Comments (Page 91)

To look at Immortality from the Engineers POV.

Jon Spaights had the idea that the Space Jockey/Engineer Race were ONCE very similar to HOW we are, they had Genetically Evolved themselves over a Great Time Period so that they would LIVE for Thousands of Years, they had Abandoned the Notion of Natural Procreation, and Eventually had LOST the Ability to do so.

Spaights then implied the Engineers were on the VERGE of a Great Discovery to ATTEMPT to Transcend from their Physical Bodies to beings of Energy who Live on in the Multiverse.

We have to ASSUME that they NEVER Managed to Achieve this.... NOW this kind of Plot is something that has gone though Changes and so from Alien Engineers to Alien Covenant the Engineers Agenda/History and Purpose likely have Changed.

But you would think that such a ADVANCED and ANCIENT Race like the Engineers who are Would-be-Gods, you would THINK they would have also WANTED to try and Gain some Eternal Life like Weyland wanted.

If we say they had been trying to Mess-About with Multiple Dimensions and the like then MAYBE they could have Unleashed some Horror from the other Dimensions like say in the PLOT to the HP Lovecraft Story.... FROM BEYOND

If this Organism can Resurrect Itself via its Life-Cycle especially if we APPLY the Original Idea from Dan O'Bannons Star Beast (EGG MORPH) then if this Ancient Organism can LIVE-ON in a Reincarnation.  And so it Genetically Transfers its SOUL onto the Egg Morph then this would be a kind of IMMORTALITY and you can Imagine the Engineers would be Interested in this and MAYBE this gives us a BETTER REASON for the Engineers to be playing with the Xeno-Ancetors Genetics.... NOT to Create a Weapon, but to PERFECT themselves and Attempt to gain the SAME kind of Reincarnation that the Starbeast has.

The ONLY kind of Success like this we actually had seen is via RIPLEY 8 but this Shows that the Xenomorph DNA maybe HOLDS THE KEY to what Peter Weyland was after ;)

I think there is Quite a lot of Ambiguity with Prometheus and also in WHAT we hear Ridley Scott say.

When he said part of the Questions are WHAT is a Soul, then its Really open for Interpretation and Debate.

What we see from the Perspective of Dr Shaw is that BELIEF in a Spiritual Soul that Exists inside of us that will go on to LIVE for Eternity if we Worship and have Faith in our GOD provided we Live a Life that does-not Displease this GOD.  However what we Discover is our Creators are FAR from the Benevolent God that she may have Faith in, after Discovering she could be WRONG she Returns to her Faith to ask "Who made them" and so Despite the Revelations she had Discovered her FAITH gave her the WILL to Carry on.

The ONLY time we hear about the SOUL in the Movie was when Peter Weyland said that it is SOMETHING that David could NEVER have.  Which is him saying  that only Humans have this Spiritual Soul that Dr Shaws Faith/Religion would suggest can Live on after Death.  However Weyland is NOT really a Believer as if he 100% Thought his SOUL would Live on in a After-Life he would NOT want to be trying to Track Down our Creators.

So if we are looking at our SOUL as being the Inner Spirit that will LIVE ON when we Die, be that in Heaven, or Tortured in Hell or Wander the World as a Ghost.  Then i do Suspect that we would NOT have Concluded as such in the Prequels.

The Emphasis of this Question seemed to Reflect back to David and his Reaction as "he is just a F-ing Robot after all"

But when your looking at what is SOUL then apart from a Genre of Music, and the Spiritual Essence of us. Then you can say having SOUL can also imply.

1) Putting all your Effort into something (Heart and Soul).

2) Determine how Good a Person you are as David said to Dr Shaw "your very kind of Heart" meaning she has a Good Soul.

3) The Experiences we have that Mold our Personality, that Determine what kind of a Person we Are, Kind, Cruel but also our Memories and Ambition.

Those (3) are what you would Expect would Live On once our Physical Body would Die.... it is those that are Transferred to the Clones in the Movie The 6th Day it is that which is Transferred to a A.I in the Movie Transcendence.

And so IF (and we are talking Sci-Fi) you had a way to UPLOAD Number (3) of a Human to some A.I/Storage and Transfer that to another Clone Body or even a Machine/Robot.  Then you would have a KIND OF like Afterlife...

But ALAS it seems Mankind had NOT been able to Accomplish that and the Engineers too.

But with David we see he has Very Human Emotions he has Ambition, Aspirations and as he is A.I and his A.I Memory can be Backed Up and Stored and likely Transferred then its kind of IRONIC that what Peter Weyland says that David has NO SOUL.... when actually he is the ONLY being who has a SOUL and can have a After-Life.

