Prometheus 2 plot, possible just speculation not FACT

Thoughts_Dreams..

Those Questions are a Mystery we dont know how long the life expectancy of a Xenomorph is...

But i can try and answer these two.

• How long from his home planet did he get?
• How close to earth did he get?

If we can take Ridleys comment on the Space Jockey, he implied that the Space Jockey was off to a undisclosed location but he did not get far before he fell victim to his cargo.

If this is to be considered true, then its a case of how far is not far? In Galactic Terms how far is not far for a Juggernaught?

30 Min Walk dont get you far, but 2 Miles is not far for a walk... 30 Minute drive can get you say 25-50 miles which is further but not far as in journey time in a Car.

So was Ridley meaning distance? or time of travel... if he means distance then the Space Jockey may have left LV-223 or some place not far.  That we have yet to see. if ever.

The destination was never mentioned... Ridleys comments as above was after Prometheus though.... so maybe the Space Jockey was not going to Earth?  Could he been going to Paradise or some other place.

Ridleys comments suggest and has is others on the subject in the past... that LV-426 was not a planned destination.

So with the clues in Prometheus and how close LV-223 and LV-426 are and connections, then it could point to the Derelict having left LV-223 but only got as far as LV-426 ... i had a theory on this but its for another subject i think i covered it before... well its 3 related theories.

One being he went into Cryo Sleep... awoke by himself and set off not knowing in the hundred years or so he was in Cryo-Sleep his cargo had evolved...  I think this is what they are going with...

The source did say that Prometheus did have lots of clues to the answers, i,e Space Jockey and Eggs. But they was vague and not explored in depth but they was in our face the whole time.

Big Dave:

It is probably alright to see new monsters but if they will not show the Xeno then they should at least show a bit of how it was made, better than they did in Prometheus. Maybe they don’t need to show the whole process but they should show enough to let us piece together one + one knowing that we could be wrong since some of the puzzle has been left out so to speak but that we understand much of it. Having an answer like this would be alright to me because it wouldn’t be extremely obvious whole at the same time it wouldn’t be as confusing as Prometheus was.

To see the new one based on Necronom 4 would be interesting. So I did a search for Necronom 4 and it looks interesting. Hopefully the unused ideas for Prometheus are good enough but seeing how Prometheus became I have my doubts not that the monsters in Prometheus sucked even though they were not better than the Xeno. Anyways it will be interesting to see what kind of monsters they will make.

As far as Ridley’s next comment about a fresher version of the Xeno it contradicts his first idea that the Xeno is done with. It just seems strange so I am not sure what he thinks.

Hopefully they will use some kind of Ultramorph or something similar to that. It would have been interesting to see how it would have looked like. My guess is that the Ultramorph was one of the good ideas that weren’t used in Prometheus but they did a lot wrong though. What if we say that the human skin would be so you could see all the muscles and so on under the skin. What if this could be used when we see the new monster? Maybe this could work eventually that is what you mean.

Maybe mankind played a big role why the Xeno was created, like the Engineers created the Xeno as a response to mankind’s growing power but that mankind wasn’t involved in creating it. I guess that this is what you mean. This could be interesting but we will see how they will make it work.

The Xenomorph in Alien Covenant, well it can be debated how much they should use it if it would be featured at all. Maybe they could use it a little but I would rather see new monsters most of the time so maybe they could have the Xeno for some minutes or what ever in the movie while they spend more time on the new ones but the new monsters must be interesting enough. Hopefully it won’t be a new born like in Alien Resurrection, that wouldn’t be very great. The newborn wasn’t a total failure it had potential but they could have changed how it acted and make it more murderous and changed a bit about how it looked like. At least they were trying something new. What is your opinion about the newborn Alien in Resurrection?

About where the Space Jockey was traveling to yes it could have been anywhere but it could have made sense for the destination to be earth if we look at the Xenos as a punishment for mankind. Maybe he wasn’t heading for earth that time but to some Engineer base or maybe a place where the Engineers had created other life forms to rule over but that they started to disobeyed so they would be punished as well as mankind would? I have nothing to back this up with, it just a thought that I have.

LV-426 seems to be a place where the SJ crash landed as far as I have understood from reading about it.

I am thinking this about the evolved things in the SJ cargo. Wouldn’t he have noticed it like if he would have seen a mark (burn like in I think it was in Alien 3)? Maybe he started to feel sick after a while and drew the conclusion that he was infected by the Alien but by that time it was too late to do anything about it.

