Comments (Page 671)

Very interesting. I don't have any details on it, but just noticed the screenshot for 21WT, order 931. Does it say "UADVANCED WEAPONS RESEARCH?"  Possibly a typo?

I'd say both were pretty good out of context (if I'm using that correctly). A:C was a decent stand alone alien movie. Die hard fans didn't get exactly what they wanted, but that's what all the shorts and filler videos are for.

I'm on the 4th Dark Tower novel and thought the movie was also pretty good on it's own.  COmpared to the books, it felt like they tried to squeeze a lot of content and story into a short hour and a half movie.  Very fast paced, but overall I thought it was an entertaining movie.  I have the books to finish if I want more detail, story, and depth.

Lastly, reviews and headlines for new movies can usually be disregarded because they will push in favor of what the author likes. I usually read reviews to get an idea of the content that will be in the movie, and not to decide if it going to be good or not.  Reviews are typically a biased opinions anyways.

"Can not understand A:C tearing up so many things that Prometheus set up. We running out of time and 2hrs screen time is all we have left. 123 mins max."

Indeed to get from Planet 4 to Origae-6 and have David experiment and build his Army then for the company and Engineers to be incoming and then a Engineer Ship with Davids Evolved Creation ending up on LV-426

Needs TWO movies or at least a 3 HOUR one.

If this is not the case, then they now need to cut things down and i feel the Movie would have to start as a AFTERMATH... so we arrive on Origae-6 David has been there for a few years, maybe setting up the Colony before he then uses them for his Army of Xenomorphs.

So the year is 2112-2115 the company arrives at Origae-6 and discover a part set up colony and then uncovers Davids Experiments.... then latter the Engineers Arrive and we see them at the end take Davids Experiments onto their ship... or David manages to see them off and take his Experiments on that ship.

Show the Cargo Hold full of Eggs, and the Pilot reveal who they are... and they set off into Space.....   No Space Jockey event shown but clearly enough to show us that THIS Ship and Cargo end up on LV-426 after the Pilot gets infected.

The Advent Video which i will debate on those threads latter, seems to imply David is sending over information over to the Company....... even as far as some of his works..

This means he had enough time to sneak not only Face Huggers but also some of his concept works and studies?  Really?  Its more less lazy if they then show he returns to Paradise and brings on board some Eggs and some of his Data.

But then the Company would be in the know and what to kind of expect... so when they arrive to meet David then it would be a bit of a silly plot, because the company should be

1) Concerned with David due to the models failings.

2) Have caution to how he admits he is gladly killing and using Humans for his Experiments.

3) Have Caution to the potential Threat these Experiments could have.

So the Advent sets up a flawed Plot now...

It would be better if he acted as Walter to the Company and Lure them to arriving at Origae-6 to discover a Colony and want answers to what happened to delay the Covenant... then they discovers Davids Trap.

But alas this shows how the writers really dont seem to be thinking things though logically.

Ok, wow. There's a Covenant PREQUEL NOVEL!? Wow wow wow!!! Lol, thanks for the newest distraction, IRaptus ! Just what I need before I go back to work...

Phobos was fascinating! It seemed like Wey-Yu was selecting candidates based on who showed the greatest amount of fear. It seemed like Daniels had to stay longer because they hadn't determined what her fears were yet.

It reminded me of the procedure ABA therapists use to determine a client's reinforcers except they were determining each participants' aversions/fears.

I think a lot depends on the writers and RS and FOX and how much thought they put into things as far as continuity and well looking at History sadly this sometimes goes out the Window.

If the Derelict is not on LV-426 from prior to the sequels to Alien Covenant,  so for example the Derelict could have been there for a long time but David just eventually gets his Eggs onto the Derelict.

If they go for this ^^^^ and if David does not just use the Covenant Crew while on the Ship to make all of his Eggs, and so he arrives at Origae-6 then they would arrive there about 10 years before Alien and if David then leaves on a Company Ship that is only as Fast as the Covenant then its likely it would take another 7 or so years to LV-426

If they go the route that as of the year December 2104 which is now when David has control of the Covenant... that there is no Derelict on LV-426....  Then at some point between the end of Alien Covenant and the start of Alien... 17 years,  David has to Multiply his Experiments and these manage to get on a Engineer Ship.

