What Weyland-Yutani Know About The Black Goo!

@Codexas

My understanding is the Shinyo Maru ends with Ripley being effected by an egg thats brought on board after docking with the Sulaco. I may have misunderstood.

On the question of arguing over what is Canon or not being silly for fiction I think we all react differently according to our personalties. 

I know one or two people here who like things clear in their mind after thinking it through, the lack of clarity is a barrier to satisfaction with the mythos.

Big Dave obviously revels in the detail and I sense does not like to be boxed in. I am the opposite I am a completer finisher who gains enormously from the task. The task here is to interpret the grand set of ideas into which John Spaights, Damon Lindelof and Ridley Scoot have placed the Zenomorph. I also work on the principle try and make a theory not work lots I can drive a coach and horses through but some are rock solid.

As an example I do not know precisely what happened to the Engineers who succeeded in going into the headroom but there is no doubt the arrangements inside that room kept the Black Goo and the Engineers head under control for thousands of years until mankind or to be precise A I (Artificial Intelligence) opened the door.      

@Codexas

I thoroughly enjoyed the read thank you. 

I will also be watching A 3 assembly cut over the next few weeks.

On the point of the derelict and jockey at the time of Prometheus Ridley indicated it occurred with an few hundred years of the break out on LV223.

However since deciding to back in to A L I E N with a third movie after Covenant if all goes well with the numbers it might suggest otherwise. Dallas could have been mislead over the derelicts age and this is science fiction after all Fox plan to bin A 3 and A Resurrection.

The mural in the headroom represents the culmination of the LV223 experiments and is a fully grown Deacon whether that represents the end point of their achievements we do not know but again Ridley has said there is an evolving creature on Paradise, is this the next step or a re igniting of ancient evil. 

"They’re going to go to the planet where the engineers came from, and come across the evolving creature that they had made. Why did they make it? Why would they make such a terrifying beast? It felt bio-mechanoid, it felt like a weapon. And so the movie will explain that, and reintroduce the alien back into it".

We also know their is a new event and mankind is caught up in the creation of the Zenomorph so how much is a rediscovery and how much is the result of the events of the coming of David and Elizabeth and Covenant to Paradise we can not be entirely certain of which is just great lots to find answers to.  

Fantastic Read... never read that CM file....  its interesting but i think as it maybe shows the company are not 100% sure what they deal with and so while its assuming a few things... (Queen laid Eggs on the Derelict, and a Queen Face Huger is made via signals from Workers when a habitable environment that favors a Hive is established).   It does so in a way that shows the company are piecing information together but they could be wrong...

The ULTIMATE Canon is Movies... and when the Franchise has been finished we finally get maybe a True Canon and hopefully another WYR reference book that can be considered as complete and also more detail...

So right now, as interesting as the CM Game plot is... and i understand as SM said parts are considered Cannon.... once Alien Prequels are done and we get what connects the Xenomorph to Engineers and LV-223 to LV-426 and Paradise.... so the next 2-3 Prequel movies (include Alien Covenant) and after Alien 5 then we should have all our answers... and it will be interesting which of these would then effect the cannon as far as the Weyland Yutani Report.

When the Franchise is finished... we may be led to accept that Alien 3 and Alien R are not canon?

@SM

When i meant what was Canon and not... Ultimately what the Franchise on screen shows will be definitive Cannon...  and things shown in deleted scenes be that Alien and Egg Morph, and Prometheus Elder Engineers etc..... when the Franchise is finished these Deleted Elements could be made as totally none Canon... (i.e if say it shows there is no Egg Morphing, or there are no Old Frail Elders).  After its all said and done, who knows the effect on Alien 3 and Alien R too.

So when i meant Semi Canon i guess i meant on one hand things like Comics... which if we took some like Fire and Stone as Canon then there is that conflict where do we then have to consider Predators in the same Universe?