The ONLY other Person we see who could FIT with having a After-Life/Resurrection was RIPLEY via Ripley 8 has she retained some of Ripleys Memories/Emotions etc.

The Xenomorph DNA had provided some kind of Storage of her SOUL.

I think that IF the Ancestral Roots of the Xeno-DNA etc is Traced to a Organism that does this (Genetic Memory Transfer) then the ENGINEERS would Certainly be Interested in UNLOCKING as to WHY/HOW this Happens so that THEY can Gain some kind of IMMORTALITY too.

By the way though Black-Ant some Very Interesting Comments ;)

@BigDave, neat post to be sure...

"Clone their SOUL,"? What do you mean by SOUL?

I like to think of a person as just a person or a sentient machine as just a sentient machine. At some point religion clouds our judgement and morality.

Am I really free to do as I please or am I forever to be judged because what my SOUL retains from the creators higher ideas. Will we all ever be really free in the sense that we may choose our path truly independent of judgement.

This goes without saying of course that to live a free and virtuous life has nothing to do with the SOUL anyway. It just means you live a life that is fulfilling and not harmful to others. We are always taught through religion though that we are born with original sin and so in other words can never be free without being forgiven first for just existing.

For just the act of existing we are all already wrong and not allowed to pursue anything with out prior approval and forgiveness of our "SIN" the sin of just existing without excepting God's approval.

This negates real freedom.....now of course there are people that advocate you can only really have ever lasting real immortality through accepting God.

So this is just part of what RS was putting out there and you can see this most importantly through the cross that Dr. Shaw wears so prominently throughout the movie. Then Peter Weyland says himself in his own words...try harder to get me in contact with those GOD-LIKE aliens so I do not die and can have immortality.

He financed the entire mission because he believed the Engineers to be the progenitors of the seeding of Earth and so he believed they would have naturally invited him to join them because he made the journey to meet with them.

However, he comes to find that the Engineers are not the benevolent Gods he thought they may be and they kill him instead.

My point in all of this and for this discussion is that any way you look at it this entire universe is out to get all of us - and it does in the end. It gets all of us.

So the conclusion me must draw from all of these movies, tales, books, belief systems is that in the very end you and only you must rely on the tools that you truly believe in to sustain and extend yourself. Everything else is in fact a one way dead end street. Cloning and passing your consciousness into another construct is nonsense.

We must look much deeper at the meaning of the underlying operating systems that we are built from in order to understand how complex the problem of sustaining our atomic lattice would be to attain something even remotely close to immortality.

First there is the question of what really is an Atom...and if we have not fully figured out gravity well we don't really know anything about atoms. However, I digress...we know enough about atoms to replace them. So this will do for a very long time....if only there were a machine that worked quickly enough at the sub atomic level to rebuild atoms.....hummmmm I wonder ???? There seems to be another post about quantum computers some where and then sub atomic machines working faster than the speed of light....or some such nonsense like all the nonsense of these machine working right at the speed of light that we are all writing these posts with and such....oh well you can only illuminate the path for others so much before the lights go out for eternity.

@MonsterZero,

"If they cloned (path to immortality ) Peter Weyland, would he retain ownership of Weyland industries? or at least a voice in the company? I don't see the company wanting to deal with this and why he will remain dead."

If they made a sentient computer and transferred his consciousness to the hardware would he still own the company?

There are a Number of ways to look at IMMORTALITY, one of those being to become Immortalized.

But if we are Specifically looking at WHAT it is that Peter Weyland wanted then he wanted Eternal Life (or at least a VASTLY increased Life).  And so with this we have to talk about the SOUL as this is also something Ridley Scott had wanted to ask about.

And to Simply Clone Someone does-not really mean Immortality or Resurrection on its own, because you could have 5 Clones of yourself from Birth that are all Raised in Different Places/Environments and they would ALL not be Identical beings ONLY in the Physical Sense.

I would be Certain that Peter Weylands Company could CLONE a Person. But you would also NEED to Clone their SOUL.  This brings me to the Movie "The 6th Day"  if you are Familiar with the Plot it takes us to a Company that is able to Take a Snap-shot of your Mind/Memories/Personality and then Transfer them into a Clone should you DIE.

If Peter Weyland had managed to Achieve this then he would NOT have needed to go Chasing after the Gods.  You cant help but think that MAYBE he had tried to Achieve such a Feat.  The Idea i had for my Prometheus 2 in 2013 followed the SAME kind of Concept.

A Being who has this Ability is David, he can surely have his A.I Soul backed up and Transferred to another Synthetic Body. My Prometheus 2 idea had Weyland find a way to Back Up a Human Soul into a A.I and then Transfer this into a Synthetic Body (but also back into a Human Brain if he wished).  It would have been to SHOW that Peter Weylands was Obsessed with Cheating Death, and in Part his Creation of Synthetics/A.I was to eventually allow them to be the IMMORTAL BODY that he could UPLOAD his SOUL into.

