Comments (Page 722)

5) Totally agree....  Davids conversation with Weyland is key, you see when we die the only thing we leave behind is LEGACY, If we have Children we can live on in their memories, our Life and Tales passed on Generation by Generation, if you have no Children then you leave Behind NOTHING...

Unless you become Famous for various reasons, Arts, Music etc like Mozart or indeed Michelangelo or say Shakespeare, Then also inventing or creating something can leave a Legacy, Edison and Tesla.. or those who Cure Diseases Hippocrates or Fleming  etc

Also having a great stature for either being part of a Monarchy or Achieving something Great be it Military or Exploration so we are talking Henry VIII or a Alexander the Great or Columbus

Weyland is dying but he leaves various Legacies, and its some of his Creations and Inventions that makes him feel he is a GOD.

When people and civilizations are long gone, its often the Legacy they leave behind, that can Immortalize their name, the same applies to Monuments built in Great Peoples Name/Image.

David knows he is superior to Weyland, and Mankind, but David is not Mortal, he may live for a long time but eventually he can be destroyed, and so David has no Legacy...  i feel how he was treated by Mankind and how he saw Weyland view himself, that David has grown ambitions to leave his own Legacy and this is why he is Interested in Creating his own Life/Legacy.

After he is Gone, his Legacy will remain. And this is what the Ozymandias Poem is about and why David quoted it.

4. I think the Engineers Technology is so advanced it may be beyond our comprehension but it does appear the use of the Technology is only limited to a selected group.

The Sumerian links are nice, my theories touch upon these more than other Mythos, and who knows how deep this goes.  I would indeed say maybe Paradise could be Dilmun  I think the whole four quarters could be used to fit in with the Engineers and other connected beings... its something i considered, and maybe we could get some connections in future movies.

My interpretation of those Statues are they are like the Buddha Offering Statues, and they are surrounding the Hanger for a Good Reason, i think these beings are offered in Sacrifice and this is a Great Honor for them, and so every now and again a Engineer Ship returns to dock in the Hanger and Take Sacrifices.

After seeing AC, i ponder if the Juggernauts were just a more Advanced Seeding Method than the Pebble Ship and dropping off a Engineer, and so the Urns contained Broken down Engineer DNA to seed Worlds more efficiently than the Sacrificial Scene in Prometheus...  But a Faction of Engineers had rebelled and perverted this Technology and Eventually got infected with a Parasite that created the first Xeno-like Organism, which the LV-223 Engineers then worshiped and maybe saw as a way they could create Life by giving Birth....  and Re-engineered it and then Sacrificed it (Mural Deacon) to then use its more Perfect DNA rather than Humanoid in the Seeding Urns..

Hence why the beings on Paradise did not look in fear or concern regarding the Juggernaught arrival until the Bombardment

But this is just my interpretation and so its not to say its correct and a lot of my basis for this does tie in with how i saw the Black Goo/Sacrificial Goo, which then months latter when Alien Engineers Draft was leaked in 2012 it seemed to add up to how i saw the Goo work.

Nice theory and i can see how some of this could fit, indeed the Bombardment scene did look like the Black Goo was a formation of a lot of particles that seemed to swarm down on the Engineers.

Alien Engineers the Black Goo was instead Scarabs, Nano-Scarabs, and in Prometheus the Component that was in the Vials appeared to be like dirt/dust in water and when he got this on his finger we could make out tiny like organisms moving within the Goo, and we can see that Semen is a Goo like substance but really it contains Hundreds of Millions of Sperm Cells.  So the Black Goo could be similar as far as the inner component and so its actually some Nano-Parasite, maybe Worm-like.

I will try and pick a few problems though, but this is just my interpretation on what you are saying and some flaws, and it does not mean to discredit your theory ;)

1) While indeed we can see how the Xenomorph could be seen as having some traits of a Beetle, or Scorpion as far as Exo-skeleton etc.... If the Motes from the Spores are the same kind of DNA then we have to ask why the Neomorphs are more Flesh-like.