The Games i have not played so i cant comment really, but that CM file is interesting... it could almost seem a basis for Blomkamps Alien 5

Maybe he followed on from the Games Plot in a way to how the company got the Derelict?  (we still have to ask what about whats on LV-223 and Paradise)....

And so Blomkamps Alien 5 concept seemed to fit in with what potential aftermath from that Colonial Marines.... File Report was looking at.

In his concept Ripley and Hicks do not look as old as the actors do now and so his original idea seemed to take place not too far after Aliens...

But since then he has been in a meeting with Fox and Ridley, and as Ridley said some things in Alien 5 was conflicting with Ridley and Fox's plans for elements in the Prometheus sequels..

Maybe hence the new Alien 5 plot that features Newt in her late 20's and is set 20 years latter. This kind of Plot would conflict with the Colonial Marines Plot and that report as far as when the company inspected the Derelict and what would they have to gain... i.e if they recover a specimen that what makes Ripley get involved 20 years latter?

I also think when i said semi Canon i meant the Games in a way because of some conflicting material.... such as Hudson.... but hell if Alien 3 and Alien R are not to be considered Canon or a Alternative Canon.... then a Alternative route that Alien 5 could take could have it Hudson maybe survived too...?

But to me, it seemed more that only Ripley, Hicks and Newt Survived and thats why i classed the Games as Semi Canon... from my point of view..

But as you said the Weyland Report it seems Fox have most of it as Canon... which include elements from Comics and Games.

But as i have said and you agreed with SM...

Ultimately things can change given time... where these Source Books, Comics, Games deleted movie scenes... could be de-canonized as far as some elements... also comments made by Ridley too....

For example the Space Jockey, Egg Cargo and when and where this event started.... previously he claimed it was a long time ago...

But by the time we finish with Alien Covenant and its Sequels...  the Canon for this could be its a event made via the aftermath of Alien Covenant and the Ships Eggs get laid by something that chest busted from the Space Jockey..

Or maybe they will keep it as a event from the long past... what i am saying is any comments also made prior and after Prometheus could be taken as not canon or changed in exchange for the events they would put down as Canon as shown in the future movies.

"Lol, in the end I guess which collection of sources contradict each other the least is considered canon."

Not really. Fox has their own take on it.  Fans have a thousand differing variations.

"My understanding is the Shinyo Maru ends with Ripley being effected by an egg thats brought on board after docking with the Sulaco. I may have misunderstood."

The events depicted in the CMTM around the Shinyo Maru occur several weeks after the events of Alien 3.

Here's the timeline according to:

http://alienstimeline.ucoz.com/index/alien_3_timeline/0-5

and

http://alienanthology.wikia.com/wiki/Alien_Universe_Timeline

and

http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline

July 28th 2179

Aliens finishes and Ripley, Hicks and Newt enter hypersleep in orbit of Calpamos (Zet Ret IV), and begin voyage back towards the outer rim (Sol).

Aug 8th 2179

Alien egg impregnates Ripley

Aug 9th 2179 (about 10 days later)

EEV crashes in Fiorina 161 after a fire on the Sulaco.

It all makes sense.  According to the Aliens Colonial Marines Technical Manual, the USS Sulaco's Westingland A-59 Lithium-Hydride Fusion Reactor is capable of 0.74 light years per day of velocity, which equals 7000900000000 km per day.

According to the Aliens universe map (which is identical in terms of distance to actual real starmaps):

http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/alienanthology/images/9/96/Alien_Universe_Galactic_Map.gif/revision/latest?cb=20120420164807

Fiorina 161 lies about 2.5 parsecs (8.5 lightyears, 80420000000000 km from Zeta (ζ) 2 Reticuli.

It would take the Sulaco around 10.5 days to reach Fiorina 161. Which the time lines show. (Reaching it around Aug 9th 2179.)

