The Alien is NOT cooked - a Scified editorial!

Of course it'snot cooked! And the AI angle will get overcooked much faster than the xenomorph (I am actually already tired of it)

Neither the Alien nor the AI need be cooked if more emphasis is put on the rest of the cast. Except for a couple characters in the last two movies, the rest have been pretty forgettable. The Quadrilogy was much better in that aspect.

I totally agree with this article. It is time to stop sending confusing messages. AI should be in the flanks and not take center stage. The alien itself is what we are here for.

"Scott reintroduced the Xenomorph in Alien: Covenant in an exercise of arrogance, to prove his prior statement that the 'beast was cooked'."

GAVIN Do you really think that this was the case? Or it was just a half ass attempt at using the beast because he does not believe in it. I mean you really think he deliberately tried to cook the xenomorph?

I think he put in the xenomorph because he was told too, because its what Fox thought the Fanboys wanted, hence his statement "If they want Aliens i'll give them f$&king Aliens."

That's why the third act was so lacklustre and rushed, because Scott didn't have the passion or even want that encounter in this film. Perhaps he arrogantly did the bare minimum with that scene to satisfy the studio, but undercooked it enough knowing it would cop criticism to prove the studio wrong about rushing the beast back in? 

Give me a cast to care about and be able able to relate to. If that happens, it doesn't matter much to me what else happens. Maybe it is too much to expect for a movie and can be done better as a mini series....sorry, I will step off the soap box.

Bishop and Ash were brilliant robots. David seems a bit flat character wise; that's why I'm not keen on him.

(part 2 )

Everything Scott does goes through the studio, and what you read is what the press says and makes up. I'm pretty sure he doesn't see himself as some kind of messiah. He's a director with influence but trust me he can't just demand $150m and walk off into the sunset,a whole studio of exec will go over scripts and ideas with a magnifying glass before making him sign on what they say is a good idea.

It's clear that the author of this "editorial" is a Cameron person who needs just another bug hunt to feel happy again.

Good riddance mr Xeno! In humble opinion what both Covenant and BR2049 lacked, and severely was originality. I've yet to see something what that Michael Green fellow was involved to be original. Some might be good, but c'mon even Logan is a Shane remake. We have formulas and cliches, enough with them. Yes we have a new 80s nostalgia on us, reusing themes and motifs but I've yet to find something that impresses me. I liked season 1 of Stranger things, was indifferent to IT (which I thought was Stranger things with Floki from vikings as an antagonist), and kind of disliked season 2. 

I dislike the new Star Trek show, not because of continuity or because I'm right wing bigot, but because in 8 episodes it ripped of Alien, Dune and Groundhog Day.

The first 2 Alien movies (well the most interesting pieces of the second one in the extended cut, well at least for me) were unique because of the innovations the brought to the table (as did BR 82), but now they only cope the imitators.

Commercially speaking, maybe now would have been a great time for a xenomorph revival, but that would not make something unique. As for AI revolt, can't we get something new? For 100 years now that we have the term robot, his main activity is to revolt against his human masters.

I'll skip the latest the new nostalgia snoozefest which is Star Wars ep 8 and wait for Alex Garland's Annihilation.

In my opinion as a HUGE Alien franchise fan, my disappointment lies with Ridley Scott. Although I enoyed both Prometheus and Alien: Covenant, they didnt feel fully fleshed out. They have some incredible themes on creation/destruction but they miss out on the empathy and character development which we all enjoy in our movies. The beast itself is definitely not cooked. What is lacking is a cohesive and compelling story that takes its time to sink its teeth into us and then apply gut-wrenching pressure to characters we actually care something about. Add a taste of REALISTIC action rather than b-horror dumbass character decisions and we may actually find a movie that we love to watch. Taking Neil Blomkamp off Alien was a monumental failure to recognize a visionary new director's potential to revitalise the franchise. Therefore, it is my opinion that Ridley Scott is indeed the one that is cooked, but not the amazing chestburster baby that exploded partly from his imagination almost 40 years ago...

