Comments (Page 382)

Alieni

"According to FANDOM, W-Y merged 2099"

According to Fox.  Ref. Weyland-Yutani Report.

Thanks BigDave

I'm glad you liked it. 

And it's nice to still find some connections or background stories to these films. 

Still hope that Disney is clever enough to let Ridley Scott finish his prequels to Alien. This universe is bigger than Star Wars.

The dates we have from the Prometheus expedition are 21 December 2093 (David walking about on the ship). 25 - 26 December (everything happens). 1 January 2094, Shaw drives away from the facility they have been exploring (in the buggy, and presumably with David still in two parts?) towards a juggernaut in the adjacent facility. Shaw sends the message and they leave 1 January in the juggernaut. As they leave, the deacon is born, giving a gestation time of about 6 days (26-1)!!! They have had plenty of time scavenging things, but the gestation time seems to be too long, but they couldn’t have had the deacon lurking about either . . .

Anyway, in Alien Covenant: Origins we learn that the company called Weyland Corporation has merged into Weyland-Yutani Corporation before The Covenant sets off. They also know that Sir Peter Weyland is dead, and there is a terrorist group not wanting the Covenant mission to come about. After lots of trouble, The Covenant finally sets off somewhere between 2094 - 2104. According to FANDOM, W-Y merged 2099 which would mean that The Covenant set off probably somewhere between 2099 and 2103 (it would probably take at least 1 year to get to Planet 4)?

One more thing, according to the novelization, Ricks says it would take "a couple of weeks" to get from where The Covenant had the accident to Planet 4.

I do remember Ridley mentioning this about Ash way back when. That he was sexually frustrated because of it, and the magazine was a stand in for his missing penis, lol

I can certainly see a connection to The Criel Mound but who knows if this was considered for any influence that we had..

Nice find though ;)

@daliens

Indeed it appears the LV-223 Outposts were based off Gigers unused work for Dune, but also the Egg silo concepts for Alien by Giger appeared to replace the Pyramid/Obelisk looking things from Star Beast/Early Alien drafts.

About the closest we got to this or the LV-223 Temples was the Cathedral in the Engineers City, but this was more of a Constructed Ancient Architecture and had more of a Roman/Greek meets Islamic Construction.... pretty much similar to the Hagia Sophia in Turkey

"You know, Ridley Scott said he made the prequels to answer who the SJ was and who made the xenomorph. After 2 films we still don't know those answers,  on the contrary we have more mistery and endless debates. "

Indeed and this is something thats Evolved a bit since the concept of the Prequels, a lot to do with Oversights/Scale regarding the Engineers because the Brainstorming that lead to Alien Engineers the HR Giger Aesthetic was more apparent and our Engineers were 12-15ft Tall and not 7-8ft Tall.

There was clues to the Xenomorph, and even though Prometheus toned it down, if we used Alien Engineers as like a Rosetta Stone to help understand Prometheus then that movie had the clues.

But while Prometheus 2 may have moved away from ALIEN, it appears Pressure was added to make the sequel become more closer to ALIEN and a Consequence of that appears the Xenomorph Origins are linked to DAVID.

some things could be changed though.... unless we have to accept a lot of the inconsistencies...  between the Xenomorphs, and Derelict and Space Jockey.  And that these are just a Oversight.

Its interesting to bring up the Pyramids,  i think we have to remember a lot has changed since the ideas that were laid down in Star Beast however...

I think RS and FOX have gone past the notion that the Xenomorph was/is the remnants of a Ancient Civilized Alien Race, it seemed to be implied only as a Bio-Weapon used by the Space Jockey Race, but at this time we could not rule out if they created it or discovered it.... but i felt the Aesthetic Connection between the Derelict and Xenomorph had to mean some connection.

Prometheus came along and changed this Aesthetic and revealed the Xenomorph was likely connected to the Black Goo Bio-Weapon that had been tested/experimented and maybe developed on LV-223.

