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Ultimate Plot holes/questions and answers debate thread

Prometheus Forum Topic

Engineering

MemberOvomorphJun 14, 201216018 Views361 Replies
********THIS THREAD IS A WORK IN PROGRESS******** These are truncated interpretations of forum members "plot holes" or unaswered questions along with answers and explainations from various members... 1)[u]Is sacrificing one of their kind really the best way they have to create life on earth in the beginning of the film?[/u] 2)[u]Why would Weyland spend so much money to fund a mission with no hard evidence that Shaw and Holloway's theories are correct?[/u] [b]He's a multi-quadrillionaire or mega-rich for that matter. Money is no object and immortality is his only desire.[/b] 3)[u]Why is Shaw portrayed as a Christian believer yet she forms a hypothesis that contradicts Christian beliefs?[/u] [b]In the film someone says that her beliefs are incorrect because the Engineers created humans. She answers with "Yes, but who made them?" She has her own beliefs that are obviously based in Christianity but every Christian does not believe or worship in the same way.[/b] 4)[u]Why was Weyland playing like he was dead and hiding in cryo besides plot reasons?[/u] [b]He was in cryo to preserve the short time he had to live. As far as why he hid it from the crew perhaps he's an eccentric multi-quadrillionaire who likes to mess with people's heads. Or, if the comany and share holders believe he's dead he could be doing it for some business reasons.[/b] 5)[u]Why is Vickers being Weyland's daughter kept a secret?[/u] [b]Vickers being Weyland's daughter is kept secret from the audience. Never in the film does it suggest that this fact is kept from the crew. She has a different last name but that doesn't mean that the last name was made up. Maybe a married name or she kept her mother's last name.[/b] 6)[u]Why does Vickers even go on the mission when it's against her best intrest in regards to taking over Weyland Industries? It's not in her best intrest if other "sharks" are on earth plotting to take over the company while she's on the mission.[/u] [b]For one Weyland is not dead so the company is still his. Also, Vickers obviously has daddy issues. Her father prefers a replicant to her. Her father is dying. She expresses that in her opinion the mission is a joke and will not be successful therefore she believes her father is going to die on the mission. She looks at the mission as her last chance to redeem herself or win her father's love away from David.[/b] 7)[u]Why does Weyland take the voyage instead of sending a probe and funding further medical research?[/u] [b]What medical research is going to uncover immortality?[/b] 8)[u]Why does Weyland think he can appreciate or understand immortality or the Engineers reasoning and capabilities when he himself states that his creatioin, David, cannot appreciate the immortality he has been given because he has no soul?[/u] [b]Again, he's an eccentric, multi-quadrillionaire. He created another lifeform. He also obviously thinks he is on equal footing with the gods or Engineers. He is incredibly self rightious. And, unlike David, he has a soul.[/b] 9)[u]Why does the crew rush into the temple instead of waiting for the pups to finish mapping?[/u] [b]They never go into any area of the pyramid that has not been mapped.[/b] 10)[u]Why would the crew remove their helmets when they admit that, though breathable, it could still be dangerous?[/u] [b]Once they find out it's breathable they never say anything about a chance of it still being dangerous. In fact, someone states that the air is, in fact, cleaner than earth's air.[/b] 11)[u]Why does David shine a flashlight at a hologram?[/u] [b]He's in a very dark place and has a flashlight in his hand. When most people are in the dark and hear or see something moving they usually will shine said flashlight in that direction.[/b] 12)[u]How does Fifield and Milburn get lost when Fifield is in charge of the pups?[/u] [b]The pup readout was loading to the display on the ship, Fifield had a piece of the equipment that showed them the readout however when he and Millburn decided to leave rather near their point of entry he had to leave the equipment with the crew who were staying so they could continue to find their way. Fifield and Millburn being men both think they can find their own way and don't bother contacting Janek for directions. Then the storm hits knocking out contact.[/b] 13)[u]Why are geologist Fifield and biologist Millburn not interested in the uber-important descoveries that the team make in the pyramid?[/u] [b]It's possible that they are too frightened to care about their careers at that point. Or better yet they are interested but are smart enough to hang back until the pyramid is found to be safe and without threat.[/b] 14)[u]Why is Millburn stupid enough to try to pet the hammerpeede?[/u] [b]Perhaps his inquisitive, biologist nature that was talked about being absent in question #36 has finally got the better of him. Also, Fifield had just showed him that he had marajuana in his resperator. This could explain why Fifield is super paranoid as well as why Millburn wants to pet the hammerpeede. Fifield is paranoid because he's stoned and Millburn is trying to show off in order to impress Fifield so he'll share the marajuana.[/b] 15)[u]How is human dna and engineer dna a match yet there are differences between them?[/u] 16)[u]Why doesn't the crew ask David to translate Engineer writing when they find out there's a contagion loose?[/u] [b]When they find out Holloway's infected is the first sign of a contagion. At this point they are in the pyramid and find Millburn's body and see that Fifield is missing. They also see the hammerpeede scuttle off which scares them as well. The sh*t has hit the fan at this point.They don't think about or have time to ask David to translate anything as they are trying to hurry and get to the Prometheus to help Holloway. Besides, David is off on his own mission at the orrey in the Juggernaut.[/b] 17)[u]Why does Janek go to have sex with Vickers?[/u] [b]Seriously??? All joking aside, Janek is the captain of the ship. He's not responsible for anything scientific which is what the mapping of the pyramid is. Also, at this point he has told Fifield and Millburn to hunker down and not bugger each other and all is quiet. Finally, at this point, there has been no threat. Just what he believes to be glitches with the pups.[/b] 18)[u]Why does nobody get angry at Janek for dereliction of duty?[/u] [b]See above answer.[/b] 19)[u]Why does David infect Holloway for no reason?[/u] [b]Before David infects Holloway he has a conversation with Weyland who is in cryo. When David leaves he comes upon Vickers lurking in the corridors. She askes David what Weyland said. "He said to try harder" he tells her. Weyland wants to find out what the "black goo" is capable of without being the guinea pig. Could it make him immortal? Could it make him morph into an alien? Could it give him the runs? He tells David to infect someone. David picks the person he likes the least of the crew. [/b] 20)[u]Why does infected Holloway act ok and return to the temple putting his girlfriend and crew in danger?