The problem is the characters don't feel authentic. For some reason, starting in Prometheus, the writers started to create characters that seem more like whimsical caricatures, and you can notice that clearly not only on both prequels, but also in the viral videos. It is beyond me why Ridley Scott thinks that this is the correct approach for human characters in the franchise.

Well....Here is a chance to write a synopses  / outline of a uncooked Xeno plot. I'd like to read them.

95% of the Alien franchise is humans talking to synths / AI's.....then a Xeno appears.

ScorpioStar

"It's clear that the author of this "editorial" is a Cameron person who needs just another bug hunt to feel happy again."

Agree. If Alien is cooked - it was with Cameron's ALIENS-bugs. We need the invulnerable to standard weapons xenomorph like as in Alien: Isolation. The Star Beast who can't be killed. And with biomechanical design of course.

@ ScorpioStar & Leto

"It's clear that the author of this "editorial" is a Cameron person who needs just another bug hunt to feel happy again."

You could not be farther from the truth. On average the Alien works better as a lone antagonist than it does as an overwhelming horde. Alien, Alien 3, and Alien Isolation all proved this, while the only movie that respectfully portrayed the Xenomorph as a super-organism was Aliens. Resurrection, both AvP movies, and a plethora of licensed video games simply portrayed the Alien as cannon fodder, mindless bugs.

Personally, I would like to see a lone Alien facing off against heavily armed protagonists, and win through its use of cruelty, intelligence, and malicious intent. I would like to see these 'Mercenaries' hunted, tortured, and violated by what they perceive to be a mere creature. This dynamic has never been explored, in the Alien franchise at least.

As for AI, I couldn't care less. I always felt the addition of Ash and Bishop as needlessly derivative, stemmed from an over-abundance of science fiction movies from the 60's and 70's that relied heavily on the narrative beat of the corporate-conspiracy (Demon Seed, Soylent Green, Logans Run, Rollerball etc.).

It's a sad ending to a promising creature. Aliens turned it into a drone/bug...something the colonial soldiers were/are well aware of.  No one in the Alien series has declared: 'We've found another intelligent life form!!'... No, it's just a bug.... Xeno's probably can't operate a golf cart, let alone a starship....Their not going to invade Earth or seek out humans to terrorize ....All the stories are going to be: Space truckers/ Explorers/Soldiers stumble upon a nasty creature/pod in a cave/derelict spaceship.

I would have liked the ending of A L I E N to be:    Ripley being dragged into space by the star beast........... trying to scream.... but .... no one to hear her...'slow fade'

@MonsterZero

Perfect!

It's the worlds biggest secret!........that everyone in the world is in on!

Eggs = Facehugger + humans = Xenomorph.

How can you write anything when everyone knows the outcome!?

Need BigDave in here to get me off the roof!! Talk me out of jumping! LOL!

un-cooking the star beast. my quick attempt:

   A team of explorers land on LV 1335. They find a network of caves. The floor of the one of the enormous caves is littered with thousands of petrified eggs. Many of the eggs are massive, 20 meters in height, some pods have opened, but no signs of what was in side.

One of the team knocks over one of the smaller pods and a small little snake like creature scurries away( jump scare scene).

Two kilometers from the entrance, is a large(100 meters) door........it has been forced open and lays ajar. Drones are sent through the giant doors, but the video is scrambled and none of the drones return.

Being 'explorers' the team decide to enter the door...It's a long slippery slope downwards....one of the crew slips and smashes his/her helmet...too dangerous to continue they send 2 back to the ship for climbing equipment...the others wait just outside the door.

They find the drones destroyed near the bottom of the slope...they start finding large humanoids(Engineers)in space suits(different from Prometheus)..these are really large.

Team has to decide whether to turn back.Big argument! Everything is old and dead......no danger?

Deciding to press on..the team enters a really large chamber with thousands of caskets containing 30 meter humanoid creatures...Tomb of the Space Jockeys...

To be continued.....OR please some one pick this up from where i left it!! Where did the flahes come from...were the Engineers tomb raiding??

Even this is hard to write!! So many cliches and a tired plot! ARRGH!!

Gavin

Your post of the 12th November is the important one. Anyone can pronounce the "Beast Isn't Cooked' the really important question and answer from said question is how do you serve it up fresh. 

