A few questions on lindelof"s and spaihts scripts (the ones that was confirmed).

On the spaihts scropt that was confirmed 1 The goblin shark alien is probably where the deacon came from. It came from the squid like facehugger that came from the pyramid that wasn't weaponised by the engineers. This is the original facehugger that the engineers discovered and is probably where the trilobyte idea came from. The deacon therefore it seems is the precursor of the xeno as they came from the weaoponised facehuggers. That had bones hard parts. This tells me that the origins of the xeno is weaponised facehuggers. So as the starbeast script indicates the engineers stumbled upon the the squid facehuggers and then weaoponised them for the destruction od mankind. 2 The black goo concept comes from the scarab like flying insects that implants its dna and can also eat ist way into a suit or helmet. It seaams from fifield that the scarabs mutates you in a xeno type ceature . Instead of breaking you down all the way it simply allows yoi to mutate. So it is a little different from the scarabs at the sart of the draft but tey have different functions. 3 When was the sleeper engineer facehugged ? By david ? He seemed to worshiop the engineer as a suiperior being and was in awe of them. So I don't think it was him that caused the engineer to be facegugged. Ridley it seems wanted to go the xeno route as well as the engineer route but fox probably decided to make it even more ambiguous and only hint at the xeno via the deacon . Any thoughts I strongly advise anyone who hasn't read the two scripts to please do so. It explains the thinking of the writers as well as where many of the scenes in the movie came from.

Oh yes I would seem that the engineers homeworld is in sagitarius's arm. How far is that from earth ??r

David says somewhere towards the center of the galaxy 10000 to 15000 lightyears from earth ????

1... This is a strange one as yes it does hint in the script that the Engineers got infected and tried to commit suicide, but the movie it does appear the engineer fell over and did not perform that action on purpose i.e intend to stick head in the archway. Now all hints if you take Lindeloff Script and movie, are that the Engineers got infected with the Goo, and now the exploded Head and infection indicates the same changes as Holloway so the Engineers must have orally got infected but this can not be confirmed, however hints suggest so due to the way the corpses had signs of exploding from outside.... Yet again we see they was running from something, if you know you are effected and you want to kill your self why would you look over your shoulder, thats a sign of trying to get away from something for safety and not a sign of knowing your fate is sealed. Regarding the infection which in the movie at least that one Engineer had, and we can assume others who died did they was either going to mutate like Fifield, or they was going to break down like Sacrificial Engineer. Now while it seems so, we have to remember Shaw said the cells showed signs of changing on the Engineer head, and signs of new cell growth so maybe this is not breaking down? Thing we have to remember is if they was changing into hybrid organisms like Fifield and Hammerpede then that would be good reason to commit suicide to prevent it or prevent you becoming a Bloodthirsty Mutant and thus threat to the rest of your kind. Especially if death prevents the transformation, otherwise why commit suicide if the Goo will transform you anyway? Another clue to this could be Milburn, they found his body dead, surely there is chance that the Goo would have got to him after the Hammerpede attack? But if he died from that attack and this prevents him from being effected by the Goo, then this would make sense as to why the Engineers would try kill themselves to prevent similar fate. If the infection was them breaking down like the Sacrificial Engineer then all that would have became of them is broken down material that carries their DNA maybe mixed with Xeno DNA and to be frank if thats the case then i cant see killing yourself having any effect on the outcome of a Goo that breaks you down... For example if the Sacrificial Engineer after we see him curl over in pain from the Goo being ingested, if someone say took his head clean off at that point would it had prevented the end result i doubt it. So my conclusion would be in my opinion that they knew they would mutate into something new. just as David said.... To create one must first destroy.... Thus the Engineers would been destroyed to create something new like the Hammerpedes and Mutant Fifield and the evidence of no effects on dead Milburn suggest that transformation can be halted if you are killed before the process finished.. Remember Fifield did not appear to had died, just burnt in his face.

2. Would appear to be added latter but Scripts hint at terraforming so we cant assume that at that point only the Juggernauts supported a breathable atmosphere. 3. It was always a Mystery why only the Last Engineer survived... when i watch the full Engineer Speaks scenes well the deleted ones and the full Engineers vs Shaw, well again the deleted ones. I get the impression the Engineer was not some bloodthirsty angry human hating madman like the theatrical showed, even in that version you could see the look of concern and contempt on his face towards Shaw and his bewilderment at David and also Violin Girl. This could indeed hint that maybe this Engineer did not agree their creation was needed to be destroyed and he could have sabotaged the mission. But that is not a proven fact, not at all.... But the scripts fast forwards scene showing Engineer being panicked we have to ask why is he panicked and why only he survived... Did he infect the Engineers after going into cryo sleep? As maybe he was last one to do so, and so he could have not gone into his until he infected the others. But the early on Hologram play back recording shows more than 3 Engineers and there is more than 3 dead Engineer bodys and yet the Juggernaut has only 4 Cryo Pods that we see and one is occupied by the surviving Engineer, so the outbreak must have occurred logically before the Engineer was panicking to get into Cryo sleep.. Thus Engineers prep for take off (Scene where David is in Orrey Room on Control Panel), then something went bad and hence latter the tunnel Running Engineers scene... And the scripts latter fast forwarded scene of a panicked Engineers. Question would still be did that mean the Engineer panicked to seal the doors to the Control room then go into cryo sleep? As it never saved the other 3..... Was he just the lucky one? Or something more? We just dont have answers.