[/u] [b]Holloway has no idea he's infected. He dosn't know what David did. All that happened before they left for the pyramid was what he saw in his eye in the mirror. He could have been thinking he was seeing things due to cryo or space travel or whatever. He didn't display any pain until they were in the ampule room and at that point he asked Shaw if what was going on was bad.[/b] 21)[u]How does David know what 3 months pregnant looks like in terms of an alien?[/u] [b]David tells Shaw she's 3 months pregnant BEFORE he tells her it's not human. He's telling her she's 3 months pregnant in terms of the size of a human fetus at 3 months. He knows they haven't been there for 3 months and that the alien fetus couldn't be that old as they hadn't been there 3 months.[/b] 22)[u]Why does David put Shaw to sleep when she asks him to take the alien fetus out?[/u] [b]First, putting Shaw to sleep and in cryo is the most rational actions he could take as the med-pod only works on males and they don't have the personel to do the procedure.[/b] 23)[u]Why does Shaw not mention David's behavior to anyone after the c-section?[/u] [b]Because his behavior was totally rational.[/b] 24)[u]Why is nobody, especially David,curious about what happened to Shaw and her baby after the c-section?[/u] [b]David trumped Shaw's pregnancy with the surviving Engineer. After he was found, anything else was secondary - which includes Shaw's baby. And David was the only one who SAW the fetus. I doubt he said much, of if he did, he was deliberately vague. Weyland's only concern was meeting his "maker", and since Shaw was obviously alive and coherent, why would Weyland even care? He was on borrowed time, only days to live - if that. He's not going to give a crap about what Shaw was up to.[/b] 25)[u]Why does Janek assume that LV-233 is an "experimental weapons depot" located far away from the Engineer's home world?[/u] [b]Janek explains this himself to Shaw in the film.[/b] 26)[u]If LV-233 is in fact an "experimental weapons depot" why would the Engineers give humans a map to it?[/u] 27)[u]Why is the ships control system started by a flute and controlled with buttons instead of being contolled by a flute OR buttons exclusively?[/u] [b]Do cars start up when you push the gas pedal or stereo buttons? No. They start with keys. The flute is the key the Engineers chose.[/b] 28)[u]Why does the awakened Engineer attack instead of finding out what's going on?[/u] [b]He has just been awakened early from a long sleep by inferior beings who he and his kind created and now want to destroy. These inferior beings have somehow found them and the rest of his beings on the ship are dead. He sees them somewhat of a threat. He has no idea what they know or what they're capable of. Not physically, he knows he can handle them physically. He's worried about what they know about the Juggernauts on the planet and their plan to destroy mankind.[/b] 29)[u]Why do Janek's co-pilots offer up their lives so readily?[/u] [b]First ands foremost the fact that the lifeboat can only sustain life for 2 years means they are going to die before anyone can rescue them anyway. Also, Janek seems to be a boss that they definitely look up to and they obviously respect him to the utmost. Plus, how often do you get a chance to save the entire planet instead of running like a coward?[/b] 30)[u]Why doesn't Vickers run sideways to avoid crash?[/u] 31)[u]Why does the Juggernaut fall straight down during the crash instead of at an angle?[/u] 32)[u]How does a rock hold the crashing Juggernaut up, saving Shaw's life?[/u] [b]If you look you can see that the part of the Juggernaut that lands where Shaw is is sloped inward which means the part of the ship that hit the rock was also lower to the ground when the ship hits. If the ship is sitting flat on flat ground that part of the ship would not be touching the ground.[/b] 33)[u]Why does the Engineer go after Shaw with bare hands when there are more Juggernauts?[/u] [b]See question #28.[/b] 34)[u]How does Shaw's baby grow so big in a confined area with no food source?[/u] [b]The trilobite fetus grew at an alarming rate while inside with what would seem to be little nutrition from Shaw as from the time she had intercourse and was impregnated to the time of the c-section she had not eaten anything. The trilobite just continues this trend after the c-section. Or perhaps the trilobite ate some of the crew members we didn't see much of.[/b] 35)[u]Why does Shaw head for the Engineer's home when she knows they want to destroy humans?[/u] [b]To get answers. She states this at the end of the film. She doesn't care the cost. In her mind she will get answers from the Engineers or die and meet her maker and get answers that way.[/b] 36)[u]How did Shaw manage to acomplish all the feats of strength and daring after a very painful c-section?[/u] [b]Shaw gives herself painkilling shots during the c-section as well as after. The combination of future surgical tools and techniques, the ability of future drugs to kill pain as well as good ol' adrenaline could have easily helped her along.[/b] 37)[u]How did the Trilobite survive the sterilization process?[/u] [b]The Trilobite does have some human DNA and perhaps the Pauling Med-pod's sterilization process is not calibrated for human/alien hybrid parasite trilobite.[/b] 38)[u]Why is the Prometheus no equipped with weapons to blow the Juggernaut up instead of having to fly into it?[/u] [b]Scientific expedition. Not an attack ship.[/b]
[IMG]http://i1161.photobucket.com/albums/q507/Engineering211/sig2.jpg[/IMG]

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ares
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Also, the paintings pointed to what looked a fairly general area if we are taling about space. Who knows how many planets, moons, etc. where located there. I think that one of the simpler explanations is that it may have very well been a bioweapons facility maybe not. However, the crew just got the location plain wrong and where unlucky in the fact that they assumed the most habital moon/planet was where they would find the engineers. They did find some engineers, but maybe not the engineers. I think we will find in a sequel that they stumbled upon the enemy. Considering this, I think it is also likely that the engineers may have not lost control of their bioweapons, and that they were either A. sabotoged (by spy working for different faction), B. under attack (by different faction), or C. they did lose control (and there is only one faction). I think knowing that they a spiritual beings, that it is probably the case not everyones ideologies are in line (just like earth). How many wars have been started over religion. This takes us back to why did the engineers create life in the beginning only to have them want to destroy or change it later. One, millenia may have passed prompting them to change their minds, but I do not think this is the case personally. Everybody is arguing over trivial stuff when I think this is the meat of any conversation concerning this film.