Your idea that you move in close and explore its behavioural tics and what they mean in much more detail and in the way it antagonises the protagonists feels like development.

Now the next question would be is the broader non fanbase elements that make the movie a financial success  interested. No idea, but to me to expose the beasts narrative of punishment, rape and subjugation to further examination whilst fresh is of no interest to me and puts it on the level of my interest in Davids interest in subjugating his victims to punishment rape and subjugation to create his Queen.

For me that is a glorification of wickedness and dysfunctional behaviour which is akin to wanting to sit in on the dreams of the mental ill.   

What made ALIEN wonderful is we had no idea it was simply its effect on the magnificent seven that was enthralling in it innovation, ever since then people have essentially tried to do it bigger make Ripley the Alien or try and fit it into a mythos so in a sense doing the opposite of what you want contextualise its behaviour rather than expand on it.

@MonsterZero

I can't help you with your plot, but I can give you a hint - as you see, I come from a planet visited by the Engineers (they were far more creative back then). I can read, type, wipe out any kind of life (armed-to-the teeth Marines included), be sarcastic now and then and, I can assure you, conducting vehicles of any kind is not a problem.

 And if you're wondering what else the Enginners were up to before their most acclaimed bug, check with a humanoid called Damon Hellandbrand - apparently, he sees us in his dreams...

@ScorpioStar I Like that beast...but it looks very big and I'm not sure it would fit in a Starship(human type)?!

That's one of the problems with Cameron's Queen Xeno.....If Ripley, Newt and Bishop had walked down the hallway or entered their cabins they would have been safe from the Queen! She could only roam in a the big load bay..worthless without her drones.

I suppose your beast also has smaller soldier drones?

@MonsterZero

I don't know anything about drones, but you should see our babies... They're so small and smart and so HUNGRY! They eat anything and everything all the time! Then again, how can you expect infants to grow huge and strong and smart if they don't eat?

It is my belief that fox did not want to pay Giger again for the alien main character  design on Prometheus..... so they concocted the prequel as a way to reboot the franchise without spending a ton of money... then after his death felt it was safe to go back and negotiate new terms with the current license holder.

I'd be interested to hear the story from that side if anyone has any info.

I'v worked in the film industry for over 20 years and I've seldom seen a decision made solely for artistic reasons that didn't have dollar signs factored in.

I believe Ridley Scott is ruining his legacy as he's clearly out of touch with his audience and what these movies have become.... it's not the artistic statement that it once was in the late 70's early 80's where the studio hadn't fully (believed to) figure out a tried and true franchise template to operate by.

Hollywood is run by accountants and number people without creativity. Sadly, you'd have to have much more fight in you than Scott has to attempt to develop characters or tell story in today' cinema..... those things don't carry well to foreign markets like explosions and action do.

Jonnysokko I think the copyright issue is more apparent in "Alien: Covenant" than in "Prometheus". I read an interview with conceptual artist Dane Hallett where he states he was disappointed that Fox's legal department prevented him to use certain biomechanic looking designs for Elizabeth Shaw and David's experiments, and that is why his designs ended looking more than victorian medical drawings. I don't think it would cost Fox so much to acquire the rights to use HR Giger's Necronomicon; it's just they decided to spend the money on other things.

I admit I haven't seen the last alien film at all except for stills of the alien.... Prometheus was enough to make me stop spending money on that.

Even dollar theater viewings and industry screenings haven't interested me in any of these blockbuster franchises.

Although I do have a free screening date to see Blade runner and the negative press interests me almost enough to see it.

But I know it won't cut muster story wise.

Alien would have been a totally forgettable movie without solid characters. Scary monster? Check. How the characters deal with it? Check. Characters you actually care about? Check.

Prometheus and AC- Monsters- Check. How characters deal- stupid! Characters you care about- David and Daniels for different reasons. Everyone else was forgettable.

dk

Sorry I don't agree with what you say. The stupidity of characters was there in the Alien franchise from day one. Kane poking the egg, Parker's stereotypical obsession about being paid, chase the cat and getting killed, smart indeed. As for likable characters, I liked Lambert the most because her fate (rape and murder). In my eyes Ripley was just as bitchy as Shaw, she becomes much more likable in Aliens (so thank Cameron 4 that).