Bigdave In both these scripts it seems that the engineers were 12-15 feet tall where as in p1 they were 8-9 feet tall . Must I realy believe that they didn't have enough cash to make the engineers 15 feet tall due to budget constraints ?? And why was evoil laughter added during sacrifice of the sacrificial engineer ? It seems that they deliberately reshot some scenes out of order to make the movie deliberately over ambiguous. And aslo by adding lost of stuff at a very late stage . It seems someone at fox decided at ta very late to to male the movie over ambiguious.

It just seems that they did too many things too mae the movie too ambiguous just so that they could further increase the cash profability of the series. I can't see a extended cut being made. They would have to remake the movie to answer the questions. Many of the mysteries simply cannot be answered. And fit into the movie . I tried - it just doesn't work. After reading the two drafts u see where many of the ideas came from and what there originak intention was.

Yes indeed they made a hash of some things.... As far as Engineers go well here is the deal.... Alien---Space Jockey... Height 26ft approx.. Ridley used children in the scene apart from the close ups, to create a illusion of the size of the Space Jockey..... While the close ups revealed the Space Jockey and Chair was about 15-16ft in length. The Prop was actually 12-15ft in length... OPPS!!!!! No way was we going to buy that the Space Jockey Race was 26ft in Prometheus, as anyone with sense of scale could tell in Alien it was 15ft Tops.... Fast Forward Prometheus concept work and early script. Prometheus---Engineers---Height 12-15ft Movie shots of Dead Engineer Head and Body fit scale of smaller 10-12ft tops beings, the Space Jockey suits David walks past again 10-12ft Tops... Ghost Engineer Scene..... if you try scale them then these Engineers are about 8ft tall or just over.... Engineer Speaks Scene, due to Engineer out of shot being on platform and not much shown of legs, creates the illusion he is 8ft tall.... you can however see his head is indeed 40% smaller than the Head they found of the dead Engineer. some parts of Engineer Speaks scene Engineer appears 7.5ft tall.... Then Engineer vs Shaw scene.... again looking at Scale of Doors in Vickers Life Boat and Vickers through movie going through them we see Engineer is about 7.5ft tall Then Engineer vs Shaw scene we get full scale of the Engineer and it is well 7ft 4 inc approx... Basically Actor Ian Whyte 7ft 1" frame in booster boots that make him appear 3" taller. So again a big Opps.... In hindsight maybe they should have used the same Camer Trickery and effects that was used in the Lord of the Rings and Hobit Movies. Those that made small 5ft4 to 5ft8" Actors appear as 3.5ft to 4ft Hobits this could been done to make 7ft+ Tall Engineer Actors appear as 10-12ft beings. of which i think the movie intended. Lindeloff even said in one interview the scale of the Engineers was dropped from 12-15ft to 10ft tall race for Prometheus again sadly the way the movie was shot the illusion failed to happen and just as our 26ft Space Jockey was shown to be 15ft, then our 10ft Engineers appeared as 7.5-8ft. Here is Ghost Engineers Ian Whyte (Last Engineer) and John Lebar in costume.. [img]http://i50.tinypic.com/2447adx.png[/img] [img]http://i49.tinypic.com/egfic.jpg[/img] And with booster boots they usually gain 2-4 inch's so that would make for the actors being 7ft 4 to 7ft 10ft in the movie, based on smallest Ian Whyte in booster boots no helmet to tallest John Lebar in booster boots plus extra inchs the Space Jockey Helmet would gain. Now depending on angles and actors used next to them etc this would create illusion of them being taller than their real average suited height of say 7.5ft, but this is not enough to create the illusion of a 9ft race let alone higher.... Hence we get our 7.5 to 8ft Engineers when shot, but then we get our 10ft Engineer Suits (Dead/Unused)

Theres more here.. [url=http://www.prometheusforum.net/discussion/comment/183295]Engineers on Set[/url] Here are two interesting ones [img]http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2013/046/6/5/prometheus_engineer_by_lady_shai-d5uzzz8.png[/img] This one the Engineer Ian Whyte is in his pressure suit and as you can see this lacks the Boots the Space Jockey ones have thus only gain a inch... Now using this info that he is about 7ft 2" in that scene i used a ruler and worked the scale difference to Shaw and came up that if Engineer is 7ft 2" then Shaw would be 5ft 3" to 5ft 4" The images on this page also show that indeed most of the scenes was shot with the Engineer with no Face Burn, and nice few images of him reading a book... Also we got this shot of the Engineer acting out the scene maybe of Trillobite attack before it was CGI added after.. [img]http://fc06.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2013/043/4/a/prometheus_engineer_by_lady_shai-d5urk0d.png[/img] Again no Face Burn, which to me shows it happened during that attack.... They then was not happy and wanted to re shoot a another scene and save the time remove face burn they then just shot the Engineer comming through the door Scene and push Shaw Scene with the Face Burn.... Whats interesting is however he has the burn no soon as the Trillobite is released on him... this disappears while he is wrestling with it, until the scene of when we see down the Trillobite to when we can see its mouth,