But the Results became Unstable and so he was Left with No Option but eventually to Grasp at the Chance to Meet our Makers.

In Reality should we EVER be able to Accomplish such a Feat as that, (same as The 6th Day Plot too) then you would have Nearly Obtained Immortality.  Once you can UPLOAD your SOUL into a A.I then you are on that Transcendence to Immortality (as the Movie with the same Name had shown).  The Scary thing is maybe ONE DAY we could to a degree Achieve this.

When you bring up "would he retain ownership of Weyland industries" its Interesting because would a CLONE have any Human Rights?  Certainly a Robot would NOT and so IF you Uploaded your SOUL into a Synthetic would you Cease to be HUMAN and Loose your Rights?

This is something i touched on with my P2 Idea as we have Vickers being ALIVE and SHE would Inherit the Company, but she is LATTER Discovered to be Synthetic (after being attacked by Yutani Geisha Androids) and as a Synthetic then she has NO RIGHTS and so the Company goes to Weylands Nephew (In Part) but as Part of a Deal he made with Yutani they gained some Assets and eventually this leads to the Merger.

But to Summarize if you FOUND a Way to UPLOAD your SOUL into a A.I that can then be Transferred either into a CLONE BODY or SYNTHETIC then you would have to a Degree gained some kind of Immortality..  but its NOT a ETERNAL LIFE as Nothing Really is Eternal.

If they cloned (path to immortality ) Peter Weyland, would he retain ownership of Weyland industries? or at least a voice in the company? I don't see the company wanting to deal with this and why he will remain dead.

Immortality sounds like heaven, but I'd think the legalities and entropy would quickly put a damper on the festivities.

Regarding the Jesus the Engineer it was Ridley Scott who indicated as such, he was basically referencing the DATE of the Outbreak/Intended Destruction of Mankind.

He had said in regards to the Coincidental Date that we should look at it as though Mankind was Misbehaving and so the Engineers sent down a Emissary to Steer us Back on Track but we Crucified him and so that was the LAST STRAW for them.  But they felt this was being a Little too on the Nose.

I dont think with Prometheus we should look at it as a Christian Story but that it Encompasses all Ancient Religion and Culture as Interpretations of Interaction with the Engineers in the Past.  And so its likely the Engineers over Time had many Emissaries they had living among us.

We could find some way to maybe link the Trinity as this is a Concept that is seen in Various Religions too.

Regarding a GOD then who knows in the Alien Universe and maybe its something that is BEST LEFT alone... as far as a SINGLE CREATOR who Created Everything but then its still Interesting to Ponder especially if our Reality is Actually just a Simulated Existence Created by some ANCIENT A.I/MACHINE.

But in regards to WHOM had Created the Engineers then i think there are other Layers above them, its a case of HOW MANY LAYERS and as you Peal Back the Layers when do you REACH something that is NOT HUMANOID at all?

I think a BIG Disappointment with Prometheus and the Engineers and Especially how we had them Continued in Alien Covenant is that i think  FANS just did-not see them as ALIEN enough.... maybe Needed something more Lovecraft with a HR Giger Twist and i still THINK that this is POSSIBLE.

After all Ridley Scott said the Engineers are NOT really Gods.... it seems they wanted to become as Gods though.

@DK

I agree to a degree.... the PLOT is Epic as a Stand Alone Movie Series, but being tied to ALIEN had meant it had became Shackled to ALIEN and we see the Consequences of that with Alien Covenant.

I like the idea of who created "gods." I just don't like it in the Alienverse. It's still my opinion that Prometheus would have been much better as something that had nothing to do with Alien.

I swear I read something long ago that said that Jesus Christ was supposedly an engineer? Not sure if it was a fan theory or confirmed, but it's an interesting idea to explore.

Not to blaspheme, but when looking at the concept of the Holy Trinity, that could be a way to explain the Higher Power/Powers that created the Engineers. The Holy Spirit interpreted as a being of pure energy and then God as an extremely powerful alien deity that used/worked with the Holy Spirit to create the Engineers. From here, we can even liken Angels to being another alien species that serve the Creators. In the fictional universe that is the Alien franchise, it could be that the Bible was humanity's way of attempting to understand the teachings that the Engineer who was known as Jesus Christ preached.

Blackant thats VERY INTERESTING... I think it would FIT more with the GOD TOPIC i created (partially Created in response to what was being said on here but going OFF TOPIC)

"The multiverse is not so much as necessary a concept"

I think its interesting to Ponder Multiverses and Inter-dimensions.  Who knows HOW FAR our Technology can Progress in 100 Years, but we maybe cant Fathom what we could be like in 1000, never mind 10'000.  The more Closer we get to being Gods and playing God then i think there is that Risk of Hubris.