2)I think the Engineers possessed such Technology and hence why the Covenant received that signal from the Juggernaught, to me it appears there are a Hierarchy who govern and have the Technology for a Purpose, and that the beings on Paradise live a more Ancient way, were they do not have Advanced Technology.

The Cathedral has some Technology as the Gold Device looks like Technology, there may be the odd piece of Technology in other places but it appears only the ONE Hanger (intended for visiting ships), and the Monitoring Docking Ship are the only places where this World has Technology as if only a selected group are allowed this Technology to Watch over the other beings.

3) Indeed a lot of mystery still surrounds Dr Shaw, the various images of her do not add up to what the Corpse was like though, maybe these images are what David was thinking about doing to her?

Its indicated things took a turn for the worse, and their relationship soured, and we dont know if David intended to kill her, but it appears he intended to capture and keep her incapacitated and eventually he had decided to experiment on her but we dont know if this lead to her death or if she was already dying.

I am not sure she was suffering badly from the infection in Prometheus due to her Hair being at least 6 months growth longer, i would assume that Nutrition is why she looked worse for wear, and after the crash, she had to remain in the Juggernaught until the outside was safe to explore

Its been since May since i saw the movie, and as far as i remember, there was a shot where Walters Face Goes Funny, cant find a image on internet and i think its in one of the trailers/TV spots..

But i cant be bothered to find it, but its where his face goes a bit like this LOL

I am sure this was the indication of when David Stabbed Walter from behind in a way that disabled him....

Indeed the Pacing is off, but then the whole movie took 2 hours if we look at it that way, but indeed that last Scene was a bit off Pace...  David can Run Faster, but still i am sure he would have been 5 Minutes behind.

But their was intended and i think shot other Scenes where Daniels and Lope were under attack from the other Neomorph and then the Xenomorph appeared, and these would have taken up some of the time as far as what Daniels and Lope were up to while David and Walter were together.

But these scenes are not in the movie...

If we look at how would David Upload himself into Walter, we need to ask how does he do this?  Wireless Technology? Then how come Walter could not just uploaded himself into David?

So if David had to somehow open up Walter and Change a Setting then Proceed with a Upload, how long would it take to Perform this considering the Data that David had stored?

So maybe swapping clothes, then cutting his hand off etc could have been quicker?  Regardless RS has said this is what happened.

Walter is Advanced, but i dont think this means Walter is Vastly Quicker and Stronger, it appears some of the Construction Materials are different, some of the Self Maintenance maybe?  But the biggest upgrade is indeed limits on the Emotion and Free-will of the Walter Model

Now i can answer the OT... which will bring me to comments made by Gralen and K-Theory

Indeed RS had hinted they was going the Space Jesus Route by it was a bit on the nose, but we need to remember the Franchise as far as Prometheus goes, was not showing us GOD, Jesus, Adam and Eve etc... it was showing us that all Ancient Mankinds Stories/Mythos and Religions are all based of our interactions with these Engineers and maybe other beings connected to their Hierarchy.

A Bold Plot, but one where it appears they keep changing their mind regarding how it all connects...  a lot of mistakes and oversights had occurred and right now, it appears the intended Space Jockey/Engineers who were to be 15ft Tall, then redesigned for 12ft... Ultimately are only portrayed as being about 7-8ft Tall.

So indeed the Space Jesus does not fit... as there are no descriptions of Jesus being 8ft and Bald ;)  But we need to remember we are not seeing this from this point of view, there is and never was any JESUS.. he was as far as the Franchise, a Emissary on behalf of the Engineers who had tried to teach us the ways that would make us accepted by the Engineers, and this BEING had some Special Abilities compared to Humans.

The Emissary could therefore be a Chosen Humanoid to represent the Engineers, maybe and most likely Genetically Modified a bit, and given great knowledge and maybe Technology.   The Emissary could also be a Hybrid, or even the Original Race above or connected to the Engineers, as we dont know what kind of Changes they are going for as far as how the Engineers fit within the whole Hierarchy of Creation.