I think it would be to much of a Coincidence and Lazy if they have it that Origae-6 happens to be by pure Luck a Engineer World, even if its one that is now in Ruin.

so it would be more likely as RS had hinted at, that some Engineers return to Paradise/Planet 4 find out what has happened and then they will be on their way to deal with the Culprit (David)

I would assume the Engineers do-not discover what happened until David is either well on his way to Origae-6 or even arrives there.   And so the Engineers will most likely come back into it and Davids Experiments end up on one of their Ships.. But i would assume it would likely be way past the year 2112 by the time the Engineers interact with David and his Creation.

Then why ask how does the Engineer ship get to LV-426, does it decide to go to Earth to kills Humans with Davids Creation or does David get the Ship and decide to kill Humans... either way...  Its a bit of a Coincidence the Ship ends up passing near LV-223 System on its way to Earth... what are the Chances?

So i think if THEY (RS and Production) really use their brains... then after David gets to Origae-6 (if this is where he is going)  then Logically at some point after  the Engineer Ship (be it David or Engineers) would likely be heading to LV-223 for some purpose.

For Engineers maybe to Eradicate LV-223, or head there to Evolve Davids Experiments. Before they may wish to destroy Earth.

For David its maybe he wants to evolve his Experiments on LV-223 or he wants to obtain some more Black Goo to create more or use this on Earth.

Then either Engineers or David either suffer the Space Jockey Event while they are heading to LV-223 or while they are leaving LV-223 and then end up on LV-426

I think this has to happen, but then with the writers and Plot who knows what they will do, what i have put its the Logical Last Moments prior to Alien but who knows what the Hell FOX/RS have in Store.

@IRaptus

"Prior to this I felt that if you ran into David in a dark alley he would probably offer you a cup of tea before stabbing you with his flute. All quiet cleanly. Now im not so sure"

Lol, I had always placed David very firmly in the "Let's not meet" category. Do you ever find that some book or movie scenes prey on your imagination and keep you awake at night with this: O_O; sort of facial expression? (Game of Thrones does that to me a lot, lol).

Well, in the early days of my Covenant obsession, imagining Dr. Shaw's final days with David on Planet 4 cost me a lot of sleep!

Imagine the existential dread of being utterly alone, light years from another human being, combined with being at the mercy of a Dr. Mengele-esque sociopath, completely unsympathetic to human needs or ethics.

David would really be the worst of both worlds.

...He's increasingly mesmerizing on screen! But if I met someone who remotely reminded me of him IRL, I'd run screaming lol.

Advent was great! Why didn't they include it in the film? ...I guess they probably wanted to wait until we had all just barely recovered from our initial trauma over the David-Shaw situation, so they could maximize the amount of sleep we all lose...? lol.

@BigDave ahh, the pre-internet dark ages...tough times, tough times!

I had no idea who he was as far as his Works until many years after Alien, and well after Aliens.... it was about 1989 when i started to look into and know more about his Works.

But it was harder them days as we never had the Internet, you never had Ebay to go and find what ever you wanted... you wanted that missing Comic as you had issues 3-12 and 15-20 but needed 1+2 and 13+14..  Back before the Internet  became mainstream which was very late 90's and more so in the decade that followed....   Back before this time you had a great difficulty to track down those missing issues.

So for me the only way to find HR Gigers works was indeed articles in Magazines etc

Kethol - YES it is a left hand !! Also i cant believe you mentioned it was Matt Hattons hands we see. I typed out during that comment about post-production i made, i originally added it may not even be Davids hand but i deleted it because i thought it sounded a bit of a stretch. turns out i was right to think that !!

Thanks

As far as Prometheus 2 goes... it would be interesting to see if Paglen and Greens drafts every see the day of light, because when i look at what the Source told me over 2.5 years ago and then i see some of the Concept ideas for Alien Covenant both stuff that was not used and the various works in Davids Lab, it does seem to hint at what i was told.

The ADF Novel seems to give hints to what the route that Prometheus 2 was going to be.

In a nutshell the Sources clues was hinting to David Re-Creating either the Xenomorph or Deacon and showing with these Experiments we could get a IDEA of how the Xenomorph in Alien came to be... And poor Dr Shaw would be used to allow David to create his MONSTERS and Her Fate was more closer to the Concepts, in that She was incapacitated and harvested for Davids Agenda.... every time she would be changing into something else.