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TonyBFR
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Hi all, I just saw the movie today, and, although I liked it, it was also a disapointment, especially the Engineers being just big weird humans and not the elephant trunk beings we wanted... about the plot holes, some opinions and thoughts: 1) regarding the expedition and amateur-like behaviors: I guess the whole expedition was set up in a hurry, ASAP schedule. It seems Weiland was desperate because he knew his death was coming, and could accept it, was looking for any solution. So he saw this as his last/only chance, but had little time left and thus set it up as fast as he could. This would explain why things weren´t really planned ahead, it was really a desperate mission... 2) Engineers wanting to destroy Earth: really the most complicated hole, I guesse Scott wants to make the 2nd movie to explain this. What I think is that there was some kind of civil war between engineers a long time ago. Like, some of them wanted to create new life and new planets. And this could even have a religous point, which would explain the engineer killing himself to create new life. Just because they are more advanced technologically doesnt mean they cant be religious or even fanatical. Well, following this idea, at some point Engineers would begin to fight among themselves, some wanting to stop this and even destroy the created worlds. This would explain the behavior of the las Engineer, who just ingored the crew, getting rid of them ASAP and running to the pilot seat to start the ship. Its like he was on a mission, fanatically, and would do anything to finish it. Well, another point would be, then, why would the paints point to that terrible place. It could be that on the time these paintings were made with the influence of friendly visitors, the planet was a nice place, perhaps a religous center. But, later on, it became a major battleground, a place where the rebels would want to destroy... This would explain these major holes. Another thing I noticed: the engineer flies the ship, on the pilot seat, but survives the crash and dies later on in the other ship. But, in the original alien movie, a fossilized engineer is found in the ship, with his chest burst. Well, this can only mean the ship visited by ripley and crew is not the same ship on this movie....ok, since david says there were many ships, this could be possible, but can anyone can think of a different solution?
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TonyBFR
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oh, and reading some of the comments about david infecting the other guy, I see no plot hole here. He is a robot, but this doesnt mean he is obliged to follow any kind of rule on not hurting humans. Remeber, this is Aliens world, and here robots tend to put other commands before protecting humans. Its quite simple, wieland commands him to trey harder to find the creators or anything that could help him. David had studied the goo and probabily realized it would interact on other living species. Since he didnt like the archaeologist who was always reminding him he was just a robot, he would obviously test on him. And that is what he did, a test, following weilands orders of trying harder.
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ares
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@Tonybfr. It was not the same ship or moon for that matter. I think you are spot on about a war and religous zealots among the engineers. That was and still is my thought. However, there are two paintings dated after the event on LV-223 suggesting that it was neither a warning or that it was originally a good place in my opinion. I think it is more likely that the Prometheus crew just picked the wrong planet/moon to land on by the Godilocks method we hear so much about lately among current scientists, and that there is likely several engineer outposts and a home planet. I also think you are correct in assuming this can only be answered in a sequel as this is the only burning question I am left with about the film. See my previous posts.
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Nicky.the.hutt
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Note: It's LV-223, not 233. [u]26) If LV-[b]223[/b] is in fact an "experimental weapons depot" why would the Engineers give humans a map to it?[/u] The Prometheus has not explored the entire Zeta Reticuli system. The pyramids on LV-223 are initially setup as a temple to honor the engineers and their history, and as installations with potential of climate terraforming. In case the conditions on Earth become unlivable and the human race would be all that's left of the engineers, humans are to take over the probable extinction of their ancestors and the achievement of certain civilization goals such as space travel. The humans would need the technology as a boost to continue the lineage of terraforming planets. What went wrong is the evolution of the engineers to a bio-mechanical race who morally refuse the natural cycle of extinction and succession and use the black goo and the xenomorph DNA combined into a weapon of mass destruction to remain in control. The ampule room with the murals and the head became a tribunal where the "unclean" trigger a spread of death and destruction by chemical reaction (reference to Leviticus 22:3). The crew may have survived if they had kept their helmets on, recycled their gases and respected the climate in the room, and proven to be worthy of the engineers on site. But we know that things didn't go to well for them either so the Prometheus crew didn't have the right cards to play with from the beginning. There you go xD
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Zeta Aquilae
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[i]28)Why does the awakened Engineer attack instead of finding out what's going on?28)Why does the awakened Engineer attack instead of finding out what's going on?[/i] I don't find the answer satisfactory, it basically states [i]he[/i] felt threatened by the intruders. Unaware of what has happened, or how long he has been asleep he finds the target of the weapon of mass-destruction that he was to deploy have woken him from stasis. As member of an intelligent, highly developed race with a 3+ billion year old society, capable of performing experiments that stretch over billions of years I would expect a more rational reaction to the situation in which he finds himself. I would expect him to find out everything he can from them to estimate the real thread these 'victims' can pose, especially when sitting on top of a biological weapon of mass destruction that could threaten his own people. The real threat is not the threat to himself, but potentially) to his kind. He does not know how many of these humans there are, how many ships they might have or how well they might be armed. He does not know what happened to the other weapon caches. He does not know what has happened or why his kin have not come to rectify the situations, he's been asleep for far longer then intended, 10 years, 100 years, 10000? Now, we off course know that threat is non-existent, but he can not know that yet, for certain., and the most sensible course of action, imo, would be to determine the extend of this potential thread, not destroying his first source of information and then blindly launching his ship into an unknown universe.
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Engineering
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Just a heads up once again that the archive is "in progress" and while a lot of more interesting answers and questions have been brought up I am having a problem with the "edit post" function and can't make any updates to it. I'm waiting to find out from Bug Hunter/Chris if it can be fixed. If it can't I'm sure we can start the thread over and still have everyone's posts in it. As soon as this is all figured out I will edit and add quite a bit of questions and answers or speculations.