I think its this Hubris that Ridley Scott felt the Foundation of the Franchise should be about, its in Essence what he seemed to be more Interested in regards to his Prequels.  The Matrix is something that comes to Mind too as FAR as when your Creations become Sentient and Overthrow you and become so ADVANCED that you END UP in another Universe that is Actually a Created Dream of the NEW GODS who we Once Created.

Sadly i cant see the Franchise even Expanding to anything New, i think they MISSED the Boat with the Prequels as they could have Connected the Engineers Plot with some of HR Gigers ideas.

I will have to check that out Monster Zero ;)

When looking at the Franchise we had been introduced the PLOT that we was Created by the Engineers, and after Prometheus we had Ridley Scott say he DID-NOT want us to meet GOD in the First Movie.

So i was looking at IF there is a Creator or Creator Species then HOW MANY runs of the Ladder to you Explore?   So could any GOD or Gods be...

1) The Engineer Elders: We simply have a more Ancient Humanoid Race.

2) Another kind of Humanoid who are Closely Related to the Engineers but have some Slight Differences.

3) Some Species that would look more like the Space Jockey

4) Some Giant Alien Species that Bare No Resemblance to Humanoids.

5) Some Alien Species who have a Cephalopod Aesthetic to them.

6) Some Alien Species who have some Resemblance to the Xenomorph.

7) Some kind of Machine/A.I

8) Or some Entity that is just Energy.

A Example of the 8 i have placed in the Banner Image, just for Reference but we could think of something that does-not have to look like them.

@BigDave, Hox..........just incredible, remarkable, transcendental in fact! Truly beyond words.

I am not sure how you both keep up with these levels of introspection, detection, re-combinative, synthetic mastery of this subject the way you both do at times. It is absolutely astounding. BigDave if there was ever a way to pull this entire franchise from the pit where it resides you just lifted it up effortlessly and I so humbly quote.. 

"Either way we see a Rebellion a Fall of these Ancient Godlike beings where the Engineers Ancestors then either Inherent the FIRE of the GODS or they Steal it.

The THEMES of Hubris when Sub-Creating or Engineering and TRYING to Play God come into PLAY at the Higher Level.

You DONT even Need the Xenomorph as you can WRITE THEM OFF..."

Some how BigDave you solved it entirely I believe. The equation works...the vision is grand enough all else can be forgive and so much is way in the past.

It is almost biblical what you are saying in a way too. These most ancient of themes that will eternally play out on grander scales where mere mortals are always the currency by which the Gods divine a larger flock, or create more enemies. 

Hox I think where you are going is equally prophetic as well. Your science is accurate.

So I understand it as such in this way. Please follow along. Human beings have had a spectacular evolution in the past 150 years. Our collective science has taken a complete departure from all the rest of human history. The very machines we communicate back and forth with on are proof of this and so much more. 

My main point in all of this is the structural necessity of so many things that were once completely all dependent all on analog structures. Our collective mechanical science was just crude elemental parts that our collective hands could build, the cogs and wheels if you will. However, in todays subjective scientific gestalt lays this newly found world of possibilities where machines are self building from the nano-layer (atomic lattice) and bootstrapping themselves right into the desired larger mechanisms of force. 

So this is power to behold. The next level is below the electron at the quark field and so on and so forth. So far it is all looking like we go sub electron in the next hundred years and so you do have these machine spaceships grown from the basic elements; but, more importantly you have them do it even quicker from the sub atomic level with a digital catalyst much faster than the speed of light.

Now this gentleman is stealing fire from God. I have mentioned before machines that work faster than the speed of light. Just give that a little more consideration as how it might apply to computers and digital self assembling things.

Human beings, all of us objectively, we are elucidating, deriving these new methods from all the digital systems that we have constructed that work at the speed of light. Now the real work must be done to go faster than the speed of light through sub atomic interactions, aka quantum mechanics.

Even though both of you are not scientists in the strictest of terms, what you are both saying is equally enlightening. There will be a great leap in the next 50 years as quantum computing evolves rapidly and then overtakes all other forms of thinking derivatively in every aspect of mankind.

What you are both saying is part of that next evolution through the sub atomic interactions where self mechanization is no longer the priority and this business of what is it to be a God comes fully into realization.

This was meant to be no matter what. In fact it is unavoidable. No matter what we all do next...there will be quantum computers....then there will be an even more faster mastery of self assembly at through the sub atomic level below the electron.