About the eggs in Prometheus it could have been that the urns turned into eggs, but I think that has been discussed before. I am not sure how that would work in practice but in a sci-fi movie then maybe. The urns should have been something else I feel but the urns are alright. Maybe they contained some material that the Engineers did that the Engineers through some sort of scientific kick-start turned into eggs, like pushing a button when you shall get light – you push a button and the rest takes care of itself.

“The source did say that Prometheus did have lots of clues to the answers, i,e Space Jockey and Eggs. But they were vague and not explored in depth but they were in our face the whole time.”

That is one of the reasons why they failed, they felt that it was in your face but obviously much of the audience didn’t feel that way. I am not sure if we shall blame Fox or lazy writing but I think that Spaights would have answered that in a better way than what we saw on screen.

Prometheus had many interesting ideas, I got to admit that. The problem is that they were executed in such an underwhelming way so much of it (not everything) became a disappointment.

Isn't in your face another way to say that it is direct and obvious? Maybe I am mistaken but English isn't my first language but if in your face is the same as obvious then it wasn't. Sorry but they failed in many ways.

The sources claims about in your face was vague and i think they refer to what Prometheus had shown us, but i think the way they shown us was not explained.  I guess it also depends on the edit of the movie.

So by in your face, i think they mean many things which include how close LV-223 and LV-426 are located and how the Juggernaught had Chest Busted Crypods, i also think maybe how the Frescos and Mural hold key if we look at other things, the time frame of the events of the Outbreak 2000 years ago.  The Xeno DNA especially the Trilobite and Deacon.  I think visually yes there was clues that if we saw them explained more or had more time on screen with a odd comment from a Member of Cast to Narrate a bit about what is happening like Holoways "just another Tomb"  which implies the Mural is actually part of a Door to another chamber.

Maybe they meant the Answers are there also by comments made by cast members..?  Like how Janek mentioned and maybe linking that LV-223 was a place they made something they was not supposed to and they (Engineers) where not stupid enough to do so on their own doorstep.   These told us LV-223 is not the Engineers Homeworld..... before the ending where David says the Engineers did not come from there.

So yes there was clues and connections but they are half done, or vague and need you to think and then no one can really come up with the correct answers.

Few things was less ambiguous, like LV-223 being a place they created and tested such Horrid and Evil Bio-logical Warfare that they intended to use on Worlds.

Big Dave:

Alright but that isn’t what in your face means to me, to me it means that it is obvious or maybe forced down your throat so to speak, well Prometheus wasn’t that it was more like the opposite. There were answers but they were very vague. As far as the editing they might have decided to first show the scenes in a particular order but then they changed their minds so maybe that made it difficult to follow it. Why couldn’t they have decided in which sequence that they should have it before they decided to shoot the movie?

The Trilobite and the Deacon were OK but they could have been done better. I think that you wrote how the Engineer got face burns from the Trilobite and how they edited it away. My example of the movie have them left but it seems to me that there are editions that removed the face burns and if so that it totally stupid and makes it more confusing. The tomb comment didn’t make sense to me but now when you say it then it makes more sense but this is also a problem with the dialogue and how they created the characters and not only the connection to the Xeno.

You might be correct that some of the answers in the dialogue for example how Shaw said “first they created us and then they tried to destroyed us.” but that was far from enough. There has got to be a way for it to be explained better than that.

If there are connections that are half there and half not then it seems to me that they haven’t really thought about it as much as they could and to some it results in a movie that is confusing. Vague clues plus a bunch of characters that don’t really work together makes it a confusing movie to many. They should really release a movie where they explained what happened behind the scenes before they were releasing the movie, that could be interesting in itself. Since it would be a documentary you could allow different parts of the creators to give their version of what happened and what could have been better.

LV-223 was like a lab where they were testing different animals for warfare; that was kind if obvious even though that part wasn’t very much explained either. The monsters were parts that made this movie enjoyable except for the Hammerpede since I am not sure how it ties into the Xeno except for the fact that it has acid for blood. If they would have been smart they should have replaced the Hammerpede with something that would have been closer to the Xeno even though I am not sure what that would have been. Hopefully Alien Covenant will explain this better.

“Just another tomb” wasn’t very obvious to me either because I understood it as the whole place was a big grave yard maybe I can be excused since English isn’t my first language. Yes it could be the way they mentioned things. Janek’s comment about that they did something that turned on them makes sense.

Hopefully they will think things through better the next time so it fits more logically even though they don’t need to spell it all out.

Yeah im not 100% sure on what they meant by in your face, i think they mean that clues are on screen or also from when we watch the movie.

But they are very open...

