related to the Deacon or the Deacon DNA (assumes that LV-223 Temple in Prometheus contains a different Xeno DNA strand and the Mural was a Deacon based DNA) but somehow something else had happened with the Derelict if we assume this is what they recovered instead that lead to more Deacon looking DNA?   Could any of the above be true and maybe what was bugging Prometheus 2?

We see Humans Controlling the Xenomorph with some Human Tech a Headset like VR on the Xenos heads and Humans with remote control so the company had managed to find a way to interface with the Xenomorph and use them in a remote controlled way.... could this had bugged Ridleys ideas? How did Mankind manage to figure a way to interface with the Xenomorph?

We see Ripley get involved, with Hicks they dont look many years older than in Aliens.... we see Ripley in what seems like she is captured by some Company Mercs who look Oriental, we also see some Humanoids in Jumpsuits (if i remember right) who seem to have no real Human detailed features, they infact look like Mannequins.  Bare in mind in  the Prometheus background information about Weyland Industries it is Weyland who Won a Lawsuit against Yutani for the exclusive use of a Patent that makes Synthetics Skin and Appearence more Human... that could explain it and indeed show us the company that is being used here is either Yutani or some other Oriental Company.

We see scenes of Ripley with explosives strapped to her, so she is either planning to destroy herself which seems odd, so she is either willing to Sacrifice herself to put a stop the Company and Xenomorph and Engineer Tech... but surely that wont prevent it?  so maybe she has something on her or they need her for something and the Bomb Vest is a way of save guarding her...  so that the company has to let her go, or give into her demands or she kills herself and this would prove a loss to the company... maybe its something she has, or some knowledge she has...?

We then see a shot of Ripley in a Space Jockey type suit that is actually very similar to one of the Prometheus Space Jockey suit concepts.... so Ripley manages to fuse herself with Engineer Tech.... could this be a part that is bumming Prometheus?  We can assume that via use of Engineer Tech/suits Ripley is able to Save the Day...

This is what i read into the concept work and comments...

so...

*Company (Oriental) manages to obtain a Engineer Craft... maybe the Derelict?

*Company manages to get hold of the Xenomorph and also a different kind, either onboard the ship or via experiments or Engineer Tech (Black Goo?).

*Company gets hold of Engineer Tech, and intends to use it. And they manage to find a way to control the Xenomorph.  Potential for Xeno vs Xeno Action....

*Company captures Ripley or indeed have her under Guard with the help of Androids.

* Ripley and Hicks manage to escape and then get hold of Engineer Technology and Ripley fuses with Engineer Bio-Mechanical Suit to take it to the company and Xenos..... yep common theme in Blomkamps Movies.

Yep sorry that was a big read guys... but its pretty much my take on Alien 5 well some parts we see, i have a expanded theory to flesh that out more than just points from the concept work... etc.

HOWEVER....

Alien 5 was on Hold..... Prometheus 2 given Green Light, and then we see a name Change and new Synopsis and new Re-write of the Plot... or spicing of a New Plot by John Logan...

However we get leaked information about Alien 5 from Micheal Biehn about Alien 5 at a time after Fox knew and made changes in regard to Prometheus Sequel now being a first part of a new Alien Prequel....

Micheal Biehn said that Alien 5 is now set 20+ years after Aliens, and it will see Ripley and Hicks Return but also Newt (who was not part of the old Alien 5 concept work) and that it seems that they are maybe setting up Newt who is in her 30s to become the one to take over after Ripley....

Biehn also said that Alien 5 and Alien: Covenant are set in similar theme but on different worlds and Alien:Covenant is set THOUSANDS of years prior to Aliens.

This seems that Prometheus 2 Paradise/Paradise Lost and Alien 5 Plots have been altered a bit so that both movies can maybe Gell together better and maybe even link?

So yes MonsterZero

There is potential to breath some life back into Alien Franchise if done right, Blomkamp had some good ideas... have Some Company Finally recover a Engineer ship be that another or the DERELICT, have them manage to obtain the Xenomorph and a Queen and experiment with it, and managed to figure a way to manipulate the DNA to produce a variation of Xenomorph... or find Engineer Bio-Tech or Black Goo to produce a new kind of Xeno or simply they have different kinds in different Cargo Holds on the Engineer Ships.

They manage to find a way to control the Xenomorph.... We will be shown a new company or Yutani and see different kind of Androids....   We explore the Engineer Ship/Derelict more and uncover Space Jockey suits and Tech the company attempts to use.