So what happened 2000 years ago?  Mankind was Evolving, the various kinds of Ancient Worship was changing, Mankind had started to behave in ways that offended the Engineers, they maybe did not worship the Engineers as intended.  The Morality and Dedication to Worship and Sacrifice of many Cultures had changed over the years..... we was becoming a BAD APPLE.

They had sent down Emmisaries to try and guide us, and we must have killed most of them... this was the Last Straw and they decided to wipe us out, and start again as while they could Spare some of us, they would Fear the Influence of this more Corrupt and Immoral Mankind could spread Globally, and this has been the case...  If we look at how Mankind Act now, in General (not saying its bad) but how we are now, a lot of us would been deemed Sinners and Outcasts, we would be Punished Burnt, Stoned etc for how Modern Mankind now in general would be seen 500, 1000, 2000 etc years ago.

Some cultures remain more true to the Ancient Ways, and are not influenced by the Growing Modern Changes to Culture, these are many Tribal Peoples who still live for the most part as they did many hundreds of years ago and who's architecture and technology is even more ancient than the Roman Times.

If we consider 2000 years ago, such Tribes then would include the Native Indians, the Aztecs, Incas and Mayans and other Tribal Cultures.

What if these guys had kept to a more Ancient Culture, and not displeased the Engineers, what if these Cultures had reacted to their Emissaries well. 

This could explain the FEW Starmaps post 2000 years ago.

So i would suspect there was not ONE Emissary but a number of them sent down to various cultures.

Haha, cool.  I like the Bishop doll.  I guess something that cool could only be found online.

Thanks for the rain check post!  I'm going to have to show Antoinette that picture!

I will be patiently waiting for your in depth analysis.

@ali81

Indeed as i touched upon a bit in previous post, the whole PLOT they gave as far as who the Space Jockey Race was... is HUGE and very BOLD... but also a bit of a Poisoned Chalice.  Its hard to get Right, and getting it right could be EPIC.

Again a lot depends how much FOX are commited to the Franchise, this was a ALIEN Franchise afterall, and they appeared to realize that Prometheus was stepping a bit away from this as far as the Events that lead to Alien and the Xenomorph are concerned.  Yet when they decided to change Alien Engineers, they felt the these connections could be toned down and ignored to explore the Engineers more.

With AC only getting like $97M Budget which would have been like $144M if it was the same as Prometheus (with inflation) it seems that FOX Financially was about 40% Less Commited to that Project and if they Felt the Alien Connections and Xenomorphs was more important than the Engineers and yet they backed AC less than Prometheus, this is a concern as far as getting any real deep explanations or movie based on the Engineers.

@Sherris

Indeed i think this is a good point, it really is down to if FOX feel a interest in the Engineers is needed,  when they was working on the Prequels, the TWO Main Questions was....

*The EGGS.... Where did they come from?, what was the purpose? how/why did the Space Jockey have them?

Extending on this would be the very Origin to the Xenomorph.

*The Space Jockey... Why was he carrying that Cargo?, where was he going? Where did he come from?

Extending on this would be to explore the Space Jockey Race and their purpose.

A Prequel would have to answer these more in terms of what the Cargo was for/where it was from and the purpose and intention and then how the Space Jockey ended up there.

The ideas then evolved into Alien: Engineers, but FOX felt that the back ground story to the Space Jockeys AKA Engineers was interesting and maybe they did not need to give us a movie that Spoon Fed the Xenomorphs or covered the Actual Space Jockey Event,  but they could give us hints to the purpose.

This however did not go down well with a number of fans... and hence maybe one reason for the Direction they took with Alien Covenant.

So is this the last we will see of the Engineers in detail?