So i think maybe they mean that if you "knew" where they was "going" or they show us the answers and then we look back at Prometheus we would go.... "oh i missed that"  so i think it was in a way that the answers are there but they are in a way that the Audience has a hard time to piece them together.

The source is very vague so as to not give much away, this is assuming they are telling the truth, and i think indeed the Full Shooting of Prometheus would maybe given more clues.

Or was they referring to only the theatrical release. And i am not sure if when they said this comment if they are applying it to the Xenomorph Origins, the Reason for the Xenomorph, The Space Jockey and Egg Cargo or what ever.  Its hard to see if they meant all of those had answers to a degree or just a few or one of these but never said which one.

Only the the questions left about the Space Jockey and Bio-Weapon and connection had its answers in Prometheus but you had to really look for them.

Like i said previous, could that be via dialog, could it be by the DNA connections i.e Hammerpede, Shaws Trilobite Squid Baby, could it be the Mural, Fresco, the Cryo Pod Chest Busted Engineers.

I think the source is implying that the movie had some of the answers, but like you i cant see them as in your face because to me in your face means Spoon Fed.

We see that Shaws Trilobite Baby, acts like a Face Huger, that is Spoon Fed, but we dont know if this is showing us how they came to be, or how they could etc.

If we are talking about the connection.

Here are some points they have made.

*The Xenomorph was created or influenced more by Mankind than the Engineers, well Mankind played the bigger part.  (what they meant they wont say)

*Mankind had been to that system prior to Prometheus.  (how, when and why, was never said)

*Mankind is 4th/5th Generation of our kind, and there have been Generations before, that the creators had evolved and wiped out. (what they mean, they are not clear, but i think maybe they hinted Engineers are maybe a earlier or later Generation?)

*LV-223 and LV-426 Incident are connected.

As far as the Sequel went....

*The Organism can be re-created provided you have the knowledge and tools to do so. (i think that means if David has the knowledge and tools he can re-create the Xenomorph). Thus shows how its created, but not showing how it was first created.

This would tie up loose ends for sure.

And so who knows... but i think maybe it does point to LV-223 being used for many experiments, but its all a bit vague.

The idea behind Prometheus 2 was not really to go all Xeno Origin and a Alien movie... these was maybe a small part like Prometheus but maybe have more explanation, so i think if we consider The Black Goo in Prometheus and everything that lead from it being Xeno DNA in Prometheus and its screen time, i think maybe the source was trying to say we would only see such similar smaller amounts devoted to the Organism, maybe less but the appearences would make more of a connection to the Original.

I think the movie was to give more screen time to the Engineers and reasons for why LV-223 and a little about the Agenda and Fall/Rebellion they had with their Hierarchy more than anything else.

But the source has never come out and exactly said this is going to happen or this, they had expanded loosely on a few things.... one being the Monsters we was to see, in that one was a past event, (Prior to David and Shaw leaving LV-223 or maybe prior to even Prometheus)  one was a new event that David had a hand in and was post Prometheus.   And that they are both different to each other, yet they both are similar to the Original Xenomorph..... one would be similar to the Ultramorph, Necromon iV design, and they are going to have one that is partially see through.  Again they never said if this applied to the Ultramorph or the other one.  Or if David has his hands in the Ultramorph one or the other.

So i cant be sure what they are saying, apart from the movie was to have Two Monsters, and that Two Monsters we cant be sure if they are in same timeline i.e one plays a part in the other, or if we have Two Monsters as in only 2... it could mean Two Types...

Such as Prometheus had (excluding Fifield) Two Monsters too, we had the Hammerpede and Shaws Baby.

But then there was 2 Hammerpedes, and Shaws Baby lead to the Deacon so we could say Prometheus had 4 monsters, in which case maybe Alien had 3 (Face Huger, Chest Buster and Big Guy).

Or do we take the stance that Alien had One Monster the Xenomorph and Prometheus had two the Hammerpede and Shaws Trilobite. (that lead to the Deacon as part of its lifestyle).

And so when the source said Two Monsters, it may not mean only Two but Two kinds?

But this was maybe not going to be the main focus as it was not going to be a Alien movie, only it would have clues.

But thats saying if the Source is right or True, and now we have Alien Covenant it seems a number of changes are made to bring back the Xenomorph, and even Ripley into the Picture.

Oh also as far as Two Monsters being different, and yet both similar to the Original Xenomorph... i think the same thing applies to the Fresco Creature and the Deacon at the end...

Both of those never really looked the same, but they both shared similarities to the Xenomorph.