The LV-223 Outpost certainly took some Nods, towards Gigers Harkonnen Temple Concepts for Dune.  It was made to appear constructed to a degree and lacked any HR Giger Bio-Mechanical Aesthetic, however we see a toned down Aesthetic within the interior of the Temples on LV-223, and indeed likewise with the Juggernauts.

I am sure many were expecting some more Bio-Mechanical Aesthetics with the Engineers Home-world, and so i think we can see how some fans became a bit disappointed.

The Questions now are will we ever see such Atheistic in future? or are these just going to come down to only the Engineers Ships?  Will we ever see any Pyramids, or Temple Complex's like in Prometheus?

I think a lot depends what worlds we are shown, in the future movies (if any are made), i dont think we will be seeing LV-426 having any such Buildings though... or under ground Caves... i think RS is sticking with the Egg Chamber being part of the Derelict.

Regarding Origae-6 and having Ancient Buildings, who knows.. i do feel IF and its a BIG if... so if they do show buildings i would think they could be more ancient looking and so discovering Pyramids could not be ruled out, but i feel it would be the remnants of a long long lost civilization.  That would be in maybe similar or lesser state than the Ancient Egyptian Temples/Pyramids.

I think it would be too much of a COINCIDENCE if Origae-6 has inhabitants, and if we see a Civilization thats not to long been destroyed/disappeared...

I also think finding a place with the Atheistic of the Juggernauts would again be too much of a COINCIDENCE too...

Maybe the Engineers who return to Planet 4 find out David is off to Oriage-6 and we find out this World is one the Engineers had Terra-formed to eventually use to SEED life on, and so they cant allow David to contaminate the place... or that its a world they had used something to wipe the slate clean thousands of years ago and Origae-6 is in the Process of Healing back to being able to be used to Seed again.

I certainly cant see the place being shown as having some Ancient Temples, that contain anything related to the Xenomorph though.

The whole what state Origae-6 is in regarding, previous in-habitats, certainly relating to the Engineers is somehing i have pondered when working on my ideas for a Alien Covenant Sequel...  I certainly would not explore this place being a outpost like LV-223 was, i am kind of reluctant that it had/was  some Ancient Culture related to the Engineers... but its not something i would rule out when i eventually evolve my Alien: Ascension Plot/Story.

But i certainly was considering a few Pyramid Structures, and thus going the route to show that many worlds had these Structures because the Engineers used them to Terra-form Worlds.

If we look at the Juggernaught ships, i think we can safely assume they can travel much faster than Earth ships, but we just dont know how fast they actually travel.   The Comics appear to suggest they can travel certain large distances within a instant..

But i am always looking to look at Movie related Evidence or connected Viral Marketing/DVD extras rather than Comics.

While we do-not know how fast the Engineer Ships are simply because we have NO Data to go by, all we can go by indeed is that David had been on Planet 4 for 10 years, that could mean he arrived about December 2094, but again its how do we read into ABOUT 10 YEARS this interpretation depends person to person, for me i would say regarding years that i would be looking at saying something either took 2 years, 3 years or 2.5 years, so if something took 1 year 5 months i would say that its about a year and half, if it was 1 year 10 months i would say about 2 years and if it was 1 year 3 months i would say about a year, or just over a year.

so in that context, and this is just how i look at how i define time, i usually split it up into Quarters and so  12-15 Months i would class as a about a year or just over a year,  16-20 months i would class as either about a year and half or just over/just under 1.5 years and 21-24 months i would class as about 2 years or nearly 2 years etc.

So by that then David being on Planet 4 for about 10 years would mean he has likely been there since December 2094 give or take a few months so we can safely assume (unless he was lying) that David arrived at Planet 4 likely around December 2094, but certainly within the 1st October 2094 to 28th February 2095 Ball Park.

But as we dont know how far Planet 4 is we cant estimate any kind of Speeds, all we really know is that David and Dr Shaw had definitely left LV-223 at very least January 2094 but due to the Hair Growth with Dr Shaw, i would Safely Assume a Period of Months had past.