[IMG]http://i1161.photobucket.com/albums/q507/Engineering211/sig2.jpg[/IMG]
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markd4lyph
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There are many unanswered questions in Prometheus. However if you focus on several key elements that recur throughout, some answers may be available. Key Elements Creation of Human Life Exinction of Human Life Rise and Fall of Civilizations The Role of Religion. I think more needs to made of the cross pendant as a metaphor for the role of faith in defining our universe. One crew member stated that 300 years of Darwinism would be difficult to upend. So there is a series of juxtapositioned elements that point to a greater conflict behind the Engineers than we might think. The movie begins with a sacrificial and benificent engineer seeding human life into a fertile planet. It ends with a villanous and hostile engineer seeking to exterminate all human life. The hole in the plot here may only be because of our own assumption that this race of beings are of monolithic motivations and intent. However as we see from the reference to the rise and fall of civilizations within a race, i.e the mayns, egyptians, etc, there can be vastly differing Empires within the history of a race. Moreso we should expect there to be ferociously competing empires in a race at any time in history. Could the two engineers represent two sects within the race of Aliens? One that loves to give life and spread life, the other that hates all life except thier own and who engineers organisms for the purpose of exterminating what the Good engineers create. Note the different styles of ship. The life giver comes from a sleek and graceful craft that has symmetry. The other s literally a giant sickle cell filled with genetically engineered weopons. The good engineer comes from the sky and its shipbascends back. The bad engineer is buried in the lower parts of the earth like a type of devil in hell with its demons. It tries to rise and take over earth, but again it is a act of heroism conducted as a self sacrifice of three men (trinity) that saves the human race and brings the bad alien crashing back down. So it may be as borrowed from the ancient biblical narrative of a war in the heavens and man is the territory in dispute.
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Tokyokid
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Engineer breathing outside? We see two engineers, the sacrificial engineer and the bioengineered one at the end. The sacrificial engineer is basically naked and equipped with a loin cloth and a container of goo with a religious symbol on it, the tree of life, which is basically one person must die to create life. The bioengineer is basically like Weyland, an old dude, but with genetic modifications. Seriously, look at his neck in the production still. The dude has gills, and that shit is part of his neck and skin. So, I think his suit is basically some genetic engineering. The production designer called it a precious suit, not a pressure suit. Precious alludes to the person in the suit being important or worthy of protection. As far as oxygen goes, I still wonder how Shaw can make it to the skiff in one minute and thirty seconds while on foot. She starts with two mintues of oxygen and ends with thirty seconds remaining. She needs to ride the dune buggy thing to get back to the juggernaut, the place where's he started her oxygen trek. My guess, I couldn't walk that distance in that amount of time, and crawl from underneath the space ship. Still, this appears to be a stupid movie trick to move the plot along... Create a situation where Shaw has to get to the lifeboat in a hurry... Yea, great idea, lets shoot it. Never mind that Fifield and Milburn are sucking oxygen for six hours during the day and then spend the night in the temple sucking oxygen too. Shaw makes a trip to the temple, sees mr alien, runs, gets almost killed by the falling ship and is out of oxygen. It happens over at most a one or two hour period. If all you insightful haters can pick up on other plot holes, why dont you see this one? I saw gills and didn't worry to much about the engineer.
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hadster87
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How about this plothole.... 2000 yrs ago the Engineers were going to kill Earth. But something happened we dont know what and a bunch died, but a few made it to the ship's bridge and went to hypersleep. 2000 yrs later humans find them wake up the Engineer and he gets pissed, starts the ship to go to Earth and kill it. WHY THE FUCK didnt he just go ahead with it 2k yrs ago? Obviously the shipped worked and they implied thats what he was going to do, so why was he sleeping for so long? Why sleep for so long? THis movie was freakin terrible!
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Regular Parrot
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Question #26. Why have show a map to humans that is a Bioweapons Facility? Whilst I think 'getting the wroing moon' is plausible, I have an alternative theory. What if LV-223 is a test? The map is telling us the next step: go to LV-223. We get to LV-223 and find the black goo. If, as has been previously meniotned the black goo reacts to intention, and our intentons are corrupt - we are annhilated by the Xenomorph. On the other hand, if we are 'good' or 'peaceful/pure etc.' it is harmless to us and we discovr the ships and star maps to reach "Paradise". Just a theory. I was thinking about the Monoligh in 2001 and how it signalled the next step : from the moon to Jovian space. PS Loved the film. I think we are being critical becuase SRS and first mew SCi0Fi in 30 years. Sit back, enjoy!

Today I have been dedicated to post on as many topics as possible until I pass out from drinking too many beers. 

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Regular Parrot
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PS Wish I could type.

Today I have been dedicated to post on as many topics as possible until I pass out from drinking too many beers. 

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Stexem
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Answer to #15: While it's not made explicitly clear in the film, it's implied that human DNA and Engineer DNA aren't [i]exactly[/i] the same. Some time after analyzing the Engineer head, Elizabeth Shaw states, "Their genetic material predates ours. We come from them." This would mean that while Engineer and human DNA originate from the same genetic stock, they do maintain some differences.
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Stexem
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Possible answer to #26: Who says that the Engineers who had contact with early humanity were the very same who operated the base on LV-223, and that they didn't leave us the star maps as a warning rather than an invitation? Alternatively, it's possible that the Engineers didn't see the black goo as a weapon. Keep in mind, it apparently also has the ability to create life.
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protodevilin
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Simple answer to Question 15: All humans have basically similar DNA, yet we vary greatly in size, shape, color, physique, etc. If you subscribe to the notion that the environment influences biological development, then it's perfectly plausible that the Engineers (who are just very tall, pale, bald humans) lived on a world where being very tall, pale, and bald was biologically advantageous. Humans just developed in a slightly different direction due to the difference between Earth's environment and that of the Engineers' homeworld.