But when they said one was similar to the Original Necromon 4 idea and unused Ultramorph, it depends which design

I think both are Awesome, and i like how light the Skin is, and i think actually something like this that is partially see through would have been Fantastic.

But i think we are going to see a more traditional Xenomorph in Alien Covenant

Which is more Mechanical looking than the previous two.

Big Dave:

Yeah that might be so but those clues could have been better. I read somewhere that there were a lot that was cut out that could have made more sense in the movie, what a pity. To me it seems they made a lot of dumb decisions when they edited it.

It could be both through dialogue and through visual things. Hopefully they will have better dialogue this time because the dialogue show a bit about how they characters are, their motivations, and so on. Prometheus could have been better when it comes to this.

The Trilobyte was cool but they could have made more of it so it could have had a stronger connection to the Face hugger. One thing that I wonder about the Trilobyte is that it was very big so wouldn’t that be a dis-advantage when it would move? In Aliens we saw something similar when Ripley said that “It was Burke” (after Ripley and Newt were rescued by Hicks and some other of the marines) but it was smaller and hence it could move faster. Are the murals and fresco different things? I am not sure, can you explain that?

When they say that mankind played a role in the creation of the face hugger it seems to me that it was created as a weapons against mankind by the Engineers. Mankind could have played an indirect role.

Hopefully they will explain a bit about how LV-426 and LV-223 are connected except for that they have similar names. They don’t need to explain that very much since I think that there are things that are more interesting. Prometheus had interesting environments so they will probably succeed in that this time also. Some people were very negative about Prometheus and complained about the worlds also but I think that is something that they managed to get right.

Maybe it would be alright to show how it could be re-created but not how it was done initially because it would keep some of the mystery. This would probably be my preferred scenario/explanation so they won’t show too much.

I am looking forward to the new monsters, hopefully one will be a see through monster. I am not really sure if all need to be connected to the Xeno because if they aren’t then it would show that the Engineers are far more dangerous since they would have the knowledge of how to make different biological weapons. Hopefully they will make the Engineers a bigger threat in the next movie but I am not really sure if you can see them as very bad since they are very human looking. The less familiar a threat is the more dangerous it becomes. Eventually this is where one of the failures with the Engineers lies that they are too similar to humans. Remember that they said that the DNA samples of the Engineer head was similar to human beings. Unfortunately that was a bad choice since it feels less threatening that way. I think that it was Shaw and another woman that took the samples. I am not sure what the name of the other character was but she probably wasn’t that important or interesting but I think that she was supposed to speak Scottish.

As far as bringing a Ripley connection I am not very interested in that. To me the Alien movies are not even about Ripley but rather about humans that get into situations that they can’t deal with very good and how they would act in a possible situation like that. Ripley could be replaced and we would still have the same kind of movie. Maybe this is to have too much of an Alien connection. Prometheus had too little so maybe this one will have too much, I don’t know.

The Engineer hierarchy might be less interesting than their agenda. Maybe a little would be explained about their society also. I mean their hierarchy as a connection between them and their Gods. As far as seeing a little bit about their hierarchy as far as how their society is organized it could be interesting to see a little about that.

Big Dave: I hope that it will not be very traditional. As far as the pictures I prefer those that have no eyes because it leaves more up to the imagination about how they can sense things.

The Trilobyte was how it was and not more like a Face Huger because it was a Hybrid between the DNA in the Black Goo Urns that has Xeno Traits and a Humans.

The Fresco and Mural dont seem to have a direct connection not one that can be made easy, but they are supposed to be connected.

The Fresco is the more interesting Mystery, the Creature featured in it, does appear to be the one holding the Egg in the other fresco.... how all this fits its open to debate... i have covered it on related Threads.

What i am interested in is how to me the Fresco was more like the Prometheus Punishment Fresco than Adam and God one, also the Alien Egg one, it is held in a similar fashion to HR Giger's pose with the Xeno Egg Prop... maybe shows us the Fresco Creature is the creator and origin of the Egg? 

But then tying into Star Beast maybe it is the Sacrifice for the Egg?  It has to be connected some how.

To me also i see the Fresco Engineer with a C-Section Scar like Shaw had...  and the way i interpret it is that something was sent down to Punish the Engineers and they or a Faction are the Prometheus, not maybe one Engineer but symbolic of all those rebellious Engineers.

Either the image shows a Punishment and Fate that connects to the Fresco, and in relation to Prometheus those Engineers will forever endure this punishment where the Eagle pecking the Liver from outside, is replaced by Something pecking its way out. i.e Chest Buster.

The C-Section?  Maybe those Host Engineers have the Organism Cut from them, and then re-stitched up to then have to go through the whole thing again.