I think the best estimate looking at the clues for me would be that David Arrives at Planet 4  between October 2094 to February 2095, but lets just go with DECEMBER then looking at Dr Shaw's Hair by the time she entered Cryo-Sleep i think it would appear this had to be again October-December 2094 and so i think the Juggernaught could travel to Planet 4 within a matter of weeks, certainly no longer than 6-8 weeks.

When we look at the JUGGERNAUTS STAR CHARTS we see they have many Galaxies in their System, we would have to ask why if they CAN-NOT Travel to these places...  The Nearest Galaxy to our own is 2.5 MILLION Light years, thats Vastly further than to LV-223, so the Prometheus would take 125'000 years to get to our Nearest Neighboring Galaxy.

We have to Assume the Engineer Ships can Travel beyond even that Galaxy because it had Many in their Navigation Systems...  but we still cant gauge the Speeds off this....  if they could reach other Galaxies within years, then reaching places like Planet 4 would take Minutes.

This is where the CRYO-PODS come in, if the Engineer Ships can Travel to Earth/Planet 4 etc within weeks, then we would have to wonder why the need for Cryo-Pods?   I would assume they are used for Longer Term Travel to distant parts of the Galaxy.

But then looking at the Basics of a Juggernaught, its not built for living on and so we can assume anything more than short journeys... so like hours or days maximum then you would indeed have Cryo-sleep Pods....

so we still cant really get any information on Juggernaught Speeds, i only assume they could get from LV-223 to Planet 4 in relatively short time, which begs the Questions then... why did not ships return within Thousands of Years?

I think determining the Speeds of the Engineers Ships helps us to paint a picture of future events, because we have to look at the Covenant taking 88 Months (give or take 7 weeks) from Planet 4 to Origae-6,  and if a Juggernaught could get to Origae-6 from Planet 4, in Months or less, or even just few years...  then this would mean any returning Engineer Ship to Planet 4 (provided they can detect the Covenant) would surely intercept it way before it arrived at Origae-6

so indeed its highly likely that David would not only reach Origae-6 but also that some Colony would be set up, prior to the Engineers returning to Planet 4....    In my idea/plans for Alien: Ascension (Covenants sequel)  i indeed have David arrive at Origae-6 in April 2112....  i have the Engineers returning to Planet 4 10 years after David departed. so in the year 2114.

Looking at the Covenant from what i gather the Events occur from December 4th/5th in regards to the movie, so the Signal would have had to been detected about 16-17th October.

Again i will have to look at the source material that we have as far as Viral Videos for information, or unseal my DVD for the extras.

We have seen a Time-Line for the Merger as in the year 2099 this is from the Yutani Report, and i guess SM can clear up where this date came from.... i.e FOX etc, or if SM suggested it and FOX went along with it?

My Prometheus 2 i was working on, had the Merger happen 25 years prior to ALIEN.  But this is just Fan work, where i had it happen under 3 years after the events of Prometheus.

So its really not sure when the Company Merged, we know there is a Weyland Yutani Company in the year 2104 and so 10 years after Prometheus and i guess that means the year 2099 fits right in the middle of both movies, so i cant see any objections against the 2099 date...

If the Origins Novel has no dates, then we have to see if any are given in any Art of the Film books or extras... as far as the Covenants Departure Date etc.

Weyland-Yutani knows that Sir Peter Weyland is dead

Confirmation of this is interesting, but it could have some explanations, we have to assume that the Company had more than Vickers and Weyland as far as Board Members, and its strange to send your only TWO Heads of Board with no Contingency plans.    So we could speculate that someone at the company or indeed any Medical Personnel who had interacted with Weyland in his last few years, MAY have knowledge that Peter Weyland was a dying pan who has only a short time left alive.

I think its logical a combination of the Mission being missing in action, with a certain amount of time with no reply and being 2 years away from Earth, with anyone who knows Peter Weyland has not many years left in him....  would be able to conclude Weyland would likely be Dead and thus classed as Deceased.

If this is not the case...  and thus the information regarding Weylands Death is confirmed by the Prometheus itself, be that the detection of Dr Shaws SOS, or/and a investigative mission.