Maybe it could have been, but with AC doing Worse than Prometheus i am sure FOX will be looking at WHY, and one side of the Coin would be  there was not enough Alien (Xenomorph) Screen Time and maybe no Queens and Ripley....  but the other side is some fans was disappointed that the movie did not continue or do justice to the LARGE PLOT surrounding these Would Be GODS

And so i think we could maybe see a bit more about them, a lot depends on how the next Movie does.... IF Alien Awakening does not do well then i think the Franchise will be Sealed Shut... and only down the line if they resurrect it they may opt for a Re-boot.

I would keep Prometheus as is but instead of going more alien in the sequel id stick to the engineer story line and their connection to the goo and xeno. maybe see davids struggle to gain their knowledge so he can create what he perceives as his perfect creation. I also love the poster in the back ground of the xenos and engineers and was so hoping for something like this in AC so would like to see something along these lines in a future prequel 

Hello I Moon Girl !

I've just noticed your response and this is a placeholder reply to let you know that I intend to reply in the near future! This is a good and though provoking conversation!

But, as it is, I'm on a beach vacation, which is somehow a lot more exhausting than it sounds, so I'm sort of asleep on my feet right now.

I very inattentively read what you wrote, and I can tell that it is something interesting and well thought out, and something that I would enjoy thinking about when I am awake enough to process it.

In the mean time, please enjoy this completely irrelevant image of the dismembered Bishop plush. This isn't a picture of my Bishop plush, but I have the exact one. Didn't bring him along on my trip, though.

Hope maybe all we have !!

sherries, I hold hope for AA as it cant be any worse, could it it? iv only watch AC once and with it being a naughty copy the quality want great. im hoping a better quality version will do it wonders but even bad quality cant hide no character building, no answers and bad pacing.

Ali81 - 

Yes it was terrible. walking out of the cinema post A:C i was never touching anything from the franchise again.

I couldnt even comment on here i was that flat. But hey it is not the end of the world it is just a film we stupidly invested too much time in. Although i must admit the worst part is that they could of told the EXACT story they did AND kept the Prometheus fans happy with some answers using small dialogue at a few points during the film.

Mind saying that i have watched A:C maybe 15 times now and i like it. Guess i must still have a bit of hope for A:A

he may have gotten his hosts from the scorpion ship that crashed. iv just read an earlier post on another topic and BD, as usual, came up with the idea

That dissected Engineer could be a clue that not all planet 4 life forms got dissolved by the inital black goo bombing.

He might even catched an alive specimen and killed it.

A sad tragedy for a proud race to get killed by such a weak android;)

David grabbed the knife right when Walter made his punch.

Remember one punch to David's face probably did nothing spectacular damage wise (he is a sturdy android nonetheless), while a precise hit with a sharp knife (combined with android strength) is another story.

Not really. Judjing by the difference in the metabolism and pure body strength /height.

It's more likely that a human directly influenced (or advised) by the Engineers got killed which not amused them 2k years ago.

First we must make clear how the "facehugger" metabolism works.

From what we can see the embryos are very small and can NOT implant their DNA into a host yet. They are simply too small/weak to attach themself to a human or any life form.

The other question is how they get covered by that egg-shell to make them grow bigger & durable+dormant for many years.

I think the obvious answer is Daniels.

I wasn't a fan of the trilobite either, I think they got its design wrong. for me it should have been some form of xeno which would have started the whole process, like in the spaights script

I cant remember the synthetics name from fire and stone but im thinking similarities between the xeno and david and his use for them. the perfect creation, created by the perfect being used to cleanse the galaxy of the imperfect and undeserving

Not interested in the Deacon---or the trilobyte---not one bit. That Trilobyte was a travesty to the level not seen in an Alien movie since the horrid baby Alien/human hybrid from Alien Rez.

I most definitely wont be doing all the theorising again. ill be on to see what people have heard and see the leaked set pictures folk get their hands on but im not going to put myself up for such a disappointing fall again.

david touches on the black goo a bit but again there r still some questions surrounding it. I remember myself and quite a few others talking about how they were going to get the covenant onto planet 4. I think most believed he was sending a message to weyland and they send out a ship so I got that bit wrong aswell haha

DP Sorry :(

Mine went pretty good. However considering the time i put into it i must admit after the first watch i was sore !!