In Prometheus there is only 4 monster encounters, and why the exception of Fifield were dealt with reasonably. And I'll take Janek over Dallas every day.

As for Covenant I cared more a dead then anybody else. Daniels? She is a joke, a Ripley-lite. David became just another space nazi robot.

Actually, it's quite simple to understand that the beast is not cooked,

All the approaches that have been made after the first movie have only disrespected him, and unlike what many think, is not just about the characters.

The xenomorph represents a murderous beast, this is true, but not any beast, but a psychopath.
That's why the first movie works so well, if you replace the xenomorph with any human being this one would kill one by one the crew of the ship, like a common assassin terrorizing everyone because you do not know when he will attack and you are in a reduced and claustrophobic place, he would be exactly like a beast. But Alien is not that, once you separate these elements from the character you stay with its psychological traits, he is not only a murderer, he is a psychopath, he lacks empathy, emotions or susceptibility, his levels of intelligence and rage are immensely high, he is calculating, his mental processes are totally ruined, he is a deranged killer who does not attack directly but studies his victims in an insane way, he is a sexual depraved, only his high violent behavior satisfies his mental need to dominate his victims, rape, murder, dismember them and get drunk with pleasure while doing it. To this we add what already know:
200 lbs of pure murderous power, an extraordinary agility, resistance and strenght from another world, supernatural adaptation, a set of weapons at his disposal that nobody else counts.

I'm surprised that this has been forgotten for so long. These disturbed psychological traits of a Xenomorph are as interesting as artificial intelligence. I hope that one day justice will be done, because as we go, we will end up with another Cameron bug hunt. and Ridley ... to say that the beast is cooked ... I admire and everything ... but respectfully, fu... the only thing cooked is your closed mind, that can not appreciate the beauty of what Giger created and is far more profound and interesting than any other pseudo-religious creationist theme.

Red0guy i ask you this though.

If you were any one of the crew from the original film, facing the same circumstances, would you have done anything different?

Kane wanted his own command, he took a risk at a big discovery to get that. Dallas went into the air-ducts alone because he was in damage control; he was a man with a chequered career on his last chance, and he'd just F'ed up. Lambert would do anything to get herself out of trouble. Brett was the junior engineers whose job was to do as his told and help fix things. Someone said find the cat to help the tracker work better - thats what he did.

Most of their mistakes were selfish and self-serving errors of judgement by damaged and weak characters, and that got them killed. 

Now fast track to Covenant. And you have Captains, XOs, and scientific staff - professional and vigorously screened and tested personnel (see Phobos clip), making blatantly poor decisions that go against everything they were trained for. Oram disregarding mission objectives was as bad as the Titanic taking a detour lol...and just as catastrophic 

Dallas was generally quite laid-back as Captain, although Brett and Parker's continued insistence that they receive higher pay seemed to annoy him. He was also averse to making decisions, a flaw he himself acknowledged and cited as the reason he was merely in charge of a commercial tug as opposed to a more impressive position aboard a space liner. When forced into a decision, Dallas seemed prone to making rushed, unwise choices under pressure, most glaringly when he allowed Kane and the Facehugger back on board the Nostromo in violation of standard quarantine protocols — a move that ultimately doomed the crew. Similarly, he opted to leave LV-426 before the Nostromo was fully repaired, leaving the crew without vital surveillance systems that they could have used to track the Alien.

Source: The Weyland-Yutani Report, ADF's Alien Novelisation 

IRaptus

Sorry I have never read any novelisations, so I cannot combat that. But then why not explain the crew's actions from covenant's novelisation?

I can argue only what is only in the movies. I don't even know when Phobos was conceived in regards to the movies script so that's that for continuity. 

 And Oram worst scene is believing a crazed android, which he called the Devil, and instead of shooting him on the spot he followed in the cellar to reenact the biblical man's fall from heaven, an overtly forced metaphor.