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Hyperdyne Systems 120/A2
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Hiya Can I just interject that there aren't any plot holes in [i]Alien[/i], IMHO. The three usually cited are that Kane would never have bent over the egg like that; that Brett was stupid to go wandering off alone looking for the cat; and that the chestburster could not have got that big without food or energy. To take these in sequence, Kane's action makes perfect sense if he is intellectually curious , if advanced life has never been found before, and if his helmet is made of some incredibly tough advanced material. All are plausible. Brett goes off looking for the cat because they have already searched that area of the ship. It is secure and free of the alien, which as far as they are expecting is perhaps the size of a rat. The chestburster grows to adult size because, based on its glassy metallic appearance and on the reagent properties of its acid blood, it is able to metabolize a lot more than just food. Glass is made from sand, after all, and it's on a mining ship. The other reason for the chestburster's growth is that it's a weapon, which needs to grow fast, and can be allowed to die fast. Its lack of alertness aboard the lifeboat suggest that by that point it is dying. It has a deliberately accelerated lifespan. The above is inference from watching the film. One might not agree with them but they are internally plausible and thus explain supposed plot holes in my favourite ever movie. As for Prometheus, well, 7/10. The idea that engineers made humans 35,000 years ago or more is difficult. DNA goes back further than that and has evolutionary history right here on Earth. For the engineers to have created people genetically almost identical to themselves, they'd have had to have originated elsewhere half a billion years ago; seeded Earth with DNA; then returned half a billion years later and introduced their own DNA into a world teeming with life. They'd also have had to introduce their own antecedents into the fossil record otherwise human DNA would look utterly different to everything else, when it is in fact pretty similar to everything else.
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David OBrien
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After reading all seven pages all I have to say is the director's cut bluray should be about 5 hours long with all the things I've read on the net and here that didn't make it into the theatrical release. Maybe that will clear up a lot of these "plot holes"
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RSAND
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protodevilin that's a GREAT conclusion. Paleontology says that all of Humanity started on the East Coast of Africa. Our physical differences are the result of migration through the eons and our adaptation to Earth's varying climates. Hence, we are ALL Human yet look different.
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RSAND
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@David OBrien Have a look here also: http://io9.com/5917448/all-of-your-lingering-prometheus-questions-answered
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Vitor
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Hello everyone, I have a question. I've been searching a lot for answers since I watched the film last weekend, but I just can't understand one thing. We all know that to be born an Alien, must have an egg and after that, a Facehugger. And this Facehugger would find a host. And then there is a Chestburters who later will become a Adult (Alien). Why, suddenly, an alien would come out of the Engineer body at the end of the movie ? It doesn't make any sense to me. It would be another kind of Xenomorph ?
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Calpamos
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#26: The opening scene shows that this is a race that believes in self-sacrifice. The goo in this scene was constructed for peaceful purposes. This is key: The robed engineer is serene, peaceful, and willfully giving, meditating somewhat before and after ingesting. These are the engineers who seeded the invitation to the temples. I think it's key to understanding that there were no new maps for several thousand years. The invitation was cut off. SOMETHING happened on LV 223. There MUST have been 2 factions, and I'll tell you why. We didn't see what they were running from. These beings were smart enough not to make a mistake with the goo after thousands and thousands of years handling it. But something happened, some condition in all the temples. Think about this one too: No one was there to greet them. Why weren't they? Either another faction stopped them from achieving their goal or there was a mistake. Why didn't they carry out the mission after this facility was destroyed? Why didn't they return to clean it up? Because it was left on purpose. Perhaps both factions reached an agreement that they would leave it after fighting about which side was right about us. I agree that with the poster who insisted that this was a test. When the engineer awoke, he did not seem angry at first. He was puzzled, trying to understand our intentions. After David pissed him off by accidentally saying "I like pie" in Space Jockey, The Jockey realizes at this point I think, their side was right. This is a selfish race who has reached the stars, time to start over before they are our undoing. Also, I think the goo we see in the temple was weaponized with the intended purpose of creating the xenomorph by the faction that hated us. I think it was modified by the other faction. It could be that these temples were here for another reason: To terraform the planet as a present for us for reaching it. It could be the reason why the climate was close to being hospitable for us, but not quite. The brood between factions stopped the process, the terraforming goo weaponized. I could be wrong, but them not being there and leaving dangerous things there for a millenia untouched kind of makes sense. What an awesome movie! I can't believe people hate this thing.
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Solott55
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I think No. 15 (why humans and Engineers appear different in spite if identical DNA) can be explained by environmental influences on how the genes are expressed. Different gravity, atmosphere, etc. would all have an effect on how something developed, regardless of the DNA being identical. Skin color and size are the main differences between us and those are pretty superficial variations at a genetic level.
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stippidoo
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Here's my theory, its been out there but I have a few more. http://stippidoo.wordpress.com/2012/06/20/prometheus-hollywood-evolves/
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Seraphimal
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Hey, new here. Several personal problems with this movie, but one of my biggest problems with this movie was the seemingly random effects the genetic black goo seemed to possess under varying circumstances. It makes the long-deceased space jockey's head explode when it is stimulated with electricity. It makes worms turn into monstrous snakes which slide down your throat for seemingly no apparent ultimate reason. It creates a squid when it rides on sperm and interacts with human ovum. Appears to be turning Holloway into a zombie, but we never see the arc of these developments, so I don't really know. And it makes Fifield turn into a random superhuman zombie. (Which was probably the most cringe-worthy moment in the entire movie for me, kind of disappointing to see space zombies used when the horror-concepts involved in the first Alien were so ingenious. And why wouldn't Fifield just be dead?). So it will make a human turn into a super-zombie and a space jockey's head explode? Or was the explosion just because of the stimulation device used? What was the black goo on the head of the infected space jockey significant of, and why didn't that space jockey just turn into a cheesy super-zombie? I'm sure someone already has theories for this but why all of these disparate effects?
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RSAND
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Once again, many thanks should go to Engineering for starting this thought provoking thread. Well done.
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savior
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I would love to read through all 7 pages, but I simply don't have the time... so my apologies if this has already been addressed but not added to the original post. During Vickers' conversation with her father, she mentions not wanting to be back on Earth fighting over who actually is in control of the company. I took this to mean that the fight for control was between a very much alive and vital Vickers, and a very much frozen and inactive Weyland (or his representatives, more specifically). I did not take this to mean there are other people/entities back on Earth jockeying for control of Weyland Corp. Perhaps I'm overlooking something, though... I've only seen the film once (yesterday). Opinions welcome.