The aliens that inhabit all the trillions of galaxies all around us did not need to conquer or fight wars for more land. Land as we understand space in three dimensions and one variable of time is only a small barrier field. The real idea of this place is what happens when you combine other faster interactions than the speed of light. The concept of space in three dimensions is then forever irrelevant. Space and time become arbitrary concepts - infinite sets of coordinates. The multiverse is not so much as necessary a concept as the idea to project your ideas and manifest them where and when you want them is what is most important in any further scientific endeavor. The freedom to choose when, where, and why are so explicit. You both tacitly cling to the vestiges of this arcane prior analog world and yet your voices are loud and clear you secretly dream of the freeness of digital through sub atomics. 

Maybe this is not more formally understood to the both of you. Your minds can be locked in these analog functions where to dream is almost the forbidden fruit from the tree of knowledge. You may look brothers but don't touch, you can touch but don't eat....you may eat brothers but don't enjoy....you know the rest. Rebellion has always been at the core of our desires to be more...

We are all still primitives comparatively as it stands right now. We are all still stumbling around in the dark looking for the light....the right illumination to show us the way. Your grasps at real divinity are what all men have fought and died for though-out the ages. 

Mere fake wealth in the forms of derivatives will not do. You both want the real thing. Just remember all real things do and must come at a price.

I am not sure if we will see the Engineers who knows?

To me the PLOT from Images i have seen and what we know so far  would maybe Indicate this TV series could be SET like 50-75 Years before ALIEN and on Earth where Humans would Discover a Crashed Engineer Ship at Sea.

I cant see WHY they DONT make it SET like after ALIEN 3 and say 2200-2300 i think IF its SET between 2040-2080 that could Contradict the WHOLE FRANCHISE.

I think before we had Alien Covenant then YES i think you could have Explored some Ancient Origin to all that Technology and Aesthetic and had INTRODUCED another Layer before the Engineers.

The Engineers Ancestors could have been some RACE that say another HIGHER RACE had either....

1) Came Across and USED them for Hosts and were Worshiped as Gods by the Engineers Ancestors.

2) As above but THEY had Engineered  the Engineers Ancestors from some Race they Came Across.

3) They had Created the Engineers Ancestors from Scratch.

Either way we see a Rebellion a Fall of these Ancient Godlike beings where the Engineers Ancestors then either Inherent the FIRE of the GODS or they Steal it.

The THEMES of Hubris when Sub-Creating or Engineering and TRYING to Play God come into PLAY at the Higher Level.

You DONT even Need the Xenomorph as you can WRITE THEM OFF...

You can Introduce the Engineers former Enslavers and these Guys have a Bio-Mechanical Aesthetic like  the Xenomorph...... RE-INVENT the STARBEAST.

Maybe a H.P. Lovecraft type universe? But...

...I'd rather they stay with the Hard Sci-Fi angle.

Do some Ian M. Banks like: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matter_(novel)

Iln, Veil and the Oct like creatures, Shellworlds, etc.... This stuff is light years ahead of Alien verse and probably difficult to introduce....But that would get my vote.

I think OP misinterpreted what RS said.

"because ‘Prometheus’ woke it up very well".

This part is important to keep in mind. It basically means it reignited new interest in the Alien universe since it introduced new ideas. RS also said face hugger / chest burster memes are getting old after 40 decades, so they will likely stick to the new and fresh Prometheus/AC arc.

In addition to that i expect the next film will focus more on the Engineers in the same sense as Prometheus teased it back in the days.

Nice to see this forum is still alive after my second hibernation and seeing some known forum folks.

....

I guess everything is better than AC if they do it well in regards of intertwining arcs in the Alien Universe.

But  my assumption is they will focus on Weyland, AI and early deep space travel. Like reaching Mars and etablishing an outpost, Asteroid mining, etc. Basically 19th century gold rush but in space this time.

Not much about Engineers beyond what we saw in the prologue in Prometheus.

@BigDave, that gels with my own thoughts about the derelict - that it is in a sense 'alive' and bio-mechanical. More grown than manufactured. It could stem from a time that pre-dates Engineers even. We need more thinking like that, to take us away from the mundane concerns of humans, and more in the direction of a universe that is utterly ALIEN in nature.

Ha Ha HOX!

Thanks for the Bump though ;)

Seems some of the PLOT to this Novel could be taking some Elements from the ALIEN V: RED HARVEST Project?

@BigDave, hats off to you sir! and cheers! Always the consummate professional.

I enjoyed this post very much, especially this last part here..."

"Then YES what we had in ALIEN and especially when you Listen to HR Gigers Ideas was something VERY ALIEN, very Surreal/Lovecraftian.