Take Shaw.... she removed the Squid Baby Trilobite, what if David managed to Qaurantine and keep the Organism.... if he then caught Shaw and infected her Eggs again would she not become pregnant again?

And then see David C-Section the Organism and repeat the process over and over?

Like Prometheus and his Punishment over and over...

I think maybe there is a connection?

The Result of this Chest Buster, then led to something else and then experiments on this, to create different types of Face Huger in the aim of Perfection.

Which the Deacon in the Mural was, and its DNA was then seeded into the Urns... for use to then upgrade Mankind.

I think these Engineers created something or did something against the Hierarchy and was punished, but then they turned their punishment to their advantage created something new from it and used this on their Homeworld and then intended to use it on Earth?

I think something similar is what could have been happening.... thats just from the clues i had.

I will have to look at the sources clues and see what i can gain from them, but we cant take them as Fact as they could be incorrect.. even though some of those clues could fit with my ideas.

We dont know what route the movie is going as far as Alien Covenant and monsters, and how much has changed from Green and Paglens drafts... it would be interesting to find out if they are close to what the source said however?

But i do think we are going to see a more Bio-Mechanical Xenomorph close if not the same as those in Alien.

I would love to know what the connections was, and i hope we get the Fresco covered in some way.

The Source did say regarding the Engineers, and Paradise Lost a few things.

These are what stuck out as interesting...

*That the Engineers/Fallen Angels connection with regards to Paradise Losts Punishment of the Fallen Angels, where some of them were turned into Serpents, would be seen as freedom from Bondage in regards to the Engineers.

*That without Sin, in context of Paradise Lost there would be No Serpents/Dragons AKA Xenomorph.

What they mean who knows.... Paradise Lost does tell of the Fallen Angels being turned into Serpents they are punished and are no longer the same appearance as their non-fallen Angel counterparts.

Is this how eventually those Engineers gain their Bio-Tech or those Pressure Suit looks? or is this how the Xenos came to be? or related?

As far as Sin, she can be connected to many other Culture and Mythos beings... Sin was said to have the bottom half body or a Serpent/Fish and she had like Reptilian looking Dog heads as a tail, but she also gave birth to such Dog like beings, and they constantly be breaking her entrails as she is constantly Pregnant and giving birth to such horrors.

She and her Offspring Guard the Gate of Hell.

We could connect that to what happened with Shaw?

When we look at the description of Sin, and her appearance and offspring then she is also linked to a number of other beings which include.

1) Echidna (Greek) Mother of Monsters, gave birth to many which included.

*Cerberus Multi headed Hell Hound who Gaurds the Gates of Hades (Hell), similar to the Multiple Hound Heads that protrude from her (Sin) Tail that Gaurd Hell

*Gorgons which include Medusa, who can turn people to stone, but also her blood can give life and bring death.

*Caucasian Eagle which is the Eagle that Ate at Prometheus Liver every day as his Punishment.

2) Lilith who has many Myths, including being Adams First Wife, who disobeyed Adam and would not submit to him and was punished and turned into a horrid part Serpent Monster...  Lilith is also connected with Lamia and Succubus and Vampires... but also connected to Sin.

Going a little off topic there.... but maybe there is a connection... Gigers one artwork is Li, he has done and based many of his female works off this.. which was his Ex Partner... but also done in a way influenced by the Godess Lilith

Does this mean some non-literal maybe Female Figure plays a Role in the Xenomorph?  The Sin/Lilith/Echidna was Mother of Monsters and many being Serpentine.

Sin was born from Satan's Head as Punishment for his Rebellion against God... and was Satans Daughter.

Now what if the Fresco is Lucifer/Satan... he given birth to a Creature, the Fresco one and what if this is Sin, and his daughter and she birth Monsters... Eggs, this would connect the Xeno Egg being held by the creature and how it is similar to HR Gigers pose with the Egg which implied creator of the Egg.

But Sin was born from Satans head... but how is a Child Born, as Sin had no Mother... in a normal conception a Father and Mother are used... the Life Cycle of a Human and many creatures, is via Sexual Intercourse that then gives birth to the Offspring.. Shaws Trillobite included.

But in the Alien Franchise, the Aliens Life Cycle and how it is Born in part is from a single Parent the Host... the start of this Birthing does not start with Sexual Intercourse... but Face Hugging...

Thus Born from the Head?

So maybe the Prometheus Satan/Lucifer was Punished as Satan in Paradise Lost and Sin was born from his Head... Face Hugged..... by some creature... that gave birth to Sin... Creature in the Fresco who is Mother to all Monsters?