We also have to remember there was indeed more scenes added to this movie that we never got to see even in deleted scenes... These include... 1) Sacrificial Scene Dialog, now Actor Daniel Twiss said he had to learn a few lines of Dialog for his scene with other Engineers. 2) We see there was a Alternative Fifield shot but there was also a unused Animatronic Fifield that was never used that looked best of them all but too Alien. 3) There was a scene of Weyland being escorted to the Transport by his Mercs followed by Ford, while Shaw and David was on board the Transport at a time when Fifield attacked.. Clips of this are shown in the Trailers. 4) There was a scene of the Engineer getting up from the crashed Juggernaught and running from inside of it, to then a shot of him running across the surface of LV 223 to the Lifeboat and he was not wearing a Mask and he had no Face Burns. 5) There was a shot of the Last Engineer kneeling down to read a book in Vickers Quarters just before he heard Shaw. There may be other scenes as well which means there could have been much more to the movie than we got to see.

Bigdave Yes it is abvious then that they made many fit even if it did not work so well. I still love prometheus . But why did they not find a way to bypass that - like cgi if only for a few scenes ?? I mean why change the sj size to such a degree that it really begs the question is this in the same universe or are they just doing this on purpose to create more confusion ?? Another example is the helmet re$oval scenes . In lindelofs draft the only time they removed their helmets was when weyland arrived in the juggernauts cargo hold. They changed this in p1 and then releases an info file sayin the black goo is also an airborne patugen. Same with the deacon mural. Al of this was just added to create more confusion and mystery and I am not so sure that they really have answers for those. Because god lknows I have racked my brains trying to find answers to the mysteries. P1 is is a mixture of the two confirmed scripts and seemingly a lot of very late changes coming in. I think they deliberately wanted to create uncertainty as whether p1 was actially in the same universr as alien . And accordingly the script changes and they throw a whole lot stuff in there at the end. I am not saying its bad it does show you that that is exactky what they (fox) wanted - controversy (because of uncertainty and over ambiguity). If spaihts draft was the one that ridley wanted after amny changes were made by ridley then that shows that ridley wanted to tell the story of the xeno and where they came from (squid like facehuggers weaponised to become the traditional facehugger producing the xeno). He answered that . The engineers seeded mankind and wanted to punish them for exactly what I don't understand. So this draft shows what ridley initially had in mind as he wanted there to be 8 different of eggs. In this script david indicates to shaw that there is 8 stasis fields and that each field contains slightly different eggs. That's why I think this a draft from spahts after ridley told him to male changes. So ridley wad telling the engineer story and xeno story. Right ?? But it simply wasn't anibiguous enough and would kill the mystery of the space jockey and the origins of the xeno. This is wanted ridley wanted to tell. And in the process destroy what caused the franchise to be such a success. Therefore I am on no doubt that fox or brandywine stepped in said no. Because I thinlk ridley wanted to finish it but was not allowed to. I don't think he had any say in the matter. So the ambiguity and changes in the Lindeloff script I believe was intended and as the filming began to finish ridley saw that there still was to many clues given that fox probably wouldn't agree to it. So they really made it too ambiguous to protect the mysteries of the franchise. It seems than that the origins of the xeno as ridley wanted to tell it was from squid like facehuggers that was weaponised by the engineers. I believe that is why fox asked chris to remove the spaihts draft as it really showed the story ridley wanted to tell. He never moved away from the engineers he simply explained how the two met. Maybe the engineers found the squidlike facehuggers thousands of years before and it doesn't mean that the xeno we know may have been around for a long time but this does show how they came to be. Maybe the stasis field of the juggernaut simply malfunctioned and a facehugger that was maybe able to go through thin crevices or underneath doors as it was the case for the squid like facehugger (of which the chestburster itself could squeeze through very tight spaces) and maybe that's how the engineer on lv 426 got facehugged. During flight the a facehugger closer to the original squidlike facehugger got loose - sqeezed his way through the crevices and when the engineer went to investigate got him when he returned. He landed and then got chestbursted and the resultant creature simply melted his way through the floor and maybe got trapped and simply excreted acid to melt the metal and disappeared below. Maybe that how he got inside the suit by simply melting and his way into the suit ?? I think ridley has given us the answers because he knows he is getting old. But fox knew the damage that would have done to the cash making ability. Well that's what I choose to believe. I salute you sir ridley scott. I now know how hard you tried. Sorry for the loss of your brother. And may you succeed in all your endeavours .

Those are some interesting theories, though something tells me that the writers weren't thinking too deep on the matter or as deep as we're thinking right now. Our theories prove to be much more in depth than what the writer thought of come to think of it. As though our ideas far exceeds that which the writer intended when writing the script. Its a weird notion if you think about it.