Nice one BigDave !!

I spoke about this in a few comments and it is how on Earth after the revelations of A:C (David Xeno,faster growth rate in A:C but not in Alien which is Davids Xeno) and the positions in space and the strict timeline add up to A:A needing a master ideas,answers and themes in one film.

I even tried to suggest Planet 4 and LV 426 are somehow the same or at least in the same system but it had so many discrepancies it can not be possible. So this is just mounting up to be one big headache for Fox.

It will take a lot of inspiration and hard work for them to get this next thing right.

Can not understand A:C tearing up so many things that Prometheus set up. We running out of time and 2hrs screen time is all we have left. 123 mins max.

There has been some good comments here..

And i think a lot of the disappointments has come down to each type of Alien/Prometheus Franchise Fan have their own expectations.

ALIENS Fans had maybe expected a bit more of a Action movie and RS and Co did not help themselves when they hinted the movie would have a blend of Alien and Aliens to it, and when they also said it would have a LOT of Aliens in it.

Alas the Actions Scenes were not that Large and it was even less a Action Flick than Alien R, we kind of got a in between Alien 3 and Alien R as far as Action (Aliens vs Humans), so indeed i think the more Action expecting fans would be let down.

ALIEN fans was expecting a more turn to the Original, as RS did say he intended to Scare the $"£% out of people, and they would Top the Chest Buster and even some scenes where basically trying to retread the Alien Trope..  

Sadly its hard to match what Alien did, as people have been introduced to the Xenomorph more and more over the years, that even keeping it in the shadows will not have the same affect as Alien did, but only replicate what Alien 3 did.  And we all know about Chest Buster and Face Hugger and Egg and so there is no surprise when Character A goes to a Egg, then we know there will be a Face Hugger and then we know Character A will Chest Bust latter.

For Alien Fans they expected a movie that would Return more to the Classic House of Horror/Maze like in Alien but only the 3rd Act touched upon this, mainly the Xenomorph on the Covenant and it simply did not compare to the Original or even as a whole the movie did not Live up to the Scares that ALIEN fans thought it would... RS said he was going for the Horror and to Scare the $£%^ out of people and even Cast Members claiming this is the Scariest of them all.... which it was not.

PROMETHEUS Fans... knew the movie would revolve around David and taking a Engineer ship to a Engineer Homeworld, and while they knew it would be taking us more to connect to ALIEN than the Journey intended for David and Shaw, the way the elements from Prometheus was dealt with proved to be a disappointment to Prometheus fans... most stuff was simply brushed under the carpet.

It never provided answers, they just seemed to come up with the quickest way to take out Shaw, the Engineers and Fast Forwards to a quick explanation of Davids experiments... but it did touch upon a Arc to Davids character and touched upon a bit of the philosophical/creation themes that Prometheus Started.

And so every Market of the Fans expected something different to what they got...  The movie was not quite a return to the ALIEN Horror element, it was not a Action movie like ALIENS and for PROMETHEUS fans it seemed like they was trying to brush these themes under the carpet so they can get back to ONE thing and thats the Xenomorph and WHO made it and WHY

Then the Curveball that was David created it, and hints to Why, are something that very much while interesting and fits with Davids Arc as far as his upbringing and experiences... is still something that certainly wont be accepted well by many ALIEN and ALIENS Fans and even some PROMETHEUS fans may find this U-Turn a disappointment.

I seem to get the impression Aliens fans and somewhat Alien fans see Alien Covenant as just a Prometheus Movie, going for what Prometheus was showing and not giving Alien and Aliens fans what they wanted.

Some are still not happy at the Juggernaught vs Derelict, the Space Jockey being these 7ft or so Humanoids...

And now they have been FED that David Created the Xenomorph and the more Quicker Infection/Gestation and different Chest Buster are all things Alien and Aliens fans may be disappointed about and the Blame gets laid at David and Prometheus.

Where actually Alien Covenant did not cater to the Prometheus fans, it covered some of it, but it appeared in a way that they cant ignore Prometheus and so left as little of Prometheus as they needed to Shut the Door on it and then go towards ALIEN.

That is interesting they were being tested with what looked and sounded like neo/protomorphs or close to it. How would they get that footage indeed.

Yes it was a solo album.