Then this would indeed lead to us to suspect those behind the Merger would indeed be aware of the Prometheus mission and likely what it had encountered.

It depends which of these outcomes is what happened as to give us a date where the Merger had not taken place...  The Questions come down to.

* How long would that SOS Signal by Dr Shaw Reach our Solar System or some distant Outpost/Ship that can relay the message to the Company.

* How long would the company wait before sending out either a mission to LV-223, or at least try some communications.   Then its a Question of how fast does Communications work, and how fast could a investigative mission take?   The same 2 years as Prometheus?

I think we can safely assume the Weyland-Yutani Merger would not have happened at least 4-5 years after the Prometheus Mission had set off....

Dr Shaws SOS message was recorded at very least on January 1st 2094

I realized i made a error in my other post regarding the Covenant and how far into the Mission it was, i was basing it off a 8 year mission, but in reality with NO given Dates of Departure or any information to how long the mission was, apart from that at the point of the Neutrino Burst it was 7 years 4 months away from Origae-6

This does not give us how long the mission had gone for though, when assuming a 8 year journey then it would have reached 10% of its journey but this is a oversight by myself, because with 7 Re-Charges left, this does not add up because if the Covenant was 10% into its journey then it needed 9 Re-Charges...

The remaining Journey Time meant the Covenant would arrive on Origae-6 around April 2112...  so a 8 year Journey would mean a Departure of April 2104 which if we assume the Re-Charge was its first then this would have taken place after 8 Months (assume Dec 5th Neutrino Blast) or just over 6 Months if we assume the events of arriving at Planet 4 by the Covenant was December 5th.

Which would mean 11-14 Re-Charge Cycles within the next 7 years 4 months.....  Which Logically means the Actual Recharge Cycles must be 11-12 Months  (ASSUME The Re-Charge was December 4th/5th).

I would say that a Re-Charge of 11-12 Months is a good Estimate and thus it is likely the Covenant Departed in December 2103 or January 2104

so that means about a 99-100 Month Journey Total, thus the Covenant Traveled about 12% of its journey before Re-Charging.

"This would mean that Planet 4 cannot be too far away from Earth and that The Covenant must be pretty fast?"

This is the Big Question with NO given Distances, we can only have wild Guess work...  If the Covenant is as fast as the Prometheus then Planet 4 would be about the 18-21 Light Years away Ball Park.

if the Covenant is as fast as the Refitted Nostromo than Planet 4 would have to be around the 42-50 Light Years away Ball Park.

We can assume the Covenant is not as fast as the Sulaco, but we really dont know how fast the Covenant is, i would assume at least as fast as the Prometheus, and i doubt twice as fast as a refitted Nostromo.  Which means a 20-100 Light Year Estimate? 

Regardless i think we can safely ASSUME Journey to Planet 4 is just a matter of within a Year from Earth at the time of ALIEN, and much much less by the time we get to ALIENS 

So that does raise a Good Question about the likelihood of other Human/Earth Missions to Planet 4 after the events of Alien Covenant.

I know Ridley Scott doesn't particularly like that song and I tend to believe that the song was chosen first, then came that cowboy hat of Tennessee. 

Was it only Shaw's nostalgia or there is some subliminal message to it?

I am going to have to try and get my hands on the Novel.

Nice or you to confirm there are no Dates given, which puzzles me now to where the "1 January 2104: The Covenant launches from Earth orbit" came from but a number of other information from that source does not add up either.

For example...

• 5 December 2104: The covenant receives a signal from Planet 4
• 25-26 December 2104: Happenings on Planet 4

Now that cant be so, because we see in Alien Covenant when they detect the Signal after the Neutrino Burst Accident, they faced TWO options... continue on a 7 year 4 Month voyage to Origae-6, while the Crew are reluctant to go into Cryo-sleep.... or check out the source of the Signal which would be a 7 week Detour..

There is only 4 Weeks 3 Days in December ;)

I think its interesting to debate this, it seems like its not important to the Plot, as a Android would NOT need any Sexual Organs..  Not as far as the David/Walter Models.