Where do i start lol... so many good points made there. 1) The confusion, yes there is a lot of that and Fox finger mainly points to many changes they have made that add to the inconsistencies. Ridley did say that they (implies himself and Fox) felt the Spaights draft was too Alien, and that they wanted to limit the links to Alien and emphasize more on the Engineers who we knew nothing about as opposed to the Xeno that we had seen and been done over and over. Spaights draft was far to Alien orientated, and little Engineer compared, and it was full of traditional Xenos as well as some various kinds and all did hint that as these Engineers liked to genetically manipulate and create life they also liked to manipulate the Xeno Bio Weapon. His draft did how ever make some sense the plot points while just seemed like a done it before plot, they did all fit together and make sense, the Lindeloff draft not so much so, but ultimately it was the editing that did the damage. If we look at the Helmet removal, then it makes sense to had added it in more than the Juggernaut scene as Spaights draft also hinted these Engineers was Terra forming the Temple mound. I felt Spaights draft was too much spoon fed and another Alien movie and yet the Engineers are and was the real Enigma left from Alien. Saying that i liked how Spaights draft made sense as far as the method of the Engineers seeding goes, as the nano scarabs in how they worked, was explained well. We saw the draft showed a consistency from both scenes of the Goo. In Spaights and later edited release for the movie, well we see conflicting elements as far as the Goo.... Fox then in a attempt to tidy up that conflict made a Weyland File that described the Goo, now this File would if we took this as canon, show some how the company at some point after or during Prometheus mission found out what exactly the Juggernauts and the Cargo do, even though the crew never... so either David figured it out or a latter Weyland mission did. But this file just made things even worse far worse... as now we had gone from Spaights bugs that... eat its victim and as so many of these did that there was nothing left of the victim, the millions of Bugs had digested the Engineer, in doing so they some how held the genetic code of the Engineer. These said bugs then came across well one did a early primitive woman, well early Sapien... she got bitten by the Scarab who injected her with Engineer DNA, this DNA then fused with and mutate her cells so she became Hybrid of Early Sapien and Engineer DNA thus Human. We then see these bugs bit some member of the crew who mutates into a Xeno Hybrid thus showing that the Xeno DNA was consumed and broken down just as the Engineers was. Lindeloff replaced this with Goo which i think made more sense and was better way in a way of doing things, in his draft this substance broke down the Engineers DNA and his broken DNA then infected with the substance, was able to either reassemble itself, or more likely fused with basic bacteria on Earth and kick started Evolution. Only problem being we saw latter the Goo seemed to mutate the Worms and Fifield into Organisms with Xeno traits and thus confusion occurred to is this the same substance and if so why did the Worms and Fifield not break down into a chemical that contained their DNA that then passed onto other things it came into contact with... We then had the how come the Engineer did not at the start pass on Xeno traits to mankind..... For me this was simple, in a nutshell that temple was where the Xeno or related organism was sacrificed like the Engineer at the start to produce a substance that would pass on Xeno DNA to what ever it came into contact with, as opposed to the Sacrificed Engineers DNA that passed on his genetic material. Fox came along with the Weyland files to suggest indeed both substances are the same, just they have different applications. If swollowed this substance breaks down the victims genetic make up and then this genetic material reforms to produce life that has imprints of the Sacrificed victim who had consumed the substance, the speed depends on amount consumed, hence Holloway did not break down instantly as he consumed a small water down amount. When the Goo leaks from its canisters it can also be inhaled and when this occurs the target does not break down, instead the victims DNA go through genetic changes and the result is a new Hybrid Organism. Problems with that is..... well how did Holloway pass on Xeno DNA traits to Shaws Embryo/Egg during Sex.... yet mankind has no Xeno DNA traits from the Sacrificial Engineer only the Engineers DNA... Also if by inhaled we get mutations then how come none of the other crew who took off their helmets in both visits to the Temple, ended up showing no signs of any infection? Only the Worms and Fifield did and they seemed to carry Xeno DNA traits (especially alternative and more so unused Fifield concepts). They did not inhale the Goo, they came into contact with it via skin...

Bigdave Thanks for clearing that up. Thescarabs then is just a replacement for the goo(or the other way around). So the ampiules that fifield broke had scarabs in them that has already consumed a xeno . So we are bacl on track and that stays the same. Thanks