"Similar to the SJ maybe ? Where Prometheus suit and SJ suit are clearly different"

Indeed Sherris over time each movie the visual atheistic changed, the 1979 Xenomorph is quite different to the more Organic Alien 3, Alien R and AVP movie ones.  And so it could have been artistic direction and changes that we was meant to assume to look more similar and so was a kind of oversight.

Yet for a number of Fans these Differences just dont add up and cant be accepted,  and so Ultimately we need to see a more Organic Derelict and a more Organic and Larger Space Jockey.

The Space Jockey and the Suits in Prometheus/Alien Covenant are actually not that different, only the Head looks more different.  The size is different though as the Space Jockey was Twice the size of the Engineers and nearly twice the size of the Space Jockey suits in Prometheus well a good 170% larger

All these things and RS comments could have been passed off and explained due to Age and Different Models, but since Alien Covenant we are now being led to the Path that the Derelict was not on LV-223 until at least 17-18 years before Alien... due to the movies Time Line... but actually if they are going the Direct Route that LV-426 has no Derelict at the time of Alien Covenant and David is off to Origae-6 and arrives there before we even get to the Derelict having Davids Eggs on it.

Then NOW the Derelict would be on LV-426 for up to 10 years Maximum and likely 5-9 years prior to Alien.

This has been debated and evolved a debate over the years with each extra clue...

There are a number of reasons for the differences, Originally they was intended to be the SAME but some creative control had decided to Tone down the HR Giger Aesthetic a Touch

Another Change was the Shape as RS wanted to show the Ship Rolling and the Shape of the Derelict which was more like a U logically would not roll, and so they made the Shape more of a C

Externally apart from differences in dimensions (Juggernaught is Larger than the Derelict) and shape a bit, the appearance of both Derelict and Juggernaught are very similar.

Internally however they are different, the Derelict looking more Organic, and also a different looking Control Room which looked much larger than that on the Juggernaught, the Derelicts also only had the Pilot Chair and no Cryo-sleep Pods in the Control/Pilot Room.

But originally those Cryo-Pods where to be located in another area, but this was changed to have them go into the Control Room by the time they began Production and Lindeloff began Script Re-writes.

Ridley Scott had first said the differences are because the Derelict is just that, its old and worn and a Derelict while the Juggernauts are Pristine and as New.

RS had then mentioned years after, that the Derelict and Juggernaught designs are separated by a few hundred years. So the Juggernauts are likely Newer Models.

And so a analogy i used years ago, applies today too.

@dk forgot about that piece. Deborah Harry solo record, right?

@IRaptus "... if the novel does work around what we saw in Phobos, we suddenly have an intriguing story"

This would make one heckuva book, IMHO, and lead perfectly into a final, bombastic, no holds barred final prequel.

In the AVP podcast not too long ago, artists Matt Hatton and Dane Hallet talked about 3AM shooting a viral piece of additional footage and storyline material that had yet to be released. They said there was a whole script for it and it showed David doing his drawings and experiments in his lab using real meat. It is Matt Hatton's hand you see in the video actually doing the drawings. Dane could not do it because he was left handed and David is right handed.

Advent is what they were talking about. It was one of the last things shot for Covenant.

Did anyone notice that the hand touching the window of Daniel's sleep pod is a left hand. That is the one David is missing, so me must have found a spare on the Covenant :) It is actually a clip of Walter's hand from the beginning of Covenant.

Its interesting to try and make the connection with the Zulus, and i think the outcome of you post could be what we shall see as far as David amassing a whole load of Xenomorphs.

Regarding David and the AI, i think he has somewhat become free of Weylands Programing, and so now has his own Goals and Agendas.

But i certainly think we could be shown that AI that the company had/has could be playing a bit more behind the scenes and in some way i would not be surprised if RS will touch upon the rogue AI simply playing a Game of Corporate Chess and unknown to Mankind, AI is actually controlling a lot of things behind the scenes.  It could be a interesting Plot Twist if this AI is actually Weyland himself.

As far as the Engineers i did think it was odd that a Military Ships would have no defense or offense mechanism/ability and how those Engineers did not seem to react with fear until the Bombardment began.

I can only come up with TWO explanations.