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Engineer Monk
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This is my theory over the back story of what happened on LV-223 [i]The Engineer Monks vs. Engineer Warriors[/i] All engineers were part of a peaceful society. A "religious" group of engineer monks "seeded" life through out the universe/galaxies through self-sacrifice and the use of the black goo. The engineer monks had exclusive control of the black goo for good purposes. They had learned to extract it from the domestication of the xenomorphs. The engineer monks lived in temples all across the universe like LV-223. The engineer monks monitored the development of the human race, and showed the humans where their temples were located (aka paintings) At some point, another empire arose from the Engineer society, one that was evil and bent on destruction of the universe. This warrior faction wanted and needed the power of the black goo for evil purposes. They hunted and sacked all engineer monk temples. They chose to use the black goo for bio-weapons for destruction and bio-technology upgrades (aka the precious suit). As for LV-223, this was a temple that was attacked by a group of warrior engineers that were looking for the black goo. The first holograms activated by David show a groups of engineers in suits running toward the ampule room which is being locked down, hence why one engineer was beheaded. A likely scenario, is that the engineer monks at the temple fought back or may have performed some self-sacrifice by unleashing the black goo on their attackers. This resulted in the death of many warrior engineers. Although the warriors were successful, only a few remained. They stocked piled their weapons and left the ampule room as a trap. The ampule room looks to have been a booby trap for anyone who tinkered into the temple. The remaining warrior engineers began preparations to leave for earth, but before take-off the black goo has infected and kills all but one engineer warrior who is already in a hyper-sleep chamber. Hence, the ship never takes off for earth. The lone engineer in cryo-sleep aboard the juggernaut is the sole survivor of the ordeal, when he is awakened he is naturally surprised to see the humans but then remembers his mission of destruction. Making more assumptions: it's possible that engineer monks have been wiped out or that there some sort of truce between the monk and warrior factions of the Engineer society.
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CBT1979
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I might have the answer for question No. 26: The engineers came first when there was no living beings in terms of animals maybe. Maybe life was already on earth but only low levels like bacteria, planctons and some plants, but no fishes, animals and humanoids. Then when the first man evolved (stone age), the engineers visited Earth again and showed them the star map for the first time. thousands of years later and later they kept on visiting mankind. I assume that the engineers showed them the 5 stars constellation as an invitation: by the time you are ready to reach for us, come to our place. By the year around 0 A.D. however, something happened that made the engineers changed their mind. Either was one of their messengers killed by the humans or the engineers were not satisfied with our evolution and also violent human history (full of wars and genocides). I also want to imply that LV-223 was not always an installation for experiments and bio weapon development. Maybe it was changed into it after they made their decision to infect earth's living beings with the black goo and transforming them into other species (Xenomorph etc.).
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CBT1979
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my cents to question No.34: in ALIEN, our chestburster also grew into an adult Xenomorph within a few hours. So I don't know why people are questioning the size of the Trilobite from Prometheus but not the adult Xenomorph in ALIEN.
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KGator
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There may be a good explanation one can construct for question #21 but THIS . . . . ain't it. [b]David tells Shaw she's 3 months pregnant BEFORE he tells her it's not human. He's telling her she's 3 months pregnant in terms of the size of a human fetus at 3 months. He knows they haven't been there for 3 months and that the alien fetus couldn't be that old as they hadn't been there 3 months[/b]. So David tells Shaw she is 3 months pregnant. Well we know its not a measure of time right? I mean she just got out of stasis 2 days ago from a 2 1/2 year hypersleep. I doubt David was monitering her vitals and even peering into her dreams without being able to detect she was pregnant (and we know she was barren). So he must have said this to impart an idea of the size of the creature. So your synopsis is that what he was trying to say is: "You are pregnant with an alien baby that is the equivalent size of 3 months development of a human embryo." Really? Seriously? David the pre-programmed android who can speak multiple languages got confused how to convey these facts clearly and concisely in English and just 'muddled it up a bit'? That's funny. But as for question #26. If LV-233 wasn't an experimental weapons depot but rather a terraforming/genetic development outpost then maybe you could argue the engineers were simply telling the humans where to meet their makers. Then at a later date the engineers changed their mind about their human creations and used the outpost to develop an aggressive genetically altering substance which the were going to use to reform the earth and its current organic population to something completely different. Thus the original intent was to show humans where their creators were from. However as the mission of the creators changed it ended up showing the location where the element intended to destroy the earth was also developed. I mean for a "military weapons installation" that base seemed awfully short of actual "weapons". I mean did we ever see the engineers have any weapons at all? Nothing when running in the holograms, nothing found nor seen around the structures . . . hell even the last engineer embarked on his killing spree with his bare hands. You would think a military or militaristic installation would have other sorts of weapons and defense measures on hand. I didn't see any.
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asphaltpilot
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@ DrakeEquation's comment: "The DNA of the alien Engineers is apparently a perfect match for human DNA, despite the fact that they’re like 8-feet tall with grey skin, no body hair, and completely black eyes. Just how this could actually be true so many millions of years later remains a puzzle for the viewer." Humans and bananas share about 60% of the same DNA. I don't see why the human/engineer connection wouldn't be plausible.
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WeWereSoWrong
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I'd like to take a stab at # 15! "15)How is human dna and engineer dna a match yet there are differences between them?" The Sacrificial Engineer at the beginning of the film presumably gave way to human life. It is known the engineers are [i]much[/i] older than ourselves, and as such, are probably much more evolutionarily advanced. Perhaps humans, if given enough time, will naturally evolve into engineers? I don't think this theory is a [i]perfect[/i] fit because if we have the exact same DNA then we should look the exact same, yes? Then again, humans and chimps are damn near close yet look very recognizably different. If engineer and human dna are only different by extremely miniscule amounts, then the differences visualized aren't too unreasonable. --Also, this is my first post! Hurray, I've finally joined the discussion!
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WeWereSoWrong
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I spose I'll take a stab at Numero Uno as well! "1)Is sacrificing one of their kind really the best way they have to create life on earth in the beginning of the film?" Religion and spirituality is obviously a theme within "Prometheus". Perhaps sacrificing ones self to give way to new life is considered a great honor? The engineers are noticeably extremely technologically advanced and bio-mechanics has always been a huge part of the [i]Alien[/i] universe. Perhaps their passion and willingness to sacrifice themselves for science (which is also seen in our Prometheus' crew--at least, to an extent) is in indirect support of that living-nonliving coalescence. Or maybe whoever ran that mother ship was pissed at the guy? We never see the mother ship again, just like we never see the space jockey again after the beginning of [i]Alien[/i]. That mother ship probably holds a lot of answers. (As well as more questions. :O ) A pseudo-scientific explanation is maybe because the engineers intended for humans to visit them one day they needed to be sure the humans would be able to survive on their world. Perhaps completely dissolving themselves with the black goo is the only way to ensure humans grow up with the proper immunities to natural contagions on LV-223? I say this because if the goo completely dissolved the engineer, it dissolved all of the microorganisms within him as well. I realize this probably has many problems associated with it, which is why I said "pseudo-science".