2) As far as the Space Jockey and Engineer relation then yes they made a mistake as far as size goes... A major one and its the biggest gripe i had with the movie aside from the edit we got. The whole movie seemed geared to be about a race of tall giant beings from out of space who had a hand in our creation, evolution and also teaching and upgrading us over many thousands of years. Hence the pictographs from Ancient Cultures worshiping giant beings. This fits well with a 12-15ft race as the drafts and concepts showed... But the actual filming, well surely those supposed now 9-10ft Engineers that dont fool most of us as we see they was just 8 foot say for arguments sakes. Is supposed to represent these taller beings from many Ancient Cultures.. How do they fix this mess...... 2 ways..... The Dead Engineers was larger than the Last one, maybe and as hinted in Alien the dead Space Jockey/Engineers suits over time fossilize and they appear to grow the longer dead they are. This could explain the size differences and thus our Engineers are 8-10ft beings that when they die they expand due to fossilization of the material the Space Jockey suits are made from etc. OR......... The Engineers on LV 223 are a servent race to some other race, a Taller 15ft race created beings in their image to perform tasks and thus the 8-10ft Engineers were born.... This could explain that at some point a revolt occurred and maybe the Engineers tried to kill off their creators with a re-weaponized Bio Weapon... And that they then wanted to use this upon the Elders new preferred children Mankind... But then maybe the Engineers created us from stolen fire of the Gods (goo) as opposed to being used as Sacrifices by these Elders. This route could explain why the Elder scenes was removed... you see Ridley and Fox could revamp these beings so that they appear indeed as 12-15ft beings. Thus these Elders are the Space Jockey they are humanoid, and created Engineers in their image to perform labour and other tasks for the Engineers... These Engineers was then also used by the Elders to seed DNA. Thus Elders may had seed one of their own to produce Engineers so that then Engineers could be sacrificed to seed worlds as opposed to the Elders. Thus maybe the Engineers decided to use us to seed life for the Xeno or some other Organism they tried to create. These are some ideas they could go with to answer the difference in sizes... not only of the Space Jockey but also why the Ancient Paintings and Murals of Ancient cultured depicted giant beings much larger than 8ft.

@oduodu Thats what Spaights draft implies.... Scarab that bites Early Sapien mutates said being into Mankind, because the Scarab has obtained Engineer DNA from consuming a Engineer DNA during the Sacrificial Scene. Result is a part Sapein part Engineer Humanoid and thats why we look like Engineers to a degree and why our DNA matched as we came from them via the Scarab that had been carring Engineer DNA.... Thus Fifield Mutant with Xeno traits that came from a bite of a Scarab means those Scarabs in the Urns must have at some point consumed a Xeno to gain that material. Now if you check my first posts well some of them, before even the Spaights draft was leaked, this is what i read into the movie. I said back then, to me it appeared that the Goo made things turn into Xeno DNA Organisms, and not like the Sacrificial Engineers. Thus i felt if the Sacrificial Engineers broken down material was not released into the Water Fall, if it was some how collected, or if he was Sacrificed inside a VAT or container, then resulting material could be collected into Vases or Ampules. If these was then introduced into the Water Fall would the result not been the same...? Thus to me this is what happened, the Urns contained for most part Genetic Material of a Xeno or related Organism, that they had optained by Sacreficing a Xeno or related Organism via the same process the Sacreficial Engineer had seeded his material. This is why the Temple had the Head Statue, it was to represent the Sacrificial Engineer to show it was his Sacrifice that allowed our creation. Thus the Star Maps was a invitation to find them when we was ready and the temple would be a History of our creation, and i felt the LV 223 was a outpost where these Engineers watched over us from, they was gardeners and we was one of their Fruits, stored in one of their green houses (Planet Earth) on their land (part of Galaxy). Something had happened however, as they did want to destroy us thats for sure... and 2000 years ago... why? When i look at the Deacon Mural what i see again is like the Head Statue if that is to show and be a symbol of the importance in the Engineers Sacrifice..... Then does the Deacon Mural mean the same? Its in a Sacrificial pose, just as Jesus was now thats not to say Deacon = Christ.. Nope the image of Christ on the Crucifix is to show mankind that it was his Sacrifice on the cross that saved mankind as he died for our Sins. Thus i read the Sacrefice pose of the Deacon as the same, to show a Deacon was sacreficed to create what ever was in those Urns. This is further backed up by this image of the Sacrificial Bowl on the Altar that was changed to a Green Orb of all things... [img]http://i.imgur.com/aK3b1.jpg[/img] Now if you take the above on the Altar with the Deacon behind it, maybe it shows that Xenos or related Organisms are Sacrificed on the Altar and the broken down Material is collected in the Urns. This was my view of the connection, but it has some holes, but then when Spaights draft got leaked it basically matched my interpretation of what the Goo/Scarabs was...

Bigdave Yes I had that idea of the slave race but I thinl now they simply added it to create more confusion. That's why the shooting script is so important to read. I just thinl we will never be able to fully answer these questions until substantially more info is found in p2 or p3. But I am tired now of forcing theories that never was intended to be solved. I like the engineer slave race theory but that evil laughter was put in a later stage and I believe that it goes with the deacon mural and helmet removal of halloway the info file released by fox the mutated fifield sitting like crab the the holes in the engineer crytubes the heap of dead engineers having something burst out of them engineers having droplets of black goo on the forehead while wearing biosuit the whole storn suddenly appearing when the spaihts draft confirms that happens where the night day line is on the planet probably due to chenges in temperatures. I have now finally accepted that it would impossible to answer the mysteries . Perhaps in p2 and p3 we might see something. But for now its fun to speculate.

Bigdave I like your theory on the why the deacon wa crucified. Bigdave What do you think about the the engineers homeworld beimg in saggitarius's arm somewhere closer to the galaxy centre. What do you think about david learning to think in trinary code and therebt becoming much more .......advanced ??? What do you thinl ??