1) These Engineers and their Hierarchy are very Naive and Arrogant, they go around Seeding Worlds and Evolving Worlds and then wiping out and starting again, where they control how much knowledge and information they pass on to those Worlds.

So it would be like the Zulu Analogy, lets assume African was completely separated from the Middle East  (Route to Europe via Egypt) or better still lets use Aboriginal People... if we never made any contact with them until after say World War 2 and assume these people are still living in Ancient Ways, of Straw/Wood Huts and simple Hunting Tools and so like how Europe was say 4000 years ago

The Europeans who visit this Aboriginal Tribes would have more Technology, we would have Planes, Cars, Tanks, Guns, Electronics you name it we have got it....    The Europeans could teach these Aboriginal Tribes how to use these things, or indeed how to make them but it would take time.

But if these Europeans simply assume if they left a Plane, a Tank, and say a Radio or other Electrical Appliance running off a Petrol/Diesel Generator... that has ran out of Fuel.  We can assume the Tribe if they have never been shown how the Europeans use this things... its likely they would struggle to ever be able to figure out how to successfully use them.

or we can assume that if the Europeans just left Australia and took all the Technology and Tools with them, then they assume those Tribes would never ever be able to Create such Technology etc by their own.

This is HOW the Engineers may have looked down at Mankind and other Races they created, they visit them teach them things but never nothing past Ancient 2000  year old Cultures would have.

The Engineers arrogantly know they are the only ones with the Technology and if they never teach their creations the Advanced stuff then there is NO WAY these Races could ever Evolve to a Technological Level, they would assume all created Races without the Engineers Help would only evolve as far as Mankind had 4000 years or so ago.

So they have no Fear or Concerns of other Races they created ever Evolving to such a point to be a threat and also ARROGANTLY they may think all of their own Species obey the Rules set by their Elders so there would be no Internal Engineer Conflicts.

So they have no need for Such Defense Mechanisms etc. (so they thought).

2) Those Juggernaughts was never Military Ships of sorts, they are just a more Advanced Means to Seed Worlds, instead of dropping off a Lone Engineer or a Engineer on every continent and then have them performing the Sacrificial Scene... they could have Evolved a way to instead perform these Sacrifices on Paradise/Planet 4 or taken to LV-223 to Perform them and the resulting broken down Matter then Stored into Urns.

so Sacrificial Goo, breaks down their DNA that falls into the Water to Seed Worlds... If the Engineer was standing inside some kind of VAT or Enclosure and his broken down material was collected and then stored into Jars and these Jars emptied into the Water Fall we can safely assume the same thing would happen.

so the Purpose of the Urns may be to Store Engineer DNA where they then drop these off onto Worlds to Seed/Evolve Life instead of the Sacrificial Scene.

If this is True, then this could explain why the Engineers where not to Fearful and it could explain the whole Culture and those Statues as maybe being selected for Sacrifice is considered a Great Honor and maybe only the Purest/Perfect of them get Chosen for this and they have Statues Erected around the Plaza to Honor their Sacrifice.

This 2nd Answer is what i am drawn to for the whole Purpose of Paradise and those Ships.... well this was THE purpose but a Faction of Engineers had decided to meddle in things and leads to the Xeno-Strain in the Urns on LV-223

Honestly i get a bit confused myself with this

I think one is the Hyper sleep pods. There are 4 in Prometheus craft and in a similar position in Alien they arent to be seen. That is what i was told on here. There are probably many others but i always think that we have to realise how far apart they were made and how RS may want things to look now as per 40 years ago. 

Similar to the SJ maybe ? Where Prometheus suit and SJ suit are clearly different. 

I think Michelle Johnston can save the franchise,  her comments are always unlocking the truth for the good readers here.

If only Fox would do some research on this forum.

Michelle Johnston thank you for the key to Covenant from your previous post. 

Advent answered some questions, even too detailed for my taste. I saw it as a homage to the arstists who created David's lab as well.

But imo it narrows the path for the next movie to a sickening mayhem. 

And it also gives way to another director.

But if Ridley Scott will do the next one I still have some faith left.

We'll see.

I must admit when i first watched "Advent" the thought that they may of put this together post-production crossed my mind. I hope i am wrong. It would of been tough to attach that inside of A:C for sure.

However i decided i would be positive with this and enjoy it for what it is. We needed some answers because as i have said before, the stuff in Prometheus that was answered got undone in A:C and it left far too many separate pieces that A:A could never hope to answer.