As a major Prometheus/Alien fan i wanted to know what answers we might get since it was coming across it was a Prometheus sequel. So i decided to see if i could piece together the story and associate the marketing trailers, screen shots etc.. into it.

I managed it. It took me 100s of hours. Finally i had something i was happy with. BUT....

I soon realised that there were only a few opportunities for reveals and that David would be potentially lying in the scenes i had marked for reveals.

Then i watched A:C and it brushed aside the opportunities it had for reveals. Some small dialogue placed into the film at key stages would of allowed this exact story to be told AND reveal some answers from Prometheus. But no!

So after searching through every piece of marketing and trailers, pausing, writing notes etc.. to realise what i am looking for is not going to be found this time.

So A:C let me down not because i knew the plot. i wanted to. that part is ok. But because it was billed as a Prometheus sequel and did not deliver what it said on the tin. (RS mouth)

Would i do it all again ? For sure. But only in this franchise.

Maybe Westworld too.

I believe the intent on the part of RS is in fact to make us believe that the xeno is doing something to lambert. yes the scene originally is brett, but RS has made the decision to put it as part of lamberts death for a reason. to make us think about what is happening after the tail rises between her legs. plus the noises the xeno makes before she screams. I believe RS intended to give the impression she is being violated

also, what were ur theories? what did u see happening and did u come up with something cool that would have helped the film?

having MUTHUR as a sleeper agent bad girl AI would be an awesome twist lol

That im not sure of yet.

I believe it is something to do with the Engineer technology. He did something that leads to a chain reaction or to an event which is processed by The Covenant as a solar flare. 

Making it look an accident.

The easy answer is MUTHUR is onside with David and told the crew it was a solar flare when it was actually something else that David concocted. However if i had to say either way, i lean towards David causing it and MUTHUR reported the facts as she saw them ?

Just a theory

Ridley Scott and his team had thought about it, but ended up sort of scrapping that idea and putting in place the idea that the fall of the Romans. The Roman Republic was very successful and conquered  almost all of Europe and North Africa, but when they became an Empire in 27 BC-- around the time they sent Jesus, yes-- things went totally downhill. 

The Persians and the Arabic territory were still going strong, but still very violent. This goes for the Chinese as well. Perhaps the only people in the world, at the time, that was "peaceful" were the uncontacted tribes in Africa, India, and North America. 

I loved Prometheus. I think most haters jumped on it due to its change in direction from what was originally announced and less 'alien' but if people just looked at it as a jump off point for a trilogy then it is an excellent start. it opened so many doors of possibility and I think more people r starting to appreciate it and what it could have done for the series. sherries, I agree, giving the engineers their own 'spinoff' would only invite negativity from the very start but for me, they need to be put on screen for a lengthy period of time to explore their culture, motives and whats become of them. I would love it to be cert 18 as I hate this pg13 BS. would a mini series be the way to go though? like everything I suppose if done right then itl work, given a good budget, good writers and directors

I think we will get something although it wont be enough.

If they do a Engineers movie it will be slammed as soon as it is announced. Purely because of Fox and their delivery of the concept.

The YT "Experts" will destroy it saying if Prometheus wasnt bad enough, now those hopeless Engineers get their own movie. It will be killed.

I think the only chance is an 8 part TV mini series. Even like cert.18 like Legion is. To explore all of what Ali81 mentions and i think the YT & Social Media audience which is massive would give a TV series a pass and wait to see how it turns out.  Levelling the playing field so we can go into it with an open mind.

That is the best i think we can hope for. And it would be amazing i think ?

Dallas was probably wrong when he said that the Space Jockey was fossilised because that would mean lying in layers of sediments for thousands of years. The Space Jockey is a skeleton, though, preserved because of the dry, cold and oxygen-free atmosphere, perhaps? How long has it been sitting there in the pilot chair of the Derelict? That is the question.