Thats just me trying to make some connections based of Prometheus Clues, and trying to piece in what the Source could have meant by.

in context to Paradise Lost Poem and Prometheus 2 the Fallen Angels (Engineers) Punishment (turned to serpents) plays a key role in freedom from bondage.

And how in same context that without Sin, there would be no Xenomorph.

But then as they also said Mankind plays the role in the Xenomorph, that and without Sin, in context to Paradise Lost may not mean Satans Daughter, but Sin as in going against the rules off God and being Sinners which then brings about Punishment.... which is the Xeno?

This HR Giger Image shows what could be Sin being birthed from Satans Head. We see the connections with Serpents, and they seem to be spewing forth mutations, of different creatures mutated and mangled together.

She is in a Sacrificial Cruciform pose.....

Gigers first Lilith..

The Top Image is Gigers (The Spell 4) Below is his The Spell 2

Many of his works has the image of Satan, in connection with this Female Figure Lilith if you look at The spell 2, and 4 then compare similarities to HR Gigers Alien Mural that was never used, there are similar themes.

Especially if we look at the Sacrificial Table, this Tables Design is featured in the other images.

Not saying its all a connection, but its interesting that HR Giger and his Bio-Mechanical Sexual Images all seemed to share a lot of themes, which include the Female Lilith and Satan and so we can connect Satan and Sin and thus AKA Sin/Lilith.

Who knows if any of this is connected however..

But it has me wondering... especially that without Sin, there can be no Serpents/Dragons... comment the source made...

And indeed HR Giger invented the Dragon/Serpent that was the Xeno as far as how it looked, and his images do have a Satan and Female Sacrifice connection as far as connected to his perverted Bio-Mechanical Nightmares and their creations.

without Gigers Lilith would his images had given birth to the many Monstrous Bio-Mechanical Nightmares?

And then when the source mentioned about how regarding the Xenomorph..... if you had the knowledge and tools of how it was created..... it could be re-created.

And so if there was no Xenomorph without Sin/Lilith... then in order for it to be created again maybe there needs to be a new Sin/Lilith well a Female Sacrifice.

And well could that be Shaw?

Maybe im running away with things a bit too much?

Got me thinking now though... lol

*Shaw plays a small role, is incapacitated for most part and Technically not Dead?

*If you had the knowledge and tools of how the Xeno was created, you could re-create it?

*Two new Monsters one is a event post Prometheus that David plays a role in?  Means other is in the past?

Could these mean, that we see Flash Back of the Origin of the Xeno, a Scene in the past as in thousands of years ago...

Then David with this knowledge of how and whats needed to create the Xenomorph... he then re-creates  it and thats where Monster 2 comes in?

*Without Sin/Lilith there is no Xenomorph, and so when i look at those images of Gigers...

Does Shaw play the role required by Sin/Lilith and is this thus our Shaw now?

The source did say that a concept was of some Humanoid connected to some Bio-Mechanical Machine.

That surely fits with the above... lol

But maybe this is wishful thinking and trying to connect things that are not connected, and maybe i have interpreted the clues wrong..

Thats saying if there is any TRUTH to them in the first place.

So its a case of just wait and see what Ridley and Fox have really got in store.... but i hope its interesting and they do give a Nod to HR Giger  i think they may do as a Tribute to his work after his passing

R.I.P HR Giger

O_O

I would be very happy if everything listed here comes to fruition. Pretty much contains everything I'm interested in within the Xeno universe.

Things I've always suspected.....

The Derelict in Alien is actually perched upon a subterranean Engineer outpost onto which it crash landed after leaving LV223, 2000 years or so after the Engineer outbreak on LV426 as seen in holographic playback in Prometheus. The egg chamber is located within this building. The Space Jockey is one of the Engineers who escaped the happenings of LV223 and after being either face hugged or somehow effected by what ever was chasing and ultimately destroyed his or her group on LV223 pilots to LV426 in order to escape. The Xeno which ultimately burst from the Space Jockey made its way down into the complex setting up a hive, becoming a Queen, laying eggs and ultimately dying off with Age. Here leads to Alien.

The Engineers are no more than meat bag and or clones of a superior species. We have seen a glimpse of this species craft in the tear drop vessel at the start of Prometheus. The superior species has either enslaved and or via a God like process procured the Engineers to give up their DNA for the use of procreation of Xenomorphic species on other worlds, either to create or destroy. These two species have been around for tens of thousands of years.