As for the Shinyo Maru having reached LV-426 in September of 2179, don't forget that the ACMTM states that on Sept 14th 2179, the Shinyo Maru send the following transmission: 

Sept 14th

COMFILE /28//sic.shinyom/1119476/savA
SAFARI FLASH.
TO: MANDEC RDIV
SUBJ: REDDOG ONE. EXTRACTION TEAM ON STATION EFFECTIVE SEP 132130. OBJECTIVE 2,000 METERS NE. WILL EXPEDITE. CAMLAC 2 OUTFIRE REPORTS FRIENDS PRESENT IN FORCE. REPEAT, IN FORCE. REQUEST WEAPONS FREE. STANDBY.

So by the times the Shinyo Maru arrives on LV426 she finds a ship from Science Division D15 (Legato) already there. It's unknown how long they were there for.

Somebody actually figured all of this out while writing this stuff.

@Michelle, S.M. & BigDaddy

Glad you guys liked the text I posted. It is from the ACMTM, all fans really owe it to themselves to read it. And you have no excuse as for some reason it's made freely available online this year:

https://vk.com/doc-8949589_284862445?dl=81e9ea54aca33a0934

RE: Timeline links - These are largely copied and pasted from my original Timeline.

That page also has the correct speed for the Sulaco (1.8 ly/day; not 0.74), and the original Alien starmap I created some years ago and which was adapted for use on the Blu-Ray menus.

 @ S.M. Wow what a great page I love it! I've been meaning to add to my collection of Aliens timelines...

But :( your timelines do not describe the events of Aliens Colonial Marines Technical Manual (which is considered canon by most), and the ACM video game and Stasis Interrupted which were announced as canon by Fox up until 2015, maybe that changed, I don't know.

But regarding the Sulaco speed you mention of 1.8 light years per terran day. I don't understand. It doesn't make sense with any of the established timelines or canon. Where did you get this specification?

The ACM TM lists it's speed as 0.74 ly per day:

http://oi63.tinypic.com/fejqe1.jpg

Which makes sense with it's travel times in the movies and timelines established (including yours I believe.)

The CMTM is incorrect.

Z2R is 39 ly from Earth and it took the Sulaco 3 weeks to get there.  39 divided by 21.

@ S.M. Whoa either that doesn't make sense or I'm making a calculation error.

Distance from Sol to Z2R is 39 light years, which is:

369000000000000 km

If you are saying the Sulaco made the trip from Sol to Z2R in 3 weeks, apparently it travelled:

17571428571428.57 km per day.

If the speed of Light C is c= 25900000000 km per day then it travelled:

678 times the speed of light. (678c)

Which makes no sense with what is listed in the technical manual (0.74c) or what you are saying (1.8c)

I'm really bad at math though, I'd love for someone to correct me.

Your calculations about the Sulacos speed are correct (678C) but you're using a different scale.  You're using C while I (and the CMTM) are using Light Years Per Day. 

Yeah, my calculations should not have been nc but ly per day. Thanks :)

In fairness I think the discrepancies listed could be down to cruising speed, vs maximum speed differences.

Pretty big difference.  3 weeks travel time vs 7 1/2 weeks.

The discrepancies are just errors. They got the size of the Sulaco wrong in the CMTM too, but to be fair it was written long before the advent of things like DVD, and later Blu-Ray and the internet, that would've made research a lot easier.

Oh wow I didn't know that. All links on the internet give it's size as 385 metres, which judging by the 5 loading docks, (the interior of one which we see in aliens looks about right.) Which other sources list a different size?

I did my own rough measurements years using stills and correlating that with the size of the dropship, the dropstation airlock, and loading lock and came to something in the 500+m ballpark.

However a guy called Jan Rukr who does papercraft Alien ships, did the most extensive research and arrived at a length of 731m.  After checking this with a couple of other people who'd done a lot of research on it, they concurred and I recommended that length be used in WYR.

The 385m has been repeated so often and is so prevalent now, that it will persist for a long time.  And that's not to rag on or condescend to Brimmicombe Wood and his collaborators or the CMTM - they produced a great book with the resources they had available.

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