Well the Slave Race makes sense.... You see we need to look back at why did Weyland go to LV 223? Because of the Star Maps Shaw and David found in the many Ancient Artifacts and depictions they found.. Many cultures had layers of Gods, and not one God like the Abrahamic Religions. Look at the Titans, look at the Anunaki Tales, they had layers of Gods, in which case there is more than one GOD... but there are Gods beneath them like Titans... In the Anunaki tale we have the Igigi... created by the Gods, but then replaced by Mankind.... these Igigi in the Anunaki tales are close to what the Bible teaches us about Angels.... Thus the Engineers could be the Igigi.

It would be interesting to see how the franchise goes... Remember Ridley said he would go futher from Alien in Paradise, and he wants to explore the Engineers more, this when you think of it is why the Elder scene may had been cut and the full Engineer speaks scene.... Ridley could be trying to redesign the Elders and by deleting that scene it would show the Elders are not smaller than the Engineers, and as the Engineers appeared smaller than the Space Jockey that could be a answer. Also by not having the Engineers speak, could indicate that they are merely just slaves to the Elders. We cant be sure which way things would go, but a interesting thing is Ridley did say that after Prometheus franchise he would maybe like to explore the Home World of the Xeno.... This implies the Xeno is not from Paradise and it could imply the Xeno is something the Engineers came across and borrowed genetic code or technology from... The Derelict and Juggernaut and Space Jockey suits all have a very Bio-Mech look of the Xeno and Xeno Hive.... very Gigerish. Yet the Sacrificial Scene the Ship did not have this and the Eldersw was robbed...

Regarding what else could happen..... We have to remember David has his own Agenda, and now his father is dead he is as hinted in movie, finally free.... We also have to remember only way Shaw can leave LV 223 is with Davids help and we have to assume that she cant get to Paradise without using Cryo Sleep, and also that David needs his head attaching to be able to be of use. Ridley said once Shaw puts David back together she better not trust him but has no choice... Now Weyland Files hint that the company and most likely David have some knowledge of a signal from LV 426, and if David can decode Engineer Language then maybe he has good understanding of the message. So once Shaw is in Cryo Sleep there is nothing to stop David taking a detour to LV 426 to find out what went down with the Derelict and Signal.... As it appeared in Alien DC that Ash had more knowledge about the Xeno, than the crew did and was aware that something is down there. In fact it all hints that the Nostromo was diverted there to obtain a sample but only Ash knew of this objective.

Bigdave I believe that until we have the shooting script we will always struggle. Evil laughter and a ship different from the juggernaut and a deleted scene with frail lepar looking engineers somehow desperate looking and then abandoning their younger contemporary indicates that unable to help themselves. They are at the mercy of someone or something else. They are not in control of the technology they have. Therefore a higher power must

Be controlling them . O guess at some point wy must have obtained terraforming tech that radiacally changes the game. Another thing that became apparent from the spaihts script is that there were many references to aliens. The battle at the end with the xenomorph was one. The discovery of the terraforming technology due to the lack of liveable worlds. The losing of men and the distraught leader (captain janek) and vickers agenda of simply making money at the cost of lives (she left ravel and chance and brought the soldiers back to protect her) this is a military reference. Maybe ridley after all does like aliens in a somewhat "canon way".

I know that about the scarabs, and for now is the most plausible explanation. But the problem is that this was an idea of Jon Spaihts, so I doubt that this is in the original script, leaving us with tons of speculation, because if we are guided by this early concept; then we must assume that long ago there was a lifeform before the Xenomorph / Deacon. According to this idea, the black goo extracted Engineer DNA to make us in his image. Then, millions of years later, The crew of the Prometheus found the result of the disintegration of a primitive creature, stored in the Urns.

There is a rumor that Fox brought Lindeloff on board to spice up Spaights Script, which could mean Ridley was not massively against Spaights draft... But not sure if we would ever know for sure how Ridley felt about the Spaights Draft, to be fair the Lindeloff draft and the movie well the scenes shot we never saw and deleted ones, when added into the movie in correct order does make for a more bigger picture movie with more answers. But there has to be reasons for why some parts was cut out, and i can only think they was not happy with the Elders, and the way the Engineers are portrayed. I am going for them to redesign the Elders to be taller more powerful race, maybe....? And that the Engineers are to them, pretty much like David is to Mankind and thats create to perform certain tasks that otherwise the Elders would have to do. Thats why i think Elders was cut, it shows they was pale and frail but more so shows them to be smaller than the Engineer. Maybe with the inconstancy with the Space Jockey, being much larger than the Engineers they could maybe show us another fraction of Engineers or Elders to be taller beings as depicted in Cave Paintings etc and add up to the Space Jockey in Alien size. Thus also the portrayal in the movie of the Engineers would appear to be no more than Genetic Robots, created to serve end perform the Agenda of the Elders. Thus the Theatrical Last Engineer basically behaved as if he had less Emotion and as if he was carrying out orders/programing. As opposed to the deleted scenes and some scenes we not even seen, where he seems intrigued with the crew and mankind. To what we have as a Engineer who well wakes up feels bit funny due to long sleep in Cryo Stasis, who then gains his awareness and then goes postal and Angry on the Human Crew.