So its interesting to ponder that as David starts to get more Human emotions, where he starts to see himself as a Real Boy (to a degree) then sure, having no Penis could be a bit of a concern for him and make him feel incomplete.

I would say that in the REAL WORLD... once we have Technology so Evolved that we can make Androids close to a David/Walter i think that in Reality the Sex Industry would be one of the largest uses for Synthetic Companions.

I would even be willing to bet in 40 years time, Sex Robots that look more Human would be a reality, where as Robots for other purposes, such as Industrial or Construction or even maybe Security would not look Human... no Exactly.

But those working as Companions or within any Health/Care Sector would certainly look more Human to fit in more.

Congratulations Sir Ridley Scott, i think its fully deserved due to his long time contribution to Cinema and TV

Cool, when I saw the triangle I immediately thought of Dan O'Bannon's first draft of Alien.

daliens - Yes we do. The first is 80% David and the other is 100% David. Unless the retcon machine will start spinning.

Ati - thanks again. 

I knew about the pyramid from the O'Bannon script, I just don't see how it could be introduced at this stage in the Alien universe. The was no pyramid in Prometheus or in Alien Covenant. Unless they find one on Origae 6 I don't think David will get the colonists to work to build one for the eggs. And in the original script the xenomorph was an extinct alien species so the pyramid kind of made sense in their own world. 

Probably Ridley Scott considered the gigeresque domes (similar to Giger’s work for Dune) we see in Prometheus as a better version of the pyramid he could not do for the first film.

You know, Ridley Scott said he made the prequels to answer who the SJ was and who made the xenomorph. After 2 films we still don't know those answers,  on the contrary we have more mistery and endless debates. 

chli

Not necessarily, however. Maybe only a very small Cabal knew that Weyland fake his death, and he was on the Prometheus. 

But I have not read that novel so there might things that I don't know about, and your interpretation is spot on.

How is this a weird question? I just watched David try to rape that chick. I guess he wanted to shove an alien in her, but here on Earth that is not the first thing that comes to mind when a man throws me across a room and kisses me. 

BigDave

I read Alien Covenant: Origins some time ago, and after having browsed through it again, there are no dates at all in the novelization. However, there is one interesting thing connected to date: Weyland-Yutani knows that Sir Peter Weyland is dead (and The Covenant leaves after this). This must mean that they have received Shaw’s message which was sent somewhere between December 25 - January 1? This, in turn, probably means that The Covenant left Earth orbit sometime in January at the earliest and therefore has travelled for only about 11 months until reaching Planet 4. This would mean that Planet 4 cannot be too far away from Earth and that The Covenant must be pretty fast?

The cover... :D

Yes, Paxton was involved as well...

'I checked out Moon 44 and no attempt to purchase this film will be made at this time nor at any time in the future.'

Lol, in spite of the fact that it offers the furniture used in Blade Runner... 8D

Yes Ati, I thought it was a good choice based on the cover art and your recommendation. This on the back cover helped too, below.

"James Cameron, who did the production design, and Bill Paxton, who worked as a set director before later collaborating with Cameron in front of the camera as an actor."

I know....will be kind in my review but I do like the classic sci-fi movies so factor that it in. Outland was great and fits with Alien. I did like The Soldier and I bought that movie too pretty cheap. I don't buy many movies but I will add quality sci-fi from all eras at low prices.

I checked out Moon 44 and no attempt to purchase this film will be made at this time nor at any time in the future.

Thank you for the embedded video, Ingeniero.

We can kill the language barrier with this video showing the English translation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3T3EGaIwIbA

Ingeniero - I have the feeling that we'll see a similar pyramid in the direct prequel to Alien.

'Alien Pyramid:

The search party from the Nostromo originally find a triangle that the Space Jockey had carved into its “dashboard,” apparently as its last act, when they investigate the Derelict Ship. After the planetoid’s endless dust storm has briefly settled, the crew can see a huge pyramid on the horizon. Another crew is sent to explore. They scale it, find an opening on top, and a volunteer lowers himself down the hatch. He finds a giant chamber that seems like a tomb, or maybe a place of worship. There are weird statues and some sort of hieroglyphics which are representative of Alien reproductive cycles.'