What ever happened on LV223 two thousand years before Prometheus was caused by a possible mutiny of the Engineers. Their superiors found out and punished the Engineers. A possible loose reference to the God Prometheus.

The creature seen in the loving embrace of an Engineer on the mural in Prometheus is another sub species used by both the Engineers and their superiors. These could also be the multiple dead and desiccated creatures seen in the spy set photo from Covenant.

The Xenomorph strain, even though originated by the Engineer species via the Black Goo can also move on to reproduce in more natural ways depending on subsequent species and combinations of methods of contagion and or hosting including egg morphing, egg laying or by the introduction of the black goo directly to a viable being.

There is no need of any form of time travel......

I truly look forward to finding out.

"The creature seen in the loving embrace of an Engineer on the mural in Prometheus is another sub species used by both the Engineers and their superiors. These could also be the multiple dead and desiccated creatures seen in the spy set photo from Covenant."

Hopefully we would get some clues to this, but everyone has a interpretation and to me the Fresco i think you mean looks more like Punishment the Engineer does not look comfortable with the Creature yet the creature looks like its sitting in a submissive position and so who knows...

But i notice the Scar like a C-Section and i think the Fresco is a representation of Prometheus.

To me the Engineer is more in the same pose with a similar Scar, as this Prometheus Fresco.

The Source did say that they are loosely basing the Plot as far as Creation and Hierarchy on common connections with Religion and Mythos in particular Biblical and Greek and so we have Titans, and Olympians as a Hierarchy but the Biblical event has only a Hierarchy under a single God (Monotheism).  And they are to all connect loosely and so maybe the Titans are Angels? etc

They said its mainly Paradise Lost and the Greek Prometheus Mythos Stories that the movies plot is touching upon in a sense, in other words maybe it wont go as deep as every aspect of the Biblical God, or the Full Greek God Origins and how they could connect.

Maybe we can draw a similarity with The Sumerian Mythos which would include the Anunnaki Tales these Gods are depicted as sometimes the same images, tablets etc that feature the same beings only in one they appear as Bearded Men, the other the head is replaced by a Eagle.  Maybe this could loosely be fitted in, in that these Gods could be Evolved into more Eagle looking beings.

The creature in the Fresco could have that beaked look to it. But also it looks a lot like O'Bannons idea for the Star Beast

So the Beauty with the Franchise is we can not be sure which theory works or fits and what clues will lead us all too, but i hope Ridley and Fox do cover some of the clues that lead many of us to our theories.

I have studied the Set Photos, and some speculation its a Xeno Related Outbreak like what happened on LV-223 or that its by David 8

But while it could be the dropping of Black Goo, as we have not seen added CGI and after effects... i only see just One Alien Being in those images who could maybe not be fully Human/Engineer Looking, but then the images are so low resolution its hard to tell.

To me the Scene looks like a Punishment, like what God did to Sodom and Gomorrah

Before these Set images had been released and so it was about March, the Source Mentioned stuff about how Mankind now as in Prometheus and Alien and 21st, 22nd Centuries is actually 4th or 5th Generation.

And that God has destroyed and evolved life on Earth over and over...

And then later, they said that the movie covers (well to consider it covers) not a Literal Paradise Lost and Biblical Events as far as Punishment God has handed out to Man over and over.

But that these events have happened in context to the movie but not in a literal sense and not necessarily as the Bible Indicates....   And so the Bible and Paradise Lost are in context of the movie. not about Punishment on Mankind...  but as far as similar events on previous Generations of Mankind.

Also that Literally Paradise Lost and the Bible, show us that we have Heaven above Earth, we have Hell below Earth, and that Paradise was on Earth and the Garden of Eden was in Paradise...  Evidence Proves these where Literally located around the area that is now Middle East and North Africa meet, but no one has been able to confirm the Exact place just it was on Earth and in and around a area that can be between Egypt, Syria and Iraq

But off course in Prometheus Paradise is not even located on Earth and so its not to be taken Literal, which means places like Hell, and Garden of Eden could maybe be shown to exist within context of Prometheus movies, but it wont be a place on Earth... so for example Hell could be LV-223 or LV-426 or even Paradise who knows.

And so after the Alien Covenant set image came out it added up to what the source was saying, and indeed we are seeing Punishment and Fall of Angels and Man, but maybe to not look at it as in context of the Bible...

And so who knows Mankind could be a later Generation of the Engineers, that scene seems to show what appear to be Human looking Aliens, that have no Hair, none of them do and they are all what you would call Perfect Human Specimens, i.e they are not short, or overweight etc...

And we see Females... so this is either Engineers, or a race related to the Engineers, either prior to them or after them or even created at the same time.. or they are a earlier Race of Mankind that was destroyed in the past.