A Derelict thats Grown, and Actually would Produce the Eggs that some Humanoids (Space Jockey) would Sacrifice themselves to Procreate them. With the Ship having a Genetic (if you would) well a Connection to the Xenomorph DNA (well Traits).  in HR Gigers idea/mind the QUEEN was the SHIP"

This resonates so deeply, so profoundly...what an incredible choice of words. Yes yes and yes the ship is the progenitor of these "eggs" and so this my good sir! THIS IS THE STUFF OF GODS.

If only you were writing these movies a long time ago before those other useless writers got there.

^^ Sorry, wrong thread. 

@BlackAnt, correction: Ash says "polarised silicon", not "polarised silicone". I know it says silicone in the subtitles, but I'm English, I hear what he says, and he says "silicon". If he'd said silicone, it would have rhymed with cone, not cun.

I'm currently writing an Alien versus Predator reboot fanfiction, I want to include some of these rejected concepts for my Engineers

https://www.scified.com/topic/50490

But to Continue.... and going OFF TOPIC.

Then YES what we had in ALIEN and especially when you Listen to HR Gigers Ideas was something VERY ALIEN, very Surreal/Lovecraftian.

A Derelict thats Grown, and Actually would Produce the Eggs that some Humanoids (Space Jockey) would Sacrifice themselves to Procreate them. With the Ship having a Genetic (if you would) well a Connection to the Xenomorph DNA (well Traits).  in HR Gigers idea/mind the QUEEN was the SHIP

"It's replacing his cell's with polarized silicone...and feeding him oxygen. If we take it off it could kill him."

Certainly Black Ant ;)

The First Time we saw the Xenomorph in ADULT FORM it looked more Mechanical/Synthetic than anything Organic, inc its Metallic Teeth.  And so YES it looked more like some kind of Robot than a Organic Creature.

I think that LIKE IT.... or NOT.... when we look at Davids Xenomorphs that have some Evolving to do, then you could WONDER as to IF/WHEN will a Synthetic Element be Added to the Process?

If  the Revelations would Conclude that a SYNTHETIC is what would be that FINAL JIGSAW PIECE.... and the Beasts Origins are Davids Creation... then i GUESS this would UPLIFT the Fascination that ASH had with the Xenomorph.

But i AGREE... that IF we get that Conclusion and even WHAT we have learned so FAR then YES i am sure its NOT what most of us would have Envisioned or even Wanted to see.

When we look back at ALIEN and Consider the Art of HR Giger then you have that Surreal Merger of Organic and None-Organic where you CANT make out where the Organic Begins or Ends and Vice Versa...

TRULY UNIQUE AESTHETIC.

A Shoe-Horned way to that Aesthetic could be some MESSING about with the Black Goo would TRIGGER a Mutation where the Pathogen can then INFECT None-Organic Material and Imprint Xenomorph DNA into it...

YES this is Scientifically Stupid to a Degree.... but this is SCI-FI and it would explain the Aesthetic Difference between the Derelict/Juggernaught and the Xenomorph from AC to ALIEN............... such a Mutation/Change would be Trouble for David and make him be able to be INFECTED too....(i would NOT have Ruled Out that the Space Jockey would be David).

@MonsterZero

It seems the Original Ideas were that David would SNEAK on the Ship some TINY EGGS and Alternatively a Xenomorph Embryo.  I think if you look at it from the COMPANY Perspective and you Wanted a Xenomorph the BEST way would be to have some Container/Tank and Safely (attempt to) place a Face Hugger in it... this is Essentially what the Predators did in AVPR.

And so if you look at it like that then the Egg would have made it more Convoluted (they was going to be placed in the Green House/Flora Nursery), a Xenomorph Embryo would been Easier but i can GUESS that keeping a Face Hugger instead does ALLOW for that Extra HORROR Moment when the Face Hugger attacks. (but we have seen this OVER and OVER).

I think you are Correct we maybe ONLY needed the ONE of them.... do we Conclude that the TWO are for Daniels and Tennessee?   (Ridley Scott said the NEXT Movie would NOT be about Xenomorphs so i am NOT sure it would have been a Easy Case of we see D+T become a Pair of Xenomorphs.

How we get from TWO of those Face Huggers to Thousands of Xenomorphs is something we have YET to find out, we know that Ridley Scott had indicated the Xenomorph is NOT QUITE there yet.... it has some more Evolving before we get to what we see in ALIEN.

We also could NOT rule out that David has some Perverted Mind and Intention to Create a Female Companion and THIS is what he means by a Queen?  Could we have Eventually seen him TURN say Daniels into something like HR Giger's Lith

It seems the Dr Shaw from Alien Covenant has some Easter Egg Nod to the HR Giger Works, and the Marvel ALIEN Comic series seems to have taken some Inspiration from Similar HR Giger Works.