It is interesting that despite the movie and franchise being named Alien, the comments have sidelined into the characterizations of the human cast in the original versus those of the prequels.

In the original the only character that is not one dimensional is Ash. Regardless of your opinions of the other characters, their characterization was poor at best. Take Dallas as an example. Being the captain of the Nostromo he should NOT have led the expedition team, that was the second in commands job; Kane. He should not have ordered Lambert on the team either, should anything had befallen her they would have been marooned. As such the expedition team should have been Kane, Ripley, and Ash. Following his complete disregard for well-known command protocols (have they not watched Star Trek) Dallas, having put Kane, and subsequently the crews lives at risk then ignores protocol again heading into the air ducts, instead of ordering Ripley to investigate the ducts, as she was the only expendable crewmate at that point.

As for Ripley, she was a bitch in the first movie, a character stereotype that is usually the first to die in such movies. Her only positive development was in Aliens when her maternal nature opened her up emotionally to Hicks, Newt and us the audience. But in Alien 3 her deflated submission to her inevitable fate, while plausible was against her character as a survivor.

For me, the best characters throughout the franchise have been Ripley, Ash, Hudson, Vasquez, Clemens, Dillon, Golic, Johner, Vriess, Janek, Shaw, David (Prometheus, not Covenant), and Tennessee.

In addition to Dallas, I found Daniels to be a Ripley-lite, Newt was way too screamy, Burke was too obvious, Fifield and Milburn were just dumb (as was Holloway) and Parker was just Yaphet Kotto. But the worst travesty is the whole Walter/David dynamic, and the praise it gets. The so-called twist at the end of Covenant was obvious the moment we knew Fassbender was gonna be portraying multiple roles. In What Happened To Monday Noomi Rapace plays seven identical sisters, each with noticeably different characters, and without the use of any accent trickery, completely outshining Michael Fassbender's performance.

Gavin

Well, What happened to Monday was more or less a shitty movie single-handedly pulled out off the dirt by Rapace. I completely agree with you on the characters, but I would rather have something new in the Alien Universe (hopefully not a new monster), not the Xenomorph done right.

Perfectly said, great editorial! 

@ St.Anger

The xenomorph represents a murderous beast, this is true, but not any beast, but a psychopath.

That's why the first movie works so well, if you replace the xenomorph with any human being this one would kill one by one the crew of the ship, like a common assassin terrorizing everyone because you do not know when he will attack and you are in a reduced and claustrophobic place, he would be exactly like a beast. But Alien is not that, once you separate these elements from the character you stay with its psychological traits, he is not only a murderer, he is a psychopath, he lacks empathy, emotions or susceptibility, his levels of intelligence and rage are immensely high, he is calculating, his mental processes are totally ruined, he is a deranged killer who does not attack directly but studies his victims in an insane way, he is a sexual depraved, only his high violent behavior satisfies his mental need to dominate his victims, rape, murder, dismember them and get drunk with pleasure while doing it. To this we add what already know:
200 lbs of pure murderous power, an extraordinary agility, resistance and strength from another world, supernatural adaptation, a set of weapons at his disposal that nobody else counts.

Another attempt to shine a light on his behavioural tics. Why on earth would a grown up audience (the original audience I represent) be interested  in "These disturbed psychological traits of a Xenomorph are as interesting....". This is science fiction where we use a secondary world to tell us more about ourselves. If I want a study of psychopathy as a rational intelligent human being I want to know how it works and where it comes from. The only intelligent way you can apply that to the A L I E N of 1979 is how did such a creature come about not get in so close you become a voyeur to unspeakable cruelty once removed as science fiction and invest a special effect with far to much gravitas. The only way to make the ALIEN interesting unless your celebrating its instincts is why, where and how. Ridley knew that as a well rounded human being, its just he forgot the franchise has a substantial fanbase which finds gratification in the power of violence rather than the power of understanding violence.  

At least this thread is revealing a rather unwholesome truth that whilst what made the first film special was its element of surprise as horror entertainment, which was essentially innocent, because the audacity was in the surprise, some people actually want to stop and glorify that curiosity of 1978 and grow it ugh.Thank god for Ripley and her sacrifice which is where the future story should have always stopped.  