In Prometheus, Ridley Scott changed the fossilised/skeletal Space Jockey into being a helmet and a space suit made for engineers (the Space Jockey is larger, however). Inside, there is, most likely, an engineer? David/Walter or a human would get lost in the large space suit. :)

My guess about how they finally link the prequels to Alien is therefore that an engineer did crash on LV-426 with xeno-eggs in the cargo hold. The engineer must have been attacked by a facehugger when loading the eggs, or when he, for some reason, went into the cargo hold before the journey (not fully understanding the danger). When he wakes up after the face-hug he enters the pilot chair and sets off on his mission (eradicating mankind or another planet somewhere). After some time, the pain in his chest forces him to quickly choose the nearest planet to land on (LV-426).

What I would like to see is a flashback scene at the end of the last prequel, where we travel 2.000 years back in time, to LV-223. We will briefly see what caused the outbreak and the engineers running for safety before the automated doors are shut (which we see in the hologram David activates). All engineers but two dies - one we encounter in Prometheus - the other escapes in a juggernaut filled with xeno-eggs . . .

What I think is more likely, though, is that the route of David is continued. In Alien: Awakening, the two face-hugger-embryos are used on Daniels and Tennessee. We get a new heroine who will continue the alien saga and conflict with David and the xenomorph. Engineers will return and find “Paradise” obliterated and filled with engineer and human corpses, and the residues of a synthetic. The engineers will not look too favourably upon this so they will hunt down David and his creations. There will be a war and everyone dies (Origae 6 and LV-223 are no more), except one engineer who dashes off with a cargo hold filled with David’s xeno-eggs . . . The information about the Xenomorph David has passed on to "Mother" and Ash, and eventually, The Nostromo lands on LV-426 . . .

jonesy, do u mean they gave u 1 buck to take it off their hands? lol

this poster riled me no end. it gave the impression of something amazing yet for me the whole filmed bombed big time. this poster was nothing but misleading but it was done with a purpose. it was done to put bums on seats which I can accept tho through gritted teeth. the mural meant something as they even have the Prometheus crew make reference to it. if was just something to flash by then I doubt it would have gotten any attention in the movie. the fact that it depicts the full life cycle of the xeno has meaning. but I fear after Prometheus it has become what u say it has. theyv decided just to forget about it and wel probably never get to understand the meaning of the mural and what its importance was

Yeah, look at the the background image of this site. Did you see the Covenant premiere in UK, I mean the streaming or the events on youtube, etc. Scott and the actors/actresses were standing in front of the wall version of it, it was the background of the photos taken by media people. Is it in the movie? Does it show something from the movie? No. They just use the image as a poster and made a portable 3D marketing background from it. They just put it there behind the important people...

However, it's interesting that there was a green stone in the middle of it. Without doubt, it looked like the mysterious green stone from the mural scene in Prometheus.

u would imagine in the next instalment david will have a flashback scene maybe with daniels to explain what really happened during the crossing. his way of explaining to daniels why she is going to die and why david is doing what hes doing

batchpool, I could go with that. david knows the company r aware of the signal from the derelict and would most likely be planning, or had a planned expedition in mind to go to the derelict. so david places the eggs in anticipation of this expeditions arrival but it happens to be the nostromo that gets redirected

'David did not kill dr Shaw, in a glimpse of an eye in the notes...'

David's drawings revealed in the movie show his dreams and nightmares.

Did not kill? And they were in love, enjoyed a beautiful relationship, etc... :)

Seriously, everybody has the right to his own version...

Thanks nakedlunch!

What about the airlock in the juggernaut(like my story pointed out), Was the space jockey flying with it open? Exposed to space….OR did someone enter the derelict earlier and open the airlock and place the eggs.

Eggs should have been fossilized just like the Space jockey...unless the laser light show kept them fresh.

hahaha 'coz he just did right, end of'