We dont want to get to the end of the 3RD prequel and still be no wiser.

Speeding up growth rates in A:C

But the Xeno in 1979 Doesnt have that - yet David created the 1979 Alien.

SJ - Engineer landed on LV426 due to LV223 outbreak.

NOT NOW!! The Xeno comes from the eggs. Engineers eggs have a different end product to the Xeno. Thanks A:C

Just so many holes to fall down. The writers and Fox need proper guidance to pull this off in A:A.

So i am glad of Advent at least this gives Fox a fighting chance of getting through A:A with minimal mess.

Really nice discussion here, folks. Advent is certainly worth the time to "dissect" (see what I did there?) in detail...

Fantastic stuff...i couldn't hold out. 

DEFINITELY would've helped A:C to have included portions of "Advent" at the end of the film. Don't know what fool edited it out (probably the same one that edited out the engineer conversation with David when they first meet in Prometheus).

just a reminder if anyone has any ideas ill add it to the story 

that's a really good point VE - i think thats def a good direction to go with - one of my goals with this is to try and flesh something out and see how close its ends up being to the final alien film well get. ill write something up 

daliens

Apparently Ridley directed the Advent. It has his "knowing" advertising style all over it. 

This is what I said when the film was released. 

"You cannot have the main character who is now driving the franchise being left off the hook constantly as the "mad robot". Put simply we need to make sense of his developing humanity.  The story needs underpin not just endless nihilistic bait and switch otherwise this human being loss's interest".

You can see this sentiment is essentially the same as your reaction to Advent, this guy is so irredeemably evil who cares ?

I am pleased with Advent it makes sense of the story whether its the story I wanted is a quite separate matter. 

I think to hang the next instalment on a robot whom we all want disconnected at the earliest juncture is high risk and only the promise of the big question and other players makes it remotely interesting. I also think Awakening has the potential because of all the competing issues to be thoroughly dreadful. Using the word Queen in an Alien short which has a particular application is not encouraging. If Covenant was channeling ALIEN Awakening may channel ALIENS and as Awakening was Blomkamps title not as daft as it sounds even to me.  

Heck, I'd be happy if David, being immortal, is still around to plant the egg aboard the Sulaco! Killing Newt, Hicks, Ripley would look pretty good on his resume'!

Oh and lets talk about Conventions!

Remember when Sigourney stood up at XenoCon 2008 and gave her famous speech!?  Or Ridley showing the first reel from Prometheus  @ XenoCon 2011?!   Of course you don't, cause it never happened!

All other 'Big' franchises have their own conventions. Marvel, Star Wars, Star Trek..

If this franchise is going to grow, I'd think having a convention would be a good start?

sherris

I think the way the back story is played out will give all sorts of hints to the palimpsest of script ideas that were worked through between 13/15. Underlying David's words are the notion of Paradise Lost a title which may or not belong to that point before David was responsible for Armageddon.

It also has to be remembered that David as the narrator may not only be unreliable toward the Covenant Crew but also is offering his vain glorious deluded view of himself. Note he describes himself as Weyland's Son. His intel maybe accurate but his perception is that of a psychopath. The idea that David could caste himself as Adam and Elizabeth as Eve makes sense of why he behaved the way he did but was delusional and Elizabeth rejected such a notion. Noomi said in one interview that she liked the idea of Elizabeth exploring a much darker side of herself that could have taken their strange co dependent relationship to another level.

Listening to David's narration put me in mind of how they could have used it as a framing device.

Imagine the prequels beginning with Walter being interrogated by the science division one of course would be the "real" Ash and they torture to him to extract Davids story, Walter having gained  access to David's memories before he sets off with his cargo of Eggs. I would have preferred a tangential Prometheus story but if they had decided on this backing into from the beginning it would have been a neat way of giving connectivity and Michael is very good at narration.         

Is anyone more optimistic about the next episode? What are the reasons?

I wonder who directed the Advent, for he may be the director of Awakening.

Even Blomkamp can take over from here.

I would use more of the promo footage of the teams shoulder cams during the initial investigation and when the neomorph confrontations went down and less of the crumby CGI.

David cannot be Adam, he is only the serpent.

I have no hope left after seeing the Advent. David is a sick monster who did not care about Shaw, he would not stop at anything.