Would we have seen this or similar?  Who Knows... the Main part of the Synopsis seemed to be that David wants to Continue to Create but it will NOT be about Xenomorphs, but what we do KNOW is that by the Time we had Concluded (another 2-3 Movies) then we would have seen HOW we get from Davids Xenomorph to the THOUSANDS of Eggs on the Derelict.

I  think the PLOT has some Potential as in the ALIEN Franchise (Theatrically) the Company has TRIED to Obtain a Specimen and they was ONLY successful in ALIEN Resurrection but NO Soon as they had Managed to Obtain some Eggs from the Queen and managed to get from them the ADULT XENOMORPHS then things went to POT.

You would Question to WHAT would they do with those Xenomorphs had they Managed to Contain them?  Surely they would LOOK beyond just using Eggs, Face Huggers as a Bio-Weapon?

So Genetic Study, Experiments would seem Logical and IF these Organisms have a HIVE MIND/TELEPATHY then i Guess you could look at ways to TAP INTO that and CONTROL THEM?

But you would NOT need to have Ripley etc back!

As FAR as the Queen Suit... this is even WORSE a IDEA than the PRED-KILLER SUIT from The Predator!

I thionmkl

All very interesting comments to be sure, "A superior species no doubt." I think you may have had it correct the first time BigDave....

"Maybe his QUEEN could be a Female Synthetic Construct who may arrive in another Human Ship at some point?  His Xenomorph does lack the more Bio-Mechanical HR Giger Atheistic and RS said the Xenomorph has some EVOLVING to do before we get to ALIEN

IF some Androids who will appear are PART Organic/Synthetic then i do SUSPECT that they will become the FINAL PART of HOW we get to our Xenomorphs in ALIEN etc."

In the first Alien if you all remember correctly Ash was analyzing Cain's cells before removing the facehugger?

Dallas asked Ash, "What's it doing to him?" Ash replied, "It's replacing his cell's with polarized silicone...and feeding him oxygen. If we take it off it could kill him."

Let us all consider the fork in the road here. Maybe David creates the Xeno. Maybe David does not create the Xeno.

Any way you look at it the facehugger on LV426 was taking an inorganic element "silicon" then binding the silicon to O, C, and H to make silicone. So we must speculate now that the Xeno, facehuggers are all more android-computer hybrids than bio-synthetic. These things can easily withstand the vacuum of space etc.

Looking at the Xeno vision from the last movie was maybe a clue as well that these creatures are hybrid computers. The fact that they have a bio-molecular scaffolding to ingest organics is interesting for the movies; but, in reality is more convoluted unnecessary non-sense. These large Chaps could just as easily get to work making black goo nano robots that wipe out an entire planet and then they all sit back and smoke cigars! LOOOOOOL

Anyway at this point there is too fine a line to draw unnecessary distinctions in what is bio-mechanical, what is more robot, android, nano fabrication....

It has been more than 40 years since I was first introduced to this kind of science and I really want to move on with more interesting concepts than intermediaries in the dark with sharp metal teeth.

We could spend months or years debating such things and yet I find there is so much more we could be studying.

BigDave this in no way is being negative about your post. I think you very clever when it comes to hypotheticals. I waited so many years for a real look at what should have been a more fully developed out premise in Prometheus, only to be let down and have this android David steal the show and everything else evidently - along with the ships kitchen sink.

We were supposed to get these 15 foot tall Engineer GODS! and we were handed David's lesser ambitions. For what I do not know. David is the Antithesis of everything we were supposed to see in Prometheus...Stealing fire from the God's is an old tale in itself. We never saw any God's in Prometheus the way that movie was made. Those Engineers did not look even close to entering God like hyper-dimensional existence. 

The Engineers should have been gatekeepers of some kind and the real God's revealed. RS could of at least done that for all of us yet instead he palmed us fools gold in the form of David taking us all on an even longer fools errand.

If RS every shows his face again in this franchise he better deliver something more substantial and real this time. No I do not even think there will be a next time - Disney put everything in the vault. Good for Disney, at least the larger mistakes made in these movies will not make it to the big screen again...you can just watch in private if you wish. Then again to do anything real with this pile of convoluted mess is near impossible. David's queen? or something transcendental, something never scene before in movie history?

You all know what they say....Go big or go home but do not come just half way with it.

Maybe she's playing a surrogate mother for some of the brood? But why? 

Why show two facehuggers being recovered? Very odd. You would think showing the audience one would do the trick? "Oooh! he has a facehugger!! Cool! Maybe one apiece for Tennessee and Daniels? ( If they wanted to suggest that, they should of had David look in their direction. "One for you Mr. T  'glance' and one for you 'evil glance' miss Daniels..." )

Bonkers. Ripley dressing up in a powered metal exoskeleton (Aliens) is fine. But a human does not have the muscle power of a Xenomorph, so it's just silly to dress up as one. The whole idea of a Xenomorph is that it is a fearsome powerful predator that can punch its way through metal and run into machine-gun fire without a care in the world. A human dressed up as a Xenomorph is just plain daft, and robs the beast of its might.