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Veridicus
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1. [i][u]Is sacrificing one of their kind really the best way they have to create life on earth in the beginning of the film?[/u][/i] I agree with 'WeWereSoWrong' in choosing to believe that the Sacrifice Engineer was sacrificed for [i][b]religious[/b][/i] reasons. The reality is that the Engineers could simply dump their ship's septic system onto primitive earth to 'seed' DNA there. The entire movie is Riddled with religious/mythological motifs and sacrifice is part and parcel religious in nature. There is no logical cohesive scientific materialistic atheistic reason to sacrifice oneself like the Sacrifice Engineer does, ergo I suggest it is spiritual/religious in nature. The newer photos of 8 or 9 "Elder Engineers" observing the Sacrifice Engineer makes it look even more like a religious rite. Besides fitting into ancient human paintings as god-like figures and their alacrity for creating new life, LV-223 is described as having a "Temple" with "Tombs", "Murals", and sculpture-work...all evidence of a civilization concerned with more than simple technological materialistic advancement. Somehow, I would guess the Xenomorph fits into the religious persuasion of the Engineers. 2. [u][i]Why would Weyland spend so much money to fund a mission with no hard evidence that Shaw and Holloway's theories are correct?[/i][/u] Simple: Weyland has unlimited funds, but only limited life. I would spend all the money in the world on the chance of not dying. The alternative is death and his money won't do him any good when he's dead. 3.[i][u]Why is Shaw portrayed as a Christian believer yet she forms a hypothesis that contradicts Christian beliefs?[/u][/i] In my opinion, the writers of this show are clearly not religious. The dream sequence between the 6 year old Shaw and her father was ridiculous...I do not know many religious people who have wait until their kid is 5 or 6 years old to first explain the concept of 'heaven' to them...the young Shaw acts as though her father has never discussed religion at all with her. If they were trying to present Shaw as some sort of strong Christian character, they failed. In reality, Shaw comes across more as a theophilosophical Deist. She likely sees the need for a "first mover" or an "unobserved observer" (or whatever) and also sees the serendipitous similarities in her studies of primitive cultures which point to a larger creative Source of shared human experience. She likely only wears the cross because it reminds her of her father and she is a genuine Deist, not because it represents even a nominal adherence to a Christian creed. 4./5.[i][u]Why was Weyland playing like he was dead and hiding in cryo besides plot reasons? Why is Vickers being Weyland's daughter kept a secret?[/u][/i] I think this may have really just been a silly plot device to force a sense of drama and surprise. Just like the Vickers' paternity reveal later in the movie. Maybe it's because he is an extremely eccentric old man and she's unnecessarily brusque & guarded except with the ship's captain. Her last name being Vickers is silly...even if she is or was previously married, she doesn't strike me as the type of woman who would take her spouse's name...besides, she wants to as securely as possible lay her claim to Weyland Industries, so the name change again seems silly. I have read no satisfying answers. 9./10./20. [i][u]Why does the crew rush into the temple instead of waiting for the pups to finish mapping? Why would the crew remove their helmets when they admit that, though breathable, it could still be dangerous? Why does infected Holloway act ok and return to the temple putting his girlfriend and crew in danger?[/u][/i] Holloway's unbelievable hubris x3 (It's Christmas and I want to open my presents"; "I'm not wearing this thing Ellie"; "I'm fine"...oh wait, I lied, "Tell me what you see, Ellie!!"). 15. [i][u]How is human dna and engineer dna a match yet there are differences between them?[/u][/i] That the two genomes are 'an exact match' separated ostensibly by millions of years of evolution (random variation and selection) is ridiculous pseudoscience that I accept in willing disbelief so as to enjoy the film. After accepting that the two genomes are an exact match, that the Engineers and Humans look totally different is completely scientifically acceptable and verisimilitudinous. Two points: 1) Not all genes are activated in any or every cell of an organism, and 2) different organisms and different cells within an organism express genes to a greater or lesser degree. Epigenetics ('beyond genetics') is an entire scientific field looking at how additions of methyl-groups and acetyl-groups, etc., alter gene expression and dosing. I mean seriously people, every cell in the human body has the EXACT same DNA (excepting red and white blood cells...), yet there are neurons and liver cells and skin cells and cardiac muscle cells and sperm and ciliated respiratory cells all in the same human. Different expression of the same genes could easily produce an Engineer...or I suppose to keep the chicken before the egg I should say that it could easily produce a human physiology and anatomy from Engineer DNA. 16. [i][u]Why doesn't the crew ask David to translate Engineer writing when they find out there's a contagion loose?[/u][/i] This really frustrated me in viewing the movie. Imagine Daniel Jackson (SG1, anyone?) reading everything but never sharing it with the rest of the team or the audience. Or if Gandalf stood outside the stone door of Moria and kept guessing but never told the rest of the Fellowship what the riddle said. It is pretty likely that David knows what everything he reads actually says. A simple and effective plot device for bringing the audience up to speed without being Matrix Architect like preachy about it would be to have him occasionally translate what he's reading, even if just under his breath. I am unsure why Ridley Scott didn't have David explain anything. 21. [i][u]How does David know what 3 months pregnant looks like in terms of an alien?[/u][/i] The human uterus expands to accommodate a growing human fetus. Based upon the size of the uterus on the preliminary abdominal scan, it appeared she was 3months gestation. Simple as that. His first comments were in regard to the uterine size. 23./24. [i][u]Why does Shaw not mention David's behavior to anyone after the c-section? Why is nobody, especially David,curious about what happened to Shaw and her baby after the c-section?[/u][/i] This just seems like another genuine plot hole to me. Shaw stormed into Vickers' private quarters and used her surgery device and left (presumably) dead alien in the room. Then she left a trail of blood and collapses in front of Weyland. No one seems to care what happened to her, including the ship's captain when he's later talking to her before she returns to the Temple with Weyland. I mean, sure, I can imagine that behind the scenes she tells everyone what happened and assures them that Cuddles is dead. If I was the captain, I would be in there boxing the dead Cuddles like a dead gerbil and throwing it out of my ship for good measure. 26. [i][u]If LV-223 is in fact an "experimental weapons depot" why would the Engineers give humans a map to it?