He did not love Shaw, for him she was only the most beautiful subject for his experiments, the human DNA needed to improve his studies.

I do not want to imagine the carnage he will do on Covenant, all the colonists' pods hanging like carcasses in an abattoir.

And I do not want to see an army of aliens or thousands of eggs, or worse, a queen.

There is no return to the Prometheus quests, but a mass slaughter.

Michelle

Well, the real money is probably from the home video market and streaming industry anyway . . .

But wasn't the short films a good solution to the tug-of-war?

Michelle Johnston - Always great reading your input Thank You ;)

I was wondering about the Christ element. The Covenant suffered the burst on Dec.6th. It took about 2 weeks to get to Planet 4 which gets us to 20/21 December. Then we have some time on the Planet and then David ends up on The Covenant which probably lands very nicely around 25th ? You also found the relevance of "The Nativity" which i was wondering about;)

Interesting too as Prometheus happened to arrive about that time of year.

i wondered if perhaps the original idea was David and Shaw were to arrive at Planet 4 / Paradise and the damage had already been done. Possibly by the enhanced Engineers on 223 ? It does now seem as though there was a possibility that could of happened going by the information in Advent. 

The Origa information is also very welcome i would not of got that either. Many Thanks again.

I sure do have hope again and perhaps as you suggest we can get those elements in the actual film instead of searching for it in bonus material. 

My main issues with Alien 3 were I felt it wasn't as scary as the first two and much of the cast wasn't as well developed. Long lasting characters like David (played by the great Pete Postlethwaite) don't get a single line until after the movie is halfway over and Jude doesn't get a line until the final 15 minutes. Also I didn't feel it was as scary as the first two.
But it is hardly a bad film. There's a lot to like about it from Weaver's stirring performance, the beautiful score by Goldenthal, the hellish color pallet, the sweeping and moody sets, and its overall themes of self sacrifice and redemption. Going back to a single Alien was an excellent idea, the space prison was a setting that felt right at home in the series, and it was the start of another great director. It has rightfully become a cult classic, and may someday be more recognized by the general public. Even if some of its choices didn't work out for it, one can still admire the risks it took. More movies should be willing to take that chance. You can watch the full length movie for free on Terrarium TV.

Thank you for starting this thread and providing an atmosphere of enquiry. Together with the Crossing we now have the story of David from his repair to the end page of Covenant. 

We now know what David found out, how he reacted, his interaction with Shaw and his determination to pick up the reigns of the LV 223 Engineers. 

The key themes are beautifully restated and the narrative hardens.

1) The creation myth is centred on sacrifice and therefore its evolution and corruption is evolved through sacrifice. 

2) The Engineers found the mechanism through knowledge based on artificial intelligence to corrupt the evolutionary path, regretted the decision and turned away from the "Wolves". This explains the simplistic "true" nature of the Engineers on Paradise and the evolved enhanced mechanical nature of the LV 223 Engineers who had set out an evolutionary path of species cleansing and start again. David found out that the Engineers rejected the pursuit of Wolves.

3) Based on the drawings of David the life cycle is a hybrid created out of the curious life forms (one of which is likened to  an Egg which grows into the ground) and of course includes the addition of elements of mankinds genetic material.

4) He responded to his love of Elizabeth and knowledge of the Engineers he gained on board the Juggernaut by deciding to start again and cleanse the world in which they would be the new Adam and Eve. She rejected this vision and probably tried to escape and lead to his using her essence to evolve his experiments, so Oram is a surrogate for Shaw as the mother. This has a nice symbolism as both were faith based spiritual questers.

5) He has clearly decided to draw Weyland Yutani in and the seeders will return to find the Engineers destroyed and he has designs for Daniels. What has he overlooked possibly Walter.

For me the Crossing (to the promised land) and Advent (awaiting the coming of the Messiah and anticipated in "The Nativity" by Piero della Francesca in the prologue of A:C) is the real story. The Covenant has come into it and is now anchored to David's journey to the constellation of Origa from which Origae is derived the constellation of the helmsman, ostler, driver, charioteer or perchance the Jockey.   

With the acquisition of the Covenant the story is repositioned and fused and perhaps we can return to the audacious and fresh within the actually movie rather than around it by way of directors reveals and shorts.