Ripley and Co are back to put a stop to this, and ultimately she uses Engineer Tech to save the day.

They are all ideas to explore... but its where does it go next?

A Potential Re-write after colaberation with Fox and Ridley to set the movie in the futher future some 20+ years would overcome the age of Sigorney and then have Newt play a role and maybe the one to take the reigns after Ripley.......this in-turn however leads us to a few problems....  how come it takes 20+ years for the company to get Engineer Ships or the Derelict... after Aliens did the company wait so long... before going back.... or before another company came by....

Or did they recover the Derelict but keep it on Ice for a long time... but surely the Company would want to exploit the Cargo and Engineer Tech ASP?   If the Derelict cant be recovered then is LV-223 the next place to go... but this would step on the toes of Promethues assuming Ridley would explain what becomes of LV-223 before the events of Alien and Aliens... as LV-223 makes us wonder why persue the Xeno in Alien and Aliens, when LV-223 has more rewards.... especially however after Alien 3 shows the companies only way to get the Xeno is via Ripley on Fiorina 161.. then after via clonning her DNA...

Why if LV-223 has related DNA and Engineer Tech?

This could be bypassed if LV-426 has nothing to be had after the destruction of Hadleys Hope... and if we are led that LV-223 has nothing to gain and thus must be destroyed to by 2179

where would this leave Engineer Tech and Xeno DNA?   in the year 2200+   Maybe the aftermath of Covenant?

This would be a way to bring in Xeno DNA and a Engineer ship in a timeline 20 years after Aliens where we are left asking what about LV-223 its now been 100+ years since Prometheus explored that Outpost... and why wait 20+ years to obtain the Derelict on LV-426.... Having both places Yield no Xeno and Engineer Tech by the time of After Aliens.. would be a good way to go... However the aftermath of Covenant and its sequels could be how the Company eventually get hold of a Engineer Ship....

Maybe this is why both Prometheus and Alien 5 look like they have had some changes to them both?

Maybe not?

@BigDave Wow!

Yeah that's a great idea! LV-223 can be destroyed and Lv-426 nuked and the derelict blown to smithereens. No loop holes...Nothing for the corps to get their hands on....UNTIL the crew of the Covenant return from the far edges of the galaxy....bringing deadly cargo! Just in time to be introduced into Ripleys timeline 2190-2200 ish.

There's a school of thinking that it doesn't matter how many people you have around you, you can still feel lonely and isolated. Some people feel like they're part of a family if they are in a group of people that they have spent a bit of time with, but if you don't trust those people, they are nothing more than aquantancies. That's the impression i get when i watch Alien.

MonsterZero

And yes this could work well if we (as we discused before) take into account that the SYTHETIC part of David in the Synopsis is putting the emphasis on the Synthetic part and also confirmed David would have a doppelganger.

If we go the route that there is another David but the word doppelganger does not usually mean another or actual genetic twin so much but someone else who is a look alike... or acts alike or looks like a Twin but from a different time in History or another part of the World.   If we assume this route than indeed it could imply that Fassbender may not play two Davids... well not two David 8 Androids... but maybe a non-sythetic look a like be this person also named David or not... and i think you sugested what if there was a David who the David 8 was modeled off?

David 1 was produced in 2025 if the look alike was around then and its on the Covenant, then maybe they could have set off on a FTL Ship in the 2030s this would explain how the Covenant would be expecting uncharted Paradise they are on a Long Journey to a Earth like World... so yes a 60-70 year journey would mean that on the same ship a return journey would bring them back around the events of Aliens.

Then if the look alike was who David 8 was based off then the FTL Ships of that decade would only match Prometheus (assume) and so it would be a 20-30 year journey.

But Regardless of that i do think that if Alien 5 is set 20 years after Aliens then having no means to obtain  Engineer Tech or Xenos from LV-223 and LV-426 would cover loop holes and then we have to ask where else can they get the Xeno Now?

And so from Paradise seems a good idea, a way that could lead to the company not getting a Engineer Ship untill many years after Aliens.... and also explain why Ripley could have put her Xeno kicking Boots up for 20 years.

I think it could work... and i think those two ideas above, would be what i would be considering if was to think of a way to re-write Prometheus 2 and Alien 5 to tie in.

Have only just got around to listening to the podcast and i really enjoyed it. Brilliant!

Was very good and I like it
long. 80 minutes should be
the minimum. I agree on the
family thing being more an
Aliens thing then in Alien.

Yes Oduodu, brilliant!