'The explorer then finds the Alien spores that had been waiting. This summary was taken from The Book of Alien which goes on to quote Ridley Scott who said, “The pyramid and the derelict-two different elements-were still the subject of a seesaw debate when I came on the project. I would love to have shot it, but the more I thought about it the more I realized it would have been wonderful in a three-hour version. What finally cracked it was the budget. We just had to get rid of it. And you know, sometimes financial practicalities force you to do a certain amount of editorial work, and I’m glad we simplified it.”'

Source: https://www.avpgalaxy.net/alien-movies/alien/deleted-scenes/

Lol, not everybody is a native speaker. :D

Awesome!

'I will soon perform my analysis.' - Lol, please be kind to it. I focused on the pyramid, not the movie quality.

Is it your blu-ray? You bought it?

"Big Spacestations"

"Big Spaceships"

That's great.

I agree dk, below.

Thank you Ati. This artwork is amazing and I'd love to see it make its way onto the screen somehow.

Good analysis BigDave on the context of the "War of the Worlds" comment from Scott. I believe he would depict the xenomorph as a weapon deployed in that scenario.

:D

I know...the color brought out the details in the shadows.

I love Daniels' mean face.

"Hell Has Just Been Relocated!"

I will soon perform my analysis.

oh god can they plz hurry up and make the next movie already and give us something fresh to discuss. aren't these 'inbetween months' dragging

Most welcome.

Correct, it's definitely time to include this video. I can't imagine her being any better if I knew French. Nice Ati.

No revelations in the Willie Nelson video...just a tribute to Tennessee.

daliens - 'We need to know who made the xenomorph. We need to know who the SJ was. I think most of the fans are now waiting for these answers rather than for another Ripley story or just some meaningless adventures in the alien universe.'

I agree with you.

'I don't know about pyramids in alien films.'

You should know because it is important. Look at this:

'Alien Pyramid:
The search party from the Nostromo originally find a triangle that the Space Jockey had carved into its “dashboard,” apparently as its last act, when they investigate the Derelict Ship. After the planetoid’s endless dust storm has briefly settled, the crew can see a huge pyramid on the horizon. Another crew is sent to explore. They scale it, find an opening on top, and a volunteer lowers himself down the hatch. He finds a giant chamber that seems like a tomb, or maybe a place of worship. There are weird statues and some sort of hieroglyphics which are representative of Alien reproductive cycles.'

'The explorer then finds the Alien spores that had been waiting. This summary was taken from The Book of Alien which goes on to quote Ridley Scott who said, “The pyramid and the derelict-two different elements-were still the subject of a seesaw debate when I came on the project. I would love to have shot it, but the more I thought about it the more I realized it would have been wonderful in a three-hour version. What finally cracked it was the budget. We just had to get rid of it. And you know, sometimes financial practicalities force you to do a certain amount of editorial work, and I’m glad we simplified it.” The image is a piece of conceptual artwork done by Chris Foss.'

Source: https://www.avpgalaxy.net/alien-movies/alien/deleted-scenes/

daliens - 'thanks for the share, you are doing a great research job.'

Thank you.

'I am just deeply frustrated by not getting any news from Disney about our beloved franchise.'

I see what you mean. I think we won't get any news before the premiere of the Star Wars - Solo movie.

'The title chosen for that film Galaxy of Terror is totally uninspired, more suitable for a parody.'

Perhaps it was intentional. He 'was' the first producer of the Alien but he was 'fired'... Imagine his feelings. 8D

Perhaps that was the reason why he produced ten Alien imitators in the eighties. :)

Intoxicating. Thank you, Ingeniero.

It's high time to add the video link to the French candidate's song taking part in the Eurovision Song Contest 2018:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-5UnMdKg70

Nice! A pink paradise.