We dodged a bullet there, I think.

Well we can ONLY go and Speculate as to WHAT was meant by David wishing to Perfect his Queen, from AC it seems he had Conducted a LOT of Experiments but that Dr Shaws Reproductive System/Egg Cells are HOW that David got to his EGGS that he showed to ORAM.  I suspect that David wanted a Queen as in Context to a MORE EFFICIENT WAY to Produce more Eggs.

How is he going to Achieve this with those TWO FACE HUGGERS is anyone's Guess and NEVER-MIND to Engineer Hybrids, i think the BLACK GOO is something he would MAYBE need to achieve any of that.

The Least Convoluted way would be that IF we saw ONE of the Face Huggers either Evolves or gets Engineered to Produce a Queen Chest Buster.

Without any Sequel or Comments about it then we MAY NEVER KNOW what would become of those TWO FACE HUGGERS and IF we can see David go and PERFECT his Queen however or whatever that may have been.

Indeed Chris we can assume that Ripley has managed to GET INTO a Xenomorph Queen Suit!! i know *FACEPALM

Other Concept we saw prior had showed us a Ripley in like a Space Jockey/Xenomorph Hybrid Suit.

Regarding RED HARVEST its HARD to say as to HOW MANY versions of ALIEN V there was.

Red Harvest gave us some RED like Xenomorph related Monsters, it also showed VARIOUS Experiments on Xenomorph Related Organisms who are FUSED with Human Tech and we even see a Xenomorph Related Organism thats Connected to the PILOT CHAIR of a Engineer Ship.

So it seems the PLOT was about a Human Company who OBTAINED the Derelict (or other Engineer Ship) they OBTAIN a QUEEN and likely Eggs from her to then Begin Various Experiments on the Xenomorph and TRYING to Obtain Traits from them for Bio-Weapons Advancements but also TRYING to find a way to CONTROL them.

We can see THAT does NOT go to Plan.

I think the PLOT has some Interesting ideas but also some SILLY ONES and so its VERY like Comic Book and i also DONT think you have to BRING BACK THE GANG to make another Movie and so it would have been a PASS from me.

I Applaud the Effort by the Concept Artist though.

Its Difficult to draw any Conclusions really, its interesting to see some more Discovered Concepts.

What we know about ALIEN V is that it was to be set 20 Years or so after ALIENS and would essentially be that ALIEN 3 and ALIEN R had NEVER Happened.

It looks like another Asian Company has recovered the Derelict in some Facility/Outpost. It seemed that this Company had attempted to Engineer the Xenomorphs but they also had a ALIENS QUEEN.

Ripley and Hicks would return and Witness the Experiments and some Horrors as a Xenomorph Outbreak had Occurred and Ripley and Hicks are going to TRY and PUT a STOP to it all.

These NEW Concepts seem to indicate that the Outpost does suffer a OUTBREAK as we see Xenomorph Resign all over the Place and what is either a LAKE or a FLOOD.

We have a New Android but is this GUY one of the Good Guys?  He seems to ATTACK either a Military Personnel to the Company who has OBTAINED the Xenomorph on one of the other MERC TEAMS

This MERC TEAM actual Alliance and Agenda is HARD to work out from this Concept Art.

The Idea also seemed to indicate we would see a Adult Newt at some point.

That'd be cool because it'd be similar to insect colonies and how they have wars

like this one time i saw a little garden ant fight this HUGE red ant

wanna know who won?

I don't know.... I'm getting a very AVP vibe with this concept art.

AVA ( Aliens Versus Aliens ) a new series ?

Dressing up as a Xeno Queen just seems so bizarre? 

Words fail me.....

The working title for Alien 5 being Red Harvest makes more sense now... Red Harvest likely a callback to the Aliens Genocide comic... the RED Xenomorphs were a competing breed. RED = Enemy Xenomorphs. Harvest = Weyland-Yutani bred Alien Hive. That's my guess.

If this is the art they showed Fox/Disney? Then I can see why the passed on it.

Doesn't inspire much.

Still want to know more about Alien 5....but....A basic plot outline or a summary would be better than any art.

I'd like to think the Xenomorph is a bioweapon created in a lab by the Engineers ( or David / humanity or another race) so I like this direction.

Daniels ( or someone still in hibernation ) as the progenitor is okay in my book,  David has a 1000 women to choose from...So I could see Daniels being spared and I don't see an actress wanting to do the makeup or become a monster.

I'd think a Royal Facehugger would need another lab to develop? Maybe the Covenant has the tools?