So its interesting but maybe the Engineers are just a our Ancestors and while Evolution shows us to come from Apes so the theory goes.

What if we take this image but imagine the Engineers replace the Ape, or they are another part of the chain be that 3rd Generation... and two others prior who look a lot less Engineer but still a little.

That image above shows us 6 Evolutionary steps, to Mankind from Ape....  What if the Elders are at Number 3, Engineers Number 4, those beings in those Set photos being Punished are at Number 5 and then we are at Number 6?

The source has not said this, but its just maybe one interpretation i have of what they said.

As always Big Dave, beautifully written and wonderfully researched.

Big Dave:

Unfortunately the fresco didn’t tell me very much. I am not sure why they even put it there if it doesn’t make sense. They should be smart enough to see what works and what don’t even though I don’t think that 5they should be underestimating the audience.

It could be interesting to see what the sin would be that created the Xenomorphs or rather that gave them (who ever they are) to make the Xeno.

I haven’t read much about Lilith even though I have heard about her. Maybe she could be used for a character in Alien Covenant in a way?

The Fresco picture could be who ever but it would be cool if it would be a figure that has some connection to it.

Sin as far as mankind going against the Engineers and being punished by that be the creation of the Xenomorph could be interesting. What if earth was given by the Engineers to mankind in a way and then they see us destroy it so the Engineers get mad at mankind and decide to exterminate us by upgrade its invention as far as life forms go by making the Xeno as a way to replace mankind.

As far as new monsters yes there could have been monsters that were created in the past. Remember that the Engineers are creating live forms a bit now and then so that could have been a possibility.

I hope that we will not see exactly where and when the Xeno was created but that we could get some clues to how it was created. One thing that I like about the Xeno is that it has some mystery about it which gives some room to speculate and I think that it should stay that way.

Having Shaw tied to a machine that gives the birth to the Xeno could be an interesting thing. This could be used like the theme of the mad scientists that do horrible things but that is smart at the same time – smart and dangerous at the same time.

They sure have a huge possibility to do some homage to Giger with this movie.

"Unfortunately the fresco didn’t tell me very much"

It was ambiguous, and i think not being able to see it well really made it harder to work out, The Mural and Two Frescos never got much screen time and so the only people who could study it would be those who have looked at the stills, and on set work and concept work for them.

If you only saw the movie then you would not see enough to spot much.

Here is a brief observation because it has been covered elsewhere.

• These cannot be purely coincidence, they are there for a reason and so they have to be connected.

• The First One many have figured it could show the Creature as a Creation of the Engineer, maybe its like the Adam and God Fresco, and yes it could look that way and the creature is in a submissive posture but its also a fetal (new born) posture. And the Engineers body language is not the same as in Adam and God Fresco.

• Another alternative way to look at it is if we take Prometheus Myth connection, then it looks a lot like one Prometheus Punishment Fresco the Engineer is similar posture and he also has similar look on his face. There is the Scar on the Engineer, similar to Shaw having a  C-Section but the Creature is not in a position that seems like its Eating at the Engineer like the Eagle and Prometheus... however  maybe its a Metaphor and what if the Engineer is used as a Host and then has something removed like Shaw’s C-Section and they have to go over this over and over.  The creature being the result of this.

Then the other Fresco which was not really shown clear in Prometheus and held the biggest clue maybe to Alien, we see a Alien Egg open and being carried by a Creature that is either the Fresco Creature a Xenomorph or a related Organism to both, what can this mean?

• The Creature is trying to get itself Face Hugged and so is a sacrifice? Maybe!

• The Creature is the one who transports the Eggs to Hosts, or Engineer Ships?

• Maybe again and my view this is similar to the HE Giger Shot of him holding a Egg on Set for a photo, were Giger is off course the creator of the Egg it came from Him, and so maybe this fresco shows the Creature in the Mural is where the Eggs came from, or at least it produced a variety of Eggs.

There has to be a connection between Engineer, Fresco Creature and Eggs and the Xenomorph but its so Ambigious to figure how.

I always wondered was the Fresco showing Prometheus Punishment, where be either.

1) This Punishment led to the Creature that Originated  the Eggs, or was a creature that could create/lay different Eggs to the Alien ones?

2) The Punishment was to be used as a Host over and over again for such Creature.

3) As above but not meaning Prometheus as in a single Engineer, but a whole Fraction/Race whos Punishment is now Hosts for such a Creature.

Then we have the Sources Comments, which kind of push me down two avenues but ill cover them another time