@shambs Yes Spaights draft actually showed us more the connection with the Life Seeding Method and how it was applied. Lindeloffs also seemed to show us the same if you read in between the lines and how you look at the clues... Spaights draft we are shown the effect of what the Scarabs do when they bit someone well when one or a few do, as opposed to be broken down and eaten by millions of them like the Engineer did. In Prometheus its not as easy to see the connection, especially if you draw the conclusion that the substance is both the same. Spaights draft we see that the Engineer was attacked by many many many Nano Scarabs who basically ate him molecule by molecule. We see the Thick Goo in Sacrificial Bowl do a similar thing in Prometheus.... Now Fifield is shown in Spaights to be bitten and suffer similar fate as the primative primate on earth was in, in that a Scarab had bitten him and injected DNA into him to mutate him..... he became something Xeno related and not Engineer because hints are there that it depends what that Scarab had obtained its DNA from. We saw that mankind came about due to many Scarabs had taken and stripped DNA from a Engineer, hence our creation and connection... So logic dictates that the Scarabs in Urns must have obtained Xeno or related DNA. Now in Prometheus again Fifield is infected with the contents in the Urns just as the Worms are and they are mutated in a Organism that carries Xeno traits... While Spaights shows us Scarabs consume and break down the Engineer and thus carry his DNA, which we then see one of these Scarabs attack a Primate to Inject it. In Prometheus all we see is the Engineer break down into tiny cells well into strands of DNA that are turned black, and you can see the Engineer breaks apart into tiny tiny black pieces of material. The conclusion i drawn was that how the Engineers DNA and cells broke apart and turned black, was the substance caused them to do so, but then the substance latter gets them to resemble into basic forms of life..... This is where a bit of insight and logic is used, but not fact... You see this world the Engineer Sacrificed himself on had trees and plant life, in order for that it needs CO2 which in order for that needs basic Lifeforms and Bacteria. Water is a building block of Life, but so too is CO2 and Carbon, thus to me the scene implies that the Engineers broken down DNA and genetic Material was dissolved and carried within the Black Goo which then came into contact with basic organisms and started to Evolve and Change them. Thus the Process was not much different to what happens with the Scarabs in the opening Scene. Many clues support this idea..... comments made by Lindeloff and the Weyland files go against this and give us a explanation, that basically contradicts everything we see on screen... Simply put the Weyland Files fail to answer... 1) If the substance when ingested breaks down the genetic material of the victim to then reform into basic life that carries its victims DNA.... Then why did Shaw get infected with what appears Xeno related DNA? And why did Mankind not have Xeno DNA from the Sacrificial Engineer? When airborne the Black Goo mutates its victims DNA.... why did it mutate to pass on Xeno DNA and why the hell was no one else infected if its in the air.... Nope i still stand by that the Sacrificial Substance breaks down its Victim and the resulting broken down Material then has the ability to bond with other Organisms and then starts to mutate that organism imprinting traits taken from the original victim that had consumed or came into contact with the Sacrificial Substance. Seems Spaights but logic and thought into his script.... Lindeloff has good ideas but then fails to apply any logic to them and even have future events contradict previous and if you tried to watch Lost you see the same thing evident in that series.

@BigDave, I sure hope you're right! I would love to see some 12-15 ft tall Space Jockeys. This would be sooo consistent with Sumerian mythology which seems to have inspired (in large part) the film. Like you said, The Igigi and The Annunaki- essentially a slave race who rebelled against their creators. Mankind was made from one such slave (Engineer) using clay, blood and water...hmm. Could explain the hostility towards us. (The new baby, as it were) Anyway, what i would give to see some concept-art Jockeys brought to life. I mean c'mon!! We can all see they are half the size!!! Ridley wasn't that dumb in the 70s and he isn't that dumb now!! That being said; Prometheus i still a masterpiece and if i told you how many times i've seen it now- you would have me commited!!

"Ridley wasn't that dumb in the 70s and he isn't that dumb now!!" We have to remember the Space Jockey was supposed to be 26ft, he even used child actors to create the illusion, only switched to real actors up close. We could see the Space Jockey was not 26ft it was 15ft tops... (i calculated it to be 13ft. Its as i have had discussions on here before regards to size, when some thought indeed the Engineer looked 10ft tall... [img]http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01559/tallest-and-shorte_1559059i.jpg[/img] Here is Worlds Tallest Man at 8ft1 compared to Smallest at near 2ft 6" The difference is 3.3X now that kind of difference from Average Man would make for a 19ft Tall one... and if you look at the difference between those two above 3.3X and how the Space Jockey was supposed to be 26ft thus 4.4X Average Man you can clearly see the Smallest Man compared to Tallest is much greater difference. Some people maybe dont even realize how large 12ft is... and a Average Person compared to a Little Person AKA Dwarf is a 50% increase. And if you take Verne Troyer aka Mini Me as being average Human then a Average Man next to him would be about 12ft 5" So a real 12-15ft Engineers next to the crew of Prometheus would be like this image. [url=http://www2.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Verne+Troyer+Andrew+Garfield+Imaginarium+Doctor+Fqt_eOSwL9_x.jpg]Verne[/url] Those other actors would be to Verne as a 12-15ft Engineers would be to say a average 5ft 8" Human.