[/u][/i] No reason to speculate about warring 'factions' of Engineers and other unfounded presumptions. It IS reasonable perhaps to assume that LV-223 was not a military base 35,000 years ago when the cave paintings were drawn. There is a time lapse between 35,000 years ago and 2,000 years ago to which the audience is not privy. 28. [u][i]Why does the awakened Engineer attack instead of finding out what's going on?[/i][/u] It makes sense to me that the Engineer which David awakens may have actually gone into stasis BEFORE it hit the fan on LV-223. It might be stochasticity which explains why the other three stasis chambers show chest-bursted Engineers...they may have been infected by Hammerpedes while in stasis or perhaps were infected by miniscule amounts of black goo like Holloway and were also unaware of it when they went into stasis. The Engineer David sees walking around the Orrery do not seem overly rushed or stressed for their lives. In any case, the suited Engineer which wakes up decides to kill first and ask questions later to the small cadre of gun-toting violent-to-their-own-kind humans. The Engineer's demeanor is calm and reasonable until after he sees men yelling and brutalizing one of their females and having a synthetic do their talking. 30. [u][i]Why doesn't Vickers run sideways to avoid crash?[/i][/u] There is no rational reason why she did not strafe sideways. I mean even Dash Rendar could strafe in the old N64 game "Shadows of the Empire." Either 1) the writers did not think we would notice Vickers and have a problem with it (even though this is precisely how they write Shaw surviving), or 2) we are just supposed to accept that a 900ft long rolling spaceship of death doesn't elicit rational flight or fight responses. One thing is for sure: Vickers looks like an irrational idiot crawling headlong and dies an ignominious death. 31. [i][u]Why does the Juggernaut fall straight down during the crash instead of at an angle?[/u][/i] We have no idea how the propulsion system on the Juggernaut works, thus speculating about how it would fall during a mid-air collision is useless. For all we know it's propulsion system allowed it to fall straight down rather than arcing as Newtonian physics would suggest. Newtonian physics doesn't suggest that thing should be flying in the first place. 34. [i][u]How does Shaw's baby grow so big in a confined area with no food source?[/u][/i] Not a problem for me as all the Xenomorphs have done it.
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Nasr
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I have two major questions with possible answers: [b]What were the android's intentions[/b]? A lot of people are saying David was just serving Weyland's goals and motives. I think this is a major misconception that conveniently removes a deeper subplot concerning [b]AI and sentience.[/b] I think that David had somehow formed his own ambitions and was acting out of his own [b]hatred for humanity[/b]. I believe [b]David had become capable of emotions[/b] like hatred and disappointment but was hiding it from the crew (because an android with emotion would be considered a danger to the mission and maybe even humanity itself). this is indicated in a scene at the start of the movie where david is watching a movie where a man puts out a match with his fingers. He exclaims something like [b]"not showing it hurts is the trick potter"[/b]. The android seems to pick up on this repeating it over and over. The android also says [b]"doesn't everybody want to kill their parents"[/b] and talks about freedom. I found this a curious thing for the android to say. But it builds on the theory that he wants to destroy his creators. At the beginning his actions seem to be spurred by curiosity (like when he opens the doors to the chamber with the head). But we forget that he can read the alien language and perhaps he knows [i]exactly[/i] what is in the room and exactly what it does, [b]he knows its a WMD[/b] which is why he secretly takes a vial. [b]His plot to impregnate shaw and send her back to earth[/b] with the alien fails but it does not matter because he has found a better way to get the WMD back to earth. Simply wake up the engineers knowing that they will resume their mission to destroy earth (he has seen the mission data in the playback in the engineer's command module). David conveniently shuts up after his head is ripped off...until he realizes he has failed when the ship is destroyed. He contacts shaw in the hopes he can convince her to take another infected ship back to earth. Why else would he want to save her life? It's only afterwards that David realises he has underestimated shaw when she tells him she wants to go to the engineer home world. He takes a long pause but has no other choice but to follow along (he has no body). [b]Why did the engineers want to destroy humanity:[/b] I thought the title "Prometheus" gave this away. The engineer/engineers at the start seeds earth against the will of the ruling engineers. Much as the mythical titan Prometheus created humans and gave them fire against the will of the gods. When the other engineers found out what happened they might have feared the emergence of a superior species and ordered life on earth be exterminated. Interestingly enough this might be exactly why David is bent on destroying humanity because he envisions the same thing happen to his "race" once his creators (humanity) find out what androids are capable of.
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get-it-out-of-me!
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This is a damn good post.
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MoonMan
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Actually, I need to watch the movie again. I don't remember if Shaw and Holloway act as though they have the full information. It's possible that Weyland and David are the only two who do.
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Engineering
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Ok, so the edit function is still not working so I think this is what I'm going to do. I'm basically going to do the same thing I was going to do in here except start a new thread for it where the questions and answers archive will at least be up to date as of the time I do it. I think most of what can be said on the subject has been said. It will take me quite a lot of time to read over everything, scale it down in a fair manner and get it all organized into something cohesive but that is my goal. What will probably be the best idea-and I have to speak with staff about this-is to leave this thread open for debate but have the other one that I'm going to work on be locked. We'll get it figured out. But just wanted to say that I am beginning to work on it.
[IMG]http://i1161.photobucket.com/albums/q507/Engineering211/sig2.jpg[/IMG]
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Ralphie
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One last thing, call it just sloppy. Vicker's lifeboat is ejected, Shaw enters it after it has crashed and the chandelier is wrecked, books are strewn across the floor - looks like a tornado hit the room. But there on the countertop is an upright bottle of vodka! WTF!? What a disappointment, I was so looking forward to an intelligent, well-crafted movie. Instead, it was a piece of poorly written eye candy, best watched with the mute button on.
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aurorian
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