@Gavin

Your last post is a excellent view on the subject matter, and with these kinds of movies, (Horror Based) it requires people to make bad choices to bring around the Plot, they are Plot Devices to drive the Plot and Ultimately if it was not for the well written inclusion of ASH, (and Special Order 937) then  we would not have had the same Alien movie.....  as Ripely would have prevented the Alien from getting on-board.

I think the Franchise has suffered with how Characters are used for sure, Alien, Aliens and Alien 3 worked well, but Alien R, Prometheus and Alien Covenant they all appeared to only be there to Drive the Plot.  The Franchise is in a bit of trouble not only just because the Beast is Cooked or Not,  as even doing a sequel that has no Xenomorphs, could still end up being another Cooked Alien movie.

The Xenomorph is kind of cooked, this is thanks to how it was handled in the latter Movies (Alien R, AVP movies) and Video Games etc, everyone had seen the Xenomorph over and over and it was now portrayed as some Alien Organism that basically had a Agenda to Procreate, and so much like some Deadly Larger Hive Organism that when goes on the loose can lead to disaster for the native Worlds Lifeforms..

I think the Changes they made with Prometheus from Alien Engineers was to explore the REASONS behind such a Parasitic, Invasive Species that could be used a a Ultimate Extermination Tool...  To explore and give some Sinister Reason and Agenda behind why would any one CREATE such a thing, rather than it being something that was Natural.  Ridley Scott has further explored this by now having it that our own Agenda to Sub-create and Create our own Artificial/Synthetic Life-forms and how we then treat these said Life-Forms who we have created as superior...  has lead one of these Creations to Dable and Experiment and Create such a Horrific Beast and then its now about DAVIDS intentions and Reasons for the Creation and what he plans on doing with it.

I think this is more what RS is trying to explore now... the Reasons behind such a Beast, rather than showing the Beast...

I think the Beast has another Round or Two in it, and so did Ridley Scott in the build up to Alien Covenant, even suggesting that the Franchise has to be about HIM (the Xenomorph) and how we can Evolve Him, but it always has to be about the Beast. Leading to him pondering if Prometheus was a mistake in Hindsight, which seems to be that the Xenomorph should have been more linked.

The Beast is kind of Cooked, and its a case now of being very Careful, because if you try and bring the Beast into it too much and done the wrong way then the Beast becomes CREMATED  I feel the Problem is HOW the Beast had been Portrayed, yes Alien explored the Beast in a different manner, and Aliens then evolved this into a more Bug like Parasite.

Alien did start from STAR-BEAST where our Beast was a Creature that would grow to be more than just a Killing Machine, but as the Franchise Evolved, Changes are made and the Changes that became ALIEN did set up that this Creature was a Bio-Logical Warfare.    Camerons Ideas evolved this so that the Beasts Life-Cycle is now similar to a Invasive Species of Insect type Organism, that could be used as a ideal Bio-Weapon.  So as of Aliens it was like the Humans in say Star Ship Troopers, being caught in a War with another Alien Race... lets say Klingon's or Predators lol  and these Humans use Eggs of the Star Ship Trooper Bugs to Eradicate the Klingon/Predator Home-worlds...  That in a Nut-shell is what our Xenomorph had become.

A Bio-Weapon, The Prequels had attempted to address this by showing us these Bio-Weapons were not just something found, they was Genetically Engineered and Created to Serve this Purpose and be used against HUMANITY because of the things we have done and way we have acted against this Bio-Weapons Creator.

so Sadly when ever we look at the Xenomorph it is just a Created Bio-Weapon, that could get out of control and set up its own Hive Network,  the Ideas behind this Organism that STAR-BEAST was trying to cover are Sadly something we maybe CANT and SHOULD NOT Resurrect

However..... The Xenomorph Pathogen had its Origins... exploring this could open up Doors to something Fresh that is not some Natural Parasite, or Genetically Engineered one.

ULTIMATELY is difficult how they can explore a few more movies centered around the Xenomorph, as its been set in STONE now to be a Engineered Bio-Weapon Invasive Parasitic Organism and nothing more.