Yes, I agree, they could use camera tricks to create the illusion that the crew is much smaller than the Engineers...but what's done is done, unfortunately.

But trying to go back to Topic, yes there was changes from the drafts. Both drafts and concepts did have Engineers as 12-15ft, Ridley said in a interview and Lindeloff that for the movie we had a race of 10ft tall beings. Now we know that illusion was not created, and we have to remember Ridley was not pleased with the Elders and he also was not pleased with some of the ideas to do with the Engineer race and Elders. Maybe this could hint to a revamp in Paradise, and maybe we could see them use special effects like Hobit and Lord of the Rings did, so we finally get some 12ft tall beings on screen. I could even live with 10ft ones that kind of expand to 12-15ft when they become fossilized etc.

These are things that could be easy to fix in Paradise. Like i said they could revamp the Elders to be a Taller Race of Engineers who created the Smaller ones just as the Anunaki created the Lgigi.

Then I expect to see some serious cases of gigantism in the engineers of the sequel, like this guy :p [img]http://i1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj636/skybeast3/Robert_Wadlow_zps777c5213.jpg[/img]

And by the way I saw when Spaights says that Fox executives are responsible for the arrival of Lindelof and changes in the prequel. But one of the big mysteries is change the container for the green Crystal...because seriusly...What does that mean?! [quote]You see this world the Engineer Sacrificed himself on had trees and plant life, in order for that it needs CO2 which in order for that needs basic Lifeforms and Bacteria. Water is a building block of Life, but so too is CO2 and Carbon, thus to me the scene implies that the Engineers broken down DNA and genetic Material was dissolved and carried within the Black Goo which then came into contact with basic organisms and started to Evolve and Change them. [/quote] Yes, you are right, but I imagine that there will be an "intelligent design", that, or that the operation of the scarabs is still plausible, even with the black goo. Another odd thing is that I dont see how the xenomorph may be practical weapons to kill other species...And then how they get rid of these monsters? There must be a reason to use this weapon, perhaps to extract DNA from us or to revive any extinct creature. BTW, the black goo is somewhat similar to that black liquid form District 9. In fact may also alter DNA and cause mutationsbut the funny thing is that this goo insectoid used as fuel XD [img]http://i1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj636/skybeast3/district9_4_zpsc9128a2e.jpg[/img] [img]http://i1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj636/skybeast3/district9bdcap4_original_zpse827535b.jpg[/img]

"But one of the big mysteries is change the container for the green Crystal...because seriusly...What does that mean?!" Well if its a change that comes as part of Lindeloff then again its his usual lol... to be fair though the movie was shot with his draft and so the changes to Crystall must have come from Ridley or Fox. District 9 what a film that was lol.. And as far as the Robert Wadlow image you posted, this guys looks a fair share larger to that person than the Engineer did to the crew of Prometheus yet that Engineer was supposed to be over 1ft taller than Robert Wadlow, having been revised down from being a supposed 3ft taller than him lol... But again i guess its case of how to we create the Illusion. But Lord of the Rings showed years ago how this can be achieved. [img]http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/114120/2836385-lotr_the_fellowship_of_the_ring_aragorn_11449246_1280_720.jpg[/img] In real life those Actors who play Men are only 4-6 inchs taller than those actors who played the Hobbits... Maybe doing this kind of trickery was too time consuming and costly for Prometheus Budget but i do hope they can use similar to give us better scale of the Elders in Paradise.

@shambs, In a little short story i entered into that prop contest, the Engineers used Xenomorphs because it was an efficient way of wiping out a population, while preserving that planet's future habitability. Kill the people, not destroy the world.

Now, that's not canon, of course...but i think it makes sense.

Well we do not know for sure how Ridley wanted the Xeno to Evolve from Alien, and we do not know how safe it was to move any Eggs that was Morphed but we do know that the Eggs on the Derelict was not a Safe Weapon to Store. As Ridley did say one of the Cargo got to the Space Jockey. If we expand upon that with Aliens and the Queen, then while this would appear to be perfect Weapon to a degree, it is also a Weapon that can procreate well and a World could end up being invested with Millions and Millions of Eggs, even if the Xeno dies out maybe the Eggs can survive? Unless they only can if they are kept under certain conditions and Stasis.... So while they may have used the Xeno and Urns as Bio Weapons, maybe they are only useful for destroying current Life on the Targeted World. A Nuke is the Perfect Weapon for Destruction but if WW3 broke out and say a country Nuked another say if Russia Nuked the UK or at least did 10X more damage to it than Hiroshima. Well if the Russians wanted to use London or gain London well it would be of new use to them due to the fall out. So its not a ideal Weapon if you intend to use the land you bomb for your own gain and i feel the same thing is with the Xeno. That it maybe just a Weapon that is used to rid of a threat and not used to take land or a planet... Unless their is a bigger picture and purpose for the Bio Weapons.